# امريكان / أمريكيين



## DarrenLamb

Hi, I was recently watching a film with some dialogue in Arabic and heard the following; 

أخوك انقتل يهاجم الامريكان صح ولا غلط؟​
Why is the term 'amreekaan' used as opposed to 'amreekiyeen' given that the plural 'Americans' was meant.​


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## clevermizo

أمريكان is a common plural (collective noun) for "Americans" used in various dialects.


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## Josh_

I suppose it is used as opposed to the other plural, because, as Clevermizo said, it is a collective (noncountable) noun used to refer to Americans collectively, generally, or in an abstract sense.  The other plural, on the other hand, is generally a plural used when countable.  

This same kind of plural is also used with other nationalities -- إيطاليان, for example.


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## إسكندراني

I've never heard أمريكيين in any dialect. أمريكان is the plural as far as I'm concerned; it's even used formally sometimes besides the usual MSA plural. *طلاينة* or *طليان *(not إيطاليان) is similar; only MSA sometimes says إيطاليون.
Consider also أتراك not تركيون. And ألمان not ألمانيون. And إنجليز not [insert wrong suggestion here]. And أسبان not أسبانيون.
توانسة not تونسيون
مغاربة not مغربيون


Specifically in Egypt I (not sure if everyone else does) say:
فرنساوية not فرنسيين


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## DarrenLamb

Ah ok, interesting. Thanks guys


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## clevermizo

إسكندراني said:


> Specifically in Egypt I (not sure if everyone else does) say:
> فرنساوية not فرنسيين



In Syrian I think it's فرنساويين.


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## cherine

It's faransaweyyiin in EA too. I only heard/read faransaweyya in older contexts, like in reference to Bonaparte and his army.


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## Kinan

clevermizo said:


> In Syrian I think it's فرنساويين.



Actually all 3 are used.


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## rayloom

أمريكان is what's commonly used in Saudi Arabic as well, for all purposes. 
As for the French, we do actually say فرنسيين, never فرنساويين nor فرنساوية.
Nor do we say طليان or طلاينة!


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## DarrenLamb

Yeah that was something I was going to ask - having grown up in the Gulf, mainly Oman, I'm not familiar with this plural pattern, except '3arab' being the plural of 3arabi. Is 'amreekaan' the only plural of this form in Saudi and Khaleeji Arabic Rayloom?


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## Mahaodeh

I think you just might have forgotten, but there is no way that one would say, as an example, هنديين in Oman rather than هنود. I'm quite sure that they also use: روس، إنجليز، عجم، ترك.

I've never heard فرنساويين in Iraq, but طليان and إيطاليين are both common.


I think that using a collective noun for people (as in 'identifiable group of people') in Arabic is the normative case, while using جمع المذكر السالم is the exception. We tend to do that even for families, tribes, and small localities such as villages and towns.


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## إسكندراني

Mahaodeh said:


> I think you just might have forgotten, but there is no way that one would say, as an example, هنديين in Oman rather than هنود. I'm quite sure that they also use: روس، إنجليز، عجم، ترك.
> 
> I've never heard فرنساويين in Iraq, but طليان and إيطاليين are both common.
> 
> 
> I think that using a collective noun for people (as in 'identifiable group of people') in Arabic is the normative case, while using جمع المذكر السالم is the exception. We tend to do that even for families, tribes, and small localities such as villages and towns.


And regions and ethnic groups


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## DarrenLamb

Yeah هنود was the only other one I was familiar with, strange, I guess Ive just never come across this


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## Silky_Sword

We also say Amerkaan أمِيركان (mostly in Levantine Arabic, don't believe other Arabs say it this way).

Since we're talking about Amreeka or Amairka, did you guys hear that al-Mas'udi was the one who gave America its name?  He used to call it in hiس Atlas or map: المارقة / Al-Mareqah / the Rogue (distant?) continent


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## Mahaodeh

Actually Amerkaan is more common than you think. It's also common in Iraq and the Gulf states. Don't know if it's common elsewhere. I believe that they all also say Ameerka rather than Amreeka.


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## Silky_Sword

Maha where are you originally from exactly??


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## إسكندراني

Mahaodeh said:


> Actually Amerkaan is more common than you think. It's also common in Iraq and the Gulf states. Don't know if it's common elsewhere. I believe that they all also say Ameerka rather than Amreeka.


That's the way Aljazeera always write it & pronounce it anyway (أميركا). In some Algerian راي songs I heard them call it مريكان (EG ف امريكان for 'in america', not pronouncing the ا).
In Egypt it's always أمريكا amriika.


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