# Ancient Greek: athletic mottos



## asi_es_la_vida

help: i'm looking for some ancient greek or latin expressions/mottos/anthems having to do with athletics and life. for example I found one: the motto for the olympic games: "CITISU-ALTIUS-FORTIUS" which means: swifter, higher, stronger. 
i want more. It's for a tattoo. can someone offer ideas, or a place where i could find some ideas? Something with the word live/life in it would be good: something strong and powerful.


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## skatoulitsa

Do they have to do with athletics or life? The only ones that are coming to me are war/fight related.
Anyway, there it goes:

1. νυν υπέρ πάντων ο αγών : 

translation: above everything else is the fight.

Note: the spelling I used is from modern greek. In ancient greek we used many different types of accents, which we do not have any more. So, in ancient greek it would look like this:
νῦν ὑπὲρ πάντων ἀγών

2. ή ταν ή επί τας : 

literal translation: either with it or on it

History: A phrase told to young Spartans when they were going to battle, by their mothers. "it" refers to their shields. If the Spartans died they were brought home carried on their shields. So, what the phrase means is "Either come back victorious or dead"

3. Μολών λαβέ :

translation: Come and get them

Spoken by Leonidas in the Thermopelae battle, where the greeks were hopelessly outnumbered by the Persians (600,000 vs 300). Xerxes offered to spare the lives of Leonidas and his men if they gave up their arms and surrender. Refusing to surrender, Leonidas responded with the notorious phrase.

This is what come to mind right now. I don't know if it is anything along the lines you were thinking about...


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## Flaminius

*Latin:*
Hic Rhodus, hic saltus.
_Here is Rhodos, here is to jump._

When an athlete bragged that once he made a great jump in Rhodus, he was challenged thus to prove the feat himself.


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## skatoulitsa

Flaminius said:
			
		

> *Latin:*
> Hic Rhodus, hic saltus.
> _Here is Rhodos, here is to jump._
> 
> When an athlete bragged that once he made a great jump in Rhodus, he was challenged thus to prove the feat himself.



And in greek (which was the original): Ιδού η Ρόδος, ιδού και το πήδημα.


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## asi_es_la_vida

This is what come to mind right now. I don't know if it is anything along the lines you were thinking about...[/QUOTE]


close. Those quotes are a little towards the violent/negative side. I think I'm looking for something a little more uplifting/inspiring. Maybe something having to do with the olympic games, I know they placed high value on the body and physical accomplishments something that glorifies athletes. Although I do like the aspect of competition/the passion of the fight in a generic sense, just maybe not having to do so specifically with war and death.


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## waterbuf

Flaminius said:
			
		

> *Latin:*
> Hic Rhodus, hic saltus.
> _Here is Rhodos, here is to jump._
> 
> When an athlete bragged that once he made a great jump in Rhodus, he was challenged thus to prove the feat himself.



Flaminius, no disrespect intended, but I think you have your
quotation  wrong.  I think it should be --

    Hic Rhodus (also Rhodos), hic salta (not SALTUS).
    Here us Rhodos; here you should jump / dance.

Don't believe me, check it out. 

I have a favor to ask though.  Tell me how you would say in
modern Greek:

   "I am sad that you won't talk to me..."

Would this come close to it? 

* Λυpάμαι ότι δεν θα μιλήσετε σε με.*

Anyway, cairete,

waterbuf


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## Flaminius

waterbuf, I know, alas, too small Latin and less Greek to fully respond to your comments.  I found, however, that it was Hegel that changed "sultus" to "sulta" here.

*Hic Rhodus, hic salta.* 
The origin of this odd saying, whose currency is largely due to Hegel and Marx, takes a little explaining. Its original form is ‘Hic Rhodus, hic saltus’ (‘Rhodes is here, here is the place for your jump’), a traditional Latin translation [see, e.g., Erasmus, _Adagia_ 3. 3. 28] of a punchline from Aesop. . . .

Be it sultus or sulta, I hope I am not so much infected by stultitia.


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## skatoulitsa

waterbuf said:
			
		

> I have a favor to ask though.  Tell me how you would say in
> modern Greek:
> 
> "I am sad that you won't talk to me..."
> 
> Would this come close to it?
> 
> * Λυpάμαι ότι δεν θα μιλήσετε σε με.*
> 
> Anyway, cairete,
> 
> waterbuf


It is close but not correct in syntax and wording.
First observation: you are using future tense in greek directly translated from the future tense in english, but I am assuming that the sentence "you won't talk to me" is not refering to "you will not talk to me sometime in the future", but it is a construction in english revealing some kind of intention, like "you don't want to talk to me". In greek, present tense would be appropriate.
Second observation: in english there is no distinction between formal and informal "you". In greek it is like in french. In your sentence you are using the formal plural form.

Anyway, to cut it short, this is the way I would say it, using the informal form (like you would talk to someone familiar):

Λυπάμαι που δε μου μιλάς
or
Στεναχωριέμαι που δε μου μιλάς
or
Λυπάμαι/Στεναχωριέμαι που δε θέλεις να μου μιλήσεις : I am sad that you don't want to talk to me.


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## ireney

Well there's always the "ΝΟΥΣ ΥΓΙΗΣ ΕΝ ΣΩΜΑΤΙ ΥΓΙΗ" which means that a healthy mind (abodes, exists) in a healthy body.

Can't for the life of me remember any other!


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## waterbuf

Flaminius said:
			
		

> *Latin:*
> Hic Rhodus, hic saltus.
> _Here is Rhodos, here is to jump._
> 
> When an athlete bragged that once he made a great jump in Rhodus, he was challenged thus to prove the feat himself.



Yes, Flaminius, you are right -- quite right -- about the origin of the 
quote.  Here is the Wikipedia version of it, but it is in German:

*Hic Rhodus, hic salta*

*aus Wikipedia, der freien Enzyklopädie*

[I had a snippet from the Wikipedia here but had to delete it  cuz it conatined 
built-in links  Being a greenhorn here, I am not allowed to post URLs or LINKs till 
I am a senior like you.]  If you'd like to see it, go for

+"Hic Rhodus, hic salta" +Wikipedia.  

You may get it in German. It gives more detail of the story of the braggard..... I'll try posting it once more. After I copied and pasted it, the G-D links may have been eradicated.

Before I go, pity that, with a name likek (Gaius) Flaminius, you don't have
more Latin.  I am glad I grew up studying Latin and, later, majored in Latin.
If you have questions re Latin, shoot them my way.  

Hope this will go now.


*Hic Rhodus, hic salta!* ... bedeutet: Zeig hier, was du kannst.
Die Worte stammen ursprünglich aus der Fabel "Der Prahlhans" von Aesop und galten als Aufforderung an einen, der wiederholt mit seiner herausragenden Leistung beim broad jump in Rhodos geprahlt hatte. Als seine Gesprächspartner genug von seiner Prahlerei hatten, forderten sie ihn auf, das Geleistete hier und jetzt zu wiederholen.

    Ob die landläufig übliche Übersetzung mit _salta = springen_ so ganz korrekt ist, stattdessen _saltus_ wie im griechischsprachigen Original heißen müsste, wird kontrovers wiedergegeben.

And your translation is OK too.  I, retired Latin Prof, would rephrase it thus:

      Here is Rhodos.  Now JUMP (Show what you can do, you sonofabitch) !!!

As for the precise text of it, there's room for doubt.  There may have 
been a Greek version of it.  If so, RHODUS would probtably have been 
RHODOS and the SALTA may have been somethin like  SALTUS.  Not
impossible.  SALTUS could be Nominative Plural of the noun JUMP and it
could be taken as "Hier IS Rhodos.  Hier (show your) JUMPS.

A bit farfetched though.  Any reference I have seen to the saying has
been "Hic Rhodos (yes, Latin could use the Green ending): hic salta!

The SALTA would be the imperative form of the Latin verb SALTARE =
to jump but also to dance.  Even the DANCE translation would make 
sense as a challenge to the braggard: "Here IS Rhodos.  Now perform
your dance!!!"  But JUMP would be more appropriate in this case.

The very origin of it?  According to Wikipedia, it first appeared in the
Aesop fable "The Braggard."  The bragging there was about his performance
in the broad jump event.

Forgive if I have wasted your time with something that's neither here nor there.

waterbuf

PS:  You probably know anyway.  If you don't know about your famous Roman
namesake, do a search for "*Gaius Flaminius Nepos."  He was quite the character.
*


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## waterbuf

Greek or Latin athletic mottos?  Here the classic Latin one:

Orandum est ut sit mens sana in corpore sano.

You should pray that there be a healthy mind in a healthy body.

The quote is from Juvenal's "Satire X 356."  In that satire he deplores the
foolishness of human beings asking the gods for the impossible in prayers.
"All you should pray for," he says, "is that there be a healthy
mind in a healthy body."


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## waterbuf

Sou efcaristw poly..skatoulitsa...

You hit the nail on the head.  I knew that what I had put together was

   close but not correct in syntax and wording. [your words]

Your explanations make perfect sense.  You see, I am a linguist and,
half a century ago, I studied classical Greek.  Just recently I tried to
acquire some demotic Greek. Egw katalabaine much more than I milw.
Can't get the Greek font here.  Would have to write it somewhere else
and then copy and paste it.  The three options you offer are poly
kala.  I'd protimw the last one:

I don't remember how I managed -- after much trial and error -- to
post my original Greek phrase in Greek fonts.  Now I can't get Greek
fornts.


 Λυπάμαι που δε μου μιλάς
 or
 Στεναχωριέμαι που δε μου μιλάς
 or
 Λυπάμαι/Στεναχωριέμαι που δε θέλεις να μου μιλήσεις : I am sad that you don't want to talk to me.[/quote]

I like your precise explanation why the English apparent future "you won't speek" cannot be translated by a future tense into Greek. I sort of knew that anyway.

I am aware of the two forms of YOU in Greek too.  Among the languages I
handle well, German and Italian and Spanish have different YOUs too.  Spanish, in fact, has FOUR forms of YOU --

     tu -- you singular, informal
     usted -- you singular, formal
     vosotros -- you plural, informal
     ustedes -- you plural, formal.

cairome pou sas gnorizw

Please convert this to Greek font for me.  

Ambros


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## skatoulitsa

waterbuf said:
			
		

> cairome pou sas gnorizw
> 
> Please convert this to Greek font for me.
> 
> Ambros



Χαίρομαι που σας γνωρίζω

Also, to set up greek (and any other language) as keyboard input, if you are on windows you can go Control Panel>Regional and Language Options click on the Languages tab, click Details, and there you can add any language you want. Usually you switch between input languages with Left Alt+Shift (or other combinations that you specify, but I think that's the default).
As for the keyboard layout for greek letters, whenever there is a latin letter equivalent, then it is the same key, and for the few that are different you can probably find the layout with a google search.

@ireney:
Isn't the correct form: Νους υγιής εν σώματι υγιές ?


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## skatoulitsa

And going back to quotes, here are some:

γνώθι σαυτόν : know thyself 
In the polytonic system: γνῶθι σαὐτόν
Unfortunately I don't know how to write the rest in polytonic, which is the original, and looks prettier imho...

μηδέν άγαν : nothing in excess

μέτρον άριστον : moderation is a virtue / moderation in everything

ουκ εν τω πολλώ το ευ : quality is not in quantity

το δις εξαμαρτείν ουκ ανδρός σοφού : doing twice the same mistake is not a wise man's doing

In all the above I've given kind of a free translation because ancient greek is very compact and condense, making it hard for me to give in english the "feel" of the quote. (in other words, I can't make it sound as cool  )


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## Zanos

skatoulitsa said:
			
		

> Isn't the correct form: Νους υγιής εν σώματι υγιές ?



The correct form is: "Νους υγιής εν σώματι υγιεί"."Υγιές" is the nominative case.


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## ireney

Urgh! Stupid typo! That's what you get for letting a machine auto-correct your possible mistakes and not checking afterwards! Zanos is absolutely correct.


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## MrPedantic

Hello Asi

I would suggest a line or two from Pindar, who wrote many odes in praise of athletes.

This, for instance, from the first Pythian Ode:

to de pathein eu prôton aethlôn​"Good fortune is the first of prizes."

(I can't do the Greek characters on my keyboard, unfortunately.)

MrP


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## Zanos

MrPedantic said:
			
		

> to de pathein eu prôton aethlôn​"Good fortune is the first of prizes."
> 
> (I can't do the Greek characters on my keyboard, unfortunately.)


*
"Τό δέ παθείν εύ πρώτον αέθλων"*


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## MrPedantic

Thank you very much, Zanos!

MrP


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## lhshurdl3r

Could somebody translate "Citius Altius Fortius" into actuall Greek characters?  I'm not a translation buff so I can't do it lol.


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## ireney

lhshurdl3r you mean translate it to ancient Greek?


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## lhshurdl3r

ireney said:
			
		

> lhshurdl3r you mean translate it to ancient Greek?


 
yes lol sorry about that. i apologize.


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## Kevman

I think "citius, altus, fortius" is probably a modern motto, so I'm not sure about Ancient Greek, but in Modern Greek it is:

ταχύτερα, υψηλότερα, δυνατότερα
(tahitera, ipsilotera, thinatotera)

or in all caps:
ΤΑΧΥΤΕΡΑ, ΥΨΗΛΟΤΕΡΑ, ΔΥΝΑΤΟΤΕΡΑ


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## ireney

ῥᾷον,,ὑψηλότερον,ἰσχυρότερον would be my best guess but, as Kevman said, it's in Latin originally so his modern Greek translation is what you'll probably find if you google it for instance.


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## Kevman

ireney said:
			
		

> his modern Greek translation is what you'll probably find if you google it for instance.


It is. I did.


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