# EN: le subjonctif en anglais



## Junky_Hero

[...]
Mais en anglais, le subjonctif c'est quoi ?



Moderator note:  This thread was split from another thread.
The reason for the split is that the thread originally had two related questions.


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## Moonlit-Sunset

Très souvent il est rendu par un présent.
Il faut que je parte -> I have to go
Je ne pense pas qu'ils soient là -> I don't think they're here

Après peut-être que cela dépend des phrases


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## viera

Un exemple de subjonctif en anglais :
I suggested that he *come *with us.


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## butch from waco

viera said:


> I suggested that he *comes *with us.


Or "that he came" maybe but I'm not sure....


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## GEmatt

Junky_Hero said:


> Mais en anglais, le subjonctif c'est quoi ?


C'est surtout moins évident en anglais qu'en français, JH ! Lire ici pour en avoir plus d'infos (sous "The subjunctive in English" --> "Form"; tu y verras la confirmation de l'exemple fourni par viera, plus haut.


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## Junky_Hero

Pourquoi "that he comes" et pas "that he come" ?
Au subjonctif, on met seulement la base verbale non ?
Merci pour le lien GEmatt 

Et l'exemple de l'autre thread est t-il juste :

Without that he be wounded


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## jann

I suggest that he comes with us 
I suggest that he come with us 
I suggest that he should come with us. 
I suggest that he came with us tick

The first conjugation (comes) is the 3rd person singular present tense, not the subjunctive... and it sounds wrong to my ear, because we do need a subunctive or a modal here.

The second conjugation is the 3rd person singular subjunctive.

The third conjugation is uses the 3rd person singular conditional mode, and is a perfectly acceptable (and common) substitute for the subjunctive in this sentence.

The fourth sentence is grammatically correct, but totally different.  You are discussing how he arrived at the gathering, and you don't quite remember.  Did he ride with John?  Or with Cathy?  You took another friend to the gathering, and you seem to remember that he rode in your car too... so you say, "I suggest that he came with us."  You are not proposing that he should do something, but rather trying to establish the fact of what actually happened.

PS.  Without that he be wounded  but you must discuss that sentence in a separate thread.


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## Junky_Hero

right, thank you


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## c10pa

parfois il y a une difference entre le sens d'une phrase au subjonctif et d'une phrase a l'indicatif. voici deux phrases dont le sens est subtilement different, a mon avis.

I expect that he's done with his homework. (indicatif)
I expect that he be done with his homework. (subjonctif)

The first implies that you expect he is already done with his homework, while the second one implies that he is not done yet, but should be done by a certain time. does anyone agree with me?


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## Becky85

jann said:


> I suggest that he comes with us
> I suggest that he come with us
> I suggest that he should come with us.
> I suggest that he came with us tick
> 
> Surely you mean 'I suggestED' in each of these examples?
> 
> Otherwise
> 
> I suggest that he comeS with us would make sense.
> 
> E.g. 'If we leave him here, they'll find him and he'll tell them where we've gone'
> 
> 'Then I suggest that he comes with us, that way he won't be able to reveal our whereabouts'.
> 
> 'I suggest that he came with us' definitely does not make sense, unless you meant 'I suggestED that he came with us' e.g.
> 
> 'We didn't know whether to leave him there, but we were worried he would tell them our whereabouts, so I suggestED that he came with us'.


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## GEmatt

c10pa said:


> parfois il y a une difference entre le sens d'une phrase au subjonctif et d'une phrase a l'indicatif. voici deux phrases dont le sens est subtilement different, a mon avis.





c10pa said:


> I expect that he's done with his homework. (indicatif)
> I expect that he be done with his homework. (subjonctif)
> 
> The first implies that you expect he is already done with his homework, while the second one implies that he is not done yet, but should be done by a certain time. does anyone agree with me?


I agree with the first part, but not with your explanation of the respective implications. I don't think the meaning in your sentences hinges on when and/or whether the homework is done; instead, the difference is as a result of the emphasis given to the word 'expect' in each case.

In the first case, 'I expect' is basically preamble, with the 'that' being what Wikipedia refers to as a complementizer. The subjunctive is not used, in such instances (cf. example sentence in §1 of the linked article).

The second case (expanded, if I may, to give a more natural-sounding phrase) calls more clearly for the subjunctive, for example in

_I expect that he be done with his homework by the time I get home._

as expressive of a wish (whether that wish is fulfilled is irrelevant). I'm not the grammarian though, so don't take this as definitive.


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## Philip(pe)

butch from waco said:


> Or "that he came" maybe but I'm not sure....



No, "I suggested that he comes with us" and "that he came with us" are both wrong. "I suggested that he come with us" is correct, as is "I suggested that he should come with us.

A good discussion of the use of the subjunctive in English, with examples, can be found here:
http://www.ceafinney.com/subjunctive/guide.html


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## jann

Becky85 said:
			
		

> Surely you mean 'I suggestED' in each of these examples?
> Otherwise
> I suggest that he comeS with us would make sense.


Hi Becky, 

No, actually I didn't mean to write "suggested."  There was no typo. --> _I suggest that he come with us._

It's true that we often say in spoken English "I suggest that he comes..." but this is perhaps not technically correct, because it uses the present indicative ("he comes") when we should instead use the present subjunctive ("that he come").  That said, we often don't bother to use the English subjunctive, so I understand that it could sound odd to you.


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## afbyorb

The last vestiges of the subjunctive in English:
*If* I *were* you I wouldn't learn anything about the subjunctive.
  Long *live* the Queen.
  "A-tisket a-tasket, I lost my yellow basket and *if* that girlie *don't* bring it back, I know  that I shall die."


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