# springs (years)



## elroy

In Arabic and Spanish, you can use “springs” (as in the season) to mean “years” in reference to someone’s age.

30 springs = 30 years of age 

Do any other languages do this?


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## סייבר־שד

I know of at least the following that do the same: French, Italian, Catalan, Portuguese and Galician. Maybe it's a feature common to all Romance languages? 

However, I would say that such an usage would almost surely be perceived as dated, literary or deliberately humorous in all of those, just like in Spanish; I don't know about Arabic, though, and I sure didn't know Arabic did that, too!

*Last-minute edit: *it seems Hebrew also shares that particular usage of the word "springs" to refer to someone's age, at least according to the Sapir Dictionary. I'll wager it's only a dated/literary/poetic term there, as well, but I can't say for sure, maybe @Drink , @Abaye or @amikama could kindly help us out here with that?


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## AquisM

I guess _summer_ is often used in a similar sense in English.

In Chinese, we use 春秋 _springs [and] autumns_ to poetically refer to someone's age and to the passing of time in general.


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## apmoy70

We poetically count summers:

52 καλοκαίρια = 52 summers (we use the colloquial «καλοκαίρι» [kalo̞ˈce̞ɾi] (neut.) = «καλός» [kaˈlo̞s̠] + «καιρός» [ce̞ˈɾo̞s̠] --> _good-season/weather_, instead of the more formal «θέρος» [ˈθe̞ɾo̞s̠] (neut.)).


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## alfaalfa

Ciao,


elroy said:


> In Arabic and Spanish, you can use “springs” (as in the season) to mean “years” in reference to someone’s age.


the same in Italian.

30 _primavere_ = 30 years of age

_Avere molte primavere _(_sulle spalle_)_ >_ To have so many springs (on the shoulders) = To be old.


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## Yendred

In French, we can say:

_30 printemps = 30 years_

But it's quite a literary use. When someone uses it in daily life, it sounds offbeat and humorous.


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## amikama

סייבר־שד said:


> it seems Hebrew also shares that particular usage of the word "springs" to refer to someone's age, at least according to the Sapir Dictionary. I'll wager it's only a dated/literary/poetic term there, as well, but I can't say for sure, maybe @Drink , @Abaye or @amikama could kindly help us out here with that?


Yes, it's common to use all seasons in birthday wishes:
מזל טוב במלאת לך X אביבים / קיצים / סתווים / חורפים

But normally you don't use seasons to indicate age (unless humorously):
-בן כמה אתה?
-אני בן X.
(Not: אני בן X אביבים.)


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## Stoggler

I’m not aware of English using “spring” in this sense, and as pointed out “summer” can be used in a similar way.

Old English used to use “winter” in this context, which makes sense (more people generally die during the winter months, especially when one’s hovel lacked double glazing and central heating!), so by making it through another winter means you’re another year older (I guess).


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## ThomasK

Indeed, Dutch does so too. However, I love referring to 65 summers or even winters at the age of 65, and that is understood (and tolerated). ;-)


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## alfaalfa

Stoggler said:


> Old English used to use “winter” in this context



THE LORD OF THE RINGS (the movie)
The Two Towers:

(before Helm's Deep fight)
..."ARAGORN: Farmer, farriers, stable boys. These are no soldiers.
GIMLI: Most have seen too many winters.
LEGOLAS: Or too few"...

In Italian
..."ARAGORN: _Stallieri, maniscalchi, coltivatori. Questi non sono soldati._
GIMLI: _Molti hanno visto troppi inverni._
LEGOLAS_: O troppo pochi_"_..._


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## Nanon

Yendred said:


> In French, we can say:
> _30 printemps = 30 years_
> But it's quite a literary use. When someone uses it in daily life, it sounds offbeat and humorous


Actually, the "spring" metaphor is more frequent when associated to "higher" numbers: _80 printemps_. It has a mixed taste of irony and sincere wishes for a long and happy life, whereas the person you are talking about is entering the _winter _of their life, not the spring.


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## Frank78

It doesn't work with the contemporary "Frühling" in German but with the dated/poetic "Lenz" it does.


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## apmoy70

Nanon said:


> Actually, the "spring" metaphor is more frequent when associated to "higher" numbers: _80 printemps_. It has a mixed taste of irony and sincere wishes for a long and happy life, whereas the person you are talking about is entering the _winter _of their life, not the spring.


We don't associate old age -above 80- with the metaphor of counting springs or winters, we do say though that above 80 "we're in the winter of our lives" (i.e. near the end)


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## Awwal12

Russian, like many other Slavic languages, may count years in summers, but not springs.  Specifically, it uses the word for summer as the suppletive form of the word for "year" when counting beyond 4 (5-20, 25-30, 35-40 etc.).

Generally I'd expect counting years in springs for languages that have originated in tropical and subtropical arid  regions.


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## Panceltic

Awwal12 said:


> Russian, like many other Slavic languages, may count years in summers, but not springs.  Specifically, it uses the word for summer as the suppletive form of the word for "year" when counting beyond 4 (5-20, 25-30, 35-40 etc.).
> 
> Generally I'd expect counting years in springs for languages that have originated in tropical and subtropical arid  regions.



We do count years in springs in Slovenian  (_Sedemnajst pomladi v meni žensko že budi_, go the lyrics of a popular song [Seventeen springs already awaken a woman in me]).

However, the word for year (_leto_) doesn’t mean summer, we say _poletje_ for that.


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## Yendred

The etymology of Romance for _year _(Spanish _año_, Italien _anno_, French _année, _Latin _annus_) is quite representative, since it's cognate with _anulus = ring, _which denotes the circular rhythm of the year.


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## Sobakus

Apart from the largely lexicalised/grammaticalised summers, Russian also uses winters, as seen in the expression _ско́лько лет, ско́лько зим!_ “long time no see”, lit. “how many summers, how many winters”. Winters seem to have been a way to count years in PIE already, as in Latin _bīmus, trīmus_ “two, three winters-old” and in Indo-Iranic.

The Germanic word for “year” comes from PIE _*yóh₁r̥,_ oblique _*yéh₁n-_ (neut.) “year”.

This is also the origin of Slavic _jarъ/o/a_ (all three genders) “spring tending towards summer”. This word is archaic in most languages, but I wouldn't be surprised if it had been used to count years.​​The adjective _hōrnus_ “this year's, less than a year old” seems to be the only remnant of _*yóh₁r̥_ in Latin (the first element is as in _hoc_ “this”); it forms a series with _bīmus_ and _trīmus._​
The Latin calendar under the kings (called Romulus' calendar) started in spring, with the first month being _Mārtius_ (Mars the war god's), likely so called because that's when military campaigning began and sacrifices to Mars took place. But it doesn't look like springs were used to count years of life – they used summers instead, as in Slavic: _aestās_, from _aestus, -ūs_ “heat”. The similarity with _aetās_ “age” is accidental.


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## Sobakus

My general impression, looking at the languages mentioned here, is that “spring” is used for counting years of life in those cultures that put a smaller emphasis on agriculture, and in regions where the climate/geography is more suitable for cattle breeding; “summers” are used where agriculture is more important and the climate more suitable for it.

Summers (and autumns) are an obvious reference to farming seasons, basically it's harvests that are being counted. Spring on the other hand is the season when calves and other cattle are born, so you can count its age in either springs or winters. This may also be the etymology of Slovenian _pomlád__,_ i.e. _po_ “after” + _mlád_ “young” + i-stem endings, so “the time after the young are born”.

Proto-Indo-European using winters in this function also fits the picture well – it's generally agreed that this society was originally nomadic-pastoralist, and acquired agriculture relatively late.


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## Mahaodeh

Sobakus said:


> My general impression, looking at the languages mentioned here, is that “spring” is used for counting years of life in those cultures that put a smaller emphasis on agriculture, and in regions where the climate/geography is more suitable for cattle breeding; “summers” are used where agriculture is more important and the climate more suitable for it.


I don’t know about that. In Arabic spring and autumn refer to being young and old. You would say someone is in the spring of his life to mean he is young, in the health and strength of youth, while someone in the autumn of his life is someone that has past youth and middle age and reached the end of his life. I’ve always understood it as using the year and seasons as a metaphor for one’s lifespan.


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## WadiH

I wonder if the Arabic usage is a calque from French.  I see the expression mostly in what I call "Newspaper Arabic", in which French and English calques are not uncommon.  Is it used in French journalistic prose (newspapers, magazines, etc.)?


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## Sobakus

Mahaodeh said:


> I don’t know about that. In Arabic spring and autumn refer to being young and old. You would say someone is in the spring of his life to mean he is young, in the health and strength of youth, while someone in the autumn of his life is someone that has past youth and middle age and reached the end of his life. I’ve always understood it as using the year and seasons as a metaphor for one’s lifespan.


But that's completely different from what's described in this thread. This thread is about the *metonymy* of some particular season for one full year, and using that to count age – and this is what I've offered an explanation for. What you describe is a *metaphor* of the yearly cycle for an entire human life. Both of these are used in English, there's no overlap between them, and neither one precludes the other.


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## Mahaodeh

WadiH said:


> I wonder if the Arabic usage is a calque from French.  I see the expression mostly in what I call "Newspaper Arabic", in which French and English calques are not uncommon.  Is it used in French journalistic prose (newspapers, magazines, etc.)?


I was wondering the same thing. I don’t know about French, but it’s relatively recent in Arabic (from the last century or so).


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## סייבר־שד

Mahaodeh said:


> I was wondering the same thing. I don’t know about French, but it’s relatively recent in Arabic (from the last century or so).


Not all that recent in French, it seems, though by far not to be ranked among the true oldies, either.  According to the CNRTL its first attestation meaning *year *(of age) is from 1770. 

The entry for *printemps *there also includes this little excerpt from Victor Hugo, which I'd forgotten about:

_"Le moment où la femme cesse de compter  par printemps et commence à compter en hivers est irritant". _(HUGO_, Homme qui rit, _t. 2, 1869, p. 44).

A rough translation could be: 

_"The moment a woman stops counting in springs and starts counting in winters is annoying." _


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## Drakonica

In Polish:
rok - a year
lato - a summer
lata - years, summers

It is possible to use a word "wiosny" (springs) too, but it is poetic / archaic.


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## Encolpius

No,  that phenomenon does not exist in *Hungarian*.


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