# Car names



## ThomasK

Let's stick to *car names*, and find sources for them, or motivations (or reservations, objections). I can think of some: 

Some kind of *values*
- *animals* (Tigra, but there should be many more)
- *winds* (Tornado, Vento ...)
- *nature* in general maybe (Laguna, ...)
- *freedom* (included in nature perhaps)
- *high numbers* (seeming to betray higher quality: 500, 2000, ...)
(- complex numbers: 3.0 seems to refer to updated computer software - but I suppose this is not used in cars)

*Sounds*
- the *i/a* difference in _Tigra)_ 

For example: how do you explain the names of electric cars, *Tesla, Reva, Venturi, Volt* _(Nissan (2 ?), Renault, Chevrolet, respectively, I believe)_
- the mysterious *x* in Lexus,

*'Njets', objections:* 
- references to death or evil : 400 in China (death, I believe), 666 (evil), 13 (which would be too low as well, I suppose)


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## ewie

A few years ago there was a British car called a _Nova_ ('newness [novelty, innovation, etc.]').  It couldn't be marketed with the same name in Spain where
'no va' means _it doesn't go_


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## ThomasK

Great ! How globalisation works !


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## Stoggler

ewie said:


> A few years ago there was a British car called a _Nova_ ('newness [novelty, innovation, etc.]'). It couldn't be marketed with the same name in Spain where
> 'no va' means _it doesn't go_


 
Other cars have had the same problem in certain parts of the world.  The Toyota MR2 didn't sell in French-speaking countries, probably due to MR2 sounding like emmerdeux!  And similarly, the Pajero doesn't sell (or has a different name?) in Spanish-speaking countries due to that word having a rude meaning.  

And Sega (not a car manufacturer!) struggle in Italy, as that is an Italian rude word!


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## ThomasK

Thanks. I remember *MR2*, but what is the meaning of *Pajero* and how about *Sega* coffee then? or is the _freddo_-addition so important ? (Cold coffee ? ;-))


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## Frank78

I´ve heard the sales figures of Prosche´s 911 broke down after 9/11 in the US.

The second thing is would you buy a car which numbers are the same as an emergency call?


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## ThomasK

I think certain cultural problems are unavoidable simply. What if it changes again, etc.? 

By the way: how could we analyse 911 ? Big/ high number, and maybe a combination of a high figure (number?) and two small ones ? I mean: we love *contrast and 'extremity': i/a, 9/1, black/ white*. But I might be going too far here...


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## Stoggler

ThomasK said:


> Thanks. I remember *MR2*, but what is the meaning of *Pajero* and how about *Sega* coffee then? or is the _freddo_-addition so important ? (Cold coffee ? ;-))


 
*Pajero* - are we allowed to use swear words here...?  Erm, I shall define it as a slang word that means "one who masturbates"...  

I believe that *sega* has the same meaning in Italian.  I don't know about Sega Coffee, or how the electronics company publicise themselves in Italy.


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## ThomasK

I found a note about (Mr. ?) Segafredo (one d, sorry) here: "Mr. Segafredo, which is a totally made up name which means something like "*saw cold*" and probably has some cool Italian idiomatic meaning (...)". Any Italians around who can help ?


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## Stoggler

ewie said:


> A few years ago there was a British car called a _Nova_ ('newness [novelty, innovation, etc.]'). It couldn't be marketed with the same name in Spain where
> 'no va' means _it doesn't go_


 
Apparently that's a bit of an urban myth, as discussed here


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## ThomasK

INteresting, thanks. I suggest everyone goes on reading here , about mistranslations. But we ought to get back to other car names. Noone has suggested an explanations for the three names of electric cars ! ;-)

For example: did the Japanese mspronounce 'Stallion' when creating *'Starion'* ? I wonder. I suppose the 'star' was more important... Or was the Mustang the trigger?


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## ewie

Stoggler said:


> Apparently that's a bit of an urban myth, as discussed here


Haha ~ I did think while I was posting that _"I wonder if this is an urban myth ..."

_Electric cars? _*Volt*_? ~ it's a unit of measurement of electricity.  Also, if it's a _Che*v*r*ol*e*t*_, I'd call that 'pretty clever'
_*Tesla*_ was an electrical inventor.
_*Reva *('re va')_ is sort-of-French for _it goes again_ ~ you plug it in for a while and _it goes again_.


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## ThomasK

Waw ! Of course: you could analyse 'Volt' phonetically and perceive 
- a forceful, becaused voiced start /v/, 
- a roaring engine resounding in the open /o/,  which by the way is more open in American English than in Dutch and BrE, symbolizing the 'opening' (revelation) of its power, and then
- the /t/ signalling the start like a thunderbolt exploding (/t/ is a plosive)... 

Do I have too vivid an imagination ?


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## ewie

Not too vivid for _me_, Thomas

The one I'd like to see an (attempt at an) explanation of is _Qashqai_ ~ which I always hear as _cash cow_.


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## ThomasK

Just amazing that a brand launches a car by that name. *Qashqa*i then... What I could think of is *the intriguing Q*: must be a special car ! By the way, *Q* is a plosive again, in alliteration by the way, followed by an open */a/* (velar or palatal) [power twice], ending in a hissing */sh/* (speed ?) and starting again [*Q2 ;-)* ](other aspect of the car ?) and ending endlessly ;-) (*ai* - the i can be pronounced for as long as your breath is). 

Is there a Japanese around to add lexical comment ? (Nissan is Japanese, isn't it ?)


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## cuchuflete

Cars of my childhood that no longer exist:

1. Named for the inventor or owner of the automobile company:
Studebaker
Nash
Oldsmobile  (Company founded by Ransom E. Olds)
Hupmobile (Really long before my time, but I saw an ancient one once when I was a kid.)

2. Named for explorers, who are now considered un-PC?
De Soto

3. American Indian Chief:
Pontiac

4. Place of historical significance
Plymouth (Rock)

5. Definitely not pulitickully keerect these days:
Chrysler Imperial

6. Bird.  (Yes, a bird!)
Skylark (Model in the GM Buick family)

7. Noble adjective:
Valiant  (Affectionately known as "The Prince", in reference to a comic book character.)
 
8. U.S. auto manufacturers have always had an affection for place names for individual models:

Sebring [racing location]
Daytona [racing location]
Tahoe
Many more I choose not to remember.


Are car nicknames allowed in this thread?  The best of all time, well documented in the novel Cinco Horas con Mario by Spanish writer Miguel Delibes, is "El ombligo".  That was the SEAT 500, the Spanish-built FIAT 'everyman's car'.  Why was it called the "bellybutton"?  Because everybody had one.  <silly grinning smiley>


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## ThomasK

Very American, but very interesting ! ;-) But un-PC? Are you referring to his Conquistador background somehow ? What did the car belong to: Buick or ... ?


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## cuchuflete

The DeSoto was a Chrysler brand, positioned in the upper-middle range, above Plymouth and Dodge, and below the Chrysler.  It competed, more or less, with the Oldsmobile (General Motors) and Mercury (Ford).  I learned to drive (sitting on my father's lap) in a 1952 version, with "fluid drive", which was something between a standard transmission and an automatic transmission.   Here is a picture of a 1952 model.


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## rusita preciosa

In the 1970s the Soviet-made sedan *Zhiguli* (named after the Zhiguli Mountains where the plant was located) was marketed under the name of *Lada* in Europe. Legend has it  that the reason was that “Zhiguli” sounded similar to “Gigolo” thus not appropriate for European languages. I think the truth was simply that Lada is easier to pronounce and spell. Now all models (including ones sold in the domestic market) are called *Lada*.

I’m wondering why the same car is called *Mitsubishi Pajero* in Europe and *Mitsubishi Montero* in the US; *WV Bora* in Europe and *WV Jetta* in the US??

EDIT: since we share nicknames, when FIAT was trying to enter the US market, its nickname was *F*ix *I*t *A*gain, *T*ony


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## gotitadeleche

> 6. Bird. (Yes, a bird!)
> Skylark (Model in the GM Buick family)



That was my first car! 

Don't forget another bird: the Pontiac Firebird (Trans Am)


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## federicoft

ThomasK said:


> I found a note about (Mr. ?) Segafredo (one d, sorry) here: "Mr. Segafredo, which is a totally made up name which means something like "*saw cold*" and probably has some cool Italian idiomatic meaning (...)". Any Italians around who can help ?



'Sega' means 'saw' in Italian, but it is also a slang word for masturbation. 
There are many jokes on the name of the company, but the correlation is not exactly immediate, and with Segafredo there is none.


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## Miguelillo 87

ewie said:


> A few years ago there was a British car called a _Nova_ ('newness [novelty, innovation, etc.]'). It couldn't be marketed with the same name in Spain where
> 'no va' means _it doesn't go_


 
Well I have to disagree on that, nova it's also a phase of a star. And when a Spanish native hear that, we don't think neither on the star nor the No Va, but as you, in something new.Actually here in México we have a brand named Innova. 

About names of cars, I remember, in my merketing class, we were taught that. We have to choose "international" names. 

For example there was a car in Japan named Laputa.  (Tha Whore) in Spanish.

Obviously nobody will buy this car. 

Another Japanese car was, Moko. (Snot) in Spanish .


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## ewie

Ah well, it probably _was_ an urban myth then, Miguelillo

On the subject of nicknames, when my parents were first married (c.1960) they had a car which they always refer to as 'our Sit-Up-And-Beg'.  Unfortunately I've no idea what car it was ... or why they called it that ... I'll have to ask them.


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## Miguelillo 87

ewie said:


> On the subject of nicknames, when my parents were first married (c.1960) they had a car which they always refer to as 'our Sit-Up-And-Beg'. Unfortunately I've no idea what car it was ... or why they called it that ... I'll have to ask them.


 
About nicknames, Here in Mexico we have a general one for the VW beetle (well the first one) We call it Vocho or Bocho. 

As a matter of fact 5 yrs ago in Mexico city almost all taxies were Vochos.

In the port of Acapulco you can see almost all taxies are still vochos


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## cuchuflete

ewie said:


> Ah well, it probably _was_ an urban myth then, Miguelillo
> 
> On the subject of nicknames, when my parents were first married (c.1960) they had a car which they always refer to as 'our Sit-Up-And-Beg'.  Unfortunately I've no idea what car it was ... or why they called it that ... I'll have to ask them.



You are invited to the Dictionary Additions forum, dear Profe Yúster!



*Ford Prefect - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia*

The _car_ progressed in 1953 from its original perpendicular or '_sit-up-and-beg_' style to a more modern 3-box structure. Like its siblings, the _car_ became a *...*
E93A (1938-49) - E493A (1949–53) - 100E (1953–59)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Prefect - Cached - Similar - 
*1957 Ford Pop, (sit up and beg) Beautiful. SOLD on Car And Classic UK*

1957 Ford Pop, (_sit up and beg_) Beautiful. SOLD, £4995 We are very pleased to offer for sale this great little _sit up and beg_ Pop. Finished in black with.
www.carandclassic.co.uk › For Sale › Classic Cars › Ford - Cached

*Ford POP SIT UP AND BEG TYPE for Sale on Car and Classic UK*

Ford POP _SIT UP AND BEG_ TYPE for Sale on _Car_ and Classic UK. *...* Classic _Cars_ for Sale and Wanted on _Car_ and Classic co.uk. Private/ · TVR 350I Convertible. *...*
www.[B]car[/B]andclassic.com/classic_*cars*.php?make=21... - Cached


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## sokol

ThomasK said:


> Just amazing that a brand launches a car by that name. *Qashqa*i then... What I could think of is *the intriguing Q*: must be a special car !



Nothing in the name Qashqai is remotely Japanese - this in fact is the name of a Turkic tribe.
So yes, a car named after a people.

Animals now - there are a few nice animal nicknames:

- VW Käfer = Beetle
- 2CV = deux chevaux (two horses) or German Ente (duck)
- Opel Manta = manta ray
- Golf Rabbit (that's the German name!)


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## Frank78

I´ve alway wondered why VW called their luxury model "Phaeton".

Phaeton in Greek mythology:
Phaeton wanted to drive his chariot (the sun) for a day. 
Phaeton was unable to control the fierce horses that drew the chariot as they sensed a weaker hand. "...consider what impetuous force Turns stars and planets in a diff'rent course. I steer against their motions; nor am I Born back by all the current of the sky. But how cou'd you resist the orbs that roul In adverse whirls, and stem the rapid pole?"[2]
 First it veered too high, so that the earth grew chill. Then it dipped too close, and the vegetation dried and burned. He accidentally turned most of Africa into desert; burning the skin of the Ethiopians black.
 "The running conflagration spreads below. But these are trivial ills: whole cities burn, And peopled kingdoms into ashes turn."[3]
  Eventually, Zeus was forced to intervene by striking the runaway chariot with a lightning bolt to stop it, and Phaëthon plunged into the river Eridanos. 
(source:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phaëton)

A bad seller was the "Ford Probe" in Germany. "Probe" means "test, sample, try".


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## ewie

cuchuflete said:


> *1957 Ford Pop, (sit up and beg) Beautiful. SOLD on Car And Classic UK*


That's the one, Mr.F ~ I remember the name now.  Now that is a _handsome_ car.  (Why are all cars so darned _ugly_ these days?)



sokol said:


> Nothing in the name Qashqai is remotely Japanese - this in fact is the name of a Turkic tribe.


How silly of me not to have made that blindingly obvious connexion, Sokkers



Frank78 said:


> A bad seller was the "Ford Probe" in Germany. "Probe" means "test, sample, try".


I seem to recall that one was a bit of a flop everywhere, Frank.  The word has _very_ unfortunate associations in English (which I won't go in to).


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## lablady

Some manufacturers have taken to naming their cars with a meaningless gobbledy-gook of letters. The changing of all the Acura model names to letters is a good example: 





> "The letters don't actually mean anything," said John Watts, senior manager of product planning at Acura, which makes the RDX. Acura once had models like the Integra and Legend, but dropped the names in favour of the more "upmarket" letter system in the mid-1990s.
> "Studies showed that the Legend name was more highly recognized than the Acura brand itself," Watts said. "We wanted to change that, and over the years it has definitely worked."


Source, including more examples from other manufacturers.

This practice could have some entertainment value as car-owners try to turn the letters into acronyms and give their cars nicknames.


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## ThomasK

sokol said:


> Animals now - there are a few nice animal nicknames:
> 
> - VW Käfer = Beetle
> - 2CV = deux chevaux (two horses) or German Ente (duck)
> - Opel Manta = manta ray


 
Some reactions: 
- I'll have to look up a 'manta ray'
- Golf Rabbbit indeed - but *why not a hare?* It is even faster, I think ! (Why only rabbits and bunnies, never hares ? 
- VW : *'kever'* was used in Dutch too
- 2CV : we called it *een geitje*, a little goat (a goatee ;-)) --- now who is right ??? 

But more important: what was the link between those cars and those names? I cannot see any link (except for the rabbit's speed), but there must be something... 

QQ: interesting, thanks !


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## ThomasK

lablady said:


> Some manufacturers have taken to naming their cars with a meaningless gobbledy-gook of letters. The changing of all the Acura model names to letters is a good example: Source, including more examples from other manufacturers.
> 
> This practice could have some entertainment value as car-owners try to turn the letters into acronyms and give their cars nicknames.


 
I found some more indeed: 
 - Lamborghini Gallardo coupe is named after a bull
 - Thunderbird, Barracuda, Charger and Firebird,for 'big-block cars'

Adn the author concludes: " 'The truly high-end cars still use names,' DeLorenzo said. "Look at Bugatti and Bentley. Rolls-Royce is showing the Ghost at Frankfurt' ."


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## miguel64086

rusita preciosa said:


> In the 1970s the Soviet-made sedan *Zhiguli* (named after the Zhiguli Mountains where the plant was located) was marketed under the name of *Lada* in Europe. Legend has it  that the reason was that “Zhiguli” sounded similar to “Gigolo” thus not appropriate for European languages. I think the truth was simply that Lada is easier to pronounce and spell. Now all models (including ones sold in the domestic market) are called *Lada*.



In Chile Lada were very popular cheap cars.  They were ugly and people used to say that it was the "communist way: functional not pretty".

Who can forget the DeLorean ? 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeLorean_DMC-12

The DeLorean was named after the manufacturer's last name


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## ThomasK

Stupid joke about Ford in my dialect years and years ago: "Ford is vort", which means : "Ford is rotten" _(the word 'vort' as such would be interesting for etymology: Dutch and English only know 'rot', whereas I am fairly sure it is the same word...)_


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## elirlandes

cuchuflete said:


> Are car nicknames allowed in this thread?  The best of all time, well documented in the novel Cinco Horas con Mario by Spanish writer Miguel Delibes, is "El ombligo".  That was the SEAT 500, the Spanish-built FIAT 'everyman's car'.  Why was it called the "bellybutton"?  Because everybody had one.  <silly grinning smiley>



The original version, the Fiat 500 [cinquecento] was always known in France as the "pot de yaourt" (the yoghurt pot) due to its shape and small size.


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## Hitchhiker

A popular nickname for the Pontiac GTO is "Goat". When I studied in Belgium I saw some American car clubs there.


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## ewie

I'm not making this up.  When I lived in France (1992-97) I used sometimes to see a car model that was called a _Cake_.  (I've no idea who manufactured it).  That always made me fall about laughing like an idiot.


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## gurseal

I remember the following from my country:

*Animals*:
Dodge *Ram*
Chevrolet *Impala*
Ford Falcon, *Taurus*
Renault *Dauphine*
American Motors *Eagle*, *Hornet*

*Nature*:
Ford *Galaxie*/Galaxy??
Chevy *Vega*, *Avalanche*, *Astro*, *Cobalt*
GMC *Canyon*, *Savana*, *Sierra*


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## ThomasK

Gread additions, those animals. I am beginning to wonder: do the Americans use more animal names for cars ? 

The nature series is interesting. And somehow I am quite sure the words have some 'sound value' as well: just listen to the 'bright' (vital ?) sounds, it sounds like... Italian !


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## gurseal

ThomasK said:


> Gread additions, those animals. I am beginning to wonder: do the Americans use more animal names for cars ?
> 
> The nature series is interesting. And somehow I am quite sure the words have some 'sound value' as well: just listen to the 'bright' (vital ?) sounds, it sounds like... Italian !


I can't feel the brightness at the moment. I must lack some sort of training in that. However, _eagle_ in the U.S. is a patriotic symbol that would be in keeping with the name of the defunct company--American Motors.


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## ThomasK

Well, I have quite some imagination and I come fromL/ live in a language where you have lots of 'deaf e''s (as in _understand_), as every infinitive has -en. Maybe that adds to my appreciation of "deaf e-less" words... 

Eagle: you don't have a car like that. I thought of German *Adler*, but that is not a name of a car either, I am afraid. But thinking of Germany: the notorious though now famous GDR car was/ is called *'Trabant'*: a companion, like in the Communist countries (all forced friends, I'd say;-).


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## SDLX Master

Stoggler said:


> *Pajero* - are we allowed to use swear words here...? Erm, I shall define it as a slang word that means "one who masturbates"...
> 
> I believe that *sega* has the same meaning in Italian. I don't know about Sega Coffee, or how the electronics company publicise themselves in Italy.


 
A masturbator, wanker or any alternate synonym is what pajero means in Spanish, but *what does pajero mean to the original manufacturer*? That is one thing I'd like to know.


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## ThomasK

I have just found a list of cars here. it is interesting as such, but I do not see new perspectives really. Or maybe some
 -  I do think the idea of travelling is often there (through nature ?): *Voyager, Range Rover, Land Cruiser,* *.Wrangler* (?).. 
 -  the tribes, but again maybe those close to nature and associated with power: *Comanche, Qashqai, Touareg*, .. 
 -  there are a lot with /ch/ and /s/: I suppose it is not a matter of a sound issue (/c/ can be pronounced as [k] or [(t)sh], but could it be that the s is a stylish letter, relatively soft also ?


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## Sepia

sokol said:


> Nothing in the name Qashqai is remotely Japanese - this in fact is the name of a Turkic tribe.
> So yes, a car named after a people.
> 
> Animals now - there are a few nice animal nicknames:
> 
> - VW Käfer = Beetle
> - 2CV = deux chevaux (two horses) or German Ente (duck)
> - Opel Manta = manta ray
> - Golf Rabbit (that's the German name!)



Small correction:

Manta, Rabbit, and deux cevaux aren't nicknames. Only the "Käfer" (Beetle) is.

Manta was as far as I know the only name this Opel was sold under.
Rabbit was the Amercan name they had to give the Golf for what reason ever.

......

Besides, before we overinterpret things: These names are, like all other product names, made up by copy-writers. Is possible that the automotive industry has a different name for them, but basically they are copy-writers.

Copy-writers don't really give a damn if the names they make up have any symbolic value or not. They make up names they hope will trigger the right emotions with the prospective consumer. Sometimes they don't even give it any thought what these names sound like in other languages or what emotions they arouse in other cultures, although they'd be wiser if they did.

A good example was the German cat-food brand they considered giving the name "Kinky". May be they thought that Kinky was a good name for something that kitty-cat would eat. Fortunately somebody stopped them ...

Another good example si the famous tooth-brush from Dr. Best. Maybe this works fine in Germany and seems like an appropriate name for the nice elderly gentleman in the white coat that you see in the TV-ads. One country where this did not work is Denmark. I can't really remember what it is called in Denmark - at least nothing that made me remember. But obviously they never gave it any thought that a lot of the TV-ads are also seen by the Danes, and there are still lots and lots of Danes around that know from their history books that Dr. Best (not him but another Dr. Best) was the head of the Danish section of the GESTAPO during WWII. And the association between dentists and torture may not be too far away to a lot of people.

So my advice: Don't overinterpret brand-names. There are great copy-writers around and there are really stupid ones. I should know. I have them around me on a daily basis.


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## gurseal

Wow! It never occurred to me that copywriters were entrusted also with naming the products. In the case of automakers, do the copywriters tend to have a background in engineering and design, and would such a background necessarily make them good copywriters in this field? Or am I getting off track? It's just that I think of all the names given to pills and medicines and figure that the people who name the products must have backgrounds in pharmaceuticals or healthcare or something related.


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## ThomasK

Sepia said:


> Besides, before we overinterpret things: These names are, like all other product names, made up by copy-writers. Is possible that the automotive industry has a different name for them, but basically they are copy-writers.
> 
> Copy-writers don't really give a damn if the names they make up have any symbolic value or not. They make up names they hope will trigger the right emotions with the prospective consumer. Sometimes they don't even give it any thought what these names sound like in other languages or what emotions they arouse in other cultures, although they'd be wiser if they did.
> 
> So my advice: Don't overinterpret brand-names. There are great copy-writers around and there are really stupid ones. I should know. I have them around me on a daily basis.


 
I agree that we should not overinterpret those names. However, my point is that those names work to some extent, and that *consumers are influenced by it, somehow subliminally*. So: if I wish to point out those backgrounds, it is also in order to show what kind of feelings are triggered, unconsciously. Some people buy a Range Rover, but wish to forget that their 4x4 contributes to the destruction of open space. It is unfortunately very hard to say how publicity and names work, but they do; otherwise not that much money would be invested in copywriters! I think they are trying to arrive at some effect, and some information may counter that. Isn't that what a book like _Hidden Persuaders_ is about? Nowadays we know the effect is unpredictable, but communication has its effect, and lots of 'collateral damage' sometimes, but that is another issue.


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## Grop

ThomasK said:


> But more important: what was the link between those cars and those names? I cannot see any link (except for the rabbit's speed), but there must be something...



Regarding _deux chevaux_ (two horses) I think it's about horsepower (actuallly fiscal power). Informally, they are often called _deuche_.

Also, I have always thought of the BMW Beetle as shaped like a beetle. In France they are called _Coccinelle_ (fr for ladybug) or just _Cox_.


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## rusita preciosa

Sepia said:


> Besides, before we overinterpret things: These names are, like all other product names, made up by copy-writers.


That's not at all how it works (at least for big companies such as automakers). I have worked on a naming project (in a different industry) so I can tell you that large companies develop brand names with the help of vendors who employ personnel with PhDs in linguistics, behavioral science etc... Sometimes the vendors are full-cycle ad agencies, sometimes they are small houses specialized in naming. Like anyone, they can be good at what they do or not.

First, the client gives the vendor a brief where they explain what is needed from the name, the vendor does the initial research and comes up with a long list of names, the client weeds out the names that will not work, then a trademark search is conducted, leaving only the names that can be trademarked in the countries where the product will be launched, then the short list is tested on the consumers (sometimes the consumers are involved on an early stage for qualitative research, but it is very expensive), than the short list is finalized and the client picks out the one.
Why are there so many bad names:
- the vendor may not be qualified or may not give the project needed resources (e.g. a big ad agency who have million-dollar projects may just not give a damn about a hundred-thousand dollar naming project).
- the client's brief may be written poorly or vaguely
- the client may not take agency's advice (aren't we all expert-namers)
- the research may not hit all perspective markets (hence names that do not work in certain languages) 
- the best name for the product may not be trademark-defendable in important markets
etc... etc... etc...

I agree with you on one point: no reason of over-thinking the names, they are not the most important attribute of a brand, after all, *Chanel#5* is a terrible brand name!


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## ThomasK

Great information. Just one question, Rusita: is there any way of proving that it works, or how ? How important could the name be for the sales figures ? I think it is quite hard to prove, just asking...


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## rusita preciosa

The only way I know to prove the effect of one name vs. another on the sales figures, is to conduct primary market research. You pick out two markets, with similar market conditions (you try as much as possible to nullify all other variables, such as overall consumer preferences, distribution differences, even weather or driving conditions...) and launch the product with different name in each market. The problem is that this is extremely expensive since a very large sample size is needed (because it is virtually impossible to find two similar enough markets). I can’t even begin to know what statistical analyses are needed to compare the results – other vendors, with PhDs in math and statistics are employed for that 
 
I would be surprised if any company would invest in a project like this. I think they would rather take this money and invest in other brand attributes and communications. It is simply the question of priorities and resource allocation. 
 
One of the posters gave an example of a toothpaste Dr.Best whose name was not appropriate in Danish(?). Well, if the Danish market makes only 5% of all brand’s revenue and the name happened to be trademark-sound in Denmark, would they allocate resources of re-naming it just for that country? I don’t think so.


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## rusita preciosa

gurseal said:


> In the case of automakers, do the copywriters tend to have a background in engineering and design, and would such a background necessarily make them good copywriters in this field?


The "copywriters” do not need to have engineering background. They need to understand linguistics and human behavior. 
 
I would even argue that they should be as far removed from the industry as possible to be able to come up with novel ideas. Being an expert can be limiting sometimes. The client (in this case the automaker), who is the expert in the industry, in the product and who knows who their consumer is, will guide them if necessary and will have the last say on the name.


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## Hakro

cuchuflete said:


> 1. Named for the inventor or owner of the automobile company:
> Studebaker
> Nash
> Oldsmobile  (Company founded by Ransom E. Olds)
> Hupmobile (Really long before my time, but I saw an ancient one once when I was a kid.)  --> Robert Craig Hupp (1976-1931)
> Abarth --> Karl "Carlo" Abarth (1908-1979)
> Alfa Romeo --> Nicola Romeo (1876-1938) bought the A.L.F.A. company in 1915
> Allard --> Sydney Herbert Allard (1910-1966)
> Arnolt --> Stanley Harold "Wacky" Arnolt (1907-1963)
> Austin --> Sir Herbert Austin (1866-1941)
> Bentley --> Walter Owen Bentley (1888-1971)
> Benz --> Carl Benz (1844-1929)
> Borgward --> Carl Borgward (1890-1963)
> etc. etc.
> 
> 2. Named for explorers, who are now considered un-PC?
> De Soto --> Hernando de Soto (1500?-1542)
> Cadillac --> Antoine de la Mothe Cadillac (1656-1730)
> 
> 3. American Indian Chief:
> Pontiac --> Indian Chief Pontiac (1715-1769) had given his name to the city where Pontiac cars were produced. Before the GM Pontiac there had been two short-lived Pontiac makes.
> 
> 4. Place of historical significance
> Plymouth (Rock) --> Plymouth city
> There are many car makes called for their "historical" home towns (Praga for example) but Plymouth was produced far from Plymouth.
> Lagonda --> a small brook flowing through Springfield, Ohio, the home town of Wilbur Gunn (1859-1920) who built cars in UK. It must have been a historical place for Mr. Gunn.
> See also point 8 below.
> 
> 5. Definitely not pulitickully keerect these days:
> Chrysler Imperial
> ZIS --> written something like Zavod Imiena Stalina (factory for the glory of Stalin ???)
> 
> 6. Bird.  (Yes, a bird!)
> Skylark (Model in the GM Buick family)
> Birds: Adler, Aiglon, Albatros, Albatross, Aronde, Bantam, Black Hawk, Bluebird, Condor, Coq, Crane, Crow, Eagle (many versions), Falcon, Firebird, Hawk (many versions), Hirondel, Hummingbird, Kestrel, Kingfisher, Kondor, La Mouette, Lark, Pinguin, Redbird, Sandpiper, Snipe, Sunbird, Superbird, Swallow, Swift, Tercel, Thunderbird, Tchaika, White Swan. Not to mention other animals.
> 
> 7. Noble adjective:
> Valiant  (Affectionately known as "The Prince", in reference to a comic book character.)
> King cars have been manufactured both in UK and US, Queen cars in US and Canada.
> 
> 8. U.S. auto manufacturers have always had an affection for place names for individual models:
> Sebring [racing location]
> Daytona [racing location]
> Tahoe
> So have the British:
> Austin Hereford, Cambridge etc.
> Morris Oxford, Cowley etc.
> Then there are model names of different makes for racing tracks all over the world: Le Mans, Mille Miglia, Brooklands, Nürburg, Targa Florio, etc.


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## ThomasK

Simply impressive ! There are a lot that I have never heard of, but I trust you...;-) But I do not want a pinguin car !


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## Hakro

ThomasK said:


> But I do not want a pinguin car !


Neither do I. Pinguin was a primitive three-wheeler manufactured only for a short time in 1954 in Germany.


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## rusita preciosa

"5. Definitely not pulitickully keerect these days:
Chrysler Imperial
ZIS --> written something like Zavod Imiena Stalina (factory for the glory of Stalin ???)"

The Moscow Automotive Factory was founded in 1916 and changed the name several times. 

From 1931 to 1956 it was ZIS (Zavod Imeni Stalina) - Stalin Factory (*imeni* means something like "named after / in the name of", no "glory" there)

After 1956 it became ZIL (Zavod Imeni Likhacheva) - Likhachev Factory, named after one of the founders of the Soviet automotive industry, who ran the factory in the 30s, 40s and 50s.


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## ThomasK

Oh yes, ZIL is something I remember. This question is turning into an (interesting) history lesson !


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## Hakro

rusita preciosa said:


> From 1931 to 1956 it was ZIS (Zavod Imeni Stalina) - Stalin Factory (*imeni* means something like "named after / in the name of", no "glory" there)


 Thanks for correction, Rusita Preciosa! 
 I knew that my interpretation wasn't correct, that's why I put there three question marks.


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## Hakro

Frank78 said:


> I´ve heard the sales figures of Prosche´s 911 broke down after 9/11 in the US.
> 
> The second thing is would you buy a car which numbers are the same as an emergency call?


I'm not sure about the sales in 2001 (9/11 year), but Porsche announced model 911 sales records in the US both for 2006 and 2007.

Yes, I could buy a Prosche 911 because our (European) emergency call number is 112. But I could also buy an Autobianchi A112 (manufactured from 1969 to 1985).


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## Juri

The name of the Japanese car *Qashkai *sounds strange in Italian. We don't pronounce the "H", so _cascai_ means I'm fallen.

Somebody don't know how many *old* jokes exist about FiAT cars.
" The Fiat drivers don't greet  during the day, because early in the morning they have already been all together by the mechanic."

"The Fiat instruction booklets are very thick, because there are enclosed
the start time of all the buses."

By the way, the coffee brand Segafredo is the family name.

Correct my English, please.


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## Sepia

gurseal said:


> Wow! It never occurred to me that copywriters were entrusted also with naming the products. In the case of automakers, do the copywriters tend to have a background in engineering and design, and would such a background necessarily make them good copywriters in this field? Or am I getting off track? It's just that I think of all the names given to pills and medicines and figure that the people who name the products must have backgrounds in pharmaceuticals or healthcare or something related.


 
No, not that kind of copy-writers - advertising copy-writers. The same guys that come up with text like

... it's the real thing!

up to complete image promotion books.

The procecure is usually like this: A has a new product. Goes to advertising agency B (out or in house) and says find us a name.
The creative director (who is often a graphic designer, often also an advertising copy writer) in cooperation with his copy-writers find out what the product is all about, who it is going to be sold to and make up a few names, bring them to the marketing people with A. They, in turn, say this or that name is OK, or they say try again. Graphic designers may or may not at this stage be involved. Usually they are not; that is the next step. They may or may not do deeper research with the help of psychologists or such. Depends on the budget. 

Big corporations, like the automotive industry, may do all this with their own people that may be organized in product management, marketing or an in house advertising agency, but basically that makes no real difference. Soft drinks, pet's food or cars, they are all products with a name, an image, a potential consumer.

And these guys don't necessarily think much in terms of symbolism. What counts are usually emotions.


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## rusita preciosa

Sepia said:


> And these guys don't necessarily think much in terms of symbolism. What counts are usually emotions.


That's quite a sweeping assumption... It actually depends on the client. A task can be done only as well as its objectives are set. If the brief is well written and clearly says "symbolism", they will think in terms of symbolism. Again, like in any trade, some take pride in their work, some don't care, some will recycle what they did for previous clients, some will do honest work. Your local garage mechanic or an ad agency are not much different in these terms. 

...and sometines at the end the little niece of the CEO comes up with a cute name and that will be it, agency or no agency


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## SDLX Master

SDLX Master said:


> A masturbator, wanker or any alternate synonym is what pajero means in Spanish, but *what does pajero mean to the original manufacturer*? That is one thing I'd like to know.


 
Nobody has an answer to my question?


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## Hakro

SDLX Master said:


> Nobody has an answer to my question?


English Wikipedia:
"The Mitsubishi Pajero is a sport utility vehicle manufactured by Mitsubishi Motors. It is known as the Mitsubishi Montero in the Americas (except Brazil) and Spain, and as Mitsubishi Shogun in the United Kingdom. It was *named after a mountain cat* that inhabits the Patagonia plateau region in southern Argentina."


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## SDLX Master

Hakro said:


> English Wikipedia:
> "The Mitsubishi Pajero is a sport utility vehicle manufactured by Mitsubishi Motors. It is known as the Mitsubishi Montero in the Americas (except Brazil) and Spain, and as Mitsubishi Shogun in the United Kingdom. It was *named after a mountain cat* that inhabits the Patagonia plateau region in southern Argentina."


 
Thank you for shedding light on the issue, Hakro. I appreciate it.


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## WhoSoyEu

In case somebody would be interested in knowing the name of brazilian cars, see here


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## mirx

Names of States:
Sonora
Durango
Dakota
Nevada

Native indian tribes:
Cherokee
Yukon
Chayenne

I am sure there are many more.


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## ThomasK

The list of car names is impressive of course, but if there are any special Portuguese-Brazilian names, it would be even more interesting. I think *Puma* could be a little Brasilian, for example. 

The most interesting aspect about this search to me is : why are state names, tribe names, chosen, etc. ? My guess is (see #1) that there is the association with freedom, or power, even with nature (which appeal to most people, even if they realize that their cars pollute the exact nature those names are referrring to), and that quite some names have a 'strong' sound, making them easy to remember, etc. 

I'd love to hear more about the specific kind of considerations that lead to the choice of particular names. Someone did point out that in some cases the CEO/ PDG/ ... finally imposes his daughter's name for purely sentimental reasons (I think it is the case with *Mercedes* (-Benz). 

Which reminds me: are there many cars having feminine names ??? I think car business has always been very masculine (in the traditional sense).


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## Sepia

ThomasK said:


> ..
> 
> I'd love to hear more about the specific kind of considerations that lead to the choice of particular names. Someone did point out that in some cases the CEO/ PDG/ ... finally imposes his daughter's name for purely sentimental reasons (I think it is the case with *Mercedes* (-Benz).
> 
> Which reminds me: are there many cars having feminine names ??? I think car business has always been very masculine (in the traditional sense).



Conc. Mercedes: That is a very old and well known story - and as far as I know also very well documented. 

Where I have my doubts is with the name "Lada". The story goes that one guy had about two hours to decide for a new brand name for a car brand that hitherto had only been sold in Russia under a, for Westerners less attractive name. He then decided for the name of his girlfriend. 

It probably is a very masculine business - but then one should not be really surprised by the feminine brand names. Many of them are old, like Merdedes-Benz, many are also simply family names. The really interestinge ones are probably the type names that are made up along the way. 

I don't really see that there are many gender-related names there. I see a lot of neutral ones, like F 458, 911, R4, and the whole range of animals like the Puma, Tigra, Viper, Mustang, Firebird, and whatever. 

The only feminine type name I could think of on the spot is the "Giulietta". May have something to do with her being the counterpart of "Romeo" in the Shakespeare play, at least in Italian. (The pun: It is one of the most famous cars from auto-maker "Alfa-Romeo", a name that was coined by pronouncing the letters AR in the international radio alphabet.

Where I am not too sure they did the right thing was the "Pajero" - I am not too sure, but I've heard that it is not a really flattering word in Latin America.


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## Polizón

Mistique: Nazca.


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## WhoSoyEu

Puma was a brazilian brand of sport cars. See about it here:
http://www.pumaclube.com.br/


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## lablady

I found a fun one: Nissan S-cargo

Supposedly, "S-cargo" stands for "small cargo", but the similarity to the French word for "snail" is unmistakable (escargot). Personally, I think Nissan was fully aware of the potential double meaning when they decided what to name the car. 

I have to say that the vehicle does bear a striking resemblance to a snail.


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## Chaska Ñawi

mirx said:


> Names of States:
> Sonora
> Durango
> Dakota
> Nevada
> 
> Native indian tribes:
> Cherokee
> Yukon This is a Canadian province, not an Indian tribe.
> Chayenne
> 
> I am sure there are many more.



Do you notice how only western locations are represented?  Nobody's driving around in a Conneticut, an Iowa, a Veracruz or an Ontario.  

The Cougar received a severe set-back here after it ran a series of ads showing somebody abandoning a pair of dogs on the highway and putting a cougar into the back of the car in their place.


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## gurseal

lablady said:


> I found a fun one: Nissan S-cargo
> 
> Supposedly, "S-cargo" stands for "small cargo", but the similarity to the French word for "snail" is unmistakable (escargot). Personally, I think Nissan was fully aware of the potential double meaning when they decided what to name the car.
> 
> I have to say that the vehicle does bear a striking resemblance to a snail.


And comparing this name to Nova, I wonder about the perceived performance of a car with a snail-sounding name.


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## ThomasK

I do think French associate 'escargots' with gastronomy than with biology or literature... ;-)


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## gurseal

ThomasK said:


> I do think French associate 'escargots' with gastronomy than with biology or literature... ;-)


ThomasK, I just meant that some people associate snails with a lack of speed and power, just as a Spanish speaker might see the oddity in promoting a car whose name suggests a lack of dependability
(no va / Chevrolet Nova).

The expression _at a snail's pace_ comes to mind.


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## ThomasK

Of course, of course, I understood, but I think the French do not make that association because they have other words for 'slugs' such as _arion_ or _limace_. Those are indeed associated with what you think. So basically we agree, however, in practice escargot probably does not have that association... But we'd need a native speaker of French to confirm that...


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## Grop

To me _escargot _is clearly associated with a lack of speed. Now, I don't think this car was ever sold in a French-speaking country.


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## Sepia

Grop said:


> To me _escargot _is clearly associated with a lack of speed. Now, I don't think this car was ever sold in a French-speaking country.



I never heard of that one - I'd associate it with a white van, if any vehicle at all. 

However, vans usually have les adventuros names. The most down-to-earth one I could think is the VW, simply called 

Transporter

Still, we all know how white-van-drivers drive:

Mercedes Sprinter 

is more like it. 

For some inexplicable reason Turkish shopowners in Germany are especially fond of the 

Ford Transit,

even those shopowners who neither im- nor export goods.





Hakro said:


> English Wikipedia:
> "The Mitsubishi Pajero is a sport utility vehicle manufactured by Mitsubishi Motors. It is known as the Mitsubishi Montero in the Americas (except Brazil) and Spain, and as Mitsubishi Shogun in the United Kingdom. It was *named after a mountain cat* that inhabits the Patagonia plateau region in southern Argentina."




This more or less proves my point further up thread: Copy-writers and others who make up product names, sometimes just pick some name that they find sounds good, that they think trigger the right assosiations, then come up with a name of some cat that "nobody" has ever heard of, and this is as far as the research goes - in the worst case scenario. And the next thing we know of is that half South-America is laughing their heads off because to them it means somebody who is sitting around masturbating.

Copy-writers usually are not psychologists, PhDs in philosophy nor the like. Some are just copy-writers, some started out as journalists, some of the best ones I know are university dropouts who have studied subjects like socioligy, history and the like.


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## gurseal

ThomasK said:


> Let's stick to *car names*, and find sources for them, or *motivations* (or reservations, objections).
> Some car makers (at least in my area of the world) used names "associated" with the "old country" (somewhere in Europe), sometimes for prestige:
> 
> Buick *LeSabre, Reatta, Riviera*
> Cadillac *DeVille*, *Seville, Allante, Eldorado*
> Mercury *Marquis*, *Montego*
> Ford *Crown Victoria, Torino*
> Chrysler *LeBaron, Cordoba*
> Chevrolet *Cavalier, El Camino, Chevelle*
> Oldsmobile *Toronado*
> Pontiac *Lemans, Gran Prix* (Racing??)
> AMC *Matador*
> 
> Now (and not necessarily from Europe) there are names such as
> Toyota *Sienna (sp??)*
> Dodge *Durango*


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## ThomasK

Interesting hints. You are right, I think: prestige - but again, those are also well-sounding names... Some notes though:
 - Siena (one n) would be Italy. 
 - Toronado: Tornado (a wind) ???


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## gurseal

ThomasK said:


> Interesting hints. You are right, I think: prestige - but again, those are also well-sounding names... Some notes though:
> - Siena (one n) would be Italy.
> - Toronado: Tornado (a wind) ???


In the US, Toyota uses the double-N spelling; and yes, the spelling was Tor*o*nado. I don't know why.


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## ThomasK

Because there was a Spanish bull inside ? A _toro_ ? The sound becomes different as well, I think...


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## Polizón

Speaking of toros... the story for the name or Lamborghini Murcielago is interesting.
Regards.


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## Juri

Notwithstanding I visited the Lamborghini factory years ago, didn't know about the  tradition of car names from bullfighting.
It has been interesting to see there a "Diablo"with destroyed front part, but with intact cockpit and  Swiss driver quite unharmed.


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## catlady60

gurseal said:


> I remember the following from my country:
> 
> *Animals*:
> Dodge *Ram*
> Chevrolet *Impala*
> Ford Falcon, *Taurus*
> Renault *Dauphine*
> American Motors *Eagle*, *Hornet*
> 
> *Nature*:
> Ford *Galaxie*/Galaxy??
> Chevy *Vega*, *Avalanche*, *Astro*, *Cobalt*
> GMC *Canyon*, *Savana*, *Sierra*



Some makes no longer in production:
Mercury *Cougar* (now has some unfortunate connotations in the US)
Ford *Pinto* (the car with the exploding gas tank--if someone rear-ended that car, and you _and_ car were history ) 
Lamborghini *Murcielago *(Spanish for "bat"--it really _flies!!!)

_


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## Cpt.Eureka

Here's a new one:

Alfa Romeo Giuletta

My first thought was "Romeo and Juliet"? Did no one tell them, how this story goes? I mean, both are dead at the end and why on earth should I literally get in the middle of this?


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## catlady60

Cpt.Eureka said:


> Here's a new one:
> 
> Alfa Romeo Giuletta
> 
> My first thought was "Romeo and Juliet"? Did no one tell them, how this story goes? I mean, both are dead at the end and why on earth should I literally get in the middle of this?



How many of those cars can you find in a salvage yard?


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## Punky Zoé

ewie said:


> When I lived in France (1992-97) I used sometimes to see a car model that was called a _Cake_.  (I've no idea who manufactured it).  That always made me fall about laughing like an idiot.


Are you sure Ewie, I can't remember such a thing


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## Forero

_Cordoba_ is not really the name of a place, as far as I know. The city in Spain is _Córdoba_, with the accent on the first _o_. Ricardo Montalbán clearly said _Cordoba_ for the car, not _Córdoba_.

One car name I have wondered about is _Passat_, apparently German for "trade winds". Wouldn't that be an odd thing to call a car in Barcelona (Catalan "by-gone", "has-been", "passé")?


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## sound shift

When I was a kid, there was a rumour that Rolls-Royce was planning to call its next new model the _Silver Mist_ but had a change of heart when an employee realised that "Mist" was German for "dung".  Could be an urban myth (I've never really understood why these myths don't reach the countryside, but I digress).

Up to about the 1950s there was a British car manufacturer called "Standard", a name evocative of, well ... 1950s austerity. I don't know what caused Standard's demise. Something tells me it was a merger, rather than the fact that the name (and possibly the car) was a bit _pshitt_. There couldn't be a car called "Standard" now, of course. It would have to be called the "Entry-Level" .

Question: What's special about the name "Toledo"?
Answer: There have been two Toledos - the Triumph Toledo and the Seat Toledo. No prizes for guessing which is/was the more naff.


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## Polizón

There are names of Japanese cars that in Spanish is really funny read.
Mazda Laputa
Nissan Moco
Mitsubishi Pajero
Many times they change the name for the Spanish and Latin American market.


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