# Zwitterstunde



## candel

Hi,
I read this poem and cannot understand this compound noun. Appreciate some help.

Regnet hernieder in den Zwitterstunden, wenn sich nach Morgen wenden alle Gassen....

It rains down into the (something)hours, when all alleyways wend towards morning.


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## Hau Ruck

I believe it means _in between_.  So _in between hours_; most likely between dusk and dawn.  I believe it is taking on the form of "hybrid" here.


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## candel

I had a hunch it meant that...I guess a native could settle it conclusively...


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## Hau Ruck

candel said:


> I had a hunch it meant that...I guess a native could settle it conclusively...



Yeah, I'm _pretty _certain but never completely certain with German! haha.  Definitely will be curious to see what a native says as well.


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## candel

We will just have to tap our fingers until a native shows up, but I am sure we are right. I am sure it means the in-between hours or maybe the ambiguous hours, though it can be confusing what this actually means. I mean there is no ambiguity as to what day an hour belongs to. Possibly the ambiguity lies in the hours which both equally resemble the fading hours of a departing day as well as the burgeoning of a new one. Reminiscent of a painting by van Gogh in which experts argued over whether the sun was a rising sun or a falling one.


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## Hau Ruck

Yeah, I think it's probably meant to be taken more poetically than literally.   
I think perhaps it has deeper meaning than the hours.  Perhaps more of a feeling those "in between hours" posses?  
Poetry can be so odd, indeed.  I have a hard enough time understanding them in English, let alone German.


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## candel

Yes it is definitely a poetic device. I think the poem is alluding to the idea of daylight hours corresponding to the waking hours of consciousness while the nebulous, ambiguous, in-between hours, that are formless as yet are of the nature of the unconscious and dream. Great poetry will seek to go beyond words and create meanings out of new strange juxtapositions such as "zwitterstunde" so the meaning can only be found in this meta-meaning, that is more than the sum of its parts. It is difficult. But that is why poetry "can" be great.


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## Hutschi

Hi, it is poetic, and so it uses metaphors.

I think they mean the hours between night and dawn (as twilight - the light of the night and the light of the dawn are meeting each other).

I think, it is also connected to "Zwielicht" - which encloses the strange light between night and dawn.

---

  But the context is: Regnet hernieder in den Zwitterstunden, wenn sich nach Morgen wenden alle Gassen ...
and this is connected to "morgen" - to dawn. (twilight zone)

Rain all down in the hours of twilight, when all lanes are turning into the direction of morning.

These are the hours showing day and night at the same time.


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## candel

Thank you Hutschi for a great analysis...


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## Hutschi

I try to make the "Zwitter" picture more clear. It is the time where you have day and night at the same time.
Moon and Sun are there possibly at the same time (male and female)
also "der Tag und die Nacht" have different gender. 

There are  two principles connected to/meeting each other.

"Twilight" is only because it has a similar meaning and resemples the sound.


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## Hutschi

Here is a translation.
Note that you did not give enough context for the grammar.

http://colecizj.easyvserver.com/pgrilein.htm

I translated Imperative but this was wrong. You can recognize this in the first stanza.

" (sie, die Einsamkeit) regnet herunter in den Zwitterstunden

"Zwitterstunden" emphasizes the principle of loneliness here.

... loneliness rains down during the hours/in the hours when dawn arises (twilight hours) and the morning comes. = the end of the night maybe after a sleepless night.

Please always give sources. This helps to avoid misunderstandings.


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## exgerman

Ithink it definitely means_ neither the one nor the other, but partaking of both._ Some cousins used to call nectarines Zwitter because they were neither peaches nor apples, but had skin like the one and the flesh like the other.


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## Hutschi

Here they translate "twittering hour": http://famouspoetsandpoems.com/poets/rainer_maria_rilke/poems/16348

The translater sees the sound as more important than the sense here.


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## candel

I didn't have the full poem...I just came across a part of it. i don't even know the name of the author...


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## Hutschi

Hi Candel, nicht so schlimm.

It is Rilke. And the Poem is "Einsamkeit" 

http://yearwithrilke.blogspot.de/2011/03/loneliness.html - Here they translated "twilight" as I prefered in my own translation.

If you search for "Loneliness" and "Rilke" you'll find lots of translations.

After considering several I stick to "twilight". Does this make sense?


Consider loneliness as key.


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## candel

I think twilight hours is good. There are many translations and some are better than others. But I think he used the words he did advisedly. "Zwitterstunde" I think he uses deliberately. He could have used "dämmerung" but he didn't so I guess he meant something with zwitter. It could have been just that the word dämmerung is just so played by now...


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## Hutschi

exgerman said:


> Ithink it definitely means_ neither the one nor the other, but partaking of both._ Some cousins used to call nectarines Zwitter because they were neither peaches nor apples, but had skin like the one and the flesh like the other.



I think this makes sense. I additionally think it as picture of waiting a long time, of a sleepless lonely night now.


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## candel

Nicht so schlimm? I am not cross if that is what you mean... Else I would go  hehe

< ... >
It rains down into the nebulous hours,
when all alleys wend towards morning,
and when bodies, which found nothing,
disappointed and sad leave one another,
< ... >


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## Hutschi

Nicht so schlimm, dass Du es nicht hattest, das Gedicht ist jetzt klar.
Enjoy the whole text, thanks Internet.


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## Hutschi

I  found an additional connotation of "Zwitterstunden" in the given context. They have a double face.
For some they are the hours of loneliness, for others the most lucky ones - which darkens the loneliness even more.

In one of the sources there is a painting. http://yearwithrilke.blogspot.de/2011/03/loneliness.html


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## Taillefer

Zwitter means "hermaphrodite".  ...in den Zwitterstunden: = in the hermaphrodite hours, i.e. during that part of the day before dawn when it is neither entirely light or totally dark (sometimes called "false dawn".


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## Kajjo

Zwitter- and Twilight- is the same idea with the stem "two". This is the best translation.


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## Taillefer

If Zwitter means twilight in this case, why does the next verse (wenn sich nach Morgen wenden alle Gassen)  indicate that the streets are turning toward "morning"? If twilight is meant, why aren't they turning toward night?


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## Kajjo

Twilight refers to both morning and evening in English (see Wikipedia). It is about the absence of shadows and the peculiar indirect illumination.

The word _Zwitter_ means something along hybrid or hermaphrodite, i.e. a mixture of two things. It has the same stem like the number _Zwei, _as is also true for _twilight _and _two_. In the invented word "Zwitterstunde" this bivalent state is focused.

_Regnet hernieder in den Zwitterstunden, wenn sich nach Morgen wenden alle Gassen....
It's pouring down in the hours of dawn (twilight), when all alleys turn to morning..._


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## Taillefer

Kajjo, please, I'm not trying to be contentious, but, in spite of Wikipedia, to most speakers of English the word "twilight" refers to a phenomenon that occurs at the end of
the day. In support of this I offer: forum.wordreference.com/threads//dusk-twilight.1790472/, quoting Thomas Tompion, Senior Member, English-England: "The use of 
twilight to mean the early morning as night turns to day, is not unknown in literature, but I've never heard it in everyday modern speech in BE."


Pertinax Senior Member (from Australia) agrees: "...in modern everyday English, as Thomas Tompion points out, "twilight" always refers to the end of day, literally or
figuratively..."   Pertinax, May 4, 2010.

This also true in the USA. 

Respectfully, Taillefer.


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## Kajjo

You are the English native. However, the German version is meant as dawn. Zwielicht (twilight) is used in German for both dusk and dawn.

_It's pouring down in the hours of dawn, when all alleys turn to morning..._


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## Taillefer

Fine. Rilke, however, did not use  "Zwielicht" but "Zwitter," which leaves the question still open.


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