# When I was having a bath the phone rang



## rom_itn

Hi all, How should I translate this sentence? 

-When I was having a bath the phone rang

Here's my go..
- Facevo il bagno quando il telefono ha squillato
Many thanks
Rom


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## Jana337

Secondo me è giustissimo. Ma userei "prendere un bagno" invece di "fare un bagno" che mi sembra più adatto per il mare.

Jana


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## V52

rom_itn said:
			
		

> Hi all, How should I translate this sentence?
> 
> -When I was having a bath the phone rang
> 
> Here's my go..
> - Facevo il bagno quando il telefono ha squillato
> Many thanks
> Rom



Dear Rom  it should be better:
"Mentre facevo il bagno ha squillato il telefono" 
Vitt52


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## lsp

Jana337 said:
			
		

> Secondo me è giustissimo. Ma userei "prendere un bagno" invece di "fare un bagno" che mi sembra più adatto per il mare.
> 
> Jana


I don't think you can use prendere with bagno in any context ... but let's ask the Italians


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## Jana337

lsp said:
			
		

> I don't think you can use prendere with bagno in any context ... but let's ask the Italians



La prova: qui

Jana


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## Nadietta

...Jana, per parlare di bagni al mare etc "prendere un bagno" non si dice, ma "fare il bagno";  al massimo, al mare si può... "prendere il sole" !

Esempi

"a me piace molto fare IL bagno quando vado al mare" ; "ieri ho fatto IL bagno, ma l'acqua era fredda".

Se poi si parla di un bagno in particolare, oppure usiamo un aggettivo, si può dire

"ho fatto UN bel bagno nel lago e mi sono rilassato". " Ho fatto già UN bagno e dopo ne farò un altro".


Ciao
Nadia


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## rom_itn

Dear friends, thanks for the help.. please tell me if it's correct if I put it this way?

Facevo il bagno quando *squllò* il telefono.

I'm trying to use INDICATIVO PASSATO REMOTO eventhough I'm not very farmiliar with the tense.  Any comment would be very much appreciated

Thanks
Rom


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## Jana337

Nadietta said:
			
		

> ...Jana, per parlare di bagni al mare etc "prendere un bagno" non si dice, ma "fare il bagno"; al massimo, al mare si può... "prendere il sole" !



Quindi il dizionario mente? 

Jana


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## Manuel_M

rom_itn said:
			
		

> Dear friends, thanks for the help.. please tell me if it's correct if I put it this way?
> 
> Facevo il bagno quando *squllò* il telefono.
> 
> I'm trying to use INDICATIVO PASSATO REMOTO eventhough I'm not very farmiliar with the tense.  Any comment would be very much appreciated
> 
> Thanks
> Rom


 
It's *squillo`*not squllo`. The passato remoto is used for the distant past, and it's falling out of usage in the spoken language.


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## V52

Jana337 said:
			
		

> Quindi il dizionario mente?
> 
> Jana



Dear Jana, your dictionary doesn't lie at all! 
"prendere un bagno" is maybe a  "literature" form, a few ancient, but  very elegant. And it is not referred only to a  "bath"  in a bathroom, it is referred to every situation. So  you can go to the seaside and "prendere un bagno" , not only  "prendere il sole".  And if you like it you can  "prendere un bagno di sole" .
But there's more 
The expression "prendere un bagno"  acquired  in times a different meaning 
"to have a financial  downfall" 
ex:  " I bought a company and it was a quite financial downfall"  
"Ho comprato una società e ho preso un bel bagno! "  
Please don't forget to correct my English!
Grazie 
Vittorio


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## Nadietta

...Manuel is right. Actually passato remato is still very used used when you are "formally" telling about historical events very distant in the past and so on . For example at school, when you are telling the teacher about what the Romans did, you could say " Nerone incendiò Roma" (but you could also use "presente storico" as well: Nerone incendia Roma to make the telling more "lively").

 Yet, in the South of Italy, at times they still use "passato remoto" also in everyday language instead of passato prossimo, for example:

" l'altro ieri mio zio mi regalò un orologio" (whereby the most people would say " l'altro ieri mio zio mi ha regalato un orologio").

Jana, maybe your dictionary really lies  because I am Italian and I have never heard of "prendere un bagno" !!!


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## V52

Manuel_M said:
			
		

> It's *squillo`*not squllo`. The passato remoto is used for the distant past, and it's falling out of usage in the spoken language.



Dear Manuel, you are right , the "passato remoto" is sadly not used so much, even though not completely disappeared yet. This is a levelling off of our culture! Speaking italian nowadays it seems like everything happened half an hour ago. The "passato remoto" instead gives to the dialogue the sense of difference between actual things a past ones. Anyway tha's why in my previous post on this thread I translated "Mentre facevo il bagno.." I chose this form to give the sentence a more progressive, nearer sense, to relate it to the "passato prossimo" "ha squillato il telefono" in a better way IMHO (as usual...)
Is interesting to know that in Tuscan dialect (the nearer to best Italian)  they use the "passato remoto"  instead of "passato prossimo", to give to the context a more  "epic" sense, and it is very common.
ex:  "Ieri andai dal dottore". To mean i definitely went were I needed to go.
ex: "hai comprato la pasta?"  "la comprai ieri". 
Maybe someone, who was in Tuscany, in this forum , can afford my information..
Vitt52


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## Jana337

Vittorio52 said:
			
		

> Dear Jana, your dictionary doesn't lie at all!
> "prendere un bagno" is maybe a  "literature" form,  a fewa little/a bit  ancient, but  very elegant. And it  is not referred does not refer only to a  "bath"  in a bathroom, it  is referred refers (or applies)  to every situation. So  you can go to the seaside and "prendere un bagno" , not only  "prendere il sole".  And if you like it*,* you can  "prendere un bagno di sole" .
> But there's more
> The expression "prendere un bagno"  acquired   in times  a different meaning over time.
> "to have a financial  downfall" I think this is most unusual. I suggest "to incur a financial loss".
> ex:  " I bought a company and it was a quite financial downfall"
> "Ho comprato una società e ho preso un bel bagno! "
> Please don't forget to correct my English!
> Grazie
> Vittorio



Remember:
"A few" exists but you need a countable noun after it (I bought a few cakes)
"A little" is used for uncountable nouns, adjectives (your case) and adverbs.
"A bit" is more colloquial than "a little" and you use it with adjectives and adverbs.

This does not have to include all cases. If I find another example not covered by the explanation above, I will come back to edit it.

Jana


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## laratri

But the word "bath" cannot be used for a bathe in the sea....


The person would be too far way anyway to hear the mobile phone rinfging on the beach..

Here we are talking about having a bath in the bath tub.... No?


So: Mentre facevo il bagno squillè il telefono...


Lara


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## V52

laratri said:
			
		

> But the word "bath" cannot be used for a bathe in the sea....
> The person would be too far way anyway to hear the mobile phone rinfging on the beach..
> Here we are talking about having a bath in the bath tub.... No?
> So: Mentre facevo il bagno squillè il telefono...
> Lara



Right Lara, but in Italian  "bathe" and "bath"  are  both translated with  "bagno" 
Bagno means =  bath / bathroom / bathe  
Anyway we are maybe going a bit further  in  explanations... but that's why we are here...
Vitt52


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## V52

Nadietta said:
			
		

> ...
> 
> Jana, maybe your dictionary really lies  because I am Italian and I have never heard of "prendere un bagno" !!!



Ciao Nadietta
piacere di conoscerti 
"prendere un bagno"  esiste  e si può dire, forse è un po' all'antica,  ma  assolutamente ancora presente nel nostro vocabolario, come Jana ha dimostrato
Vitt52


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## Nadietta

...still, I' d suggest not to use the expression "prendere un bagno" when communicating in the current language in the contest of bathing, but to prefer "fare il bagno". It might  be anyhow a local/regional expression.

If this can be of interest, my dictionary (lo Zingarelli), which anyway does not contain the expression "prendere un bagno", indicates an alternative meaning of " fare UN bagno" = subire una pesante sconfitta in giochi di carte, specialmente bridge".


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## Nadietta

...beh se esiste sarà forse un'espressione regionale/locale e sicuramente riferita a "bagno nella vasca" non a "bagno nel mare".. In effetti, come ha fatto notare Lara, si parlava di "bagno nella vasca" .....Qui comunque l'espressione non si è mai sentita, te lo garantisco, per cui credo proprio abbia un uso limitato!


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## DesertCat

There is a song Un Bagno In Mare (by Irene Grandi) and I took it to mean a dip in the sea.  Is this wrong?


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## V52

Nadietta said:
			
		

> ...beh se esiste sarà forse un'espressione regionale/locale e sicuramente riferita a "bagno nella vasca" non a "bagno nel mare".. In effetti, come ha fatto notare Lara, si parlava di "bagno nella vasca" .....Qui comunque l'espressione non si è mai sentita, te lo garantisco, per cui credo proprio abbia un uso limitato!



Certo, limitato, ma si può dire. Sullo Zingarelli è riportato alla voce "prendere", capo IV , pag 1460. Quanto al fatto che sia riferito solo  al  "bagno nella vasca" , questo non è precisato, io lo collegherei al concetto più "lato" di bagno, che vale per ogni tipo di "bagno", per cui secondo me è valido anche per i "bagni di mare".  
Ciao
Vittorio


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## Alfry

DesertCat said:
			
		

> There is a song Un Bagno In Mare (by Irene Grandi) and I took it to mean a dip in the sea. Is this wrong?


si, esatto
it is not wrong.


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## shaula

Jana, I have noticed that too many times De Mauro lists words that are not used in modern Italian. The native can find it enriching but for non-native it is confusing.
If I may suggest, try Garzanti which I consider the best online dictionary. You need to register but they don't bother you with spam or anything.

Ciao
shaula


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## laratri

shaula said:
			
		

> Jana, I have noticed that too many times De Mauro lists words that are not used in modern Italian. The native can find it enriching but for non-native it is confusing.
> If I may suggest, try Garzanti which I consider the best online dictionary. You need to register but they don't bother you with spam or anything.
> 
> Ciao
> shaula


 

I agree with you....

Lara

I've never heard of "prendere un bagno" in the bath tub... it could perhaps be used for "taking a bathe"....
The fact that bathe, bath are translated with "bagno"  helps confusion....

Lara


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## Jana337

Grazie del suggerimento. Ho già usato Garzanti ma De Mauro mi è piaciuto di più Vabbè, otterrà un'altra opportunità di convincermi.

Jana


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## V52

Jana337 said:
			
		

> Grazie del suggerimento. Ho già usato Garzanti ma De Mauro mi è piaciuto di più Vabbè, otterrà un'altra opportunità di convincermi.
> 
> Jana



May I correct your sentence Jana? 
(...) ho già usato IL Garzanti , ma IL De Mauro  mi è piaciuto di più. Vabbè, AVRA'  (oppure GLI DARO')  un'altra opportunità  PER  convincermi. 

Ciao 
Vitt52


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## V52

shaula said:
			
		

> Jana, I have noticed that too many times De Mauro lists words that are not used in modern Italian. The native can find it enriching but for non-native it is confusing...
> 
> Doesn't the  Oxford Dictionary do the same?
> Vitt52


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## Jana337

Vittorio52 said:
			
		

> May I correct your sentence Jana?
> (...) ho già usato IL Garzanti , ma IL De Mauro mi è piaciuto di più. Vabbè, AVRA' (oppure GLI DARO') un'altra opportunità PER convincermi.
> 
> Ciao
> Vitt52



Certo, mille grazie!

Jana


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## Panpan

Nadietta said:
			
		

> ...
> 
> Yet, in the South of Italy, at times they still use "passato remoto" also in everyday language instead of passato prossimo, for example:
> 
> " l'altro ieri mio zio mi regalò un orologio" (whereby the most people would say " l'altro ieri mio zio mi ha regalato un orologio").


 
How far South?  And how widespread is it?  Might I hear this in common usage in the smaller towns around Bari and Brindisi?

Panpan


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## Nadietta

...Vittorio, my dictionary Zingarelli, on page 1372, says, "prendere un bagno" = "bagnarsi" which does not mean fare il bagno nella vasca" but sounds more like "to get wet". 
Anyway if you 'd use the expression in the contest of "fare un bagno nella vasca " ("to have a bath" or even worse "fare il bagno (mare etc) ("to bathe")" it would sound rather "unnatural", in my opinion. It's a bit like in Napoli where you use the verb "tenere" to say "avere", es "Tieni fratelli?"= "hai fratelli"? (have you got any brothers and sisters?"); to me saying that would sound very unnatural, but they use it there, locally. I am still convinced it's a restricted regional/local use. Ciao, interesting discussion anyway.


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## Nadietta

Panpan said:
			
		

> How far South?  And how widespread is it?  Might I hear this in common usage in the smaller towns around Bari and Brindisi?
> 
> Panpan





Yes, you would hear it surely in those sorroundings; in South of Italy it is still very used, in Sicily for example. How widespread in Middle-Italy I am not sure, yet I have heard it also by people from Tuscany.


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## V52

Nadietta said:
			
		

> ...Vittorio, my dictionary Zingarelli, on page 1372, says, "prendere un bagno" = "bagnarsi" which does not mean fare il bagno nella vasca" but sounds more like "to get wet".
> Anyway if you 'd use the expression in the contest of "fare un bagno nella vasca " ("to have a bath" or even worse "fare il bagno (mare etc) ("to bathe")" it would sound rather "unnatural", in my opinion. It's a bit like in Napoli where you use the verb "tenere" to say "avere", es "Tieni fratelli?"= "hai fratelli"? (have you got any brothers and sisters?"); to me saying that would sound very unnatural, but they use it there, locally. I am still convinced it's a restricted regional/local use. Ciao, interesting discussion anyway.



Cara Nadia
probabilmente abbiamo due diverse edizioni dello Zingarelli, su entrambe però c'è la stessa definizione. "Prendere un bagno" è un'espressione poco usata, ricercata senza dubbio, diciamo.. affettata, e legata forse a un tempo lontano. Ma è riferita, nella mia esperienza, a tutti i tipi di bagno, anche quelli di mare, termali eccetera. L'ho sempre "percepito" come utilizzato in senso rafforzativo del concetto, ovvero " fare un bagno prendendosi tutto il tempo necessario, senza fretta, in modo rilassante e completo", al contrario del più sbrigativo "fare un bagno" . L'uso di "prendere" , in questo caso, secondo me è proprio come dici tu: equivalente al "tenere" del dialetto napoletano (io direi "lingua", per quanto è bello!), dove "tenere" che sta per "avere". Lo stesso uso che in Inglese viene fatto di "to get" , del resto, il quale è un rafforzativo del concetto di possesso. 
Si, discussione interessante, perchè è sulla "percezione" della lingua. 

I wrote in Italian to be clearer with Nadia, anyway every non-native friend can ask me about all expressions they don't understand. I'll be pleased to explain.
Vitt52


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## V52

Panpan said:
			
		

> How far South? And how widespread is it? Might I hear this in common usage in the smaller towns around Bari and Brindisi?
> Panpan



Dear Panpan 
Do you know what's the problem in using "passato remoto" ? It's difficult to understand when it must be used... you must study italian grammar before! And it doesn't happen so frequently... However in every language any difficulty is a "sentence to death" , for the difficult term, or expression, or grammar rule. For the same (sad) reason, Italian Language is about to loose its wonderful musical conjunctives. But my feelings are really ingenuous, I can't "stop the progress!" and the condemn is declared! Who's the judge? The italian TV networks! I work on TV dialogues and often they asked me to "cut" every "passato remoto" because "we don't use it anymore"... How bossy! 
Vitt52
  PS
I fight my battle against "injustice" of course, and I still apply "passato remoto" to my dialogues, but every day I am a little bit more... like a Robin Hood in the Sherwood forest...


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