# Using the search feature - brainstorming



## Outsider

JamesM said:


> I wish I could get this search engine to work better for me. I have trouble finding things like previous threads on the matter.  If anyone can point me to some tips on how to use the search engine here, I'd certainly appreciate it.


JamesM asked me this in another thread. Since it was off-topic, I did not want to reply there, but it can be helpfful for many forum users, so I thought I'd post it here.

A few tips:

1. Have you noticed there's an Advanced Search feature? It's very useful, because it allows you to search just some forums, or just in thread titles, or just in threads with replies by a certain user which narrows down the number of his you get quite nicely.

2. What I usually do when I want to find an old thread is try to remember a keyword (or keywords) that was used in it (usually by me), but is not a very frequent word in the language. In this case, I searched for "hypercorrection", which I was pretty sure I had used in the thread in question.

3. If you are looking for threads about a certain topic, rather than specific threads, select "search title only", to avoid getting a million usesless hits.

I hope this is helpful to others.


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## fenixpollo

4. I may choose "search titles only" to limit the search; but if I'm searching for threads in the Spanish-English forums (for example), I'll do a search for the Spanish term and then for the English term.

5. If I remember that I participated in a thread on this subject, I'll go to the advanced search and type in the keyword; and I'll also type my username in the "find posts by user" field.  The search will only return threads that I have participated in.

More suggestions.   Great thread, Outsider.


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## Alxmrphi

The normal plain, non-advanced search is pretty useless, if you want to search, it's always best to use the advanced one. Unless it is the title of a topic, in that case, plain search is easier.


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## Kelly B

Thanks, Outsider, for starting the discussion here. I added a link to this thread to James' post in the original thread.

In addition to the good ideas already noted, it's useful to know that operations work here, as they do in Google: 
keyword1 +keyword2: results must include both words
keyword1 -keyword2: results will include the first word, but not the second
"keyword1 keyword2" results will include the exact phrase in quotes
keyword* the asterisk replaces any text - this is useful, for example, if you are looking for a verb in any of its conjugations. So entre* will give results including entrer, entrez, entres...

Simply typing keyword1 keyword2 will give you results for either word, and often that yields an overwhelming quantity of them.


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## geve

Good idea indeed! 


fenixpollo said:


> 5. If I remember that I participated in a thread on this subject, I'll go to the advanced search and type in the keyword; and I'll also type my username in the "find posts by user" field. The search will only return threads that I have participated in.


If you usually subscribe to threads you participate in, you can also launch a regular search and look for the blue box 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 in the list of results.

The search function is also available within a thread: there's an option on the right top corner "search this thread". Particularly helpful if you're about to post something in an already long thread and want to check that it's not been said (the jokes thread for instance!!)


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## LV4-26

Just an idea as I've been long struggling with the search engine ever since the beginning and only learnt to use it through trial-and-error techniques.

Why not write a post that would sum up all that has been said here and elsewhere on how to use the search feature (especially Kelly's #4)? It could be added in elroy's thread "WRF's best kept secrets" (the search issue is addressed there but far from thoroughly) , and you could *add a link to it in the advanced search window*?

I think it would be extremely useful especially (but not only) for the newbies.

Or is it explained elsewhere? I tried in the FAQ but only saw tips for dictionary searches.


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## Jana337

LV4-26 said:


> Just an idea as I've been long struggling with the search engine ever since the beginning and only learnt to use it through trial-and-error techniques.
> 
> Why not write a post that would sum up all that has been said here and elsewhere on how to use the search feature (especially Kelly's #4)? It could be added in elroy's thread "WRF's best kept secrets" (the search issue is addressed there but far from thoroughly) , and you could *add a link to it in the advanced search window*?
> 
> I think it would be extremely useful especially (but not only) for the newbies.
> 
> Or is it explained elsewhere? I tried in the FAQ but only saw tips for dictionary searches.


OK, we can do it. But please tell us what you - and your fellow-strugglers - think would be worth mentioning.



Jana


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## LV4-26

Jana337 said:


> OK, we can do it. But please tell us what you - and your fellow-strugglers - think would be worth mentioning.


Well, I can only mention what I would have liked to find there. Basically it concerns just about all of Kelly's post above, i.e. *what to enter in the "Search by Key Word" box.

* - inclusion, 
note that this seems to be the default option now. You can add a + (as Kelly said), a comma, the word AND, or even a mere space, the system will automatically perform an _AND search
_on +street
on AND street
on, street
on street

 - exclusion, 
street -in

 - expressions between "", 
"in the street"

- use of the asterisk
(as in Kelly's example)

- how to perform an _OR search. _Lately, I've only found one technique to be available : adding the word OR.
"in the street" OR "on the street"

- mention that you can make a search with two expressions or a word plus an expression
"in the street" "on the street"
in "on the street"

- maybe, for those who haven't been using it for a long time, point out that the system changed (for the better) a while ago. I seem to remember that the default option was the _OR search_ before.

All the rest..., 
eg
- go to advanced search, 
- select "search titles only" (when necessary) 
-  search by user name
..I don't think is really needed. It can be understood with, I guess, a little common sense and a little practice. I mean it's there, right under one's eyes, in the advanced search window.


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## lsp

Expressions between "" has never worked for me. I get the same thing searching for _"ti voglio bene"_ as I would have gotten for _ti +voglio +bene_. They should be very different results. Anyone else have this problem?


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## TrentinaNE

I could have sworn that putting an expression within quotation marks used to work fine for me, but more recently it hasn't, so I'm wondering if there's been a change to the search software.

Elisabetta


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## Jana337

I don't know what you did but they are different for me:
174 results for *vuole +bene *and *+vuole + bene*
10 results for *"vuole bene"*


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## fenixpollo

Jana, is the spacing important between the plus signs? Meaning, is _vuole + bene_ the same as _vuole +bene_?


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## Jana337

fenixpollo said:


> Jana, is the spacing important between the plus signs? Meaning, is _vuole + bene_ the same as _vuole +bene_?


I tested it with several combinations and they appear to be equivalent. I have never used the one with spaces because it goes against my Boolean intuition. 

Jana

P.S. You can test the thingy in Google. Not with + because they include all words by default anyway, but with -: word -another is different from word - another. The - sign is ignored in the latter case.


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## panjandrum

The list of threads at the end of each dictionary entry is often very useful.  It has all the threads in any forum that include the key word in their title.  For example, looking up street in the dictionary I find:
*Forum discussions with the word(s) 'street' in the title:
*
in ...street or on...street?
Grub Street = Fleet Street ?
On the street or in the street
street
street
Street/road
street words
high street
Female Street Picasso
hight street banks
in Baker Street
in/on the street
walking down the street
in / on the street
man in the street
Pick someone off the street
He stood on a street corner
Sell one's ass on the street
Prepositions and streets - in, or, at XXX street.
I was on the street when suddenly someone...
I'm dragging my feet to hit the street tonight
To be sold from street stalls in the capital
the dog is in the street
"street words"
how to pronounce "loch" in a street name "Loch Haven"?
"Street corners"--actually "corners"?

I don't think the + makes any difference in the forum search?
If I search for *+in +on +street* I get exactly the same set of results as searching for *in on street*.


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## LV4-26

panjandrum said:


> I don't think the + makes any difference in the forum search?
> If I search for *+in +on +street* I get exactly the same set of results as searching for *in on street*.


Yes. As I said in my previous post, I think
+
,
AND
[space]
all work in the same way, i.e. they all trigger off an _"AND search"
_


> The list of threads at the end of each dictionary entry is often very useful


Very right. Try to type has been doing (without any extra sign) in "English definition". You won't find any definition, of course, but you'll get a direct link to the ongoing thread in EO.

EDIT : I also tried with desk sergeant which was the title of one of my very first threads here. I didn't find any  link to it in the English definition dic. So I thought it was because that thread was too old (March 2005). But then I tried in the English-French dic. and there it was...
Could it be because the thread was started in the bilingual forum?


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## LV4-26

Jana337 said:


> I don't know what you did but they are different for me:
> 174 results for *vuole +bene *and *+vuole + bene*
> 10 results for *"vuole bene"*


Same here.

 For  "in the street", I get 11 results, all of which contain the exact phrase with the three words in the right order

With in the street,  (without the quotation marks), I get 16 results. The 5 extra results are
- *in*/on *the street* (two threads).
- If I could do anything it would be to kiss you....*in* the middle of *the street
- *to walk *in* off *the street
-* to be sold from *street *stalls *in the *capital 

Quod erat demonstrandum


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## DearPrudence

Hello

Please, be nice, I'm searchingly challenged (among other things).
So I suppose this question has already be answered or the solution is simple but I wonder if it's possible to locate a post more precisely in a thread.
I've just discovered (wow, congratulations  ) that you can show posts only and not the whole thread but the problem is that it still doesn't tell you where the post is exactly in the thread.
It's true that the key words are coloured in red but some people write in that colour + some threads are fairly long (the one I was looking for is 17-page long).
Is there a way to find this post without looking at all of them (which I did and of course I haven't found it)

Thank you


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## Jana337

Yes. In the search page, tick "posts" instead of "threads" (at the bottom of the page). Then you'll get the exact location.

This is briefly mentioned (not explained, though) here. I am sure many of you can learn a lot from that thread. 

Jana


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## Jana337

It would be actually very nice if other search-challenged members contributed to this thread. I'll gladly volunteer and draft a FAQ but - being a fast searcher - I would have to grope in the dark.

So: If your searches are painfully long and inefficient, please join this thread and describe briefly your problem. Give an example if possible. 

Thanks.


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## LV4-26

If I've understood your question correctly.....
Supposing you know
- which thread it is
- a specific word in the post
- the  poster's name

- Go to the thread in question
- Click on "Search this thread" (extreme right, next to "thread tools")
- Click on "advanced search"
- Enter your key word
- Enter the poster's name
- Click on the thread title which is inside the post window (not the one on top). It usually reads Re:xxxxxxxxx

There you are.
Feel free to report back if that's not what you want or if it doesn't work.


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## DearPrudence

Happy to contribute.
See the extent of my inability at using those things:
instead of clicking on the "re: funny/embarrassing ..." I clicked on the thing above  
OK, by you, WR, I was properly humbled. I hope it will help generations of dummies like me.

edit: thank you LV4-26, well spotted.  Please don't banish me for not having been able to use the search function properly for more than a year


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## fenixpollo

I guarantee you, Prudence, that hundreds of other users, if not thousands, have exactly the same questions as you. Don't apologize, and don't fear banishment for asking good questions.


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## Nunty

We the search challenged were invited to contribute to this thread, with examples. I rarely manage to do an effective search in these forums (though I don't have that problem in Google), and here is an example.

Today I posted in CD:_To my intense surprise advanced searches of this forum yielded 0 results for both "capital punishment" and "death penalty". _[...]​A couple posts down, Tony replied:A  search for —> "Capital punishement" <— yielded me 14 threads in the Cultural Discussions forum alone. ​A search for —> "Death penalty" <— yielded me 33 threads, again in the Cultural Discussions forum alone.​So what am I doing wrong (besides using standard spelling, Tony  )? I put the two words inside quotes and I clicked on "thread titles" and did not change anything else in the search options, and each time I got no results.


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## Jana337

Tony didn't click on "thread titles". It's usually worth a while to search posts as well (unless you search for words like "love" that are ubiquitous ).

In one of the threads I found that way, death penalty is in the title but in Spanish.
Here's a thread about Saddam being sentenced.

The other threads touch the topic marginally (values, abortion) or are totally irrelevant (do the French love sex? etc.).


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## LV4-26

Nun-Translator said:


> [...]and I clicked on "thread titles"
> [...]


Which is precisely why you didn't get the same result.
I bet Tony used the "entire posts" options
I get exactly the same (14 and 33) by choosing "search in entire posts"

Conversely by chossing the "thread title" option, I get
1 thread for "capital punishment
0 thread for "death penalty"

Also, the links you put in your post do not work. Links to forum search results seem to never work (I know, it also happened to me). I can't remember why, though. 

EDIT : OK, Jana's been quicker.


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## cuchuflete

LV4-26 said:


> Also, the links you put in your post do not work. Links to forum search results seem to never work (I know, it also happened to me). I can't remember why, though.



Links from search results expire after a little while...30 minutes I think.

I just searched for the word _monkeys._

Here is a thread I found: http://forum.wordreference .com/  showthread.php?t=284825&highlight=monkeys 

To show that link, and not have it expire, just delete everthing after the thread number, and post this:

http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=284825


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## Jana337

The "highlight" doesn't make a thread expire, so you don't need to delete it (perhaps for cosmetic reasons if you want to). 

Only links with "searchid" inside are perishable. How long they live depends on current traffic in the forum. The software seems to remember a fixed number (50? - just my guesstimate) of searches and if many people perform a search of any type (normal search, search for posts by a specific members, clicking on new posts), your searchid link expires very soon. 

Jana


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## LV4-26

Jana337 said:


> Only links with "searchid" inside are perishable.


And the only urls that have "searchid" inside correspond to lists of search results, right?


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## Jana337

LV4-26 said:


> And the only urls that have "searchid" inside correspond to lists of search results, right?


Yes but again, notice that if you click on New Posts and many other links, you use the search function - you may not even know.  Mike should disable search for a while so that you notice how much you depend on it. 

Jana


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## LV4-26

Thanks, Jana.
Wow, this thread is great! I'm currently making a whole lot of interesting observations on how this site works technically!


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## lsp

Jana337 said:


> Yes but again, notice that if you click on New Posts and many other links, you use the search function - you may not even know.  Mike should disable search for a while so that you notice how much you depend on it.
> 
> Jana



No... please! He had to once and it was awful. Hopefully those who weren't here and/or don't remember will take our word for it (and hopefully this isn't a crowd that has to touch the stove even after someone says it's hot)!


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## DearPrudence

Hello
The search-challenged dummy is back!
Someone asked a question about *"@"* in French. I had seen threads about it so I tried to look for them.
I typed @, then "Search titles only" (what a drudgery you always have to go to advanced search for that  ) and then selected "French-English" but there was no match.
Then I realized it simply didn't work with that symbol.
Fortunately I know what the word is in French (not a common one like "at" since it's "arrobase") and I managed to find them.
So my question is (at last!): what do we have to type to find such a thread?

Sorry for that question and thank you very much for your patience.


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## Nunty

Another question along similar lines. How do we search for hyphenated words?


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## LV4-26

Nun-Translator said:


> Another question along similar lines. How do we search for hyphenated words?


Hi Sister,
By using the "s, as you would do with an expression.
Example, if you enter "search-challenged"
you'll get only those posts (5) that contain this exact sequence of signs.
If you don't use the "s, i.e., if you enter search-challenged
you'll get 500+ posts, including all the posts with just the word _search._


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## DearPrudence

DearPrudence said:


> So my question is (at last!): what do we have to type to find such a thread with @ in the title?


I know, I'm bumping, it's no good. It's just because I have a question and I don't know where to ask it:
I think I remember having seen a thread about "meeting foreros in real life" in the cultural forum about forer@s saying they had met fellow forer@s or something like that, maybe a year ago (around september,oct 2005 but I must say it's quite vague), but I can't find it anymore.
Any ideas where it is? I don't really know what keywords to type. I've tried with "me*t" "forer*", doesn't seem to work but as you know I'm ...

Don't hesitate to delete this post.

Thanks. 
(ça fait un peu "perdu de vue" mon appel )


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## geve

DearPrudence said:


> I've tried with "me*t" "forer*", doesn't seem to work but as you know I'm ...


I don't think the * works in the search function here: I've noticed that when there are blanks in my request (eg. "meet foreros"), the software replaces it with * ("meet*foreros")... Anyone can confirm?


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## KaRiNe_Fr

DearPrudence said:


> I've tried with "me*t" "forer*", doesn't seem to work but as you know I'm ...


I've tried with %, searching "%real life" in entire post, and found this one. (don't know if it's the one you seek...)
 
 Edit #1: ça fait bizarre de nous parler en anglais les filles. 
Edit #2: I think Gève is right.
Edit #3: argh, lien tout cassé...


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## geve

KaRiNe_Fr said:


> I've tried with %, searching "%real life" in entire post, anf found this one. (don't know if it's the one you seek...)


What does the % do then? 
A quoi sert le % alors ?  

Cette traduction, juste pour vous. Cadeau.


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## Kelly B

This one, maybe? there are other links in it to try, as well. I tried _meet +forum +members_ and limited the search to the CD forum.
http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=279024

I found the same one Karine did, via a different route, with _meet +"real life"_
http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=160759


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## DearPrudence

Girls, girls (les filles, les filles) I have something. Thanks a lot, Kelly
After following 2 links, here is what I've found here: I was sure VenusEnvy was involved in some way. Here is what she says:
In the meanwhile, here's a thread about those of us who have already met, or would like to meet!

And then:  


*DearPrudence*, you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:

This page or thread has been deleted.
You are not logged in.
If you are trying to post, your account may be awaiting activation.
If you were logged in and are seeing this message, then try the following:

Clear your web browser's cache.
Click "Remember Me" when logging in.
At least I'm happy to see that I'm not crazy and that this thread did exist!!! Now I suppose I shouldn't ask what happened to it or I could see men in black coming into my house and ... I prefer not to imagine the rest 

edit: Nevertheless I can't help myself wondering why this (quite important thread if my memory's correct) has been deleted and not closed. That would avoid people wasting space & everybody's time asking stupid questions ... (sorry for my English)


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## Kelly B

I'll put on my trench coat and dark glasses and see what I can find out.


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## Super Wombat

I'm just a newbie myself, but have had problems with the Search Tools, so will print out some of the fantastic replies in this Forum and work on them... 

I would like to add a tip to those already mentioned above... to find something in WordReference I often use Google, typing in the word I'm looking for + WordReference... I get results that I don't find by searching directly in WordReference.

From what I can pick up in this forum the Search Tools are motored by a software that seems to be creating problems...

I wonder if it wouldn't be possible to combine a software system with a manual backend where moderators insert relevant words to the Search section...
The same could apply for the Dictionary.
With a good back end it takes no time to modify a web site... I do it daily on my own web site.


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## Jana337

Please give an example of a thread that you couldn't find by searching directly here (and also the search string in Google).


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## Super Wombat

Hi Jana,
after your request I went back and checked on the example I had in mind and found that I was initially using the Dictionary Tool and not the Search Tools...

"come non detto" as they say in Italian...  (...forget I even opened my mouth!)

I wonder if you could answer me about whether the dictionary gets updated with all the things posted in the forums... 

I often wonder how WR started.... and the initial motivations behind it. I looked around and the only thing I found was WR's 2-year birthday last June or thereabouts, which is really incredible when you see how it has grown in such a short space and how it has been embraced all over the world.
Do you have any link you can refer me please?


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## Jana337

JustMarriedinVenice said:


> Hi Jana,
> after your request I went back and checked on the example I had in mind and found that I was initially using the Dictionary Tool and not the Search Tools...


You can use that one as well but only when the keyword is in a thread title.





> I wonder if you could answer me about whether the dictionary gets updated with all the things posted in the forums...


Usually (= when the server works the way it should), titles of new threads are immediately reflected by the dictionary. 





> I often wonder how WR started.... and the initial motivations behind it. I looked around and the only thing I found was WR's 2-year birthday last June or thereabouts, which is really incredible when you see how it has grown in such a short space and how it has been embraced all over the world.
> Do you have any link you can refer me please?


I'm afraid I cannot offer a link to a concise history of WR.  Just browse Comments and Suggestions to see what kinds of problems this community dealt with in the pastl

Jana


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