# Bulgarian : един въпрос на "вечер"



## mchatin

Hello Bulgarian speakers,
I am learning Bulgarian and I try to understand the logic behind things. 
As a mature learner, it only makes sense when you know the logic and define rules. 

I am familiar with the genders of the words and their rules according to word endings. According to the rule, the word "вечер" is masculine as it ends wirh a consonant. And добър вечер is a good example. However I wonder why it is common to use приятна вечер. I wonder why it changes to feminine gender like so while you use приятен ден in stead of довър ден. 
Can anyone explain the logic? Is there any other examples? 

Thanks in advance.


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## nimak

mchatin said:


> According to the rule, the word "вечер" is masculine as it ends wirh a consonant.


There are several exceptions, even though they end in consonant some nouns are of feminine gender: вечер, нощ, песен, есен, пролет, любов, обич etc. The nouns that end in -ост, -ест, -аст are of feminine gender too. These exceptions are present in other Slavic languages too.

In Bulgarian, in all other cases вечер is used as a feminine noun, except in the greeting "добър вечер". Why in this expression the adjective is of masculine gender will explain you better the native speakers of Bulgarian.


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## DarkChild

Вечер is a feminine noun and always receives feminine adjectives and the article -та. 

The greeting добър вечер is an exception in that it appears with the masculine form добър. But even there you can sometimes hear the response добр*а* да е, not добър да е. Important to note that the accent in добър вечер falls on the first syllable, while in any other situation the word добър has the accent on the second syllable.

There used to be a thread here discussing why the greeting is the way it is. It is thought that вечер was originally a masculine noun but over time became feminine. My _personal _hypothesis is that has to do with pronunciation. It may be that it was easier to say the phrase that way.


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## Awwal12

mchatin said:


> I am familiar with the genders of the words and their rules according to word endings. According to the rule, the word "вечер" is masculine as it ends wirh a consonant.


Slavic languages basically always contain some feminine nouns ending in a consonant. In Bulgarian it will be нощ, мощ, мисъл, реч etc. Вечер, however, is curious because originally it was masculine indeed (the trace of which fact is still preserved in "добър вечер").


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## mchatin

Thank you very much indeed. It was very helpful for me as well as it will be for all Bulgarian learners reading this thread.



DarkChild said:


> Вечер is a feminine noun and always receives feminine adjectives and the article -та.
> 
> The greeting добър вечер is an exception in that it appears with the masculine form добър. But even there you can sometimes hear the response добр*а* да е, not добър да е. Important to note that the accent in добър вечер falls on the first syllable, while in any other situation the word добър has the accent on the second syllable.
> 
> There used to be a thread here discussing why the greeting is the way it is. It is thought that вечер was originally a masculine noun but over time became feminine. My _personal _hypothesis is that has to do with pronunciation. It may be that it was easier to say the phrase that way.


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## DarkChild

There are also those words that can be either masculine or feminine depending on the meaning

Example: мед, газ, прах


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## katibo

The specialists say that in the past, the word *вечеръ *was in masculine and the phrase has kept the gender of the adjective. For me it is also a question of euphony, it is easier to pronounce д*о*бър в*е*чер than добр*а *в*е*чер.

And this question made me think that in добър вечер, добър ден - добър is pronounced with the stress on O and yet in all other cases is pronounced добър with a stress on Ъ.


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## katibo

"Забележително е, че на старобългарски "вечеръ" е в мъжки род. Затова се пише с твърд знак, напр. "вечеръ сей". При развитието на думата от мъжки към женски род правописът ѝ се променя и става "вечерь", затова и приема опр. член за женски род –та."


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## Sobakus

It's probably historically unconnected, but the same gender duality is found in Latin _vesper_ [m],_ vespera_ [f] and AGr. ἕσπερος, ἑσπέρᾱ/ἑσπέρη. What's even more funny is that the Latin masculine form is of the o-declension in the accusative _(vesperum)_, but the ablative and the adverb "in the evening" are of the 3-d declension, indiscriminately _vespere_ or _vesperī _(this variation is common)_._ It seems that the masculine gender is more concrete (also meaning "Venus, evening star"), while the feminine is more abstract ("eve, eventide"). The feminine might in origin simply be the plural collective of the same noun (PIE fem. sg. = neut. pl.). But the masculine is used for "the West" in Latin while it's feminine in AG.

In Russian, Ukrainian and Bulgarian, the clearly derived feminine _вече́ря_ means "supper" (in Russian mostly known from biblical contexts). BCS has _vèčera_ in the same meaning.


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