# Os Lusiadas canto 1 estrofe 34



## konungursvia

I'm translating Camoes whole Lusiadas into modern English, but I'm having trouble with this strophe:

  Estas causas moviam Citereia,
 E mais, porque das Parcas claro entende
 Que há de ser celebrada a clara Deia,
 Onde a gente belígera se estende.

 So far I have Citereia as a metonymy for Venus: "These causes were put forward by Venus, And more, because...
 and I really can't get the rest, or what it's talking about.


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## Vanda

Hi there!
I am pretty sure it is already translated into English. I'll take a look. BTW, I think these gods and godess names are not translated. I'll be back!


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## konungursvia

Ah, yes, they are translated, but I don't think the translations sound good, they all tried too hard to reproduce the great Camoes' grandeur, and stuffed too much fluff into their English versions. I'm trying to do it without looking at existing ones too much. Can anyone say generally what the sentence is about, who is the real subject, and what the point is? Muito obrigado!


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## Vanda

Ufa! ok, cause they are pretty difficult even in Pt! I'll have a go:

Estas causas moviam Citereia,
These causes moved Citereia
E mais, porque das Parcas claro entende
and more, 'cause she understands it clearly about the Parcas
Que há de ser celebrada a clara Deia,
that the fair Deia will be celebrated
Onde a gente belígera se estende.
where the fighter folks are.

Very roughly!


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## konungursvia

Haha, thanks so much, however that's my understanding of it so far, but I want to translate it _after_ figuring out what the Parcas are, and who Deia is.  In exchange for your kindness, I'll show you one of my better strophes, the one before this one:

  Against these fears did fair Venus raise,
 (Fond as she was of da Gama’s fair land,)
 Such virtues she saw and so gave us praise,
 So like the Rome she had once found so grand;
 Our strong hearts she loved, and our decent ways,
 Her brightest star over Lisbon did stand,
 And our language she felt, with little change,
 Sounded like Latin in timbre and range.


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## konungursvia

But do you, or anyone else, have any idea how to explain what or who the Parcas and Deia are? Basically I see that Venus is trying to say that the Gods should allow da Gama and Portugal their victories, as Jupiter wants.


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## Vanda

I am trying to find a site on Roman mythology so it 'll be easier to identify these godesses.

Well, something in here.

My student is just arriving.... So I'll answer you later!


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## brusr

Hi, translating poetry is very hard, in fact, I think it is an imposible task, however, if you really wanna do it, I will try to help.

The parcas, as far as I know, were, in greek mitology, three "blind" (if I'm not wrong, they had just one eye, which they shared among the three) sisters that were responsible for the destiny of every human being.I don't know if my explantion was clear, if wasnt, tell me...

Deia, I have no idea, but will seach here.

PS:Sorry for my english mistakes in advance...


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## Lucia Adamoli

That´s right brusr, the Parcas are related to life and death, I am not sure but they weaved and cutted the thread of life for each mortal... In argentina's (or buenos aires, "porteño") slang "parca" is a name for the death, in her black cloak and with a scythe in her (his?) hand.

Here! this thread (hehehe) 

Deia... sorry, no idea about it.


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## Vanda

Citereia is another name for Afrodite or Venus


> Chama-se Afrodite (Vênus), ou Citeréia, do nome da ilha a que aportou, ou ainda Cipris,


 
déia = deusa / godess (poetic usage) from Latin: Dea.

And here about Parcas, Moirae.


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## konungursvia

Wow, this really helps, obrigadissimo!


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## konungursvia

So the Parcas are... the Furies?


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## Outsider

konungursvia said:


> Estas causas moviam Citereia,
> E mais, porque das Parcas claro entende
> Que há de ser celebrada a clara Deia,
> Onde a gente belígera se estende.


De acordo com o que a Vanda disse.

Citereia: Vénus.
Deia: deusa (Vénus de novo)
Parcas: deusas associadas ao destino.

So, I think what the passage means is that, being able to foretell the future, Venus knew that she would be celebrated wherever the "warlike people" (=the Portuguese) reached, and that was one of her motivations for helping them. 

I understand your desire to create something new, rather than taking the beaten path, but I think it would save you a lot of time if you at least had a few annotated editions of _Os Lusíadas_ to help you. For example, there is one edition of the poem in Portuguese which contains extensive notes, explaining the meaning of all metaphors and mythological references. To avoid breaking the forum rules, I will send you the name of the publisher by private message.

P.S. Oops! Do you think you could activate your private message folder?



konungursvia said:


> Haha, thanks so much, however that's my understanding of it so far, but I want to translate it _after_ figuring out what the Parcas are, and who Deia is.  In exchange for your kindness, I'll show you one of my better strophes, the one before this one:
> 
> Against these fears did fair Venus raise,
> (Fond as she was of da Gama’s fair land,)
> Such virtues she saw and so gave us praise,
> So like the Rome she had once found so grand;
> Our strong hearts she loved, and our decent ways,
> Her brightest star over Lisbon did stand,
> And our language she felt, with little change,
> Sounded like Latin in timbre and range.


That's a nice free translation, but can I just make two comments? 

It sounds a little odd to read this in the first person ("us", "our ways", "our hearts"...), when the original is in the third person ("them", "their hearts"...) Also, you make reference here to things which are not mentioned in the original strophe, such as Vasco da Gama and Lisbon. Still, it may be a defensible styllistic choice.

You should call Vasco da Gama just Gama, not "da Gama". We don't do that in Portuguese.


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## konungursvia

Boa tarde! This time I'd like to ask for help interpreting brandamente in strophe 43:

 Tão brandamente os ventos os levavam,
  Como quem o céu tinha por amigo:
  Sereno o ar, e os tempos se mostravam
  Sem nuvens, sem receio de perigo.
  The second, third and fourth lines I have just fine, but what does brandamente mean exactly in this context? is it fiery, or shining? Muito obrigado os amigos lusofones.


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## Vanda

brandamente - soft, like in a soft breeze, a soft wind


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## konungursvia

Thanks for the feedback, Outsider, it's really appreciated. I'll  change it back to the third person, I think. I was misled by the fact that French is my main neo-Latin language, and I saw "Nos fortes coracoe~s" for a moment as "Our strong hearts" rather than the correct "In the strong hearts." However, since the third person is used so much in Portuguese, even for the second person "o senhor" for example, do you  think I might have the right to adapt them a bit according to what seems to me in English to be all  right?


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## konungursvia

Thanks, I got it now, Vanda.


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## konungursvia

Also, Outsider, I agree with you about "Gama" vs "da Gama", but unfortunately that's become the norm in English, as in "da Vinci", such as "The da Vinci Code". Strange, but true. Besides, it fits my iambic pentameter


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## Vanda

> I might have the right to adapt them a bit according to what seems to me in English to be all right?


 
For that and for Da Gama, since you are adapting/ making your own version of a poem, well, remember that you are entitled to do what suits you on behalf of _poetic license_.


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## konungursvia

And here, in return, is the section of the strophe that you all helped me to understand:

  So gently the winds were flowing that day,
 To them the heavens in friendship did yield;
 The air serene, and the weather’s display:
 A sky without clouds, a peaceful blue field.

 Obrigado!


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