# Using 'it' at the end of a phrase



## ayupshiplad

Hey again guys,

I should most likely know this after 5 months, but I don't! 

I was wondering if you just miss out the 'it' in phrases like "forget it!" "don't worry about it!" etc or whether it had to be included in some way? 

Thanks.


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## spielenschach

ayupshiplad said:


> Hey again guys,
> 
> I should most likely know this after 5 months, but I don't!
> 
> I was wondering if you just miss out the 'it' in phrases like "forget it!" "don't worry about it!" etc or whether it had to be included in some way?
> 
> Thanks.


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## pauloamado

Ayups, if I can understand correctly, you are asking if in Portuguese we leave the 'it' at the end of sentences out from an eventual translation. The answer is that it actually depends on the sentence and depends on the verb, I can't see how to generalise this rule, but normally if a verb is transitive in English (if it requires an object), it is also transitive in Portuguese, of course there are exceptions, but sticking to your examples: 

* verb to forget - if somebody forgets, they forget *something* or about *something.* In Portuguese => verbo esquecer - alguém esquece *algo* ou alguém se esquece de *algo *(notice the object). So, "forget it" translates as "Esqueça isto/isso" (or "Esqueça-se disto/disso")

* verb to worry - if someone worries, they worry about *something* or over *something.* In Portuguese => verbo preocupar(-se) - alguém se preocupa com *algo*. So, "don't worry about it" translates as "Não se preocupe/Não te preocupes com isto/isso"

Of course, "Esqueça" is also "Forget it" and "Não te preocupes" is "Don't worry about it", but it's just because the object is implied. If you could give more examples, we could try to derive an informal rule for that 

I hope I helped somehow, please let me know if this is what you were talking about.

Cheers.
Paulo.


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## Dom Casmurro

ayupshiplad said:


> Hey again guys,
> 
> I should most likely know this after 5 months, but I don't!
> 
> I was wondering if you just miss out the 'it' in phrases like "forget it!" "don't worry about it!" etc or whether it had to be included in some way?
> 
> Thanks.


Hi Ayup, judging from the exclamation marks (forget it!, don't worry about it!), I assume that the person who is at the hearing side is very much aware of what the other one is shouting about. In that case, _Esqueça!_ and _Não se preocupe!_ are just enough, there being no need to add an object or a pronoun. By the way, the same applies to 'Don't worry!' in English. You can ignore the 'about it' in that case, can't you?
Cheers!


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## Denis555

Don't worry! Be happy!


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## ayupshiplad

Ahh ok. I am rather less confused now. I was asking because my Portuguese friend often misses out 'it' in such expressions when speaking English (Eg he used to say 'forget!' instead of 'forget it!') and so I presumed that the 'it' wasn't necessary in Portuguese otherwise he would have included it in English...if that makes sense! Anyway, cheers!


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## batmacumba

Your question does make sense and at least in Brazilian Portuguese, I may say we often don't use "it" at the end.


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## Outsider

Yes, it's the same in Portugal. There's no need for the dummy "it" in Portuguese.

Forget it! --> Esquece/Esqueça.​
However:

Don't worry about it. --> Não te preocupes (com isso) / Não se preocupe (com isso).​


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## Ricardo Tavares

Another situation...

It is raining outside.

In Portuguese: Está chovendo lá fora. where is the "it" in this translation ? 
In this case, it wouldn't make sense to say "Isto ou Ele está chovendo lá fora"
Sounds weird and even funny !....


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## ayupshiplad

Ricardo Tavares said:


> Another situation...
> 
> It is raining outside.
> 
> In Portuguese: Está chovendo lá fora. where is the "it" in this translation ?
> In this case, it wouldn't make sense to say "Isto ou Ele está chovendo lá fora"
> Sounds weird and even funny !....


 
Ahh but that's a different matter altogether  I would be rather worried with myself if I thought saying 'Isto está a chover lá fora' was correct even if I'd been studying Portuguese for a day!


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## pauloamado

That is certainly a whole different usage. In Portuguese the rule says: "Os verbos que expressam *fenômenos naturais* são chamados impessoais, apresentam oração sem sujeito, e são conjugados na terceira pessoa do singular". The same does not happen in English, where there would be no sense in saying: "Is raining outside". Similar Portuguese verbs are: ventar, nevar, gear, trovejar, relampejar, amanhecer, escurecer etc. But it should be noticed that "Choveram rosas no palco" (Roses rained down on the stage) *has* a subject: rosas.

Playing football yesterday reminded me of two other common uses of 'it' that we normally miss out in Portuguese: "Shoot it!" (Chuta!) and "Passe it!" (Passa!/Toca!). But again, in these cases, the existence of the object *ball* is implicit.

Paulo.


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## Dom Casmurro

pauloamado said:


> That is certainly a whole different usage. In Portuguese the rule says: "Os verbos que expressam *fenômenos naturais* são chamados impessoais, apresentam oração sem sujeito, e são conjugados na terceira pessoa do singular". The same does not happen in English, where there would be no sense in saying: "Is raining outside". Similar Portuguese verbs are: ventar, nevar, gear, trovejar, relampejar, amanhecer, escurecer etc. But it should be noticed that "Choveram rosas no palco" (Roses rained down on the stage) *has* a subject: rosas.
> 
> Playing football yesterday reminded me of two other common uses of 'it' that we normally miss out in Portuguese: "Shoot it!" (Chuta!) and "Passe it!" (Passa!/Toca!). But again, in these cases, the existence of the object *ball* is implicit.
> 
> Paulo.


May I take a ride (pegar uma carona) on Paulo`s post to add that, very much like such football verbs as _chutar_ and _passar_, there are a handful of others that have become so specalized in their meaning that no object is needed to clarify what the speaker is trying to say. 

Examples:
1) *Ele lê muito*. You don't need to add the word _livros_ here: it goes without saying that the person you are talking of is an avid reader of books. What is even more interesting in this case, is the fact that the verb _ler _has become so specialized in its referring to books only, that virtually nobody should presume that you are talking about such printed matter as magazines or newspapers.

2) *Ela gosta de receber*. What? People, of course. Where? Chez elle, évidemment. It is very clear here that she enjoys entertaining people in a social way. And by the way, I have heard the verb _entertain_, in English, being used without an object, just like _receber _(_She likes to entertain_, period.)

3) *Fui*. This is just a slang, meaning that you didn't actually go away, but are very determined to. It's exact translation is _I'm out of here_. 

This having been said, fui.


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## uchi.m

ayupshiplad said:


> Ahh ok. I am rather less confused now. I was asking because my Portuguese friend often misses out 'it' in such expressions when speaking English (Eg he used to say 'forget!' instead of 'forget it!') and so I presumed that the 'it' wasn't necessary in Portuguese otherwise he would have included it in English...if that makes sense! Anyway, cheers!





ayupshiplad said:


> Ahh but that's a different matter altogether  I would be rather worried with myself if I thought saying 'Isto está a chover lá fora' was correct even if I'd been studying Portuguese for a day!



I agree with you, Ayupshiplad, when you say that Portuguese-speaking chaps often drop the "it". Look at this sentence:_I like it when it rains. --- (Eu gosto quando chove)._​According to your last post, it is clear for you why the blue "it" does not appear in the Portuguese translation. However, fledgling Brazilians tend to drop both of them in the above example, often because they translate Portuguese word by word into English.


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## Ricardo Tavares

uchi.m said:


> I agree with you, Ayupshiplad, when you say that Portuguese-speaking chaps often drop the "it". Look at this sentence:
> _I like it when it rains. --- (Eu gosto quando chove)._​According to your last post, it is clear for you why the blue "it" does not appear in the Portuguese translation. However, fledgling Brazilians tend to drop both of them, in the above example, often because they translate Portuguese word by word into English.



Very good exemple, Uchi.m !


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## Outsider

uchi.m said:


> I agree with you, Ayupshiplad, when you say that Portuguese-speaking chaps often drop the "it". Look at this sentence:_I like it when it rains. --- (Eu gosto quando chove)._​According to your last post, it is clear for you why the blue "it" does not appear in the Portuguese translation. However, fledgling Brazilians tend to drop both of them in the above example, often because they translate Portuguese word by word into English.


Which above example do you mean?


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## uchi.m

Outsider said:


> Which above example do you mean?



This one: _I like it when it rains. --- (Eu gosto quando chove)._


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## Outsider

Then it's not just Brazilians who don't use pronouns in there. Nobody does in Portuguese.


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## Ricardo Tavares

uchi.m said:


> This one: _I like it when it rains. --- (Eu gosto quando chove) ._



Correct !


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## uchi.m

Outsider said:


> Then it's not just Brazilians who don't use pronouns in there. Nobody does in Portuguese.



Ok. I was just saying that from my Brazilian standpoint, since I was afraid to generalize, stating that the Portuguese do that also, and be severely criticized.


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## Outsider

I understand, but, you see, this is a very general thing. No Romance language would ever put a pronoun where those "its" are (in Spanish: _me gusta cuando llueve_). It's not an issue of translation from English.


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## ayupshiplad

uchi.m said:


> _I like it when it rains. --- (Eu gosto quando chove)._​According to your last post, it is clear for you why the blue "it" does not appear in the Portuguese translation. However, fledgling Brazilians tend to drop both of them in the above example, often because they translate Portuguese word by word into English.


I love your English!

Too true. However I still sometimes get confused with it's and the like. For example:

"Do you speak English?"
"Sim, falo". 

However: 

"Você fala português?"
"Sim, falo, mas só ando a aprendê-lo há 5 meses, então não falo muito bem". (EP)

Is that correct? Have I included/omitted the correct its?!


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## Outsider

It is correct, although the following would also be correct, and more common in colloquial speech:

"Sim, falo, mas só ando a aprender há 5 meses, então não falo muito bem".​The word "sim" is optional in all three sentences.


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## ayupshiplad

Does saying 'aprendê-lo' instead of aprender pretty much mark me out as a foreigner?


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## Outsider

No, it just marks you as educated. It's more formal. 

I'd missed the following:



ayupshiplad said:


> "Sim, falo, mas só ando a aprender há 5 meses, então não falo muito bem".​


I would not use the word "então" in this way. Say "por isso" instead.


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## uchi.m

Outsider said:


> I understand, but, you see, this is a very general thing. No Romance language would ever put a pronoun where those "its" are (in Spanish: _me gusta cuando llueve_). It's not an issue of translation from English.



Perhaps I was not clear. What I meant is that novice English learners in Brazil are likely to translate the sentence _"Eu gosto quando chove"_ as something close to _"I like, uh, when... rain" _

This English's *it* issue demands a lot of effort of the Portuguese speaker to save in the back of his/her mind.


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## Outsider

Oh, yes. "I like when rains." "I like that rains." That's probably the sort of thing that Ayupshiplad's friends say.


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## Ricardo Tavares

Outsider said:


> Oh, yes. "I like when rains." "I like that rains." That's probably the sort of thing that Ayupshiplad's friends say.



Or "I like when it rains". That's what I whould have said and written. Now I can see that it is wrong, thou....


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