# ... on the death of ...



## Amerykańska kobieta

I want to send my sympathies to family in Poland, something like this:

My sincerest sympathies on the tragic death of the president of Poland and the other on the plane.

My start is:
  Moje najszczersze współczucie o tragicznej śmierci prezydenta Polsky i innych ludzi na tym samolocie.

This probably has a lot of problems, but one for sure is which preposition to use for "on" the tragic death of ...

Dziękuję uprzejmie, Ak


----------



## frenchboy

Amerykańska kobieta said:


> I want to send my sympathies to family in Poland, something like this:
> 
> My sincerest sympathies on the tragic death of the president of Poland and the other on the plane.
> 
> My start is:
> Moje najszczersze współczucie o tragicznej śmierci prezydenta Polsky i innych ludzi na tym samolocie.
> 
> This probably has a lot of problems, but one for sure is which preposition to use for "on" the tragic death of ...
> 
> Dziękuję uprzejmie, Ak



Przekazam swoje najszczersze współczucia ze względu na tragicznych okolicznościach śmierci Prezydenta, wielu czołowych dyplomatów oraz innych Polaków. [Przeżywamy te chwile jak w Polsce... (?)]

My sincerest sympathies on the tragic circumstances of the deaths of the President, many leading diplomats and other Poles.

Bardzo miłe, że piszesz. Mam nadzieje, że jakoś pomogłem...


----------



## -Arturo-

Amerykańska kobieta said:


> I want to send my sympathies to family in Poland, something like this:
> 
> My sincerest sympathies on the tragic death of the president of Poland and the other on the plane.
> 
> My start is:
> Moje najszczersze współczucie o tragicznej śmierci prezydenta Polsky i innych ludzi na tym samolocie.
> 
> This probably has a lot of problems, but one for sure is which preposition to use for "on" the tragic death of ...
> 
> Dziękuję uprzejmie, Ak



Almost perfect AK.

Moje najszczersze współczucie z powodu tragicznej śmierci prezydenta Polski i innych ludzi w tym samolocie.


I would also change the second part of the sentence to something more formal but your version is also ok. 

Moje najszczersze współczucie z powodu tragicznej śmierci prezydenta Polski oraz innych ludzi poległych w katastrofie samolotu.


----------



## -Arturo-

frenchboy said:


> Przekazam swoje najszczersze współczucia ze względu na tragicznych okolicznościach śmierci Prezydenta, wielu czołowych dyplomatów oraz innych Polaków. [Przeżywamy te chwile jak w Polsce... (?)]
> 
> My sincerest sympathies on the tragic circumstances of the deaths of the President, many leading diplomats and other Poles.
> 
> Bardzo miłe, że piszesz. Mam nadzieje, że jakoś pomogłem...



Hey Frenchboy, a few mistakes.

Przekazuje swoje najszczersze wyrazy współczucia z powodu (it just sounds better for some reason) tragicznych okoliczności śmierci Prezydenta, wielu czołowych dyplomatów oraz innych Polaków.


----------



## Ben Jamin

-Arturo- said:


> Almost perfect AK.
> 
> Moje najszczersze współczucie z powodu tragicznej śmierci prezydenta Polski i innych ludzi w tym samolocie.
> 
> 
> I would also change the second part of the sentence to something more formal but your version is also ok.
> 
> Moje najszczersze współczucie z powodu tragicznej śmierci prezydenta Polski oraz innych ludzi poległych w katastrofie samolotu.


 
"Ludzi" just does not sound well here, it should be "osób" (persons), as a more respectful expression.


----------



## Amerykańska kobieta

On ludzie verses osoby -- too late for my message, but could you give me some other contexts when osoby would be more respectful.  In US English the word "persons" and "people" are used quite interchangeably, with a slight favoring for "people."   

To be honest I use ludzie and osoby interchangeably based on which declension of the word and adjectives I am most sure of at the moment.  I'm a bit slow when it comes to getting my declensions correct without really giving it thought.

Thanks, Ak


----------



## arturolczykowski

Definitely "najserdeczniejsze wyrazy współczucia" and "osób" sound better in this context.


----------



## dn88

Amerykańska kobieta said:


> On ludzie verses osoby -- too late for my message, but could you give me some other contexts when osoby would be more respectful.  In US English the word "persons" and "people" are used quite interchangeably, with a slight favoring for "people."
> 
> To be honest I use ludzie and osoby interchangeably based on which declension of the word and adjectives I am most sure of at the moment.  I'm a bit slow when it comes to getting my declensions correct without really giving it thought.
> 
> Thanks, Ak



To my mind, the word "ludzie" is more general. When you say "osoby", it's more like you're focusing on each individual. Also, as it has already been mentioned, "ludzie" doesn't sound good in this context, "osoby" seems better and more formal.


----------



## Faycelina

dn88 said:


> To my mind, the word "ludzie" is more general. When you say "osoby", it's more like you're focusing on each individual.


This is what I also feel in that context.
np. Wielu ludzi zgromadziło się dziś na Rynku - you mean a crowd of "anonymous" people.
Wiele osób przyszło dziś na wykład - if you know at least some of them, I wouldn't use "ludzi" in that context. 
It's hard to make a quick line in a good point but more or less it's like that.



dn88 said:


> Also, as it has already been mentioned, "ludzie" doesn't sound good in this context, "osoby" seems better and more formal.


Hmm, I'm not really sure about it. You can say about this situation also "zginęło tam wielu wspaniałych ludzi" and it's not less formal. 
As far as I'm concerned it's all about treating them anonymously or not.


----------



## dn88

Faycelina said:


> Hmm, I'm not really sure about it. You can say about this situation also "zginęło tam wielu wspaniałych ludzi" and it's not less formal.
> As far as I'm concerned it's all about treating them anonymously or not.



You make a valid point there, but without an adjective, "ludzie" just doesn't sound half as good as "osoby" in this context.


----------



## Ben Jamin

Amerykańska kobieta said:


> On ludzie verses osoby -- too late for my message, but could you give me some other contexts when osoby would be more respectful. In US English the word "persons" and "people" are used quite interchangeably, with a slight favoring for "people."
> 
> To be honest I use ludzie and osoby interchangeably based on which declension of the word and adjectives I am most sure of at the moment. I'm a bit slow when it comes to getting my declensions correct without really giving it thought.
> 
> Thanks, Ak


I understand that Polish is not your native tongue. English (American English) differs from Polish in this respect. You just cannot transfer connotations of a word from one language to another. In Polish the word ludzie used about defined persons has a slightly condescending meaning (common people, the crowd, labour force), while persons is definitely more respectful or deferential. Ludzie about the mankind is neutral (human beings). The most deferential, however, is "osobistosci" (personages).


----------



## Ben Jamin

Faycelina said:


> This is what I also feel in that context.
> np. Wielu ludzi zgromadziło się dziś na Rynku - you mean a crowd of "anonymous" people.
> Wiele osób przyszło dziś na wykład - if you know at least some of them, I wouldn't use "ludzi" in that context.
> It's hard to make a quick line in a good point but more or less it's like that.
> 
> 
> Hmm, I'm not really sure about it. You can say about this situation also "zginęło tam wielu wspaniałych ludzi" and it's not less formal.
> As far as I'm concerned it's all about treating them anonymously or not.


 Do not forget that you have used a qualifier "wspaniałych". This changes a lot.


----------



## Amerykańska kobieta

Thanks for the added information.  The concept of a crowd and/or anonymity ("generic" people) helps a lot.

 Dziękuję uprzejmie, Ak


----------

