# Indoor Malls/ Outdoor Strip Malls



## MelB

Indoor malls are a very significant shopping resource in America.  I looked up "mall" or shopping mall in my unabridged dictionary, and found "le centre commercial."  That's fine, but we have "indoor shopping malls," and "strip malls," which are outdoors.  They are often outdoor shopping areas along highways, or avenues.  The word refers to something different then outdoors shopping areas along a street in the downtown of a city. 

I was trying to figure what words in French to use to describe these. 

I was thinking for an indoor shopping mall, I would just say, "le centre commercial intérieur."  Is that correct?  If not, what is the right way to say it?

Also, is there way to refer to an "outdoor strip mall"?  Perhaps, "le centre commerical extérieur?  That though doesn't seem precise enough.


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## GenJen54

For those who do not understand the concept of "strip malls," you can look at this thread HERE.


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## Fredb

Hey Mel, 

Am not sure we differentiate that much those terms, because in the end you are just going to the mall/ centre commercial, wherever it is located doesn't make that much of a difference.
Shopping mall is centre commercial, strip mall would be zone commerciale maybe (zone along higways where shopping malls are agglutinated).


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## french4beth

In Grand dico, I found the following 3 definitions: 'centre commerciale linéaire,' 'commerce en bande,' and 'commerce en rangée' - are these just for NA, or are the terms used in Europe?
I believe 'centre d'achats' is only used in Quebec (right?).


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## hald

I never heard any of these terms.

As far as I can tell, "centre commercial" works either for indoor and outdoor malls.

"outdoors shopping areas along a street in the downtown of a city" : that would be "rue commerçante" in french.


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## Danse Macabre

I'd never use "centre commercial" for outdoor mall. I'd say "rue commerçante" instead. 

I'm also thinking about "galerie commerciale" but in my mind it is more used for indoor malls.


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## geve

For me, "rue commerçante", is really a _rue_ with some _commerces..._ 
According to the pictures in the thread posted by GenJen54, this is not the same thing. More likely, in France, strip malls would be located on a _route nationale_, just outside small cities or _zones industrielles_, and you'll have a chinese restaurant, a locksmith, a dry-cleaner, a DVD rental and a furniture store, all lined up and facing a row of parking spaces (a row, not a wide parking area)...

I'm not sure there's one word on which everyone would agree...  
I've never heard the words found by french4beth. I'd say that _galerie commerciale_ is a small _centre commercial_. 
But _zone commerciale_ or _zone commerçante_ could do the trick - though without further explanations, it will not suffice to ensure that the person gets the exact idea


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## Agnès E.

Mmm...
Pour moi, une galerie commerciale/marchande est un bâtiment abritant plusieurs magasins différents sous le même toit. Ce serait ça, pour moi, _strip mall_. Bien qu'en France les galeries commerciales, bordant rarement une route, sont rarement en ligne comme dans la photo, en effet.

Un centre commercial est, selon moi, une zone regroupant une ou plusieurs galeries commerciales/marchandes, ainsi que des restaurants franchisés, des concessionnaires automobiles, et des magasins franchisés.

NON ! je ne donnerai pas de noms propres, na !


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## EmmaPeel

I do agree with Agnès  

Nevertheless, a big "galerie commerçante" will be called "centre commercial"
And the "strip mall" (on the photos) is also called "Centre commercial".
If the shops are in the same area but detached form each other and if the aera is very big, it is called "zone commerciale".
e.g. in a "zone commerciale" or ZAC (Zone d'Activités Commerciales), you may have a strip mall, plus serveral car shops or furniture shops or equipment shops...


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## geve

Oui, c'est ça, le problème : on a peu de strip malls en France... On en a quelques uns tout de même, sur les nationales (j'en ai vu entre Dreux et Verneuil-sur-Avre, pour être précise  ), ainsi qu'en banlieue parisienne... Mais je n'arrive pas à trouver de photos


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## MelB

Still, if as Emma says, a strip mall (which is outdoors), and a indoor mall are called, "centre commercial," how can I make clear in my writing that I'm referring to an indoor mall. 

I think the "galerie commerciale" is smaller than an indoor mall. As Agnes describes it, it's a building sheltering several stoors.  The indoor mall in America is generally huge.  

Would, as I mentioned originally, the phrase, "centre commercial intérieur" help?  or "centre commericial en dedans"?

I was thinking that the word "intérieur" would be good to convey the idea of indoors versus outdoors.


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## Agnès E.

No, Mel, we would not in French describe it so specifically, this is one main difference between French and English! 
I would stick with *centre commercial*.


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## MelB

Agnes, 

I want to be able to convey in what I'm writing that I'm indoors.  There's got to be a way to be able to do that in French. 

I can say, "un centre commercial" for the mall, but in continuing to write, I want people to understand where I am physically.  I'm in an indoor shopping area (with common grounds, benches, a food court, with stands that provide many different types of food, etc).   

Maybe I can say, "je vais un centre commerical.  Il est en dedans une batîment immense avec plus de cinquante magasins, sur trois étages.  Il y a des sentiers à côté des magasins, une place commune dans le centre,  avec un arbre de Noël, très grand, des banquettes, une fontaine, une cour de la nourriture, avec une grande variété de la cochonnerie, mais un peu qui est bonne .  . . ."

Comme ça.

I think I understand you.  For mall, I need to use, "un centre commercial," but certainly there are words in French which can then be used to make clear that it's all indoors.


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## geve

I would add to what Agnès already said, that the problem would be to make clear that you're talking about a strip mall. 
If you're referring to an indoor mall, well, that's what people will understand anyway if you write _centre commercial  _


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## Agnès E.

Then, just say: *je suis dans un centre commercial*. Everyone will understand you are inside, Mel!


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## MelB

Thanks Geve/Agnes, 

Actually, I was writing about the indoor type mall.  So if "dans un centre commercial" conveys that it's indoors, that's perfect.  I was concerned that "centre commercial" was ambiguous on whether it was indoors or outdoors and that I needed to say more.


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## Agnès E.

Actually, it would have been slightly more difficult to express that you were... outdoors, Mel!


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## MelB

Gee, I shouldn't have even mentioned outdoor strip malls, as I wasn't working on that.  The indoor mall was easy.  I raised what they say in English, is a "red herring."  Ha-ha!  Actually, my confusion was that hald had said in this thread that "un centre commercial" can be indoors or outdoors.  

A question though.  If I just say, "je vais à un centre commercial," would people know it's indoors?  Or do I need to use "dans" and say something like, "je suis dans un centre commercial," which is the phrase you gave me. 

Right now I have in what I'm writing, "je marche sur des sentiers d'un centre commercial, qui est bondé, même dans le milieu de la semaine."

Would it be clear from that sentence that I'm indoors? 

Passez une bonne journée, Agnes.


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## Agnès E.

If you say _je vais à_..., you mean: _I'm going to_... (mouvement from any place to the mall: can be in a car, by foot, by bicycle...)
If you want to say that you are in it, you have to use the static verb _être_.

If you want to describe what you are doing once you're inside: *je marche dans les allées d'un centre* .... the rest of your sentence is fine.  And then, it is obvious you are indoors, wandering.


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## EmmaPeel

MelB said:
			
		

> A question though. If I just say, "je vais à un centre commercial," would people know it's indoors? Or do I need to use "dans" and say something like, "je suis dans un centre commercial," which is the phrase you gave me.


 
Yes if you say "Je vais au centre commercial", people will think first of an indoor mall as it is the most common in France. But it also depends on the context. Then if you say "Je marche dans le centre commercial" or "dans les allées du centre commercial" or "dans la galerie du centre commercial", as Agnes suggested, no doubt will  be left.


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## MelB

Great, and it sounds like "les allées" is correct, and what I was trying "les sentiers," isn't which is fine.  In fact, there was method in my madness.  That's why I sent you my sentence, hoping if "sentiers" was wrong, you would pass along the right word.  

EmmaPeel, 

Also, it sounds like when you say, "dans la galerie du centre commercial," you are then talking about being in the common area part, not in a particular store.  

Agnes said:  "Pour moi, une galerie commerciale/marchande est un bâtiment abritant plusieurs magasins différents sous le même toit."  That sounds like a small indoor mall to me. 

And it sounds differnt from "la galerie du centre commercial."

Am I right that if one refers to that, one is talking about the common areas in a large mall--maybe on a walkway, a bench, in the food court, by a fountain, rather than being inside a particular store.


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## wordwarrior

Just wondering, are you writing for a European audience, or a Quebec one?


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## MelB

Actually, I was writing a journal for myself at this point to try to improve my writing in French, although I am getting some feedback from French people to help me.  Is there a different way to say "indoor mall" in Canada, than in France?


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## Gil

"Mail" est utilisé en Ontario:


> Le mail de la rue Sparks, le premier mail en plein air au Canada, offre une agréable diversité qui se fait rare dans les milieux de la vente de détail d'aujourd'hui.


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## MelB

Gil, 

Do they also use "un centre commercial," in Quebec, or is that term used only in France?  

For smaller indoor shopping areas, in France they seem to use:   une galerie commerciale/marchande.  Are any of those terms in use in Quebec? 

Also, I wonder if in France, they use "le mail."  I would think the people from France who have responded to this thread would have mentioned that word if they did.  Still, "le mail" is in my Collins Robert unabridged French dictionary as meaning in English, "mall"  

Ideally, I'd prefer to use a term everyone agreed on -- the people in Quebec and France.  But I would say the Brits and we Americans have a few differences on words in English also.


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## Gil

> Do they also use "un centre commercial," in Quebec


Yes.


> For smaller indoor shopping areas, in France they seem to use: une galerie commerciale/marchande. Are any of those terms in use in Quebec?


I don't think so.


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## Agnès E.

MelB said:
			
		

> Also, I wonder if in France, they use "le mail." I would think the people from France who have responded to this thread would have mentioned that word if they did. Still, "le mail" is in my Collins Robert unabridged French dictionary as meaning in English, "mall"


 
No, although the word _un mail_ does exist in French! 

It describes, in the Northern half of France only, the village square where the market used to take place (generally once a week) in the past. This rectangular space is generally lined with trees in order to provide nice shadow during the summertime. Nowadays, most villages don't have any more weekly market.

In the village of Touraine (founded in the 9th century by Charlemagne's bishop Alcuin) where we use to spend our summer holidays, _le mail_ is still used for the Saturday market and serves as a parkplace the rest of the week.

This makes me wonder what the origin of this word is...


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## geve

That's why it rang a bell ! Thanks Agnès for the explanation, I had vaguely in mind that the term could be commerce-related...

Also, today in France, many people say "un mail" instead of "un e-mail" (_je t'envoie ça par mail, est-ce que tu as reçu mon mail ?_), so I guess that's how French people would understand it  (well, obviously not if you write "je marche dans les allées d'un mail"...)


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## Agnès E.

Non Geve, car un *mail* (courrier électronique) se prononce le plus souvent avec un è (gargl !).

Alors qu'un *mail*, mot de français très ancien pour "place du marché", se prononce _maille_, comme dans le tricot ! c'est pourquoi je me demande s'il ne serait pas lié au mot anglais _mall_...


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## geve

ah, je ne savais pas comment se prononçait le mot dans son usage correct/historique en français... merci Agnès


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## The Ho

To MelB : _Une galerie commerciale_ is very rarely heard. _Galerie marchande_ is OK.


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## EmmaPeel

Agnès E. said:
			
		

> Alors qu'un *mail*, mot de français très ancien pour "place du marché", se prononce _maille_, comme dans le tricot ! c'est pourquoi je me demande s'il ne serait pas lié au mot anglais _mall_...


 
Pour information :
Je viens de regarder dans les dictionnaires et en fait le *mail* qui désigne quelquefois une promenade publique, vient de la similitude au terrain de *jeu de mail*. 

Actually, *pall-mall* comes from the French *mail* game, hence *mall *comes indirectly from the French *mail *meaning pedestrian alley.


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## geve

je ne connaissais pas non plus le jeu de mail...
une promenade publique ? est-ce que ça pourrait être dans ce cas lié au mot anglais "mile" ? comme le "Royal Mile" à Edinburgh...


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## EmmaPeel

geve said:
			
		

> je ne connaissais pas non plus le jeu de mail...
> une promenade publique ? est-ce que ça pourrait être dans ce cas lié au mot anglais "mile" ? comme le "Royal Mile" à Edinburgh...


 
Le jeu de mail, en fait c'est le jeu de maillet dans lequel on pousse des boules de buis avec des maillets.


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## wordwarrior

In Canada, the very common term "mail" is almost always pronounced to rime with the English "small" (influenced by the English) although it would be more correct to call it "le centre d'achat" or for a higher level of language "le centre commercial". Interestingly, their names often include the term "place" as in Place d'Anjou, Place d'Orléans, or Les Galeries XXX , but they are never referred to in the general as "des galeries". 

I don't know of a specific term for strip malls, although they are very common. In a small town, they might be referred to as "le centreville" , or la zone commerciale, or simply "le p'tit 'mall' du coin".


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## Gil

Exemple d'emploi au Canada:


> Les Galeries de Hull
> À quelques pas du Casino du Lac-Leamy, le centre commercial Les Galeries de Hull se distingue par le vaste choix des 75 boutiques ....


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