# j'en perds mon latin



## electro

Hello all!

What exactly is the meaning of this phrase: "J'en perds mon latin" ?

Context could be possibly referring to forgetting something? I'm not quite sure, and I don't the know meaning of this phrase...

Thanks


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## Canard

I can't figure it out at all.
I can't make any sense (out) of it.
etc.

According to the WF dictionary, there's also "C'est à y perdre son latin !" with the same meaning.


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## itka

J'en perds mon latin = je n'y comprends plus rien, c'est trop compliqué


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## LaRue

je perds mon latin. = i lost my latin. i think
en can be at or in or into or as, or blah blah blah

im going to think of it as "i lost in latin" or maybe "i failed in latin" as in latin the subject.


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## Gil

Suggestion:
I am at a lost...
Edit:  Une amie me suggère "at a loss" et elle a raison
C'est bien d'avoir une amie


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## Canard

A touch formal there, Gil  Isn't "j'en perds mon latin" casual?


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## Gil

Canard said:


> A touch formal there, Gil  Isn't "j'en perds mon latin" casual?


I don't think so, in 2008.  
On ne perd pas le latin que l'on n'a jamais appris.


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## Canard

Ah, my mistake. Then your suggestion would be perfectly fine if the register is higher


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## electro

Alright, that's helps me a lot!

Thanks to everyone.


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## itka

"J'en perds mon latin" is not a all high register ! It is very casual, even a bit familiar ... and I think everybody uses it, even people who never learn latin !

I'll ask people on the French Only Forum.


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## Canard

What contexts would you use it in? If you say "I am at a loss" among friends, you must be joking or among some very serious friends  In fact, I'd venture to say that unless you're at a solemn ceremony such as a funeral, or so astounded that you're speechless ("I'm at a loss _for words_"), then I wouldn't really use that translation in everyday life. I could see it being used among friends if something horrible has just happened, but not mere confusion or lack of understanding.


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## Gil

Canard said:


> What contexts would you use it in? If you say "I am at a loss" among friends, you must be joking or among some very serious friends  In fact, I'd venture to say that unless you're at a solemn ceremony such as a funeral, or so astounded that you're speechless ("I'm at a loss _for words_"), then I wouldn't really use that translation in everyday life. I could see it being used among friends if something horrible has just happened, but not mere confusion or lack of understanding.


O.K.  I'm the guilty one  and I'm not a native speaker.  Thanks for clarifying things.


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## david314

itka said:


> "J'en perds mon latin" is not a all high register ! It is very casual, even a bit familiar ... and I think everybody uses it, even people who never learn latin !
> 
> I'll ask people on the French Only Forum.


  I believe that I'd say:  *I've lost my Latin.*

pax vobiscum


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## Punky Zoé

coup de pouce said:


> I agree with Gil: _en perdre son latin_ is high register
> It is also old-fashioned and I would use it only in a humorous way, even if I was speaking with stiff-necked diplomats.


Hi

I don't think so, it is a common expression (even if young people may not say it), used in every kind of social context.


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## Hieronymus IV

J'utiliserai désormais cet idiome. Merci beaucoup.


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## Bobbibounette

Gil said:


> I don't think so, in 2008.
> On ne perd pas le latin que l'on n'a jamais appris.


 
very clear reference to the origin of the expression!

I agree with both Gil and Coupdepouce about the higher level of language. It would definitely make my pupils smile (I'm not sure they'd really get it by the way) and add to their belief that us teachers know only about Mozart and personnally met dinosaures!!!


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## Hieronymus IV

Donc, je peux dire «J'en perds mon français»?

(Malgré n'avoir jamais possédé le français.)

[*Edit* :  c'est une petite plaisanterie]


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## Punky Zoé

Hieronymus IV said:


> Donc, je peux dire «J'en perds mon français»?
> 
> (Malgré n'avoir jamais possédé le français.)


Non, cela n'aurait pas le même sens, cela signifierait "je ne trouve pas mes mots en français" ou j'ai du mal à m'exprimer en français".

Je ne connais pas l'origine de l'expression, mais je pense que latin n'y a pas exactement le sens de "langue latine" mais plutôt de "compréhension".

(d'ailleurs tu ne le perds pas, ton français )


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## Hieronymus IV

Ah, je vois. Merci.


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## KaRiNe_Fr

Salut,



itka said:


> J'en perds mon latin = je n'y comprends plus rien, c'est trop compliqué


 
Et aussi : je ne sais plus quoi faire ! (tellement j'y comprends que couic ! )

Quant au registre, je vais répondre dans ton fil sur le FS...


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## qwill

All these subtleties leading to something like :  "I've lost my Latin, its all Greek to me... really double-Dutch !(which of course, a French would translate by : "J'en perds mon latin, c'est de l'hébreu pour moi, c'est vraiment du chinois ! )


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## Bobbibounette

Excellent qwill! 
(yet I think 'j'en perds mon latin' means you understood until something happened and confused you... is it conveyed in one of your expressions)


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## Nicomon

Bobbibounette said:


> Excellent qwill!
> (yet I think 'j'en perds mon latin' means you understood until something happened and confused you... is it conveyed in one of your expressions)


 This is how I would use it too. Juste like itka and Karine said.
_Je n'y comprends *plus *rien / je ne sais *plus* quoi faire_. There is (at least when I use it) definitely an idea of surprise or confusion. 

Incidentally... Robert & Collins also suggest: _*I can't make head nor tail of it*._ Which is in line with Canard's suggestions, in post #2. 
But I do think that in certain circumstances, gil's _I'm at a loss_ would work. 

Whereas if I say for example « _la physique nucléaire, pour moi c'est du chinois/japonais »,_ I mean I never had, and probably never will understand anything of it. And I believe (someone will correct me if I'm wrong) that _Greek / really double-Dutch_ are closer to that meaning. _What in the world are you talking about? It's all Greek to me!_

_Edit : _The TLFI also makes a difference between_ y perdre son latin_ and_ c'est du latin/chinois/de l'hébreu._ On this page. And the register is indeed considered familiar.


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## wildan1

No Latin references in the AE version: _I'm clueless..._

Or _I can't make head nor tails of it_ (more formal)


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## timpeac

wildan1 said:


> No Latin references in the AE version: _I'm clueless..._
> 
> Or _I can't make head nor tails of it_ (more formal)


But from what I can tell from the above discussion there is the idea that you started off ok but it's all got a bit much now. How about "I'm losing the plot now".


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## wildan1

timpeac said:


> But from what I can tell from the above discussion there is the idea that you started off ok but it's all got a bit much now. How about "I'm losing the plot now".


 
So, _At this point I am clueless_
or
_The situation has left me lost in the dust..._


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## Gerard Samuel

How about "it's all Greek to me"?


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## wildan1

Gerard Samuel said:


> How about "it's all Greek to me"?


I think that's _C'est du chinois pour moi_


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## Arrius

Also *je suis au bout de mon latin* (_I really can't deal with/handle this//This is beyond me_), for which there is no need to have any Latin at all.


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## david314

david314 said:


> I believe that I'd say:  *I've lost my Latin.*    The preceeding was a stupid suggestion, sorry!
> 
> pax vobiscum


  Huh, what was I smoking? 

I like the most recent suggestions.  Perhaps, also:  _I'm out of *my element/depth*_.


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## Bobbibounette

Arrius said:


> Also *je suis au bout de mon latin* (_I really can't deal with/handle this//This is beyond me_), for which there is no need to have any Latin at all.


never heard it, sorry...


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## Arrius

Bobbibounette said:


> never heard it, sorry...


 
From the Glossary of Colloquial French for the Use of English Readers by E.L.Kastner:
*"Être (*or* se trouver) au bout de son latin*,_ to be at one's wit's end, to be at the end of one's resources_.......... "Birotteau se trouvait au bout de son latin; il avait usé tous ses artifices pour lui dérober la connaissance des symptômes de sa gêne". (BALZAC, César Birotteau)*"*


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## Bobbibounette

Soit ! 
Je me contente de signaler aux futurs lecteurs de ce fil que mes oreilles de native de 35 ans n'ont jamais entendu cette expression utilisée par le commun des mortels...


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## Arrius

According to some reference books, this suspect phrase is also used untranslated in English (like _faute de mieux_ and _nobless oblige)_, but I have never heard this.


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