# echar



## vince

Where does the Spanish word "echar" come from?

Is it related to French "jeter"?

What are cognates in Portuguese and Italian?


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## Frank06

Hi,



vince said:


> Where does the Spanish word "echar" come from?
> Is it related to French "jeter"? What are cognates in Portuguese and Italian?


Both 'echar' and 'jeter' go back to Latin iactare, so yes, they're cognates.

Here (bottom of the page) I found a list of other cognates in various Romance languages:


> Berry, giter ; provenç. gitar, gietar, getar ; espagn. jitar, jetar ; ital. gittare, gettare ; du latin jactare, fréquentatif de jacio (voy. JET).


 
Groetjes,

Frank


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## Outsider

A non obvious Portuguese cognate seems to be deitar (<_dejectare_
).


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## hosec

Hola:

Si no me equivoco, el español "echar" en la expresión "echar de menos" proviene del portugués "achar".

Salud.


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## vince

But "achar" is actually Spanish "hallar" (say it in Argentinian and it will be more clear)

is it possible to say in Spanish:

"Te hallo de menos"?


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## jonquiliser

En cuanto se refiere a la expresión "echar de menos", yo había entendido lo mismo que hosec; y de hecho, la RAE también así lo indica. Pero esto se debe a una confusion entre "achar" português y el "echar" castellano; realmente "achar" quiere decir "hallar" en castellano, como dice vince, pero por ser tan parecidas lo habrían entendido como "echar". El verbo achar a su vez proviene del latín "afflare". (and no, "hallar de menos" doesn't exist, as far as I know )

Pero la etimología de "echar" es lo que ya han dicho, es decir, vienen del latín actāre


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## vince

Is there a scientific name of this phenomenon, where a related language "mis-borrows" an expression due to phonetic similarity rather than etymologically, yet is still 'perceived' as a native phrase?

I've seen this happen in another language too.


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## papillon

hosec said:


> Si no me equivoco, el español "echar" en la expresión "echar de menos" proviene del portugués "achar".


Very interesting. I am a little confused about this transformation. Does "achar" mean "to miss " in Portuguese? And how did the "de menos" part get added on?


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## vince

achar  is the Portuguese version of Spanish's "hallar" (to find)

It can also mean "to think (that)", e.g. "Acho que você fez uma boa pergunta"


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## tvdxer

"Echar" is cognate with the English words eject, deject, inject, reject, adjective, abject, subject, object, adjacent, and jet.


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## keops1987

papillon said:


> Very interesting. I am a little confused about this transformation. Does "achar" mean "to miss " in Portuguese? And how did the "de menos" part get added on?


 

Achar does not mean to miss in portuguese, it is simply just a verb that means to "find" (broadly). "de menos" adds meaning to this verb in the way that you "find" someone missing, or substracted if you will from your company ( menos is also the translation for the arithmetical "minus")


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## Cecilio

In Catalan we have the expression "trobar a faltar", which is equivalent to Spanish "echar de menos". The Catalan verb "trobar" means "to find", therefore it's similar in meaning to Portuguese "achar".


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## JB

vince said:


> Is there a scientific name of this phenomenon, where a related language "mis-borrows" an expression due to phonetic similarity rather than etymologically, yet is still 'perceived' as a native phrase?


 
I do not know the term, but I think it is probably a phenomenon in all languages.  There is the term "loan words".  Japanese is loaded with words like "doa" (door), "raita" (cigarette lighter), etc.   I remember once asking a Japanese visitor to the U.S. if he knew the word "typhoon", and he reminded me that it is Japanese (tai fun).  (U.S. scientists adopted ite to replace of "title wave".)

In English, from Span. we have "Waco, TX" (hueco), "lasoo" (lazo), hosegow (juzgado) and many more.

In English the French term "pars coeurs" meaning "for hearts", referring to an exercise regimen, became "par course", which sounds English and makes some sense.

And in France, the government has an official list of banned anglecisms, such as "Le drugstore", "le businessman", "le jet".  I imagine young people in France these days, who have grown up with them don't even know they are not French.

And in Mexico, I have seen English words, like sandwich (clearly English, from the Earl of Sandwich) just gradually take on the Spanish phonetic spelling.


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## chaya

*Hi everyone. *
*echar *(Ladino) = se coucher (Fr) 

I have heard this word used by the Ladino - speakers in several countries. It seems quite logical albeit picturesque to me that one 'throws oneself down' to sleep.


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## Outsider

In Portuguese, too, _deitar-se_ can mean "to lie down" to sleep.

P.S. And I see from the links above that Spanish _echarse_ has the same meaning, as well.


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