# Are speakers of a second language too sensitive about their own mistakes?



## KateNicole

Hello everybody!
I've been thinking about this a lot lately, and it seems to me that most of my friends and co-workers who speak Spanish as a _second_ language, but speak with near-native fluency are hyper-sensitive when it comes to making mistakes and become very flustered, upset or downright defensive if anyone corrects or questions them. 

Do you think that in general, people who study foreign languages are more sensitive to criticism and making mistakes than people who study math, science or anything else basically? I do . . . 

Please keep in mind that I am only referring to people who have _studied_ a foreign language very dilligently for a long time. I'm not referring to someone who speaks a second language because they grew up at home speaking it yet never studied it, nor am I referring to people who haphazardly (and luckily) picked up a language while living in another country/travelling.


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## pamproductions

I don't think that people who study languages are any different than other subject learners, or experts come to think about it - especially when it comes to taking opinions or advice.  

We all live in a sphere on knowledge in which we feel comfortable in, or our comfort zone; and when that is challenged some people become defensive about the matter.  Others don't, but these are the rarer type of person.  

We all think we know a thing until we study it more, or study some aspect which we don't know.  Then we begin to understand how much we don't know.  This is were the heart of learning begins and becomes a joy as the good old Buddhist said to his pupil.  Learn the things in which we know not, and then we become what we know not.  

I say no more, but study what you don't know - whether that advice is from book or persons direct.


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## Pivra

I am sometimes for English, since I've been speaking it since I started Middle School (I'm in grade 10) and should've been better.


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## KateNicole

But would you be considerably more upset to find a correction on an English essay than on your math test, for example?


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## pamproductions

Would you Kate?  And why?  What's the difference?  Only that many think maths to be maths, while others think maths easy as learning languages, which not all of us would agree with.


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## KateNicole

The difference is that English is his/her foreign language, and math is not.

I was _not_ in any way implying that one is easier to learn than the other! (Nor do I really care) I only used math as a non-foreign language example. I'm _not_ trying to ask how foreign language ranks in difficulty or importance. 

I asked because I didn't understand if he/she said he feels sensitive simply because he thinks he should know more English by now, or if he was saying that he is _more_ sensitive about the mistakes he makes in his second language than the mistakes he makes in any other subject area.
                       *          *         *
To answer my own question, and part of your question:
I try to not be overly sensitive because I've just accepted the fact that no matter how careful I am and no matter how much I study, I will still have near-native fluency, not native fluency.  I'll never master Spanish 100%.  Because I try so hard, I'm more sensitive to the mistakes I make in my foreign language that mistakes I make in my native language.  The disappointment and frustration is greater.  Anyway, I don't think I get nearly as upset as some of my peers.


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## Residente Calle 13

KateNicole said:
			
		

> I try to not be overly sensitive because I've just accepted the fact that no matter how careful I am and no matter how much I study, I will still have near-native fluency, not native fluency.  I'll never master Spanish 100%.



Hi Kate,

Hmmm. I have been speaking Spanish for longer than any other language but I don't think I'll ever master Spanish 100%. And with all due respect to all of the other foreros, I don't think anybody here has mastered Spanish 100%, not even the natives who speak and write much better Spanish than yours truly.

I don't know how you speak Spanish but you write it very well. And no matter how much you study, your Spanish will always get better than it would be if you didn't study at all. But that goes for every one of us. 

You get sensitive about mistakes for the same reason grown men cry when they lose a championship baseball game; because you care. I think that's a good thing.


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## lazarus1907

¿Sensitive about my mistakes in English? ¡¿ME?! Yes, I am, to tell the truth.  It is one of my worst weaknesses, and the reason why I am so crap at learning languages.

By the way, I would laugh if anyone claimed to be able to master Spanish 100% as you say. I am not even half way through, and it's my mother tongue.

Regards.


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## KateNicole

Hello dear Calle and Lazarus!!
I know what you two mean about not even being able to master a native language 100%. I should have explained myself better, but what I was trying to say is that there will always be very minor mistakes that I will make subconciously that a native speaker wouldn't ever make because "it just sounds wrong". Even though I can usually tell what sounds "right" or "wrong", there will always be certain things that will go undetected by my little radar 

Oh and Lazarus, don't be so modest. The RAE probably calls on you to proofread their dictionary!


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## Residente Calle 13

KateNicole said:
			
		

> I should have explained myself better, but what I was trying to say is that there will always be very minor mistakes that I will make subconciously that a native speaker wouldn't ever make because "it just sounds wrong". Even though I can usually tell what sounds "right" or "wrong", there will always be certain things that will go undetected by my little radar



Yes, I know. I can't speak Italian like a native but it's okay Italian for a foreigner and that's not all that bad. You've obviously invested more time and effort in Spanish and it shows. I don't think it's strange at all that someone would get worked up about mistakes they make in a language they put so much into but people react differently to this sort of thing and have different goals.


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## KateNicole

I was just thinking that people might get more worked up about it because language is so _social_. If you get corrected too much, you might feel like you're not good enough to converse freely or mingle with the crowd. I guess language mistakes can make you feel a little ostracized at times.


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## SofiaB

Like anything else it depends. I have seen people at various levels from beginners to experts. Some get mad over the slightest thing and others do not. I personally do not because I make mistakes in all the languages I speak. One it is a learning experience. Two if you know many languages the potential to make mistakes is higher. So for me and many others it is no big deal. Of course others get angry; often that is an impediment to learning.


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## danielfranco

KateNicole said:
			
		

> Please keep in mind that I am only referring to people who have _studied_ a foreign language very dilligently for a long time. I'm not referring to someone who speaks a second language because they grew up at home speaking it yet never studied it, nor am I referring to people who haphazardly (and luckily) picked up a language while living in another country/travelling.


 
Hi, Kate!
I guess that statement eliminates me, both in English AND Spanish! 
Unfortunately, I haven't studied either language very dilligently, and only speak them because I have lived in both Mexico and the USA. But let me share two observations:
I have noticed that many, many native speakers of the language (of both the ones I know) are the ones often bent out of shape when anyone at all corrects their language mistakes. As a matter of fact, something very common to hear after one of those corrections is the ever-ready,
"oh yeah? you understood what I said anyway! Din't'ya?",
or also,
"yeah, yeah... what HE said!"

And I suppose that people who study anything very dilligently are the type of people used to demand a lot of themselves, and believe they can master anything with enough determination. I don't think they are wrong, it's just that I'm not one of them, so I have trouble getting worked up about the myriad mistakes I make every time I speak in either language. 
Laters!
Dan F


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## natasha2000

KateNicole said:
			
		

> But would you be considerably more upset to find a correction on an English essay than on your math test, for example?


 
It depends on preferences.

Mistakes in English/Spanish paper did upset me, and in maths papers never. But I like languages, and hate mathematics.
On the other hand, I also had friends who were not upset at all by mistakes in X language papers (whatever language is), but they became very sensitive when it came to mistakes in maths or physics, or whatever other paper.


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## lazarus1907

I hate making mistakes in general, but I don't get angry at other people and I don't even mind when others correct me. On the contrary: If you are not corrected, you could eventually meet an impasse (© made in France) and not make significant progress, condemned to make the same mistakes all your life without even realizing it. My problem is that I feel bad every time I know I am not speaking correctly, even if I realize without other’s help; and the same goes for the pronunciation. But I warn you: My attitude is the worst possible one if you want to learn how to speak other languages; stay away from it!


  I guess that’s why I love Maths : You learn the rules properly, and it is extremely unlikely that you make mistakes.


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## natasha2000

lazarus1907 said:
			
		

> I hate making mistakes in general, but I don't get angry at other people and I don't even mind when others correct me. On the contrary: If you are not corrected, you could eventually meet an impasse (© made in France) and not make significant progress, condemned to make the same mistakes all your life without even realizing it. My problem is that I feel bad every time I know I am not speaking correctly, even if I realize without other’s help; and the same goes for the pronunciation. But I warn you: My attitude is the worst possible one if you want to learn how to speak other languages; stay away from it!
> 
> 
> I guess that’s why I love Maths : You learn the rules properly, and it is extremely unlikely that you make mistakes.


 
Well, it's like you were describing me..  I think that nobody feels happy when makes mistakes, especially someone whose profession are languages. What is important is the attittude you have when someone corrects you. I do mind when people correct me, but not because they corrected me, but because I made a mistake, so my anger goes towards myself, not towards people who correct me. But on the other hand, I cannot agree with you more when you say that if you are not corrected, you will get used to speak in this way (wrongly!) and once you learn something wrong and take a habit of using it, it is very difficult to change it. So, I do ask people to correct me, because I know it is good for me. And I'll manage somehow my hurt pride...


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## blue-eyes

Language is a living subject...it changes, it evolves, it adds words and meanings and its adopts words from other languages. Its perfectly normal to make mistakes in your 1st, 2nd, 3rd and any other that you speak.

When you earn your bread and butter by using language correctly, you tend to habitually check and recheck everything, but not because of any sensitivity. Even then, no-one is infallible.

saludos@todos


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## Bienvenidos

I like learning the correct usage of a term, but I really feel dissapointed in myself if I make a mistake in one of the other languages that I know. It's just something about my character--I want to present myself with the highest standards possible (i.e. no grammar mistakes!) But then again, I usually just laugh it off and say, "how come I did that?" 

*Bien*


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## macta123

A bit yes (If it is more useful in daily context). For example in cities here in India   English is the second language. So in offices and all when you grow up English is very much needed. So many people have a hesistation to say things clear (So it causes a mild (mild) inferiority complex - when facing more better speakers of that particular Second language ).
 Moreover I have seen most using their second language without any hesitation.


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## la tierra

I think that some people can speak more accurate a second language than a lot native speaker, because when people learning a second language always look dictionary and try to learn much more words but besite it, how many of you are looking at dictionary in your mother tongue in a day (even in a year)?

please correct my mistakes


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## Kelly B

KateNicole said:
			
		

> ...become very flustered, upset or downright defensive if anyone corrects or questions them. ...


What you observe might not be related to hyper-sensitivity or offense at all, but to the break in the flow of a conversation. Even in English, I get flustered and off-track if I am interrupted. Where was I? what was I saying, and what was the point I wanted to make? argh! It's gone, gone....

This is _much _worse in my second language, of course, because of the added effort of putting the sentences together in the first place. Making a correction during the course a conversation can throw the other person completely off balance, even if you meant it kindly and even if that person would appreciate your help. If you wait until the person finishes his point, it might be better received.


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## JonnieJag

I've been living in France for 15 years (yes you get less than that for murder in some countries! LOL) and unfortunately no one corrects my mistakes. It drives me nuts.


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## natasha2000

JonnieJag said:
			
		

> I've been living in France for 15 years (yes you get less than that for murder in some countries! LOL) and unfortunately no one corrects my mistakes. It drives me nuts.


 
So, either your French is excellent, or you are hopeless case... heheheh


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## JonnieJag

Is there a third option ?


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## natasha2000

JonnieJag said:
			
		

> Is there a third option ?


 
I wouldn't know... 
Anyway, this was just a joke, I really didn't mean anything bad... No hard feelings, I hope...


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## F/2.8

It depends ... if I am speaking second language French, and a French-speaker corrects me, usually I don't mind because it provides a good opportunity to improve. 
But if I am corrected by a person who speaks French as a second language, I do get a little upset inside. Perhaps it's to do with the fact that I've studied it just as much as the other person.


Incidentally I find that native speakers rarely speak their own tongue perfectly. I don't think I use correct English grammar more than a few rare times a day.


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## chintino

Hey there =)

I think I can weigh in on this because I have put in a tremendous effort to learn Spanish. The trip has been a fun one so far, though, so I have no complaints in that department.

I can tell you that I have been sensitive of making mistakes in the past. Very sensitive. Not so much in a defensive way, since I have always acnkowledged my mistakes, but more in a way that I would hesitate to say things for fear of saying them wrong.

I have decided, recently, to try and take a more humble approach to language learning. I will speak as if I knew what I was talking about, but at the same time, I now openly invite everybody who is willing to correct my Spanish. Since I started using this attitude I feel that my Spanish has really leaped up. Now that people are correcting me, and offering me more colloquial ways of saying the same things, I feel like I am now really learning how to speak more fluently and with more confidence. I now no longer fear making mistakes, because what I can tell you is this: almost every time I have made a mistake and someone has corrected me, it has been a marked memory for me, a memory that makes it very hard to make the same mistake again.

For me, having people correct my Spanish is the best way to learn. I am thankful for anybody who helps me do so. English, on the other hand, is another story. This is my native language, and I know that if I truly wanted to I could avoid run-on sentences etc. etc. The truth is, though, I mostly just like to write in a very flow-of-thought manner which would not always be appropriate in an academic setting. In this case, currently criticisms are closed in the Chintino English department. 

Laters!

- Chui


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