# Norwegian: Adverbs ending in -vis



## sjiraff

Hello everyone, I just thought I'd make a thread about something I wondered for a while now.

Why is it you you "vanligvis" and "antakeligvis" and "Sannsynligvis" (Usually, probably, probably) 

But I never see anything like "angiveligvis" (From angivelig, alegedly) - like in English we would say, "The alleged murder" but "He allegedly murdered someone".

Or even "dristig" - do you say "han gikk dristig..." meaning he went boldly, while also describing something as "bold" - det var dristig?

Is it just that a lot of adjectives ending in -ig are the same as their adverb counterpart? 

Thanks!


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## myšlenka

Hi,
adverbs derived from adjectives are sometimes formed with -_vis_, others are formed with _-t_ . In the latter case they are homophonous with neuter adjectives. I am sure that you have learnt at some point that adjectives ending in _-ig_ don't get a _t_-ending in the neuter. Well, the same rule applies to the adverbial counterparts


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## sjiraff

myšlenka said:


> Hi,
> adverbs derived from adjectives are sometimes formed with -_vis_, others are formed with _-t_ . In the latter case they are homophonous with neuter adjectives. I am sure that you have learnt at some point that adjectives ending in _-ig_ don't get a _t_-ending in the neuter. Well, the same rule applies to the adverbial counterparts



What exactly does it mean if they are 'homophonous' with neuter adjectives? I mean, you would think there would be "forskiktigvis" meaning to do something carefully, rather than just to do something "careful", if you know what I mean.


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## myšlenka

sjiraff said:


> What exactly does it mean if they are 'homophonous' with neuter adjectives? I mean, you would think there would be "forskiktigvis" meaning to do something carefully, rather than just to do something "careful", if you know what I mean.


They are homophonous when they sound exactly the same. The _t_-ending is used for both neuter forms of adjectives and for adverb formation.
_Et fint hus_ - adjective
_Hun synger fint_ - adverb

As for adjectives with _-ig_, they don't take a _t-ending_:
_Et dristig forsøk_ - adjective
_Han gikk dristig_ - adverb
_En forsiktig mann _- adjective
_Han gikk forsiktig_ - adverb (no one with interpret this as an adjective).

*_Forsiktigvis_ doesn't mean the same thing.


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## sjiraff

myšlenka said:


> _Et dristig forsøk_ - adjective
> _Han gikk dristig_ - adverb
> _En forsiktig mann _- adjective
> _Han gikk forsiktig_ - adverb (no one with interpret this as an adjective).
> 
> *_Forsiktigvis_ doesn't mean the same thing.


But you say, "det er vanlig" and "Han gikk vanligvis til butikken om morgen" - why don't you say "forsiktigvis" to be the adverb of forsiktig, meaning like to "do something carefully"? 
It's just that sometimes I see people saying sannsynlig, when I would have thought "Hmm couldn't that have been sannsynligvis?"

It seems kind of inconsistant for the adjectives/adverbs ending in -ig, since some add "-vis" but others don't seem to at all

Thanks!


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## myšlenka

sjiraff said:


> But you say, "det er vanlig" and "Han gikk vanligvis til butikken om morgen" - why don't you say "forsiktigvis" to be the adverb of forsiktig, meaning like to "do something carefully"?
> It's just that sometimes I see people saying sannsynlig, when I would have thought "Hmm couldn't that have been sannsynligvis?"


In general, you can say that adverbs derived from adjectives with adding -_t,_ are manner adverbs. They describe the manner of the action. If you add _-vis_, you get a sentential adverb and they say something about the proposition as a whole. _Vanligvis_ doesn't describe the manner in which he walked, but rather that it was a habitual action.


sjiraff said:


> It seems kind of inconsistant for the adjectives/adverbs ending in -ig, since some add "-vis" but others don't seem to at all


Inconsistant perhaps, but there are a bunch of English adverbs too that don't take the _ly_-ending (she drives fastly, he works hardly, she arrived lately).


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## sjiraff

myšlenka said:


> In general, you can say that adverbs derived from adjectives with adding -_t,_ are manner adverbs. They describe the manner of the action. If you add _-vis_, you get a sentential adverb and they say something about the proposition as a whole. _Vanligvis_ doesn't describe the manner in which he walked, but rather that it was a habitual action.


Ahh yeah, you're right I never even realised that. But can't it also be a normal adjective? "He painted it normally" (Rather than, he normally painted it)?




myšlenka said:


> Inconsistant perhaps, but there are a bunch of English adverbs too that don't take the _ly_-ending (she drives fastly, he works hardly, she arrived lately).


When should one say antakeligvis / sannsynligvis in that case? I'm certain I've seen people just say "antakelig" on its own

Thanks!


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## myšlenka

sjiraff said:


> Ahh yeah, you're right I never even realised that. But can't it also be a normal adjective? "He painted it normally" (Rather than, he normally painted it)?


I am not sure what you are asking here. I can imagine that a given adverb (with _-t)_ can be interpreted as a neuter adjetive if the syntactic-semantic requirements are met, but I cannot come up with an example of that.




sjiraff said:


> When should one say antakeligvis / sannsynligvis in that case? I'm certain I've seen people just say "antakelig" on its own
> 
> Thanks!


_Sannsynlig _is an adjective and is used when an adjective is required. _Sannsynligvis_ is an advberb and is used when an adverb is required.
As for _antakelig_, it is an adverb in itself and _-vis_ is probably added by some speakers due to analogy, but it's not necessary.


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## sjiraff

myšlenka said:


> I am not sure what you are asking here. I can imagine that a given adverb (with _-t)_ can be interpreted as a neuter adjetive if the syntactic-semantic requirements are met, but I cannot come up with an example of that.


Oh sorry I actually meant to type adverb and not adjective, so I mean when you say "_Vanligvis_ doesn't describe the manner in which he walked, but rather that it was a habitual action." - if we put it in to English as "normally" can't it also become a regular adverb rather than always habitual? "The wall is painted normally" as opposed to "The wall is normally painted" or "normally the wall is painted". It is kind of ambiguous with the first sentence but it can mean two things, either the way the wall is painted or, as you said if it's habitual. Or maybe if we took the example of "random" - "The wall is painted randomly", is it just me or does saying "The wall is painted random" sound wrong? (Meaning, it's painted at random intervals, or painted in a random manner. I would say 'the wall was painted randomly' if the wall was covered in random colours and splashes, meaning the painter was random in the way he did it, not necessarily that he did it at random times)

Now when I think about it I think i've got my wires crossed, when I put English out of the picture it becomes obvious 

"Veggen er malt tilfeldig" - the wall is painted random (in a random way) where as
"Veggen blir malt tilfeldigvis" - the wall gets painted randomly (at random times) - right?



myšlenka said:


> _Sannsynlig _is an adjective and is used when an adjective is required. _Sannsynligvis_ is an advberb and is used when an adverb is required.
> As for _antakelig_, it is an adverb in itself and _-vis_ is probably added by some speakers due to analogy, but it's not necessary.


Oh I see, I think this is the thing that caused my doubt in the first place, when I saw people saying "antakelig" instead of "antakeligvis", it made me wonder if almost every -ig adjective could have -vis added, to turn it in to like an adverb (as we do for many words in English)

So do you think a minority of such words take -vis at the end? Is "forsiktigvis" even a word?

Thanks!


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## myšlenka

sjiraff said:


> "Veggen er malt tilfeldig" - the wall is painted random (in a random way) where as
> "Veggen blir malt tilfeldigvis" - the wall gets painted randomly (at random times) - right?


"Veggen er malt tilfeldig" - in a non-systematic way.
"Veggen blir malt tilfeldigvis" - by accident.


sjiraff said:


> So do you think a minority of such words take -vis at the end? Is "forsiktigvis" even a word?


I don't have a list of these words so it's hard to say what is the majority/minority pattern,

I haven't found _forsiktigvis_ in any Norwegian dictionary, but that doesn't mean that it can't be a word. I would translate it with "tentatively" or something along similar lines. Most cases I found online are related to verbs like say, claim, assume etc.


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## sjiraff

myšlenka said:


> "Veggen er malt tilfeldig" - in a non-systematic way.
> "Veggen blir malt tilfeldigvis" - *by accident.*


The last one means by accident, like, "med it uhell"? I thought it would have meant "randomly" (at random intervals) as with vanlig/vanligvis





myšlenka said:


> I haven't found _forsiktigvis_ in any Norwegian dictionary, but that doesn't mean that it can't be a word. I would translate it with "tentatively" or something along similar lines. Most cases I found online are related to verbs like say, claim, assume etc.


Ah yes I understand, in that case it seems kind of similar to omhyggelig or something too.

Thanks


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## myšlenka

sjiraff said:


> The last one means by accident, like, "med it uhell"? I thought it would have meant "randomly" (at random intervals) as with vanlig/vanligvis


No, not that kind of accident  The wall just happens to be painted. _Tilfeldgvis_ does not entail any repetition.



sjiraff said:


> Ah yes I understand, in that case it seems kind of similar to omhyggelig or something too.


If _forsiktigvis_ is similar to _omhyggelig_? Not at all. Here is an example I found online:

"Går vi forsiktigvis ut fra en oljepris på 60 dollar fatet, så rommer disse [oil fields perhaps] olje for 20 000 milliarder kroner." I interpret _forsiktigvis_ here as "moderately, tentatively".


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## sjiraff

myšlenka said:


> No, not that kind of accident  The wall just happens to be painted. _Tilfeldgvis_ does not entail any repetition.


Oh right, I forget that tilfeldig is also like coincidentally rather than just "random", I was reading it in the wrong way I think. 


If _forsiktigvis_ is similar to _omhyggelig_? Not at all. Here is an example I found online:

"Går vi forsiktigvis ut fra en oljepris på 60 dollar fatet, så rommer disse [oil fields perhaps] olje for 20 000 milliarder kroner." I interpret _forsiktigvis_ here as "moderately, tentatively".[/QUOTE]

Hmm I just realised I confused tentive with attentive, I was thinking more of doing something with care, like more as in "gunstig" maybe


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## raumar

I wouldn't use "forsiktigvis". As myšlenka mentioned in post #8, native speakers are also sometimes in doubt about the use of "-vis". People sometimes add "-vis" to words where it doesn't belong. In the oil price example, it should be possible to replace "forsiktigvis" with "forsiktig". But if "forsiktigvis" is a word, "cautiuosly" may be a good translation.


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## sjiraff

raumar said:


> I wouldn't use "forsiktigvis". As myšlenka mentioned in post #8, native speakers are also sometimes in doubt about the use of "-vis". People sometimes add "-vis" to words where it doesn't belong. In the oil price example, it should be possible to replace "forsiktigvis" with "forsiktig". But if "forsiktigvis" is a word, "cautiuosly" may be a good translation.



Well that puts my mind at rest a bit, I was never sure if I should have been ending more adjectives with -vis. (apart from the ones such as enkeltvis, dagevis, ukevis etc which are easy to know)

Thnaks!


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## basslop

myšlenka said:


> I am not sure what you are asking here. I can imagine that a given adverb (with _-t)_ can be interpreted as a neuter adjetive if the syntactic-semantic requirements are met, but I cannot come up with an example of that.
> 
> 
> 
> _Sannsynlig _is an adjective and is used when an adjective is required. _Sannsynligvis_ is an advberb and is used when an adverb is required.
> As for _antakelig_, it is an adverb in itself and _-vis_ is probably added by some speakers due to analogy, but it's not necessary.



To the latter point I would like to add _forhåpentlig_. Many natives, myself included, tend to use _forhåpentligvis_ instead. I am working at getting rid of it. 
 A bit off  the thread but still:Words like _forhåpentlig_ and _antakelig_ sounds to be of German origin. Could it be that the _vis-_ending is current in German and that we sort of inherit this partly in Norwegian alrhough it is not quite current (in Norwegian)?


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## sjiraff

basslop said:


> To the latter point I would like to add _forhåpentlig_. Many natives, myself included, tend to use _forhåpentligvis_ instead. _I am working at getting rid of it_



I'm not sure why that made me laugh but it's good to see someone caring! I had no idea it was wrong though, I always interpretated it like "hopefully" where as I would have thought forhåpentlig is more, "hopefull" maybe?

I wish you all the success!


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