# Pronunciation: 這(这)



## JenniferOverington

It seems as though 這 can be pronounced two ways: 
1. ㄓㄜˋ(zhe(4)), or
2. ㄓㄟˋ (zhei(4)).

Is this like "read" (present, long e) and "read" (past, short e) in English, or is this a regional difference? 

謝謝啊!


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## coucoululu

It's only a regional difference.
some people in the north(e.g Beijing)pronounce 这 "zhei",which is "zhe" in a dictionary.
but we don't pay attention to that.Both are OK.
不客气


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## Dragonseed

I found people tend to pronounce "zhei4" when the next character is 一 (yi1), maybe as a contraction of zhe+yi:
這是甚麼? zhe shi shenme? (what is this)
這一個嗎? zhei yi ge ma? (this one?)
Is this a general rule?


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## coucoululu

No.it's not a general rule.We also say "zhei shi shen me".
and I don't think the 2 pronouncations make any difference to a native speaker.


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## JenniferOverington

Oh, hey, this is really cool. My book has "zhei4 zhong3 bi3" and "zhe4 shi4 liang3 kuai4". It seems as though zhei4 has an appealing sound with some word combinations. 

謝謝


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## shivasprogeny

I tend to hear "zhei" used more commonly when followed by a measure word, but the native speakers I have asked say there is no difference (as confirmed by those that have posted already).

"Zhe shi wode chezi"  vs. "Zhei liang chezi shi wode."


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## Dragonseed

The last two posts seems to go towards my "contraction" theory: zhei = zhe + yi...
When you say: 
those two cars = 這兩輛車子
this (one) car = 這(一)輛車子
Does it make sense to anyone else?


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## 2PieRad

> 這一個嗎? zhei yi ge ma? (this one?)


这个吗？would probably be used more in colloquial speech without the 一。 And I don't find any problem saying either zhe nor zhei, even when you're speaking about more than 1 item.

Personally, I think I tend to say zhe more often than zhei in any scenario.

It may be possible that zhei is a bit more informal and relaxed than zhe. You may hear children saying 这是啥？那是啥？as zhei and nai, instead of the dictionary zhe/na. But even so, I don't think there's much of a difference at all.


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## snowyau

The 这（一）个 theory sounds quite plausible - it's part of "eliding", which is present in all languages.


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## the_dumb

those two cars = "那"兩輛車子


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## the_dumb

Here in Taiwan,the character,這,is pronounced as ㄓㄜˋ.So there is not a "i" sound.


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## Dragonseed

Hello the_dumb!
There might be regional differences even within our small island, but...

Can you listen carefuly when you say "this car" in Mandarin: doesn't it sound a lot like "zhei tai che - ㄓㄟ  ㄊㄞ  ㄔㄜ"    (or even "zei tai tse" if like me you have a strong Taiwanese accent...)


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## kwang

Dragonseed said:


> The last two posts seems to go towards my "contraction" theory: zhei = zhe + yi...
> When you say:
> those two cars = 這兩輛車子
> this (one) car = 這(一)輛車子
> Does it make sense to anyone else?


I don't think 這(一) makes Zhei. We also say "zhei xie dong xi( 这些东西）and "zhei wei xian sheng (这位先生）。

It's just colloqual. I've read a book about public speaking before. It said ," very many Americans read " fe-byou-air-y" instead of " feb-roo-air-y", but they should read "feb-roo-air-y" on formal occasions."

I agree with Erebos12345. It's more informal and relaxed (easier).


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## snowyau

kwang said:


> I don't think 這(一) makes Zhei. We also say "zhei xie dong xi( 这些东西）and "zhei wei xian sheng (这位先生）。



In your examples, 这(一)些东西, 这(一)位先生 could be seen contractions as well.

I'm not an expert in grammar, but (一) in this context doesn't quite mean "one" (rather "the" or "a" - meaning "this specific thing/person"?) and perhaps over time (一) has become optional in writing and thinking, but the pronounciation has remained?

For example, you can't say "两些", so "些" explains this theory of mine a little bit better.

I think it's also strange to say (zhei) 这三位先生, you would normally say "zhe san wei". (or is this just me?)

But I might be wrong - can someone shed more light on this?


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## the_dumb

Dragonseed said:


> Hello the_dumb!
> There might be regional differences even within our small island, but...
> 
> Can you listen carefuly when you say "this car" in Mandarin: doesn't it sound a lot like "zhei tai che - ㄓㄟ ㄊㄞ ㄔㄜ" (or even "zei tai tse" if like me you have a strong Taiwanese accent...)


 
Sure.I think it's the personal choices.


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## Mugi

snowyau and others are completely right in their conjecture that the pronunciation "zhei4" is the result of the merging of "zhe4" and "yi1" (这+一). Likewise with "nei4" (那+一) and "nei3" (哪+一). It's Mandarin Phonology 101. There are numerous academic papers that mention this trend, some dating back decades.

One can pronounce the 这 in 这个人是我的朋友 as either "zhe4" or "zhei4", because as others have pointed out, there is an omitted "yi1" (一). 
In theory, the 这 in 这是我朋友 can only be pronounced "zhe4" because there is no omitted "yi1" (一) - it would be grammatically incorrect to have 一 between 这 and 是. In practice, native speakers generally adhere to these rules.

However, in recent years, there has been a tendency, particularly by younger speakers, to use "zhei" irrespective of the grammar of the utterance. So one will sometimes "Zhei4 shi4 wo3 peng2 you" for 这是我朋友, though to most native speakers it will sound worng (or at least odd), although many may not know why.


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## JenniferOverington

I appreciate all your responses - thank you!


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## James Bates

这 is supposed to be pronounced zhe4, yet I often hear it pronounced zhei4. Is the latter pronunciation specific to Beijing?


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## xiaolijie

I don't think it's specific to Beijing. It seems to be more frequenly used where there is some emphasis in the pronounciation, especially in the combination 这个 (Some people even say that "zhei" is actually the pronununciation of "这一(个)").


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## James Bates

Thank you!


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## Youngfun

xiaolijie said:


> I don't think it's specific to Beijing. It seems to be more frequenly used where there is some emphasis in the pronounciation, especially in the combination 这个 (Some people even say that "zhei" is actually the pronununciation of "这一(个)").


And Beijingers like to put emphasis a lot! 
In Beijing I think you rarely hear zhe4 except in very formal speech.

Ditionaries define zhei4 as the merging of "这一" but I think I've also heard zhei4 俩，zhei4 三个


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## James Bates

xiaolijie said:


> I don't think it's specific to Beijing. It seems to be more frequenly used where there is some emphasis in the pronounciation, especially in the combination 这个 (Some people even say that "zhei" is actually the pronununciation of "这一(个)").



Is there any construction in which it would be wrong to pronounce 这 as zhe4? For example, would it be wrong to pronounce 这个 as zhege instead of zheige?


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## brofeelgood

Can't think of any. And no.


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## Asadullah

You can _always_ pronounce 这 as zhe4. However, you cannot always pronounce it as zhei4.
Similarly, you can _always_ pronounce 那 and 哪 as na4 and na3 respectively, but you cannot always pronounce them as nei4 and nei3.
Therefore, the safest way is to stick to zhe4, na4, and na3, since you can never go wrong with them.


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## James Bates

Could a native speaker verify these rules?


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## ktdd

Yeah, I can think of at least one combination in which zhei4 does not seem to apply.
这么 is always zhe4me5 never zhei4me5. Actually it's more complicated. It's pronounced more like zhen4me5 (or even 这么着 zen4me5zhe5, 这么说 zen4me5shuo1, but it could be just me).
Similarly 那么 is never nei4me5. It's pronounced more like nen4me5 (you can say it's a weakened na4 influenced by /m/). And in rapid, casual speech, it's all slurred together, like 你这人怎么那么矫情 ni3zhe4ren2 zem3 nem4 jiao2qing5.

Just for your reference, there is a note in 《现代汉语词典》 under the 指示代词 sense: (I'm not endorsing it. It's just what the dictionary says.)


> ［注意］在口语里，‘这’单用或者直接跟名词时，说 zhè；‘这’后面跟量词或数词加量词时，常常说 zhèi。以下〖这程子〗、〖这个〗、〖这会儿〗、〖这些〗、〖这样〗各条在口语里都常常说 zhèi-。


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## fishy business

There is one place where you have to say zhèi: 这一次 (which means "this time"). It is wrong to say zhèyícì in this case. You must say zhèiyícì.


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## fyl

fishy business said:


> There is one place where you have to say zhèi: 这一次 (which means "this time"). It is wrong to say zhèyícì in this case. You must say zhèiyícì.


That is not true. You can definitely say zhe4 in 这一次.


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