# czaj



## Encolpius

Hello, I don't if you realize you are the only nation you use a unique word for tea. Now that many young people learn English I think they would understand "tea", but my question is how about the word "czaj"? You use czajnik (from Russian). Would a native Polish-speaking understand another Slav using the word "czaj"? WR members might be a special situation because I think most of you speak some foreign language. Would it be a 100 zł or 500 000 zł question in the famous game show? Thanks.


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## alexsylvester

"Czaj" is for me a quite fancy word. I would understand it, if someone used it in a chat, however I don't think it's very common in use. Maybe among older society somewhere on the east, prisoners or so called "hipsters", but it's only my guess. However, there is a difference between words "czaj" or "herbata"(tea), for me at least. "Czaj" is usually very strong home made tea prepeared in a teakettle. It's definitely not a tea made from tea bags of some popular brand. "Herbata" can refer for anything made from tea leafs, that is to say both made from tea bags and made in traditional way.

Actually the word "cha" in Japannese means "tea", so that's probably where it cames from to areas of current Russia, but I'm not sure, in Middle East they also called it "shai". Anyone who knows the roots?


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## Encolpius

Oh, that is very interesting. I have thought there is no such word as "czaj" in Polish.  I haven't found it in a big dictionary. Maybe it is slang, regional, old-fashioned then.


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## wolfbm1

There is a related word "czajnik", a tea kettle. I only use the word 'herbata' when I mean 'tea'.  I could use the word 'czaj' to mean a Russian-style tea.


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## jasio

Encolpius said:


> Oh, that is very interesting. I have thought there is no such word as "czaj" in Polish.  I haven't found it in a big dictionary. Maybe it is slang, regional, old-fashioned then.



Yeap. It's a criminal slang: http://pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/czaj. 



alexsylvester said:


> "Herbata" can refer for anything made from tea leafs, that is to say both made from tea bags and made in traditional way.


There is also a diminuitive form 'herbatka', typically referring to a tea party or herb teas, though sometimes refers to regular tea as well (children talk, Warsaw dialect).



alexsylvester said:


> Actually the word "cha" in Japannese means "tea", so tht's probably where it cames from to areas of current Russia, but I'm not sure, in Middle East they also called it "shai". Anyone who knows the roots?


Considering geography of the region, Japanese origin does not seem to be very probable. According to https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Чай it's a loanword from Chineese. English Wikipedia gives a more detailed information about origins of the names of tea from distinct Chinese dialects ('cha' from Mandarine and Cantonese and 'tê' from Amoy). 



Encolpius said:


> Hello, I don't if you realize you are the only nation you use a unique word for tea.


Not so unique, if you consider that it comes from Latin 'herba thea'.


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## marco_2

In Lithuanian they say *arbata *- maybe it's a result of our long neighbourhood.


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## Encolpius

Interesting, so you have two words for tea: herbata and czaj. I don't think other nations made that distinction...


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## jasio

Encolpius said:


> Interesting, so you have two words for tea: herbata and czaj. I don't think other nations made that distinction...



You may think of the distinction like 'coffee' and 'espresso'. 

The general and commonly understood word for tea is 'herbata'. 'Czaj' is a slang word for tea prepared in a certain way - very strong, almost narcotic. Think of a half of a glass of dry leaves per a glass of drink.   It's not that unique either: for example in Russian the drink is called чифирь (http://pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/чифирь#ru), while tea in general is чай. 

Some society groups may indeed use "czaj" for 'just' a tea drink - especially a very strong tea (sometimes also referred to as 'siekiera'), though definitely it's not "czaj" in it's original meaning in a criminal subculture. I think it's a result of a fascination in criminal societies now and in the past; there are also many other commonly used jargon words of a similar background. The fascination is not unique to Poland either, consider for example a fasion in Parisian apaches, dress style inspired by 'mafia', hip-hop, etc.

I also don't think that an average person could easily guess the word's meaning especially if taken out of context. As far, as I can remember, when I heard it for the first time in the spoken language, I had to ask about it (to make sure, at least), although I spoke Russian and definitely knew the Russian чай.

More fun is with potatos (ziemniaki, kartofle, pyry, brambory - all refer to the same thing), train (pociąg, sznyfcug, cug, cuch, bana), and many others.


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## jasio

marco_2 said:


> In Lithuanian they say *arbata *- maybe it's a result of our long neighbourhood.



Sure, it's a loanword. BTW, in Belorussian it's гарбата (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/76/Be-гарбата.ogg), although Belorussian wikipedia claims it's from Latin rather than Polish.


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## alexsylvester

jasio said:


> Some society groups may indeed use "czaj" for 'just' a tea drink - especially a very strong tea, though definitely it's not "czaj" in it's original meaning. I think it's a result of a fascination in criminal societies now and in the past;



Yes, it's strongly connected with criminals society. Watch this video at 2:36:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCyKAfIRlGA
He speaks "Roman, zaparz mi czaju"(Roman, make me "czaj"). In the movie "Symetria" there is a lot of "grypsera" - criminal slang. You might also meet this word in a menu in a tea house. I've just seen it once and it was refered to very strong brew, but personally I don't think it is very common.



> Considering geography of the region, Japanese origin does not seem to be very probable. According to https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Чай it's a loanword from Chineese. English Wikipedia gives a more detailed information about origins of the names of tea from distinct Chinese dialects ('cha' from Mandarine and Cantonese and 'tê' from Amoy).



Yes, after a while I realized that China was definately more likely direction. But it seems, that tea is known in Russia thanks to Mongols, however further Chineese influence is unquestionable. Below text describes it quite good. Probably more can be found about this topic in papers by american historician Jeremiah Curtin.
http://3obieg.pl/droga-chinskiej-herbaty-rosji-polski
http://historia.newsweek.pl/jejmosc-radzi-herbate,83442,1,1.html
According to above texts and wikipedia, formerly in Poland tea was known more under the name "zioło" (herb) and it wasn't very common. It was mostly green tea then and it was used more for medical purpose. Because in Latin "herba" means "zioło", so "herba thea" means "tea herb". From the one hand it was used for medical purposes, but from the other many percieved it even as a sort of a poison and it was very unpopular. More popular were meads, beer, wine  and coffee. Russians spreaded it in Poland in XIX century and the term "czaj" could be more often in usage then, but the word "herbata" was known before.


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## kakapadaka

Encolpius said:


> Interesting, so you have two words for tea: herbata and czaj. I don't think other nations made that distinction...



We most certainly don't. Some people may say _czaj _just like some people might say _Mieszkam w Ju-es-ej _or _Lubię się napić łiskacza. _It's a neologism (or perhaps a hapax, if you will) that may not be understood by other speakers unless they share a specific context. For instance, some user above mentioned that it's only for a strong type of tea, which surprised the hell out of me - i've never heard of this definition. Just use _herbata _and forget _czaj_, you're better off this way.

Also, I would rather not guess how the prison slang works is if my only notion of it comes from a movie... Just saying - if you ever go to jail in Poland ask for _czaj _and then tell me if it worked


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## Encolpius

kakapadaka said:


> It's a neologism (or perhaps a hapax, if you will) that *may not be understood by other speakers* unless they share a specific context.



Thanks for all the answers again.


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## Poland91pl

I am 26 and never heard the word czaj. My mum used to put a lot of tea leaves in some kind of a little jug-like thingy and poured a little of boiled water into it so it got really strong. We called it "esencja" :/ehsentsya/ Then we didn't have to brew the tea all day long - just a few drops of that essence and some warm water.


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## Yaro

Czaj - generally means 'tea' as in readily prepared brew, not dried leaves in any form. As this word was always at best colloquial, connotation would be so called beverage would be rather crude, eg. dried tea leaves just poured with boiling water, possibly served in small tin or metal pot. Word indeed doesn't seem to be in popular use in Poland anymore.

Originated from prison slang, where it meant (means?) very - VERY! - strong tea drunk to get high (czaj – Wikisłownik, wolny słownik wielojęzyczny quoting Bogusław Dunaj 'Elementy obce w najnowszej leksyce polskiej' possibly the most reliable, university source published in year 2000 and the title meaning 'latest loanwords in Polish vocabulary' which would suggest the expression had it's high days in years 80/90. LOaned from russian by the way.

In another source (Czaj - Miejski słownik slangu i mowy potocznej - polish version of English internet Urban Dictionary, meaning that anyone can post there whatever seems to them) one can find post from 2008 saying the same with addition of this cute little detail that the best is to use just lots of dried black tea leaves brewed in boiling water for as long as it gets and that the most popular kind of tea used for that in Polish prisons is the one called Madras. Author of the post must have known what he was talking about LOL

Have to confess that in my student years tried to follow this recipe in desperation, when as usually I left entire year of studying subject to be revised in just one night. Three bags of strong black variety tea brewed in a cup covered with a saucer for five minutes. Upset stomach - always, with quite a few cases of vomiting it out. But efficient enough to revise all night and go to exam next day without any sleep, not a trace of tiredness, but feeling rather ghastly and jittery.


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