# Urdu, Hindi: A stirrer



## Qureshpor

In both Urdu and Hindi, a situation that is made worse by someone who stirs it up and then stands watching the spectacle unfold as if nothing has happened is termed "jaltii par tel Daalnaa" and "tamaashaa dekhnaa" respectively. I am sure there would be many other equivalents for these situations, both in Urdu and Hindi.  But, what is the term for the "stirrer". In English slang he/she is called a "shit-stirrer". What are equivalent polite and slang terms for this person in Urdu and Hindi. I can't seem to think of even one for the moment.

Thank you for your help in advance.


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## tonyspeed

QURESHPOR said:


> In English slang he/she is called a "shit-stirrer".



I have never heard this phrase in my part of the world. I have heard the term "instigator".


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## Qureshpor

tonyspeed said:


> I have never heard this phrase in my part of the world. I have heard the term "instigator".


It's a British English term. You can see plenty of explanations on the net. There is even a Youtube video called "The biggest shit stirrer in the world". If you can't think of a suitable term for a "shit-stirrer", just a plain "stirrer" will do. The opposite would be a peace-maker I suppose.


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## Wolverine9

"Shit-stirrer" is used in the U.S. too.  Instigator, agitator, and inciter would be formal terms.  Trouble-maker is another common form.

There is _bhaRkaane vaalaa_.


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## tonyspeed

Wolverine9 said:


> "Shit-stirrer" is used in the U.S. too.  Instigator, agitator, and inciter would be formal terms.  Trouble-maker is another common form.
> 
> There is _bhaRkaane vaalaa_.




I guess we could also use the modern word in English: troll.


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## Qureshpor

Wolverine9 said:


> "Shit-stirrer" is used in the U.S. too.  Instigator, agitator, and inciter would be formal terms.  Trouble-maker is another common form. There is _bhaRkaane vaalaa_.


Thank you, wolverine for confirming that "shit-stirrers" exist in the US too!

"bhaRkaane vaalaa/vaalii" is a good equivalent. But somehow, in my view it does n't quite capture the evil intent that is inherent in a "shit-stirrer". It is definitely good for a "stirrer". After starting this thread, the word "fitnah" came to my mind. From this one gets "fitnah-parvar" which I think would most certainly be another one to add to the list. For a female there is a colloquial term "fitnii", which again I think is quite apt too.


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## tonyspeed

Platts has:

H اکتارو उकतारू _uktārū_ [S. उद्+कार+उक], s.m.  *Instigator*, inciter, aider, abettor; one who forwards or promotes, promoter.

_āg-lagāʼū_, adj. & s.m. Combustible, inflammable; an incendiary; a seditious person, firebrand, *instigator* of quarrels:


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## marrish

[Urdu] فتنہ انگیز _fitnah-aNgez_ on the formal side? I was also thinking along the lines of گوه کا کیڑا...


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## Qureshpor

tonyspeed said:


> Platts has:
> 
> H اکتارو उकतारू _uktārū_ [S. उद्+कार+उक], s.m.  *Instigator*, inciter, aider, abettor; one who forwards or promotes, promoter.
> 
> _āg-lagāʼū_, adj. & s.m. Combustible, inflammable; an incendiary; a seditious person, firebrand, *instigator* of quarrels:


I like the basic "aag-lagaa'uu", which one can use for both the genders. Thanks.


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## Qureshpor

tonyspeed said:


> I guess we could also use the modern word in English: troll.


Yes, thank you. I do remember someone using it in this forum in the past. But is n't this more to do with a person on the net whose sole aim is to seemingly create disruptions and arguments? I am not sure if that would qualify him or her to the dizzy heights or should I say abyssal depths achieved by a "shit-stirrer".


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## Qureshpor

marrish said:


> [Urdu] فتنہ انگیز _fitnah-angez_ on the formal side? I was also thinking along the lines of گوہ کا کیڑا  ...


For those who may not be aware "fitnah" means "sedition", "discord" and "mischief" amongst other things. So fitnah-aNgez is fitnah bhaRkaane vaalaa/vaalii and fitnah-parvar is fitnah-paalne vaalaa/vaalii. There is also fitnah-zaa (fitnah-paidaa karne vaalaa) and fitnah-pardaaz, which I am not sure how to translate. All of them, to use wolverine's example are equivalent to "trouble-maker" or better still a "mischief-maker".

I do like "guuh kaa kiiRaa", marrish SaaHib. Does it equate to a "shit-stirrer"? It's no good if this "kiiRaa" is stirring in the shit. It needs to stir the shit! What do yo think?


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## UrduMedium

Another Urdu choice given the description so far: fasaadii


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## Alfaaz

A few more possible words in Urdu: محرک ، نمام ، اشتعالی - _muHarrik, nammaam, ishti'aali

_Edit: two more: فتان ، فاسد  _- faasid , fattaan_


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## Wolverine9

Are any of the terms that have been listed actually used as a slang?


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## marrish

QURESHPOR said:


> For those who may not be aware "fitnah" means "sedition", "discord" and "mischief" amongst other things. So fitnah-aNgez is fitnah bhaRkaane vaalaa/vaalii and fitnah-parvar is fitnah-paalne vaalaa/vaalii. There is also fitnah-zaa (fitnah-paidaa karne vaalaa) and fitnah-pardaaz, which I am not sure how to translate. All of them, to use wolverine's example are equivalent to "trouble-maker" or better still a "mischief-maker".
> 
> I do like "guuh kaa kiiRaa", marrish SaaHib. Does it equate to a "shit-stirrer"? It's no good if this "kiiRaa" is stirring in the shit. It needs to stir the shit! What do yo think?


I've corrected the lack of nasalization in my post in aNgez, sorry for the typo.
QP SaaHib, Re. _guuh kaa kiiRaa_... as it is obvious, this phrase doesn't contain the explicit element of ''stirrer'' however it implies that it describes a person who functions at his or her best in this environment, thus doesn't miss any opportunity to make a decent place a paa-xaanah, through an action of spreading or stirring. _guuh kaa kiiRaa guuh meN hii xush rahtaa hai!_


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## Qureshpor

Alfaaz said:


> A few more possible words in Urdu: محرک ، نمام ، اشتعالی - _muHarrik, nammaam, ishti'aali
> 
> _Edit: two more: فتان ، فاسد  _- faasid , fattaan_



Yes, faasid, fasaadii certainly convey the sense. I believe in the Qur'an the word used is "mufsid" for a "mischief-maker" (in the plural, mufsiduun)  compared with "musliHuun" (peace makers). ishti3aalii looks good too but I am not familiar with nammaam and fattaan.


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## Qureshpor

Wolverine9 said:


> Are any of the terms that have been listed actually used as a slang?


To my mind, even guuh kaa kiiRaa is n't slang really but I think fitnii might be.


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## Faylasoof

Yes, most of the terms above would be regarded as part of formal speech.  But there is a word we use which, for us at least, is the same as a  ''stirrer'' in informal speech /slang: _*bhaRkauu*_ (from _bhaRkaanaa_) = _bhaRkaane waalaa_.


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## marrish

phuuT Daalne waalaa/-ii


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## Qureshpor

Faylasoof said:


> Yes, most of the terms above would be regarded as part of formal speech. But there is a word we use which, for us at least, is the same as a ''stirrer'' in informal speech /slang: _*bhaRkauu*_ (from _bhaRkaanaa_) = _bhaRkaane waalaa_.





marrish said:


> phuuT Daalne waalaa/-ii


Yes, bhaRkaa'uu like aag-lagaa'uu is short and gender free. phuuT Daalne vaalaa/vaalii is very expressive too. 

Looking at words linked to "fasaad", reminded me of "fasaad kii jaR". This seems to be in similar wavelength to "phuuT Daalne vaalaa/vaalii". And as no one has quoted a shi3r in this thread so far..

biThaa ke Ghair ko qaa'im nah kar fasaad kii jaR
nikaal is ko kih hai yih bashar *fasaad kii jaR*

Bahadur Shah Zafar (1775-1862)


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## greatbear

QURESHPOR said:


> In both Urdu and Hindi, a situation that is made worse by someone who stirs it up and then stands watching the spectacle unfold as if nothing has happened is termed "jaltii par tel Daalnaa" and "tamaashaa dekhnaa" respectively.



I have never heard of "jaltii par tel Daalnaa": it's grammatically wrong to me. It's always "jalte par tel Daalnaa" (not a very common expression in Hindi though; what is common is "jalte par namak chhiRaknaa", though that has a different sense).

Meanwhile, "bhaRkaanevaala" and "tamaashbiin" would be a couple of words for the two kinds, respectively. Of course, there are many other options. "aag lagaanevaalaa" works as popular usage; no real slang used in Hindi.


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## Qureshpor

"*jaltii aag meN tel Daalnaa*" shortened to "*jaltii meN tel Daalnaa*" or even "*jaltii par/pih tel Daalnaa*" is an Urdu idiom that is perfectly grammatical in its construction.

I consider myself a student of Urdu. There is always room for learning and I am willing to learn and that too with the full knowledge that it is not an easy task. When the poet "DaaGh/daaGh" said the following, how right he was.

nahiiN khel  ai daaGh yaaroN se kah do
kih aatii hai Urdu zabaaN aate aate


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## greatbear

That still sounds strange to me, and stranger with "aag Daalnaa"! "aag" can be "daal"-ed as well? Oh dear!

As for my previous post, I just realized that I wrote "jalte" whereas the usual proverb is "jale par namak".


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## Qureshpor

^ No, that is my mistake in typing.


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## marrish

QURESHPOR said:


> Yes, bhaRkaa'uu like aag-lagaa'uu is short and gender free. phuuT Daalne vaalaa/vaalii is very expressive too. _[the Urdu verses by the last Mughal Emperor left out]_


Another gender neutral, concise and perhaps even literal would be _guuh-aNgez_.


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## Qureshpor

marrish said:


> Another gender neutral, concise and perhaps even literal would be _guuh-aNgez_.


To give your word some respectability (even though a shit-stirrer does n't deserve any respectability), one can always use "shar-aNgez", don't you think?


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## marrish

QURESHPOR said:


> To give your word some respectability (even though a shit-stirrer does n't deserve any respectability), one can always use "shar-aNgez", don't you think?


_sharr-aNgez _is just perfect, QP SaaHib, very good for usage in all situations.


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## Qureshpor

marrish said:


> _sharr-aNgez _is just perfect, QP SaaHib, very good for usage in all situations.


I think, as a noun perhaps "shar pasand" might be a better option. (?)


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