# FR: have been studying



## Caesar

Ça va tout le monde?
Je viens de trouver ce forum-ci et je l'ai bien aimé. C'est magnifique, ça. Alors, voici ma première doute. Comment je pourrais vous dire la phrase suivante en français?
"I have been studying french"
Est-ce qu'il y a quelque temps verbal en français équivalent à cela d'anglais(have been.)?
J'ai déjà cherché la réponse partout mes livres.
à bientôt


----------



## river

Mea culpa. J'étudie le français depuis. . .


----------



## Gil

Ma suggestion (avec un peu plus de contexte):
"I have been studying french for two years"
"J'étudie le français depuis 2 ans."

Edit:  In French, we sometimes have to use the present tense when we would use some other tense in English. One such case is with the preposition depuis = "since" or "for.

Source : here


----------



## Jean-Michel Carrère

To the best of my knowledge, this English tense (the present perfect continuous) never corresponds to the French *imparfait*, river. In most cases, as Gil said, it corresponds to the present in French, more rarely to the passé composé.


----------



## Caesar

Thank you ppl,
Well, as you can well notice, I believe, my mother tongue is Portuguese, whose syntax is pretty much similar to the french one, and since I haven't been studying it for a long time, I still think a lot in my own language, when I should be thinking in French. But that usually works fine for me. 
So, in Portuguese we have a 'tense' that may correspond to the english present perfect continuous tense(thx Jean-Michel, I didn't remember it), one in which I can express an action I've been doing repeatedly in the past for some undetermined time. "Eu tenho estudado". I can easily express this idea in English by simply saying "I've been studying". But I can't, or at least haven't yet figured out how, say it in French. And I know it's not the same thing as merely "j'étudie français" or "j'ai étudié français", those sentences, solely, do not mean "I've been studying"(do they?) or "Eu tenho estudado"(they don't). So, what I need to know is precisely how to say that sentence without any further context. How do I say "I've been studying lately"? Simply "J'étudie dernièrement"?
Anyway, I've got to start thinking in French more.


----------



## LV4-26

When you say
_I've been studying French for two years_
you have to use the *present* in French and Gil's translation is the most appropriate :
_J'étudie le français depuis deux ans _because the English sentence means that you're still studying it.

Now to translate
_I've been studying lately_
you'll use the* passé composé* as you're not supposed to be studying any longer.
Hence  : _J'ai étudié récemment.

_The English present perfect has no fixed equivalent in French. It can be either the présent (when preceding "for" and "since", hence when indicating that the action is still going on) or the passé composé (most of the time).

The "continuous" part of the tense here is irrelevant in French. It doesn't change anything in *this* case.


----------



## EmmanuelOA

But isn't 'Eu tenho estudado' like 'I have studied'?

Because in Spanish it'd be 'yo he estudiado', and the literal French would be 'j'ai étudié'... and by literal I mean, taking into account the equivalent tenses:

Sujet + avoir + participe passé = sujeto + haber + pasado participio = subject + have + past participle

French and English only have 'have' and 'avoir' for what in Spanish we say 'haber' and 'tener' which have two different meanings but are translated the same into English and French.

I've noticed then that you said 'tenho estudado', the Spanish 'tengo', and inferred it means have, avoit and haber/tener.

Sorry if it was too much, I just didn't know how to summarise all that


----------



## Gil

> Sujet + avoir + participe passé = sujeto + haber + pasado participio = subject + have + past participle


Falso.  Ça ne marche pas comme ça.


----------



## EmmanuelOA

I know it doesn't, that's why I said 'literally'.


----------



## Gil

EmmanuelOA said:
			
		

> I know it doesn't, that's why I said 'literally'.


Compris


----------



## LV4-26

The use of the present perfect in English (I don't know for Spanish or Portuguese) is governed by a notion which I think is called "aspect" (which *basically* deals with the influence of a past action on the present time). Going into it would be a little complicated but let's just say that this notion doesn't govern the use of the French passé composé, or not to the same extent and in the same way.
This is why the present perfect and the passé composé aren't strict equivalents (despite their common construction).

Though I've been studying English for quite a long time now, the present perfect still keeps part of its mysteries to my French linguistic logic and I still hesitate sometimes between using the simple past and the present perfect in English (enven though I "think" in English).


----------



## bongbang

LV4-26 said:
			
		

> Though I've been studying English for quite a long time now, the present perfect still keeps part of its mysteries to my French linguistic logic and I still hesitate sometimes between using the simple past and the present perfect in English (even though I "think" in English).



In American English, you can probably get by very well ignoring the present perfect _simple_ and using only the past simple.  However, the present perfect _continuous_, which is the subject of Caesar's original question, is indeed used and necessary. Your sentence is one example but here's another, where the influence on the present is given even more emphasis.

You wake up in the morning, look out the window and see the lawn is wet although it isn't raining. You figure it probably rained some time last night but don't know (or care) exactly when or for how long, so you say to yourself, "Oh, it's been raining."

To use either the present perfect simple or the past simple in this instance would sound totally weird to me. 

Likewise, when a friend you haven't seen in ages shows up with a significantly more muscular body, you say: "Man, you've been working out!" (Although he might reply that he busted his knees two months ago and hasn't been to the gym since.)


----------



## LV4-26

Now this _is_ interesting indeed.

My problem is I've been taught that you should use the past simple each time you've got an indication of time (like _yesterday, two years ago, last month, _etc...._)
_ Example :_ 
I've lost my key _(hence, I can't open my house door)
_I lost my key *last week.

*_But nowadays, I'm no longer sure it works all the time. Let's take your example
_It's been raining.
_Now what if I add _last night_ ?

If I follow the rule I was taught I should say
_It rained last night

_But then I just have a feeling that the usual wording would have to be_
It's been raining last night
_just because it sounds more familiar to me.

Which is right ? The rule my teachers taught me or my gut feeling ?

EDIT : I also have a feeling that you would use the simple past here only if you wanted to stress that it happened last night an not the night before or at any other moment.


----------



## bongbang

I've been thought the same thing, LV4-26.  To indicate a specific point in time, you have to go with the past simple. So:

_It rained last night._

Indeed, if you look back at my example, you'll find that I said something very similar as I was setting up a condition for the present perfect continuous:



> You figure it probably rained some time last night



But of course, that was immediately followed by: 



> but don't know (or care) exactly when or for how long



That's very important, as the present perfect continuous describes the *present* (the effects left by the rain) and not the past (the rain itself). Naturally, that logic cannot be sustained once you add to the sentence a specific time in the past.

So for once, the teachers are right!

One thing to remember, though. The action in this case must be continuous or recurring, not instantaneous. So you can't say when you find your dog missing in the morning: "Someone's been stealing the dog". 

Present, Perfect, Continuous, it's all very logical, no?


----------



## LV4-26

bongbang said:
			
		

> "Someone's been stealing the dog".


Yes, I guess this would only work if someone stole your dog then brought it back five minutes later then stole it again and so forth for hours on end 
- What have you been doing all night ?
- I've been stealing bongbang's dog


----------



## SamuelSkripnokov

En fraçais ça se dit. etre en train de faire quelque chose. Its the best equivalent to. I am doing something. In the past use imparfait. in english we say. it is raining in the past it is, it was raining. that means progressively in the past. if you say it rained. that means the action is totally completed. Was raining implies a longer amount of time.


----------



## pepskrik

LV4-26 said:


> When you say
> _I've been studying French for two years_
> you have to use the *present* in French and Gil's translation is the most appropriate :
> _J'étudie le français depuis deux ans _because the English sentence means that you're still studying it.
> 
> Now to translate
> _I've been studying lately_
> you'll use the* passé composé* as you're not supposed to be studying any longer.
> Hence : _J'ai étudié récemment._
> 
> hello there, I've just bumped into this very interested and enlightening thread and I confess that regarding the present perfect conti/present perfect /past simple I also come up against a lot of hesitations and f.e when you translate _I've been studying lately _by _J'ai étudié récemment_, I am kind of confused because in this case I would have said _I have studied latey _for _J'ai étudié récemment _


----------

