# FR: as if God conceived of it and you became it



## soul2soul

Bonjour,

Its as if God thought of/concieved a beautiful person and YOU became it.

C'est comme si le Dieu concevait une personne sympathique et tu l'es devenue.

Is that ok?

Merci


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## Lacuzon

Bonjour,

 [...] et que tu le devenais.


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## soul2soul

Merci Lacuzon de votre réponse. Why would we use imparfait for devenir?


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## Lacuzon

Hi,

Just because you used imparfait for concevoir and because concevoir and devenir belong to the same condition.

You could also say:
C'est comme si le Dieu avait conçu une personne sympathique et que tu l'étais devenue.


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## LV4-26

soul2soul said:


> Merci Lacuzon de votre réponse. Why would we use imparfait for devenir?


To match the _imparfait_ in the first clause, I believe. 

Now, there's an hidden issue in your sentence.
Did you mean....
_and YOU became it._
...as a totally independent clause, in which case the sentence would work equally well with a full stop ==>
_It's as if God thought of/concieved a beautiful person. And YOU became it._

or is it related to the rest of the sentence in the following way
_It's as if God thought of/concieved a beautiful person and (*as if*) YOU became it._
?

Lacuzon's use of the word _que_ shows he believes the second option to be true and explains why he matched the tenses of the verbs.


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## LV4-26

Lacuzon said:


> Hi,
> 
> Just because you used imparfait for concevoir and because concevoir and devenir belong to the same condition.
> 
> You could also say:
> C'est comme si le Dieu avait conçu une personne sympathique et que tu l'*étais devenue*.


(emphasis added)
Personnellement, je préfère cette version, plus fidèle au sens d'origine.


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## soul2soul

Thanks again.
So do we use the same tense for both the verbs?

Actually a child wants to say to her mother - its as if God thought of a beautiful face and you got it. He conceived a beautiful personality and you became it. And He created an extraordinary mother, but this time i got it.

C’est comme si le Dieu créait une jolie tête et tu l’as eue..Il créait un esprit intelligent et tu l’as eu..Il concevait une belle personalité et tu l’as obtenue..Il créait une personne chaleureuse et tu l’es devenue..et pour finir il a créé une maman extraordinaire.. mais cette fois c’est moi qui l’ai reçue.

Merci d'avance



LV4-26 said:


> To match the _imparfait_ in the first clause, I believe.
> 
> Now, there's an hidden issue in your sentence.
> Did you mean....
> _and YOU became it._
> ...as a totally independent clause, in which case the sentence would work equally well with a full stop ==>
> _It's as if God thought of/concieved a beautiful person. And YOU became it._
> 
> or is it related to the rest of the sentence in the following way
> _It's as if God thought of/concieved a beautiful person and (*as if*) YOU became it._
> ?
> 
> Lacuzon's use of the word _que_ shows he believes the second option to be true and explains why he matched the tenses of the verbs.



Its related to the rest of the sentence. The sentiment is that God conceived the superlative- a beautiful face, personality etc, and mom, you were the one who got it all. And when He created the perfect mom, I got her.


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## LV4-26

soul2soul said:


> Thanks again.
> So do we use the same tense for both the verbs?
> 
> Actually a child wants to say to her mother - its as if God thought of a beautiful face and you got it. He conceived a beautiful personality and you became it. And He created an extraordinary mother, but this time i got it.
> 
> C’est comme si le Dieu créait une jolie tête et tu l’as eue..Il créait un esprit intelligent et tu l’as eu..Il concevait une belle personalité et tu l’as obtenue..Il créait une personne chaleureuse et tu l’es devenue..et pour finir il a créé une maman extraordinaire.. mais cette fois c’est moi qui l’ai reçue.


The full paragraph confirms that there is indeed an implicit "as if" before _you got it._

I would use the plus-que-parfait, (_avait conçu_/_avait eue._...) at least for the first sentence. For the rest, I'm afraid we're having a problem. Repeat the "_comme si_" each time and agree the verbs accordingly or try to be as flexible as the English original? 
This requires some consideration.


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## soul2soul

Au secours! I'm confused 

C’est comme si le Dieu avait con_ç_u une  jolie tête et tu l’avais eue..Il créait un esprit intelligent et tu l’avais..Il concevait une belle personalité et tu l’obtenais..Il créait une  personne chaleureuse et tu la devenais..et pour finir il a créé une  maman extraordinaire.. mais cette fois c’est moi qui l’ai reçue.

Mieux?! 

Merci


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## Oddmania

soul2soul said:


> Thanks again.
> So do we use the same tense for both the verbs?
> 
> Actually a child wants to say to her mother - its as if God thought of a beautiful face and you got it. He conceived a beautiful personality and you became it. And He created an extraordinary mother, but this time i got it.
> 
> C’est comme si le Dieu créait une jolie tête et tu l’as eue..Il créait un esprit intelligent et tu l’as eu..Il concevait une belle personalité et tu l’as obtenue..Il créait une personne chaleureuse et tu l’es devenue..et pour finir il a créé une maman extraordinaire.. mais cette fois c’est moi qui l’ai reçue.
> 
> Merci d'avance



Here, I'd say Plus-Que-Parfait + Passé Composé as LV4-26 said 

_C'est comme si Dieu avait crée un joli minois/visage et que tu l'as eu etc..._

Her mother got this beautiful face several decades ago (when she was born), but God created it before. 
It's a bit complicated, because it wouldn't be that illogical to say that her mother got her face and that God created it at the same time. But we can assume that God thought of this face before the mother got it.

If you say _C'est comme si Dieu créait un joli visage et que tu l'avais_, it's not real at all. It's like... " _Well, imagine, God creating a beautiful face for you, and then you get it._ "

But I'm a bit surprised to see no Pluperfect tense in the English sentence. How to distinguish those instances ?

PS : I feel like _avoir_ needs subjunctive here instead of indicative...
_
C'est comme si Dieu avait crée un joli minois/visage et que tu l'*as (/aies ?)*  eu etc..._

I guess I am wrong though.


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## LV4-26

My try so far
_C'est comme si Dieu avait imaginé un beau visage et que tu en avais hérité. Il a conçu une belle personnalité et c'est toi qui l'incarne. Au bout du compte, Il a créé une mère extraordinaire et, cette fois, c'est moi qui en profite. _

I changed a few verbs to make it sound more natural in French.
_Au bout du compte_ is to avoid repeating "_et"_, and it comes up logically, given the context.
I chose to keep the original construction, i.e. not to repeat the "comme si" each time. That explains why I shift from the _plus-que-parfait_ to the _passé composé_.

I also used the _c'est toi/moi qui_ gallicism to emphasize the _you_s and the _I_.


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## soul2soul

More confusion!

Although i agree with Oddmania.. if we used plus que parfait with passé composé, it sounds ok:C'est comme si Il avait conçu un visage et que tu l'as eu.

But not sure 

I guess that's the beauty of a language 



LV4-26 said:


> My try so far
> _C'est comme si Dieu avait imaginé un beau visage et que tu en avais hérité. Il a conçu une belle personnalité et c'est toi qui l'incarne. Au bout du compte, Il a créé une mère extraordinaire et, cette fois, c'est moi qui en profite. _
> 
> I changed a few verbs to make it sound more natural in French.
> _Au bout du compte_ is to avoid repeating "_et"_, and it's logical given the context.
> I chose to keep the original construction, i.e. not to repeat the "comme si" each time. That explains why I shift from the _plus-que-parfait_ to the _passé composé_.
> 
> I also used the _c'est toi/moi qui_ gallicism to emphasize the _you_s and the _I_.



Merci LV4 26! I loved your version. Could you please include this as well and let me know your final take on this : <<Il concevait un esprit intelligent  et tu l’as eu..Il créait une personne chaleureuse et tu l’es  devenue.>>

Merci mille fois!

My try:
 Il concevait un esprit intelligent et que tu l’adoptes. Il créait une personne chaleureuse et c’est toujours toi qui la deviens.



Oddmania said:


> Here, I'd say Plus-Que-Parfait + Passé Composé as LV4-26 said
> 
> _C'est comme si Dieu avait crée un joli minois/visage et que tu l'as eu etc..._
> 
> Her mother got this beautiful face several decades ago (when she was born), but God created it before.
> It's a bit complicated, because it wouldn't be that illogical to say that her mother got her face and that God created it at the same time. But we can assume that God thought of this face before the mother got it.
> 
> If you say _C'est comme si Dieu créait un joli visage et que tu l'avais_, it's not real at all. It's like... " _Well, imagine, God creating a beautiful face for you, and then you get it._ "
> 
> But I'm a bit surprised to see no Pluperfect tense in the English sentence. How to distinguish those instances ?
> 
> PS : I feel like _avoir_ needs subjunctive here instead of indicative...
> _
> C'est comme si Dieu avait crée un joli minois/visage et que tu l'*as (/aies ?)*  eu etc..._
> 
> I guess I am wrong though.



If we used the subjunctive, would that not denote a doubt? But the child is sure about it


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## LV4-26

soul2soul said:


> Merci LV4 26! I loved your version. Could you please include this as well and let me know your final take on this : <<Il concevait une belle personalité  et tu l’as obtenue..Il créait une personne chaleureuse et tu l’es  devenue.>>


The use of the _imparfait_ or _plus-que-parfait_ (but I would decidedly exclude the former in your opening sentence for time-sequence reasons) is required *only* when you add "_comme si" _in front of each sentence. 

Examples
C'est comme si je volais. (It's as if I were flying)
C'est comme s'il pleuvait des larmes (it's as if it were raining tears)
C'est comme si je perdais la raison (it's as if I were losing my mind)
C'est comme si j'avais perdu la raison (as if I lost/I'd lost my mind).

Otherwise (i.e. *without* the _comme s_i) those tenses are just inappropriate.
Therefore, I would use the passé composé instead ==>
_Il *a conçu* une belle personalité  et tu l’as obtenue..Il *a créé* une personne chaleureuse et tu l’es  devenue_.

Is that clearer?


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## soul2soul

Yes, i kind of get it.
But since the rest of the sentences are an extension of the 1st,( that is, there is _comme si_ before all the sentences, only we are not using it again and again), shouldnt there be a plus que parfait as well in all the sentences? Why do we then change the tense to passé composé after the 1st sentence?
I hope my question is clear..

Merci


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## LV4-26

soul2soul said:


> Yes, i kind of get it.
> But since the rest of the sentences are an extension of the 1st,( that is, there is _comme si_ before all the sentences, only we are not using it again and again), shouldnt there be a plus que parfait as well in all the sentences? Why do we then change the tense to passé composé after the 1st sentence?
> I hope my question is clear..


Yes, it's clear. And I hope I'll be equally clear in my answer. 

First of all, I'm not sure there's an implicit "_as if_" before all sentences in the English version -- which doesn't stop them from being "extensions" of the first, as you rightly said.
Similarly, I don't mean to imply one in the translation.

It so happens that, in English, you're using the same tenses, "as if" or no "as if". That's the way English grammar works. But that doesn't work in French. 

We can always imagine an understood "_comme si_" in front of all sentences. But, in any case, *its value will remain purely semantic*.
On a strictly *grammatical* point of view, using the _plus que parfait_ just sounds incorrect here without the _comme si_.

The only way you could keep the _plus-que-parfai_t all the way through would be by repeating the _comme si_ for all sentences but the last. But I don't think that would make a faithful rendition of the original, at least from a stylistic point of view.


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## soul2soul

Thank you so much LV4 26 for the detailed explanation. It is so much clearer now.
C'est _*comme si* _Vous étiez un ange et vous m'expliquiez cette différence!! 

Well just wanted to convey how much i appreciate the time you spent to explain it to me. 

Merci encore.


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