# Urdu, Hindi: download



## marrish

Perhaps it is a couterproductive question as in this case only a few are likely to have the courage to use another word than ''_Daa'unloD_'', but please, can we have a conversation for the sake of a mental exercise how to substitute the well rooted and accepted loan-word ''Daa'unloD''' in Hindi and in Urdu? As it is a verb, to download or ''Daau'nloD karnaa'', can we think of some verbs?


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## Qureshpor

Download = nikaal-laad

Upload = Daal-laad


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## marrish

Your reaction to this thread is really lovely: prompt, extensive (you gave more than I've asked for ) and you have given us all the chance to have a glimpse of your creative approach to language matters.

Now to the point. I had the idea of _khaiNchnaa_ or something to this extent in my mind.


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## Alfaaz

These seem to be terms used in Urdu: 
Download: زیراثـقال
Upload: زبراثـقال


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## Qureshpor

Alfaaz said:


> These seem to be terms used in Urdu:
> Download: زیراثـقال
> Upload: زبراثـقال


I think mine are more easily understood!

What these words convey to my mind is "under the loads" and "over the loads", if I read them with an izaafat.


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## marrish

Me too! And they appear to be direct calques.


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## Alfaaz

QURESHPOR said:
			
		

> I think mine are more easily understood!
> 
> What these words convey to my mind is "under the loads" and "over the loads", if I read them with an izaafat.


Yes, it's probably true that your translations have greater comprehensibility! However, it seems (just as in the carcinogenic etc. thread) we are dealing with specialized terms, for which a higher register is usually preferred. 

Just in case anyone's interested, here's an Urdu Wikipedia page with many translations of technical/computer terms.


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## Qureshpor

^ You are of course right. But, if a simpler term can do the job, I think it ought to be adopted. I am not talking about about my effort, by the way.


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## marrish

I am very indebted for the replies from both the participants, to begin with. I think ''downoad'' is not a specialized term any more and it has become the part and parcel of everyday life, at least for some. I would like to have a easy-going term for day-to-day usage. A heavy term for ''_aap ne un jaanvaroN kii tasviireN ''download'' kar lii haiN?_'' seems out of place.


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## marrish

Alfaaz said:


> Yes, it's probably true that your translations have greater comprehensibility! However, it seems (just as in the carcinogenic etc. thread) we are dealing with specialized terms, for which a higher register is usually preferred.
> 
> *Just in case anyone's interested, here's an Urdu Wikipedia page with many translations of technical/computer terms. *


Very interesting, and thanks for sharing. I think we can have a discussion on each and every one of them, but to stick to the topic, I simply don't agree with the train of thought presented there which appears to be calquing (is there such a word in English?)

There are some typos as well.


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## Chhaatr

If it is a matter of simplicity, then how about 

download = "le lenaa"
upload = "daal denaa"

kyaa aapne jaanvaroN kii tasviireN Internet se le lii haiN?
kyaa aapne jaanvaroN kii tasviireN Internet pe daal dii haiN?


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## marrish

Chhaatr said:


> If it is a matter of simplicity, then how about
> 
> download = "le lenaa"
> upload = "daal denaa"
> 
> kyaa aapne janvaroN kii tasviireN Internet se le lii haiN?
> kyaa aapne janvaroN kii tasviireN Internet pe daal dii haiN?


Wow, this is what I was after, after all. Simplicity. Thank you. Could you imagine yourself saying ''_khaiNch liiN_''?

Another one for ''upload'', _lagaa denaa_.


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## Chhaatr

marrish said:


> Could you imagine yourself saying ''_khaiNch liiN_''?
> 
> Another one for ''upload'', _lagaa denaa_.



Sure why not?  KhaiNch sounds more interesting.  With this I would like to use "pheNk dii haiN" for upload.

kyaa aapne jaanvaroN kii tasviireN Internet pe pheNk dii haiN?

I think with "pheNk" you'll have to be more informal like:

yaar internet pe jaanvaroN kii tasviireN pheNk dii kyaa?


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## tonyspeed

While all of these suggestions are wonderful, I wonder if they capture the nuance of the English word which
is comprised of a direction and the actual verb: load. The meaning being, we are receiving bytes one at a time
and piling them up somewhere as if we were piling boxes on a truck.

Therefore I suggest:
utaar kar laadnaa
chaRhaa kar laadnaa

I know the second one seems a bit redundant, but I hope you see the intent.


Edit: I see QP-saahib had this intent above in the 2nd post !!


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## insouciantguru

e-saamaan Kheenchiye
e-saamaan Chadaaiye


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## Qureshpor

insouciantguru said:


> e-samaan Kheenchiye
> e-samaan Chadaaiye


What is "samaan", insouciantguru? The only "samaan" I am familiar with is "pitaa-samaan" etc.


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## insouciantguru

QP Sahab, Sorry, the correct spelling would be saamaan. It means "luggage" or "storage" or "baggage" or "stuff", it's a flexible word that can take on different nuances depending on the context..


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## Chhaatr

tonyspeed said:


> While all of these suggestions are wonderful, I wonder if they capture the nuance of the English word which
> is comprised of a direction and the actual verb: load. The meaning being, we are receiving bytes one at a time
> and piling them up somewhere as if we were piling boxes on a truck.
> 
> Therefore I suggest:
> utaar kar laadnaa
> chaRhaa kar laadnaa
> 
> I know the second one seems a bit redundant, but I hope you see the intent.
> 
> 
> Edit: I see QP-saahib had this intent above in the 2nd post !!



TS jii, with direction in mind we could even say:

download = niiche laad
upload = uupar laad


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## marrish

I'm very pleased with the responses so far. 

In post #4 some ''high register'' expressions have been mentioned (from a Wikipedia page). Perhaps it would be possible to have High Hindi words, if available?


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## tonyspeed

Chhaatr said:


> TS jii, with direction in mind we could even say:
> 
> download = niiche laad
> upload = uupar laad



Thankyou. This is simpler.


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## BP.

Continuing with the air of this discussion, 'download' could simply be _utaarnaa_. When you download stuff from a vehicle, you say just that.

Another simple term could be _giriftaar karnaa_.


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## Chhaatr

^ Is this "giriftaar" same as giraftaar karnaa (to arrest)?


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## Wolverine9

Yes, the same.  In Hindi it's usually _giraftaar _but in Urdu it's _giriftaar_.

P گرفتار _giriftār_, vulg. _giraftār_ [_girift_, q.v.+_tār_ = Pehl. _tar_ = Zend _tar_; S. तार्], adj. & s.m. Taken, seized, arrested,  captured; involved (in), entangled; liable; stricken, smitten (with love, &c.), captivated;—one who is taken, &c.; a captive, a prisoner:—_giriftār-shuda_, part. adj. Taken, &c. (=_giriftār_):—_giriftār karnā_, v.t. To take, seize, arrest, apprehend, capture, to make a prisoner or captive of; to involve (a person, in, -_meṅ_); to captivate:—_giriftār honā_ (-_meṅ_), To be taken, &c.; to become a prisoner or captive; to be involved (in), to be smitten (with), to be enamoured (of).

गिरफ़्तार girafta:r (_a_) arrested, captured, apprehended.


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## nineth

If new words need to be coined, I would propose something like:

download = nichlaad =  निचलाद 
upload     = uchlaad =  उचलाद


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## Qureshpor

Good suggestions. I also had in mind "up-laad" (up being shortened form of uupar) but I believe "up" has another meaning in Hindi compound word formation, does n't it?


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## nineth

QURESHPOR said:


> Good suggestions. I also had in mind "up-laad" (up being shortened form of uupar) but I believe "up" has another meaning in Hindi compound word formation, does n't it?



Indeed, 'up' is commonly used where one would use 'sub/vice/deputy' in English. upaadhyaksh (vice president), upa pradhaanacharya (vice principal)


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## Faylasoof

Alfaaz said:


> These seem to be terms used in Urdu:
> Download: زیراثـقال
> Upload: زبراثـقال


 You are right Alfaaz SaaHib! These are the standard technical terms in Urdu for download and upload so there is hardly a need to invent more unless one wishes to for fun. Of course most people use the English terms anyway.


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## Faylasoof

BelligerentPacifist said:


> Continuing with the air of this discussion, 'download' could simply be _utaarnaa_. When you download stuff from a vehicle, you say just that.
> 
> Another simple term could be _giriftaar karnaa_.


 Yes, _utaarnaa_ (download) and _chaRhaanaa _(upload) may also be used. 
But this is not appropriate. We always use _giriftaar karnaa_ with the meaning of _capture, __seize, __apprehend, arrest_, as mentioned above in post # 23.


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## marrish

> *Alfaaz :* These seem to be terms used in Urdu:
> Download: زیراثـقال
> Upload: زبراثـقال​





Faylasoof said:


> You are right Alfaaz SaaHib! These are the standard technical terms in Urdu for download and upload so there is hardly a need to invent more unless one wishes to for fun. Of course most people use the English terms anyway.



Faylasoof SaaHib, you have stated that these terms are standard technical expressions in Urdu. Have you happened to come across them anywhere in a text or in a dictionary? I would be grateful for the feedback.


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## marrish

marrish said:


> I'm very pleased with the responses so far.
> 
> In post #4 some ''high register'' expressions have been mentioned (from a Wikipedia page). Perhaps it would be possible to have High Hindi words, if available?


Possibly this query has got lost amongst other posts, so please, are there any Modern Standard Hindi equivalents of ''download'' and ''upload''?


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## nineth

marrish said:


> Possibly this query has got lost amongst other posts, so please, are there any Modern Standard Hindi equivalents of ''download'' and ''upload''?



For formal Hindi, I see no better way than by rephrasing download as "obtain from .... site", and similarly, "make available at .... site" for upload.

download -> rephrase as '... se praapt karna' (praapt being high hindi for obtain)
upload     -> rephrase as '... par upalabdh karaana'  (upalabdh karaana being high hindi for provide)

Though these don't capture all possible usages of download/upload, one will have to rephrase similarly within context.


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## marrish

nineth said:


> For formal Hindi, I see no better way than by rephrasing download as "obtain from .... site", and similarly, "make available at .... site" for upload.
> 
> download -> rephrase as '... se praapt karna' (praapt being high hindi for obtain)
> upload     -> rephrase as '... par upalabdh karaana'  (upalabdh karaana being high hindi for provide)
> 
> Though these don't capture all possible usages of download/upload, one will have to rephrase similarly within context.


I'm very grateful for the fact that you have responded, and for Purusha Sukta as well!

I don't remember it right now but I saw somewhere words according to the Sanskrit grammar that contained the idea of ''bharnaa''.


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## Faylasoof

marrish said:


> Faylasoof SaaHib, you have stated that these terms are standard technical expressions in Urdu. Have you happened to come across them anywhere in a text or in a dictionary? I would be grateful for the feedback.


 marrish SaaHib, the problem with our lexicons is that they can't keep pace with technology! They have a long way to go yet. So no I don't have a dictionary reference as yet but Urduphones working in computer science tell me that these are the terms they use when they are not using the English borrowings.  Apparently there is quite a large glossary of Urdu terms in computer science, physics, biology, chemistry, astronomy etc. but I only have a few so far.
As regards this specific request of yours I was told by my colleagues to go here.


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## marrish

I'm immensely indebted that you have responded promptly to my question. I am aware of the Wikipedia page and the discussion about the terms used therein and I can follow some points but I can't follow others, like ''what is the need to use Sanskrit (for _laadnaa_! sic!) when we have Arabic words''.

I have said in my answer to Alfaaz SaaHib's post that these suggestions are simple calques, down and up is translated with Persian origin words and for ''load'' an Arabic word which is used in Urdu has been employed. 


My understanding of the language is that it is not right. Why English should be the pattern on basis of which one literally translates parts of words?

The other issue is that I don't consider ''download'' to be a part of specialized technical vocabulary,  let me be as bold as to say that it is a daily word. 

For these reasons I can't accept _zer-isqaal_. Why _zer_? What is the need to say that it is ''downwards''. You simply make some files be transfered onto your computer. For me it is the idea of _utaarnaa, khaiNchnaa, jazb karvaanaa_. Why give this word a higher technical status? Persian seems to use different terms after all.


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