# השתגעת



## Ali Smith

Shalom,

In מה, השתגעת?‎‎ (What, have you gone mad?), should we pronounce the verb as hishtagata, hishtaga'eta, or hishtaga'ata? I know we would pronounce "Did you pray?" as "hipalalta?".

Thanks!


----------



## elroy

hishtaga’ta

(The apostrophe represents the ע.)


----------



## Abaye

If you can read niqqud, you can always use conjugation tables like לוחות נטיית הפועל - האקדמיה ללשון העברית.


----------



## Drink

He has a valid question though. If you look up the nikkud for לבעבע, it will tell you לְבַעְבֵּעַ, yet most Israelis would say "leva'abea", adding an extra "a" that is not found in the nikkud. In the word השתגעת, however, this does not happen and it is simply pronounced hishtaga'ta.

I don't know what the pattern is, but I just had the thought that maybe it has to do with stress. That maybe the extra "a" is not added when it is the stressed syllable?


----------



## elroy

Abaye said:


> If you can read niqqud, you can always use conjugation tables like לוחות נטיית הפועל - האקדמיה ללשון העברית.


 I like this one because it has  transliterations in Latin script: Hebrew conjugation tables


Drink said:


> If you look up the nikkud for לבעבע, it will tell you לְבַעְבֵּעַ, yet most Israelis would say "leva'abea", adding an extra "a" that is not found in the nikkud.


 Interestingly enough, Pealim gives the pronunciation with the extra “a,” so maybe it’s even standard?
Hebrew conjugation tables


----------



## Drink

elroy said:


> Interestingly enough, Pealim gives the pronunciation with the extra “a,” so maybe it’s even standard?
> Hebrew conjugation tables



What's more interesting is that their nikkud is still as expected without the extra "a".

I would say that this is basically the unwritten universal standard that it is pronounced that way, even in careful and formal speech. I wonder if the Academy has any articles on the topic.

Perhaps the only exception I can think of is careful religious recitation.


----------



## Abaye

Interestingly the feminine form is originally hishtaga`*a*t and yet in practice it's hishtaga`t.


----------



## Drink

Abaye said:


> Interestingly the feminine form is originally hishtaga`*a*t and yet in practice it's hishtaga`t.



Actually, הִשְׁתַּגַּעַתְּ is just an alternate Biblical form. הִשְׁתַּגַּעְתְּ is the normal and recommend one.


----------



## Abaye

Drink said:


> Actually, הִשְׁתַּגַּעַתְּ is just an alternate Biblical form. הִשְׁתַּגַּעְתְּ is the normal and recommend one.


I'm not sure what you mean by "alternative biblical form" and by "normal and recommended one".
Words like שמעת, ידעת (feminine) appear in the bible with patach under the ע and therefore התשגעַת.


----------



## Tamar

We do not pronounce the ע letter anymore. 
Some Yemini Jews still do, but most of us cannot pronounce it at all, so you can pronounce [hishtagata] or [hishtagat]. 
If you can pronounce it, you can use it (but most people will find it strange). 

Also, about התפללת - it's pronounced [hi*t*palalta] or [hi*t*palalt]


----------



## Drink

Abaye said:


> I'm not sure what you mean by "alternative biblical form" and by "normal and recommended one".
> Words like שמעת, ידעת (feminine) appear in the bible with patach under the ע and therefore התשגעַת.



I had thought that both forms are found in the Bible, but I am having trouble finding examples like הִשְׁתַּגַּעְתְּ. So I guess forms like הִשְׁתַּגַּעַתְּ are much more common if not universal in the Bible. However, all Modern Hebrew sources I've seen list only הִשְׁתַּגַּעְתְּ.


----------

