# I was doing that



## espana1

How do you say in German "I was doing X when Y"?

For example,

I was watching TV when she arrived.

Would it be:  Ich habe den Fernseher angesehen, als sie angekommen ist.?

Thanks


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## mannibreuckmann

watch TV => *fernsehe*n

Ich *sah* (gerade) *fern*, als sie ankam.


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## espana1

Thank you!


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## Hutschi

espana1 said:


> How do you say in German "I was doing X when Y"?


 
It depends on the context.
In some contexts it is "als", in other contexts it is "wenn".


Er sah fern, als sie kam. (This is for one time. _*At the moment,* when she came, he did it.)_

Er sah fern, wenn sie kam. (This is if you mean, _*every times* when she came, he did it.)_

This is for the past tenses. "Als" is only used in past tenses, including also "vollendete Gegenwart". Er hat ferngesehen, als sie gekommen ist.

In present tense and in future tense, you have to use "wenn".


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## Frank78

Hutschi said:


> Er sah fern, als sie kam. (This is for one time. _*At the moment,* when she came, he did it.)_
> 
> Er sah fern, wenn sie kam. (This is if you mean, _*every times* when she came, he did it.)_



It just can be the first case because the English sentence is past progressive and simple past. One action interrupts the other which was already going on.


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## elroy

Frank is right.  For once, the meaning is clear without further context.


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## Hutschi

You are right. I did not understand this properly.

But if it is not a translation of the progressive ("one-time"), you should consider the other form.

1. Sie las gerade, als er kam. She was reading when he arrived.
2. Sie las gewöhnlich, wenn er kam. She usually read when he arrived. ??? Is this really not "was reading"? - It is a repeated interruption.

3. Sie las gewöhnlich/immer gerade, wenn er kam. - What is this in English?


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## Frank78

If it´s a repeated action I´d go for simple present in both parts of the sentence:

Mary usually cooks dinner when her husband comes home from work.


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## Hutschi

Thank you for this explanation. So my construction was a false friend.

So the fact is here in both languages but in German it uses another construction.


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## Derselbe

Frank78 said:


> If it´s a repeated action I´d go for simple present in both parts of the sentence:
> 
> Mary usually cooks dinner when her husband comes home from work.


 
That would also be my choice if you use present tense. But in that case I'd use present tense in German as well:
Mary kocht für gewöhnlich Abendessen, when ihr Mann nach Hause kommt. (Und wird das auch morgen tun)

"Mary usually is cooking dinner when her hunsband comes home from work" seems to be wrong.

But our German sentence was "Sie las für gewöhnlich, wenn er kam." and not "Sie ließt für gewöhnlich, wenn er kommt."
So what about action which used to be interrupted in the past, but is not interrupted anymore. 
"Mary usually was cooking dinner when her husband came home from work." (But that's not the case anymore because she died or something  )
seems fine to me...

I don't know. Who can help us?


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## berndf

Derselbe said:


> "Mary usually is cooking dinner when her hunsband comes home from work" seems to be wrong.
> "Mary usually was cooking dinner when her husband came home from work." (But that's not the case anymore because she died or something  )


Doesn't sound right either. If I wanted to express that it is a discontinued habit, I would say:
_Mary used to be cooking dinner when her husband came home from work._
_Sie kochte für gewöhnlich Abendessen, wenn/als ihr Mann von der Arbeit heim kam._
In German I would use _wenn,_ if she started as soon as he had arrived and _als,_ if she was already cooking when he arrived.


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## Frank78

_"Mary used to be cooking dinner when her husband came home from work."

_Wrong again I think. "Used to be + [verb]ing" indicates that you GET used to something.

So my suggestion:
_"Mary used to cook dinner when her husband came home from work."_


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## elroy

Hutschi said:


> 1. Sie las gerade, als er kam. She was reading when he arrived.
> 2. Sie las gewöhnlich, wenn er kam. She usually read when he arrived. ??? Is this really not "was reading"? - It is a repeated interruption.
> She would usually be reading when he arrived.
> 
> 3. Sie las gewöhnlich/immer gerade, wenn er kam. - What is this in English?
> She would usually/always be reading when he arrived.





Frank78 said:


> Mary usually cooks dinner when her husband comes home from work.


 This sentence means that Mary usually cooks dinner *after* her husband comes home from work.

If you mean that he arrives while she's cooking, then you could say

_Mary* is usually cooking* dinner when her husband comes home from work._

Although I think I'd prefer to reverse the order and use "while":

_Mary's husband usually comes home while she's cooking dinner._


Derselbe said:


> "Mary usually is cooking dinner when her hunsband comes home from work" seems to be wrong.


 This would be okay if you put "usually" between "is" and "cooking."  See above.


> "Mary usually was cooking dinner when her husband came home from work."





berndf said:


> Doesn't sound right either. If I wanted to express that it is a discontinued habit, I would say:
> _Mary used to be cooking dinner when her husband came home from work._
> _Sie kochte für gewöhnlich Abendessen, wenn/als ihr Mann von der Arbeit heim kam._


 Neither one sounds good to me.  I would say 

_In the past,_ Mary _would usually be cooking_ dinner when her husband came home from work. 





> So my suggestion:
> _"Mary used to cook dinner when her husband came home from work."_


 Again, this means that she used to start cooking dinner *after *her husband came home from work.


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## berndf

elroy said:


> Neither one sounds good to me. I would say
> 
> _In the past,_ Mary _would usually be cooking_ dinner when her husband came home from work.


Maybe you are right. _Mary used to be cooking_ might collide with expressions like _Mary used to be pretty_. I am not sure.
-->I would be interested in second opinion here.



elroy said:


> Again, this means that she used to start cooking dinner *after *her husband came home from work.


Exactly.

This is how it looks to me (who doesn't like to blue takes the green):

_Mary used to cook dinner when her husband came home from work._
_=_
_Maria kochte für gewöhnlich Abendessen, wenn ihr Mann von der Arbeit heim kam._

_Mary used to/would usually be cooking_ _dinner when her husband came home from work._
_=_
_Maria kochte für gewöhnlich Abendessen, als ihr Mann von der Arbeit heim kam._


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## elroy

berndf said:


> Maybe you are right. _Mary used to be cooking_ might collide with expressions like _Mary used to be pretty_. I am not sure.
> -->I would be interested in second opinion here.


 I don't know what the grammatical explanations are, but _Mary used to be cooking_ sounds dreadful to me, and I'd be surprised if other native speakers did not feel the same way. 





Frank78 said:


> "Used to be + [verb]ing" indicates that you GET used to something.


 I just noticed this.  Can you give an example of what you mean?  I don't think you're right.  In fact, I don't think there's _any_ situation in which I would use that form.


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## berndf

elroy said:


> I don't know what the grammatical explanations are, but _Mary used to be cooking_ sounds dreadful to me, and I'd be surprised if other native speakers did not feel the same way.


 
_He *used to be sleeping when* my poor mother and my brother Florence waited up for me, till the hour of my arrival. _
Source


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## elroy

berndf said:


> _He *used to be sleeping when* my poor mother and my brother Florence waited up for me, till the hour of my arrival. _
> Source


 First of all, this is a translation from Spanish.  Hardly a reliable or authoritative way to judge the acceptability of an English construction.  Translators, even if they're native speakers of the target language, use funny constructions all the time.

Furthermore, "sleeping" here functions adjectivally, and it describes a state, not an action.  You could just as well say "He used to be asleep."

Also, this "when" is not the same "when" that we've been discussing here.  Here "when" is used to mean "while."

Finally, this is literature - and translated from another language, at that - and literature is not necessarily a reflection of modern, colloquial usage.


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## Hutschi

elroy said:


> ...
> Also, this "when" is not the same "when" that we've been discussing here. Here "when" is used to mean "while." ...


 
For "when" in the meaning "while" we have two forms in German.
1. Als (all kinds of past tenses, for one time) 1. Als er kam, kochte Sie (gerade) Kaffee. (Sie begann, bevor er da war, war aber noch nicht fertig, als er kam.) I suppose this case is meant in the original posting. 2. Als er kam, kochte sie ihm Kaffee. (Sie begann, als er da war.) 
2. Wenn (all kind of past tenses, when the action is repeated, present and future tense.) Wenn er kam, kochte sie gewöhnlich gerade Kaffee. Wenn er kam, kochte sie Kaffee. Wenn er kam, begann sie, Kaffee zu kochen. Wenn er kommt, kocht sie Kaffee. Wenn er kommen wird, wird sie Kaffee kochen.

For the meaning "when" -> "if", we have also two forms: 1. "wenn", 2. "falls". But these ar not on topic here but for contrast.


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## ABBA Stanza

Wow, what a discussion! Here's my two cents' worth:



Derselbe said:


> "Mary was usually cooking dinner when her husband came home from work."





berndf said:


> _Mary used to be cooking dinner when her husband came home from work. _





elroy said:


> Mary _would usually be cooking_ dinner when her husband came home from work.


All of these sentences seem fine to me. Of course, Elroy's suggestion reads very well, but I wouldn't want to stick my neck out and denounce either of the other two as being erroneous, given the right context.



espana1 said:


> How do you say in German "I was doing X when Y"?





mannibreuckmann said:


> Ich *sah* (gerade) *fern*, als sie ankam.


What surprises me here is that nobody has pointed out the other possible ways of expressing this idea in German. Here are some examples taken from the Internet:

_"Ich war *am arbeiten*, als ich über das Wahlresultat informiert wurde."_

_"Ich war *beim Kochen*, als du angerufen hast."_
(Note: this form is popular in Southern Germany, because it avoids the use of the simple past tense completely. )

_"Wir waren gerade *beim Essen, da* klingelte das Telefon."_

Abba


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## brian

I have to agree with elroy, and his construction with "would be + <gerund>" is _exactly_ what I had in mind reading this thread.

I can't explain why "used to be cooking" sounds awful, but it does. "Would be cooking" is way more natural.


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## Derselbe

Hutschi said:


> For "when" in the meaning "while" we have two forms in German.
> 1. Als (all kinds of past tenses, for one time) 1. Als er kam, kochte Sie (gerade) Kaffee. (Sie begann, bevor er da war, war aber noch nicht fertig, als er kam.) I suppose this case is meant in the original posting. 2. Als er kam, kochte sie ihm Kaffee. (Sie begann, als er da war.)
> 2. Wenn (all kind of past tenses, when the action is repeated, present and future tense.) Wenn er kam, kochte sie gewöhnlich gerade Kaffee. Wenn er kam, kochte sie Kaffee. Wenn er kam, begann sie, Kaffee zu kochen. Wenn er kommt, kocht sie Kaffee. Wenn er kommen wird, wird sie Kaffee kochen.



I have to disagree. 
"when" in
"_He *used to be sleeping when* my poor mother and my brother Florence waited up for me"_
is to be translated with "während". And that's exactly the point elroy had in mind when he said that's not the same "while" that we've been discussing so far. 

"_He *used to be sleeping when* my poor mother" => 
_"Er schlief für gewohnlich während meine arme Mutter....."

"Wenn" und "als" kommen hier beide mE nicht in Betracht.

....................................................................
Also the interrupted activity is not the same. While in
"She was cooking *when* her husband came home." 
"when" introduces the interrupting action
in
"_He *used to be sleeping when* my poor mother"
_"when" introduces the permanent action which goes on.


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## lrosa

Hutschi said:


> For "when" in the meaning "while" we have two forms in German.
> 1. Als (all kinds of past tenses, for one time) 1. Als er kam, kochte Sie (gerade) Kaffee. (Sie begann, bevor er da war, war aber noch nicht fertig, als er kam.) I suppose this case is meant in the original posting. 2. Als er kam, kochte sie ihm Kaffee. (Sie begann, als er da war.)



If I understand correctly, "Als er kam, kochte sie ihm Kaffee" can have the 3 meanings of "When he came, she *was making* him coffee" (she was in the process of making coffee), "When he came, she *would make* him coffee" (it was her habit to start making coffee after he arrived) *and* "After he came, she *made *him coffee" (something that happened only once)?

Or would the habitual action use "Wenn"?



EDIT: Oops, I forgot to add my observation that it's the word "gerade" here that marks the past progressive meaning - isn't that right? (I guess that's what you just said, Brian)


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## brian

I think the habitual one is only with "wenn."

Also, without further info, I think the meaning would mostly be taken as: "When (After) he came, she made him coffee."

If you wanted to highlight that she was making coffee (progressive) when he came, you'd have to have more context or say "gerade."


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## Frank78

lrosa said:


> If I understand correctly, "Als er kam, kochte sie ihm Kaffee" can have the 3 meanings of "When he came, she *was making* him coffee" (she was in the process of making coffee), "When he came, she *would make* him coffee" (it was her habit to start making coffee after he arrived) *and* "After he came, she *made *him coffee" (something that happened only once)?
> 
> Or would the habitual action use "Wenn"?



If you want to express a habit you must use a word like "immer" (always) or "jeden Tag"

"Immer/Jeden Tag kochte sie ihm Kaffee, als er nach Hause kam."

Otherwise I understand it as single actions. Either parallel or one after the other.


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## Derselbe

ABBA Stanza said:


> What surprises me here is that nobody has pointed out the other possible ways of expressing this idea in German. Here are some examples taken from the Internet:
> 
> _"Ich war *am arbeiten*, als ich über das Wahlresultat informiert wurde."_
> 
> _"Ich war *beim Kochen*, als du angerufen hast."_
> (Note: this form is popular in Southern Germany, because it avoids the use of the simple past tense completely. )
> 
> _"Wir waren gerade *beim Essen, da* klingelte das Telefon."_
> 
> Abba



Because they all are quite colloquial and we don't want to teach colloqial German as long as nobody explicitly asks for it. 

"Ich bin am _Inf_." is a colloqial attempt to imitate the English progressive forms that we actually don't have in German language.  

In order to avoid simple past you could also just say "Ich habe gerade gekocht, als du angerufen hast." You don't need to use nominalizations. Besides that, "beim _Inf._ sein" is just as "am _Inf._ sein" considered stylistically bad German.



> _"Wir waren gerade *beim Essen, da* klingelte das Telefon."
> _


_

_This seems to require a new sentence in my opinion. "Wir waren gerade beim Essen. Da klingelte das Telefon"


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## Derselbe

lrosa said:


> If I understand correctly, "Als er kam, kochte sie ihm Kaffee" can have the 3 meanings of "When he came, she *was making* him coffee" (she was in the process of making coffee), "When he came, she *would make* him coffee" (it was her habit to start making coffee after he arrived) *and* "After he came, she *made *him coffee" (something that happened only once)?



"Als er kam, kochte sie ihm Kaffe." -> "After he came, she *made *him coffee"  

If you want to express "would make" you have to say something like:
"*Wenn* er kam, kochte sie ihm normalerweise/immer/in der Regel Kaffe."

If you want to express "was making" you have to say:
"Als er kam, kochte sie ihm gerade Kaffe."


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## brian

Derselbe said:


> This seems to require a new sentence in my opinion. "Wir waren gerade beim Essen. Da klingelte das Telefon"



Right, "da" is an adverb there ("then"), not a conjunction, because of the word order. Otherwise, it'd be "...beim Essen, da (_since_) das Telefon klingelte," which doesn't make much sense.

Anyway, even if "am/beim + <infinitive>" is stylistically bad, if people do use it, it's good to know.


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## lrosa

Indeed, I recently asked a German friend from Cologne how she would say "I was cleaning my room when you rang" in German, and she replied "Ich war gerade dabei, mein Zimmer aufzuräumen, als du angerufen hast."


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## berndf

Derselbe said:


> "Ich bin am _Inf_." is a colloqial attempt to imitate the English progressive forms that we actually don't have in German language.


This is not quite true. This form is very traditional in many regional varieties of German and is not an immitation of English. It has just never made it into the higher registers of the standard language.


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## Derselbe

lrosa said:


> Indeed, I recently asked a German friend from Cologne how she would say "I was cleaning my room when you rang" in German, and she replied "Ich war gerade dabei, mein Zimmer aufzuräumen, als du angerufen hast."



That is absolutely fine - no objections whatsoever. "dabei sein, etwas zu tun" is a good way to descibe the idea of "I was doing X when y happend."

What we were talking about would be:
"Ich war gerade am Zimmeraufräumen, als du angrufen hast." which sounds quite terrible, since you have to integrate the object into the verb... I don't think many people would say things like that - not even in dialects.



> This is not quite true. This form is very traditional in many regional varieties of German and is not an immitation of English. It has just never made it into the higher registers of the standard language.


Okay you're probably right on that. And I never said that I wouldn't use those forms in colloquial speech with my friends. You just have to be aware that it's considered substandard and I think that's the reason why nobody mentioned it.


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## Hutschi

Frank78 said:


> If you want to express a habit you must use a word like "immer" (always) or "jeden Tag"
> 
> "Immer/Jeden Tag kochte sie ihm Kaffee, als er nach Hause kam."
> 
> Otherwise I understand it as single actions. Either parallel or one after the other.


 
You can express it as habit in two different ways:
1. Immer/jeden Tag kochte sie ihm Kaffee, als/wenn er nach Hause kam. 
2. Sie kochte ihm Kaffee, wenn er nach Hause kam.

There are more possibilities ...


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## lrosa

Hutschi said:


> You can express it as habit in two different ways:
> 1. Immer/jeden Tag kochte sie ihm Kaffee, als/wenn er nach Hause kam.
> 2. Sie kochte ihm Kaffee, wenn er nach Hause kam.
> 
> There are more possibilities ...



Are there possibilities which avoid the Imperfect tense (which I always feel funny using)?


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## Frank78

Hutschi said:


> You can express it as habit in two different ways:
> 1. Immer/jeden Tag kochte sie ihm Kaffee, als/wenn er nach Hause kam.
> 2. Sie kochte ihm Kaffee, wenn er nach Hause kam.
> 
> There are more possibilities ...



In your second sentence it´s simply not clear that it was a habit. It can be but it´s ambiguous.


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## Derselbe

Frank78 said:


> In your second sentence it´s simply not clear that it was a habit. It can be but it´s ambiguous.



I have to agree. "Sie kochte ihm Kaffee, wenn er nach Hause kam." sounds strange without a clarification as to what is actually meant.



> Are there possibilities which avoid the Imperfect tense (which I always feel funny using)?



Why would someone try to avoid our great Präteritum (Imperfect is a latin tense)? 
Okay, seriously you can use Perfekt. But contrary to what you've probably been taught, Perfekt and Präteritum don't necessarily mean the same. There are differences, so I don't think it's advisable to avoid Präteritum.


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## berndf

brian8733 said:


> I think the habitual one is only with "wenn."


It has nothing to do with habitual or not but with this: 



brian8733 said:


> Also, without further info, I think the meaning would mostly be taken as: "When (After) he came, she made him coffee."


(No need to be so cautious. )

"Als" denotes mere temporal coincidence, "wenn" implies causality. If you use "wenn" you always imply that the she makes coffee *because* he comes and the action is triggered by his coming not just taking place at the same time when he comes.


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## Hutschi

berndf said:


> It has nothing to do with habitual or not but with this:
> (No need to be so cautious. )
> 
> "Als" denotes mere temporal coincidence, "wenn" implies causality. If you use "wenn" you always imply that the she makes coffee *because* he comes and the action is triggered by his coming not just taking place at the same time when he comes.


 
It can include causality. But usually it only means that the times are in connection. The cause can be a causality from outside.

Example: Immer, wenn ich an die Straßenbahnhaltestelle kam, standen dort Leute. They did not stand there in any connection with me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by *Hutschi* 

 
You can express it as habit in two different ways:
1. Immer/jeden Tag kochte sie ihm Kaffee, als/wenn er nach Hause kam. 
2. Sie kochte ihm Kaffee, wenn er nach Hause kam.

There are more possibilities ...

Frank78: In your second sentence it´s simply not clear that it was a habit. It can be but it´s ambiguous. 

Not. This is clear. In the past tense it can only be used in this way if it is a habit. (With habit I mean, that it is repeated.
If it is only one time, you have to use "als".

In the present tense, it changes. In the present tense it is ambiguous.



lrosa said:


> Are there possibilities which avoid the Imperfect tense (which I always feel funny using)?


It depends on what you want to say:

Sie kochte ihm Kaffee, als er gekommen war. - He was already there when she started.

Sie hat ihm Kaffee gekocht, als er gekommen ist. 

This is also possible.


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## berndf

Hutschi said:


> The cause can be a causality from outside.


Yes, that is true. 


Hutschi said:


> Immer, wenn ich an die Straßenbahnhaltestelle kam, standen dort Leute. They did not stand there in any connection with me.


Good example. You would use "wenn" even if no reason (common cause) has (yet) been established. The repeated coincidence is or at least appears law-like. This law-likeness explains the use of "wenn" in "immer wenn", not habituallity.


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## Hutschi

The causality is clearly used when you can translate "wenn" with "if".

This is not the case in the examples for a habit (Gewohnheit). The coffee examples are using as well habit as chance (Zufall).

You will have a causality in: "Wenn/als das Wasser heiß war, brühte sie den Kaffee." But in this case, it is "when" in English as far as I know.


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## berndf

Hutschi said:


> You will have a causality in: "Wenn/als das Wasser heiß war, brühte sie den Kaffee." But in this case, it is "when" in English as far as I know.


I don't think so.
In "Sie kochte Kaffee, wenn er kam" his arrival triggers the actions of making coffee. If you want to express a mere coincidence you have to say "Sie kochte Kaffee, als er kam".

"*Immer* wenn er kam, kochte er Kaffee" is different because of the law-like nature of what is expressed.


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## BurnRose

Would something like "Ich war tun dass" or "Dass ich war tun" work? I know 'tun is off a little, wrong tense. but how would that be phrased?


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## mannibreuckmann

What do you want to express in English?


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## BurnRose

I should have read more, I was going for the literal translation of the thread title. "I was doing that". I didn't see the what and when. but what is the proper way to say "doing"


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## mannibreuckmann

The trouble is: You often use "machen" in cases you use "do" in English. That's why I ask for what you wanted to express in English.

Example:

"He was doing the dishes, when..."

"Er machte (gerade) den Abwasch, als..."


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## BurnRose

Oh ya that's right. 'Was machen Sie' 'was machst du'. (ich mache dass?)

i had nothing to express, just an open sentence statement as if i was pointing to something


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## Derselbe

BurnRose said:


> but what is the proper way to say "doing"



There is no. It depends on the particular construction. Sometimes you have use Infinitiv in German, sometimes Partizip, sometime standard verb conjugations... So there is no answer to that question. But by studying German you might also become sensitive for the different usages in English. Just some examples maybe:

Doing this is fun. -> "Es macht Spaß, dies *zu tun*." 
Playing soccer is fun. -> "*Fußballspielen* macht Spaß."
He is doing exercises. -> "Er *macht* gerade Sport."
Listening to the music on his I-Pod he went to the shopping mall. -> "Musik *hörend* ging er ins Einkaufszentrum."


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## BurnRose

Vielen Dank.  Ich verstehe.  Ich brauche zu bruch mich von Englisch.


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## BurnRose

Ich muss mir von Englisch brechen


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## mannibreuckmann

Du musst dich vom Englischen lösen, ja!


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## ABBA Stanza

Derselbe said:


> lrosa said:
> 
> 
> 
> Indeed, I recently asked a German friend from Cologne how she would say "I was cleaning my room when you rang" in German, and she replied "Ich war gerade dabei, mein Zimmer aufzuräumen, als du angerufen hast."
> 
> 
> 
> That is absolutely fine - no objections whatsoever. "dabei sein, etwas zu tun" is a good way to descibe the idea of "I was doing X when y happend."
> 
> What we were talking about would be:
> "Ich war gerade am Zimmeraufräumen, als du angrufen hast." which sounds quite terrible, since you have to integrate the object into the verb... I don't think many people would say things like that - not even in dialects.
Click to expand...

Sorry about the late reponse, but I think it would be wrong to condemn the _"Ich war gerade am Zimmeraufräumen, als du angrufen hast"_ construction, and to sing the praises of the "absolutely fine" alternative with an infinitive clause. To me, _Zimmeraufräumen_ is not a particularly long and clumsy word by German standards (although it would indeed probably scare the living daylights out of my fellow countrymen back home ). So I could definitely see myself saying something like that.

Of course, the more information is added, the more attractive the infinitive clause becomes. However, the converse is also true. For example, while the more detailed sentence

_"Ich war gerade dabei, mein Zimmer aufzuräumen, als du angerufen hast."_

sounds good, the less detailed sentence

_"Ich war gerade dabei zu essen, als du angerufen hast."_

doesn't sound any better (and is even arguably worse) than

_"Ich war gerade am essen, als du angerufen hast."_

So I see the two alternatives as complementary. Which one is best depends on how much information needs to be packed into the sentence.

Of course, I'm aware that some of this stuff is colloquial, but on the other hand, who would say:

_"Ich *aß* gerade, als du *anriefst*."_

The answer (at least in my neck of the woods) is simple. No one.

Abba


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## gaer

elroy said:


> I don't know what the grammatical explanations are, but _Mary used to be cooking_ sounds dreadful to me, and I'd be surprised if other native speakers did not feel the same way.


It sounds very awkward. As for the rest of this discussion, I thought it was answered in the beginning, then went off track.


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## Frank78

ABBA Stanza said:


> _"Ich war gerade am essen, als du angerufen hast."_
> Abba



I don´t like the "am" constructions. These sounds really awful.



ABBA Stanza said:


> _"Ich *aß* gerade, als du *anriefst*."_
> 
> Abba



Surely rare, but fine. And definitly a better style than "Ich war am essen...".


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## Derselbe

ABBA Stanza said:


> Sorry about the late reponse, but I think it would be wrong to condemn the _"Ich war gerade am Zimmeraufräumen, als du angrufen hast"_ construction, and to sing the praises of the "absolutely fine" alternative with an infinitive clause.



I'm sorry but "Ich war gerade am Zimmeraufräumen" sounds terrible. I know that the "am tun" constructions are widespread and I can't say that I never used one, but object-integrated infinitives are just way to much to my ears. I don't think it would be wrong to codemn it. And again, I doubt that many German natives would say that sentence. "Ich war gerade dabei, mein Zimmer aufzuräumen" sounds absolutely fine. I can't tell you why, but the difference couldn't be bigger.
I'll be really  surprised if the other German natives here object to my statement.

Same is true for your "Ich war gerade dabei, zu essen." vs. "Ich war am essen.". The first one sounds way better and not at all snobbish. It can perfectly be used in both colloqial and formal speech. However, "Ich war am Essen" is not as bad as "am Zimmeraufräumen" and is surely widespread. But "ich war am Zimeraufräumen" is really not even used in stadard colloquial speech (maybe some dialects, who knows).


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## ABBA Stanza

Frank78 said:


> I don´t like the "am" constructions. These sounds really awful.





Derselbe said:


> I'm sorry but "Ich war gerade am Zimmeraufräumen" sounds terrible. I know that the "am tun" constructions are widespread and I can't say that I never used one, but object-integrated infinitives are just way to much to my ears.


Thanks for your feedback, Frank and Derselbe. It's interesting to hear how natives see things that I had previously thought were "im grünen Bereich". I'll try to make a deliberate attempt to improve my German in this area in the future!

I wish you both a great long weekend. Maybe we'll meet up on another thread before it's over? In the meantime, all the best. 

Abba


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## sokol

ABBA Stanza said:


> Thanks for your feedback, Frank and Derselbe. It's interesting to hear how natives see things that I had previously thought were "im grünen Bereich". I'll try to make a deliberate attempt to improve my German in this area in the future!


Well, we had that discussion about "am essen" ("German progressive") before; I haven't re-read the whole thread again but the gist of it is that it seems to be considered rather colloquial by Germans (in Austria it is considered foreign ).



Derselbe said:


> I'm sorry but "Ich war gerade am Zimmeraufräumen" sounds terrible.


It sounds terrible to me, me being Austrian  - but it seems that this is used frequently. Whatever, as said above, most Germans seem to agree that this is colloquial and not quite standard language.



Derselbe said:


> "Ich war gerade dabei, mein Zimmer aufzuräumen" sounds absolutely fine.


I agree, this is perfectly fine.


Derselbe said:


> Same is true for your "Ich war gerade dabei, zu essen." vs. "Ich war am essen.". The first one sounds way better and not at all snobbish.


Here I don't agree - at least to me "Ich war gerade dabei, zu essen" sounds horrible; in Austrian German (both standard language and colloquial speech) I'd never use anything else but "Ich war gerade beim essen/Essen" (not sure wether this counts as nominalised noun concerning new spelling ). - But as you can't quite give a reason why it sounds perfect for your ears I can't really explain why I prefer "beim" here.


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## Derselbe

ABBA Stanza said:


> Thanks for your feedback, Frank and Derselbe. It's interesting to hear how natives see things that I had previously thought were "im grünen Bereich".



Again, regular "am Inf. sein" construction are in fact widespread and "im grünen Bereich" as long as you don't have to put other words into the verb. The vast majority of German natives uses them in colloquial speech. I just caught myselft saying "Guck mal da draußen. Die Katze ist wieder am Jagen." 

You just have to be aware that it's a bit out of place in written language and some German natives dislike them in general. 

As regards constructions where you have to put objects or whole sentences into a verb there is only one thing to say in my opinion: Don't do it 

"Ich war grade am Diefensterinmeinemzimmermiteinemlappenputzen, als das Telefon klingelte..."


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## Derselbe

sokol said:


> Here I don't agree - at least to me "Ich war gerade dabei, zu essen" sounds horrible; in Austrian German (both standard language and colloquial speech) I'd never use anything else but "Ich war gerade beim essen/Essen" (not sure wether this counts as nominalised noun concerning new spelling ). - But as you can't quite give a reason why it sounds perfect for your ears I can't really explain why I prefer "beim" here.



This is very interesting. Some of the colloquial <-> snobbish differences seem to be upside-down in Austria (or in Germany  )

However, "Ich war gerade *beim* Essen." is fine in Germany too. My statement was that I prefer the "dabei" constrution over "war *am* Essen.". "*beim* Essen" seems to be a valid alternative and maybe even more idiomatic than the "dabei" solution.


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