# Beggars, panhandlers, street people



## Chaska Ñawi

Here's a quote from a discussion on China: 





> The idea that you should not give money to beggars because they are fake is common all over the world. I do not find it a convincing reason. You do not know who is a fake beggar and who is a real beggar. So what if you are cheated? It is not very much money. I do not want to live in a society where, if I need to beg, no one will give me money because they think I am a fake.



How are beggars seen in your country?  What do you personally give them?  Do you talk to them?  Where do they come from (ie, are they local, or displaced from the countryside, to give 2 examples)?  Are there local laws against them?  Does your society distinguish between beggars and the people who busk, clean your car windshield, etc. for a bit of change?

I never saw beggars anywhere in Canada until the late 80's or early 90's, when three things happened.  Greater restrictions were put on welfare payments and subsidized housing, and group housing for mentally ill or disabled people was broken up and the residents were "returned to the community".  Lo and behold, we had an instant population of street people.

In the nearest city to me, there are three kinds of beggars.  In the first category are the locals, mostly mentally disabled in some way; many have been there for years.  I got tired of passing them every day without knowing a thing about them, so I introduced myself; we're now on a first-name basis.  I give them tickets to the local soup kitchen, money, or hot tea .... depends on the time of year and what I have.

In the second category are transients looking for work, many from Newfoundland and on their way west to find jobs in the Alberta oil patch.  They are not happy about begging.  I talked to one pair of kids who'd been camping out by the railroad tracks, but all their gear was stolen and they were hoping to panhandle enough money to at least buy a tarp.

In the third category are the drug addicts and alcholics.  Most are in their late teens or early twenties.  They sit smoking in doorways (or are sometimes passed out) and aren't always aware of their surroundings.  I must admit I tend to avoid this group.

Some cities have "anti-loitering" ordinances to discourage panhandlers; ours does, but it isn't enforced as long as the panhandlers are polite.  

What is the situation where you live?


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## Daddyo

I think back in the 'eighties the situation was well satirized by a comedianne called Judy Tenuta, when she said that most people try to ignore "street people" as much as possible... She said in her stand-up routine: "...So I was walking with the NY mayor (what? It could happen!) down the street and he tells me, 'we don't have much trouble here with street people', and I says, 'yeah, right! As if the sidewalks are supposed to feel soft and squeeshy, mister mayor!'"
And that's it.


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## luis masci

Interesting topic Chaska. I always wanted to know about it; how it’s managed in other countries and things like that. 
In Argentina in general, and in big cities in particular it’s a huge problem really. 
I used to pass at midnight in Córdoba down town and saw a lot of people sleeping outdoor, on the sidewalks. Some of them elder people... others, were mothers with several small children.... so much touching really. 
About children cleaning your car windshield...my goodness!!! There’re a lot. It’s annoying because almost in each trafic light you get them over your car. 
You never could have enought change for all of them. 


P.S. Remember I’m only a Spanish speaker, any correction will be welcome.


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## badgrammar

There are plenty of panhandlers in France, no doubt about it.  I tend to mentally divide them into little categories like Chaska - there are those who probably ought to be working but aren't, whether it be from laziness or because of addictions.  There are those who have little or no chance of finding enough work to support themselves (the elderly, disabled, etc.).  There are those for whom the begging becomes the work (please do not think me awful if I mention that there are some "nomadic" groups in France that beg "for a living").  There are immigrants, primarily from Eastern Europe, who are obviously in financial difficulty and would probably just like to get back home, or would be happy to take a job if they could get one (Funny, I have no recollection of any African or North African immigrants asking for money, though it must have happened to me before).

And finally, there is a group that particularly touches me, the mentally ill.  My own brother is mentally ill and if my family were unable to take care of him, he'd be one of those dirty, scary looking guys at the stoplight with a cardboard sign and a cup, ranting and raving, having loud discussions with people and things that do not exist.  "But for the grace of God go I", as they say.  A lot of homeless are mentally ill, unfortunately the little bit of change we can spare won't make a dent in their recovery...

So I have no qualms about giving to many, sometimes any, of the above categories...  Although I pick and choose and obviously can't give to everybody.  Sometimes I give nothing for days, then see someone who looks like they really need it and I'll give them a euro or two.


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## KateNicole

To answer your question as quickly possible:

Where I live (Racine, Wisconsin) it appears to me that the majority of panhandlers suffer some sort of a mental illness, and there are also those who are drug addicts or alcoholics, but I believe that on top of that, they are also mentally ill.  Many people where I live are obsessed with the idea that they "won't help themselves" and therefore deserve no help from the public.  I'm 100% in favor of people working for their own needs, but most of the panhandlers I've seen have no address or telephone, and no place to bathe themselves and take care of other personal hygiene manners, which renders them "unemployable" in many aspects.  A lot of these people just don't have a fighting chance.  Sometimes I buy them food.  I worry about handing them cash because I don't want it to be spent on alcohol or drugs.  We've also given them coats and toothbrushes, toothpaste and mouthwash.  Sometimes I wish I could take people like that into my home for a month to help them get on their feet, but in this day and age, I would probably be compromising my safety.  I don't blame most of them though because I think it's incredibly difficult to "superar" (can't think of the word in English) extreme poverty and homelessness.  It's like you have no where to start and nowhere to go . . . 
It depresses me when I think about it, and I don't think blaming them helps.  I always ask people, "If you owned a bussiness, would YOU hire someone that showed up to an interview unbathed and in tattered clothing?"  The answer is usually "no."


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## emma42

katenicole, your experience closely mirrors mine in my hometown of Nottingham.  Many of the beggars who are substance addicted are also mentally ill or have never had a "fighting chance".  I am acutely aware of them as I walk by and sometimes feel like a Dickensian character, just ignoring "the fallen" as I walk back to my warm flat.  I, too, would like to be able to bring them back to my home and help them get on their feet, but I can't because of my personal safety.  I once brought a woman back who said she was too scared to return to her violent husband.  When I awoke, she had stolen £20 from my purse and returned to her home.  I can't afford to lose £20 as I live on what is well below average earnings.


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## Etcetera

Here in Russia beggars are a real social problem, and no one can suggest a solution to it. After the collapse of the Soviet Union a lot of people were forced to go to the strees to ask for money, 'cause they couldn't find any job. Now, fifteen years later, the situation isn't anything better, there are still beggars - in the streets, in metro, in local trains... They're not only people who lose their job and everything, but also refugees from Chechnya, for instance.
But now the problem becomes still more complicated. Beggary is more a business now, and it's commonly known in St. Petersburg and Moscow that all those people who ask for money in metro have to pay a large part of their 'income' to criminals. Yes, asking for money in public places is strictly forbidden. So, they have to pay to the police. And so on. 
I myself decided long ago not to give any money to beggars in the metro, as well as in the streets. But I usually give money to those who come to churches to ask for help. I believe they don't cheat me.


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## badgrammar

Hi Etcetera,

I think yours is also a very good solution - it is often better to give to associations (religious or non-denominational) who set up food kitchens, shelters and other such programs for those in need.  

When I was traveling in India last year, I was surprised at not seeing more beggars...  Although the ones I did see in the big cities such as Delhi seemed to be somehow organized - I don't know how to explain it, but I got the feeling profitable street corners "belong" to professional beggars, and they come accompanied with gruesome props such as maimed or ill children and babies - which I suspect often were not their own.  

But the hardest thing is not giving anything to children, so I always carried around fruits and sweets.  They were not always well-recieved, but atleast if you give them something to eat, you can believe it will go towards feeding them and not to line some adult's pockets...

Reason for editing: Egregious faults!


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## Etcetera

*Badgrammar*
I've just remembered an episode that must take place in 1997 or so. My Mum and me were going somewhere by a local train. At one station a yonug woman accompanied by two children (aged 6 and 1, I suppose) came into the train and said to the passengers she was a refugee from a minor town in Chechnya which was ruined almost completely and she and her children had nothing to eat. We ourselves had very little money then, but we were going from a market, so we had some food (children food, as well), and we gave them some, and so did some other passengers. They received it with gratitude... I've seen scenes like that in recent years, but obviously times has changed since - now beggars ask for money only.


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## badgrammar

Very nice story Etc., and I guess that is why sometimes we all give what we can, because sometimes people are in genuine need, not just looking for an easy way to make some money...  Once again I say "But for the grace of God (or my "higher power") go I...


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## badgrammar

Hey, I just had an experience at the grocery store that is in line with this idea.  In front of me was a older woman (maybe she wasn't very old, but it is hard to say).  She was buying two baguettes and two small cans of sardines. The cashier told her 2€ and something.  The women said "Du oros?" and hand the cashier a handful of 1 and 2 cent coins.  She didn't have enough, and showed the cashier to take off one can of sardines.  She still didn't have enough.  She was missing maybe 30 cents.  So I gave the thirty cents.  After the woman I guess was trying to ask the exact price of the sardines - maybe she was going to go try to round up enough for the second can.  So I just bought them for her.  She was so grateful and I guess she was telling me thank you in her language, then she actually took my hand and kissed it.  Which made me feel very embarassed, but that probably made me feel as happy to do that as she was happy to have the two cans of sardines.  Everybody wins!


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## Etcetera

How nice. And I agree, it's really pleasant to help people.


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## Lancel0t

Sad to say in our country there are lots of beggars.  Some of them really don't have any other means of living. Some of them used it as a profession, some of them are just too lazy do something else and some of them are similar to what chaska have described. It's only sad to know that our government is not doing anything to solve this problem.


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## maxiogee

One can never know if the person one is approached by is a genuine case (unless one is familiar with them, of if they are obviously under the influence of some sort of drug) so the best I can do is to occasionally give the price of a night in a hostel to someone who asks and appears to be genuine. I'm sure I'm wrong more often than I'm right, and the first thing they do is get them to their source of 'chemical adjustment'. However, I presume that sometimes I do make a difference, and that makes up for the times I don't.
if I have the time, and if they look like they'd listen, I'll chat to them and see if there is anything I can offer other than monetary assistance. Usually though, I rushing.


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## Etcetera

BTW, here in Russia the government encouraged a whole program in order to prevent people from giving money to beggars. I remember there were several TV shows and a lot of newspaper articles about how narcomans, for example, use people's sympathy to get money for drugs. There were also some revelations about young women whom one could see very often in metro or local trains. These women used to carry with them little children, usually sleeping, and ask people for money "to feed the child" and so on. Interestingly enough, I've just thought I haven't seen such women since the campaign has started!


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## panjandrum

I find this really difficult.

I was walking from work to my car one Wednesday. I was stopped by a guy who explained that he'd had a hospital appointment that morning, he'd travelled 60 miles by train to get there, and he'd had his wallet stolen. He had no return ticket and no money. Could I spare something to help him get home.
I gave him enough for his train fare.

I was walking from work to my car one Thursday. I was stopped by .....

True story.
He didn't get anything on Thursday.

I get around this difficulty by contributing to reputable charities that support the homeless in my City. I don't give money in response to individual appeals. Sorry if that seems heartless.


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## badgrammar

Happened to me too, Baltimore, a rainy night on Charles STreet, parked he car and headed for the cinema with my guy.  Middle-aged guy tells me some story 'bout how he needs to get back to Washington with his daughter, points into the distance "She over there, we gotta' get home"...  He offered to leave me his watch.  I of course said no, and gave him a 20 to catch a train to DC.  He took my address, said he'd send it to me.

I knew I'd been screwed as soon as I turned to walk away.  

But on the off-chance that someday I'm helping someone who really needs it, I guess I prefer that to being not trusting anyone and refusing aid to someone who truly needs it.


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## Boyd

Well I live in Toronto and I agree that there can be some kind of a classification done. My son was a street person for about a year a few years ago. He was one of those begging for money for drugs and alcohol. (Thank goodness this is no longer the case) There are also the people who were released from mental health institutes. It's not that hard to tell the difference between these two groups and I've only once seen a family on the street. I think a factor as well is that there are people who just don't want to be inside at all for some reason. There are plenty of shelters but some people just do not want to be inside. During his time on the street this was part of the situation with my son. Even after he stopped taking drugs, got a job and had his own apartment, occasionally he would just not be able to "take it" any more and would get the tent and go off camping somewhere so that he could spend time outside. 
I don't usually give them money. I stayed in communication with my son when he was on the street and learned that there are many places where they can be fed, clothed, given vitamins, medications etc for free so I figure my taxes are helping already.


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## Mariaguadalupe

Well, here's my two cents worth:

There was one woman once who came by my house one day soon after the big 85 earthquake in Mexico city, told me her grandchild had just arrived to live with her after losing her family in the quake.  A couple of weeks later, she came by again, with the same story, and then after a hurricane had struck some gulf coast city, again.  I gave her something only the first time.  

We have a lot a professional beggars around here.  We even have one who presents himself as a blind person.  He's been seen driving a car.  And the other one who begs for money sitting in a wheelchair yet is the president of a disabled persons organization and drives around in a recent model car.  (hmmm)  We also have those who carry along their stage props (oops!) their children, some of whom are given valium or other drugs so that they (the children) can lie listlessly in a drug induced sleep all day long.  This is very sad.  

We then have those who have been deported from the US and since they are left on the border, they have nowhere else to go and no means to get a job. (or so they say, yet when I have offered them a temporary job, some have said, Oh my goodness no!) So, hmmm again. 

We still have one more situation, those children who get separated from their parents because they (parents) have left them behind in their attempt to cross over to the States or their parents are in jail.  Several charitable organizations began a home to deal with this type of homeless children and now the government agency DIF has stepped in to take care of them.   


So now, I help in one of the local food kitchens and help different organizations raise money towards specific goals.


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## Cath.S.

There are plenty of beggars in French bi cities. I never give money to organizations, especially since the ARC scandal, but I do give food to the Red Cross and such like when they come to our local supermarkets.

I give money whenever I can afford it to street beggars whose face I like,  or sometimes to people who are so dirty and/or ugly looking that I think no one else will give them anything.


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## coconutpalm

I give money occasionaly, but only to the old or the (seemingly disabled). As I have said in the "china" post, there are many many fake beggars and many of the children are controlled by a criminal group.


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## maxiogee

I used to work in the presbytery of a defunct city-centre church. My job entailed typesetting a magazine produced on the premises. I also was nearest the hall door.
We had a regular stream of mendicants. Some we grew to recognise. Stories were legion, and oft repeated.
One day a colleague was stopped in the grounds of the church by a woman with a story we had heard before. She told Patricia that she was stuck in Dublin and needed money for a train to Cork. There was a family emergency and she needed to get there urgently. Patricia gave her the price of the train-fare. The rest of us (including two priests, who hear more of these stories than anyone else) told Patricia that she had fallen for one of the most common sob-stories, and she would never see her money again.
Three months later the woman turned up with a bunch of flowers and paid back the money.
We were *all* stunned, even Patricia, who at this stage had come to believe what we had told her.


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## Etcetera

That's truly wonderful.
So, the only advice that can be given: listen to your heart. A cheat will cheat themselves at the end.


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## coconutpalm

Yes, really wonderful story!
What a pity most of us have come to distrust other people!
I second Etcetera's sugesstion!


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## badgrammar

Great story, Max...  I guess that's why even if sometimes you get cheated, sometimes you also genuinely help a good person.  Have to keep up your faith in humanity.



			
				maxiogee said:
			
		

> I used to work in the presbytery of a defunct city-centre church. My job entailed typesetting a magazine produced on the premises. I also was nearest the hall door.
> We had a regular stream of mendicants. Some we grew to recognise. Stories were legion, and oft repeated.
> One day a colleague was stopped in the grounds of the church by a woman with a story we had heard before. She told Patricia that she was stuck in Dublin and needed money for a train to Cork. There was a family emergency and she needed to get there urgently. Patricia gave her the price of the train-fare. The rest of us (including two priests, who hear more of these stories than anyone else) told Patricia that she had fallen for one of the most common sob-stories, and she would never see her money again.
> Three months later the woman turned up with a bunch of flowers and paid back the money.
> We were *all* stunned, even Patricia, who at this stage had come to believe what we had told her.


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