# El segundo de la clase del año A



## larq005

Hola a tod@s.

¿Cuál sería la forma más 'real' de traducirlo?

Mi aportación:"2nd of the class of 2009".

Saludos.


----------



## elirlandes

Es una construcción que no se emplea en inglés. Habría que usar una frase completa estilo: I/He/She came second in my/his/her class in 2009.


----------



## larq005

Hola, elirlandes. 

El background, en que no he caído hasta que he visto tu respuesta, es que se trata de una distinción que se otorga en el curso final de una carrera universitaria.

Para dar esa idea, quería usar una frase que incluyese "class of 2009".

¿Crees que sabiendo esto podría existir alguna otra aproximación?

¿Podría ser algo así como 2nd best of class of 2009 (el segundo mejor de la clase de 2009)?

Saludos.


----------



## elirlandes

[He/She] had the second highest [grade/marks] out of everyone in the class of 2009.


----------



## larq005

Ok. Lo único es que esa forma, aunque correcta me parece un poco "pedante" (perdón por la expresión). 

¿Para suavizarlo podría quedarse como "[He/She] had the second highest [grade/marks] out in the class of 2009."?

Muchas gracias.


----------



## elirlandes

[He/She] had the second highest [grade/marks] out in of the class of 2009."?

Así quizás mejor.


----------



## larq005

What do you think about "Second best student in the last year at university."? 

Errors with prepositions?

Thanks.


----------



## elirlandes

"the last year at university" quiere decir "el último curso de la unversidad".

Se podría decir "Second best student at the university, last year" pero "best student" no es muy exacto... best at what? good person? hard worker? best exam results? Además, no precisa en que curso está - el mejor estudiante no tiene por que estar graduando, sino puede estar en el primer ano.


----------



## goodoldave

larq005 said:


> Hola a tod@s.
> 
> ¿Cuál sería la forma más 'real' de traducirlo?
> 
> Mi aportación:"2nd of the class of 2009".
> 
> Saludos.



Hola,

I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for but, in the US, the second highest graduate (grade-wise) is called the Salutatorian.  The number one graduate is the Valedictorian.

Dave


----------



## Ynez

En español se dice para el mejor:

el mejor expediente de la promoción


----------



## elirlandes

goodoldave said:


> Hola,
> 
> I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for but, in the US, the second highest graduate (grade-wise) is called the Salutatorian.  The number one graduate is the Valedictorian.
> 
> Dave


This is very much an American English usage.

Historically and in British/Irish English, a "valedictorian" is the person, usually one of the students, who is chosen to represent the students to give the valedictory address or speech - this is a speech of farewell (vale dicere - from the latin). It has not necessarily anything to do with grades outside the US.


----------



## larq005

Bueno, visto que no soy capaz de darle el sentido exacto en inglés, probaré a hacerlo en español.

Literalmente, "...obtenida la nota media de ... en el expediente académico correspondiente a los estudios conducentes al título oficial de ..., se encuentra en el segundo lugar de los estudios ..., promoción 2008/2009, de la universidad ..."

Yo creo que más claro no lo puedo poner jeje


----------



## elirlandes

whose transcript shows an average grade of xx with respect to the studies which lead to the oficial title of yyy, he/she recieved the second highest grade in the 2008/2009 year of ZZZ University.


Ya ves por que las reglas del foro piden que se ortogue algo de contexto...


----------



## goodoldave

elirlandes said:


> This is very much an American English usage.
> 
> Historically and in British/Irish English, a "valedictorian" is the person, usually one of the students, who is chosen to represent the students to give the valedictory address or speech - this is a speech of farewell (vale dicere - from the latin). It has not necessarily anything to do with grades outside the US.



This is a little different in the US.  The valedictorian is the student with the highest grade.  He/She also automatically gives the valedictory address.

Dave


----------



## larq005

Yes, but I *need* to write it in one phrase (without verbs) and with few words.


----------



## elirlandes

goodoldave said:


> This is a little different in the US.  The valedictorian is the student with the highest grade.  He/She also automatically gives the valedictory address.
> 
> Dave


Perhaps it is the other way around. i.e. perhaps it is the same as elsewhere, but that the valedictorian is chosen by way of the student with highest grade winning the right to be valedictorian.


----------



## elirlandes

larq005 said:


> Yes, but I *need* to write it in one phrase (without verbs) and with few words.



Second highest grades in the class of 2008/2009. = 2o de la clase del 2008/2009


----------



## larq005

Ok. To finish, in that very good phrase, could you introduce in any gentle way that 2008/2009 was the last year in those studies?


----------



## goodoldave

elirlandes said:


> Perhaps it is the other way around. i.e. perhaps it is the same as elsewhere, but that the valedictorian is chosen by way of the student with highest grade winning the right to be valedictorian.



I'm not sure I understand the distinction you're making.  In the US, the valedictorian is not chosen, but determined mathematically based on grades.

Dave


----------



## elirlandes

larq005 said:


> Ok. To finish, in that very good phrase, could you introduce in any gentle way that 2008/2009 was the last year in those studies?


I think that it is fair to say that this is implied.
"The class of 2008/2009" means the class that was finishing the entire course in 2009. For example, if you are starting a four year degree course in September 2010, you are in "the class of 2015" or "the class of 2014/2015".


----------



## elirlandes

goodoldave said:


> I'm not sure I understand the distinction you're making.  In the US, the valedictorian is not chosen, but determined mathematically based on grades.
> 
> Dave



What I am suggesting is that you are saying is that it *is *chosen - by grades, as opposed to by other means. Notwithstanding this, it is not the grades that make the person valedictorian, but the fact that that person gives the valedictory speech.

For example, if the person with the highest grades is not available to make the speech, who is the valedictorian, the person with the grades, or the person who makes the speech?


----------



## larq005

elirlandes said:


> I think that it is fair to say that this is implied.
> "The class of 2008/2009" means the class that was finishing the entire course in 2009. For example, if you are starting a four year degree course in September 2010, you are in "the class of 2015" or "the class of 2014/2015".



Ok. You are right. 

Thank you very much for all your support.

The first of the losers has ever been so commented!!


----------



## goodoldave

elirlandes said:


> What I am suggesting is that you are saying is that it *is *chosen - by grades, as opposed to by other means. Notwithstanding this, it is not the grades that make the person valedictorian, but the fact that that person gives the valedictory speech.
> 
> For example, if the person with the highest grades is not available to make the speech, who is the valedictorian, the person with the grades, or the person who makes the speech?



I see what you're saying now.  To my mind, the valedictorian is the person with the grades, regardless of who gives the speech (for example due to illness).  The person puts this distinction on resumes, job applications, etc.

I notice that in one of your previous responses, you say the valedictorian is usually a student.  In the US, it is always a student in the graduating class.  Are there instances in Ireland/England where the valedictorian is not a student?

Dave


----------



## elirlandes

goodoldave said:


> Are there instances in Ireland/England where the valedictorian is not a student?


No - now that I think about it, I am pretty sure that it is always one of the students.
You will find the following curious I am sure - in my high school, I got the highest grades, but voted (along with everyone else) to have another guy be Valedictorian -i.e. to represent us bidding the school farewell - because he was really funny. His speech was hilarious. Then, in university, I did not get the highest grade in my class (by a long shot) but was chosen as valedictorian as I was known as a bit of a public speaker.


----------



## goodoldave

elirlandes said:


> No - now that I think about it, I am pretty sure that it is always one of the students.
> You will find the following curious I am sure - in my high school, I got the highest grades, but voted (along with everyone else) to have another guy be Valedictorian -i.e. to represent us bidding the school farewell - because he was really funny. His speech was hilarious. Then, in university, I did not get the highest grade in my class (by a long shot) but was chosen as valedictorian as I was known as a bit of a public speaker.



That is interesting.  It seems that in the US, we don't have those separate roles.  When someone says that they graduated valedictorian, it is understood that they had the highest grades in their class.  I think I like your system better.  It allows the student to chose who they want to represent them as a graduating class.

Is there also a salutatorian and, if so, is he/she elected also?

Dave


----------



## Alma Shofner

O sea que aprendiste la lección :verbo mata carita/grados?


----------



## larq005

Alma Shofner said:


> O sea que aprendiste la lección :verbo mata carita/grados?



No he entendido ": verbo mata carita/grados". ¿A quién te refieres?


----------



## Alma Shofner

Que primero él tenía los grados más altos pero uno que era muy divertido fue elegido valedictorian. En la universidad, él no tuvo los grados más altos, pero era reconocido por su habilidad de expresión (verbo.)

En México se usa decir "verbo mata carita" cuando un muchacho que es muy bueno para enamorar con palabras le quita/gana una chica a otro que es bien parecido (carita.)

En este caso, lo ajusté un poco: verbo mata grados. La habilidad para expresarse le gana al que tiene los mejores grados.


----------



## larq005

Ok. Suena lógico...solo que nunca lo había oído


----------



## elirlandes

Alma Shofner said:


> Que primero él tenía los grados más altos pero uno que era muy divertido fue elegido valedictorian. En la universidad, él no tuvo los grados más altos, pero era reconocido por su habilidad de expresión (verbo.)
> 
> En México se usa decir "verbo mata carita" cuando un muchacho que es muy bueno para enamorar con palabras le quita/gana una chica a otro que es bien parecido (carita.)
> 
> En este caso, lo ajusté un poco: verbo mata grados. La habilidad para expresarse le gana al que tiene los mejores grados.



Quizás aquí diriamos en inglés - form over substance.


----------



## Alma Shofner

El que yo dije no existe. Es un "ajuste" mío. Disculpen. Me gusta eso de form over substance.


----------



## larq005

¡Qué post más completito nos está quedando! jeje


----------



## elirlandes

larq005 said:


> ¡Qué post más completito nos está quedando! jeje



Hasta tenemos para formar nuestro propio forum chiquitito...


----------



## larq005

Bueno, pues al hilo de lo que acabas de decir, se me ha ocurrido que, si es de tu gusto, puedo añadirte como contacto.

Saludos.


----------



## elirlandes

larq005 said:


> Bueno, pues al hilo de lo que acabas de decir, se me ha ocurrido que, si es de tu gusto, puedo añadirte como contacto.
> 
> Saludos.



No te cortes...
Saludos a todos...


----------

