# White Americans



## lizguat

I am wondering how to translate "White Americans" in a politically correct way.  By "white americans" I mean people living in the USA that are not a part of minority groups.


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## _anna_

La tarducción literal sería "americanos/norteamericanos blancos"
Tambien podrías decir "la población blanca"


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## Eva Maria

lizguat said:


> I am wondering how to translate "White Americans" in a politically correct way. By "white americans" I mean people living in the USA that are not a part of minority groups.


 
Lizguat,

Te refieres a que quedaría políticamente incorrecto decir "los blancos", o "la mayoría blanca", no?

Y "La raza blanca" ?

What about "caucásicos"? "La raza caucásica" o "Los caucásicos".

Look:

"Como sinónimo de "blanco" se ha usado la denominación *caucásico* o caucasoide, por la hipótesis según la cual la gente de piel clara se habría originado..."

EM


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## romarsan

Hola chicos,
Curiosamente, en español, si dices "blancos/negros" suena mucho mas duro que si dices "de raza blanca/negra", que suena menos directo. En fin...


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## Eva Maria

romarsan said:


> Hola chicos,
> Curiosamente, en español, si dices "blancos/negros" suena mucho mas duro que si dices "de raza blanca/negra", que suena menos directo. En fin...


 
Lizguat,

"La población blanca" sugerida por Anna es una buena idea.

Hi, Romarsan,

Te parece que "caucásicos" suena más bien a película policial tipo CSI, Bones,...?

EM


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## scotu

This is contraversial but I suggest*: "**caucásicos (or blancos???)*" if your intention is to include hispanics. "*anglos*" if hispanics are not included.


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## romarsan

Hola Eva,
No, caucásico no me suena a lenguaje forense, jajaja. Solo pensé que raza blanca igual es un término de connotación más amplia, claro que necesitariamos saber que tipo de escrito maneja Lizguat...
Un placer encontrarte.
Rosalía


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## Eva Maria

scotu said:


> This is contraversial but I suggest*: "**caucásicos (or blancos???)*" if your intention is to include hispanics. "*anglos*" if hispanics are not included.


 
Scotu,

Sin embargo, los hispanoamericanos - dependiendo también de la zona geográfica, desde luego - me parece que no son propiamente caucásicos. Pienso que entrarían en el grupo amerindio, no? O bien serían una mezcla de caucásico y amerindio?

Esto de dividir "los blancos" en "los anglosajones" y "el resto de caucásicos" (que puede incluir individuos de todas las naciones europeas restantes, de ciertas áreas de Asia y África, y de determinadas zonas del continente americano) queda un pelín....

EM


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## The Guru

I agree with Anna. "Norteamericanos blancos" or "la población (de raza) blanca" are good options.

Eva, eso de caucásico o caucasiano me parece un anglicismo como una catedral. Como bien dices, suena a película porque algunos traductores de doblaje parece que no se enteran de que "caucasian" en inglés es un formalismo para referirse a "de raza blanca" y lo dejan tal cual, pero en español nunca se ha dicho con ese sentido. Caucásico en español es lo que procede del Cáucaso, allá por el mar negro, ya sea blanco, negro o de colores. De todas formas no me extrañaría que dentro de unos años a un madrileño de raza blanca se le llamara caucásico. Sin sentido pero políticamente correcto. 

Scotu, are you sure that "caucasian" includes hispanics / latinos in the US?. I thought the ethnic groups in the US were: caucasian / white, hispanics / latinos, afro-american / black, Asian, etc.

Perdón por extenderme. Saludos


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## scotu

The dictionary definition of the English word "*anglo*" is "a white American of non-Hispanic descent, as distinguished esp. from an American of Mexican or Spanish descent." This word probably comes from the term "anglo-saxon" but certainly includes all people of European desent. (Dictionary.com)

I grew up in Miami where we had a large Cuban population. In those days there were only three races; caucasions, negros, and orientals. It never would have occured to any of us that the Cubans or any of the people from South America who lived in Miami were anything other than _white._ When I moved to California I was suprised to find out that Mexicans were something other than white. Suddenly a brown race appeared to join the white, black and yellow races. we invented the words_ latino_ and _hispanic _because it isn´t politically correct use color to identify races. (Except that we whites are very comfortable keeping the word "white" for us.) 

I not sure what is the policically correct English word for "White American" is, much less, the politically correct Spanish word.

scotu


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## Basenjigirl

Scotu,
While we're on the subject, we no longer say "oriental" in English unless we're referring to a rug. . The correct term is "asian."


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## Eva Maria

scotu said:


> The dictionary definition of the English word "*anglo*" is "a white American of non-Hispanic descent, as distinguished esp. from an American of Mexican or Spanish descent." This word probably comes from the term "anglo-saxon" but certainly includes all people of European desent. (Dictionary.com)
> 
> I grew up in Miami where we had a large Cuban population. In those days there were only three races; caucasions, negros, and orientals. It never would have occured to any of us that the Cubans or any of the people from South America who lived in Miami were anything other than _white._ When I moved to California I was suprised to find out that Mexicans were something other than white. Suddenly a brown race appeared to join the white, black and yellow races. we invented the words_ latino_ and _hispanic _because it isn´t politically correct use color to identify races. (Except that we whites are very comfortable keeping the word "white" for us.)
> 
> I not sure what is the policically correct English word for "White American" is, much less, the politically correct Spanish word.
> 
> scotu


 
Scotu,

Thanks for your detailed explanation!

Sólo un pequeño detalle:

No es lo mismo un mexicano (u otro hispanoamericano) que un español. Los españoles son europeos, caucásicos o de raza blanca; los mexicanos pueden incluir desde los de origen europeo, pasando por los "mestizos" mezcla de caucásico y amerindio, hasta los de raza amerindia propiamente dicha.

EM


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## scotu

Eva Maria said:


> Scotu,
> 
> Thanks for your detailed explanation!
> 
> Sólo un pequeño detalle:
> 
> No es lo mismo un mexicano (u otro hispanoamericano) que un español. Los españoles son europeos, caucásicos o de raza blanca; los mexicanos pueden incluir desde los de origen europeo, pasando por los "mestizos" mezcla de caucásico y amerindio, hasta los de raza amerindia propiamente dicha.EM


 
But this gets confusing, for example an Argentinian of German decent comes to the USA, although he is German and therefore "white" when he gets to the US he is "hispanic or latino" and therefore now brown?

"amer-indian" Is not a frequently used word in the US but when used it refers only to the North America indians who are now called "native Americans" 

scotu


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## suso26

Y que es un amerindio me pregunto yo?


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## Eva Maria

scotu said:


> But this gets confusing, for example an Argentinian of German decent comes to the USA, although he is German and therefore "white" when he gets to the US he is "hispanic or latino" and therefore now brown?


 
Hahahahaha, Scotu!

You're right! 

It could also be an Argentinian from Italian or Spanish descent, too! And s/he'll be as "white" as a German!

Pero tampoco es lo mismo un argentino que un español! (I'll stop here!)

Why couldn't we consider and call all people just human beings regardless of anything else? It'll be much easier and less stressing!

EM


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## Eva Maria

suso26 said:


> Y que es un amerindio me pregunto yo?


 
Hello, Suso!

Look:

*- Amerindio* es el descendiente de cualquiera de los pueblos nativos de América (comúnmente exceptuando a los esquimales, cuyo origen étnico es distinto).

Saludos cordiales,

EM


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## scotu

lizguat said:


> I am wondering how to translate "White Americans" in a politically correct way. By "white americans" I mean people living in the USA that are not a part of minority groups.


 
After all this discussion I now suggest "*gringo*" as a politically correct Spanish word for "white American" At least that´s what we white Americans are called here in Mexico and while sometimes tourist take offense at this word, anyone who lives here knows that no offense is meant and therefore no offense is taken. 

scotu


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## wildan1

The most PC term I know is "Euro-American"--so PC that a lot of native English speakers wouldn't understand the term.

But different terms seem to be preferred in different contexts:

_Anglos_ when compared to Latinos/Hispanics
_Caucasians_ when compared to Asians
_Whites_ when compared to Blacks
_Mainstream_ when compared to ethnic
_WASPs_ when compared to Catholics or Jews!

it's a national obsession in the US, and far from resolved...


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## scotu

Eva Maria said:


> You're right!
> 
> Why couldn't we consider and *call all people just human beings*?
> It'll be much easier and less stressing! EM


 
Now you are the one who´s right! I have never understood why we have this passion for labeling and classifying our neighboors.

scotu


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## mnewcomb71

Before anyhting else, we need to understand what is being written.  The context can play an important role here in how to describe a non-minority American (and for the record, I detest the labels as American is American as in from a country).

Anyhow, in most forms that we fill out it is either:
Caucasian
White, Non-Hispanic, Other

Se oye mucho también:
White America
Black America


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## wildan1

mnewcomb71 said:


> Before anyhting else, we need to understand what is being written. The context can play an important role here in how to describe a non-minority American (and for the record, I detest the labels as American is American as in from a country).
> 
> Anyhow, in most forms that we fill out it is either:
> Caucasian
> White, Non-Hispanic, Other
> 
> Se oye mucho también:
> White America
> Black America


 
and... (yuck) _people of color_


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## suso26

Y es verdad, en Mexico hay mas diversidad de Razas, sin embargo, podríamos clasificar a los Españoles como Caucásicos de la misma forma que un Alemán o un Holandés? Creo que mas bien es el tipo Mediterraneo.


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## Eva Maria

suso26 said:


> Y es verdad, en Mexico hay mas diversidad de Razas, sin embargo, podríamos clasificar a los Españoles como Caucásicos de la misma forma que un Alemán o un Holandés? Creo que mas bien es el tipo Mediterraneo.


 
Querido Suso,

Tienes razón! Pero "mediterráneo", "nórdico", "eslavo", sólo serían "subrazas" dentro de la "raza blanca".

Por cierto, no resultaría de lo más ridículo un diálogo como:

- Hola, me llamo.... y soy caucásica.

- ¿Qué tal? Yo me llamo.... Pues yo soy caucásico-amerindio.

Jajajaja!

Besos,

EM


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## scotu

Does anyone disagree that *anglo (EN)  *_and _*gringo (ES) = white american*?

http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/dictionary/DictionaryResults.aspx?refid=1861585622

http://www.bartleby.com/61/42/A0304200.html


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## Arrius

_Caucasian_ was originally used widely in America, especially by the police in descriptions.  It is now creeping into BE, replacing _White_ and _European._ Surely the police are justified in describing a victim or suspect in some way to give an idea of that person's appearance, otherwise whatever confusion there may be, will be increased. Preferably a term that is readily understandable without causing offence.


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## Fantasmagórico

scotu said:


> Does anyone disagree that *anglo (EN)  *_and _*gringo (ES) = white american*?
> 
> http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/dictionary/DictionaryResults.aspx?refid=1861585622
> 
> http://www.bartleby.com/61/42/A0304200.html



 To me, "gringo" is OK in very informal contexts only.


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## heidita

wildan1 said:


> _Caucasians_ when compared to Asians
> ...


 
I don't know why you say that. Caucasian I would think is the term to use, as this is the one they use  (at least on TV!!) when describing a suspect: tall, Caucasian, long hair....
I have always understood it was a white person.


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## wildan1

scotu said:


> Does anyone disagree that *anglo (EN) *_and _*gringo (ES) = white american*?
> 
> http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/features/dictionary/DictionaryResults.aspx?refid=1861585622
> 
> http://www.bartleby.com/61/42/A0304200.html


 
Well your linked reference speaks of _Anglo_ in a Canadian context, but in my experience that is not really the term used there. 

It is _anglophone_, meaning native English-speaker without reference to skin or racial definition. You could be a black-skinned Jamaican but you are an anglophone. Or a dark-skinned Haitian or Réunionnais who is a francophone.

The distinctions made there are _francophone, anglophone_ and _allophone._ The latter is native speaker of a third language other than English or French: Hindi, Urdu, Portuguese, Yiddish, etc. to name a few of the frequent ones found there.


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## Outsider

lizguat said:


> I am wondering how to translate "White Americans" in a politically correct way.  By "white americans" I mean people living in the USA that are not a part of minority groups.


In my opinion, _estadunidenses blancos_ is perfect. (_Estadunidenses_ being more politically correct than _americanos_.)

I would advise against using _caucasianos_, which in Spanish is likely to have vaguely racialist connotations.

Just one more suggestion up for discussion.


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## Fantasmagórico

Outsider said:


> In my opinion, _estadunidenses blancos_ is perfect. (_Estadunidenses_ being more politically correct than _americanos_.)
> 
> I would advise against using _caucasianos_, which in Spanish is likely to have vaguely racialist connotations.
> 
> Just one more suggestion up for discussion.



 I agree; just one correction: estad*o*unidenses blancos.
  953 results in Google for "estadounidenses blancos".


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## Kibramoa

In the United States, for the 2000 Census the government used "blanco".*
*_Los grupos que se muestran en la pregunta acerca de la raza en el censo caen bajo los seis grupos raciales que son necesarios para el gobierno federal: *blanco*, negro o africano americano, indio americano o nativo de Alaska, asiático, y nativo de Hawaii y de otras islas del Pacífico.  ....Las personas de origen hispano pueden ser de cualquier raza..._​http://www.census.gov/


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## gdmarcus

I'm surprised that noone has mentioned the term "güero".  My Mexican friends use the term "güero" to mean a light-skinned, often light-haired, estadounidense.  They also use the term "gringo", but it just means an estadounidense, with less emphasis on physical appearance or "whiteness".


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## Arrius

An explanation of the term *gringo* is that, in the Texas Revolution that started in 1835 ("Remember the Alamo"), the Mexicans heard their enemies singing an old English song with the chorus, "_Green grow_ the rushes o'er" and used a corruption of the first two words as a general label for them. There were, incidentally, ethnic Mexicans on the Texan or Texian side too.


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## jolugega

La verdad es que todas estas definiciones tan " coloridas" implica un profundo racismo por parte de los que inventaron términos tan variopintos como " nativo americano", " caucásico", " afroamericano", etc. Creo que el que no es racista no tiene complejos en llamar a la gente por su color, sin que ello implique que haya algún tipo de connotación negativa : el que es blanco, pues blanco, el que es negro, pues negro, el que es amarillo, lo mismo, y no por eso se está insultando a nadie; vamos, digo yo. Todo este galimatías me recuerda a la manía antigua de llamar  a los negros, gente de color. Decía un chiste : sí, gente de color....negro. En fin, que en mi opinión no pasa nada por llamar a la gente por su color y el que se pica ajos come.


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## Eva Maria

jolugega said:


> La verdad es que todas estas definiciones tan " coloridas" implica un profundo racismo por parte de los que inventaron términos tan variopintos como " nativo americano", " caucásico", " afroamericano", etc. Creo que el que no es racista no tiene complejos en llamar a la gente por su color, sin que ello implique que haya algún tipo de connotación negativa : el que es blanco, pues blanco, el que es negro, pues negro, el que es amarillo, lo mismo, y no por eso se está insultando a nadie; vamos, digo yo. Todo este galimatías me recuerda a la manía antigua de llamar a los negros, gente de color. Decía un chiste : sí, gente de color....negro. En fin, que en mi opinión no pasa nada por llamar a la gente por su color y el que se pica ajos come.


 
Jolugega,

Totalmente de acuerdo contigo!

Esta manía de poner etiquetas a todo y clasificarlo todo: los altos, los gordos, los listos, los ricos, las mujeres, los negros,... ¡Qué pesadez! Parece que una/o no pueda ser ella/él misma/o!

Es cierto, ¿alguien puede ofenderse porque le llamen "indio" si efectivamente es un indio? ¿Qué diferencia hay con respecto a decirle "eres muy delgado" si es verdad que su naturaleza es muy delgada?

Creo que el problema no está en las palabras, sino en cómo se dicen. No es lo mismo decirle a alguien en un tono gracioso "tu piel es amarilla como un limón" que decir "sucio amarillo de mierda", no? Hay un abismo entre estas dos frases, que deberíamos llenar con tolerancia, respeto y consideración por los demás. 

Live and let live!

EM


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## Outsider

gdmarcus said:


> I'm surprised that noone has mentioned the term "güero".  My Mexican friends use the term "güero" to mean a light-skinned, often light-haired, estadounidense.  They also use the term "gringo", but it just means an estadounidense, with less emphasis on physical appearance or "whiteness".


Like _gringo_, _güero_ is an informal term. The original post specifically requested a politically correct phrase.


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## Isiltasuna

white america =* la américa anglosajóna*,  si es que quieres referirte a aquellos descendientes de irlandeses y británicos.

claro que si te refieres a la raza caucásica, descendientes de los pueblos anglosajones y mediterráneos (franceses, portuguese, españoles, italianos, irlandese, británicos, alemanes... es decir, Europa en general), yo me decantaría por el término *"la américa de raza blanca"* o caucáisca (a mí también me recuerda a series tipo CSI, Bones etc) y "la américa afroamericana".

más confuso me parece el término "hispanic-americans", o los latinos residentes en USA, un francés, portugués, italiano, o español que resida en eeuu también sería por ende un latino(dada la raíz linguística que nos une)

PD. yo los términos gringo y Güero no los utilizo, de hecho el término gringo sólo lo escucho en las películas o series cuando un mexicano se está refierieno a un yanki (estadounidense).


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## jolugega

Eva María : Me alegro de que estés de acuerdo conmigo, es que ya está bien de ser tan remilgados y " políticamente correctos" - frase, por cierto, que me repatea- y fariseos.


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## aurilla

Why not just say "the white majority"? That's what the "natives" use.


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## Eva Maria

jolugega said:


> Eva María : Me alegro de que estés de acuerdo conmigo, es que ya está bien de ser tan remilgados y " políticamente correctos" - frase, por cierto, que me repatea- y fariseos.


 
Jolugega,

No puedo estar más de acuerdo contigo!

Lo "políticamente correcto" (o lo "socialmente correcto") no sólo repatea, sino que directamente "rejoe"!

Todo esto me parece una manera de limitar, coartar, esclavizar a la persona, no dejándola ser ella misma (dentro de una "ética natural", desde luego), impidiéndole expresarse por ella misma. Atenta contra el libre albedrío del ser humano, confinándolo a unas reglas del juego falsas y falaces.

EM


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## scotu

aurilla said:


> Why not just say "the white majority"? That's what the "natives" use.


 
I disagree that "natives" use the term "the white majority".
I only see this term used by redneck natives when they are trying to maintain that minorities are ruining the country and that in a "democracy" the (white) majority should rule.

scotu


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## scotu

Arrius said:


> An explanation of the term *gringo* is that, in the Texas Revolution that started in 1835 ("Remember the Alamo"), the Mexicans heard their enemies singing an old English song with the chorus, "_Green grow_ the rushes o'er" and used a corruption of the first two words as a general label for them. There were, incidentally, ethnic Mexicans on the Texan or Texian  Tejas side too.


This orgin of the work gringo is mostly considered bunk due to the fact that "gringo" crops up in written Spanish quite a while before the war in question. 
The most likely source of "gringo" is the Spanish word "gringo" itself, which means "foreigner" or "unintelligible gibberish." The root of "gringo," in turn, is thought to have been "griego," Spanish for "Greek," often applied as slang to any foreigner because the Greek language has for centuries been a convenient metaphor for anything foreign and unintelligible. 

scotu


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## little harley

White Americans is used normally and commonly in news media. 
Mexicans = all citizens of Mexico no matter what the color or ethnic descent.
I always take note that in Mexico I have never heard the terms African-Mexican, Polish-Mexican, Asian-Mexican, etc...
Maybe they don't recognise some differences as being that important.
Eh?


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## scotu

little harley said:


> White Americans is used normally and commonly in news media.
> Mexicans = all citizens of Mexico no matter what the color or ethnic descent.
> I always take note that in Mexico I have never heard the terms African-Mexican, Polish-Mexican, Asian-Mexican, etc...
> Maybe they don't recognise some differences as being that important.
> Eh?


 
I think sometimes think that we use terms like "African-American, Italian-American, _whatever_-American", to imply that such hyphenated americans are not "pure" americans they are really half American and half whatever. (Note that "white American" does not have a hyphen)

scotu


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## Arrius

I did say _an_ explanation for *gringo*. I did not look it up in the Online Etymological Dictionary beforehand as my story was so charming, but now I see it agrees with your explanation,*scotu*:

_1849, from Mex.Sp. gringo, contemptuous word for "foreigner," from Sp. gringo "foreign, unintelligible talk, gibberish," perhaps ult. from griego "Greek." The "Diccionario Castellano" (1787) says gringo was used in Malaga for "anyone who spoke Spanish badly," and in Madrid for "the Irish."_


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## aurilla

The so-called mainstream America or predominant white population is identified as the "white majority". (Whether we like the term or not.) 

According to the Census, this will cease to be true by the year 2020.


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## Fernando

Since the original question asked for a translation for "white American", I would simply say "estadounidense anglosajón" or "estadounidense blanco", or to be precise, "estadounidense de origen europeo/de ascendencia europea". 

"Estadounidense blanco/de raza blanca" is ambiguous, since (at least in Spain) we would think that most Hispanics/Latinos are also white, except for those clearly of black or Amerindian ascendence.

And yes, I know that "anglosajón" is far from exact, since we leave out the Normans, the Celtics, Polish, Dutch and Germans (except the people from Sachsen.


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## little harley

I think sometimes think that we use terms like "African-American, Italian-American, _whatever_-American", to imply that such hyphenated americans are not "pure" americans they are really half American and half whatever. (Note that "white American" does not have a hyphen)
Scotu,
 I hadn't thought of it in that way before, but it may be so. I think some people need to identify some difference between themselves and others to strengthen their sense of identity. 

Little Harley, American (de ascendencia Mexicana)


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## wildan1

_African-American_ is a fairly recent term coined by the Rev. Jesse Jackson in the 1980s. His point was that calling people black focused on appearance and not origin. The term was widely embraced by the black community, and now has spread broadly to general usage, side-by-side with _black_ I would say.

The logical equivalent, _Euro-American_, is heard in some circles, but not widely used in the US. Most people do still say _whites, white Americans_


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## txpaddler

wildan1 said:


> _African-American_ is a fairly recent term coined by the Rev. Jesse Jackson in the 1980s. His point was that calling people black focused on appearance and not origin. The term was widely embraced by the black community, and now has spread broadly to general usage, side-by-side with _black_ I would say.
> 
> The logical equivalent, _Euro-American_, is heard in some circles, but not widely used in the US. Most people do still say _whites, white Americans_


 
Wikipedia reports that Jesse Jackson popularized the term African-American in the 1980s, but the coinage is much older, as documented in this entry from the Online Etymology Dictionary:

AfricaL. _Africa (terra)_ "African land," fem. of _Africus,_ from _Afer_ "an African." _Africanas_ "Africans" was in O.E. There are isolated instances of _African-American_ from at least 1863 (_Afro-American_ is attested from 1853), but the modern use is a re-invention first attested 1969 (in reference to the _African-American Teachers Association_) which became the preferred term in some circles for "U.S. black" (n. or adj.) by the late 1980s.


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## scotu

Arrius said:


> Mex.Sp. gringo, contemptuous word for foreigner


 
I take exception to the phrase describing gringo as a "contemptuous word" I heard it every day and it´s meaning is nothing more than foreigner. It may sometimes be used in a contemptous way but then it usually is acompanied with the word "pinche" as in "pinche gringo"scotu


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## Arrius

I take exception to the phrase describing gringo as a "contemptuous word" scotu
You had better complain to the Online Etymological Dictionary; I was just quoting. I think you could talk about _a nice gringo_ or _un gringo amable_, so it can't be too bad.


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