# 'ndrangheta



## Panpan

Ciao a tutti
Potreste spiegarmi cosa vol dire questa parole per favore? - 'ndrangheta

Il contesto è;

Sono migliaia gli studenti che si sono radunati questa mattina sul lungomare di Locri, in provincia di Reggio Calabria, per partecipare alla marcia della speranza e contro la 'ndrangheta, promossa dai sindaci di Napoli e di Cosenza, Rosa Russo Jervolino e Eva Catizone.

Grazie mille

Panpan


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## Elisa68

In genere viene tradotto come _Calabrian mafia._


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## Panpan

Grazie, mi ha fatto capire.


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## Silvia

I don't like the definition Calabrian mafia and I hope English speakers won't use it.


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## radiation woman

Does anyone actually have any information on the origins of the term "'ndrangheta"?  I'd be curious to know where the word comes from.


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## uinni

Hi!


			
				radiation woman said:
			
		

> Does anyone actually have any information on the origins of the term "'ndrangheta"? I'd be curious to know where the word comes from.


 
Maybe you'll be content with this info:

Etimo incerto; forse da una voce del greco di Calabria, corrispondente al gr. classico _andragathía_ 'coraggio, valore' (fonte GDI Garzanti)

Uinni


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## radiation woman

Thank you.  That's slightly satisfied my curiosity, although it would have been great to have someone from the area give their insight into the term and its origins.


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## Sierra

>> I don't like the definition Calabrian mafia and I hope English speakers won't use it.  <<

Hi Silvia, 

I've never even thought of "Calabrian mafia" as incorrect or offensive or anything. Could you explain more about why you don't like it?

Thanks.


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## Silvia

Mafia and andrangheta are two separate things, Calabria and mafia are two different things, Calabria and Sicily are two different regions (Sicily is an island), both historically and geographically.


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## Sierra

So one would have to say the "Sicilian mafia" and "Calabrian 'ndrangheta" to be accurate.  I always thought mafia was a generic term for organized crime.  Thanks for that.


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## Elisa68

Sierra said:
			
		

> So one would have to say the "Sicilian mafia" and "Calabrian 'ndrangheta" to be accurate. I always thought mafia was a generic term for organized crime. Thanks for that.


This is how the FBI web site translates them:
_...the Sicilian Mafia, Camorra or Neapolitan Mafia, 'Ndrangheta or Calabrian Mafia, and Sacra Corona Unita or United Sacred Crown. The FBI refers to them as "Italian Organized Crime" (IOC)._


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## uinni

Sierra said:
			
		

> So one would have to say the "Sicilian mafia" and "Calabrian 'ndrangheta" to be accurate. I always thought mafia was a generic term for organized crime. Thanks for that.


 
Saying that mafia is Sicilian or 'ndrangheta is Calabrian is to be redundant, for the names already imply the region (they come from).


Uinni


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## radiation woman

Sierra said:
			
		

> So one would have to say the "Sicilian mafia" and "Calabrian 'ndrangheta" to be accurate. I always thought mafia was a generic term for organized crime. Thanks for that.


 
Certainly in English the word "mafia" is used as a generic term to refer to organised crime, particularly criminals in Italy.  Also I found this definition in an Italian dictionary:

màfia: *màfia* 

_s. f._ solo _sing._ 

associazione clandestina tipica dell'Italia meridionale e soprattutto della Sicilia, fra persone che si organizzano per difendere i propri interessi al di fuori della legge e compiere atti criminali per interesse o vendetta personale e collettiva, ispirandosi a sistemi che affondano le loro radici in costumi atavici

est. ogni sorta di truffa o speculazione organizzata

scherz. ostentazione compiaciuta di qualche cosa.


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## uinni

radiation woman said:
			
		

> Certainly in English the word "mafia" is used as a generic term to refer to organised crime, particularly criminals in Italy. Also I found this definition in an Italian dictionary:
> 
> màfia: *màfia*
> 
> _s. f._ solo _sing._
> 
> associazione clandestina tipica dell'Italia meridionale e soprattutto della Sicilia, fra persone che si organizzano per difendere i propri interessi al di fuori della legge e compiere atti criminali per interesse o vendetta personale e collettiva, ispirandosi a sistemi che affondano le loro radici in costumi atavici
> 
> est. ogni sorta di truffa o speculazione organizzata
> 
> scherz. ostentazione compiaciuta di qualche cosa.


 
It is widespread also in other regions, but it is a Sicilian criminal organization.

Anyway we also hear of "Russian/Albanian mafia", for instance, in order to address criminal organizations that act in similar ways...
I guess we could conclude that the word "mafia" has become an antonomasia, and I understand that outside Italy, people may speak of "calabrese mafia" to explain what "'ndrangheta" is...

But as you have been educated about the two terms, you can use them in the proper way... 

Uinni


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## Sierra

That certainly was an education  

But just out of curiosity, non si dice/si sente mai *"la mafia calabrese"?  *


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## uinni

Sierra said:
			
		

> That certainly was an education
> 
> But just out of curiosity, non si dice/si sente mai *"la mafia calabrese"? *


 
Non penso che la mafia e la 'ndrangheta permettano (vicendevoli) sconfinamenti nella propria "giurisdizione"; ergo...

Uinni

Epperò: http://www.uonna.it/mafie-calabresi.htm


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## Don Zauker

Sierra said:
			
		

> That certainly was an education
> 
> But just out of curiosity, non si dice/si sente mai *"la mafia calabrese"? *


Yes, it is a widespread term in italian news.

You know, italian writers hates repetitions so they need synonims, even improper ones...


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## V52

uinni said:
			
		

> Hi!
> 
> 
> Maybe you'll be content with this info:
> 
> Etimo incerto; forse da una voce del greco di Calabria, corrispondente al gr. classico _andragathía_ 'coraggio, valore' (fonte GDI Garzanti)
> 
> Uinni



Very interesting  Uinni!  
In Tuscany,  (where I belong) we use the exclamation "ndranghete!"  to point out the locking of a door.  Do you think this can be related with the word "'ndrangheta"?  (in this case it could mean  a closed situation not allowed to strangers)
Vittorio


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## V52

I'm very sorry all the times they speak of this crime organizations, because i feel they are the most visible aspect of Italy abroad. Very sad...
Vittorio


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## uinni

Vittorio52 said:
			
		

> Very interesting Uinni!
> In Tuscany, (where I belong) we use the exclamation "ndranghete!" to point out the locking of a door. Do you think this can be related with the word "'ndrangheta"? (in this case it could mean a closed situation not allowed to strangers)
> Vittorio


 

Maddai! E' praticamente un'onomatopea!
Dati gli pseudo-valori su cui si fondano 'ste organizzazioni criminali, mi sembrerebbe più plausibile quel citato _andragathía_ .

Ma chi lo sa, che il capostipite non fosse invece qualche toscanaccio trapiantato colà!  


Uinni


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## V52

uinni said:
			
		

> Maddai! E' praticamente un'onomatopea!
> Dati gli pseudo-valori su cui si fondano 'ste organizzazioni criminali, mi sembrerebbe più plausibile quel citato _andragathía_ .
> 
> Ma chi lo sa, che il capostipite non fosse invece qualche toscanaccio trapiantato colà!
> 
> 
> Uinni



I agree. Non credo che sia un'onomatopea, ma una derivazione toscana dal termine calabrese, che sicuramente proviene dalla radice greca che tu hai indicato.

Not an onomatopoeia, but maybe a tuscan derivation from the calabrian word, which,as you pointed out, definitely comes from,the greek root IMHO. (As you know in Calabria there are still nowadays places where they speak Albanian and a sort of  greek language the "Grecanico") 
Vittorio


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## uinni

Vittorio52 said:
			
		

> I agree. Non credo che sia un'onomatopea, ma una derivazione toscana dal termine calabrese, che sicuramente proviene dalla radice greca che tu hai indicato.
> 
> Not an onomatopoeia, but maybe a tuscan derivation from the calabrian word, which,as you pointed out, definitely comes from,the greek root IMHO. (As you know in Calabria there are still nowadays places where they speak Albanian and a sort of greek language the "Grecanico")
> Vittorio


 
In intended to say that "ndranghete!" referred to the locking of a door recalls the noise made by a (heavy iron) lock when locked.

Uinni


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## V52

uinni said:
			
		

> In intended to say that "ndranghete!" referred to the locking of a door recalls the noise made by a (heavy iron) lock when locked.
> 
> Uinni


Definitely, do you think this could be a real casuality? 
V


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## Manuel_M

grappa said:
			
		

> Thank you Manuel I could not find the word " 'ndrangheta". Is it dialect?


 
I think it was originally a dialectical term, but most Italians nowadays refer to the Calabrian mafia that way.


Edit: Actually, Uinni pointed out in another thread that the term 'Calabrian mafia' is technically wrong, since *Mafia *is the term which should be reserved for organised crime based in Sicily.  But I think that Calabrian mafia would help non-Italians understand very quicky the meaning of *'ndrangheta*.


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## grappa

We use mafia as slang in my part of the united states to indicate any goupe of people from a town. For example the "Mokane mafia" refers to a group of men from the small missouri river town of Mokane who play golf at the club in Fulton missouri


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## Tellure

- VECCHIO THREAD -

Mi è stato detto che "the Mob" può essere una traduzione di 'ndrangheta e volevo, se è il caso, una vostra conferma.

Grazie mille,
R.


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## tsoapm

Non si dice “le mafie” però in italiano qualche volta? Mi viene da pensare che se si usa così la parola, si può considerare 'ndrangheta una delle “mafie”, no? 

@Tellure – I think in English you understand “the mafia” from “the mob”. I think this translation is an American one. Wiser heads than mine will probably be able to tell you all about it.


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## Tellure

TSoaPM said:


> @Tellure – I think in English you understand “the mafia” from “the mob”. I think this translation is an American one. Wiser heads than mine will probably be able to tell you all about it.


Ok, allora mi hanno detto male. Grazie mille, TSoaPM!


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## tsoapm

But in English I think we’re less careful about distinguishing between all of them anyway… I think we tend to think of them all as different “mafias”, despite the evident controversy. So you could probably use it.


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## Tellure

TSoaPM said:


> But in English I think we’re less careful about distinguishing between all of them anyway… I think we tend to think of them all as different “mafias”, despite the evident controversy. So you could probably use it.


In effetti, mi rendo conto che per voi non fa molta differenza distinguere tra mafia e 'ndrangheta. Grazie ancora.


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## tsoapm

Prego. 

Mark.


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## london calling

The Mob would indicate the US Mafia to me, although I think it's used to mean organised crime these days. 

So where's the Vth Cavalry got to? No Americans on-line?


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## joanvillafane

(bugle call in background)....
The Mob is definitely used to refer to the U.S. Mafia. And just to confirm, I don't think the distinction between the Sicilians and the Calabrese is finely understood here.  The word 'ndrangheta is not commonly seen in print.  I don't even know how to pronounce it! 

Edit:  P.S.  "Organized crime" has no nationality.  We also hear of the Russian mob, the Colombian mob, etc.


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## Tellure

joanvillafane said:


> (bugle call in background)....
> The Mob is definitely used to refer to the U.S. Mafia. And just to confirm, I don't think the distinction between the Sicilians and the Calabrese is finely understood here.  The word 'ndrangheta is not commonly seen in print.  I don't even know how to pronounce it!
> 
> Edit:  P.S.  "Organized crime" has no nationality.  We also hear of the Russian mob, the Colombian mob, etc.



Come al solito london ci ha visto giusto.  Grazie infinite, joanvillafane, per l'esauriente ed utilissimo contributo.


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