# verb + 는지



## idialegre

I am translating a Korean pop song and having trouble understanding the grammar of:몰랐죠 얼마나 사랑했는지

I am fairly sure it means "I didn't know, did I, how much I loved you..." but I don't really understand the usage of 는지 here. Can someone help?

감사합니다!


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## kenjoluma

Sometimes, for some artistic reason, word order can be switched, which eventually leads to verb positioned in the beginning of the sentence.

It should be '얼마나 사랑했는지 몰랐죠'.

It could be roughly translated to:

(I) didn't realize how much (I) loved (you/him/her).


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## idialegre

Kenjoluma, thank you for your reply to my question. However, it is not the word order that puzzles me, but the exact grammatical content of the suffix 는지. I'm just learning Korean, so I guess I haven't learned that suffix yet, but I have asked a few native speakers, and none of them has been able to explain it to me cogently. Or to put it another way, what is the difference between 얼마나 사랑했는지 and 얼마나 사랑했어요?
Thank you and any others who are nice enough to help!


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## FrankYi

Hi,

what is the difference between 얼마나 사랑했는지 and 얼마나 사랑했어요?


얼마나 사랑했어요?  this is simply a question. 

얼마나 사랑했는지    this phrase need more to complete a sentence. 

 that will be a predicative.

as kenjoluma mentioned, 몰랐죠 얼마나 사랑했는지 has switched word order.

I put them common order again.

 얼마나 사랑했는지 몰랐죠.

 As you see above, 사랑했는지 is followed by a predicative(모르다/몰랐죠).


 In conclusion, ㄴ+지(는지) can be expected to be used to make verb into OBJECT in the sentence.
 but, this is just one of ways. I guess you probably did not learn this in your book or from your teacher. this is too complicated problem even for Korean  to explain. 
 and also, it simultaneouly contains the sense of past tense. 

 사랑하다-> 사랑했다 (tense changed. but still a predicative )
      ----> 사랑했는지  ( can be a objective)

  As far as i learned, this procedure is pretty similar to the usage of to-infinitive in English.

   I want play(x)  I want to play. 


 As a native speaker of Korean, I also have trouble in explaining clearly how this works. Let me give some examples more. I hope this will be helpful for you.



(나는) Paul이 어제 책을 샀는지 모르겠다

(나는) 가격일 얼마인지 모르겠다.

(나는 )미국 대통령의 이름이 무엇인지 모르겠다.

(나는) 그곳에서 무엇을 파는지 모르겠다.



 While making some example sentences, it occurred to me that 는지(or ㄴ+지) always goes well with the verb 모르다 and question words.


 For your better understanding, let me analyze one of them.

 (나는) Paul이 어제 책을 샀는지 모르겠다.

  1) (나는) 모르겠다.
  2) Paul이 어제 책을 샀다.  

  (나는)  _____2_____   모르겠다.


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## Askalon

I'm not very good with Korean, but if it's any help I can try to explain how my teacher taught it.

There are actually a whole boatload of 지's from the way I've learned it, but I'm assuming this is what my teacher refers to as "the wonder 지".  Basically, to the extent I've learned in class, we would usually translate it as "if" or "whether."  And it would always be following by a verb that somehow expressed uncertainty or wonder: 모르다, 알다, 궁금하다, etc.

I'm guessing this is the same usage of it, except that the usage probably goes beyond the basic examples I've seen, where the translation to "if" or "whether" works in the sentence.  Here, that wouldn't work ("I didn't know if/whether how much I loved you" isn't grammatical, obviously).  But it seems like it's the same idea.


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## idialegre

Askalon and Frank Yi, thank you both very much for your help. I kind of think I understand, and I hate to try your patience, but just a few quick questions:

1) In the example (나는) Paul이 어제 책을 샀는지 모르겠다, I assume this translates as, "(I) don't know if Paul bought a book yesterday." Is that correct?

2.) If the last word were changed and we had
 (나는) Paul이 어제 책을 샀는지 모르겠어요
how would that change the meaning?

3.) Would (나는) Paul이 어제 책을 샀는지 알아요 be correct as "(I) know Paul bought a book yesterday"?

Thanks so much, sorry for all my questions!


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## Askalon

Again, take my comments with a grain of salt, but:

The difference between (1) and (2) is just the sentence ending (i.e. conjugation of the verb).  (2) is how you would say it normally, if you were talking to a person that you need to use respectful speech with.  (1) is just sort of a default conjugation--it doesn't have any level of respect for the person you're talking to, so you'd use it in situations where you're not really talking to anyone (e.g. in diaries, newspaper articles, talking or thinking to yourself, or in example sentences like Frank Yi used).  It doesn't change the meaning of the sentence, but each one is used in different situations.

I'm not sure about (3), a fluent speaker will have to answer that.  If it is grammatical, then I would think it'd translate to "I know whether Paul bought a book yesterday"--which isn't saying he did or he didn't, just that you know.


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## FrankYi

Askalon's answers are all correct.

Regarding the last question, i will add some my opinion to it.


(나는) Paul이 어제 책을 샀는지 알아요. 
I know Paul bought a book yesterday.

Although your translation is very good based on the measing of the example sentences, the helping article(조사 in Korean and Japanese) is used incorrectly.

 I'm not sure there is any particular rules in that, but "는지" does not go well with "알아요."

  anyway, to make it comfortable for listeners, i'd like to change "샀는지" into "샀다는 것을".


 Paul이 어제 책을 샀다는 것을 알아요. 



 Lastly, I'd like to ask all a question.

 "I know whether Paul bought a book yesterday" 

 This sentence is a commonly-used form by native English speakers?


  As English learner, i would translate it the same way above if i should do.
  but, it's pretty strange to me that "whether" exists along with verbs which have the meaning of "certainty"-- know , be sure -- instead of "uncertainty" 




 I wish what I'd like to say would be understood well


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## Askalon

> "I know whether Paul bought a book yesterday"
> 
> This sentence is a commonly-used form by native English speakers?



Yes, constructions like that are perfectly fine in English and are commonly used.

If I'm understanding correctly then, it appears in Korean that 는지 can only be used when the speaker is actually uncertain of something, unlike the usage of if/whether in English.

I do recall my teacher using examples with 알다, however.  It just seems it can't be used with 알다 to say the speaker actually knows something, as then there wouldn't be the uncertainly that's necessary when you use 는지.

I looked through my notes and found these examples:

(1) 누가 그 일을 하는지 알고 싶다. (I want to know who did this work.)

(2) 어디 있는지 알아요? (Do you know where he/she is?)


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## idialegre

Thank you both very much for the answers. I understand it now - at least as well as my current knowledge of Korean allows.

Just to clear things up for FrankYi: "I know whether Paul bought a book yesterday" is certainly fine English, but I think sentences like that don't really appear very often. It indicates that the speaker knows the answer to the question "Did Paul buy a book yesterday?", but it does not indicate whether the answer is yes or no, i.e., whether Paul did or did not buy a book.

Imagine this conversation:

A: Is Susan engaged?
B: Maybe.
A. You mean she's not engaged?
B. I didn't say that.
A. So what's the story?
B. Maybe she is, maybe she isn't.
A. Well do you even KNOW whether she's engaged?
B: Yes, I know whether she's engaged.  (Implied: But I'm not telling you!)


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