# Urdu and Punjabi: Chavli maarna



## Cilquiestsuens

Gulaabi Urdu is the name given to their Urdu by Punjabi speakers....

*Chavli* is something like non sense, uT paTaang, bakwaas (coming from Punjabi chavval = Paagal, Bewaqoof).

My questions : Has any one heard this used as an Urdu word ? Second question : I am not even sure chavlii is a Punjabi word (I actually think only chavval is, chavli seems a typical gulaabi word...) Can any one confirm....?


----------



## panjabigator

I didn't know this word before, so I'll ask my parents about it in the morning.

My dictionary defines <chavaL> (retroflex _laam_> as "mean, low, base, shameless, undependable."  It also lists a word, which appears to be a derivative: <chavaLpuNaa>- "meanness, baseness."

I've heard one of my _chachis_ describe Urdu as a _gulaabii zubaan_.


----------



## Cilquiestsuens

panjabigator said:


> I didn't know this word before, so I'll ask my parents about it in the morning.
> 
> My dictionary defines <chavaL> (retroflex _laam_> as "mean, low, base, shameless, undependable." It also lists a word, which appears to be a derivative: <chavaLpuNaa>- "meanness, baseness."
> 
> I've heard one of my _chachis_ describe Urdu as a _gulaabii zubaan_.


 

I've heard it repeatedly as chavval (with a clearly geminated 'v') and rather in the meaning of paagal and something like that.

I also wonder where this gulaabi urdu expression comes from.....


----------



## BP.

I've heard the term _Gulaabi Urdu_ many times, and each time it was being used to refer to the Urdu accent of some Pashtuns. When I say 'some', I mean to exclude those who've spoken Urdu among Urduphones all their lives and have lost that FOB accent. Certainely no Delhi Yousufzais or Rohilas.

Dari speakers speak with a similar same _Gulaabi_ accent.

I'm hypothesizing the word _gulaabi_ came from the _gulaabi jaara_: mild/fresh temperatures these people have in their towns almost all year round.

Cilko, never heard of any of the Panjabi accents as _Gulaabi_. And HAVE heard _chaaval_ but until a few minutes ago didn't know what it meant.


----------



## Cilquiestsuens

Funny, BP, never heard gulaabi Urdu used about Pakhtuns, who definitely have a distinct accent in Urdu (I think Urdu wale find this accent irritating). Is it an expression used in Karachi...

I've definitely heard gulaabi Urdu used by educated Urdu / Punjabi speakers and even writers to describe in a jest their accent or the specific Urdu they use.


----------



## BP.

_Gulaabi lehja_ is supposed to be cute.

I read _gulaabi_ in the context I reported, only once or twice, and that wasn't by any well-known writer.


----------



## panjabigator

Just encountered this one:


> Dhur dhur chaval na vaja



Any more info on this word?


----------



## Faylasoof

Cilquiestsuens said:


> Gulaabi Urdu is the name given to their Urdu by Punjabi speakers....
> 
> *Chavli* is something like non sense, uT paTaang, bakwaas (coming from Punjabi chavval = Paagal, Bewaqoof).
> 
> My questions : Has any one heard this used as an Urdu word ? Second question : I am not even sure chavlii is a Punjabi word (I actually think only chavval is, chavli seems a typical gulaabi word...) Can any one confirm....?



Well, چاولی_ ch*aa*vlii_ is used in Urdu but its usage is different.  We use چاولی to mean  a سوپ_ suup_ = غلہ افشاں_ ghallah afshaa.n _= A kind of basket for tossing threshed grain to separate the kernel form the husk. Some also call it a  چھاج_chhaaj_. 

 Not sure of the etymology of چاولی but it could be Prakrit, Awadhi, etc. May be Punjabi but the usage is very different.


----------



## Koozagar

Chavli marna is often used in Pakistan by Punjabis while speaking both Urdu and Punjabi. It originally is a Punjabi expression but as is the case in Pakistan, Punjabi and Urdu often diffuse into each other. When someone does something extremely stupid and cheap or something that is idiotic beyond your imagination you say:

"yeh kiya chavali(or chaval) mari hay" or in Punjabi " ay ki chavali(or chaval) mari aay"

A mean, cheap person is referred to as chaval.


----------



## Faylasoof

Koozagar said:


> Chavli marna is often used in Pakistan by Punjabis while speaking both Urdu and Punjabi. It originally is a Punjabi expression but as is the case in Pakistan, Punjabi and Urdu often diffuse into each other. When someone does something extremely stupid and cheap or something that is idiotic beyond your imagination you say:
> 
> "yeh kiya chavali(or chaval) mari hay" or in Punjabi " ay ki chavali(or chaval) mari aay"
> 
> A mean, cheap person is referred to as chaval.



I understand the Punjabi usage. Just that in Urdu, as I say above,  _chaavlii_ has a totally different meaning. I don't think they are related and assume the Punjabi word is written as چولی_ ch*a*vlii_ instead of the Urdu چاولی_ ch*aa*vlii_. Is this correct?


----------



## Koozagar

I believe you are right FLS. Punjabi word doesn't have 'alif' between 'chay' and 'vow'. they are different words. I agree.


----------



## panjabigator

Koozagar said:


> Chavli marna is often used in Pakistan by Punjabis while speaking both Urdu and Punjabi. It originally is a Punjabi expression but as is the case in Pakistan, Punjabi and Urdu often diffuse into each other. When someone does something extremely stupid and cheap or something that is idiotic beyond your imagination you say:
> 
> "yeh kiya chavali(or chaval) mari hay" or in Punjabi " ay ki chavali(or chaval) mari aay"
> 
> A mean, cheap person is referred to as chaval.



Wonderful!  Thanks for the confirmation.

Is it spelled چاول؟ Is the _vao_ gemminated (i.e., does it have a _tashdeed_)?  I suspect it does, because it would be hard to say without one.


----------



## Koozagar

چول with tashdeed on و and چولی with zabar on چand tashdeed and zabar on و


----------



## panjabigator

دھنواد جی!


----------



## Faylasoof

Koozagar said:


> چول with tashdeed on و and چولی with zabar on چand tashdeed and zabar on و



 OK! So they are with a _shaddah_ and written like this : چَوَّل  &  چَوَّلی .

Many thanks, koozagar!


----------



## Koozagar

my pleasure


----------



## Qureshpor

*I would say that the definition provided by PG is the original meaning of the word (i.e. kamiinah) but it has become to mean, as explained by Koozagar, someone "idiotic". It is a feminine noun. As for the tashdiid, I would say only half a tashdiid!

 "chaval" "chavlaaN"/"chavliyaaN" maardaa e


*


----------

