# If you say so....



## JONO.

How do you express this in Russian. For example: 

Man 1: Hey Jack, you're a smart guy! 

Man 2: Sure/If you say so!


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## Explorer41

- Джек, а ты умный парень!
- Конечно!/А ты думал?!

Of course, there are plenty expressions for that, all with different meanings, and I'm not sure which of them is the closest to the English expression.

"Пожалуй, так", "несомненно", "согласен", "раз ты так говоришь" (a literal translation, but maybe it's the farthermost from the English expression - it's very... conditional, and reads literally). Some may remember the Bible and reply so: "ты говоришь..." ;-)


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## Maroseika

Some more variants:
Тебе видней.
Как скажешь.


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## Albertovna

What are we translating, "sure" or "if you say so"?
Sure = А то ж! Ну ещё бы!


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## Maroseika

Albertovna said:


> What are we translating, "sure" or "if you say so"?


We are translating the phrase in the thread title.


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## Explorer41

Albertovna said:


> What are we translating, "sure" or "if you say so"?
> Sure = А то ж! Ну ещё бы!


*Albertovna*, this is (partly) the cause of my doubts. I was thinking what does "if you say so" exactly mean. And also I was thinking why did *JONO.* post that "Sure". So I decided both questions have one answer: "Sure" is the synonym (in some way or another) of "if you say so", and *JONO.* gave it to us so that we could understand him better. And I gave my reply thinking about it -- the Russian expressions "Конечно!" and "А ты думал?!" are more or less synonyms. Now my question is: was I wrong?


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## Carrot Ironfoundersson

A think that _как скажешь_(with a smile) is the best option.


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## Albertovna

Carrot Ironfoundersson said:


> A think that _как скажешь_(with a smile) is the best option.


Yes. Also, as Maroseika said, "тебе видн́ее/видней".


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## JONO.

Thanks guys 
And I think that Sure and If you say so has the same implications.


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## Albertovna

JONO. said:


> And I think that Sure and If you say so has the same implications.


I do not think so. "Sure" and "конечно" imply absolute certainty, whereas "[All right,] if you say so" and "Тебе виднее"/"Как скажешь" imply a degree of uncertainty so that you leave the final decision to your interlocutor.


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## Explorer41

*Albertovna*, I'm not sure. Because:
1) there are different ways to say "if you say so";
2) there may be different thoughts behind it. For example, that: "if it weren't true, you wouldn't say so! And now, as you say so, it's an additional evidence I'm smart, very smart! Even you say so, not only others and I". This way of thinking is called "proof by contradiction", "доказательство от противного". ;-)

So, I will agree with you only if you are absolutely sure in what you are saying. Otherwise, I will tend to agree with the native


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## morzh

Maroseika said:


> Some more variants:
> Тебе видней.
> Как скажешь.




Exactly.


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## ahvalj

Also, the shortest variant (though somewhat limited stylistically): «дык!» ,-)
— Джек, а ты умный парень!
— Дык!


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## Carrot Ironfoundersson

ahvalj said:


> Also, the shortest variant (though somewhat limited stylistically): «дык!» ,-)
> — Джек, а ты умный парень!
> — Дык!



Без "ну" как-то не смотрится...


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## morzh

ahvalj said:


> Also, the shortest variant (though somewhat limited stylistically): «дык!» ,-)
> — Джек, а ты умный парень!
> — Дык!



No, won't do. You use a social group slang (Митьки), and "if you say so" is not a dialect by any stretch of imagination.
It is the same as if someone translated "you are a stunning woman" as "ты - клевая кадра!"


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## ahvalj

morzh said:


> No, won't do. You use a social group slang (Митьки), and "is you say so" is not a dialect by any stretch of imagination.


Well, this word is much older than Митьки. Moreover, I have never heard anybody of this movement (though Шагин himself is a stepson of my late chief...). This word is indeed somewhat emphatic, but not dramatically more so than most of the variants suggested above, I would say.


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## morzh

ahvalj said:


> Well, this word is much older than Митьки. Moreover, I have never heard anybody of this movement (though Шагин himself is a stepson of my late chief...). This word is indeed somewhat emphatic, but not dramatically more so than most of the variants suggested above, I would say.



And again, you are wrong. "Дык" as an interjection is indeed old enough, but became very popular in this very form "Дык!" (as a assertive response) in 80-s, used by "Митьки". You might've not heard it from them, but you heard it from someone who heard it from someone, who eventually heard it from them.
"Дык!" simply was not in use in THIS PARTICULAR role before the mid-80s.


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## ahvalj

Well, I don't know of course the exact modality the original English phrase conveys. In Russian we have a range of variants presented above, «дык» being a more emotional member of it. Though, again, it may be too strong for the suggested text — I have never been to an English-speaking country to judge.


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## ahvalj

morzh said:


> It is the same as if someone translated "you are a stunning woman" as "ты - клевая кадра!"


«Дык» is not in this category anymore (if it ever used to), it is a much more neutral word nowadays. If Митьки indeed were responsible for revitalizing this lexeme, it has already lost any associations with their way of speaking. A bit of democracy ©:
http://www.google.ru/search?client=...oe=UTF-8&redir_esc=&ei=kuAJT_PdH-P44QTdoq3fAw


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## Explorer41

Carrot Ironfoundersson said:


> Без "ну" как-то не смотрится...


А куда Вы хотите вставить "ну"?


morzh said:


> No, won't do. You use a social group slang (Митьки), and "if you say so" is not a dialect by any stretch of imagination.
> It is the same as if someone translated "you are a stunning woman" as "ты - клевая кадра!"


I don't agree, it is absolutely not the same. At least for me.
First, the word "дык" by itself makes no connotation to "Митьки", at least in my mind. Maybe because I born later. Actually, the feature of "Митьки" is not the use of the word "дык". The feature is that "Митьки" used the words "дык", "ёлы-палы" and some another third word, which I don't remember, only. And didn't use other words (according to what I heard of them -- I didn't hear that much). So, if one says "Дык, ёлы-палы", it reminds of "Митьки". If one just says "дык", it doesn't. In my case -- it doesn't at all.

An example:
- Так ты умный парень, Джек!
- Дык, ёлы-палы!  (the accent is on the first word).
It is "Митьки".

PS: I asked an older person, again. The third word was "оттягиваться".


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## morzh

ahvalj said:


> I have never been to an English-speaking country to judge.



I have 

"If you say so" has many-many meanings.

One of them is "You are entitled to your opinion", that is "I don't care but I'll take your word for it". Or "I'll go along with this, even though I don't like it".

Example:

- Jeannie is a hottie!
- If you say so....

The meaning of it is: - Джинни - клевая девочка. - Ну, тебе видней. (Как скажешь). 
That is, in my opinion she is so-so, but I won't argue with you.


Now, 1) Дык - is assertive, and  "if you say so" is more of "I don't mind you saying so, but it is not what I think".
So not only it is not a good equivalent emotionally, it also is not a good equivalent at all, as "Dyk" is more or less enthusiastic assertion "Of course, I agree!".


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## Carrot Ironfoundersson

> А куда Вы хотите вставить "ну"?



Спереди. При этом выражение лица должно быть самодовольным.


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## morzh

JONO. said:


> How do you express this in Russian. For example:
> 
> Man 1: Hey Jack, you're a smart guy!
> 
> Man 2: Sure/If you say so!



Now, this particular case:

in Man2 answer "Sure" and "If you say so" are not exactly the same.

If I said "sure" as the response, I either 1) am very cocky and accept the praise as well-deserved, or 2) I am smirking as I I am saying that, and I am thus turning the compliment to a little humorous situation - I am not taking myself all too seriously.

If I said "If you say so" I mean "Well, I am not supposed to tout my own horn, but if it is your opinion, I will go along with it". 
Or, maybe, the slash here is unneeded, and it is "Sure, if you say so" - then it is the same as above.


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## morzh

Carrot Ironfoundersson said:


> Спереди. При этом выражение лица должно быть самодовольным.



"Дык!" may be used with or without "ну".


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## Carrot Ironfoundersson

morzh said:


> "Дык!" may be used with or without "ну".



Не спорю. Но сам употребляю только с "ну". Привычка-с.


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## Albertovna

Explorer41 said:


> I'm not sure


Neither am I. Maybe, "if you say so" is polysemantic. We should ask a native speaker. I am not even sure if the Russian equivalents are polysemantic.


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## Syline

My opinion, or better say perception: 
Sure - конечно, разумеется (a person readily agrees, sounds as a braggart)
As you say so - как скажешь (a person's answer is more reserved, modest)  

That is of course without consideration of possible irony, sarcasm and others.


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## rusita preciosa

Syline said:


> Sure - конечно, разумеется (a person readily agrees, sounds as a braggart)


I absolutely disagree. To me there is no doubt that both answers express doubt in what the first person said. Maroseika's answer in post #3 is the most appropriate.


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## Albertovna

rusita preciosa said:


> both answers express doubt


Always or in this context?


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## rusita preciosa

Albertovna said:


> Always or in this context?


In the context.


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## Syline

rusita preciosa said:


> I absolutely disagree. To me there is no doubt that both answers express doubt in what the first person said.


I've mentioned irony, sarcasm and other possible implications while speaking about meaning by default.


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## JONO.

it is the 'sure' that is in the sarcastic sense.


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## morzh

Explorer41 said:


> А куда Вы хотите вставить "ну"?
> 
> I don't agree, it is absolutely not the same. At least for me.
> First, the word "дык" by itself makes no connotation to "Митьки", at least in my mind. Maybe because I born later. Actually, the feature of "Митьки" is not the use of the word "дык". The feature is that "Митьки" used the words "дык", "ёлы-палы" and some another third word, which I don't remember, only. And didn't use other words (according to what I heard of them -- I didn't hear that much). So, if one says "Дык, ёлы-палы", it reminds of "Митьки". If one just says "дык", it doesn't. In my case -- it doesn't at all.
> 
> An example:
> - Так ты умный парень, Джек!
> - Дык, ёлы-палы!  (the accent is on the first word).
> It is "Митьки".
> 
> PS: I asked an older person, again. The third word was "оттягиваться".



Again (have to repeat myself).
(Also have to state that I was a 20-something when Mit'ki movement started, so I watched both advent and decline of the usage. I am 50 now).
1. I never said "Дъiк" was invented by Mut'ki. "Dyk" is folksy version of already a spoken form "Дак", which is a version of "Так".
- Так я ж ему сказал!
- Дак я ж ему сказал!
- Дъiк я ж ему сказал!

2. Now, usage as a standalone response "Дъiк!", with or without "Ну" and "Елъi-палъ", was invented by Mit'ki, or at least became widely known due to them. People, who had no relation to Mit'ki started using it. I started using it. Just 'cause it sounded funny.

3. Now, here, in Wikipedia, someone quoted the "stereotypical" conversation of Mit'ki. (the article about the Mitki slang)
http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Митьки

— Дык!
— Ну, ёлы-палы!…
— Дык!
— Ёлы-палы!

As you can see, "Дък" has no "ну". Nor does it have to.


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## Explorer41

Well, I'll repeat myself too  (why not to?)


morzh said:


> 2. Now, usage as a standalone response "Дъiк!", with or without "Ну" and "Елъi-палъ", was invented by Mit'ki, or at least became widely known due to them. People, who had no relation to Mit'ki started using it. I started using it. Just 'cause it sounded funny.


Well, I didn't say anything about invention of the phrase or its usage. I just said that, specifically for me, *ahvalj*'s usage of "дык" makes no connotation to "Митьки", or this connotation is very little and doesn't affect much its possible modern usage. By the way, "Митьки", as far as I understand, did not go very far from the traditional culture mainstream, and thus that connotations, being so little, are not so important as well. So the word "дык" is just "просторечное", and nothing more. Of course, when one says "дык, ёлы-палы... оттягиваться!", it will be a joke with the goal to remind about "Митьки"; it is another thing.


morzh said:


> Again (have to repeat myself).
> (Also have to state that I was a 20-something when Mit'ki movement started, so I watched both advent and decline of the usage. I am 50 now).
> 1. I never said "Дъiк" was invented by Mut'ki. "Dyk" is folksy version of already a spoken form "Дак", which is a version of "Так".
> - Так я ж ему сказал!
> - Дак я ж ему сказал!
> - Дъiк я ж ему сказал!
> 
> [...]
> 
> 3. Now, here, in Wikipedia, someone quoted the "stereotypical" conversation of Mit'ki. (the article about the Mitki slang)
> http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9C%...8C%D0%BA%D0%B8
> 
> — Дык!
> — Ну, ёлы-палы!…
> — Дык!
> — Ёлы-палы!
> 
> As you can see, "Дък" has no "ну". Nor does it have to.


I don't know, to whom you answer. Seemingly, to me; but I didn't say anything neither about the invention of "дык", nor about "ну".
Anyway, thank you for the derivation of "дык" from "так". It's interesting.


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