# Elle est tout jeune pour être mariée.



## johnL

I think this is what I'm hearing in my French lesson. From the context, I know that they're saying, "She is too young to be married." But I'm not sure I'm hearing all the words correctly, and they didn't dwell on it because it wasn't the point of the lesson. I'm just wondering if I "guessed" correctly.


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## Aupick

My guess: 

Elle est trop jeune pour être mariée.
_She is too young to get married._


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## Cath.S.

Aupick said:
			
		

> My guess:
> 
> Elle est trop jeune pour être mariée.
> _She is too young to get married._


Yup, it most certainly is _elle est *trop* jeune_, Aupick.
But 
_to get married = pour se marier_
_to be married = pour être marié(e)._


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## johnL

Thanks, guys. Guess I have to settle for "close!"


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## Starcreator

What about "Elle est trop jeune d'être mariée." Est-ce plus correct?


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## Anne345

"Elle est trop jeune d'être mariée." is incorrect.


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## Kelly B

Could "tout jeune" be used to say "she is awfully/very young"?


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## Agnès E.

Oui, par exemple si l'on est surpris par sa jeunesse.

J'ouvre une porte, je vois Kelly B. Je croyais que Kelly B. avait 75 ans et elle en a 17 ! Je m'écris*E* : "Mais Kelly est toute jeune, c'est incroyable !"


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## Cath.S.

Agnes E. said:
			
		

> Oui, par exemple si l'on est surpris par sa jeunesse.
> 
> J'ouvre une porte, je vois Kelly B. Je croyais que Kelly B. avait 75 ans et elle en a 17 ! Je m'écris : "Mais Kelly est toute jeune, c'est incroyable !"


Tu t'écris à toi-même, ma poule ? Et nous, alors, on compte pour du beurre ?  

_écrire => j'écris_
_s'écrier => je m'écrie_

Blague à part, si tu croyais qu'elle avait 17 ans, et qu'en fait elle en a 75, tu ne t'écrierais pas « Mais Kelly est toute vieille, c'est incroyable ! ».
On emploie tout jeune, tout petit, mais pas "tout vieux" ni "tout grand", _et je ne sais pas pourquoi !_
Qu'en penses-tu, Agnès ? Qu'en pensez-vous, les autres ? Pouvez-vous m'éclairer ?


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## Agnès E.

C'est vrai, l'on a tendance à utiliser "tout" suivi d'un adjectif suggérant l'attendrissement (toute jeune, toute mignonne, toute petite, toute ronde, toute menue, par exemple). Non ?!?


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## johnL

Huh? What? Hey, what's that mean?

Anybody remember me? The one who started this thread by asking a question about my French _lesson_? _Lesson 5 (out of 52)? _I'm only getting about every 4th or 5th word here, you guys! So what's the verdict? Could I have heard "tout"? Or "toute"? It sure didn't sound like "trop." Thanks.


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## Agnès E.

There is only one sentence possible, John :

Elle est trop jeune pour être mariée

=> she is too young to be married

As for our French conversation, I'm sorry... being French discussing on a French-English forum, we are sometimes tempted to use our language...


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## Gil

Agnes E. said:
			
		

> C'est vrai, l'on a tendance à utiliser "tout" suivi d'un adjectif suggérant l'attendrissement (toute jeune, toute mignonne, toute petite, toute ronde, toute menue, par exemple). Non ?!?


Tout faux?  Tout croche?


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## Kelly B

Well, that's why I asked my question: couldn't the original sentence have been
"Elle est toute jeune pour etre mariée" if toute jeune is awfully/very young (rather than too young)?


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## Agnès E.

Gil said:
			
		

> Tout faux? Tout croche?


Voui, mé non !  
On ne peut pas dire (je mets au féminin pour que ce soit plus évident, n'y vois aucune discrimination, hein !) : sa réponse est toute fausse... 
Quant à "tout croche", je ne comprends pas bien


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## Agnès E.

Kelly B said:
			
		

> Well, that's why I asked my question: couldn't the original sentence have been
> "Elle est toute jeune pour etre mariée" if toute jeune is awfully/very young (rather than too young)?


 
Non, Kelly, cette phrase ne va pas. En effet "trop... pour" implique une relation de cause à effet : "tu es trop intelligente pour ne pas le comprendre" ou "son niveau de français est trop faible pour qu'il puisse s'exprimer".

On pourrait dire ici, pour exprimer la même chose :

"elle est toute jeune, elle ne peut pas être mariée ! [c'est impossible, je n'en crois pas mes yeux !]


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## Kelly B

Ahh. Thank you!


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## johnL

Agnes E. said:
			
		

> There is only one sentence possible, John :
> 
> Elle est trop jeune pour être mariée
> 
> => she is too young to be married



Okay, thanks. 
Maybe the speaker lapsed into English: "Elle est _too_ jeune..."


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## Agnès E.

johnL said:
			
		

> Okay, thanks.
> Maybe the speaker lapsed into English: "Elle est _too_ jeune..."


 
Haha! 
Really, we can't think of another possibility...
Anyway, if it was "tout" it would have been "toute jeune" and then you should have heard the "*te*" ending. Have you heard something similar?


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## la grive solitaire

Could it possibly be: "Elle est *tou*jours trop jeune pour être mariée / pour se marier" ?


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## Agnès E.

Well, this would require some further details (reasons why she is still too young to be married) :

Elle ne pouvait pas se marier l'année dernière car elle avait 13 ans.
A 14 ans, elle est toujours trop jeune pour se marier, c'est illégal.

(For instance)
Too complicated, John would have heard all this (toujours is a long word).


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## LV4-26

_tout vieux_ existe. Mais ne s'applique, à ma connaissance, qu'à des objets_._
_Regarde-moi ce cartable, il est tout vieux. Il faut m'en acheter un autre._
_J'ai un tout vieux vélo dans ma grange._


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## Agnès E.

LV4-26 said:
			
		

> _tout vieux_ existe. Mais ne s'applique, à ma connaissance, qu'à des objets_._
> _Regarde-moi ce cartable, il est tout vieux. Il faut m'en acheter un autre._
> _J'ai un tout vieux vélo dans ma grange._


 
C'est vrai ! J'avais plutôt des qualifications de personnes en tête...


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## johnL

Agnes E. said:
			
		

> Haha!
> Really, we can't think of another possibility...
> Anyway, if it was "tout" it would have been "toute jeune" and then you should have heard the "*te*" ending. Have you heard something similar?



I listened to it again, and I have to say it definitely sounds like "tout," not "toute." In fact, when I first heard it, it kind of threw me, because it sounded like he was saying, "too jeune..." So it was like an apparent inclusion of an English word that fit right into the context!

Well, I guess I'll chalk this one up to getting some "extra" education from you folks outside of my lessons!

Thanks again.


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## Cath.S.

Could you not make us hear it?
You could record it and have the file hosted here, for instance :
http://www.yousendit.com/


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## johnL

egueule said:
			
		

> Could you not make us hear it?
> You could record it and have the file hosted here, for instance :
> http://www.yousendit.com/



It's on VHS, but I can probably figure out how to do it.  I'll get back to you.


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## johnL

Okay, here's the link: (If I can get it right this time!)

http://s4.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=0Q1S5HJ50CLH3BXBRMV55AH7U

Sorry there's some dead air at the beginning; my new computer won't run the sound-editing software my old one would!


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## LauraSBH

J'entends "trop."  Bon soir.


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## Gil

LauraSBH said:
			
		

> J'entends "trop."  Bon soir.



Moi itou:  "trop"


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## Cath.S.

The speaker does not articulate well.
Still I also hear _trop_.


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## la grive solitaire

egueule said:
			
		

> The speaker does not articulate well.
> Still I also hear _trop_.



For what it's worth, me four.


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## johnL

Wow! I hear it now, too! The recording that's online sounds different to me from my original!

Well, I'm not even sure what to say now. Except, thanks, I really appreciate all the input. I hope everybody doesn't feel like it was a PITA for nothing.


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## Kelly B

I learned something new, so I'm glad you asked. It often works out like that.


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## Gil

johnL said:
			
		

> Wow! I hear it now, too! The recording that's online sounds different to me from my original!
> 
> Well, I'm not even sure what to say now. Except, thanks, I really appreciate all the input. I hope everybody doesn't feel like it was a PITA for nothing.



Looking for PITA
No, it was not the first option.


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## johnL

egueule said:
			
		

> The speaker does not articulate well.
> Still I also hear _trop_.



I actually hear "twop." Is this why you say he does not articulate well? I've heard many instances (from different speakers) where an r sounded to me like a w.


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## LauraSBH

Well, the french "r" is much more subtle than the english one...especially with another consonant such as this.  Consider "france"...it is perhaps more accurate to compare the "r" to the english "w."  I once saw a columnist transliterate is as "fwonce."  He was exaggerating a bit for laughs, but still it isn't trop far from the twuth! ;-)


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## Cath.S.

LauraSBH said:
			
		

> Well, the french "r" is much more subtle than the english one...especially with another consonant such as this. Consider "france"...it is perhaps more accurate to compare the "r" to the english "w." I once saw a columnist transliterate is as "fwonce." He was exaggerating a bit for laughs, but still it isn't trop far from the twuth! ;-)


You're wight, Lauwa, but I'm a native and "trop" in John's wecording sounds stwange to me, even though I immediately wecognized it.


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## johnL

Very good, you guys! 
I have to say, "the French R" is the only part of learning French that I'm not enjoying! (It's the only part I'm having trouble with!)


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## Kelly B

If it feels like you're clearing thick phlegm from your soft palate, you've got it!

[This is not chat. It is serious attempt at linguistic phonetics, even if the exclamation point makes it sound a bit hysterical.]


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## johnL

Kelly B said:
			
		

> If it feels like you're clearing thick phlegm from your soft palate, you've got it!
> 
> [This is not chat. It is serious attempt at linguistic phonetics, even if the exclamation point makes it sound a bit hysterical.]



Yeah, well, sometimes it does! And just when I think I'm doing pretty well, *I spit something up!*  (This, also, is not idle chit-chat; it really happens!) That tends to make me think I'm doing something wrong!

But really, I think the worst part is that there are so many "r" sounds, like the "w" we were just talking about! When do you use the w, when do you clear your throat, when do you just "curl" the r a little?


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## Starcreator

Anne345 said:
			
		

> "Elle est trop jeune d'être mariée." is incorrect.


 
Comment cela ne serait-il pas correct? Je pensais que avec le verbe être on dit toujours 'de' avant un adjective. C'est bon de le faire. Il est interessant de se marier. Quelqu'un peut-il m'expliquer ce règle?


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## Benjy

je me crois pas assez intelligent pour t'expliquer la règle mais j'en ai trop envie pour y renoncer  

basically.. assez/trop <adjective> pour (que) is the way you express the idea. that's pretty much all there is to it


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## lizzy

et ce n'est pas invariable?


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## beri

Starcreator said:
			
		

> Comment cela ne serait-il pas correct? Je pensais que avec le verbe être on dit toujours 'de' avant un adjective. C'est bon de le faire. Il est interessant de se marier. Quelqu'un peut-il m'expliquer ce règle?


You hit the nail in the head, look
_*Il est * intéressant de se marier_
"Il est" is what we call une tournure impersonnelle and means "*it* is"
But here, it is "elle est trop jeune pour se marier". Just translate it and you will get exactly the same "she is too young *for* that"


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