# Buyer = Boss?



## Joca

In some parts of this country, it is not uncommon for street vendors and even shop assistants to address you as "patrão" rather than "senhor". "Patrão" is the Portuguese word for "boss", while "senhor" stands for "sir". They can also use the feminine "patroa" instead of "senhora", but this is less usual. I can notice a slight sense of sarcasm when they say "patrão/patroa", but perhaps that's just like me. Anyway, it is as if they wanted to make you feel very important - more important than they think you are, until the very moment when you open the wallet. Then you become an ordinary person again. Ok, these hunchs are irrelevant. What I wanted to know if you have a similar practise in your country or area and, if so, how you feel about it, if anything.


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## dhernan3

Hi!
What you wrote was very interesting because the street vendors in Mexico have the same habit.They use similar words like in Portuguese: "Seño", "Señito", "Patron", "Patrona". Using this words is a sign of respect to the person who is buying and also because, as you said, they want to make you feel important and comfortable. I have never taken in a bad way and I dont think people do it, but it was very interesting that you asked about it. 
Have a nice day.


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## cuchuflete

Isn't patroa also a colloquial way for a man to refer to his wife?



> Depois faço a loteca com a patroa
> Quem sabe o nosso dia vai chegar
> E rio porque rico ri à toa
> Também não custa nada imaginar


Vinicius


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## Joca

cuchuflete said:


> Isn't patroa also a colloquial way for a man to refer to his wife?
> 
> 
> Vinicius


 
Yes, though I am afraid it is somewhat contemptuous.

Joca


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## vachecow

In the US (or at least where I live), at less formal shopping places (like a farmers market, not a mall), it would be common for someone to say "What can I do for you boss?" or "Ok, Boss.  Comin right up."  

In most places it is still "sir."


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## badgrammar

In France, sometimes people will do this, calling the other person "Chef".  But it is not necessarily or exclusively from the seller to the buyer.  It can be the other way around, as a sign of respect and of warm familiarity to the person your dealing with...

Example:  You're ordering something from a waiter in a café, there is a good feeling, a positive interaction, or it is someone you deal with a lot:  "Eh chef, tu m'en mets deux des cafés, dac?" (Hey boss, give me two of them coffees, 'kay?")


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## Henryk

Something like that doesn't exist here in Germany. Shops in general have the motto "der Kunde ist König" (the customer is king) but nonetheless it doesn't have any influence on the customer's treatment or how he's addressed. The nicest thing you might expect from shop assistants is a "Guten Tag" (good day), you can really count yourself lucky if she's looking at you at the same moment. 

I think I should take a trip to Portugal to get the feeling of being someone important.


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## xrayspex

That's pretty common here also. (Southern US.)  I wouldn't take offense unless the tone was sarcastic.   However, now that I think about it, "boss" is NOT  a term that people would commonly use with their actual supervisor or employer.


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## amnariel

You lucky people.... 

Only in better shops, where owners want customers to feel more important and return again sellers address them with "madam" and "sir" but in majority of shops sellers behave like they know you their whole life and like you are there to make their life miserable, acutal buying is far from their vision of you coming in. This is pretty annoying to be honest.

In my opinion addressing buyers with "madam" and "sir" is a sign of curtesy and it is eliminating buddy bahaviour from relation buyer - seller. One can always start a friendly conversation if one feels like anyway...

I guess I'll be joining Henryk on his trip to Portugal


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## vachecow

xrayspex said:


> However, now that I think about it, "boss" is NOT  a term that people would commonly use with their actual supervisor or employer.


Thats a good point.  I think perhaps if you have a good boss he probably wants you to think of him as an equal, and the term "boss" puts him far above you.


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## Flaminius

In view of similar economic relationships between the employer and the employee and that between the consumer and the supplier, the languages used for the former setting is of metaphoric use to understand the latter.


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## Joca

amnariel said:


> ...
> 
> I guess I'll be joining Henryk on his trip to Portugal


 
Hi

I wish you both a very nice trip, but who has mentioned Portugal?  I, who have begun this thread, come from Brazil! What we share with Portugal is the language, but I am not sure about this use of "patrão" in Portugal.

JC


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## amnariel

Joca said:


> Hi
> 
> I wish you both a very nice trip, but who has mentioned Portugal?  I, who have begun this thread, come from Brazil! What we share with Portugal is the language, but I am not sure about this use of "patrão" in Portugal.
> 
> JC



  oooops.... Brasil it is then 


and not to get too OT  No seller will address customer as "boss" in my country. And I prefer when sellers tell me you with capital Y, "vi" in my language (and I believe "Sie" in German, I'm not sure about other languages) since that is, at least for me, normal way to address people I do not know.


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## Henryk

Great! Now I have to alter our booking for Brazil!   

Yes, it's customary and polite to address people you don't know as "Sie" in Germany.


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## .   1

I would not feel confronted if a merchant referred to me as 'boss'.
It is accurate and descriptive of the situation.
I have the money and the merchant is trying to hawk something to me that I probably don't need and definitely don't want or the merchant would not be approaching me.
The buyer is always the boss.
The customer is always right.

.,,


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## badgrammar

However, when you go to see a merchant, you can also presume that if he knows his stuff and is a prfoessional in his businees, he is truly the boss.  That is why, atleast here, we sometimes refer to the professional who is helping us as "Chef"... because it is his expertise that will ultimately make us happy with what we purchase.  We seek his advice.  Otherwise, buy what you will with your big bucks, but if the man or woman who serves you does not appreciate you, you will not get the biggest bang for your buck.  it's maybe about respecting each person for their personal proficiency and expertise and letting them know it so that they will treat you as a valued customer, because you treat them with respect.

If you really want to gget screwed, go in there with a presumptuous "I'm the boss" attitude.  He'll hate you and will only seek to make a buck off you instead of wanting to give you the best deal because you are not only a good customer, but a decent person he can relate to.  Doesn't work everytime.. But it's the method I prefer...


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## Joca

. said:


> I would not feel confronted if a merchant referred to me as 'boss'.
> It is accurate and descriptive of the situation.
> I have the money and the merchant is trying to hawk something to me that I probably don't need and definitely don't want or the merchant would not be approaching me.
> The buyer is always the boss.
> The customer is always right.
> 
> .,,


 
I see your point: you are right. But maybe it's something specific to the Portuguese language in Brazil. "Patrão" is in many contexts a slightly sarcastic or ironic (I can't choose which) term. In such cases it is not for you to be very much flattered at all. I am wondering if it has to do with our past of slavery and the scorn with which common people still look at real or imaginary masters. 

JC


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## danielfranco

Well, over here in Texas the connotation of "boss" is for someone who lords it over you whether you agree or not. It always makes me think of how prisoners answer the guards in jail, "yessir, boss, sir..." But maybe that's a caricature preserved by the movies and TV.
So, when someone tells you, "okay, we'll do it your way, you're the boss" it often means that they don't agree but they have no option because you are in the driver's seat. I think mostly the merchants stick to "sir/ma'am" when they try to get formal with you, but otherwise they'll push for the friendly tone.


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## Macunaíma

Addressing customers as _patrão _is quite informal and you are more likely to be addressed in this way in a small shop or in more downmarket shops. I agree with Joca that it sometimes sonds... I can't quite put my finger on it, I'm not sure if _sarcastic_ is the word that I want here... Anyway, I think it's not very elegant on the part of the shop owner.

JOCA, as for CUCHUFLETE's question about _patroa _being used colloquially by a man to refer to his wife, I think it's jokey and humorous rather than anything else, don't you think so?


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## Joca

Macunaíma said:


> ...
> 
> JOCA, as for CUCHUFLETE's question about _patroa _being used colloquially by a man to refer to his wife, I think it's jokey and humorous rather than anything else, don't you think so?


 
Yes, could be, Macunaíma. At the same time, referring to your wife as "patroa" gives me the impression that she no longer attracts or interests you as a woman. Didn't she grow too fat? Didn't she become a bully? It is as if you were simply expressing (whether right or wrong) the routine (or the trap) of wedlock that most couples are bound to know.

But of course this is off-topic.

JC


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## tvdxer

Most workers don't greet customers as "boss" here, but I might have heard it once or twice before.  The attitude implied by the usage of the word is reflected in an American saying, however, "The customer is always right."

The use of "patroa" for "wife" reminds me of something I occasionally hear on hobby forums...men jokingly (perhaps somewhat contemptuously) referring to their wives as "she who must be obeyed" and the like.


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## .   1

tvdxer said:


> The use of "patroa" for "wife" reminds me of something I occasionally hear on hobby forums...men jokingly (perhaps somewhat contemptuously) referring to their wives as "she who must be obeyed" and the like.


I have used and heard that phrase for my whole life and I have never associated it with anything other than respect.
I will definitely not obey anybody that I do not respect unless they are holding a much bigger stick than me.

.,,


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## Joca

. said:


> I have used and heard that phrase for my whole life and I have never associated it with anything other than respect.
> I will definitely not obey anybody that I do not respect unless they are holding a much bigger stick than me.
> 
> .,,


 
As for me, I will more easily "obey" a woman than a man, whether they deserve my respect or not. Maybe it has to do with my late oedipal mother or with some old-fashioned idea of chivalry.


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## .   1

Joca said:


> As for me, I will more easily "obey" a woman than a man, whether they deserve my respect or not. Maybe it has to do with my late oedipal mother or with some old-fashioned idea of chivalry.


When bullies are concered I do not take note of gender.

.,,


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## Joca

. said:


> When bullies are concered I do not take note of gender.
> 
> .,,


 
I will agree, but I think of a bully as primarily a male figure. I can yield my palm to you. *






* That means: I am possibly wrong, but...


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## .   1

Joca said:


> I will agree, but I think of a bully as primarily a male figure. I can yield my palm to you. *
> * That means: I am possibly wrong, but...


And I can gratefully accept it.

G'day Joca,
That means that I am eager to agree with you.

I quite like the angle of some of your opinions.
See ya on the boards mate.


Robert


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## Joca

. said:


> And I can gratefully accept it.
> 
> G'day Joca,
> That means that I am eager to agree with you.
> 
> I quite like the angle of some of your opinions.
> See ya on the boards mate.
> 
> 
> Robert


 
And I raise my hat to you, too.

JC


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## .   1

Joca said:


> And I raise my hat to you, too.
> 
> JC


To get back on thread, even tenuously, that would be 'I doff's me topper to you' as would an employee to a boss or a seller to a customer when they are happy to agree or to acknowledge a valid point.

.,,


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## alexacohen

OK, to get back on topic before anyone says anything, "patrón" was used in Spain in the same sense. But just the male form. But I'm not sure if it was used widely, as I've heard it only used like this by elderly people, and only in the Northwest.
Now that I think of it, I've heard it in Portugal too.
And now that I really think of it, the one and only boss is Bruce Springsteen.
Alexa


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## brilliantpink

Macunaíma said:


> Addressing customers as _patrão _is quite informal and you are more likely to be addressed in this way in a small shop or in more downmarket shops. I agree with Joca that it sometimes sonds... I can't quite put my finger on it, I'm not sure if _sarcastic_ is the word that I want here... Anyway, I think it's not very elegant on the part of the shop owner.



Thanks all, now I'll have a much better understanding of the situation next time I'm in Mexico and a shop owner addresses me as 'patron' (or the female equivalent). And by the way, when we were in Mexico recently, we were often addressed (in English) as "hey mister" and "hey lady". I don't think the vendors realized how rude 'hey lady' sounds to us. 
Here 'boss' might conceivably be used in such a situation but it sounds rather hillbilly-like. And there is no equivalent for a female customer. 'Sir' and 'ma'am' would be more common, but are not often used either. 
But we do have the use of 'the boss' to refer to one's wife. I imagine this being used by any man who admits, be it ironically or ruefully or bitterly, that his wife gets her way more often than he cares to admit.


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## .   1

brilliantpink said:


> But we do have the use of 'the boss' to refer to one's wife. I imagine this being used by any man who admits, be it ironically or ruefully or bitterly, that his wife gets her way more often than he cares to admit.


Same here but tone is everything.
You're the boss!  This means that she has just asked me to do something that I want to do or told me to do something that I have asked to do.

You're the boss.  This means that I must do something that I don't want to.

Until coming here I had no idea just how tonal my languge is.
I may start using smilies to clarify some tones.

.,,


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