# French Words In Hebrew



## BillyBaynu

Shalom.  I am looking for French words used in Hebrew.  This may be Aoyama's area of expertise.   Those that speak French will note the use of French words, concepts and grammar. This is no doubt a result of Ben Yehuda having spoken French.  For example רומן -  a novel.  Since there was no word for this is Biblical Hebrew, the word was take directly from French.   רימון is another example; apparently a translation of "grenade" (pomegranate).   Any one have additional examples.   תודה


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## mediterraneo24

French did play a certain role in Israel, for example the old driver's license card had a french part. Also other official documents had or still have french sections... This could be because of Ben-Yehuda or an intent to try and get closer to the european community..

http://www.safa-ivrit.org/imported/french.php


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## origumi

mediterraneo24 said:


> http://www.safa-ivrit.org/imported/french.php


Many words in this list cannot be considered loadwords into Hebrew. Although understood by most people, they keep their foreign nature.

Regarding words like רומן (novel) or רימון (the fruit name for the weapon) - sometimes it's hard to track the origin. Such words can arrive from other European languages, not necessarly French (even if exist in French), via various borrowing paths.


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## BillyBaynu

Thanks for the very quick and informative reply.   The article is very interesting.  I forgot about cinema.  It is likely that  תפוח אדמה was borrowed from French, but some reseach on Wikipedia indicates that this construction is used in other languages as well.
תודה רבה


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## ks20495

The revivers of the Hebrew language were most familiar with the languages of Central and Eastern Europe (Yiddish, Russian, German, Polish, Hungarian -- probably in that order). 

So, they tended to bring loanwords from those languages - rather than from the languages of Western Europe. 

I once read, however, the the Hebrew "ככה ככה" (so-so or alright) mimics the French "comme ci comme ça." But, that may be folk etymology.


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## BillyBaynu

I am sure you are right.  I have been reading the website, looking at other languages as well.  Apparently a lot of German influence as well - such as  עתון newspaper (zeitzung).


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## rolmich

[QU OTE=mediterraneo24;9343982]French did play a certain role in Israel, for example the old driver's license card had a french part. Also other official documents had or still have french sections... This could be because of Ben-Yehuda or an intent to try and get closer to the european community..

http://www.safa-ivrit.org/imported/french.php[/QUOTE]

Thanks for this very interesting link.
By the way, french was also the official language of the post office where up to this day you can see whenever a position is not operating : *Fermé*.
My contribution :
_genre = _artistic/literary trend
_avant-garde_
_Madame = female brothel attendant _(the french probably don't appreciate this one).
_nouvelle vague = _cinema new school.


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## vivnara

I think that the reason French was the official language in the post office for so long and on driver's licences is that this was still a remnant of the Ottoman Empire.


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## BillyBaynu

Good point.  Thanks.  Hadn't thought of that.  My favorite example is a friend who came back from kibbutz with a sign reading "Granades", which in French is 'pomegranates' but in English means something else entirely.
שלום


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## Aoyama

Considering French words in Hebrew involves two levels of things :
- French words _translated from French into Hebrew _(like tapuakh adama -pomme de terre), 
- French words _as they are, transposed in Hebrew, _Rolmich is giving some examples
there are many others, one is Coccinelle (debated here already), may words about food : "filet mignon, croissant, éclair, baguette etc"
For 





> _Madame = female brothel attendant _


cited by Rolmich, I beg to differ a wee little bit, it's not an _attendant_ but someone _running_ the place (cf. Mama).
The very interesting site given by Rolmich gives many examples (some wrong with *a* instead of *à*), mixing French words coming to Hebrew _from English _(_déjà vu, tampon, carte blanche, cliché, Eau de Cologne_) with "real" French words.
*Aviron *is an interesting word, supposedly linked to French *avion* (from avis = bird in Latin), but in fact linked to Hebrew *avir* (air), -on ending "Hebrew Greek". Aviron exists in French, but is another word (oar).
Post Office parlance uses French (from the Union Postale Universelle, in 1874, Bern treaty, English has been added in ... 1994), and Israeli Post Office used French for years, together with Hebrew and Arabic (not English). It must have change a bit now a days.
Now, in dealing with French words in Hebrew, one must also take into account French words brought by immigrants _not French_ . In fact, French people didn't do much to export French in Israel, at least at the beginning.
The first wave would include the early Russians [Jews] (beginning of the 20th century), would brought French words used in Russian (probably "genre, avant-garde, cliché, bistro" etc).
The second wave would include the Rumanians, who where accustomed to use many French words like vis-à-vis, café, merci, pardon (and many others).
The last wave would be the North Africans (Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia), in the mid 50ies until mid 60ies, who brought a new "wave" of French to Israel (without forgetting Lebanese, Egyptian, Syrian, Turkish and Iranian Jews who also had some French background).
BUT, the French word I like best, supposed to be the FIRST French word brought into Hebrew ... by Rashi, from Troyes, is ... "poireau" (Hebrew has its own word for it).
There are some other French words in Rashi's writing, most of them not readable because they are Old French, transcribed by Rashi in his own way. But poireau is probably the _only one_ readable as it is, as in Modern French.


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## ks20495

Another good example is "אפרופו" (from French "à propos"). 

Does "אוטוטו" come from French?


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## Aoyama

Correct spelling (but often forgotten) is à-propos, with a hyphen ... French, but probably (once again) _via_ English.
אוטוטו = autoto, au toutou ?

Looking closely at the site provided by rolmich, one notices a few things.
As it is the case, often, with _borrowed foreign words_ in many languages, different levels of _adaptation_ and _adoption_ occur.
Some words are translated into Hebrew, as we have seen.
Some words are "Hebrew-ised" (hébraïsé), like "nonchalant*i*" (and others, on the same model).
Some expressions remain in French but are written phonetically in Hebrew (nouveau/x riche/s, avant-garde, à-propos etc).
Some expressions are translated (à la guerre comme à la guerre, noblesse oblige, après moi le déluge etc).
I guess many other words have been forgotten (or unaccounted for) : gourmand, camembert, brie, salade, crème de la crème, pied noir, étiquette, intellectuel (this one French, and coined by Zola during the Dreyfus Affair), bourgeoisie, petit-bourgeois etc.

Now,for good measure , another thread should deal about _Hebrew words in French_ ... Like tohu-bohu, chérubin, géhenne etc


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## ks20495

אוטוטו means "about to". It just sounded French to me


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## Aoyama

How do you read it ?
Must be Ototo ... It means younger brother in Japanese or a kind of saké (rare) ...
French has the word "tôt" (early) , "plutôt" rather etc


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## ks20495

It's pronounced אוֹטוֹטוֹ, with the stress on the last syllable. 

You could say, for example: 
.אני אוטוטו מסיים את התואר
I'm about to finish my degree.​


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## Aoyama

Right.
Japanese has the word "yatto" or toto (pronounced to-to-) meaning "finally about to" ... 
Mamma mia ...


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## BillyBaynu

מצוין, תודה רבה

This is great information, thanks to every one who contributed. 
However it raises several questions:

1. How do you spell Coccinelle in Hebrew?
Where was it previously discussed? (I read all the Hebrew threads)
I lived in Israel for 4 years. I head thwe word and was told was it 
meant, but only discovered the etymology last year!

2. On a related item, does any one know the history of פרת משה רבינה ?
For those who don't know, the "lady" in lady bug is Mary.
In England it's "our lady's bug" ie: the Madonna.

Why פרה?  
There is a chidlren's song about פרת משה רבינה, who complains about the name.


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## ks20495

1. קוקסינל

2. According to this article (http://www.haaretz.co.il/hasite/pag...ontrassID=2&subContrassID=5&sbSubContrassID=0),
it is a translation from the Yiddish. 

Jews in Europe replaced Gentile references to the Virgin Mary or to Jesus with a reference to Moses for obvious reasons.


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## BillyBaynu

תודה רבה
במויחד על התגובה המהירה
 לצרי הדיבור שלי הרבה יותר טוב  מהקריאה  
יקך לי קצת  זמן לקרוא תי מאמר
 אצליח בסוף, ואם יש שאלות אדע לאן לפנות


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## rolmich

You can find an explanation about "Coccinelle" on :
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/*Coccinelle*
_French transsexual actress and entertainer._
Interesting to note that "coccinelle" is not used in France with the same meaning as in Israel.
Lately, you hear quite often in Israel "nicha" ("niche" in french) in the sense of :
Small customer section, new on the market, and not yet exploited.
Also used in the arts/literature with the same meaning.
Thanks *aoyama*, but *mediterraneo *should be credited for the very interesting link, not me.


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## Aoyama

See this also :
http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=1676134&highlight=coccinelle
Speaking about "niche", the word is French, as we know, but this use has expanded from English, for this particular meaning. I discussed this somewhere else already. The real French equivalent is "créneau".
Kol hakavod to mediterraneo.


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## scriptum

Aoyama said:


> Right.
> Japanese has the word "yatto" or toto (pronounced to-to-) meaning "finally about to" ...
> Mamma mia ...


אוטוטו is Russian / Ukrainian.
In Russian it sounds "vot-vot-vot" = הינה, הינה, הינה.
In the southern dialects and in Ukrainian "v" disappears.


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## scriptum

Aoyama said:


> There are some other French words in Rashi's writing, most of them not readable because they are Old French, transcribed by Rashi in his own way. But poireau is probably the _only one_ readable as it is, as in Modern French.


One shouldn't forget such half French, half Hebrew words as אווז. The word is found in the Bible, but its modern meaning (_oie_ - from lat. _avis_) has been ascribed to it by Rashi. Or, at least, so I have read somewhere.
Or such one-third Hebrew, one-third Arabic, one-third French word as the charmante שרמוטה ...


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## Aoyama

> אוטוטו is Russian / Ukrainian.
> In Russian it sounds "vot-vot-vot" = הינה, הינה, הינה.
> In the southern dialects and in Ukrainian "v" disappears.


exit Japanese then. Not really a surprise though ...


> Or such one-third Hebrew, one-third Arabic, one-third French word as the charmante שרמוטה ...


didn't know about this one : "charmotah" ?


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## rolmich

For me "charmante" and "sharmutah" have exact opposite meanings.


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## Aoyama

But then, also, how can "charmante" and "sharmutah" be linked ? One would expect "sharmanti/t" ... 
Now, could there be a link with "motek" ...


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## scriptum

Aoyama said:


> But then, also, how can "charmante" and "sharmutah" be linked ? One would expect "sharmanti/t" ...
> Now, could there be a link with "motek" ...


שרמנטי exists in MH, too, but it was borrowed directly from French.
שרמוטה was borrowed indirectly, via Arabic, and it has conserved its arabic meaning.


rolmich said:


> For me "charmante" and "sharmutah" have exact opposite meanings.


Well, connotations of "charm" are obviously different in different cultures. 
Anyway, I only report what I read somewhere. Maybe somebody with a good knowledge of Arabic can confirm or deny the etymology of "שרמוטה".


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## rolmich

Aoyama said:


> But then, also, how can "charmante" and "sharmutah" be linked ? One would expect "sharmanti/t" ...
> Now, could there be a link with "motek" ...


"motek", in my knowledge comes from "matok/metuka" (sweet).
As for "sharmutah", and since no one with a good command of arabic comes forward, my guess, and contrary to a previous comment of mine, is that it comes from the french "charmante", describing a woman exaggerating her feminity. To simper (in french "minauder").


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## Aoyama

> "motek", in my knowledge comes from "matok/metuka" (sweet).


Yes, must be.
Now, for the shift between "charmante" and "sharmutah", I can't say, but why not ...


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## vivnara

Two more French/Hebrew words not on the list are
 ויטרינה   -- vitrine
קפושון  -- capuchon, used in Hebrew for the hooded sweatshirts kids wear in the winter


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## OsehAlyah

Hmmm no one has mentioned Sabon.


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