# Ladies and gentle fuckin' men



## Franck Bronte

Hi,

Please, tell me, are you ok with this one ?

_"Mesdames zé messieurs."_

From a drug dealer introducing his new stuff to his best customers...


Thank you.


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## ce que est est

Seems kind of corny to me, but I don't know exactly what zé connotes.  It's not just some tic of pronunciation?


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## Micia93

the "zé" corresponds to the liaison between "mesdames" and "et", but it doesn't suggest the word "fucking" here ...


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## Martyn94

Micia93 said:


> the "zé" corresponds to the liaison between "mesdames" and "et", but it doesn't suggest the word "fucking" here ...


But what would, especially since "fuckin'" is just an intensifier here? (And I don't think that there is any particular significance to the fact that it appears before "gentlemen": sticking it before the second term of a pair is a common trick of speech). Franco's idea seems quite a good way to jazz things up


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## Micia93

I thought that "fuckin" was far more than a mere intensifier, it still remains rather vulgar doesn't it? I mean, you won't use in common speech with, let's say, your boss?


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## Martyn94

Micia93 said:


> I thought that "fuckin" was far more than a mere intensifier, it still remains rather vulgar doesn't it? I mean, you won't use in common speech with, let's say, your boss?


Perhaps you might if your boss were a more senior drug dealer. I have certainly said it in moments of exasperation to bosses in the civil service, if I thought they were unlikely to be very shocked (and were male, as they mostly were in those days).


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## Micia93

ho I see! Nevertheless I will not try to use it ...!


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## Martyn94

Micia93 said:


> ho I see! Nevertheless I will not try to use it ...!


I do not take any particular pride in using it myself, and it needs care and precision (or, as I said, just great exasperation). But in some contexts, as perhaps between drug dealers and their clients, it is absolutely commonplace - to the extent that you have to use a "tricky" formulation like "ladies and gentle fuckin' men" to give it any impact.


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## Uncle Bob

I assume that the retailer in question continues the sentence so perhaps you could transfer the vulgarity to the next bit.

(I did once see part of one episode of a TV series about government ministers and their advisors ("In the Thick of It" ?) in which "fuck" seemed to occur three times in every sentence. Since the characters were either incompetents or nasty pieces of work I assume it was fairly realistic).


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## Micia93

OK, but Franck's Mesdames zé Messieurs" seems very weak in comparison, since this is what a presenter, for instance, usually says during a show, to the audience
sorry Franck ! 


PS : I was answering to Martyn!


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## Martyn94

Micia93 said:


> OK, but Franck's Mesdames zé Messieurs" seems very weak in comparison, since this is what a presenter, for instance, usually says during a show, to the audience
> sorry Franck !
> 
> 
> PS : I was answering to Martyn!



if you imagine it delivered in the exaggerated "corny" way favoured by "television compères", it works well enough for me. As Uncle Bob says, the use of "fucking" in some contexts is no big deal: just a sort of verbal tic.


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## Petites mousctaches

Martyn94 said:


> if you imagine it delivered in the exaggerated "corny" way favoured by "television compères", it works well enough for me. As Uncle Bob says, the use of "fucking" in some contexts is no big deal: just a sort of verbal tic.


Totally agree with you on the verbal tic. From personal experience (sorry) the F word is used in the middle of every sentences, words or to replace one. So it is very difficult to translate and most of them are lost in French.
So zé is weak but what else can be used?


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## Micia93

"sacré (e) Untel" ?? but difficult in the plural "sacrés compères" sounds too obsolete
to be honest, I don't really know


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## Itisi

Micia93 said:


> Mesdames zé Messieurs" seems very weak in comparison!


 True, but none of us, brilliant thinkers, can come up with anything more 'suitable'; so *Uncle Bob*'s solution seems the only possibility...


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## Micia93

this is the same problem : how to render it?

_I assume that the retailer in question continues the sentence so perhaps you could transfer the vulgarity to the next bit.

_


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## Martyn94

Petites mousctaches said:


> Totally agree with you on the verbal tic. From personal experience (sorry) the F word is used in the middle of every sentences, words or to replace one. So it is very difficult to translate and most of them are lost in French.So zé is weak but what else can be used?


Just so. The only French word I can imagine being used in vaguely the same way (I do not mix much with drug dealers nowadays) is "putain", but I don't see how to shoehorn it in here.


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## Martyn94

Itisi said:


> True, but none of us, brilliant thinkers, can come up with anything more 'suitable'; so *Uncle Bob*'s solution seems the only possibility...


Or simply don't bother: it is not much of a vulgarity in many contexts, and the overall situation (drug dealer and clients) is sufficiently louche that readers will not need it rubbed in.


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## Petites mousctaches

Martyn94 said:


> Just so. The only French word I can imagine being used in vaguely the same way (I do not mix much with drug dealers nowadays) is "putain", but I don't see how to shoehorn it in here.



Personal experience with people cursing not with drug dealers...

the idea of putting it. off to the next sentence looks good to me. Maybe you could use the English phrase and write it so it sounds like a bad English accent : "lédize ande gentleumane" since he is show off his new stuff he is making the show. And French people use the English phrase sometimes to sound funny. (Faire son show à l'américaine)


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## Itisi

Petites mousctaches said:


> "lédize ande gentleumane"


 I do like that!


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## archijacq

mesdames et meschieux ?


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## FleurMarlowe

Bonjour,

Peut-être: Chères dames, putain de messieurs ?


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## Itisi

FleurMarlowe said:


> Chères dames, putain de messieurs ?


 Le procédé marche en anglais, on reconnait la tournure, mais en français, dans ce contexte, on se demande ce que ce mot fait là!


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## EmmanuelM

"lédize and gentleumane" sounds to me like someone impersonating Belmondo in an old movie though.
"mesdames zé messieurs", sounds to me like someone wanting to diminish the formal tone, quite the contrary of showing off.
If "fucking" is here used mostly to make some emphasis on the introduction, to make it last longer to say, etc...  I would consider making it a cursing version of "Attention, mesdames et messieurs". Something like :
"Mesdames et messieurs, je vous demande votre putain d'attention"
In France too we like to put "putain" before the last word of a sentence to make an impact


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## Itisi

Chers gonzes et gonzesses
Chers caves( et bourgeoises/bobonnes) (bof!)


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## EmmanuelM

The original poster should tell us how old is the drug dealer and when the scene takes place. Gonzes and gonzesses, and even more caves, is for a fan of B&W movies now I'm afraid (don't get me wrong, I love that slang, but if the original poster is here to subtitle a 2013 comedy show that takes place in a Manhattan flat...)

"Votre putain d'attention, m'sieurdames !"
is a shorter version of my first proposition.

Here the drug dealer would be a 25 yo today, parodying a formal announcement he heard numerous times on TV when he was a bit younger, or the messages he hears each time the subway has a problem. Something believable, in my opinion.


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## Martyn94

EmmanuelM said:


> "lédize and gentleumane" sounds to me like someone impersonating Belmondo in an old movie though.
> "mesdames zé messieurs", sounds to me like someone wanting to diminish the formal tone, quite the contrary of showing off.
> If "fucking" is here used mostly to make some emphasis on the introduction, to make it last longer to say, etc...  I would consider making it a cursing version of "Attention, mesdames et messieurs". Something like :
> "Mesdames et messieurs, je vous demande votre putain d'attention"


That seems a bit too much for what is, in context, a very small attempt to bring some attention to what follows. Franck's original effort seems to me to achieve an appropriately "sleazy" tone: I am not sure that you can do better, considering how worn out "fucking" has become in some sorts of idiomatic English.


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## EmmanuelM

Martyn94 said:


> That seems a bit too much for what is, in context, a very small attempt to bring some attention to what follows.



Keep in mind that the original
""Mesdames et messieurs, je vous demande votre attention" 
is the typical introduction of a message said by a robotic voice or an human voice over the loudspeakers in railways and subway stations in France each time an announcement is made. So in the end, even now it's more part of the street language than you could expect, it can be parodied without sounding out of place.

Also, I searched a bit for it, and I wonder if we're not asked to translate a translation  (ie : the original words are not English in the first place ?)


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## Itisi

Mesdames zé Messieurs, alors faites gaffe maintenant, etc.../ ouvrez vos esgourdes - ou est-ce encore trop années 50 ?

Ou : calculez-moi-bien ? (je suis plus dans mon élément avec l'argot de la Méthode à Mimile...)


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## EmmanuelM

Itisi said:


> Mesdames zé Messieurs, alors faites gaffe  maintenant, etc.../ ouvrez vos esgourdes - ou est-ce encore trop années  50 ?



Carrément, maman !


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## Itisi

EmmanuelM said:


> Carrément, maman !


 Alors vise ma dernière modification, mon petit! (Et toc! )


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## EmmanuelM

"maman" is here because they liked at that time to make words rhyme like in "Je veux, mon neveu !". Nothing was hinted about your old age  [I'm 42 yo btw]
The  original poster should tell us more. I found that in a 2012 movie from Thailand (English title : "Countdown") a similar drug dealing scene takes place, and the English subtitles are exactly the words we're asked to translate... [Bad hypothesis removed]

PS : Okay I found out that the words are actually said in English by an English/US actor in a Thai movie where the rest of the cast speaks Thai (they're in New York, it plays on the fact they're a bit lost there, I guess). The scene is in the trailer of Countdown. You know what ? Keep "Ladies and gentle fuckin' men" as it is then, even for French subtitles ! It's used to make some cliches about the New York dealers  In another scene in the trailer, he parodies Darth Vader, etc... All his lines in the trailer are super simple English, ("It's so much fun !" "You want to know who I am ?", "Welcome to the night of your life" etc). You should keep worn-out clichés when they are used as clichés.


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## Itisi

EmmanuelM said:


> Okay I found out that the words are actually said in English by an English/US actor in a Thai movie where the rest of the cast speaks Thai (they're in New York, it plays on the fact they're a bit lost there, I guess). The scene is in the trailer of Countdown. You know what ? Keep "Ladies and gentle fuckin' men" as it is then, even for French subtitles ! It's used to make some cliches about the New York dealers  In another scene in the trailer, he parodies Darth Vader, etc... You should keep clichés when they are used as clichés.


 Nice work! 

(And btw, 'Et toc!' was for my attempt at modern slang in my 'Dernière Modification' - and I'm not offended!)


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## Martyn94

Itisi said:


> Nice work!
> 
> (And btw, 'Et toc!' was for my attempt at modern slang in my 'Dernière Modification' - and I'm not offended!)


But it seems a shame since we have worked so hard. But maybe it will "come in" as we say.


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## Franck Bronte

EmmanuelM said:


> [...] You know what ? Keep "Ladies and gentle fuckin' men" as it is then, even for French subtitles ! It's used to make some cliches about the New York dealers  In another scene in the trailer, he parodies Darth Vader, etc... All his lines in the trailer are super simple English, ("It's so much fun !" "You want to know who I am ?", "Welcome to the night of your life" etc). You should keep worn-out clichés when they are used as clichés.
> ...
> At least it's not a possible lazy translation we're used to translate



Good job, you found out!
Just to let you know, the movie is directed by Nattawut Poonpiriya and distributed by GTH.

Ok, I keep it as it is. Highlighted in italics of course.

God, I love this word but sometimes it just drives me crazy.
I liked the "mesdames et meschieux"  of archijacq.
A little bit the same verbal madness.

Thank you all.


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