# Figurati



## Biondo

Ciao a tutti,

Although there is a dictionary translation for "figurati" - "wouldn't you know" or "you figure" i am still slightly confused. In English if you paid someone a compliment and they replied with "wouldn't you know" or "you figure" it seems a little rude, however, i believe in Italian that it is not rude and it is an accepted reply and not rude at all, am i right or wrong in this understanding and can you explain why please and perhaps suggest some other words to use instead of "wouldn't you know" that may help me to understand.

Grazie,

Biondo.


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## winnie

when someone replies 'figurati!' what (s)he is trying to convey is something like: you don't have to worry about it, it was a pleasure and i'm glad for being helpful to you.

i.e.:

-grazie per avermi prestato il giornale _thank you for the newspaper you lended to me_
- figurati!_my pleasure!_

HTH


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## Artrella

my textbook also says figurarsi is used for expressing neglect and negative opinion.

example

E a me che me ne importa del compratore? (What do i care about customer?)
A chi lo dici.. figurarti a me (Tell me about it, i couldn't care less)

it is also used for assertion:

Mi puoi aiutare? _Can you help me?_
Figurati! _Sure!_

another example where fugarasi can be used would be:

La disturbo? _Am I bothering you?_
Si figuri!_ Not at all_



			
				winnie said:
			
		

> when someone replies 'figurati!' what (s)he is trying to convey is something like: you don't have to worry about it, it was a pleasure and i'm glad for being helpful to you.
> 
> i.e.:
> 
> -grazie per avermi prestato il giornale _thank you for the newspaper you lended to me_
> - figurati!_my pleasure!_
> 
> HTH


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## Biondo

Thank you very much Winnie / Chiaro,

The usage with a positive response is very clear now but the expression of negative opinion is now my current confusion  



			
				chiaro said:
			
		

> La disturbo? _Am I bothering you?_
> Si figuri!_ Not at all_


Especially this statement Chiaro, it's hard for me to understand a response to a question that is positive (or appears positive to me) "Si figuri" that in English you would reply to with a negative?

Please explain further if you have time...

Thanks,

Biondo.


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## Artrella

Biondo said:
			
		

> Thank you very much Winnie / Chiaro,
> 
> The usage with a positive response is very clear now but the expression of negative opinion is now my current confusion
> 
> 
> Especially this statement Chiaro, it's hard for me to understand a response to a question that is positive (or appears positive to me) "Si figuri" that in English you would reply to with a negative?
> 
> Please explain further if you have time...
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Biondo.




Oh! Io penso che questo non è corretto.  Se io dico "si figuri"... non vuol dire che infatti io disturbo a quella persona? Per me la signora si sente disturbata!!


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## Jana337

Artrella said:
			
		

> Oh! Io penso che questo non* è sia*  corretto.  Se io dico "si figuri"... non vuol dire che infatti io disturbo * a*  quella persona? Per me la signora si sente disturbata!!



Art, se qualcuno ti aiuta, tu dici "mille grazie" e la persona risponde "si figuri"/"figurati", vuol dire "this is absolutely not worth mentioning, stop speaking about it".

Se chiedi "disturbo" e il interlocutore risponde "si figuri"/"figurati", vuol dire "absolutely not, what an absurd idea".

Spero di averti chiarito le idee.

Jana


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## Manuel_M

There are various expressions in  many languages, which at first glance, and to go by their literal meaning would be taken to mean as the opposite of the meaning the speaker would like to convey. Think of _'break a leg'_ in the context of the stage, or _'in bocca al lupo'_ in all contexts in Italy. A foreigne would never think that the speaker was actually wishing his listener good luck.


_Figurati _as a response to an expression of gratitude _(_and similar meanings_)_ should not be taken to mean the same as _figurarsi _in other contexts. It has to be understood in the light of the meaning it has acquired through usage over the years.


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## winnie

Artrella said:
			
		

> Una correzione Winnie..."to lend /lent/lent"
> 
> Allora >>> _Thank you for the newspaper you *lent* (to) me_


 
molte grazie Art!


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## r0by

C'è una canzone di Alanisse Morissette (Ironic) dove viene usato "It figures" in una accezione molto simile al nostro "figurati" in alcuni casi.


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## Manuel_M

I'm not familiar with the Alanis Morisette song, but the menaing of i_t figures_ in English is normally vey different from that of *figurati.* _It figures_ normally means _it is included (e.g. It figures in the list)._

It can also mean  _I'm not surprised/that is what I expected/it fits the pattern_ 
(e.g. _So X is the murderer? I__t figures_). The latter use of phrase is often restricted to '_figures_' ( that is , without the 'it') in every-day language.

I hope I'm not causing confusion.


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## Artrella

Jana337 said:
			
		

> Art, se qualcuno ti aiuta, tu dici "mille grazie" e la persona risponde "si figuri"/"figurati", vuol dire "this is absolutely not worth mentioning, stop speaking about it".
> 
> Se chiedi "disturbo" e il interlocutore risponde "si figuri"/"figurati", vuol dire "absolutely not, what an absurd idea".
> 
> Spero di averti chiarito le idee.
> 
> Jana




Thank you Jana, but you know I've asked this question to some Italians and they told me "hey you'd better don't disturbe that woman"...boh!


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## Alfry

I agree with Jana.
Maybe those friends of yours didn't understand the situazion


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## mekas

per favore, che cosa la significa di parola, "figurati"
qualche volta, alcuni dicono: per figurati


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## Sierra

It's one of those phrases that fascinated me as well when I first moved to Italy - many uses but not directly translatable to English.  Among some of the uses I can think of:

*"Figurati" - *
*"You're welcome"  *

*"Posso prendere un'altro biscotto?""Ma figurati..."*
*"Can I have another biscuit?""But of course..."*

*"Figurati se viene..."*
*"As if he's going to show up..." - *

*"Se io ho problemi di soldi, figurati per i disoccupati..."*
*"If I have money problems, what more for the unemployed..."*

I'm sure there are other contexts in which it can be used and I'm keen to see responses from native Italian speakers


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## rom_itn

mekas said:
			
		

> per favore, che cosa la significa di parola, "figurati"
> qualche volta, alcuni dicono: per figurati


 
Here is a link to another 'figurati' thread! 
http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=45410&highlight=figurati

Ciao, Rom


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## giaco1978

Sierra said:


> It's one of those phrases that fascinated me as well when I first moved to Italy - many uses but not directly translatable to English. Among some of the uses I can think of:
> 
> *"Figurati" - *
> *"You're welcome" *
> 
> *"Posso prendere un'altro biscotto?""Ma figurati..."*
> *"Can I have another biscuit?""But of course..."*
> 
> *"Figurati se viene..."*
> *"As if he's going to show up..." - *
> 
> *"Se io ho problemi di soldi, figurati per i disoccupati..."*
> *"If I have money problems, what more for the unemployed..."*
> 
> I'm sure there are other contexts in which it can be used and I'm keen to see responses from native Italian speakers


 
I don´t see any other context at the moment but can you tell me if you can you use other expression like: can you imagine him doing this or:try to figure out him.
thanks


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## TimLA

Ciao ragazzi!
Un vecchio argomento e una domanda banale.

Contesto:
Io e mia moglie entriamo in un ristorante a Venezia e dico "siamo in due".
Non c'è un tavolo per due, ma c'è un tavolo per quattro (due tavoli per due persone insieme).
Il proprietario dice qualcosa tipo: "Non abbiamo...vediamo cosa facciamo..." e subito va al tavolo per quattro, lo separa in due tavoli per due persona e dice "Eccolo...una soluzione" (o simile).
Io dico: "Buona idea, grazie, grazie mille"
Subito lui dice chiaramente: Si figura, si figura.

Era la prima volta che ho sentito la frase, e credo che vuol dire "di niente".

Domande:
1. Si figura = figurati, ma in modo formale?
2. Perchè "si figura" invece di "di niente"? - qualcosa regionale?

Grazie in anticipo!


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## Salegrosso

1) Hi Tim,
probably he said _Si figuri!,_ that is the courtesy-respectful form for _Figurati!_
The meaning is the same as explained above in this thread, that is: _No problem, you're welcome, it's my pleasure,_ _it has been of no effort for me, _etc.

2) Thanks to Sierra for his/her post no.16, a very clear overview.

3) Here I mention another Italian saying that is used in a similar way as one of the meaning of _figurati_. 
- La disturbo? _(Am I bothering you?)_
- Ci mancherebbe altro! (It means: _Of course you aren't / No, you're welcome to tell me all / No, go ahead please,_ etc.)
Sometimes shortened into: 
- Ci mancherebbe! _(The same meaning)_


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## TimLA

Excellent, thanks very much!


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## Salegrosso

_Figurati!_


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## london calling

Salegrosso said:


> 1) Hi Tim,
> probably he said _Si figuri!,_ that is the courtesy-respectful form for _Figurati!_
> The meaning is the same as explained above in this thread, that is: _No problem, you're welcome, it's my pleasure,_ _it has been of no effort for me, _etc.
> 
> 2) Thanks to Sierra for his/her post no.16, a very clear overview.
> 
> 3) Here I mention another Italian saying that is used in a similar way as one of the meaning of _figurati_.
> - La disturbo? _(Am I bothering you?)_
> - Ci mancherebbe altro! (It means: _Of course you aren't / No, you're welcome to tell me all / No, go ahead please,_ etc.)
> Sometimes shortened into:
> - Ci mancherebbe! _(The same meaning)_


 
E che ne dici di s_'immagini_? Che corrisponde a s_i figuri_, ma stranamente non ho mai sentito dire _immaginati _per dire _figurati_...o sbaglio io?


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## Salegrosso

You're absolutely right, London. Both in the first half and in the second one of your post.


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## badbadger

So, can one use "s'immagini" in all of the cases "si figuri" is used or are they only ever really used equally for certain contexts?  

Thanks,


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## rafanadal

How would you translate this one:
A: "Non ti registri su...? 
B: "Ma figurati se mi registro su...! Non ci penso nemmeno!

A: "Aren't you going to register on...?
B: "..........if I'm going to register on...I don't even think about it!


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## london calling

rafanadal said:


> How would you translate this one:
> A: "Non ti registri su...?
> B: "Ma figurati se mi registro su...! Non ci penso nemmeno!
> 
> A: "Aren't you going to register on...?
> B: "..........if I'm going to register on...I don't even think about it!


Ciao!
_You must be joking!/Come off it! I have no intention of registering...._


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## rafanadal

Thanks Jo.
As anyone can see the uses and possibilities of "figurati" in Italian are endless...


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## Gnappulina

Ciao tutti,

Quando esco l'ufficio di una professoressa, lei sempre me dice "figurate". Cosa vuol dire in inglese?? "Take care" per esempio??

Grazie mille,
Gnappulina


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## infinite sadness

Gnappulina said:


> Ciao tutti,
> 
> Quando esco *dal*l'ufficio di una professoressa, lei sempre m*i *dice "figurat*i*". Cosa vuol dire in inglese?? "Take care" per esempio??
> 
> Grazie mille,
> Gnappulina


E' una risposta di cortesia, che vuol dire "you're welcome", "imagine that", "of course!"


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## rafanadal

It also can be something that you think to yourself. For example the other day I was thinking of calling one of my friends up to get together on new year's eve and I happened to think to myself:
"Ma figurati se non si è già organizzato".
How can we render this at best?
"But..as if he hasn't already fix something up"
mmh...as usual it doesn't sound as smooth as I'd like it to....


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## TimLA

rafanadal said:


> It also can be something that you think to yourself. For example the other day I was thinking of calling one of my friends up to get together on new year's eve and I happened to think to myself:
> "Ma figurati se non si è già organizzato".
> How can we render this at best?
> "But..as if he hasn't already fix something up"
> mmh...as usual it doesn't sound as smooth as I'd like it to....


 
Hmmm...
To what does the "ti" refer?

But, (I) immagine/wonder if something has yet to be organized...


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## rafanadal

No no Tim.
My sentence means "I'm going to call my buddy up to see if he wants to celebrate New Year's Eve with us" but as I'm reaching for the phone I think to myself: 
"figurati se non *SI* (not "ti", meaning he himself) è già organizzato".
In other words I had a feeling he had already fixed something else for New Year's Eve and I expressed that suspicion to myself.
Sorry if I didn't explain clearly 
One more thing: the use of "figurati" in this case expresses nearly certainty.


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## TimLA

rafanadal said:


> "figura*ti* se non *SI* (not "ti", meaning he himself) è già organizzato".


 
The "ti" at the end of "figura" - to what does it refer?


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## rafanadal

It means "you think yourself". But it is a fixed expression. It comes natural to say it because you are thinking to yourself, well, you can also say it out loud:
Figurati se viene. meaning "he won't come for sure"


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## TimLA

Ok, so the "figurati" is the person talking to themselves.

So probably the shortest way we'd say it in AE would be:
Unless he's doing something else.
Unless he's got something else planned.
Unless he's got something else going on.


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## rafanadal

Mmh, sorry Tim, but....
I have to say that your examples seem to get the sentence to lose a bit of its spice in Italian.
"Figurati se viene" is extremely overused in Italian, I think daily by millions of people, and it expresses certainty about your feeling, in anticipation, that he/she won't be showing up because he/she doesn't feel like, has something else to do, hasn't time etc etc..
It's the tipical phrase you say in italy when you are about to invite someone and you are almost sure they will say no.
How would you put it in English?


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## TimLA

rafanadal said:


> Mmh, sorry Tim, but....
> I have to say that your examples seem to get the sentence to lose a bit of its spice in Italian.
> "Figurati se viene" is extremely overused in Italian, I think daily by millions of people, and it expresses certainty about your feeling, in anticipation, that he/she won't be showing up because he/she doesn't feel like, has something else to do, hasn't time etc etc..
> It's the tipical phrase you say in italy when you are about to invite someone and you are almost sure they will say no.
> How would you put it in English?


 
My response was to:
"Ma figurati se non si è già organizzato"
If you wanted to keep the idea of talking to youself, it might be something like:
But I'll bet he's doing something else.

In terms of "figurati se viene"
I'll bet he won't come/show-up.
But I immagine he won't come.


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## rafanadal

"I'll bet" sounds good. Seems to me it conveys the very well the idea.
We always square the circle, in the end, don't we?


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## giovannino

Hi Tim and Happy New Year
I think that _figurati se...! _is stronger than _I'll bet. _A wordy paraphrase of, say, _figurati se ti chiederà mai scusa! _might be "just try to imagine him apologizing and you'll realize it's completely out of the question".
Maybe one could say _There's no way he's (ever) going to apologize _or _(You can) forget about him apologizing._


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## rafanadal

By the way guys, I noticed afterwards that the same example I gave, "Figurati se viene" had been given by Sierra in post 14.
I simply forgot about it.
Well he used "AS IF to translate.
So we have two versions, Tim's and Sierra's.
Which one captures at best our "Figurati se viene"???


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## SpookyT

I'd say Sierra's.

_I'll bet_ is like our _Scommetto_ -- that's the meaning, but I think _As if_ conveys it way better  ...As Giovannino said, there's the whole part of "I know him/her well, I'm sure he/she won't deign to... (apologize/come to the party/reply to the invitation)" - everything in a_ Figurati_


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## rafanadal

Good Spooky, I wouldn't rule out Giovannino's no way, though.
Sounds even stronger.
Ciao


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## giovannino

I very much like Sierra's translation (_As if he's going to show up_). It's probably as close as one can get to _figurati se..._
However, I was wondering about her translation of _figurati _in another of her examples:
*"If I have money problems, what more for the unemployed..."*

Rather than "what more", shouldn't it be something like "(just) imagine what it must be like (or "how much worse it must be") for the unemployed"?


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## TimLA

giovannino said:


> Hi Tim and Happy New Year
> I think that _figurati se...! _is stronger than _I'll bet. _A wordy paraphrase of, say, _figurati se ti chiederà mai scusa! _might be "just try to imagine him apologizing and you'll realize it's completely out of the question".
> Maybe one could say _There's no way he's (ever) going to apologize _or _(You can) forget about him apologizing._


 
Happy New Year!!! And thank you! Thank you!
Reinforcements have arrived!


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## rafanadal

What an array of ammunition!!
I'll bet (mild)
As if (humorous and hopeless)
No way (hopeless in agony)


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## TimLA

This is one of those "super-idiomatic" uses that you really don't understand unless you've heard it, 1000 times, in context.

So If it's that strong then:
As if! (no other words necessary)
No way it'll happen.
No way that'll happen.
Like that'll happen.
Like that'll happen in my lifetime.

In terms of "what more for the unemployed" it seems like the dictionary definition of figurarsi - imagine - is a little closer.

just imagine...
imagine...


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## rafanadal

Good your "like that".
I wouldn't have thought. It sounds very close, I seem.
As if could be used in this case (2 women talking):
Mary: "You know, Joe has invited me over to his place to show me his butterflies' collection".
Laura: "AS IF!.
Couldn't it?


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## TimLA

rafanadal said:


> Good your "like that".
> I wouldn't have thought. It sounds very close, I seem.
> As if could be used in this case (2 women talking):
> Mary: "You know, Joe has invited me over to his place to show me his butterfly collection".
> Laura: "AS IF!.
> Couldn't it?


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## rafanadal

TimLA said:


>


 
In this case we have got it Tim. 99,9% Italians would say "Figurati!" in Laura's shoes!!!


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## giuliotta

I read this thread and some others but I'm still not sure how 'figurati' should be translated in contexts like these, when it often follows or replace 'niente' :

Su un treno affollato un signore mi pesta un piede.
- Scusi
- Niente, si figuri.

Una collega fa cadere dei fogli dalla mia scrivania.
- Scusa!
- Niente! (oppure: figurati!)

My try:
A man step on my foot on a crowded train.
- Excuse-me
- It was nothing (?)
A colleague drop the papers on the ground.
- Sorry (?)
- Not a problem (?)

Thank you.


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## SpookyT

Ciao Giuliotta,

My suggestions: "No problem", "No worries", "Not a problem", "Don't worry", "I'm fine." and so on.

PS: Scusa (in questo contesto) = Sorry. "Excuse me" è per quanto dici "Mi scusi, permesso..."


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## giuliotta

Grazie SpookyT, ottimi suggerimenti! 
Quindi 'it was nothing' qui non c'entra niente, vero? Si usa solo in risposta a un ringraziamento? Ho provato a usare 'excuse-me' perché mi sembrava che 'sorry' fosse un po' troppo informale da dire a uno sconosciuto. 

E' incredibile e affascinante come espressioni del genere, che si usano tutti i giorni, rimangano ancora misteriose per me.  I have a loooong way to go.


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## Odysseus54

giuliotta said:


> Grazie SpookyT, ottimi suggerimenti!
> Quindi 'it was nothing' qui non c'entra niente, vero? Si usa solo in risposta a un ringraziamento? Ho provato a usare 'excuse-me' perché mi sembrava che 'sorry' fosse un po' troppo informale da dire a uno sconosciuto.
> 
> E' incredibile e affascinante come espressioni del genere, che si usano tutti i giorni, rimangano ancora misteriose per me.  I have a loooong way to go.



"Excuse me" corrisponde allo "scusi" che si dice per esempio per introdurre una domanda fatta ad un estraneo.

"I am sorry" invece, per scusarsi di qualcosa gia' fatto.

Ovviamente, uno puo' sempre dire "excuse me" e poi pestare il piede dell'estraneo, intendiamoci.

In quel caso, pero', e' opportuno aggiungere un "I'm sorry"


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## Pasquale Gatto

This will probably not translate to all correctly but when I first learned about "figurati" it sounded to me like the "father" of an Italian American East Coast US saying "forget about it" or the more street wise version "forgetta bout it".


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