# vide-poche



## dewsy

Hello

This is a caption under a photo:

Vide-poche de belle qualité en tôle chromolithographiée.

I know what a vide-poche is - it is a thingy about the size of an ashtray where you put your keys, small change etc...

The only thing I can come up with is a 'tidy', which sounds awful as a caption.

Any ideas??
Thanks


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## Xanthius

I've never had a good translation for vide-poche in my head - normally (small) bowl is the best I can think of...

better answers please(!)


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## Lechatnoir

I doubt this is a real term but "sundries tray" sounds cute to me 

although not as cute as a tidy.  I love british english


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## dewsy

Wow! Thank you for the fast replies.

I think sundries tray sounds just perfect for the image and the style of writing


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## Lechatnoir

great! "sundries" should be pulled into play more often


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## Eclectic Stew

Some suggestions, depending on how fancy the thing is and how/where it is used:

personal/dresser/desk valet or organizer, 

or probably better for your average Joe emptying his pockets at night, a catch-all tray, or just a catch-all. 

Do a google image search for these terms and see if one fits your needs.

(I agree that "tidy" has a certain appeal, but only if you're very Bree-teesh (or feigning such)).

-- eStew


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## wildan1

If it is like this, it can be called _a valet tray_


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## Keith Bradford

We've just encountered the same question and decided on "_loose change tray_".


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## LMorland

wildan1 said:


> If it is like this, it can be called _a valet tray_


However, it's more likely to look like this.  

In which case we're back to "sundries bowl" (rather than "tray").  Or perhaps "loose change bowl".  But I do like "sundries" as well.


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## franis

It is called a valet tray


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## LMorland

franis said:


> It is called a valet tray


Bonjour, franis, and welcome to the Forum! 

[…]

Because frankly, I'm an American, and I've never heard the term _valet tray_ in my life.  And if I were to try to picture one, it wouldn't look like this _vide-poche_ here 
 or this one here   .

[…]


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## franis

[…]
I am in fact British, English. 
[…]
Valet Trays are typically made of Porcelain or Leather.
The version in which you speak of  is made of porcelain as others have said previously "It it is a thingy about the size of an ashtray where you put your keys, small change etc...".
[…]


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## Nicklondon

May I humbly confirm that Franis is absolutely spot on with his answer; it is a valet tray.


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## LMorland

Nicklondon said:


> May I humbly confirm that Franis is absolutely spot on with his answer; it is a valet tray.


Thank you, Nicklondon.  I'd just mention that the term _valet tray_ was suggested a long time ago by *wildan1*


> *If it is like this,* it can be called _a valet tray_.


_[emphasis mine]_

However, what I'm talking about looks like this, or this, or this.  None of which can be called a tray.  They are bowls.  (See Keith Bradford's contribution above.)


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## MmeC

How about "change dish" or "dresser caddy"?


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## LMorland

Thank you, MmeC!  

I think _change dish_ fits the bill very nicely!  (For this side of the pond, at least.)  And _dresser caddy_ would work well for the item that Wildan found. 

(I do like the term_ valet tray; _I just don't believe it's used much in the U.S.  And in fact, this item here is referred to as a "Valet Tray Desk or Dresser Organizer", which explanation implies that the seller feels the need to define the term "valet tray".)


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## Nicomon

Hello,

How about _trinket dish/bowl_ that I found on several bilingual sites for _vide-poche(s)? _It seems less restricive than _change dish, _which doesn't include keys, metro tickets, wallet, invoice... or any other little thing that can be found in one's pockets (especially men who don't carry purses). 

I also like _dresser caddy, _but doesn't that imply that the so called _vide-poche(s)_ is placed on a dresser? 
What if it's not, but rather on a credenza, table, bookshelf, etc.? 

I have heard _valet tray_ but I would normally associate it to an object made of leather or... organizer. As in most of these *pictures*.


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## LMorland

Nicomon said:


> How about _trinket dish/bowl_ that I found on several bilingual sites for _vide-poche(s)? _


Yeah, that's more or less along the lines of _sundries bowl, _suggested at the beginning of this thread.  However, _trinkets _to me are something that one collects, and wouldn't include spare change and metro tickets.  But if the term is already in use, I bow to it! 





Nicomon said:


> I also like _dresser caddy, _but doesn't that imply that the so called _vide-poche(s)_ is placed on a dresser?


 Yes, it does.  I have two _vide-poche(s) _[please, what is the plural form in French?!] in my apartment in Paris, and neither is located on a dresser.  In fact, I don't even own a dresser!  



			
				nicomon said:
			
		

> I have heard _valet tray_ but I would normally associate it to an [...] organizer.


Moi aussi.
 P.S.  Nicomon, I see that it's still warm enough in Montréal for bunnies to stay outdoors!


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## Nicomon

Thank you LMorland. I thought "trinket" was a (more or less) synonym of "knick knack". 

As read googling "trinket" + "loose change": 





> - Great *trinket dish* for your *loose change*, jewelry, accessories, trinkets, notes...
> - This Scalloped *Trinket Dish* holds jewelry, *loose change*, etc. and looks great doing it


 Then again, I was only trying to give another idea. "Sundries" probably works better.


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## MmeC

I stand by "dresser caddy" and "change dish". […]


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## Nicomon

I, for one, certainly didn't mean to start or continue a controversy. I'm francophone and was mainly asking about "trinket dish"... after seeing "trinket basket" in *Termium* as one possible translation of « vide-poche ». It just "sounded" less restrictive to me. I then supplied examples that I found googling... 

That said, I have nothing against "dresser caddy" or "change dish". I guess the reason why there are different solutions ("wall pocket" being another)
is that a « vide-poches » can take many different "looks" (for lack of a better word).


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## wildan1

Nicomon said:


> a « vide-poches » can take many different "looks" (for lack of a better word).


I think you have summed up the issue, Nico--everyone is right in this discussion. It just seems that this little object so neatly described in French by its function has all sorts of more specific variations in English depending on its size, use and… maybe even the gender of the intended user.


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## Keith Bradford

It's a fairly widespread phenomenon -- there seems to be a tendency for French nouns to describe function, and English nouns to describe appearance.


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## franis

Okay guys, 
I am pretty sure that I am correct when saying Valet tray can be made of two materials leather or porcelain,
In this case it is a porcelain valet tray […]

http://www.betterlivingthroughdesign.com/accessories/porcelain-vide-poche.html. After searching tirelessly for a website which backs my knowledge here it is.


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## ewie

I've always called those things _coin trays_


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## LMorland

Keith Bradford said:


> [W]hat can we do when the people who make and sell these blasted things give them so many different names?  We don't invent these terms you know, and there's no universal law that says a single thing must have a single name.


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## Nicomon

I second  LMorland.  Thank you Keith.  And thank you to Ewie, for clearly showing that "valet tray" isn't the single option in BE.  
I even found "trinket tray" on a UK website.


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## LMorland

Nicomon said:


> And thank you to Ewie, for clearly showing that "valet tray" isn't the single option in BE.


Indeed!  I just clicked on Ewie's link, and the company that markets these _coin trays_ also sells such presumably upper-class gear as Chelsea Shooting Socks! 

   Forgive my ignorance if I'm wrong -- I only hail from a former colony [i.e., the U.S.] -- but it seems to me that the sort of folk who wear _shooting socks_ might also have a _valet1 _(or at least their families once did). Which is to say that there _does _seem to be a clear distinction, even in Merry Old England, between a _valet tray _(which is large enough to have useful compartments) and a smaller bowl, or tray, that is meant for _loose change, sundries, trinkets, _or what-have-you.

________________
1 _valet: _a man's male servant who performs personal services (as taking care of clothing)


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## liline26

Hello everyone,

I am reviving this subject (not sure revive is the right word though..) because several proposals have been made and I would need to agree on one general most-used term because I need to use it in a translation for a website selling "vide-poches". So the term need to be the one most searched by people and easily understandable.

Therefore, would "coin tray" or "loose-change tray" work in that case? And does the idea not impliy that you can only put money inside but also keys etc.?

Thank you all for your help!


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## Quaeitur

For me, a _vide poche_ has an "official" name, at least in the US, which definition can be found in the dictionary (see the second definition). It's, as suggested by many here, a _*valet tray.*_


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## LMorland

liline26 said:


> Hello everyone, I am reviving this subject (not sure revive is the right word though..)


It's just right!





liline26 said:


> because several proposals have been made and I would need to agree on one general most-used term because I need to use it in a translation for a website selling "vide-poches". So the term needs to be the one most searched by people and easily understandable.
> 
> Therefore, would "coin tray" or "loose-change tray" work in that case? And does the idea not imply that you can only put money inside but also keys etc.?


I would definitely not use _coin tray,_ because that evokes a tray specifically made for sorting coins.  

I still object to the term _valet tray _because (1) it's a British English term that I'd never heard of in my life before this thread, and (2) it seems to imply compartments.  However, others proved (see above) that the term is used for _small porcelain bowls.  _Is that what your company is selling?  And where is your target audience located?  If most of your projected customers are British, you could go with valet tray.

My preferred term, however, is _sundries dish.  _Yet it's quite possible that most people wouldn't use that term to initiate a search.  Why not make the main label _valet tray, _but make sure that your web page is also tagged with _sundries dish, loose-change tray, _even _trinket bowl _so that all such search terms will drive customers to your site?


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## petit1

I have googled" *catch-all *" and "catch-all bowl" and found a lot of images corresponding to "vide-poche".


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## LMorland

Quaeitur said:


> For me, a _vide poche_ has an "official" name, at least in the US, which definition can be found in the dictionary (see the second definition). It's, as suggested by many here, a _*valet tray.*_


Yes, but... I do insist, as an American, that before I got involved on this thread I'd never heard the word _valet tray _used.  I probably did read the word in some 19th-century novel, and what I pictured in my mind is what Wildan referred to in post #7.  

The problem is that, no American -- outside the upper classes, anyway -- uses a consistent word to describe these objects.  That is, we really don't have a name for them in the U.S.  One proof: as I mentioned above, I have two _vides-poche _(if that is the correct plural) in my apartment here in Paris.  I frequently rent our apartment to North Americans, and when the topic comes up, they inevitably, _spontaneously _refer to my _vides-poche _as *ash trays.*   (They resemble, in form although not in design this, or this.)

Because that's what we always used for our "catch-all" coins, keys, etc.:  a (presumably clean) ash tray!

Just for the record!


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## liline26

Thank you all for your clear explainations!

Thank you LMorland I  edited my post to correct my mistakes. By the way concerning vide-poches  plural it is vide-poches (however there always is an S to poches even  in singular form as you do not "vide" only one "poche" in it^^, see http://www.etudes-litteraires.com/pluriel-noms-composes.php for composed words plural explaination).

As I need an expression used not only by British people I wouldn't use valet tray even if it seems to be commonly used. I cannot use ashtray as we also sell ashtrays but I like "catch-all bowl", however there are only 62 000 hints in google for about 550 000 for "loose-change bowl". Do you think it is ok to use this last expression in that context?

Thanks a lot


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## Quaeitur

liline26 said:


> As I need an expression used not only by British people I wouldn't use valet tray even if it seems to be commonly used. I cannot use ashtray as we also sell ashtrays but I like "catch-all bowl", however there are only 62 000 hints in google for about 550 000 for "loose-change bowl". Do you think it is ok to use this last expression in that context?



There are 1 380 000 hits for valet tray... (with quotation marks see "valet tray"). That's the name of the item, even though some people may never have heard of it ...


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## wildan1

Quaeitur said:


> There are 1 380 000 hits for valet tray... (with quotation marks see "valet tray"). That's the name of the item, even though some people may never have heard of it ...


Agreed--and I am neither British, upper class nor living in the 19th Century...


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## liline26

I have far less hits for "valet tray" (only 161 000, with the quotation marks like you yet) I thought we all had the same google, don't we?
Anyway thank you all for your help!


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