# Luoghi di rappresentanza famosi



## Citrinette

Original sentence:
             Tantissimi mosaici hanno decorato abitazioni e luoghi di rappresentanza famosi; dalle domus romane di imperatori dove stupire e mostrare la propria ricchezza...

My version:
                Many mosaics have decorated homes and famous rooms, take for example the Domus (homes) of Roman emperors where they tried to dazzle and show off their wealth...

I talked to the author of this and she said that "luoghi di rappresentanza famosi" means famous rooms to host famous people in, as the example suggests with the roman emperors. It would be the Oval Room at the White House in our modern culture. I just can't find a proper and appropriate translation for it.

Thanks!


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## elfa

Would "rooms for entertaining famous people" work here?

Incidentally, I'm not sure about the meaning of "Many mosaics have decorated..." Does make much sense to me ..but maybe that's just me.


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## Citrinette

Perhaps you are right, the translation was given to me already translated with google translate. parts of it are ok, others are a bit strange, others are completely off. This might be one of the strange bits. Let me try to translate it again. 

Here's what I've come up with, perhaps better than the other version:

Mosaics  have decorated many homes and rooms of importance, take for example the Domus  (homes) of Roman emperors where they tried to dazzle and show off their  wealth...

Perhaps this is better.

But I'd rather have a shorter term than "rooms for entertaining famous people". Something more formal even.


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## Paulfromitaly

Citrinette said:


> Perhaps you are right, the translation was given to me already translated with google translate. parts of it are ok, others are a bit strange, others are completely off. This might be one of the strange bits. Let me try to translate it again. I'll edit the original post.


Please do not modify the original post (the following comments would no longer make sense).
Add a new post containing the amended translation, please.


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## Citrinette

Paulfromitaly said:


> Please do not modify the original post (the following comments would no longer make sense).
> Add a new post containing the amended translation, please.




OOps I'll put it back then... I was told by another modifier on a separate occasion to modify the original post rather than post an answer... Perhaps it was a different situation.


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## Paulfromitaly

Citrinette said:


> OOps I'll put it back then... I was told by another modifier on a separate occasion to modify the original post rather than post an answer... Perhaps it was a different situation.


When you want to add further information, you can usually edit your original post, as long as once you've done that the following posts still make sense.
In this case I think it's better if you just add a new post to this thread


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## Citrinette

Paulfromitaly said:


> When you want to add further information, you can usually edit your original post, as long as by doing that the following posts still make sense.
> In this case I think it's better if you just add a new post to this thread



Yes that makes perfect sense. Indeed I think it was before anyone had answered!


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## tranquilspaces

Perhaps "iconic" rooms?

Instead of decorated, perhaps "mosaics have adorned"?


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## Citrinette

Yes those both sound good to me 

Mosaics  have adorned many homes and iconic rooms, take for example  the Domus  (homes) of Roman emperors where they tried to dazzle and show  off their  wealth...

Thanks!


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## byrne

Ok iconic here could work but di rappresentanza is a tough one...

1)I worked for an American bank which had "_uffici di rapressentanza_" here in Rome and other cities around the globe and an "agency" in Milan (for operative work)... The "_ufficio di rapressentanza_" was basically a base for meeting with government officials, big company directors etc and for staff stopping off from abroad. 

2) My mother-in-law has two drawing rooms one for everyday use (tutti giorni) one for rappresentanza (guests and entertaining)...

I've checked the other threads but with no luck... do we have some sort of equivalent?

It's somewhere for wining and dining people...!


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## CPA

_Ceremonial rooms?_


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## tranquilspaces

In a house, I would just call it a space for entertaining.


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## byrne

CPA said:


> _Ceremonial rooms?_


 
Brilliant CPA in many cases but not for the offices or my mother-in-law!

maybe there isn't a single word for the whole range of possibilities..

Office: maybe just an _office or base_? _We've got an office/base in Hong Kong..?_ But it loses the prestige of the original..

private home: _vistor's/guest's sitting/dining room_ , but it sounds like it's theirs for the duration of a long stay...

p.s. Sorry Shannon saw yours after, I think you are right...


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## CPA

byrne said:


> Brilliant CPA in many cases but not for the offices or my mother-in-law!
> 
> maybe there isn't a single word for the whole range of possibilities..
> 
> Office: maybe just an _office or base_? _We've got an office/base in Hong Kong..?_ But it loses the prestige of the original..
> 
> private home: _vistor's/guest's sitting/dining room_ , but it sounds like it's theirs for the duration of a long stay...


 
Er, I thought Citrinette was referring to _Ancient Rome _and drawing parallels to the Oval Office...

Your mother-in-law might have a _Sunday parlour._

An office might have an _executive boardroom._


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## byrne

CPA said:


> Er, I thought Citrinette was referring to _Ancient Rome _and drawing parallels to the Oval Office...
> 
> Your mother-in-law might have a _Sunday parlour._
> 
> An office might have an _executive boardroom._


 

I totally agree that  _Ceremonial Rooms_ for Citrinette is perfect


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## Citrinette

Ceremonial sounds as if they held ceremonies in these rooms, I don't actually know if they did or not. When I compared it to the Oval office, it was to parallel the similarities in receiving important guests. But are ceremonies actually held in these rooms? 

I'm still leaning towards "Iconic".


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## elfa

Citrinette said:


> Ceremonial sounds as if they held ceremonies in these rooms, I don't actually know if they did or not. When I compared it to the Oval office, it was to parallel the similarities in receiving important guests. But are ceremonies actually held in these rooms?
> 
> I'm still leaning towards "Iconic".



If I can pitch in here, I would go for "ceremonial rooms" too. To me it denotes rooms where important and stately happenings take place which *include* the reception of important guests. I don't think it means necessarily that ceremonies were held there.


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## Citrinette

Elfa: You have convinced me  I'll use ceremonial rooms.

THANKS EVERYONE!


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## Samu!

Hello everyone,
this meaning of "rappresentanza" seems to be quite tough to translate!

My addition to this thread concerns a slightly different maeaning of "di rappresentanza" I'd like to conceive:

"international fashion brands have chains of own (monobrand) shops, which mainly fall in two categories:
1. *negozi/sedi di rappresentanza* in famous and fashionable places (e.g. Times Square in NYC, the Champs Elysèe in Paris)
2. mass-consumer shops in malls, designer outlets and the like"

*Would that "negozi/sedi di rappresentanza" be "showrooms"? Or "boutiques"?*
I'd like to conceive the idea that these shops are not only made for shopping, but also for brand-making.

Thank you!


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## elfa

Samu! said:


> *Would that "negozi/sedi di rappresentanza" be "showrooms"? Or "boutiques"?*
> I'd like to conceive the idea that these shops are not only made for shopping, but also for brand-making.



_Flagship store _is something you hear in the UK.


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## Samu!

elfa said:


> _Flagship store _is something you hear in the UK.


 
Nice! (and quick too)

From the description I found on this wiki page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flagship#Flagship_stores
it's exactly what I was looking for, thank you very much!


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## elfa

Samu! said:


> Nice! (and quick too)
> 
> From the description I found on this wiki page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flagship#Flagship_stores
> it's exactly what I was looking for, thank you very much!



You're welcome!


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## tranquilspaces

elfa said:


> _Flagship store _is something you hear in the UK.



We use it here too.


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## occhibelli

elfa said:


> If I can pitch in here, I would go for "ceremonial rooms" too. To me it denotes rooms where important and stately happenings take place which *include* the reception of important guests. I don't think it means necessarily that ceremonies were held there.


 
This is very tough, since the term covers so many disparate spaces. A rappresentanza, for example, is also a diplomatic mission, which does not necessarily have a ceremonial room. A rappresentante can be a sales person but also a diplomat, an ambassador. Perhaps you could refer to "reception" rooms or areas, an all-purpose term.


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## Puffarbacco

I've found the term "state room" or "stateroom". Wikipedia says that "The term was most widely used in the 17th and 18th centuries" for european mansions. Could it be used for the description of an ancient roman _domus_? Maybe it seems exaggerated...


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## london calling

Puffarbacco said:


> I've found the term "state room" or "stateroom". Wikipedia says that "The term was most widely used in the 17th and 18th centuries" for european mansions. Could it be used for the description of an ancient roman _domus_? Maybe it seems exaggerated...


_Domus_ means house, not room, and we use 'domus' in English  when talking about mansions in Ancient Rome in any case.

Welcome.


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## Tellure

Puffarbacco said:


> I've found the term "state room" or "stateroom". Wikipedia says that "The term was most widely used in the 17th and 18th centuries" for european mansions. Could it be used for the description of an ancient roman _domus_? Maybe it seems exaggerated...


Forse sarebbe meglio se tu postassi l'intera frase che contiene l'espressione che devi tradurre.


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## Odysseus54

Puffarbacco said:


> I've found the term "state room" or "stateroom". Wikipedia says that "The term was most widely used in the 17th and 18th centuries" for european mansions. Could it be used for the description of an ancient roman _domus_? Maybe it seems exaggerated...



I like 'state room', and I think it could be used in the description of a Roman domus to mean its main reception hall (tablinum).  However, the OP is about 'luoghi di rappresentanza'.  I read that as 'cerimonial rooms/halls' or similar, which was already suggested seven years ago.

Are you still working on the OP from seven years ago, or do you have something else in mind ? If you do, please let us have the sentence to translate, the context and your translation attempt.


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## london calling

Odysseus54 said:


> I like 'state room', and I think it could be used in the description of a Roman domus to mean its main reception hall (tablinum).


Appunto. _State room_ potrebbe indicare una stanza del domus, non traduce 'domus'.


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## Odysseus54

london calling said:


> Appunto. _State room_ potrebbe indicare una stanza del domus, non traduce 'domus'.



Chi ha detto che traduce 'domus' ?


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## Puffarbacco

Odysseus54 said:


> I like 'state room', and I think it could be used in the description of a Roman domus to mean its main reception hall (tablinum).  However, the OP is about 'luoghi di rappresentanza'.  I read that as 'cerimonial rooms/halls' or similar, which was already suggested seven years ago.
> 
> Are you still working on the OP from seven years ago, or do you have something else in mind ? If you do, please let us have the sentence to translate, the context and your translation attempt.



Yes, using "state room" I was trying to describe the main "public" rooms (vestibule and _atrium_), in opposition to the private part of the domus.
I was just reading this thread that it's about "luoghi di rappresentanza", but in the first sentence I think it means "sale di rappresentanza". Anyway I thought that the translation "Cerimonial rooms" doesn't suit my description.
Describing this particular domus, I'm trying to say that some specific decorations were limited to the staterooms in order to impress visitors. My attempt to translate the sentence "Le decorazioni erano probabilmente limitate agli ambienti di rappresentanza della domus, come atrio e vestibolo" is this:

The presence of the decorated trabeation was probably concentrated in the _atrium_ and in the vestibule, the staterooms of the domus.

Thanks to all.
Bye


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## london calling

Odysseus54 said:


> Chi ha detto che traduce 'domus' ?


Puff:



Puffarbacco said:


> I've found the term "state room" or "stateroom". Wikipedia says that "The term was most widely used in the 17th and 18th centuries" for european mansions. *Could it be used for the description of an ancient roman domus?* Maybe it seems exaggerated...


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## Puffarbacco

london calling said:


> Puff:


Yes, but I meant the description of some rooms of the domus, not the entire one! Sorry, it was a bad explanation.


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## london calling

Puffarbacco said:


> Yes, but I meant the description of some rooms of the domus, not the entire one! Sorry, it was a bad explanation.


Grazie del chiarimento.


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## Tellure

Puffarbacco said:


> Yes, using "state room" I was trying to describe the main "public" rooms (vestibule and _atrium_), in opposition to the private part of the domus.



Spero che questo documento possa esserti utile:

On the basis of the above observations, we should probably acknowledge the absence of any clear term to define the rooms, which were designated for the accommodation of formal ceremonies and for the house-owner's self-presentation.
The English language has no adequate term for this room-type. There is no equivalent in
English for the Italian *Sale di rappresentanza or Saloni*, which conveys ideas of prestige and power attached to men holding public office. The widely term "*reception room*" has slightly different connotations. The word lays stress upon the action of receiving guests
in a formal or ceremonious manner: in this sense, the triclinium is also a place of
reception, but, within the customs of Roman social life, the cubiculum too is a place of
reception, though on a different scale. The need for a term that defines a room-type is
not a mere question of terminology. Bearing in mind that each room of Roman domestic
buildings housed a variety of activities, categorizing the domestic spaces by terms, though generic, may help us to define a series' of settings adapted for different activities.
As rooms set for a gathering of people for the purpose of social entertainment, they may be defined as "*assembly-rooms*". The term is borrowed from the domestic architecture of 18th century England. In the "social house", like in the Roman domus, distinctions of rank and etiquette were dominant. In a world affected by mobility, social success depended partly on the ability to cement personal bonds and receive favours from the patronus. The game of contacts with others of varying social rank was mainly played out in country houses, which were an advertisement of the culture, education, and wealth of their owners. Consequently, the social house of the period, like the Roman house, was made up of an increasing number of public meeting places arranged for different social events. Along with the dining room, as the biggest and most richly decorated room of the house, a variety of assembly-rooms were intended for different types of entertainments (playing cards, drinking tea, or just walking and talking).
*Though on a different scale and social pattern, the term 'assembly-rooms' may be
applied to certain spaces in the Romano-African house, where the owner met his guests on social occasions and displayed his status.*
https://www.google.it/url?sa=t&sour..._Bc4QFgguMAI&usg=AOvVaw2MR-dp9dJAe2V_U6nSJRF1

Se hai tempo e modo, ti consiglio di continuare la lettura di questo testo molto interessante.


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## Puffarbacco

Grazie molto interessante!


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## il-saggio

_Luogo di rappresentanza, sede di rappresentanza, giardino di rappresentanza, palazzo di rappresentanza..._ 
These are _showcase-places_ created to hit who observe, as a spectator, and give him a sensation of greatness referred to the owner. The place has the purpose, or the task, to communicate a political, economic or social meaning.

I believe we could call them _representative locations/places_, but this is only the point of view of an italian who lives in italy, I have no idea if it's used or sounds alien!

I have an example: I own a company which produces red vehicles in the middle of Italy, I need to transform my headquarters into something that contribute to make my name become a myth. 

I hope this few words can help to face this _tough_ argument! 
Greetings from Florence!


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## london calling

il-saggio said:


> _Luogo di rappresentanza, sede di rappresentanza, giardino di rappresentanza, palazzo di rappresentanza..
> _
> I believe we could call them _representative locations/places_, but this is only the point of view of an italian who lives in italy, I have no idea if it's used or sounds alien!


Definitely not English.


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## il-saggio

london calling said:


> Definitely not English.



I tried...


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## Flaviam88

CPA said:


> _Ceremonial rooms?_


Yes. As an architectural and art historian I agree that they are ceremonial rooms.


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