# froides proies ourdie



## Bobbum

I'm a bit puzzled by these lines by poet Olivier Larronde:
_Si je suis ... d'une autre _é_toffe,
                    La trame n'en est pas de vos oiseaux de mer
                    Mais de leurs froides proies ourdie.
_Could it be: If I'm made of other stuff, the frame isn't made of your sea birds but of their warped cold prows? 
I don't get it.


----------



## Franco-filly

Proies here is their prey.  Cold, gnarled prey?


----------



## Bobbum

I realized that mistake shortly after sending but was too busy to go back and edit. The meaning is still rather vague. James Dickey (_Delivrance) _uses the quote on the intro page of _To The White Sea._


----------



## hampton.mc

Froides proies ourdie(s) are you sure there is no s for ourdie?
Froides proies sont les poissons


----------



## Bobbum

There's no s. May be a misprint.
After ample consideration I think I get it now. He's identifying with the not-so-pretty side of nature.


----------



## hampton.mc

Bobbum said:


> I'm a bit puzzled by these lines by poet Olivier Larronde
> _Si je suis ... d'une autre _é_toffeLa trame n'en est pas de vos oiseaux de me Mais de leurs froides proies ourdie.
> _Could it be: If I'm made of other stuff, the frame isn't made of your sea birds but of their warped cold prows?
> I don't get it.



La trame n'en est pas tisser par vos oiseaux  marins mais par leurs froides proies.
(in this case it refers to the fish!)
The confusing bit here is "ourdie" refers to the fabric but it's place at the end of the sentence (poetic form)


----------



## hampton.mc

No my mistake, there is no s because it refers to the fabric and not to the fish!!


----------



## hampton.mc

He is identifies with the preys (the victims) and not with the predators


----------



## hampton.mc

Does it make more sense? Or I wasn't clear enough?


----------



## Cath.S.

Bobbum said:


> I'm a bit puzzled by these lines by poet Olivier Larronde:
> _Si je suis ... d'une autre _é_toffe,
> La trame n'en est pas de vos oiseaux de mer
> Mais de leurs froides proies ourdie.
> _Could it be: If I'm made of other stuff, the frame isn't made of your sea birds but of their warped cold prows?
> I don't get it.


My own (pathetic) attempt:
_If I am made of a different cloth, its weave was not plotted by your marine birds but by their frigid prey._


----------



## hampton.mc

Sounds good to me cath


----------



## Cath.S.

hampton.mc said:


> Sounds good to me cath


Merci, mais tu n'es pas difficile. 
Ça manque carrément de rythme.


----------



## Cath.S.

hampton.mc said:


> Sounds good to me cath


Merci, mais tu n'es pas difficile. 
Ça manque carrément de rythme.
Sans compter d'autres défauts qui m'échappent mais dont je sens la présence.


----------



## hampton.mc

Tu en as bien saisi le sens


----------



## Bobbum

Merci Cath, hampton and Franco-filly. You've shed some light on the subject. Cath your attempt was not pathetic at all. I love it.


----------



## Cath.S.

Bobbum said:


> Merci Cath, hampton and Franco-filly. You've shed some light on the subject. Cath your attempt was not pathetic at all. I love it.


Merci. C'est gentil de dire ça.  Mais il est déjà difficile de traduire de la poésie vers sa propre langue, alors,  dans l'autre sens...


----------



## Bobbum

I'm amazed at how well the French have mastered the English language. 50 years ago it was a different story. I spent a year as teaching assistant in Bordeaux and the first thing my professor said to me was, "How long do you have been here in Bordeaux?" Without a native speaker as assistant he would have been lost. Now they are translating poetry into my language that is beyond my grasp. Amazing!


----------



## hampton.mc

Will take it as a compliment


----------



## Cath.S.

Au nom de la Nation française toute entière, qui se tient derrière le fauteuil de mon bureau et retient son souffle alliacé tout en lisant par dessus mon épaule, j'ai l'honneur d'accepter ce compliment.


----------



## Meille

Sans vouloir insulter ni toi ni la foule derrière , je suggère quelque très petits changements:

_If I am *cut from* a different cloth, its weave was not *designed/conceived* by your marine birds but by their frigid prey._


----------



## Cath.S.

Meille said:


> Sans vouloir insulter ni toi ni la foule derrière , je suggère quelque*s* très petits changements:
> 
> _If I am *cut from* a different cloth, its weave was not *designed/conceived* by your marine birds but by their frigid prey._


J'avais bien dit que mon essai était lamentable.
Dommage pour _plot_, ceci dit, que j'avais choisi (à tort, certainement) parce qu'il rendait le sens d'_ourdir_ (*= tramer,* un complot, une machination).
By the way, the crowd is yelling "Off with Meille's heac!" but I am trying to talk them out of doing irreparable harm.


----------



## Meille

Pas du tout lamentable.
Je suis d'accord, on cherche (*je *cherche, en tout cas) quelque chose entre 'plotted' et 'conceived'.

Je l'ai! *Contrived*!

As for the crowd... pfff! Let them eat cake!


----------



## Cath.S.

C'est bien, mais il manque le double sens d'ourdir.
Pourquoi pas tout simplement employer _weave_, qui a plusieurs sens dont ceux que nous cherchons ?


----------



## Meille

D'accord, 'woven' fait parfaitement.
Mais là, on est pris avec 'its weave was woven'.

Alors:

If I am cut from a different cloth, it was woven not by your (je veux toujours dire ici 'birds of prey' mais non) seabirds but by their frigid prey.


----------



## Cath.S.

Meille said:


> D'accord, 'woven' fait parfaitement.
> Mais là, on est pris avec 'its weave was woven'.
> 
> Alors:
> 
> If I am cut from a different cloth, it was woven not by your (je veux toujours dire ici 'birds of prey' mais non) seabirds but by their frigid prey.


Excellent.


----------



## Bobbum

Bien que l'original n'est pas rimé, on pourrait facilement le faire. (Selon mon dictionnaire, on peut employer ou _wove _ou _woven_ comme participle passé.)

                                    I am wove in a different way
                                    Not as your seabirds but their prey


----------



## Bobbum

Maybe better:

                     I am wove in a different way
                     Not _of _your seabirds but their prey


----------



## Cath.S.

It's good, Bobburn, but the notion of cold is missing.


----------



## Bobbum

I am wove in a colder way
                  Not of your seabirds but their prey


----------



## Cath.S.

Bobbum said:


> I am wove in a colder way
> Not of your seabirds but their prey


Je doute que quiconque puisse faire mieux. J'espère que notre aide à tous t'aura été de quelque utilité


----------



## Bobbum

Merci pour votre tolérance.


----------

