# Negrito



## pat_efc

Hola a todos,

No sé si os sabeis sobre la polemica que sigue Luis Suarez - futbolista uruguayo.

Se dice aquí, en la prensa inglesa, que durante un partido, Luis Suarez dijo 'negrito' muchas veces a Patrice Evra (futbolista negro), probablemente para molestarle. Esta noche se ha prohibido jugar a Luis Suarez durante 8 partidos. Me preguntaba si en su cultura, si se dice esta frase se considera racista o no? O depende del contexto o la relacion entre las personas que hablan? Qué piensan los usuarios uruguayos de aquí?

Y por favor corregid mi espanol.

Muchas Gracias


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## gengo

I don't see how referring to the race of an opposing player during a game could be considered anything but racist in any country or language.  I haven't spent enough time in Uruguay to know exactly how this word is used there, but it seems pretty obvious to me that such terms would be frowned upon.  That is, regardless of whether the word negrito is used in Uruguay in a way that corresponds to nigger, or is used neutrally to refer to those of African descent, it isn't sportsman-like to mention a person's race in such a context.


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## Filis Cañí

Unless you are referring to a black baby, calling someone _negrito_ is meant to offend. It is like calling an adult Black man "boy".


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## Adolfo Afogutu

I completely agree with gengo. Negrito (a) is often used by someone’s partner as a loving nickname, but in that context it is one of the two, either Suárez wanted to have an affair with Patrice Evra , or he wanted him to react and see the red card.


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## Vampiro

No es un comentario racista, más bien hinchapelotas, buscando algún tipo de reacción.  Sí, tiene un tinte despectivo, pero no racista.
Uffff... me olvidé que acá hay que hablar en inglé... bueno, ustedes lo traducen.
Siyutumorrou
_


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## IvanJo

The Uruguayans use that word to refer to someone in a sweet way. However, I think in that case it was kind of derogatory, but not racist.


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## Roberto_Mendoza

I agree with the comments about "negrito" having an affectionate connotation in some contexts; I use it to refer to one of my best friends (that's his nickname, "Negro"). However, to say that Suárez meant to use the word in a provocative way, but that it wasn't racist... Where does the provocation come from, then, if it wasn't meant to refer to the Evra's race? 

The truth is that these types of provocations happen all the time in a soccer field, but that doesn't make them acceptable. I suspect the Premier League is trying to set an example with Suárez. The paradox is that oftentimes, these types of sanctions generate an overreaction, and that's how we end up with political correctness.


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## duvija

OK, I'll say something I really keep fighting against. It's not racism. We do call people names that should be racist/classist/whatever in any other language, but ... Uruguayan people say it's not racist, so it isn't. We call each other 'negrito/a, ñato/a, gordo/a, flaco/a, petiso/a,  etc.'. And that's normal. 
Technically, the defense is that we can do it, cuz it's tender. And there is no history of racism, at least openly. Not too much slavery (mostly for housework) and then slavery was abolished pretty early. The result is that we have more blacks than any other southern country, because the Brazilian slaves ran away from Brazil and into Uruguay, and then they were free. No lynching, no nothing... So the word 'black' does NOT have the connotations that the English word has. This is true.

Then, if we really should call people by some physical carachteristics, is a complex issue.

(The fact that I personally don't like that usage, is irrelevant. I'm always fighting against people who try to convince I'm wrong and they're right). 
(BTW, I was always 'negrita/flaca/petisa')


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## Obnubilado

La gente en Inglaterra o Irlanda puede ser consciente de la polémica actual sobre esta palabra - negrito. Luis Suarez, un futolista uruguayo con Liverpool, acaba de recibir una suspensión de 8 partidos, y una multa de,....no estoy seguro....40,000 libras inglesas...,  para abuso racista de un jugador negro de Manchester United, Patrice Evra. Suarez le llamó a Evra 'negrito' unas cuantas veces durante un partido hace unos meses. 

Suarez dice, en su defensa, que en Uruguay esta palabra no tiene conotaciones racistas. ¿Qué piensa la gente aquí de eso?


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## Go Blue

Fui criada en los estados unidos y se muy bien el problema del racismo...pero vivia 17 años en latino america (Chile, Argentina y URUGUAY) y es cierto que no tiene conotaciones racistas.  Si tiene nariz grande le dicen narigona...si está gorda, le dicen gordita, si tiene piel morena le dicen negro/negrito.  No es un desprecio.

Janet


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## chileno

Go Blue said:


> Fui criada en los estados unidos y se muy bien el problema del racismo...pero vivia 17 años en latino america (Chile, Argentina y URUGUAY) y es cierto que no tiene conotaciones racistas.  Si tiene nariz grande le dicen narigona...si está gorda, le dicen gordita, si tiene piel morena le dicen negro/negrito.  No es un desprecio.
> 
> Janet



Totalmente de acuerdo.

No sé exactamente que le dijo, pero seguro no es por racismo.

Incluso enojado, le puede haber dicho ¿Qué te pasa negro de mierda? y aún así, ni siquiera va por racismo.


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## IvanJo

Go Blue said:


> Fui criada en los estados unidos y se muy bien el problema del racismo...pero vivia 17 años en latino america (Chile, Argentina y URUGUAY) y es cierto que no tiene conotaciones racistas.  Si tiene nariz grande le dicen narigona...si está gorda, le dicen gordita, si tiene piel morena le dicen negro/negrito.  No es un desprecio.
> 
> Janet



Es verdad, pero dependiendo del tono en el que se dicen, los diminutivos podrían ser despectivos. Como un intento de minimizar a la persona: Que le pasa a ese gordito, que se cree ese negrito.

Pero no es racista.


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## Obnubilado

chileno said:


> Incluso enojado, le puede haber dicho ¿Qué te pasa negro de mierda? y aún así, ni siquiera va por racismo.



Si 'negro de mierda' no es racista, ¿qué es? O sea, he leído algunos comentarios en los dos hilos sobre eso, diciendo que no es racista, entonces si eso no es, ¿cómo se puede ser racista? ¿Qué más se puede decir?


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## IvanJo

Obnubilado said:


> Si 'negro de mierda' no es racista, ¿qué es? O sea, he leído algunos comentarios en los dos hilos sobre eso, diciendo que no es racista, entonces si eso no es, ¿cómo se puede ser racista? ¿Qué más se puede decir?



Yo sí creo que si te dicen: "Negro de mierda" es racista.


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## Go Blue

It would be like saying someone is "full of shit" (USA), but that is not racist - it's about the person's attitude/actions. "Who does he think he is????"  Negro comes from latin and has to do with color not RACISM.  It may be rude - but certainly not racist.


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## IvanJo

Lo que yo creo es que si te dicen "xxxx de mierda" xxxx se refiere a un "defecto" con el objetivo de insultar. Como decir gordo de mierda o enamo de mierda. Y si el emisor piensa ser negro es un defecto, entonces, es racista.

Saludos


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## andy town

Hello. Yo también creo que es racismo, pero si no piensan igual en Uruguay ¿qué le vamos a hacer? Que yo sepa, en España, no es lo mismo llamarle a uno "hijo de puta" en Sevilla que en Bilbao.
Andy


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## pat_efc

But I would argue that Luis Suarez is not playing football in Uruguay at the moment, and that he was not speaking to a Uruguayan - so there would be no mutual understanding.

In English the term 'little black man' is purely descriptive in it's isolated form but if one was to say it repeatedly to a black person it would be deemed racist as there it is used in a derogatory way.

Y les pregunto a los uruguayos, que 'negrito' es una palabra que hace referencia a la raza de alguien, asi que si se diera esa frase en una manera despectiva, como lo de Suarez, ciertamente es racista no?


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## chileno

Obnubilado said:


> Si 'negro de mierda' no es racista, ¿qué es? O sea, he leído algunos comentarios en los dos hilos sobre eso, diciendo que no es racista, entonces si eso no es, ¿cómo se puede ser racista? ¿Qué más se puede decir?




You are from a racist country, so anything can be considered racist, if said in another tone of voice. 

I am from Chile, and I can tell you that if I say " hola mi negro/negrito" it cannot be considered racist. What's more, it is used as a term of endearment.

Of course I can get mad and tell you "Qué te pasa gueón/negro de mierda?" and still is not racist, just an angry statement.

Again, I know it is difficult for someone like you to understand that because you were raised differently.

That's all.


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## chileno

pat_efc said:


> But I would argue that Luis Suarez is not playing football in Uruguay at the moment, and that he was not speaking to a Uruguayan - so there would be no mutual understanding.
> 
> In English the term 'little black man' is purely descriptive in it's isolated form but if one was to say it repeatedly to a black person it would be deemed racist as there it is used in a derogatory way.
> 
> Y les pregunto a los uruguayos, que 'negrito' es una palabra que hace referencia a la raza de alguien, asi que si se diera esa frase en una manera despectiva, como lo de Suarez, ciertamente es racista no?




Negrito is used more often as a term of endearment.

Now, consider the word "kid"

If I tell you, even if I don't know you much, "Hi there kid, how may I help you?" is that derogatory? Is that racist?

Granted, if you and I and friends and we are playing say ping pong, and I say "This is gonna be easier than taking a candy from a kid" uh, kid?

That I would take it as to poke fun and see if I get to your nerves, right?

Is that racist or even derogatory in any way?


As much as it might be impossible for you to think about, it is a fact that there are countries that are not racist.


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## Vampiro

chileno said:


> As much as it might be impossible for you to think about, it is a fact that there are countries that are not racist.


I would say "not racist at all".
That's the point in this thread.  For us (I mean South America) is normal to call "negrito, negro, gordo pelado, chino, petiso, cholo, etc" to somebody, and there not problem at all with that.
Anyway, I smell to scisors today.
Bye.
_


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## duvija

Well, I would use the example of 'boy'. Clearly, you wouldn't use it in the USA, but you may call your own child by that name. Don't you think?

And before we go on with Suárez and his lack of uruguayness, have you seen his face? of course, in Uruguay, he's 'negrito'. 
And no, 'little black man' is NOT the translation for 'negrito'. You cannot translate one single word into three, and still maintain the same 'register' usage. Yes, if you want to stick to the definition, you may do what you want, but no one, in Uruguay or anywhere else, would call somebody 'hombre negro chiquito' (which is the real translation of your sentence). Register counts, ok?

And I really hate the word 'negrito', but that doesn't make me think I should generalize and force other people not to use it. Each one, in their environment, should decide. 
Trust me: I learnt real 'racism'  in the USA. I didn't know how bad it was, before I came to this country. And I'm Jewish, so I've heard 'judía de mierda' more than once. So I try to explain, but it never works. It's really ingrained, so there is some leeway somewhere.


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## chileno

Vampiro said:


> I would say "*not racist at all*".
> That's the point in this thread. For us (I mean South America) is normal to call "negrito, negro, gordo pelado, chino, petiso, cholo, etc" to somebody, and there not problem at all with that.
> Anyway, I smell to scisors today.
> Bye.
> _



You are right on the first count, on the second one... I think you might be off.  

At least this time.... but we'll see.


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## Obnubilado

chileno said:


> You are from a racist country, so anything can be considered racist, if said in another tone of voice.
> 
> I am from Chile, and I can tell you that if I say " hola mi negro/negrito" it cannot be considered racist. What's more, it is used as a term of endearment.
> 
> Of course I can get mad and tell you "Qué te pasa gueón/negro de mierda?" and still is not racist, just an angry statement.
> 
> Again, I know it is difficult for someone like you to understand that because you were raised differently.



'Someone like me?'..... ¿en serio?¿me conoces personalmente? ¿Y sabes como me educaron? Debes tener poderes psíquicos. No entiendo por que tienes que hacer un ataque personal en el medio de una discusión  sobre un tema del lenguaje. Eso es rarísimo y muestra una actitud muy defensiva y hóstil. 

También.....'you are from a racist country'? ¿Conoces bien Irlanda? ¿Has vivido aquí? Claro que hay racistas aquí, como en Chile, como en todos los lados. Pero 'a racist country'? ¿Cómo lo sabes? Y me parece que estás diciendo que en Chile hay un nível especial de convivencia entre las razas que no existe en otras partes, por lo menos en mi país. ¿Qué evidencia tienes para esta opinión?

Tu mensaje es el más estraño que alguna vez vi en este foro. Repito, si 'negro de mierda' no es racista, ¿qué es?


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## duvija

Obnubilado said:


> . Repito, si 'negro de mierda' no es racista, ¿qué es?



Oh, did Suarez say 'negro de mierda'? (I should read a newspaper, then).


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## Obnubilado

chileno said:


> As much as it might be impossible for you to think about, it is a fact that there are countries that are not racist.



Esta idea de que hay países racistas y no racistas es un disparate total. ¿No existen racistas en Chile? ¿O en Uruguay? ¿Ningunos? Perdona, pero no lo creo. 

Si crees que hay países en que no existe el racismo, supongo que quieres decir como en Chile o Uruguay, por ejemplo, estás viviendo en una fantasía.


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## IvanJo

duvija said:


> Oh, did Suarez say 'negro de mierda'? (I should read a newspaper, then).



I think that here in Perú is like that:

Hola negrito/gordito/flaquito -- Forma cariñosa de llamar a un amigo.
Ese negrito/gordito/flaquito quien se cree -- Menosprecio
Negro de mierda: -- Racismo.

It depends on how is used.

I don't think Suarez said "Negro de Mierda", this comes from someone who said that to say "Negro de mierda" is not racist in Uruguay. What do you think duvija?


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## Obnubilado

duvija said:


> Oh, did Suarez say 'negro de mierda'? (I should read a newspaper, then).



Oh please. If you even read the thread you would see I was answering Chileno who claims that 'negro de mierda' is not racist. I never said that that was what Suarez said. And 'negrito' clearly can be affectionate, if said to a friend. But Patrice Evra was not his friend, in fact, Liverpool and Man United hate each other, and Suarez was clearly using his race to try and insult him, or affect how he played. I think we can be sure that he wasn't using it as a term of endearment.


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## Roberto_Mendoza

I will repeat: I agree that in many (all?) Latin American countries, and Spain,  the words "negro", "gordo", "chaparro" or whatever might be used as a term of endearment. I use them with my friends and they use them with me.

That being said, are some of you really arguing that Suárez actually called Evra "negrito" in a kind, endearing way, and that this is all a big misunderstanding? Give me a break! For all I know, Suárez is not a racist, but the truth is he sought to provoke Evra by taunting him about his skin color. 

The problem, I believe, stems from the fact that we sometimes feel represented by public figures, like Suárez, and feel the need to justify or explain their attitudes, as though the whole country were just like them. The truth is that Suárez is not representative of Uruguay or any other Latin American country. There are all kinds of people in almost every country, including racists.

As far as the claim that there are countries where racism just doesn't exist... I would like to see one. That doesn't mean that all racist attitudes take the same form or that are validated by official policies (institutional racism), but discrimination of some sort, specially based on real or perceived ethnic differences, exists nonetheless. Don't feel alluded to and don't get defensive; it's not an accusation against you as a person (whether you are from Uruguay, Chile, Argentina, Spain, Mexico, Colombia, Brasil, etc.), it's the acknowledgment of one of the ugly sides of society in general.  I feel that the sooner we recognize that a problem exists (without falling into the p.c. trap), the better equipped we are to deal with it and ameliorate it.  At least those are my 2 cents. Cheers.

P.S. Merry Christmas to everyone.


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## gengo

Muy bien dicho, Roberto.


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## Vampiro

Obnubilado said:


> Esta idea de que hay países racistas y no racistas es un disparate total. ¿No existen racistas en Chile? ¿O en Uruguay? ¿Ningunos? Perdona, pero no lo creo.
> 
> Si crees que hay países en que no existe el racismo, supongo que quieres decir como en Chile o Uruguay, por ejemplo, estás viviendo en una fantasía.


Por supuesto que hay, pero el racismo no es parte de nuestra cultura ni forma parte de nuestros problemas diarios.
Y si no que lo digan los extranjeros que hoy en día llegan por miles a vivir a Chile.
Acá un diario puede poner como titular “El Negro Piñera se fue de parranda” y el señor Piñera no va a demandar a nadie por eso, tampoco se escuchará ninguna voz mencionando la palabra racismo por cosas como esa y ejemplos debe haber miles.
Me retiro de este hilo.
Si fue por decir “negrito” no estoy de acuerdo con el castigo a Suárez, si dijo “negro de mierda” se merece un tirón de orejas por el insulto, pero ocho partidos es una exageración propia de países con la piel demasiado sensible.
_


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## Obnubilado

Estoy totalmente de acuerdo con lo que ha dicho Roberto Mendoza arriba.


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## ptak30

The OP didn't  ask how this term was to be translated but whether in their culture the  forum members would regard it as racist, and whether it depended on the  relationship between the speaker and the one spoken to. He went on to  ask specifically about the views of the Uruguayans.

We regard all derogatory comments about the race,  colour or creed of a person as being actionable at law - so *negrito* would be regarded as racist at law and by the general public in the UK (*negrito *being  translated as  "Nigger"). As far as I know Suarez  hasn't been charged  by the crown (police), only by the Football Association. He's lucky.

 Perhaps *negrito* is a term of endearment in Uruguay, where it appears that it is _normal_  for people to be called names according to their physical  characteristics. ¡Que chapero tullido! would be normal banter which any  cripple in Uruguay would regard as a more-than-friendly epithet. If that  is polemical, I'm afraid it is down to the nature of the original  question and not our honest attempts to answer it. However I would point out that the answers to this question from the forum members of some countries have been most informative -saying that there is no problem is how stereotypes are perpetuated.

As one final point about the word* negrito* and the use of the dimimuitive. It seems to me, that many ex-colonial countries tend to use diminuitives a lot (Mexico and Australia to name just two). The diminuitive may have been used as a sort of babytalk to ingratiate themselves with the people in power but as that tone is no longer required one can now just regard it as a form of dialect.


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## lauranazario

Compañeros del foro:

Este hilo ya se ha apartado bastante del tema de la consulta original y ha pasado a otros aspectos de índole subjetiva que no son materia de discusión del foro de Vocabulario.

Hilo cerrado.

LN - Moderadora


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