# Etymology of Persian خیر/xeyr/xayr "no"



## PersoLatin

According to Wiktionary: "From Arabic _خَيْر_‎ (ḵayr), possibly via Persian _خیر_‎ (xayr)", is there a more certain answer to this please?


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## fredoon

I don't completely understand your question, but I guess this could help you.
خِیر in Farsi means "No", as you pronounced it. 
_خَيْر_ simply means "goodness" in Arabic but in Farsi is common to pronounce خِیر with this meaning!


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## PersoLatin

Thank you.

I wanted to know whether خیر that is used in Persian with the meaning “no”, is a word of Persian origin. In the link I provided it says “it is possibly from Persian”


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## desi4life

PersoLatin said:


> According to Wiktionary: "From Arabic _خَيْر_‎ (ḵayr), possibly via Persian _خیر_‎ (xayr)", is there a more certain answer to this please?



Under the Persian Etymology 2 section, it’s stated to be a “Clipping of نه خیر‎ (na xeyr)”. You seem to have mistakenly looked at the etymology of Urdu خیر which is stated to be "From Arabic خَيْر‎ (ḵayr), possibly via Persian خیر‎ (xayr)".


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## PersoLatin

desi4life said:


> Under the Persian Etymology 2 section, it’s stated to be a “Clipping of نه خیر‎ (na xeyr)”.


Thank you. 

I still don't see in there a meaning for this 'Persian' خیر, in نه خیر or نخیر.


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## desi4life

PersoLatin said:


> Thank you.
> 
> I still don't see in there a meaning for this 'Persian' خیر, in نه خیر or نخیر.



The meaning is stated right below the Etymology 2 section:

Persian

Etymology 1
From Arabic خَيْر‎ (ḵayr).

Pronunciation
(Classical Persian): IPA(key): /xajɾ/
(Dari): IPA(key): /xajɾ/
(Iranian Persian): IPA(key): /xejɾ/
(Tajik): IPA(key): /xajɾ/

Noun
خیر • (xeyr)
1. good

Etymology 2
Clipping of نه خیر‎ (na xeyr).

Adverb
خیر • (xeyr)
1. (formal) no
Synonyms: نه‎ (na), (formal) نخیر‎ (na-xeyr), (formal) نه خیر‎ (na-xeyr)


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## PersoLatin

Many thanks desi4life for taking time on this, I am however sure I am missing a trick here, is the answer staring me in the face but I can't see it?

Etymology 1: I know خیر/xeyr means "good" in Arabic & I am desperately hoping that this is not the same خیر/xeyr in نه خیر.

Etymology 2 I can see that it says خیر‎ is a 'Clipping of نه خیر', but where does it say what خیر itself means? It is obvious the key part of نه خیر in نه/nah "no" so what does خیر mean here, what does it add, is it used in other words?

Also isn't "Clipping of نه خیر" a different way of saying "we don't know"?


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## desi4life

PersoLatin said:


> Many thanks desi4life for taking time on this, I am however sure I am missing a trick here, is the answer staring me in the face but I can't see it?



Yes, I believe so. Under Etymology 2 is “Clipping of نه خیر‎ (na xeyr)”, and below that is the word “Adverb” followed by “خیر (xeyr)” and the definition: “(formal) no”.

Etymology 2
Clipping of نه خیر‎ (na xeyr).

Adverb
خیر • (xeyr)
1. (formal) no


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## rarabara

hi,
general & basic overview
it seems we use a word in Turkish  ("Hayır"="no"). But although it is in the conformity with great and little wovel harmony, I am not sufficiently sure whether it was actually and / or originally Turkish word.

we do not use such a word in Kurdish. So, this is likely not a Kurdish word.

I know one word almost as same as it stands on the side of its script in Arabic , but as far as I know that word not an Arabic word also (Or i may be wrong). because it is closer to mean  "outside of" phrase or sometimes "except" (Maybe Arabic speakers better explain) but this word probably borrowed from arabic into Turkish and we use it "gayrı"

...


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## bearded

Could the Farsi word be derived (a 'corruption') from Arabic  غير (ghayr) meaning ''not / other than''?


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## rarabara

bearded said:


> Could the Farsi word be derived (a 'corruption') from Arabic  غير (ghayr) meaning ''not / other than''?


oh,thank you.This word was the word I implied.
probably this word غير  is being at upper side of throat than خير  or there should be stronger but more elegant friction in خير
thank you for reminding. (Note: I confused خير and غير 's pronunciation ,unfortunately these are very different words in Arabic)


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## PersoLatin

bearded said:


> Could the Farsi word be derived (a 'corruption') from Arabic غير (ghayr) meaning ''not / other than''?


This seems plausible and & I am speculating now, it may be a calque for the Arabic لا غیر ‘no other’.


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## rarabara

PersoLatin said:


> for the Arabic لا غیر ‘no other’.


Hi,I consider that this particle to be something like : "not other than" because of negation.


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## Derakhshan

PersoLatin said:


> I know خیر/xeyr means "good" in Arabic & I am desperately hoping that this is not the same خیر/xeyr in نه خیر.


That it is. خير "no" is simply the result of a regional culture of politeness. Instead of flat out saying نه you say a nice word instead. That's why خير is used in formal contexts only.

In Gulf Arabic, you can say سلامتك "your wellness" to refuse something politely, as a parallel.


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## PersoLatin

^^ Thank you. 

Any thoughts on the etymology of the word? See OP.


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## Derakhshan

خير? It's from the root خ ي ر related to "choice, selection," and from this the sense of "good" is derived (like how "choice" in English can mean "good, preferred").

It's most common use besides meaning just "good" is as a comparative/superlative "better/best": كُنتُمْ خَيْرَ أُمَّةٍ أُخْرِجَتْ لِلنَّاسِ "You are the best nation ever brought forth to men".


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## PersoLatin

Thanks.

So no Persian/Iranic connections at all, which was the question in OP?


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## Derakhshan

As far as I can tell, no.


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