# oh castitatis lilium [Elfen Lied]



## Talis

Hi everyone,

I read this quote the other day and tried to translate it using some of my very rusty high school Latin (I only took Latin for a semester, so I'm not very good at all). I ran the individual words through the translator here, but didn't have a lot of success. The phrase / poem is:

O quam sancta
quam benigna
quam amoena
O castitatis lilium

I think I've got:

quam = how
amoena = pleasant

Can anyone help with the rest? Also, if you know the source of the quote, I would appreciate it. It sounds so familiar to me, as if I've read it before....

Thanks in advance...


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## Focalist

I believe these words are from a Gregorian chant _Ave Mundi Spes Maria_. They mean

O so holy, 
so serene, 
so gentle, 
so pleasant, 
O lily of chasteness​
F


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## Talis

Thank you very much, Focalist!

What is so maddening is that now I've seen your translation, the meaning of the words is so obvious. I'm really kicking myself over "lilium" especially because I have a print on the loft wall of a madonna lily, complete with the botanical name.

It's a very pretty snippet of the chant. I'll try to find the complete work.

Thanks again.


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## cristóbal

here's the words and the "original score".  heh.

http://www.silos.arrakis.es/partituras/avemundi.htm

just in case you feel like singing along.


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## Talis

cristóbal said:
			
		

> here's the words and the "original score".  heh.
> 
> 
> just in case you feel like singing along.



 Thank you very much, Cristobal! I'll give it a try today, although my singing is he worst ever heard.


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## cristóbal

Haha, can you even read that type of music?  I sure can't!     Good luck.


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## sancta_lilium

Um.. yeah
That's definetly from Elfen Lied, an anime.

here's the entire song:

Os iusti meditabitur sapientiam
et lingua eius loquetur iudicium
Beatus vir qui suffert tentationem
Quoniam cum probatus fuerit
Accipiet coronam vitae
Kyrie, ignis divine, eleison
*O quam sancta,
quam serena,
quam benigna,
quam amoena
O castitatis lilium*

And the translation:
(rough)
The mouth of the Just shall meditate wisdom
And his tongue shall speak judgement
Blessed is the man who endures tempation
For, once he has been tried
He shall recieve the crown of life
Oh lord, holy fire, have mercy
*Oh, how sacred
How serene
How benevolent
How lovely
Oh lily of purity

*... -nod- that's about right.


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## pidomas

*Well, its like:*
*Oh, how sacred
How serene
How benevolent
How lovely
Oh lily of purity*


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## Gringoxlatino

sancta_lilium said:


> Um.. yeah
> That's definetly from Elfen Lied, an anime.
> 
> here's the entire song:
> 
> Os iusti meditabitur sapientiam
> et lingua eius loquetur iudicium
> Beatus vir qui suffert tentationem
> Quoniam cum probatus fuerit
> Accipiet coronam vitae
> Kyrie, ignis divine, eleison
> *O quam sancta,*
> *quam serena,*
> *quam benigna,*
> *quam amoena*
> *O castitatis lilium*
> 
> And the translation:
> (rough)
> The mouth of the Just shall meditate wisdom
> And his tongue shall speak judgement
> Blessed is the man who endures tempation
> For, once he has been tried
> He shall recieve the crown of life
> Oh lord, holy fire, have mercy
> *Oh, how sacred*
> *How serene*
> *How benevolent*
> *How lovely*
> *Oh lily of purity*
> 
> ... -nod- that's about right.


 

It actually is the introduction from the anime Elfen Lied.


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## ki_mkt

Lilium is the opening song to Elfen Lied sung by a Japanese opera singer, Kumiko Oguro.

*Original*

_Os iusti meditabitur sapientiam_
_Et lingua eius loquetur indicium_ (Psalms 36:30)
_Beatus vir qui suffert tentationem_
_Quoniam cum probatus fuerit accipiet coronam vitae_ (Iacobi 1:12)
_{Kyrie, fons bonitatis}_
_Kyrie, Ignis Divine, Eleison_
_{O quam sancta, quam serena, quam benigma_
_Quam amoena esse virgo creditur.}_
_O quam sancta, quam serena, quam benigma_
_Quam amoena O castitatis lilium_ 

*Translation*

_The mouth of the Just shall meditate wisdom_
_And his tongue shall speak judgement_ (Psalms 37:30)
_Blessed is the man who endureth temptation_
_For once he hath been proven, he shall receive the crown of life (_James 1:12)
_{Lord, fountain of holiness}_
_Lord, Fire Divine, have mercy_
_{O how sacred, how serene, how benevolent_
_How lovely, is this virgin who believeth!}_
_O how holy, how serene, how benevolent_
_How lovely, O lily of purity_


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## pablo222

Ki

There are no less than 4 different openings to the TV series Elfen Lied and 7 variants of the song throughout the series.   The most common is given but its a rough translation given  in the english subtitled version for nonenglish speakers. Its actually more correct than the english dub version. In the subtitle versions they actually give a rough translation of the song which is where most people post the words from. However, depending on which one they took it from, it may or may not fit correctly and thus people are going that does not look right or that does not translate right.

First through 3 versions are:

O si usque        Oh, the just mouth  of the defeated pretend to
edita vitus                   
sapientia

Et lingua Deus              elevate their wisdom and words
No Praetendiese

Beatus vir qui               Blessed is the man who endureth temptation
suffert
tentationem

Quoniam cum probatus     Because of those proven through trials
fuerit accipiet                    and receive the crown of life
cornonam vitae               

Kyrie, fons bonitatis,             O Lord, fountain of merciful holiness
Kyrie, ignis divine, eleison    O Lord, Fire Divine, have mercy

O Quam sancta, Quam serena,      O how holy, how serene
quam benign, quam amoena       How benevolent, how lovely
esse virgo creditur                       Is the virgin who believed

O Quam sancta, Quam serena,      O how holy, how serene
quam benigma, quam amoena       How benevolent, how lovely
O castitas lilium               O lily of purity

Note that if you try to do a simple latin to english translation some words do not seem to fit the context.

Example is two sets of phrases. Kyrie fons bonitatis is a prime example.  This melody was taken from 8th to the 10th century Gregorian chants and thus set in those contexts. Thus Kyrie, Fons bonitatis means exactly  My Lord God, Fountain of merciful Holiness. The next phrase shows why this is a very old song. because its Kyrie, Ignis, Divine, Eleison is out of context in the modern sense.  Since 1322 according to the Vatican,  Kyrie, eleison is the only term that can be expressed together as a response to the previous call of God.  The other is the opening phrase. Its Middle age terminology and people who translate it get it absolutely wrong who do not look at the context and time it was written. Like I said, Lilium is based off a very old gergorian chant called Kyrie, Fons Bonitatis that predates the organ arrangement versions which most people use to assume the context of Lilium.  If you are going to try finding the original chant, good luck. Its never sung anymore and only very few are still in existence. Lilium is derived from 33 bars of Bach that is now in a museum and the words are taken from several variants of Kyrie, Fons Bonitatis from both French and German sources according to the director of Elfen Lied.

In the next 4 versions of the TV series including the English dub versions, the listing is:

Os Iusti        The mouth of the Just shall meditate wisdom
meditabitur
sapientiam

Et lingua eius               And his tongue shall speak judgment
loquetur indicium

Beatus vir qui               Blessed is the man who endureth temptation
suffert
tentationem

Quoniqm cum probates   For once he hath been proven through trials
fuerit acceipient               he shall receive
cornonam vitae                the crown of life

Kyrie, fons bonitatis,             O Lord, fountain of merciful holiness
Kyrie, ignis divine, eleison    O Lord, Fire Divine, have mercy

O Quam sancta, Quam serena,      O how holy, how serene
quam benigma, quam amoena       How benevolent, how lovely
esse virgo creditur                       Is the virgin who believed

O Quam sancta, Quam serena,      O how holy, how serene
quam benigma, quam amoena       How benevolent, how lovely
O castitas lilium               O lily of purity

If you want to hear the compete version of Lilium, you will need to find the DarkJedi version who spent nearly a year putting it together.  Its on youtube and you can find it on several torrents.

Like I s


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## Castitatis

Castitatis means lily of purity


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## pablo222

Castitatis  means Purity of a woman. Meaning a women being a virgin. Lilium means Lily. 

O castitatis lilium literally translates to O Lily of purity.


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## Dr. Fumbles

From what I'm finding it looks like they can't say or write the words right: indicium wrong, it's iudicium (i tried finding what judgement was and I kept going to iudicium).  Am I right or wrong on this?  They also seem to think it's benigma when it's benigna and I know this from speaking Castilian alone, diríamos (we'd say) benévola but in this case benigna if we're talking about the right word also the fact that it's benign in English.  So far those are the only ones I can find wrong, anyone else notice this?

I take that back the lyrics in the anime are correct, it seems people don't know how to look at them, not you guys's fault.


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## pablo222

The problem with translation in these context is when the words were originally written. The Song was taken from an 8th to late 12th century Gregorian chant that was not originally put to music as it was a chant.  So, you are going to find variations in the English spelling. After all, many words with old German origins are often spelled more like the old German spelling than the English. You will find that some words are spelled differently depending on who transcribed the document and what their linguistic origins were.   The key is to find the overall general use of the words you are using. It was not until the late 1300s when English had an official dictionary of spelling and definitions of use. That is the Oxford Dictionary which was used by the College of Oxford by order of the King of England to standardize the English Language. Before this period, English was not an official language as the nobility spoke French and Latin as the two primary languages via William the Conqueror. 

We can spend years debating how words were used  from either French or German origin then translated to modern English.  The best place to find reference is not the worthless wiki of the internet that does more harm than good with the English language but with the help of the Vatican resources outreach. They can actually help with this issue if you are super die hard as to complete satisfaction of translation.

The translation I gave was referenced from an original French source of how certain words were used in prayers, chants and early church worship music.  However, you are most welcome to try and find an English variant from either a Spanish or early English/ Scottish source if you are bored or have too much time on your hands.  The translation is what it is. I have seen the multiple spellings you have pointed out. Even in the Original Efin Lied ( Which is German for Elf Song) and  is the source of this song has two different spellings in the subtitled version for Benigna and Benigma that was released. Some people my not have noticed that but I did. 

The time frame was easy to pin down as it has to do with the use of church language that was only in use during this period. But you also need to understand that the Song was written by a Japanese person who took a generalized English translation of the song and modified it to suit their purpose.  Lilium is from what I have learned comes from a mix of a German Gregorian Chant which I do not know the exact source other than it comes from Kyrie fons Bonitatis which is a known Gregorian chant  and Bach. The rest can be debated for years on end. There are several versions of the Gregorian chant and until the author of the music states exactly which one he used, it will always be a problem as to context and spelling.  The author of the music does not remember exactly other than he wrote part  of the song while studying in Europe.


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