# 我还以为不会下雨呢



## cheshire

Sentence (甲): 我*还*以为不会下雨呢,连伞也没带​I think this sentence means "I din't think it would rain; I didn't even take my umbrella with me."

(1) What I don't understand is, what exactly does *还 *mean?
(2) The sentence says "I didn't even take an umbrella." Why was 连伞也 used? Why "even"? Am I missing something here?

Sentence (乙): 人不大,*还*挺神气的. You are not big, but you are alive.​I don't know this translation is good, but what does the 还 mean in this sentence?


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## samanthalee

Hi Cheshire, I have to tell you I was stumped for a long moment when I saw your question some hours ago. I was hoping some other native Chinese speakers can come to your rescue. But apparently not.

So here's my take on Sentence B: 人不大,不过*还*挺神气的. You may be minute, but you certainly are smart-looking.
还 in this sentence conveys an air of surprise, an exclamation upon an unexpected observation, an "oh my" sort of feeling. I added a "不过" in your original sentence to show that the "but" in the English translation is not related to "还". 



cheshire said:


> Sentence (甲): 我*还*以为不会下雨呢,连伞也没带​I think this sentence means "I din't think it would rain; I didn't even take my umbrella with me."
> 
> (1) What I don't understand is, what exactly does *还 *mean?
> (2) The sentence says "I didn't even take an umbrella." Why was 连伞也 used? Why "even"? Am I missing something here?
> 
> Sentence (乙): 人不大,*还*挺神气的. You are not big, but you are alive.​I don't know this translation is good, but what does the 还 mean in this sentence?


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## ryuusaki

Tough question.

1. 我以为不会下雨(呢)
I thought it wouldn't rain! (not I didn't think it would rain.)

2. 我*还*以为不会下雨呢
I thought it wouldn't rain!

basically the two sentences mean the same thing, with or without the word *还. *However, in the second sentence, with the word *还, *the tone changes a little bit.

In sentence 1, the tone is rather flat, kind of like just stating what you previously thought. (I think 呢 can be omitted since there is no rising tone.) But in sentence 2, the word *还* gives a feeling that you really didn't expect it to rain, and you are surprised by it. The tone is a bit stronger.

2nd question.

连伞也没带
(I) didn't even bring (the) umbrella.

I think it sounds kinda like "I was quite sure that it wouldn't rain that *I didn't even bring my umbrella*." Does it make sense to you?

人不大,*还*挺神气的

I don't know how to explain this one. But PS. 大 here means old/grown-up, not big; and 神气 doesn't mean alive. It kinda means "spirited" or "cocky" (not the extreme type of cocky, 神气 is not a negative adjective).

That's the best I can do. It is a really tough question.


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## springlovesword

*"还"* up to my understanding, using this word has 2 funtions and depending on the context you can choose one. 1."*还"* is just to emphasize that the rain is annoying and to express the speaker's regret of not bringing an umbrella with him/her. 2."*还"*is used to say that it actually rained. 
There is not great difference between using "*还*" an not using. But in daily conversation, we prefer to use this.
Hope I have made myself clear. Chinese are usually subtle....

I will answer your question below tomorrow.
Sentence (乙): 人不大,*还*挺神气的. You are not big, but you are alive.
​I don't know this translation is good, but what does the 还 mean in this sentence?


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## Saint-Jean d'Acre

The English translation is OK.
还 here means it is not expected


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## NextNoName

cheshire said:


> Sentence (甲): 我*还*以为不会下雨呢,连伞也没带​I think this sentence means "I din't think it would rain; I didn't even take my umbrella with me."
> 
> (1) What I don't understand is, what exactly does *还 *mean?



还 in this context is "used for emphasis". That is the sixth definition out of seven definitions for the character in my "New Century Chinese-English" dictionary published by _Learners Publishing_ and _Foreign Language Teaching and Research Press_. The original meaning for this character is "still" or "yet". Imagine, this character acquired new meanings over time however the link between the new evolved meanings and the original meaning is still there.



> (2) The sentence says "I didn't even take an umbrella." Why was 连伞也 used? Why "even"? Am I missing something here?


That sounds natural to me. Like for example, "Damn it, I didn't *even* take my damn umbrella." Doesn't that sound natural.



> Sentence (乙): 人不大,*还*挺神气的. You are not big, but you are alive.​I don't know this translation is good, but what does the 还 mean in this sentence?


还 here means "still" or "yet". I would translate it as: Size (or Body) isn't big, yet quite cocky (or smart-looking).


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## cheshire

I'm sorry for this late reply, I had to read "in case" thread...
Thanks to you, I now perfectly understand the usage used there in the two sentences. 
Could you tell me one more thing: If you were asked to choose one word other than *还*, what would you choose?

我*( )*以为不会下雨呢,连伞也没带​


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## springlovesword

I may put“竟然”here


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## NONAME7943

springlovesword said:


> I may put“竟然”here


 
I don't think so. "竟然" doesn't make any sense here.

我*( )*以为不会下雨呢,连伞也没带


I would choose "本来" here. It means "originally".​


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## Dalian

springlovesword said:


> I may put“竟然”here


I don't think 竟然 fits in there.
Other than 还, I'd choose 本 or 本来.


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## kareno999

Agree. But 本 is too formal to fit this context.
Another option is 原来


Dalian said:


> I don't think 竟然 fits in there.
> Other than 还, I'd choose 本 or 本来.


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## cheshire

Thanks everyone!
It's really great to have a separate Chinese forum. I hope we enjoy ourselves here!


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## Pierre Lucien

Why doesn't hai 还 mean "moreover" here ?


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## Dalian

Pierre Lucien said:


> Why doesn't hai 还 mean "moreover" here ?


还 has a number of meanings. Here it expresses a feeling that one didn't expect something to happen.


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## cheshire

你的中文讲的还不做呢！This 还 means "unexpectedly, surprisingly". I leaned from your responses. But what about the next 还?  Isn't that somewhat "reserved, humble" 还? 他的中文讲得*还*算可以。​


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## kkmp

cheshire said:


> 你的中文讲的还不做呢！This 还 means "unexpectedly, surprisingly". I leaned from your responses. But what about the next 还?  Isn't that somewhat "reserved, humble" 还?他的中文讲得*还*算可以。​



unexpectedly, surprisingly：
你的中文讲的还不错（可以）嘛。 
下这么大雨，没想到你还真准时到了。

barely, merely, better than nothing, after all：
你的中文讲的还不错（可以）。
还算不错，电话最后打通了。

The difference is very small. 

There are a handful of functional words in Chinese which are very flexible. There is no easy way to tell why they mean this or that.  Only practice makes perfect.


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## Loo

*T*here*'*s 7 different meanings of 还 (when its pronoucing as 'hai 2')

1.still 
多年没见,你还是没变。 
*M*any years passed,*_**yo*u still not changed.
我还是不能同意你。
*I'*m still not agree with *yo*u.

2.even more (with the mood stronger than '更') 
他比我还高。
*H*e is even taller than me.
-it implies: actually the speaker is tall.

他比我更高。
*H*e is taller than me.
-it implies: we don*'*t know if the speaker is tall.*_**T*he sentence just tell us the relation of height of these 2 persons.

3.unexpectedly
没想到你还真能解决了。
*B*eyond my expectation,*_**yo*u solved it.

4.so so
你唱得还可以。
*Yo*ur singing is ok.

5.even
我还在找别人帮忙呢，怎么帮你呢？
*E*ven me who's still looking for help,*_*how can i help u?

6.used to emphasize a rhetorical question
我都听你的了，还不行吗？
I do submit to all *yo*ur wishes,*_*that*'*s not enough?

7.as also,else,there remains
还有很多事情要做。
*T*here remains a lot to do.

*T*he difference b*e*tw*een* 5 and 6:
*I*n case 5,*_*we use this character in the sentence which describe the situation.
*I*n case 6,*_*we use this character in the question.
*B*ecause their difference is really narrow.*_**F*or me, a chinese native speaker,
*I* can hardly point out the difference if some one ask me in a sudden. 
*S*o we have to learn it by those key sentences...

*S*o for Sentence (甲): 我*还*以为不会下雨呢,连伞也没带
*I*t*'*s clearly the meaning of 'unexpectedly'.

and for Sentence (乙): 人不大,*还*挺神气的
*I*t means 'unexpectedly' also

*I*t express the mood of 'a turn of events'.

*Moderator's Note: Please write in Standard language forms and avoid chatspeak or SMS style. This is after all a language forum. Writing in English requires the use of capitalization and the use of a space after each punctuation mark (except after opening quotation mark, opening parenthesis and em-dash). *


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## cheshire

What a marvellous answer! Welcome, Loo 老師!


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## slhardware

Here is a good forum (both of chinese and english )for me.
Hoping I will be a member of yours soon.


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