# Cash machine or ATM



## Memai

Hi. At restaurant I heard someone asking the waiter to bring the ATM for paying. Is it correct to call it ATM ??  Or a cash machine??


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## The Newt

Memai said:


> Hi. At restaurant I heard someone asking the waiter to bring the ATM for paying. Is it correct to call it ATM ??  Or a cash machine??



It's not clear what the waiter brought. ATMs are generally not portable.


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## entangledbank

I think I'd call that the _card machine_. A cash machine or ATM is a very large, solid machine in the wall of a bank.


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## The Newt

entangledbank said:


> I think I'd call that the _card machine_. A cash machine or ATM is a very large, solid machine in the wall of a bank.



Right, you could bring a handheld card reader to the table. A lot of restaurants take payment that way.


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## panjandrum

The thing a waiter would bring for paying would not be an ATM or a cash machine.
Perhaps it's a 'card reader' or a 'card payment machine' or a 'card machine'.


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## Memai

So we should call it card reader?  

I am sure the ATM is incorrect. But I just want to be sure of its formal and informal name. 
Thanks a lot


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## The Newt

Memai said:


> So we should call it card reader?
> 
> I am sure the ATM is incorrect. But I just want to be sure of its formal and informal name.
> Thanks a lot



In the US I think we'd say "card reader," but other terms may be in use elsewhere.


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## Barque

Memai said:


> I am sure the ATM is incorrect. But I just want to be sure of its formal and informal name.


_ATM_ stands for _Automatic Teller Machine_.
A _teller_ is (WR dictionary): _one who works in a bank to receive or pay out money over the counter.
_
Therefore an ATM is a machine that does the job of a teller. It can't, by any stretch of imagination, refer to the machine that the waiter brings to your table when you want to pay with a card.


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## Memai

So. What is the correct name for this machine??


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## Barque

entangledbank said:


> the _card machine_





The Newt said:


> a handheld card reader





panjandrum said:


> a 'card reader'





panjandrum said:


> a 'card payment machine'



Take your pick. I like "card machine" myself.


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## PaulQ

Barque said:


> I like "card machine" myself.




An ATM:


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## Myridon

The Newt said:


> A lot of restaurants take payment that way.


The only restaurants I know of that do anything similar are Chili's and Olive Garden that have a touchscreen device that sits on your table the entire time.  It's called a Ziosk (a trademarked specific device -  kiosk with a z).  You can pay to play games like Candy Crush Saga.  You can also order drink refills and desserts through it.
I have no experience at all of a waiter bringing something to the table.


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## Packard

The only place I've come across this is at the Apple Store.  They have a proprietary reader that looks like an integrated Iphone.

This is an image I found on line:


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## Edinburgher

Card payment terminals are ubiquitous in shops, but they are generally wired or plugged in at the till.
In many restaurants, these terminals are detachable and can be brought to the table, for you to put in your PIN.  Walking to the counter to pay is obviously too strenuous for today's clientele.


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## Myridon

Edinburgher said:


> You need to get out more.
> Card payment terminals are ubiquitous in shops, but they are generally wired or plugged in at the till.
> In many restaurants, these terminals are detachable and can be brought to the table, for you to put in your PIN.  Walking to the counter to pay is obviously too strenuous for today's clientele.


I'm afraid going to Scotland for dinner is beyond my means. I eat out a lot here - no restaurants here have them.  I haven't even heard this practice mentioned before.
We don't have PINs with our credit cards - you have to sign for anything over some amount that seems to be random per store and card type.  Needing a signature pad and a stylus makes it more complicated.
Yes, I have seen the ones that connect to mobile phones that are used at the register by small businesses that too small to use the expensive services that provide the normal machines.  Needless to say, the owner of the business doesn't hand me his phone so I can swipe the card myself.


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## Egmont

Myridon said:


> ... I have no experience at all of a waiter bringing something to the table.


They're rare in the U.S., but well-nigh universal in Europe. I don't recall a sit-down restaurant that took credit cards any other way in my most recent trip to Europe (the last week of 2017).


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## Barque

Egmont said:


> They're rare in the U.S


They're fairly common in the larger cities in India - the waiter bringing the machine over to your table.


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## andrewg927

I don’t go out very often but I have seen the Square card reader at the fair. I believe Olive Gardens has a tablet on the table for paying.


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## panjandrum

Egmont said:


> They're rare in the U.S., but well-nigh universal in Europe. I don't recall a sit-down restaurant that took credit cards any other way in my most recent trip to Europe (the last week of 2017).


Also well-nigh universal in Canada.


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## london calling

We have card readers everywhere here in Italy, aka POS (point of sale) card readers/terminals.


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## Myridon

entangledbank said:


> I think I'd call that





panjandrum said:


> Perhaps it's a





panjandrum said:


> Also well-nigh universal in Canada.


It seems to be one of those universal things that no one talks about like the aglets on shoelaces.


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## dojibear

To me a restaurant that brings a card reader to your table is rare. But for the last 20+ years all restaurants and bars accept credit cards for payment: you put the card on the tray and the waiter takes it to the machine for you. At restaurants where you pay at a cash register, all of them accept credit and debit cards. So do all grocery stores and gas stations. I even pay by debit card at McDonald's. I keep some cash in my car, but rarely use any.

So the only difference is that some restaurants have a *wireless, portable* card reader they bring to your table. To approve a purchase, the small card reader must interact in real time with a larger computer (and often with the internet). That is why it has to have wireless communication.

There isn't a very good word for these machines in AE. We usually call them *card readers* because they "read" electronic information stored on your credit card or debit card. They also have keys to input your pin number, when that is needed.

But the card reader communicates with a remote computer (a computer at your bank, or at Visa or Mastercard, or at the restaurant's HQ, or all of these). It is the computer which "processes the transaction" (the purchase) and "authorizes" (accepts) your electronic payment. The physical card reader just communicates (with you and with the computer).


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## 2PieRad

The machine processes both credit and debit cards. So if you present your debit card to the waiter, you may hear "I'll bring the debit machine." (Just to add another option to the list.)

Usually, because the context is so clear, the waiter will only refer to it as "the machine."

Many still require you to enter a PIN, but many are "contactless", only requiring you to tap your card against the machine.


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## e2efour

As pointed out above, a c_ard reader_ or _card scanner_ is not the same as an ATM or cash machine.

We are often told in the UK that you should never let your credit card out of your sight (i.e. never give to the waiter), when you go abroad, that is if you want to prevent fraud.


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## panjandrum

Myridon said:


> I'm afraid going to Scotland for dinner is beyond my means. I eat out a lot here - no restaurants here have them.  I haven't even heard this practice mentioned before.
> *We don't have PINs with our credit cards* - you have to sign for anything over some amount that seems to be random per store and card type.  Needing a signature pad and a stylus makes it more complicated.
> Yes, I have seen the ones that connect to mobile phones that are used at the register by small businesses that too small to use the expensive services that provide the normal machines.  Needless to say, the owner of the business doesn't hand me his phone so I can swipe the card myself.


I think I have spotted a critical difference.
In the UK, and in many other places, credit and debit cards are "chip and pin".
It makes sense that in a location that requires a signature, the portable card machine is not going to be acceptable.


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## andrewg927

e2efour said:


> As pointed out above, a c_ard reader_ or _card scanner_ is not the same as an ATM or cash machine.
> 
> We are often told in the UK that you should never let your credit card out of your sight (i.e. never give to the waiter), when you go abroad, that is if you want to prevent fraud.



If you come to the US, you will be asked to leave your card to the waiter (unless they have a portable machine).


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## Egmont

london calling said:


> We have card readers everywhere here in Italy, aka POS (point of sale) card readers/terminals.



One of the places I used such a machine on my recent trip was just a few km from you, in Sorrento. 



panjandrum said:


> ... It makes sense that in a location that requires a signature, the portable card machine is not going to be acceptable.



But it is, and I have used them often. The machine contains a printer that prints a paper slip. The customer signs that slip.


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## andrewg927

panjandrum said:


> I think I have spotted a critical difference.
> In the UK, and in many other places, credit and debit cards are "chip and pin".
> It makes sense that in a location that requires a signature, the portable card machine is not going to be acceptable.



For credit cards, we have to put in our zip code for the machine to process (in place of a PIN number).


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## Myridon

e2efour said:


> The machine contains a printer that prints a paper slip. The customer signs that slip.


The Ziosk I mentioned above has a printer, but, as I mentioned, it sits on the table and it has a lot more functions.  Checking their website, I see they are in 11 major chains for a total of 4500 restaurants nationwide.
If you have gift cards or cash or you're the type of person who is intimidated by complex electronic gizmos (like my parents), you are still dependent on the waiter.  I'd be willing to bet that a large proportion of the people who could use the machine, don't use it.


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## andrewg927

Myridon said:


> The Ziosk I mentioned above has a printer,...



Does it? I remember you sign on the screen and your receipt is sent to your email.


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## Loob

andrewg927 said:


> I don’t go out very often but I have seen the Square card reader at the fair. I believe Olive Gardens has a tablet on the table for paying.


I really don't understand this answer.


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## andrewg927

Loob said:


> I really don't understand this answer.



Don't worry about it. I don't suppose you have the same thing in the UK.


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## JulianStuart

The US did not adopt the chip/PIN card system (used widely outside the US)  that allows such card-readers to be brought to the table for payment and PIN entry.  That's why the US and ROW (rest of the world) members are answering differently.

The device below can be used by US merchants with "ATM" or debit cards linked directly to a bank account - and only a PIN is needed (I just used one today) justlike at an ATM in the wall machine.  If it's a credit card, a signature is still needed.  The PIN with such US debit cards will not work in Europe, for example, even if the US debit card has a chip.  The PIN is not the same.  I travel a lot and have come across a wide range of systems over the years.  (In Japan a few years ago, I finally found a petrol/gas station that had  an old paper/roller machine in the back and let me use that!)  Nowadays the US card can be used in Europe but the restaurant/shop etc will require a signature (and the capability of accepting one)

Uncategorized Archives - Chip & PIN Card Payments




From that article:


> A *mobile credit card machine *uses the landline* coverage to connect and thus it allows users to make and accept payments anywhere in the UK. Many people confuse mobile with portable card terminals, but unlike the mobile ones that use the landline and can work anywhere in the country, *portable card terminals are connected via Bluetooth technology and only have about a 200 meter radius, therefore making them suitable for restaurants* and bars, but not door to door payments.


* I think this refers to cell/mobile phone systems (as opposed to Bluetooth)


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## Edinburgher

JulianStuart said:


> * I think this refers to cell/mobile phone systems (as opposed to Bluetooth)


Indeed not bluetooth, but not cell/mobile either.  "Landline" means the real phone wire that comes into the building from the street.
Inside a house, you can have a "wireless" phone that communicates by means of a low-tech short-range radio with its base station that's connected to the land line.

The "mobile" card machine uses similar low-tech radio technology to talk to the restaurant's box instead of being physically connected to it by a plug.  That box then uses the landline phone to talk to the bank's computers.


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## natkretep

If we're still discuss the term used for the item, I see *portable card machine* use here:
Portable Card Machines| WiFi Card Machines | Worldpay

I've also seen *wireless payment terminal*.

They are generally good for chip-and-PIN credit/debit cards, but some can handle contactless payments (payWave), and some can handle signature cards and print paper receipts like the one below.


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## Loob

Going back to post 1 - is there anyone anywhere that would see "Bring me the ATM" as a normal expression?


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## JulianStuart

Edinburgher said:


> Indeed not bluetooth, but not cell/mobile either.  "Landline" means the real phone wire that comes into the building from the street.
> Inside a house, you can have a "wireless" phone that communicates by means of a low-tech short-range radio with its base station that's connected to the land line.
> 
> The "mobile" card machine uses similar low-tech radio technology to talk to the restaurant's box instead of being physically connected to it by a plug.  That box then uses the landline phone to talk to the bank's computers.


I have a landline at home (in a region where cell phone strength is low/variable), but someone with a “mobile credit card machine” will need to have to take a base station everywhere they go to get to a “landline”.  And they can do that “everywhere in the UK”.  Is that realistic, being restricted to to taking a base station with them and finding a landline each time they want to accept a payment?  It’s the logic that made me conclude that it was likely a mobile phone type technology they were referring to.  But who knows, perhaps they do go somewhere and always have to ask to plug their base station into a landline socket everywhere they go?


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## JulianStuart

Loob said:


> Going back to post 1 - is there anywhere that would see "Bring me the ATM" as a normal expression?


I think the OP will need to reveal which restaurant/country they were in when they heard this!


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## Edinburgher

Loob said:


> Going back to post 1 - is there anyone anywhere that would see "Bring me the ATM" as a normal expression?


Definitely not.


JulianStuart said:


> Is that realistic, being restricted to to taking a base station with them and finding a landline each time they want to accept a payment?


My comment in #34 was based on what "landline" means.  Having now read the rest of the paragraph from which you quoted in #33, I agree with your assessment that they must mean the mobile/cell network.  They are simply using the term "landline" incorrectly.


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## Keith Bradford

JulianStuart said:


> I have a landline at home (in a region where cell phone strength is low/variable), but someone with a “mobile credit card machine” will need to have to take a base station everywhere they go to get to a “landline”.  And they can do that “everywhere in the UK”.  Is that realistic, being restricted to to taking a base station with them and finding a landline each time they want to accept a payment?  It’s the logic that made me conclude that it was likely a mobile phone type technology they were referring to.  But who knows, perhaps they do go somewhere and always have to ask to plug their base station into a landline socket everywhere they go?



I don't understand this - it doesn't matter what you have at home, we're talking about payments in bars and restaurants.  Virtually every such retail outlet I know in Britain and France (including even small country bars) has facility for card payment.  In larger restaurants it's by a portable *card reader *(images in #33 and #35); smaller places may ask you to go to the counter to pay on a wired-in version (which is the norm in shops), still called a *card reader*.  Payments of less than 20 euros are often done by touch only, with no insertion of cards or keying in of numbers.  You never sign anything, unless there's a technical problem with the card or the reader.

The term *ATM *is only known here via American films.  We call them* cash dispensers*, *cash machines* or sometimes *the hole in the wall*.


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## Myridon

Edinburgher said:


> My comment in #34 was based on what "landline" means.  Having now read the rest of the paragraph from which you quoted in #33, I agree with your assessment that they must mean the mobile/cell network.  They are simply using the term "landline" incorrectly.


The quoted article is horrible on technical details.  200m for Bluetooth?  No, 10m is the max for Bluetooth.  Even with WiFi you'd need repeaters to get 200m.



Loob said:


> Going back to post 1 - is there anyone anywhere that would see "Bring me the ATM" as a normal expression?


Yes, let's go back to this.  For those of you for whom these machines are "universal," what do you say to the waiter now?  Do you still just say "Bring me the bill/check/ticket?" or whatever it is that you said back in ye olden days, or do you say something about the machine?


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## Myridon

andrewg927 said:


> Does it? I remember you sign on the screen and your receipt is sent to your email.







In this image, you can see the slot where the paper comes out at the bottom of the screen.  Even on the new ones on the company's website (I've never seen one of the newer models), there's a slot.


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## Packard

I think it has to be "reader".  When I think "credit card machine" I think of the old knuckle buster imprint devices.


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## natkretep

Myridon said:


> Yes, let's go back to this.  For those of you for whom these machines are "universal," what do you say to the waiter now?  Do you still just say "Bring me the bill/check/ticket?" or whatever it is that you said back in ye olden days, or do you say something about the machine?


No special request is necessary. You just ask for the bill the normal way. (I suppose it is possible that the waiter will ask, 'How are you paying?' I don't hear this much these days.) The waiter will return with the bill and the machine.


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## Keith Bradford

Myridon said:


> ...what do you say to the waiter now?  Do you still just say "Bring me the bill/check/ticket?" or whatever it is that you said back in ye olden days, or do you say something about the machine?



I don't care about the machine; that's the waiter's business, so I don't ask for it.  I say "Can I pay now?... Can I pay by card?..."  Then the waiter will say either (presenting a portable machine) "Here you are, if you'd like to insert your card" or (wired-in machine) "Would you mind coming over to the cash desk?"


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## Myridon

natkretep said:


> No special request is necessary. You just ask for the bill the normal way. (I suppose it is possible that the waiter will ask, 'How are you paying?' I don't hear this much these days.) The waiter will return with the bill and the machine.





Keith Bradford said:


> I don't care about the machine; that's the waiter's business, so I don't ask for it.  I say "Can I pay now?... Can I pay by card?..."  Then the waiter will say either (presenting a portable machine) "Here you are, if you'd like to insert your card" or (wired-in machine) "Would you mind coming over to the cash desk?"



That's what I expected.  You never refer to the machine by name so we haven't bothered to come up with a standardized name.
I was at an Olive Garden last week and someone had moved the Ziosk off the neighboring table (it takes up an annoying amount of room at a restaurant where everyone has multiple plates).  When it came time to pay, they asked the waiter, "Where's the thingy?" while pointing to mine.


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## JulianStuart

Keith Bradford said:


> I don't understand this - it doesn't matter what you have at home, we're talking about payments in bars and restaurants.  Virtually every such retail outlet I know in Britain and France (including even small country bars) has facility for card payment.  In larger restaurants it's by a portable *card reader *(images in #33 and #35); smaller places may ask you to go to the counter to pay on a wired-in version (which is the norm in shops), still called a *card reader*.  Payments of less than 20 euros are often done by touch only, with no insertion of cards or keying in of numbers.  You never sign anything, unless there's a technical problem with the card or the reader.
> 
> The term *ATM *is only known here via American films.  We call them* cash dispensers*, *cash machines* or sometimes *the hole in the wall*.


Those “wired-in” versions are the standard ones in the normal retail outlets you mention (presumably also “non-mobile” as a result)  but not the “mobile credit card machine” that allow (presumably travelling) merchants “to go anywhere in the UK “and accept a payment on their device. Those were the ones I was confused by the article saying they used a landline, and Edinburgher had the same reaction to their use of the term. 

Bluetooth can actually go up to 100m (Class 1) although the more widely known class 2 (~10m) and 3 (~2m) are much shorter range.

The device Nat showed in post #35 is the type I was offered when using a US based-credit card in the UK because it allowed me to sign the paper - even though the card had a chip it did not have a PIN in the non-US system.  Such devices are rare in the US so far, because it is standard practice to give the establishment one’s card for them to take it to their wired-in device and return with a piece of paper for you to sign  So, we have no name in the US for the non-US device (athough we know it’s not an ATM!) but “_portable_ card reader” seems to be widely understood as a general category outside the US. Within the US, it could refer to other things (like Square etc)  The article seemed to trying to distinguish this from a “_mobile_” one, but apparently causing some confusion The spread of contactless payment systems will add some more deliberation on new names - these “readers” _might_ end up with the same name around the world, but that thread is not yet upon us


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## Edinburgher

Myridon said:


> The quoted article is horrible on technical details. 200m for Bluetooth? No, 10m is the max for Bluetooth.


That's what I thought too, but evidently I'm getting a bit long in the tooth to keep abreast of recent developments.  According to Bluetooth - Wikipedia
version 5 can potentially get up to 240m.


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## By-the-sea

In answer to the original question about whether we call a card reader an ATM, it occurs to me that perhaps the speaker was a German speaker. Recently noticed people asking to pay by the German word for ATM in restaurants/cafes etc in Austria.


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## Memai

Thanks a lot for your answers. The story happened in SAUDIA Arabia. And the person was an Arabian guy.


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## Memai

At saudi arabia it is familiar to ask for the card reader. So the waiter ring it to you for paying


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