# FR: ce qui / qui



## bbdrummer

Should I use qui or ce qui here...

avaient pensés qu’ils étaient poursuivis par la police, _ce qui/ qui_ est accusé de faire des arrestations arbitraires

(I can never understand this rule)
Thankyou!

*Moderator note: *multiple threads merged to create this one.
See also: FR: ce qui / ce que / ce dont


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## syd047

ici il s'agit de "qui"


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## bh7

I have had the same problem.  My teacher told me the following:

The "ce qui" is used when "qui" refers to a whole phrase or idea, rather than to a specific person or thing.  In your sentence above "qui" refers to "police", rather than to the whole phrase "ils étaient poursuivis par la police".  So, "qui" was needed.

In the phrase,
"School was closed today, which made me very happy."
the "which" refers to the whole preceding phrase "school was closed today", not just to "school".  So, "ce qui" will be required.
"Aujourd'hui, l'école était fermée, ce qui m'a rendu très content."

In the following phrase, 
"He is blind, which I didn't know before I met him." 
the "which" refers back to the whole preceding phrase "he is blind", not just to "he".  So, in this case, "ce que" will be required.  
"Il est aveugle, ce que j'ignorais avant de le rencontrer."

The "ce" is always required in the expressions "all that [which]" (tout ce qui, tout ce que) and "here's what" (voilà ce qui, voilà ce que).


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## Sentance

I read these as follows:

qui - which/who/that etc. relating the verb to the previous subject

ce qui - what, again with no need for a new subject

I am confused therefore by the following:

_"D'une part, il dit que les passions sont des impressions "de réflexion", *ce qui* signifie qu'elles constituent des réactions aux sensations qui les précèdent"

_How I suppose this should be read is:

In one part, he says that passions are impressions 'of reflection', *which signifies *that they constitute reactions to sensations which precede them.

To my mind however, this requires *qui*, not *ce qui*.  With *ce qui*, I am tempted to read it as:

In one part, he says that passions are impressions 'of reflection', *what signifies *that they constitute reactions to sensations which precede them.

I understand that is could be read instead as:


In one part, he says that passions are impressions 'of reflection', *that which signifies *that they constitute reactions to sensations which precede them.

But still, this feels it would read better simply as *qui*, and that *ce qui* isn't necessary.

I'm sure I'm missing something.  Can anyone tell me what it is?


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## Stefan Ivanovich

I would try and illustrate the difference thus:

He says he lost his way, which means he took me for an idiot.
_Il dit qu'il s'était perdu*, ce qui *signifie qu'il me prenait pour un imbécile.
_(which/_ce qui _stands for a whole phrase, and is the second clause's subject)

He says he lost his yellow dog, which had two tails and had been born on Xmas eve.
Il dit qu'il avait perdu son chien jaune, _*qui *avait deux queues et était né la veille de Noël.
_(which/_qui _stands for a word or word group, and is the second clause's subject)

He says he lost his yellow dog, which his father had given him for Xmas.
Il dit qu'il avait perdu son chien jaune, _*que *son père lui avait offert à Noël.
_(which/_que _stands for a word or word group, and is the second clause's object)

Is it any clearer now?


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## Areyou Crazy

i have noticed  that  there seems to be a pattern ,when you use 'ce qui' it doesn't classify the thing already mentioned
but if you use 'qui' it provides us with further information about the 'thing' already mentioned!

There might be exceptions though but it is a pattern i have seen... I think ...


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## Harmione

Sentance said:


> qui - which/who/that etc. relating the verb to the previous subject


Not necessarily a subject:
Ex: Il a rencontré la personne qui va le remplacer (qui replaces a direct objet)



> ce qui - what, again with no need for a new subject


*Qui *in relative clauses can't be anything but a subject



> To my mind however, this requires *qui*, not *ce qui*.  With *ce qui*, I am tempted to read it as


You're wrong there. If you want to use "qui" only, you would have to transform your sentence:
_"D'une part, il dit que les passions sont des impressions "de réflexion", *qui* constituent des réactions aux sensations qui les précèdent"_

*ce qui* replaces a clause, *qui* replaces a word (or group of words but no verb included) as Stefan has just explained.


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## Pure_Yvesil

A)D'accord pour le verbe X, ce qui me paraît plus approprié
B)D'accord pour le verbe X, qui me paraît plus approrpié


Can anyone tell me what the difference is between these two phrases?

To me it sounds like

A) .... *which *sounds more appropriate


but I have no idea what would set the second phrase apart from the first one. Phrases like _"je suis d'accord avec cette proposition, qui me paraît être la plus évidente"_ and "_je suis d'accord avec cette proposition, ce qui me paraît être la plus évidente"_ seem different in the sense that "ce qui" seems to refer to the enitre sentence, while "qui" refers to the "proposition".

Translation wise I see no real difference though ?


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## snarkhunter

Hello,

It's basically a matter of what you consider as the _reference_ related to "paraître".


"Je suis d'accord avec *cette proposition*, _qui_ me _paraît_ être *la plus évidente*"

"*Je suis d'accord* avec cette proposition, _ce qui_ me _paraît_ être *le plus évident*"


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## Pure_Yvesil

Je crois comprendre:

"Je suis d'accord avec *cette proposition*, _qui_ me _paraît_ être *la plus évidente*"
je penche pour cette proposition car elle est la plus évidente de toutes les propositions

"*Je suis d'accord* avec cette proposition, _ce qui_ me _paraît_ être *le plus évident*"
c'est assez évident que je suis d'accord avec cette proposition, car c'est moi qui l'ai avancée !


C'est bien ça snarkhunter ?


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## snarkhunter

Oui (désolé pour le retard, je ne m'étais pas connecté hier...), c'est bien ainsi qu'il faut le comprendre : en fait, la composition exacte de la _relative_ dépend de l'élément que l'on souhaite mettre en évidence.


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## mrs banksy

Hi, I'm a bit confused about the use of "qui" and "ce qui"?

In this sentence, have I used the right one? :

*Dans dix ou vingt ans, j’espère que je serai devenue médecin, ce qui me rendrait très heureuse.
*
I've looked it up, but I'm still not sure how to use it - is "qui" only used when talking about a noun?

Thank you in advance!!


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## Carpette

Hi,


I would say "qui' refers to one noun or noun phrase, whereas "ce qui" refers to a whole phrase -- here, the whole "je serai devenue médecin" bit. In the same sentence, if you wrote "..., *qui *me rendrait heureuse", we would understand that the noun right before woudl make you happy. E.g.:
_"C'est en 1990 que j'ai rencontré mon mari, qui m'a rendue heureuse."_

So your sentence is right!


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## Maître Capello

In short, *qui* is translated as _who/which/that_, while *ce qui* is translated as _what/which_ (literally: "that which").

_C'est en 1990 que j'ai rencontré mon mari *qui* m'a rendue heureuse._ ↔ In 1990 I met my husband, *who* made me happy. / I met my husband in 1990 and *he* made me happy.
_C'est en 1990 que j'ai rencontré mon mari, *ce qui* m'a rendue heureuse._ ↔ I met my husband in 1990, *which* made me happy.

_J'aime *qui* est pur._ (literary) ↔ I like *anyone who* is pure.
_J'aime *ce qui* est pur._ ↔ I like *what* is pure. / I like *the things that* are pure.

_Il a cassé un vase *qui* était très cher._ ↔ He broke a vase *that* was very expensive.
_Il a cassé un vase, *ce qui* a fait des histoires._ ↔ He broke a vase, *which* made a fuss.


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