# Hungarian-Italian: elválás-feledés...



## muguete

Hi!

Can anyone translate this to me?

"Nem az elválásban van a feledés, hanem a feledésben az elválás..."

Many thanks!


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## ronanpoirier

"Non è nello silenzo che sta l'allontanamento, ma nell'allantolamento è che sta lo silenzo."


I just don't know what form of "to be" to use in that case.


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## muguete

Well, unfortunately I can't help you out with that  Anyway, thank you very much!


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## Spectre scolaire

ronanpoirier said:
			
		

> "Non è nello silenzio che sta l'allontanamento, ma nell' allontolanamento è che sta lo il silenzio."


 Some metatheses and vowel changes would spice up any language - including Italian... I hope I got it right now.
 ​


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## irene.acler

Spectre scolaire said:


> Some metatheses and vowel changes would spice up any language - including Italian... I hope I got it right now.
> ​


 
You got it!


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## tie-break

Non è nel silenzio che sta l'allontanamento, ma nell'allontanamento è che sta il silenzio.


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## Spectre scolaire

tie-break said:
			
		

> Non è nel silenzio che sta l'allontanamento, ma nell'allontanamento è che[*?*] sta il silenzio.


 If you eliminate *è*, I would expect *che* to “pass the same threshold”... 

I am repeating for myself this _adage_ over and over again. I may be wrong... (Something _is_ “clumsy” here - you’re right about that!)
 “Eliminate” < e[x] + _limen_, “threshold” ​


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## Zsanna

It is probably too late now, but I can't go past the problem: the original term is not about silence but about parting and forgetting.
In English: Forgetting (about somebody) is not when parting (= when two people separate) but (the real) parting is in forgetting.
Or to understand it: 
You don't forget somebody when you leave them but you leave them when you forget them.

Now in Italian...
Non è nella separazione che sta l'oblio ma nell'oblio che sta la separazione.


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## MSZ

Zsanna said:


> It is probably too late now, but I can't go past the problem: the original term is not about silence but about parting and forgetting.
> In English: Forgetting (about somebody) is not when parting (= when two people separate) but (the real) parting is in forgetting.
> Or to understand it:
> You don't forget somebody when you leave them but you leave them when you forget them.
> 
> Now in Italian...
> Non è nella separazione che sta l'oblio ma nell'oblio che sta la separazione.


Or perhaps (for what it's worth):
Non  è che l'oblio risulta dalla separazione; la separazione viene dall'oblio.


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## Zsanna

Thanks, MSZ - it's certainly good if the native speakers have a choice of explanation!


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## MSZ

Well, as you said, it is probably a bit late... But if it hadn't been for your clarification and suggestion, the alternative would not have presented itself to me . So thanks back!


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## Ajace

Zsanna said:


> Thanks, MSZ - it's certainly good if the native speakers have a choice of explanation!


Zsanna's translation is more correct than MSZ's, 'cause the suffixes "ban" and "ben" in "elválás*ban*" and "feledés*ben*".
That suffixes suggest the use of verb "to be = to stay".

For this reason use of "risulta" or "viene" isn't correct, beacuse them indicate a movement from the source.
In this case in hungarian there would appear the words:
"elválás*ból*" and "feledés*ből*".

The only revision is a repetiton of "to be" in the sentence:

_Non è nella separazione che sta l'oblio, ma *è* nell'oblio che sta la separazione._

Other form:
_"Non è l'oblio ad essere nella separazione, ma è la separazione ad essere nell'oblio"._

But this is not very elegant.
Maybe it's better:

_"Non è l'oblio nella separazione, ma la separazione nell'oblio"._


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## MSZ

Ajace said:


> Zsanna's translation is more correct than MSZ's, 'cause the suffixes "ban" and "ben" in "elválás*ban*" and "feledés*ben*".
> That suffixes suggest the use of verb "to be = to stay".
> 
> For this reason use of "risulta" or "viene" isn't correct, beacuse them indicate a movement from the source.
> In this case in hungarian there would appear the words:
> "elválás*ból*" and "feledés*ből*".
> 
> The only revision is a repetiton of "to be" in the sentence:
> 
> _Non è nella separazione che sta l'oblio, ma *è* nell'oblio che sta la separazione._
> 
> Other form:
> _"Non è l'oblio ad essere nella separazione, ma è la separazione ad essere nell'oblio"._
> 
> But this is not very elegant.
> Maybe it's better:
> 
> _"Non è l'oblio nella separazione, ma la separazione nell'oblio"._


 
I like Zsanna's version as revised by Ajace the best.  In the original Hungarian, the word order implies an emphasis, or focus, on _where_ the concept/feeling is to be found  (or not found) - "it's not in the separation" ... The use of _che_ captures this. I am not sure (and Ajace, you'll have to inform us) whether your version also necessarily implies this emphasis. I suspect it can be taken that way, but I wonder if it must have that implication - which it does, I think, in Hungarian.

I agree with the point about *-ban*, *-ben*. It loks like I was giving an _interpetation_, not  a _translation_.

Mille grazie!


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## Ajace

> The use of _che_ captures this. I am not sure (and Ajace, you'll have to inform us) whether your version also necessarily implies this emphasis.


You're right!
My best trouble on hungarian is interpretation of emphasis.
In italian it isn't easy express it in written language...



> It loks like I was giving an _interpetation_, not  a _translation_.


You're right again...
I don't agree the concept of "oblio into separazione" or "separazione into oblio" and I prefer your interpretation!

But I think (and it's only my opinion... Unfortunately, I don't know hungarian so good :S) that:
The use of different suffixes for "movement from", "movement to" and "stay in" shows a special care for this.
So... I think that the sentence wants say that "separazione is into oblio".

[Though, I am not very able to interpret and translate... I just wanted show an italian viewpoint (because it unfortunately miss :/)]


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