# Would have/ Had



## cheshire

"If I *would have* *done* that, my wife* would have* killed me."

I read that this type of sentences is typical German grammar errors. I'm wondering if Spanish has any structure equivalent of that of German.


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## hippie_omega

I'm not sure if the sentence in English is correct, I would say: "If I had done that, my wife would have killed me", and the meaning in Spanish would be: "Si hubiera (o hubiese) hecho eso, mi esposa me habría matado".


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## cheshire

Thanks! Is the following possible or natural in Spanish?

"Si *habría* hecho eso, mi esposa me habría matado".


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## Raphaelus

"Si yo hubiese hecho eso, mi esposa me hubiera matado."

Don't use "habría."


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## cheshire

1 *"If I *would have* *done* that, my wife* would have* killed me."
2 *"If I *had* *done* that, my wife *had* *killed* me."

I think the second type is wrong in English, but I suspect that it's OK in Spanish. Isn't that what you're suggesting by this sentence "Si yo hubiese hecho eso, mi esposa me hubiera matado."?


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## samarje

1 *"If I *would have* *done* that, my wife* would have* killed me."
2 *"If I *had* *done* that, my wife *had* *killed* me."

Both of these sentences seem wrong to me. In American English, we would generally say, *"If I had done that, my wife would have killed me."*

Your second sentence doesn't make sense because it states that your wife actually did kill you  

I have heard (rarely, but it does crop up) the statement, "If I *only would have* , then  *wouldn't have happened*." For example, "If I only would have studied better, then I wouldn't have failed my Spanish test." or "If I *only would have* stopped snoring, then my wife *wouldn't have killed* me."


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## gdmarcus

cheshire said:


> 1 *"If I *would have* *done* that, my wife* would have* killed me."
> 2 *"If I *had* *done* that, my wife *had* *killed* me."
> 
> I think the second type is wrong in English, but I suspect that it's OK in Spanish. Isn't that what you're suggesting by this sentence "Si yo hubiese hecho eso, mi esposa me hubiera matado."?



I agree with and will reiterate the opinions of hippie omega and samarje: the above two sentances are incorrect in English. In English, one would say "If I had done that, my wife would have killed me."


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## Bridgita

gdmarcus said:


> I agree with and will reiterate the opinions of hippie omega and samarje: the above two sentances are incorrect in English. In English, one would say "If I had done that, my wife would have killed me."[/quote
> 
> I'm sorry to disagree with you gdmarcus, but I think the first sentence is correct.


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## Jellby

"Si hubiera/hubiese hecho eso..." -> for the condition, you need the subjunctive (in this kind of conditional sentences), both subjunctive forms are equivalent here. Some people from the Basque region tend to say "habría", but it is wrong.

"...mi mujer me habría matado" -> for the conditioned part, you use the conditional tense, that's what it is for, to express that something is subject to a condition. It is possible, but not recommended, to use the -ra (not the -se) form of the subjunctive here for etymological reasons, so "me hubiera matado" is also correct.

I think it's the same in English:

If I had done that my wife would have killed me
subjunctive -> had done
conditional -> would have killed


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## Rayines

As Jellby has well explained, in Spanish it's possible -and even correct- to replace the Potential
/Conditional Perfect with the Subjunctive (habría >>> hubiera), but it isn't correct the inverse situation: to replace the Subjunctive with the Potential.
Then, the correct one is:
_"Si hubiera/se hecho eso, mi mujer me habría matado"._
Also you can say: _"Si hubiera/se hecho eso, mi mujer me hubiera matado"._
But it isn't correct (although you hear it sometimes): _"Si habría hecho eso, mi mujer me habría matado"._


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## Outsider

cheshire said:


> "If I *would have* *done* that, my wife* would have* killed me."
> 
> I read that this type of sentences is typical German grammar errors. I'm wondering if Spanish has any structure equivalent of that of German.


No, in Spanish you _cannot_ use the same tense in the protasis and the apodosis.

Si *hubiera/hubiese hecho* [imperfect subjunctive] eso, mi mujer me *habría matado*. [conditional]


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## Jellby

Outsider said:


> No, in Spanish you _cannot_ use the same tense in the protasis and the apodosis.



In indicative you can:

Si llueve me mojo
Si hago eso mi mujer me mata


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## Outsider

You are correct, Jellby. Let me correct what I wrote: 

...in Spanish you _cannot_ use the same tense in the protasis and the apodosis of counterfactual conditionals.


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## Forever Green

Outsider said:


> No, in Spanish you _cannot_ use the same tense in the protasis and the apodosis.
> 
> Si *hubiera/hubiese hecho* [imperfect subjunctive] eso, mi mujer me *habría matado*. [conditional]



So it would be "habría" in the conditional, contrary to the Puerto Rican poster above who said "hubiera"?


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## Outsider

Oops, do I have to correct myself again?  
I guess so. You _can_ use the same tense in the two components of a counterfactual conditional, provided it is the imperfect subjunctive I:

Si *hubiera/hubiese* hecho [imperfect subjunctive I or II] eso, mi mujer me *habría/hubiera* matado. [conditional / imperfect subjunctive I]

In the latter sentence, the subjunctive is used with a conditional value. Sorry about the mess. 

(It's still interesting that Raphaelus picked two different tenses, though.)


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## Rayines

Forever Green said:


> So it would be "habría" in the conditional, contrary to the Puerto Rican poster above who said "hubiera"?


That is the correct way, but, as we have previously explained, the form "hubiera" is accepted instead of "habría" (only accepted  ).


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## sigjak

A veces se puede oír la combinación  "si +pluscuampf. de subjuntivo - imperfecto de indicativo", como:

Si me lo *hubieras dicho* antes, te *había* prestado el dinero.

¿Puede aceptarse esta construcción en el lenguaje coloquial, para hacer hincapié en que es evidente o muy seguro que te lo había/habría prestado, y con mucho gusto?


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## Jellby

sigjak said:


> A veces se puede oír la combinación  "si +pluscuampf. de subjuntivo - imperfecto de indicativo", como:
> 
> Si me lo *hubieras dicho* antes, te *había* prestado el dinero.
> 
> ¿Puede aceptarse esta construcción en el lenguaje coloquial, para hacer hincapié en que es evidente o muy seguro que te lo había/habría prestado, y con mucho gusto?



No se me ocurre que pueda ser correcto. Sí puede ser en presente:

Si me lo *hubieras dicho* antes, te presto el dinero

con el sentido que indicas.


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## Rayines

También podría llegar a decirse: _"Si me lo decías, te lo prestaba"._


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## gdmarcus

Bridgita said:


> gdmarcus said:
> 
> 
> 
> I agree with and will reiterate the opinions of hippie omega and samarje: the above two sentances are incorrect in English. In English, one would say "If I had done that, my wife would have killed me."[/quote
> 
> I'm sorry to disagree with you gdmarcus, but I think the first sentence is correct.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Since this forum is for non-native speakers to learn other languages, the information we present as native speakers will often be taken quite seriously by others.  Factual information (such as grammar, as opposed to subjective info such as slang terms and interpretations) *must* be correct or the non-native speakers may learn something incorrectly.  I teach English grammar, so I am confident that "If I *had *done that, my wife would have killed me" is correct.  However, if anyone needs verification, there are many wonderful English grammar sites; just google "conditional English"  and you will find numerous examples of the hypothetical conditional in the past tense, of which the above example is a case, as well as the other examples of the standard use of the conditional.
Click to expand...


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## hippie_omega

Jellby said:


> "Si hubiera/hubiese hecho eso..." -> for the condition, you need the subjunctive (in this kind of conditional sentences), both subjunctive forms are equivalent here. Some people from the Basque region tend to say "habría", but it is wrong.
> 
> "...mi mujer me habría matado" -> for the conditioned part, you use the conditional tense, that's what it is for, to express that something is subject to a condition. It is possible, but not recommended, to use the -ra (not the -se) form of the subjunctive here for etymological reasons, so "me hubiera matado" is also correct.
> 
> "me hubiera matado" is not correct in Spanish in this case, because it is not subjunctive, it is conditional, so in Spanish we use the "postpretérito": "habría matado"
> 
> I think it's the same in English:
> 
> If I had done that my wife would have killed me
> subjunctive -> had done
> conditional -> would have killed


 Here: "would have killed" is, in Spanish, the conditional: "habría matado"


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## hippie_omega

Rayines said:


> As Jellby has well explained, in Spanish it's possible -and even correct- to replace the Potential
> /Conditional Perfect with the Subjunctive (habría >>> hubiera), but it isn't correct the inverse situation: to replace the Subjunctive with the Potential.
> Then, the correct one is:
> _"Si hubiera/se hecho eso, mi mujer me habría matado"._
> Also you can say: _"Si hubiera/se hecho eso, mi mujer me hubiera matado"._
> 
> Here "me hubiera matado" is not correct. The first one is correct.
> 
> But it isn't correct (although you hear it sometimes): _"Si habría hecho eso, mi mujer me habría matado"._


 
This, of course, isn't correct.


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## hippie_omega

Rayines said:


> That is the correct way, but, as we have previously explained, the form "hubiera" is accepted instead of "habría" (only accepted  ).


 
Rayines: you are right!!! Even though it is not correct, many people use it that way.


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## hippie_omega

Jellby said:


> No se me ocurre que pueda ser correcto. Sí puede ser en presente:
> 
> Si me lo *hubieras dicho* antes, te presto el dinero
> 
> con el sentido que indicas.


 
No se puede decir : Si me lo hubieras dicho antes, te había prestado dinero; se usa el condicional: te habría prestado dinero.


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## Jellby

hippie_omega said:


> Rayines: you are right!!! Even though it is not correct, many people use it that way.



Note that, for etymological reasons (I believe), the "-ra" form of the subjunctive *can* sometimes be used with indicative or conditional meanings. It is not incorrect. Granted, the "canonical" tense in this case is the conditional, but "hubiera" is also correct.


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## Rayines

Jellby said:


> Note that, for etymological reasons (I believe), the "-ra" form of the subjunctive *can* sometimes be used with indicative or conditional meanings. It is not incorrect. Granted, the "canonical" tense in this case is the conditional, but "hubiera" is also correct.


Totalmente de acuerdo. Anoche no le pude contestar esto mismo a hippie_omega porque ya era un poco tarde.


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## Bridgita

No, I agree that:  "If I had done that, my wife would have killed me."  is correct, but I also felt comfortable saying the other sentence, but the more I think about it, it sounds a little odd.


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