# How sizeable is the thesaurus for unit or group (e.g., English pride of lions, pack of wolves) in different languages?



## Lusus Naturae

English has a sizeable thesaurus for different groups in the animal kingdom, e.g., _conspiracy _of ravens/lemurs, _lamentation _of swans, _memory/parade_ of elephants.

Chinese has an immensely sizeable thesaurus for different units of countable nouns (e.g., the unit for lamp is _zhan, _for door is_ shan, _for ship is _sou_), a rather sizeable thesaurus for the less concrete units* of uncountable nouns (e.g., for smoke is _lü_, for afterglow is _muo_) and for groups (e.g., for infantry and cavalry can be _biao _or _duei_).

* as opposed to the more concrete quantifiers like glass of water, cup of tea

Do most languages feature a more or less sizeable thesaurus for different units or groups?


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## Ben Jamin

Lusus Naturae said:


> English has a sizeable thesaurus for different groups in the animal kingdom, e.g., _conspiracy _of ravens/lemurs, _lamentation _of swans, _memory/parade_ of elephants.
> 
> Chinese has an immensely sizeable thesaurus for different units of countable nouns (e.g., the unit for lamp is _zhan, _for door is_ shan, _for ship is _sou_), a rather sizeable thesaurus for the less concrete units* of uncountable nouns (e.g., for smoke is _lü_, for afterglow is _muo_) and for groups (e.g., for infantry and cavalry can be _biao _or _duei_).
> 
> * as opposed to the more concrete quantifiers like glass of water, cup of tea
> 
> Do most languages feature a more or less sizeable thesaurus for different units or groups?


Are the names of groups the same as units of countable nouns? I have a feeling that this is not the case.


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## pollohispanizado

From what I understand, English has a ridiculously large number of specific names for groups of animals because English aristocrats in the Renaissance period were keen on making up unique ones as they were out hunting.

Now, I don't know if that is the real answer (or if I remembered it correctly), but it sounds plausible enough to me. It's undeniable that the sheer quantity of these words is overwhelming. I certainly don't use or hear 80% of them except for facetiously.

As Ben Jamin pointed out, you seem to be conflating two concepts. We do use words that could be considered quantifiers, but it is far from being a salient feature of the English language (or any European language, as far as I know...) We mostly use them to quantify uncountable nouns.


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## Hulalessar

Classifiers as used in many Asian languages are a distinct thing from collective nouns.

In a language with classifiers if you are talking about cows in certain contexts you must use both the word "cow(s)" and the classifier.

Whilst in the more arcane cases, such as "an exaltation of larks", the collective noun is going to be accompanied by the thing collected, in the case of commonly used collective nouns you can use the word on its own. You can also refer to the things collected without the collective noun - indeed in some cases it would not be appropriate, as in "cows provide us with milk".


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## Red Arrow

In Dutch:

*clan *for badgers
*familie (family) *for apes/monkeys, bears and closely releated humans
*ketel* *(kettle)* for wild baby swines
*kolonie (colony)* for seals, micro organisms and humans
*kudde (herd)* for herd animals (rhinos, elephants, horses, cows, sheep, donkeys, goats...)
*meute* for hunting dogs and a large group of humans
*moord (murder)* for crows
*parlement* for owls
*roedel *for dogs/wolves and deer
*rotte (rotten) *for wild swines
*school* for fish and sea mammals
*span* for sled dogs
*sprong (jump)* for deer and rabbits
*toom (bridle)* for geese, chickens and piglets
*troep (troup, troop, junk)* for apes/monkeys, lions, geese and soldiers
*vlucht (flight)* for birds and bees
*volk (folk) *for bees and humans
*zwerm (swarm)* for flying insects
The English word "school" (of fish) is apparently a loanword from Dutch.


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## apmoy70

In Greek we have only:

-*«Σμήνος»* [ˈsmi.nɔs] (neut.) < Classical neut. noun *«σμῆνος» smênŏs* --> initially _a swarm of bees_, later, _swarm in ɡeneral_ (of unknown etymoloɡy). «Σμήνος» describes any _larɡe_ or_ dense ɡroup of flyinɡ beinɡs_ (birds or incects alike).

-*«Αγέλη»* [aˈʝe.li] (fem.) --> _herd, flock_ < Classical feminine noun *«ἀγέλη» ăɡélē* (idem), from IE *h₂eɡ́- _to drive_. From the verb *«ἄγω» ắɡō* with a suffix *-l- comparative with Lat. agilis, Skt. अजिरा (ajirá), _mobile, quick_. From «αγέλη» the Koine name for _cow_ *«ἀγελάς» ăɡĕlás* (fem.) which in Byzantine/Modern Greek replaced the "difficult" earlier one *«βοῦς»* for it (ἀγελάς (Koine)/αγελάδα (MoGr) = _animal, member of a herd_). «Αγέλη» describes_ any group of social animals_ (predatory or nonhunter alike).

-*«Κοπάδι»* [kɔˈpa.ði] (neut.) --> _drove, flock, herd, shoal, ɡaɡɡle etc._ < Byzantine Greek neuter diminutive *«κοπάδι(ο)ν kopádi(o)n* of Classical deverbative feminine noun *«κοπή» kŏpḗ* --> _cutting, felling, chopping_ < Classical verb *«κόπτω» kóptō*. Τhe initial meaninɡ of «κοπάδι(ο)ν» was _section of flock/herd_. «Κοπάδι» is the generic name of _a ɡroup of animals of the same species_.

-*«Ποίμνη»* [pim.ni] (fem.) --> _herd, flock of sheep, (Koine) fold_ < Classical fem. *«ποίμνη» poí̯mnē* (idem) < Classical 3rd declension masculine noun *«ποιμήν» poi̯mḗn* (nom. sing.), *«ποιμένος» poi̯ménŏs* (ɡen. sinɡ.) --> _herdsman, shepherd, metaph. guardian, leader, master_ (PIE *peh₂-(i)- _to protect_ cf Skt. पायु (páyu), _guard, protector_, Av. pāiiu- _herdsman, protector_). «Ποίμνη» is the _sheep_ or_ goat herd_. 

-*«Αποικία»* [a.piˈci.a] (fem.) --> _colony_ < Classical feminine noun *«ἀποικίᾱ» ăpoi̯kíā* (idem) < compound; Classical prefix and preposition *«ἀπό» ăpó* + Classical masculine noun *«οἶκος» oî̯kŏs*. The word is calqued for the English _colony_ when describing _a flock of seals_, or _penguins_.


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## Penyafort

In the Romance languages, the extensive use of suffixes often helps in such things as creating collective groups. But I don't feel like there are fewer collective nouns for animals than in English, yet I may not be acquainted with many of them.

Regarding *Catalan*, the most usual collective suffixes for nouns are _-ada, -alla, -am, -at, -era and -menta_. For animal groups, -ada is definitely the most used among them, so that from _gat _we've got _*gatada '*_group of cats', from _gos _'dog' _*gossada*_, from vaca 'cow' *vacada*, from _lloca _'laying hen' we've got *llocada *'group of baby chicken', from _porc/bacó_ and _truja _'sow' we get _*porcada/baconada/trujada*_, etc.

Other collective nouns may use these suffixes but not be derived from animals (or not so obviously). Among these:

*ramat *or _*folc *_for cattle (sheep, cows, etc)​​*banc *for fish that are the same​​*mola *for fish that are different​​*aviram *for poultry  [au = bird]​​*eixam *for bees​​_*canilla *_for hounds (hunting together)  [ca = dog]​
*vol *or _*bandada *_for birds (flying together)​​*rècula *for beasts of burden​​There are also general terms such as *esbart *which can be used for both people and animals, more general ones such as _*colla*, *munió* _which are for people and animals but can include some things, general terms that were used more specifically in the past (*estol *for ships), etc.

Some used for children are _*mainada*_, _*criaturam*_, _*quitxalla*_, _*xicalla *_and, funnily, _*canalla*_, which originally was a group of dogs.

Of course, more international ones also exist in the language, such as *colònia*, _*família*_, etc.


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## merquiades

There are a lot of words for animal groups in English but I've never heard of 90% of them





			
				infoplease said:
			
		

> ClassificationSpecies NameGroup Name*Mammals*apesshrewdnessassespacebadgerscetebatscolonybearssleuth, slothbuffalogang, obstinancy, herdcatsclowder, pouncecattledrove, herddeerherd, bevydogspack, mute, kennelelephantsherdelkgangferretsbusinessfoxleash, skulk, earthgiraffestowergoatstribe, tripgorillasbandhippopotamusesbloathorsesteam, harras, stud, rag, stringhyenascacklekangaroostroopleopardsleaplionspridemartensrichnessmoleslabormonkeystroop, barrelmulespack, span, barrenottersrompoxenteam, yokepigsdrift, drove, teamporcupinespricklerabbitscolony, warren, nestrhinocerosescrashsealspod, herdsheepdrove, flock, herdsquirrelsdray, scurrytigersstreakwhalespod, gam, herdwolvespack, rout*Birds*birds in generalflight, flock, volary, bracebitternssedgebuzzardswakebobolinkschainchicks (of many species)brood, clutchcootscovercormorantsgulpcranessedgecrowsmurder, hordedottereltripdovesduleeaglesconvocationfinchescharmflamingosstandgeeseflock, gaggle, skeingrousepackgullscolonyhawkscast, kettle, boilheronssedge, siegejaysparty, scoldlapwingsdeceitlarksexaltationmallardssord, bracemagpiestiding, gulp, murder, charmnightingaleswatchowlsparliamentparrotscompanypartridgecoveypeacocksmuster, ostentationpenguinscolonypheasantnest, nide, brood, nye, bouquetploverscongregation, wingptarmiganscoveyrooksbuildingquailbevy, coveyravensunkindnesssnipewalk, wispsparrowshoststarlingsmurmurationstorksmusteringswallowsflightswansbevy, wedgetealspringturkeysrafter, gangwidgeonscompanywoodcocksfallwoodpeckersdescent*Reptiles and Amphibians*crocodilesbaskfrogsarmytoadsknotturtlesbale, nestsnakes, vipersnest*Fish*fish in generaldraft, nest, school, shoalbassshoalherringarmysharksshivertrouthover*Invertebrates*antscolonybeesgrist, hive, swarmcaterpillarsarmyclamsbedcockroachesintrusionfliesbusinessgnatscloud, hordegrasshopperscloudhornetsnestjellyfishsmacklocustsplagueoystersbed


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## muhahaa

Finnish:
lauma (most land animals)
parvi (birds, fish, flying insects)
tokka (reindeer)
katras (sheep)


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## Red Arrow

merquiades said:


> There are a lot of words for animal groups in English but I've never heard of 90% of them


Hmmm... 25 words sounded familiar to me, probably because of BBC documentaries.

I forgot about "bed" for oysters. This is also used in Dutch. Same with "nest" and "plaag" (plague).

It is very odd that a kettle is a group of hawks in English, but a group of baby swines in Dutch.


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## merquiades

Red Arrow said:


> Hmmm... 25 words sounded familiar to me, probably because of BBC documentaries.
> 
> I forgot about "bed" for oysters. This is also used in Dutch. Same with "nest" and "plaag" (plague).
> 
> It is very odd that a kettle is a group of hawks in English, but a group of baby swines in Dutch.


And I'd say a kettle of fish.


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## Stoggler

merquiades said:


> There are a lot of words for animal groups in English but I've never heard of 90% of them



Most of those seem designed to catch out the 99.9% of people who don’t know or care about such things and to make certain males feel superior knowing such things.


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## entangledbank

Most of those are not real English, in the sense that they're not really used. Herd, pack, and flock cover land mammals, with a pride of lions being perhaps the only specific 'term of venery' that is in genuine use. All birds are in flocks, not parliaments or murders, except that 'gaggle of geese' is a known alternative to a flock of geese. There are probably several other exceptions that are actually used - a pod of cetaceans, for example. I don't think the long list should be counted in anyone's comparative statistics.


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## Red Arrow

entangledbank said:


> There are probably several other exceptions that are actually used - a pod of cetaceans, for example.


Buffalo gang, colony, troop, flight, brood, nest, bed, plague, swarm, hive, kennel and army are definitely used.


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## merquiades

I would have to look up troop, flight, brood, and army to see what exactly they could be used for.   I thought brood would be for horses and nest would be for robins, but I looked them up and I was wrong.
I don't even know some of the animals.  Widgeons, ptarmigans, lapwings?


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## apmoy70

Since you've mentioned it @Lusus Naturae, in Greek military nomenclature, Artillery and Cavalry use different terminology from Infantry, to describe a specific group of troops and their leaders:

Infantry: *«Ομάδα»* [ɔˈma.ða] (fem.) < Classical Gr. *«ὁμάς» hŏmắs* (fem.) --> _ɡroup, bunch, ɡanɡ, team, squad_ (from PIE *somHós, _same, alike_ cf. Skt. सम (samá), Proto-Germanic *samaz > Eng. same) which is the translation of _Infantry_ _Squad_ (USE), _Infantry_ _Section_ (BrE). Artillery: *«Στοιχείο»* [stiˈçi.ɔ] (neut.) --> _element_ < Classical Gr. *«στοιχεῖον» stoi̯kʰeî̯ŏn* (neut.) --> _component, element, elementary_ or _fundamental principle, part_ (PIE *stei̯gʰ- _to stride, march_ cf. Lat. vestigium, Ger. steigen, Dutch stijgen). «Στοιχείο» is commanded by a *«Στοιχειάρχης»* [sti.çiˈar.çis] (masc. & fem.) < «στοιχεῖον» + v. *«ἄρχω» ắrkʰō* --> _to lead, rule, ɡovern, command_.
Infantry: *«Διμοιρία»* [ði.miˈɾi.a] (fem.), which is the equivalent of Eng. _Platoon_. Artillery/Cavalry: *«Ουλαμός»* [u.laˈmɔs] (masc.) < Classical masc. noun *«οὐλαμός» oulamós* --> _thronɡ, crowd, troop of cavalry_ < *«ϝόλαμος» wólamŏs* --> _pursuit_, o-ɡrade of v. *«εἴλω» eí̯lō* --> _to crowd toɡether, hem in, accumulate_ (PIE *ue̯lH- _to turn, wind_ cf. Proto-Germanic *wallaną, _to well up, spring out_ > Ger./Dt. wallen, Enɡ. wall). It's commanded by an *«ουλαμαγός»* [u.la.maˈɣɔs] (masc. & fem.) < «ουλαμός» + v. *«ἄγω» ắɡō* --> _to lead, ɡuide_.
Infantry: *«Λόχος»* [ˈlɔ.xɔs] (masc.), o-grade of deponent v. *«λέχομαι» lékʰŏmai̯* --> _to lie down (in ambush)_, equivalent of Enɡ. _Company_. Artillery: *«Πυροβολαρχία»* [pi.ɾɔ.vɔ.larˈçi.a] (fem.) < *«πυροβόλο»* [pi.ɾɔˈvɔ.lɔ] (neut.) --> _cannon, ɡun_ (*«πῦρ» pûr* --> _fire_ + v. *«βάλλω» bắllō* --> _to throw, cast, hurl_) + v. *«ἄρχω» ắrkʰō* --> _to lead, rule, ɡovern, command_. Cavalry: *«Ίλη»* [ˈi.li] (fem.) < Classical fem. noun *«ἴλη» ílē* --> _band, troop of horses_ < v. *«εἴλω» eí̯lō* (see earlier). «Ίλη» is commanded by an *«ίλαρχος»* [ˈi.lar.xɔs] (masc. & fem.) < «ἴλη» + v. «ἄρχω».  
Infantry: *«Τάγμα»* [ˈtaɣ.ma] (neut.) from v. *«τάσσω» tắssō* --> _to arrange, appoint, assign_, which is the translation of Enɡ. _Battalion_. Artillery: *«Μοίρα»* [ˈmi.ɾa] (fem.) < Classical Gr. fem. *«μοῖρα» moî̯ră* (fem.) --> _part, portion_, o-ɡrade of deponent v. *«μείρομαι» meí̯rŏmai̯* --> _to receive as my portion_. It's commanded by a *«Μοίραρχος»* [ˈmi.ɾar.xɔs] (masc. & fem.) < «μοῖρα» + v. «ἄρχω». Cavalry: *«Επιλαρχία»* [e.pi.larˈçi.a] (fem.) < Classical prepositon and prefix *«ἐπί» ĕpí* --> _on, upon, over_ + «ἴλη» + v. «ἄρχω». Ιts commander is an *«Επίλαρχος»* [eˈpi.lar.xɔs] (masc. & fem.).


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## entangledbank

Red Arrow said:


> Buffalo gang, colony, troop, flight, brood, nest, bed, plague, swarm, hive, kennel and army are definitely used.


Nope, not all. A swarm of insects is - that's the generic term for any insect. Plague and army yes, for insects that cause destruction or appear in huge numbers; these would be felt as metaphors, not specific terms for kinds of animal. A troop of baboons or something (with Gerald the talking gorilla from _Not the Nine O'Clock News_ firmly reminding us 'A whoop, professor, a whoop of gorillas; a flange of baboons.') The thing is, all these terms are not specific to some kind of animal, they're not of the 'parliament of owls' variety. Any insect that swarms is a swarm of that insect; any insect that forms a nest can be described as a nest of that insect, if it's in one. These are generics like 'group' or 'crowd'. They're descriptive of what you find. As such, they could no doubt be multiplied: a display of butterflies (or of dahlias), an incursion of murder hornets (or of Somali refugees). These are just the ordinary nouns of the language being applied, on a particular occasion, to animals.


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