# Hindi/Urdu: bird



## Machlii5

Greetings,
I don't know if there is a dictionary that could answer my question about the use of the different words for “bird“ (in the zoological sense) - but all the dictionaries I have access to have left me in the lurch: 
I've learned ciRiyaa in my Hindi lessons,   pankhii  and  parindaa  from bollywood songs,  pakshii from a headline on bbc hindi.com, and I found the rest in dictionaries.  It seems that all of them are generic terms. 
Would you please be so kind to enlighten me as to the difference in origin / frequency / connotation, or whatever might be relevant?

1. खग        khag        m
2. चिड़ा    ciRaa       m       
3. चिड़िया  ciRiyaa    f                   
4. पंखी    pankhii    m       
5. पक्षी     pakshii    m         
6. परिंदा   parindaa   m


----------



## greatbear

"chiRiyaa" is used for a sparrow, but it works as the generic term for birds and is a highly frequent term in Hindi. I have never heard "chiRaa" before. I have never heard a "khag" but it does seem to exist; but there is a "kaag", which means a crow or raven (now usually called "kauuwaa" rather than "kaag"). "Pakshii", "parindaa" and "pankhii" are all synonymous terms; I have not done any statistical research and of course the word used changes depending on the region and milieu you are in, but based on my experience so far, "chiRiyaa" and "pakshii" are the most frequent. "Parindaa" is regarded as something of a more literary term, and in common day-to-day speech is rarely used. "PaNkhii" ("paNkh" means bird feathers) could be found in poetry, but again not many people use it otherwise. You forgot another word, which is sufficiently common: "panchhii" (पंछी).

Then there are words now existing only in expressions: like "pakheruu" (पखेरू), which is only used in expressions like "praaN pakheruu ho gaye". Also a "piddi" (पिद्दी), a very small bird, hence the usage "piddi" for someone, something insignificant, trivial.

And finally, a Hindi poetic term would be "gaganchar" (one who moves in the sky, literally).

The above responses are only valid for Hindi in my experience; usage varies according to the region, so others may have had different experiences. Urdu may of course have different frequencies of usage.


----------



## Faylasoof

Machlii5 said:


> Greetings,
> I don't know if there is a dictionary that could answer my question about the use of the different words for “bird“ (in the zoological sense) - but all the dictionaries I have access to have left me in the lurch:
> I've learned ciRiyaa in my Hindi lessons, pankhii and parindaa from bollywood songs, pakshii from a headline on bbc hindi.com, and I found the rest in dictionaries. It seems that all are of them are generic terms.
> Would you please be so kind to enlighten me as to the difference in origin / frequency / connotation, or whatever might be relevant?
> 
> 1. खग khag m
> 2. चिड़ा ciRaa m
> 3. चिड़िया ciRiyaa f
> 4. पंखी pankhii m
> 5. पक्षी pakshii m
> 6. परिंदा parindaa m


 In Urdu, we routinely use چڑیا चिड़िया chiRiyaa (general term / sparrow, fem., a shuttlecock!), chiRaa / ChiDDaa (male sparrow), parindah (= bird, plural parinde = birds). [My '_ch'_ = your '_c'_ !]

We discussed some of these here and here. 

You may also wish to search the term 'bird' in Platts.


----------



## Qureshpor

Very comprehensive answer indeed from gb. I remember hearing "paNkh-pakheruu" in Muhammad Rafi's "chal uR jaa re paNchii" song. "chiRaa" is the other half of a "chiRiyaa". kaag/kaagaa, especially the latter is found in Urdu poetry (including songs). "parindah" (like aa'indah = aane vaalaa = future) is a "karne vaalaa" word and in this case it means "uRne vaalaa" (bird). There is a famous poem for children by Iqbal called "parinde kii faryaad" where the poor bird is saying, amongst other things..

Gham dil ko khaa rahaa hai, dil Gham ko khaa rahaa hai"


----------



## greatbear

I forgot to mention in my previous post that "pankh" (and "par") also means the more important "wings", not just "feathers". Which is why "pankhii" and "parindaa".


----------



## marrish

Supplementary to the post above, let me say that _pakSh_, too, means a wing.


----------



## greatbear

marrish said:


> Supplementary to the post above, let me say that _pakSh_, too, means a wing.



Ah yes, though nowadays one is more used to thinking of "party" (as in "virodhi paksh" meaning "opposition", also "vipaksh") or "side" (as in which side are you on?) when one uses "paksh".


----------



## marrish

greatbear said:


> Ah yes, though nowadays one is more used to thinking of "party" (as in "virodhi paksh" meaning "opposition", also "vipaksh") or "side" (as in which side are you on?) when one uses "paksh".


Sure! But we can speak of a ''left wing'' or a ''right wing'' too!


----------



## Abu Talha

Just to add to the helpful answers above, I would say that parindah is the most common and generic name for "bird." chiRyaa is properly a sparrow but it can be any small songbird. I don't think it can be used for larger birds. Even for the plural "songbirds", I think one would use parindah versus chiRyaa, as for example in the sentence, "The birds were chirping outside."


----------



## greatbear

daee said:


> Just to add to the helpful answers above, I would say that parindah is the most common and generic name for "bird." chiRyaa is properly a sparrow but it can be any small songbird. I don't think it can be used for larger birds. Even for the plural "songbirds", I think one would use parindah versus chiRyaa, as for example in the sentence, "The birds were chirping outside."



In Hindi, "pakshii" would be the common as well as appropriate term for birds in totality, especially larger ones, but "chiRiyaa" is also often used for all birds. "parindaa" is much more rare in Hindi compared to "pakshii", "chiRiyaa" and "panchhii".


----------



## Abu Talha

greatbear said:


> In Hindi, "pakshii" would be the common as well as appropriate term for birds in totality, especially larger ones, but "chiRiyaa" is also often used for all birds. "parindaa" is much more rare in Hindi compared to "pakshii", "chiRiyaa" and "panchhii".


Good to know. I guess I should qualify my answer as being very specific to the kind of Urdu I hear around me. I haven't heard pakshii before (doesn't mean much, I haven't heard a lot of words), but panchhii sounds very poetic and high register to me. I don't really hear it in daily speech.


----------



## marrish

I don't experience _paNchhii_ as poetic, and absolutely not as high register. Please note that _parindah_ means not only a bird, but may refer to flying insects as well!


----------



## Qureshpor

Is n't there another word for "sparrow" in Hindi? "gauraiyaa".


----------



## marrish

With its male counterpart, _gauraa_.


----------



## BP.

marrish said:


> I don't experience _paNchhii_ as poetic, and absolutely not as high register. Please note that _parindah_ means not only a bird, but may refer to flying insects as well!


Wouldn't the latter be _parwaanah _rather. Both are beings with _par_s.


----------



## BP.

marrish said:


> With its male counterpart, _gauraa_.


Really? I just thought we see the gauraiyyah* chuRiyaa and the gauraiyyah chiDDaa through our windows. Thanks fo rthe info.

*writing as spoken


----------



## marrish

BelligerentPacifist said:


> Wouldn't the latter be _parwaanah _rather. Both are beings with _par_s.


Of course, thanks for the correction. I'd misread _parindah_ for _parwaanah_ somehow...


----------



## marrish

BelligerentPacifist said:


> Really? I just thought we see the gauraiyyah* chuRiyaa and the gauraiyyah chiDDaa through our windows. Thanks fo rthe info.
> 
> *writing as spoken


Your periphrastic _gauraiyyah chiDDaa_ is so tiny a creature that it requires a single word to be defined, _gauraa_.


----------



## BP.

marrish said:


> Your periphrastic _gauraiyyah chiDDaa_ is so tiny a creature that it requires a single word to be defined, _gauraa_.


Oh
Thanks.


----------



## tonyspeed

In my personal esperience, pakshii is a formal word, but it is learned early enough in life not to matter (amongst the educated anyway). A survey done in Haryana in the 70s showed that at the age of 7 only 20% of children knew that word (I'm assuming you learn the word for bird before age 7), but by the age of 11 72% knew the word. chiRiyaa and panCHii in my experience are the colloquial words. They used panCHii on a sesame street song (Gulli Gulli Sim Sim) if that is of any indication of it's commonness. I'm assuming they did their research ...


parindah - i must agree is fairly uncommon in Hindi except for in songs and poetry.


----------



## greatbear

daee said:


> Good to know. I guess I should qualify my answer as being very specific to the kind of Urdu I hear around me. I haven't heard pakshii before (doesn't mean much, I haven't heard a lot of words), but panchhii sounds very poetic and high register to me. I don't really hear it in daily speech.



On further reflection, I find that "parindaa" is not so rare in Hindi; it is of course not the most common but it is used a lot more than what I had initially thought. There are highly used expressions like "parindaa bhii par nahiN maar paaegaa", and one uses "parindaa" there, not the other bird synonyms.

As for "panchhii", to me also it sounds poetic and conveying a rustic flavour.


----------



## Abu Talha

greatbear said:


> As for "panchhii", to me also it sounds poetic and conveying a rustic flavour.


I think you've hit the nail on the head. I won't hear it in formal speech, so it's probably not high-register as Marrish sb says, but I associate it with a rich eloquent rural kind of speech. 


greatbear said:


> ... but "chiRiyaa" is also often used for all birds.


To me, it would sound strange if chiRyaa were used for anything larger than a pigeon. Even a pigeon would usually be called a kabuutar. I can't think of chiRyaa being used for fowl, crows, eagles, vultures. Is this possible in Hindi?


----------



## greatbear

daee said:


> To me, it would sound strange if chiRyaa were used for anything larger than a pigeon. Even a pigeon would usually be called a kabuutar. I can't think of chiRyaa being used for fowl, crows, eagles, vultures. Is this possible in Hindi?



chiRiyaa means a sparrow and more generically all very small birds. However, one often says things in Hindi like "is jangal meiN kai chiRiyaaeN haiN" or "us zuu meiN kai baRii chiRiyaaeN bhii haiN": thus even if eagles and vultures are not called a "chiRiyaa" when specifically alluded to, when all birdkind is being talked about, "chiRiyaa" is often said in colloquial speech. Of course, "pakshii" for the birdkind is a better term in Hindi than "chiRiyaa".


----------



## Abu Talha

greatbear said:


> chiRiyaa means a sparrow and more generically all very small birds. However, one often says things in Hindi like "is jangal meiN kai chiRiyaaeN haiN" or "us zuu meiN kai baRii chiRiyaaeN bhii haiN": thus even if eagles and vultures are not called a "chiRiyaa" when specifically alluded to, when all birdkind is being talked about, "chiRiyaa" is often said in colloquial speech. Of course, "pakshii" for the birdkind is a better term in Hindi than "chiRiyaa".


I see. Even in Urdu, a zoo is called chiRyaa-ghar so perhaps it is similar usage.


----------



## Qureshpor

tonyspeed said:


> parindah - i must agree is fairly uncommon in Hindi except for in songs and poetry.



There is a film called "parinda" made in 1989

vuh parindah jise parvaaz se fursat nah thii
aaj tanhaa hai to diivaar pih aa baiThaa hai

(Poet ?)

The bird that once had no spare time left after his flying
Has come down today to perch on a wall, all by himself!

There is another word for "bird" in literary Urdu.."taa'ir"

ai taa'ir-i-laahuutii us rizq se maut achchhii
jis rizq se aatii ho parvaaz meN kotaahii

Iqbal

O celestial bird, death is better than that subsistence
In pursuit of which one has to cut short one's flight!


----------



## greatbear

QURESHPOR said:


> There is a film called "parinda" made in 1989



Yes, an award-winner and popular film it was. So was "Ghaatak", which means murderer but hardly ever used as a word in speech.


----------



## lcfatima

I heard someone saying chiRi. Is this Punjabi?


----------



## tonyspeed

greatbear said:


> Of course, "pakshii" for the birdkind is a better term in Hindi than "chiRiyaa".



I think we could relate this with English. Commonly, people say birds, but when having scientific discussions  "fowl" is usally used.


----------



## greatbear

tonyspeed said:


> I think we could relate this with English. Commonly, people say birds, but when having scientific discussions  "fowl" is usally used.



I don't think we can; birds is for all birds, including those of the size of albatross, whereas "chiRiyaa" means sparrows and thus very short birds. It's simply a colloquialism to call all birds as "chiRiyaa", whereas using "birds" for birds is not a colloquialism. Fowl is merely a type of birds, whereas "giddh" are not a type of "chiRiyaa".


----------



## marrish

lcfatima said:


> I heard someone saying chiRi. Is this Punjabi?


Whom did you hear saying it?


----------



## lcfatima

My friend's father in law. Come to think of it, they are Hindko speaking, not Punjabi. Though he speaks in accented Urdu with his grandchildren, I heard him call bird 'chiRi' and wondered about that. Maybe it is Hindko or 'motherese'/baby-language.


----------



## lcfatima

I happened to ask my husband about chiRi just now, too. He says 'pahaaRi' log use this also. I believe he means PoTohaari speakers.


----------



## tonyspeed

Hindi پنچهی पंछी _panćhī_ [S. पक्षी], s.f. A bird:—_panćhiyan_,  Braj. pl. of _panćhī_.
Sanskrit پکشی पक्षी _pakshī_, पक्षि _pakshi_, adj. & s.m. Winged;  taking the side (of), siding (with);—a bird;
Persian پرنده _paranda_, vulg. _parinda_, part. Winged; flying,  fleet;—s.m. A bird, &c.=_parand_, q.v.
*Hindi چڙي चिड़ी ćiṛī* [Prk. चडिआ; S. चट+इका], s.f. A hen sparrow; a bird:—_ćiṛī-mār_, s.m. A bird-catcher, a fowler.

Platts has no knowledge of chiRiyaa...


----------



## marrish

lcfatima said:


> I happened to ask my husband about chiRi just now, too. He says 'pahaaRi' log use this also. I believe he means PoTohaari speakers.


It is as much Standard Urdu as Standard Punjabi.


----------



## BP.

tonyspeed said:


> I think we could relate this with English. Commonly, people say birds, but when having scientific discussions  "fowl" is usally used.


We have murgh for fowl in urdu. FYI.


----------



## Faylasoof

lcfatima said:


> I heard someone saying chiRi. Is this Punjabi?


 Not quite! We use it in compounds like chiRii-maar = bird catcher.


lcfatima said:


> I happened to ask my husband about chiRi just  now, too. He says 'pahaaRi' log use this also. I believe he means  PoTohaari speakers.


Not just the Punj-aab but also used in the Do-aab - the Gangetic plain!


tonyspeed said:


> Hindi پنچهی पंछी _panćhī_ [S. पक्षी], s.f. A bird:—_panćhiyan_,  Braj. pl. of _panćhī_.
> Sanskrit پکشی पक्षी _pakshī_, पक्षि _pakshi_, adj. & s.m. Winged;  taking the side (of), siding (with);—a bird;
> Persian پرنده _paranda_, vulg. _parinda_, part. Winged; flying,  fleet;—s.m. A bird, &c.=_parand_, q.v.
> *Hindi چڙي चिड़ी ćiṛī* [Prk. चडिआ; S. चट+इका], s.f. A hen sparrow; a bird:—*ćiṛī-mār, s.m. A bird-catcher*, a fowler.
> 
> *Platts has no knowledge of chiRiyaa*...


 _*This is one term where we use chiRi-.. too! Otherwise it is chiRiyaa for us!*_ _*...  and this shows this lexicon's age!*_


----------



## greatbear

Yes, we also use "chiRi-maar", but that's the only place where we use "chiRi".


----------



## marrish

We use _chiRii_ while playing cards.


----------



## marrish

tonyspeed said:


> Hindi پنچهی पंछी _panćhī_ [S. पक्षी], s.f. A bird:—_panćhiyan_,  Braj. pl. of _panćhī_.
> Sanskrit پکشی पक्षी _pakshī_, पक्षि _pakshi_, adj. & s.m. Winged;  taking the side (of), siding (with);—a bird;
> Persian پرنده _paranda_, vulg. _parinda_, part. Winged; flying,  fleet;—s.m. A bird, &c.=_parand_, q.v.
> *Hindi چڙي चिड़ी ćiṛī* [Prk. चडिआ; S. चट+इका], s.f. A hen sparrow; a bird:—_ćiṛī-mār_, s.m. A bird-catcher, a fowler.
> 
> _*Platts has no knowledge of chiRiyaa...
> *_
> 
> 
> Faylasoof said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not quite! We use it in compounds like chiRii-maar = bird catcher.
> Not just the Punj-aab but also used in the Do-aab - the Gangetic plain!
> _*This is one term where we use chiRi-.. too! Otherwise it is chiRiyaa for us!*_ _*... and this shows this lexicon's age!*_
Click to expand...


Notwithstanding the age of Platts SaaHib's lexicon, he did provide the posterity with the appropriate entry, which is interesting, as ever:

H 
*چڙيا**चिड़िया** ćiṛiyā, prov. **चिड़ैया**, ćiṛaiyā (i.q. ćiṛī, q.v.), s.f.* _A hen-sparrow; a bird;—a kind of sewing; a gusset;—a scotch (so called from its bird-like shape); a crutch; a shuttlecock; the timber by which the column or beam and the crusher of an oil-mill are connected:—ćiṛiyā-ḵẖāna, s.m. An aviary:—ćiṛiyā-kā, ćiṛiyā-wālā, s.m. (colloq.) A term of abuse:—sone-kī ćiṛiyā, s.f. 'A golden bird'; a valuable prize._

Let me rehabilitate the memory of this buzurg!


----------



## tonyspeed

marrish said:


> Let me rehabilitate the memory of this buzurg!



I guess the search feauture on that page is not perfect. Devanagari pulled up nothing, but ciriya did - as opposed to chiriya.


----------



## marrish

I hope you must have already noticed that the transcription there uses ch (actually ćh) for aspirated ch, which we transliterate here as chh.


----------



## greatbear

marrish said:


> We use _chiRii_ while playing cards.



Yes, of course, that's another word though, with the long 'i' ending, meaning the suit of clubs in a card deck.


----------



## marrish

greatbear said:


> *Yes, of course, that's another word though*, *with the long 'i' ending*, *meaning the suit of clubs in a card deck.*




Thanks, indeed this is the meaning in the context of playing cards. 

I disagree with you that it be another word, it is exactly the same word.

It has undisputably an ending in long 'i', but this is a truism as all Prakrit based nouns ending in ''i'' have a long ''i'' at the end in Hindi or in Urdu. Is the emphasis on its length relevant?


----------



## marrish

QURESHPOR said:


> Is n't there another word for "sparrow" in Hindi? "gauraiyaa".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> marrish said:
> 
> 
> 
> With its male counterpart, _gauraa_.
> 
> 
> BelligerentPacifist said:
> 
> 
> 
> Really? I just thought we see the gauraiyyah* chuRiyaa and the gauraiyyah chiDDaa through our windows. Thanks fo rthe info.
> 
> *writing as spoken
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

I forgot to add that it may be also called _gaurvaa_ (I thought directly of _mirachvaa_).


----------



## greatbear

marrish said:


> Is the emphasis on its length relevant?



For me, yes, because "chiRii" means clubs to me and "chiRi" didn't mean anything to me till now (maybe from now onwards, small birds). The suit of clubs in a game of playing cards and sparrows are two different things to me.


----------



## marrish

greatbear said:


> For me, yes, because "chiRii" means clubs to me and "chiRi" didn't mean anything to me till now (maybe from now onwards, small birds). The suit of clubs in a game of playing cards and sparrows are two different things to me.


''chiRi'' doesn't still mean anything to me. A sparrow or small bird is _chiRii_.


----------



## greatbear

marrish said:


> ''chiRi'' doesn't still mean anything to me. A sparrow or small bird is _chiRii_.



Ah, ok, I understand now. I was thinking of post 27 when I mentioned "chiRi" but it seems then that both "chiRi" and "chiRii" exist for sparrows?


----------



## marrish

greatbear said:


> Ah, ok, I understand now. I was thinking of post 27 when I mentioned "chiRi" but it seems then that both "chiRi" and "chiRii" exist for sparrows?



I can reply to your question only partially positively, that is only *chiRii* (well, not only, also other words) exists for a female sparrow. I mean *[chiRi]* - with a short sounding final *-i* doesn't exist, as to the best of my knowledge.


----------



## Machlii5

Sorry, I'm late, but I want to thank you each and everyone for contributing to this thread. It proved to be very interesting, and it has helped me very much.
Basically I had expected something on the lines of Spanish where you have the word “ave“ for large birds, and “pajaro“ (sparrow) for small birds in general. 
But it's much more complex in Hindi/Urdu!


----------



## tonyspeed

According to Platts,  chiRiyaa is  actually  a female  sparrow,  a hen-sparrow. 
The generic  term is  gauriyaa.  Do people still  use  gauriyaa in  your  experience? 

H گوريا गौरिया gauriyā, or गौरैया gauraiyā [gaurā, q.v.+S. इका], s.f. A sparrow (syn. gargaiyā).

I see this has been somewhat discussed above.


----------



## Wolverine9

Technically, chiRiyaa is a female sparrow and chiRaa is a male sparrow.  chiRiyaa is used generically for both, though.  As far as I know, gauriyaa is also a female sparrow and thus synonymous with chiRiyaa, but is not as common.  Likewise, a male sparrow would be gauraa.


----------



## Kasrav

this discussion has provided perhaps enough inputs to Machlii5, but if not given earlier there is also

vihang (sanskrit?) = bird


----------

