# 2 segols + penultimate stress + weather



## MarX

שלומ!

I noticed that some words which are related to the weather have two segols and are stressed on the penultimate syllable.
Is there something to that or is it just pure coincidence?

Some examples:

שֶמֶש
שֶלֶג
גֶשֶם
עֶרֶב

And they are all masculine.


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## Flaminius

Hello,

If a word consists of two segols then it always have a penultimate accent in Hebrew.

Segolate nouns are derived from either 1a23 or 1i23 pattern (where 1-3 mean the three consonants comprising a root).  When the second and the third consonants in a root became unpronounceable without a vowel that follow the pattern, a segol, or /e/, was inserted between the two consonants.  The vowel between the first and the second consonants was also changed to /e/.  Just like the original pattern, the stress remained on the first vowel, thus creating a penultimate accent unlike most of the Hebrew vocabulary.  [It is believed that in the prehistory of Hebrew, all nouns had case endings.  They were possibly _-u-_, _-a-_, _-i-_ directly connected to the third consonant.  Since that would split nouns of the two patterns into two syllables, *ragl (foot) —> *rag.lu, no supporting vowel needed to be inserted.]

I am not directly answering your question but I think I could at least push the enquiry a few steps back to the cause.  These nouns you have listed above have two segols and a penultimate accent because they belong to 1a23 and 1i23 patterns.   Looking other nouns derived from the patterns would determine whether they are coincidence or not.


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## MarX

Very informative post, Flaminius!
Thank you!

That they have something to do with weather/season/time is just a coincidence?


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## Nunty

Just one other little note: שמש is feminine.


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## Tamar

> Just one other little note: שמש is feminine


Actually, שמש is both feminine and masculine, but in spoken language we treat it as feminine.


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## MarX

Tamar said:


> Actually, שמש is both feminine and masculine, but in spoken language we treat it as feminine.


My dictionary also says that. But now I know that feminine is preferred in the spoken language. 

Toda!


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## Nunty

Tamar said:


> Actually, שמש is both feminine and masculine, but in spoken language we treat it as feminine.



You are right, of course, Tamar. I should have specified.


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## amikama

MarX said:


> That they have something to do with weather/season/time is just a coincidence?


Just a coincidence, I guess. I'd be surprise if it was _not_ a coincidence  


By the way, segol+segol is not the only _mishqal_ of penultimate-stressed words - there are also tsere+segol (סֵפֶר) and holam haser+segol (בֹּשֶׂם).


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## MarX

amikama said:


> By the way, segol+segol is not the only _mishqal_ of penultimate-stressed words - there are also tsere+segol (סֵפֶר) and holam haser+segol (בֹּשֶׂם).


Toda raba!!


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