# justos términos



## Mr Bones

Hello, everybody.

I'm looking for somenthing equivalent (or similar) to the Spanish expression "en sus justos términos".

The sentence is this:

_Me gustaría que esto se tomara *en sus justos términos*.

I'd like this to be taken in..._

I tried to find something but now I've drawn a blank.

Do you have any suggestion?

Thanks a million,
Bones


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## Vol Boy

I need a little context; there are several possiblities in English.  Following your example (to show what context would be helpful): "A Ud. le gustaría que [_qué_] se tomara en sus justos términos?"


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## DrMiguel01

Dear Mr Bones.

Here is a possibility, as I understand the sentence: "I'd like this to be taken for its true worth."

Have a great New Year!


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## Mr Bones

Thanks for your answers. 

In the sentence I asked about, the speaker is going to reveal a trait of his own carácter -the fact the he has a tendency to get depressed from time to time-, but he wouldn't like to be misunderstood. So, when he warns that he wants his words to be taken "en sus justos términos", he is asking for a fair assesment of his confession. He wouldn't like his interlocutor to think that the situation is more serious than it really is. "En sus justos términos" is somenthing we usually say in Spanish (at least in Spain). It means something like "to be well or rightly or even fairly understood"

Thanks, Mr Bones


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## onbalance

Basándome en tu explicación, dudo que haya una frase hecha que tenga ese mismo matiz. En tal caso, yo podría decir algo como "Don't overreact . . . " o "Don't jump to conclusions . . ." Podría ser que expressiones como "due consideration," "due regard," "for what it's worth," "fair consideration," etc. sean más fieles lingüísticamente, pero no me parece que tengan ese mismo matiz.

Espera más sugerencias.


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## Rubns

I agree with onbalance, even in Spanish I didn't know what meant until you specified.


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## Mr Bones

Yes, I think you're right, onbalance and Rubns. I think I'll settle for "I would like it to be understood correctly", which is the literal meaning and a safe choice.

Thank you very much,

Mr Bones


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## onbalance

Mr Bones said:


> Yes, I think you're right, onbalance and Rubns. I think I'll settle for "I would like it to be understood correctly", which is the literal meaning and a safe choice.
> 
> Thank you very much,
> 
> Mr Bones



¿En inglés o en español? Mejor maneras existen en inglés para expresar semejante idea, como por ejemplo "Don't rush to judgment, but . . ."


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## vertebrado

Una traduccion mas directa no qudaria bien en ingles:
"take it in its strict terms"
o algo parecido no existe en ingles?


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## onbalance

vertebrado said:


> Una traduccion mas directa no qudaria bien en ingles:
> "take it in its strict terms"
> o algo parecido no existe en ingles?



Hola. Se oye "In strict terms," pero esta frase no aplica aquí.


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## Mr Bones

onbalance said:


> ¿En inglés o en español? Mejor maneras existen en inglés para expresar semejante idea, como por ejemplo "Don't rush to judgment, but . . ."



I see your point onbalance, but the thing is that I'm doing a translation and this is within a longer sentence, so it has to fit into it. I has to be something along the lines of what I wrote more or less, although I might change the wording.

Thanks for your help...
Bones


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## vertebrado

onbalance said:


> Hola. Se oye "In strict terms," pero esta frase no *se* aplica aquí.


Why not, it sounds as an equivalent of en su justos terminos, because justo and strict have the same meaning here.
Should I open a new thread asking for the meaning of In strict terms?

PS. I correct your Spanish with the hope you will pay me back with my English.


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## onbalance

vertebrado said:


> Why not, it sounds as an equivalent of en su justos terminos, because justo and strict have the same meaning here.
> Should I open a new thread asking for the meaning of In strict terms?
> 
> PS. I correct your Spanish with the hope you will pay me back with my English.



Mr. Bones dijo que "He wouldn't like his interlocutor to think that the situation is more serious than it really is." "I'd like for you to take this in strict terms" no expresa esta misma idea.


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## vertebrado

What does _take something in strict terms_ mean then?

In Spanish it would mean understand something within the meaning of the words that have been uttered and not think anything beyond the meaning of those words. Which is what Mr. Bones said, stick to the words and not to make a big deal out of that.
 In English?


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## k-in-sc

"Properly gauged" comes to mind. It would help to have more context.
It would also help for vertebrado not to try to translate everything literally.


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## onbalance

vertebrado said:


> What does _take something in strict terms_ mean then?
> 
> In Spanish it would mean understand something within the meaning of the words that have been uttered and not think anything beyond the meaning of those words. Which is what Mr. Bones said, stick to the words and not to make a big deal out of that.
> In English?



Tienes razón a un cierto extento. "In strict terms, más o menos, quiere decir "en esas mismas palabras," o sea, "en este mismo sentido." Pero, a mi parecer, esta definición no corresponde a la explicación de arriba. Basándome en las explicaciones de Mr. Bones, me parece que si la persona con la cual el locutor está hablando toma en cuenta sólo el significado literal de lo que dice el locutor, esa otra persona puede llegar demasido rápido a una conclusión. Por el contrario, me parece que el locutor quiere que el oyente no se limita a sus palabras literales y que mantenga la mente abierta.


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## mijoch

In the context:-

"...........his words to be taken at face value"


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## vertebrado

onbalance said:


> Tienes razón a un cierto extento. "In strict terms, más o menos, quiere decir "en esas mismas palabras," o sea, "en este mismo sentido." Pero, a mi parecer, esta definición no corresponde a la explicación de arriba. Basándome en las explicaciones de Mr. Bones, me parece que si la persona con la cual el locutor está hablando toma en cuenta sólo el significado literal de lo que dice el locutor, esa otra persona puede llegar demasido rápido a una conclusión. Por el contrario, me parece que el locutor quiere que el oyente no se limit*e* a sus palabras literales y que mantenga la mente abierta.



I'm not so sure what Mr. Bones wanted, I see it 50%, only Mr. Bones can tell us if he wants the listener to stick to his words and not to have an open mind, or on the contrary takes his words and interpret them not making a big deal out of them.

I insist on this because this translation seems to be more natural to a native Spanish speaker.


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## k-in-sc

Vertebrado, I find myself working around your posts. I encourage you to ask yourself if you are contributing anything substantive before you post to a thread.


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## vertebrado

k-in-sc said:


> Vertebrado, I find myself working around your posts. I encourage you to ask yourself if you are contributing anything substantive before you post to a thread.


I think the only post which does not add any substantial value is that one you've just posted above and consequently the one I'm posting right now.


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## k-in-sc

So you are only trying to boost your post count?


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## vertebrado

k-in-sc said:


> So you are only trying to boost your post count?


Piensa el ladron que todos son de su condicion.


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## k-in-sc

vertebrado said:


> Piensa el ladron que todos son de su condicion.


(Ladrón ... condición)


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## vertebrado

k-in-sc said:


> (Ladrón ... condición)


You well may correct my English mistakes too, rascal.


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## Vol Boy

I would say something like: "I am going to tell you something, and *I want you to take it for exactly what it is [no more/no less]*."

Your proposed text is a nuanced thing to convey, but I think -- certainly once the speaker confesses his depression -- that this caveat would be perfectly understood.


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## k-in-sc

Vol Boy said:


> I would say something like: "I am going to tell you something, and *I want you to take it for exactly what it is [no more/no less]*."


That sounds good. I would punctuate it as "exactly what it is -- no more, no less."


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## Mr Bones

Thank you, Vol Boy. It's a good suggestion. I'll think about it carefully.

Mr Bones.


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## onbalance

mijoch said:


> In the context:-
> 
> "...........his words to be taken at face value"



Tal vez esto sea una buena traducción para en justos términos pero tiene más o menos el mismo significado de "in strict terms," lo que no corresponde a la explicación que Mr. Jones nos dio. Confieso que no entiendo bien la frase en español y me pregunto si tendré algo más que ofrecer a este hilo.


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## mijoch

Hi Vol Boy

That sounds like "words at face value".


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## Vol Boy

k-in-sc said:


> That sounds good. I would punctuate it as "exactly what it is -- no more, no less."



If "no more, no less" is used, I agree 100%.  I used brackets only to signal that part as optional; to my mind, it really just amplifies the first part of the sentence.

Sorry for the confusion.


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## Vol Boy

mijoch said:


> Hi Vol Boy
> 
> That sounds like "words at face value".



I agree, but I think my suggestion is stronger.  

Actually, now that I think about it, if I were about to confess depression to someone and I wanted to make the point Mr. Bones suggests, I would likely say both!

So, "I am about to tell you something, and *I want you to take it for what it's worth -- no more, no less.  I want you to take it at face value; don't read anything into it.*"


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## Mr Bones

Hello again.

The expression "en sus justos términos", at least in the way and in the context I used it, implies that you're asking the other person to make an effort because you're going to say something which is delicate or sensitive and might be misunderstood. In that sense, it's different from "at face value" because your words don't contain everything you want to express, so you're not asking to be understood in a completely literal way. The speaker feels that he's going to enter a dangerous área, so he asks his listeners to be fair and sensible in their judgement.

This is a longer except of the text I'm translating:

Un asunto distinto, y acaso de mayor importancia, es esa parte ligeramente depresiva que hay en mí.
También esto lo reconozco, aunque, igual que antes, me gustaría que se tomara
en sus justos términos. Me explico: yo tengo una tendencia a la tristeza, a la
melancolía o incluso al pesimismo que a veces puede jugarme malas pasadas. 

Thanks for your help,
Mr Bones


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## Vol Boy

Mr Bones said:


> Hello again.
> 
> The expression "en sus justos términos", at least in the way and in the context I used it, implies that you're asking the other person to make an effort because you're going to say something which is delicate or sensitive and might be misunderstood. In that sense, it's different from "at face value" because your words don't contain everything you want to express, so you're not asking to be understood in a completely literal way. The speaker feels that he's going to enter a dangerous área, so he asks his listeners to be fair and sensible in their judgement.
> 
> This is a longer except of the text I'm translating:
> 
> Un asunto distinto, y acaso de mayor importancia, es esa parte ligeramente depresiva que hay en mí.
> También esto lo reconozco, aunque, igual que antes, me gustaría que se tomara
> en sus justos términos. Me explico: yo tengo una tendencia a la tristeza, a la
> melancolía o incluso al pesimismo que a veces puede jugarme malas pasadas.
> 
> Thanks for your help,
> Mr Boens



I'm not sure why you think "take it at face value" implies no effort on the part of the listener.  Some things are easy to take at face value; other things are harder i.e., the listener must force him/herself not to jump to conclusions.  The same holds true with "take it for what it's worth."  In any event, certainly the addition of "don't read anything into it" eliminates any ambiguity.  

Maybe somebody has a better option, but I would suggest you look at my last post.  It seems to fit. 

And if it's too long, maybe reconsider my original suggestion: "*Take it for what it is -- no more, no less.*"


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## Mr Bones

I think "for what it's worth" is a good option too.

Thanks again.

Bones


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## Vol Boy

Mr Bones said:


> I think "for what it's worth" is a good option too.
> 
> Thanks again.
> 
> Bones



Sorry.  I just created another option!  *Take it for what it is* works, but is not what I meant to say.  I meant to type *..for what it's worth*.  (You can see how close in meaning many of these phrases are in my mind; maybe that tells you something!!  )


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## k-in-sc

Or "accept it for what it is."


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## onbalance

Mr Bones said:


> I think "for what it's worth" is a good option too.
> 
> Thanks again.
> 
> Bones



Ya te lo había recomendado. Si fuera tú, aclararía el contexto porque no estoy seguro de que estas sugerencias (take it for what it's worth, at face value, in strict terms) sean traducciones fieles.


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## Vol Boy

k-in-sc said:


> Or "accept it for what it is."



  Also good.  Or "*hear it for what it is*" -- depending on how well you know the person to whom you are "confessing."


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## Txiri

Mr Bones said:


> _Me gustaría que esto se tomara *en sus justos términos*.
> 
> I'd like this to be taken in..._



I'd like this to be taken _in the spirit in which it is offered.
_


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## vertebrado

onbalance said:


> Ya te lo había recomendado. Si fuera tú, aclararía el contexto porque no estoy seguro de que estas sugerencias (take it for what it's worth, at face value, in strict terms) sean traducciones fieles.



El problema que tiene Mr. Bones, supongo, es que la expresion en espanol tampoco es muy clara, ya que _los justos terminos_ pueden ser las palabras o en un sentido figurado la situacion del hablante. Si se tratase de lo primero la traduccion seria sin duda en la linea de_ in strict terms_, si se tratase de la segunda habria que traducirlo en la linea de _for what it is worth._


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## Vol Boy

onbalance said:


> Ya te lo había recomendado. Si fuera tú, aclararía el contexto porque no estoy seguro de que estas sugerencias (take it for what it's worth, at face value, in strict terms) sean traducciones fieles.



He posted more context, and I think all of these are fine.  The only adjustment I'd make after reading the passage would be:

Another issue, and maybe of more importance, it that lightly depressing part that remains in me.
I recognize it too, though, just like before *I'd like it to be taken (or understood) for exactly what it is.
*So let me explain: I have a tendency toward sadness, melancholy or even toward pessimism that at times
can get the beter of me.


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## Mr Bones

Vol Boy said:


> He posted more context, and I think all of these are fine.  The only adjustment I'd make after reading the passage would be:
> 
> Another issue, and maybe of more importance, it that lightly depressing part that remains in me.
> I recognize it too, though, just like before *I'd like it to be taken (or understood) for exactly what it is.
> *So let me explain: I have a tendency toward sadness, melancholy or even toward pessimism that at times
> can get the beter of me.



Thank you, again. VolBoy. Very useful help.

Bones


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## k-in-sc

"Esa parte ligeramente depresiva que hay en mí" is not "that lightly depressing part that remains in me" but "my tendency toward mild depression," "my slightly depressive side," etc.


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## Vol Boy

k-in-sc said:


> "Esa parte ligeramente depresiva que hay en mí" is not "that lightly depressing part that remains in me" but "my tendency toward mild depression," "my slightly depressive side," etc.



Yeah, the word I was looking for was "depressive."


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## k-in-sc

But it sounds awfully clinical. Constructions with "depressed" or "depression" would be more colloquial.


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## Vol Boy

k-in-sc said:


> But it sounds awfully clinical. Constructions with "depressed" or "depression" would be more colloquial.



Fair point. I think a more colloquial translation could be, "...*mild depression I feel inside*..." or "...*slightly** depressed feeling I have inside*..." 

 I double-checked "depresivo" in the DRAE, and one definition is the more general --> "adj. Que deprime el ánimo."  While it's really a nuance of what we're talking about, that definition could be a number of words describing something that brings one "down."

It's a nuance, but I think it gives rise to a few more possiblities e.g., "...*that slightly 'down' feeling I have inside*..." or "...*that slightly discouraged part of me*..." or "...*that slightly 'blue' feeling in me*..."


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