# mox osculis parieti datis...



## bookandlanguagelover

Hello,

My sentence is: Sed mox osculis parieti datis, valedicebant inviti."

I believe the translation is " But soon after giving kisses to the wall, they unwillingly said goodbye."

My question is, why is "osculis" in that form and not the typical accusative plural form of the 2nd declension neuter nouns, "oscula?"  Does it have to do with the form of "datis?"

I'd really appreciate the forum's help on this one.  I'm rusty but loving getting back into Latin!  Thanks!


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## brian

Hi b.a.l.l.,

This is called an ablative absolute. The relevant words are put into the ablative case and are translated roughly as "with such and such having been done" (passive since _datis_ is a perfect passive participle). So:

literally: _But with kisses soon having been given to the wall, they unwillingly said goodbye._

The ablative absolute can be used in place of various clauses, for example temporal clauses, which would thus give the smoother translation: _But soon after they gave kisses to the wall, ..._

Not sure what kisses to the wall are--sounds kind of strange--but maybe it's an idiom.

Also, it should be _invīt*ē*_ with an _e_, not _i._


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## bookandlanguagelover

Thanks so much!  That's what I ended up figuring out.  And osculis has to match with datis, right?  The closest thing in English being, "kisses given"  or "given kisses." ?


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## brian

Yep. (Formal) English has nominative absolutes that work just like ablative absolutes in Latin:

_The meeting (having been) canceled, we decided to go have a drink.
Having no energy whatsoever, I went right to sleep.
Things being as they are, we really can't spend that kind of money._

Ancient Greek had a genitive absolute that was the same thing.

So it's a very common construction across languages.


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## Cagey

Hi Brian,

I agree about the other two, but this doesn't look like an absolute construction to me:


> Having no energy whatsoever, I went right to sleep.


The participle phrase modifies the subject (I), methinks.


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## brian

Whoops, of course not! Thanks. 

I was testing to see if anyone would notice.


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## Stoicorum_simia

brian8733 said:


> Also, it should be _invīt*ē*_ with an _e_, not _i._


_Inviti_ is nominative plural: 'they, unwilling, said goodbye'.


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## brian

I would read that more as _The unwilling (people) said goodbye_. _Invīt*ē *_just sounds much better/more appropriate/more Latin here. But I suppose it could be either.


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## Stoicorum_simia

brian8733 said:


> I would read that more as _The unwilling (people) said goodbye_. _Invīt*ē *_just sounds much better/more appropriate/more Latin here. But I suppose it could be either.


 
_Inviti_ sounds good to me. The context must be Pyramus and Thisbe, don't you think?


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