# I am going to the liquor store to buy some vodka



## Thomas26

I am going to the liquor store to buy some vodka. 

Ja idę do monopolowego kupować trochę wódki.

Thanks

Dzięki


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## NotNow

The pronoun _ja_ isn't needed unless there is some confusion about who's going to the store.  The infinitive_ kupić_ should be used instead of _kupować_.  You probably shouldn't use the word _trochę,_ but wait for others to comment on that.

This is my version:

Idę do monopolowego żeby kupić wódkę.


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## Thomas26

The reason I used wódki is because of using the genitive after trochę. 

Thanks for the help, I didn't think to use żeby.


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## linguos

You will find that many people use "trochę" in their everyday speech, so it sounds perfectly natural, in fact I think I more often hear people say "Idę kupić trochę czegoś" rather than "idę kupić coś", at least when it comes to the everyday products.

Anyway, you can say it in many different ways:

_Idę (do monopolowego) kupić* trochę wódki._ - with "trochę" sounds rather colloquial, without it perfectly natural

_Idę do monopolowego, żeby kupić wódkę_ - normal

_Wybieram/Udaję się do sklepu monopolowego, ażeby zakupić 0,5 l wódki - _this sounds formal and pompous and thus can be used for humour 

_Idę po wódkę_ - the simplest option


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## majlo

My version: "Idę do monopolowego po wódkę". Plain and simple. Tells the story. I also think 'trochę' is redundant.


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## BezierCurve

My lifelong experience of buying vodka tells me that majlo's answer's the best.


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## linguos

To myself, "trochę" does seem redundant as well, however I believe that's the way most people say it.

Don't tell me you don't hear common people saying "Kupię trochę sera/mleka/wódki/etc."?

Besides, one could argue that "do monopolowego" is also redundant here. "Idę po wódkę" - it doesn't matter where the speaker goes, but what is the purpose of his errand. He might buy vodka at a supermarket as well.


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## Rusak963

linguos said:


> To myself, "trochę" does seem redundant as well, however I believe that's the way most people say it.
> 
> Don't tell me you don't hear common people saying "Kupię trochę sera/mleka/wódki/etc."?
> 
> Besides, one could argue that "do monopolowego" is also redundant here. "Idę po wódkę" - it doesn't matter where the speaker goes, but what is the purpose of his errand. He might buy vodka at a supermaket as well.



Chyba nigdy nie słyszałem, żeby ktoś powiedział: Idę do sklepu kupić trochę wódki. Zawsze się mówi po wódkę lub połówkę, ćwiartkę, ćwiarteczkę (chociaż teraz nie ma już ćwiartek dzięki naszej super UE) małpkę, pół litra, flaszkę, gorzałkę. Można też określić markę wódki i jej ilość, np. idź kup 0,7 Maximusa, etc.
Jeśli chodzi o ser czy produkty na wagę to tak, można powiedzieć, że idę kupić trochę czegoś. Co do mleka to się nie zgodzę. Nie mówi się idę kupić trochę mleka, tylko idę po mleko. Sytuacja jest podobna do tej z wódką.


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## linguos

Wiem, że "się nie mówi", ale ludzie i tak się w ten sposób wysławiają. A przynajmniej mój brat, ojciec, sąsiedzi i wiele innych osób, które znam i które często spożywają alkohol. Toteż nie zgodzę się z tym, że "*zawsze* się mówi po wódkę lub połówkę [...]", choć przyznaję, iż to brzmi zdecydowanie lepiej. 

Anyway the original question was: Is the sentence "Ja idę do monopolowego kupować trochę wódki." grammatically correct? The answer to that is, of course, "No, it isn't". Other examples given by NotNow, majlo, and me are some of the many options that Thomas26 could use.


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## Thomas26

linguos said:


> He might buy vodka at a supermaket as well.



Not where I live, only in a liquor store, thus the reason I put it in there. I wish it was in supermarkets also!


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## Thomas26

Thanks for the help everyone, I have a feeling I will be asking many more questions in the future.


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## ryba

Hi,





linguos said:


> _Idę (do monopolowego) kupić* trochę/ćwiartkę**/pół litra*** wódki._ - very colloquial, used by the uneducated people



Used by uneducated people?! What makes you say so?

_Idę kupić_ (_iść_ + infinitive) sounds much more natural than _Idę, żeby_. The only instance in which I'd opt for using _żeby _is when someone's asked me why I'm going to the the liquor store (dlaczego idę do monopolowego).


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## BezierCurve

> Besides, one could argue that "do monopolowego" is also redundant here


True, in some context it is redundant. But there _are _other places where you can get it as well, so, you might need to make that extra point.


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## linguos

ryba said:


> Hi,
> 
> Used by uneducated people?! What makes you say so?
> 
> _Idę kupić_ (_iść_ + infinitive) sounds much more natural than _Idę, żeby_. The only instance in which I'd opt for using _żeby _is when someone's asked me why I'm going to the the liquor store (dlaczego idę do monopolowego).


Oh, ryba, that's now what I meant... At first I wrote that this is a very popular option, but then I was reminded that using "trochę" here sounds bad, so I changed it. People from my family almost always say "Idę kupić _trochę_ wódki" (when they mean more than one bottle), but they in fact are _very uneducated_. Rusak pointed out that he was lucky to never stumble across anyone saying "trochę wódki", so I realised that it may be that I'm one of those unlucky guys who have to live with people who use very strange language. 

Anyone, the 'uneducated' part referred only to the intrusion of "trochę", not to the contruction _iść + infinitive_ per se.  I will edit my first post to make it more clear.


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## ryba

Aaah, now I see, it's about _trochę_. But don't worry, I think it's safe to say this _trochę_ doesn't have anything to do with the speaker's level of education. I'd see it as as normal as saying _Idę s_(_obi_)_e trochę pobiegać_ / _Idę się trochę przebiegnąć_. It seems to me that this kind of _trochę_ gives the sentence a sort of a euphemistic feel.


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## majlo

linguos said:


> Anyway the original question was: Is the sentence "Ja idę do monopolowego kupować trochę wódki." grammatically correct? The answer to that is, of course, "No, it isn't".


Well, as it stands alone, I believe, it's perfectly correct.


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## linguos

Why do you think that "kupować" is _perfectly correct_ when it comes to running a particular, single errand? I would really never say "Idę kupować masło", it sounds awful to me.


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## Ben Jamin

NotNow said:


> The pronoun _ja_ isn't needed unless there is some confusion about who's going to the store.  The infinitive_ kupić_ should be used instead of _kupować_.  You probably shouldn't use the word _trochę,_ but wait for others to comment on that.
> 
> This is my version:
> 
> Idę do monopolowego żeby kupić wódkę.



You're perfectly right! You really are fluent in Polish!


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## Ben Jamin

Rusak963 said:


> Chyba nigdy nie słyszałem, żeby ktoś powiedział: Idę do sklepu kupić trochę wódki. Zawsze się mówi po wódkę lub połówkę, ćwiartkę, ćwiarteczkę (chociaż teraz nie ma już ćwiartek dzięki naszej super UE) małpkę, pół litra, flaszkę, gorzałkę. Można też określić markę wódki i jej ilość, np. idź kup 0,7 Maximusa, etc.
> Jeśli chodzi o ser czy produkty na wagę to tak, można powiedzieć, że idę kupić trochę czegoś. Co do mleka to się nie zgodzę. Nie mówi się idę kupić trochę mleka, tylko idę po mleko. Sytuacja jest podobna do tej z wódką.



Simply "Idę [do monopolowego/sklepu/whatever] kupić wódki.
Words in brackets are usually omitted.
But yes, what regards the original question, the sentence is correct grammatically, but unidiomatic. 

If you say 'kupić wódkę" you want to say that you speak about a specific amount of bottles (or even of a specific brand in addition), it is something like 'I'm going to buy *the *vodka".


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## majlo

linguos said:


> Why do you think that "kupować" is _perfectly correct_ when it comes to running a particular, single errand? I would really never say "Idę kupować masło", it sounds awful to me.



I didn't say that 'kupować' is perfectly correct when it comes to running a particular, single errand. I only said that the sentence "Ja idę do monopolowego kupować trochę wódki" is grammatically correct.

By the way, if I heard someone say "Idę (do monopolowego/sklepu etc.) kupić *trochę* wódki, I would have the impression that they're going to some sleazy joint where they measure out units of vodka with a ladle and sell it in used pickle jars. 



BenJamin said:


> If you say 'kupić wódkę" you want to say that you speak about a specific amount of bottles



I couldn't disagree more. Saying 'kupić wódkę' has no implications of quantity whatsoever as far as I'm concerned.


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## BezierCurve

Well, the most popular version is probably the one with "flaszkę" (or "dwie, trzy... N flaszek").


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## linguos

As far as I know, Thomas26 was looking for a suitable translation of "I am going to the liquor store to buy some vodka". 

I wouldn't say that "Ja idę do monopolowego kupować trochę wódki" is a grammatically correct translation of the English original as we are evidently referring to a single errand, so the imperfective "kupować" doesn't fit here. There may be nothing wrong with it per se, but what its grammar suggest is different from what we would expect from the context.  Unless, he's going to meet a nice lady at the liquor store and so the whole process of buying vodka will take him much more time than usual. 

Apart from that I agree with the other natives.


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## ryba

majlo said:


> If you say 'kupić wódkę" you want to say that you speak about a specific amount of bottles (or even of a specific brand in addition), it is something like 'I'm going to buy *the *vodka".
> 
> 
> 
> I couldn't disagree more. Saying 'kupić wódkę' has no implications of quantity whatsoever as far as I'm concerned.
Click to expand...


Oh, come on. As far as I am concerned, it has, or it is likely to have. Just as Ben Jamin said, the use of the Accusative _wódkę_ (as opposed to the Genitive _wódki_) implies the speaker has a pre-formed idea on what they're going to buy, exactly as they do in the case of the translation _I'm going to buy *the *vodka_.





majlo said:


> By the way, if I heard someone say "Idę (do monopolowego/sklepu etc.) kupić *trochę*  wódki, I would have the impression that they're going to some sleazy  joint where they measure out units of vodka with a ladle and sell it in  used pickle jars.


Hahah, either that or that they are very used to going to the liquor  store with the intention of buying vodka, and they're just going there  to get *some* (some more). That being said, I keep on thinking that both interpretations may be far-fetched and there may be nothing to it; the person might just mean they want to get some vodka for the party, for instance.


When it comes to you guys discussing whether or not the sentence is grammatically correct, I think the reason you can't reach an agreement is that the concept of grammar is very vague, and, while majlo's discussing it's syntactically correct, linguos stresses the fact that the pragmatic selection's just not right.


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## majlo

I can't see how "Idę kupić wódkę" has any implications in quantity, and I believe it indeed doesn't. On hearing that, one can't tell whether one (though it's the most plausible option), two, three or more bottles of vodka are going to be purchased.

Your comment about the grammar being vague is spot-on. However, I just want to stress that I was referring to the sentence without context.


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## ryba

majlo said:


> On hearing that, one can't tell whether one (though it's the most plausible option), two, three or more bottles of vodka are going to be purchased.


Yeah, yeah, sure, that's what I meant. The hearer doesn't have to know what the speaker has in mind. Even the speaker may have only a remote idea of what they're going to buy. But the idea is there, as opposed to _Idę kupić wódki_, where it does not manifest. That's how I see it. Why would the speaker use the nominative case, otherwise?


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## Thomas1

_Idę po wódkę.
Idę kupić wódkę._
The most common and the simplest.


ryba said:


> Yeah, yeah, sure, that's what I meant. The hearer doesn't have to know what the speaker has in mind. Even the speaker may have only a remote idea of what they're going to buy. But the idea is there, as opposed to _Idę kupić wódki_, where it does not manifest. That's how I see it. Why would the speaker use the nominative accusative case, otherwise?


I generally agree with this understanding. 
It's just now occured to me, however, that this remote idea of quantity is sometimes present in the speaker's mind in the case of 'kupić wódki' too (I realise this may run against the logic of how the grammar comprehends it, but this is how it's used to my experience--I've come across it used like that).


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## majuk

Hi, I'm joining your dissussion about vodka 

As far as I know, the case of the verb is not determined by what speaker has in mind, but by the verb he/she is using. So "kupić" requires accusative (which is for unanimated nouns equal to nominative) and not the genetive. We could in informal language use genetive after "kupić" but than (in my opinion) we have in mind (even if it's not told) the word "trochę", which reqires the use of genetive. Just try to use the verb "kupić" with other nouns, which are not counted by "trochę" but by exact number, for exemple "książka", "dom", "buty" 

Sorry for my English, I'm not used to disscuss Polish grammar in English


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## Ben Jamin

majuk said:


> So "kupić" requires accusative


 
No, not in general. Only for countable substantives: kupić samochód, buty, psa, dom. For uncountable substantives you can use both accusative and genitive:
kupić chleb/chleba, wodę/wody, cukier/cukru.
The genitive used is here is called "genitivus partitivus" (partial genitive), when you buy an partial amount of something (not all). 
Corresponding constructions exist in other languages: French (acheter de l'eau), Italian (comprare dell'acqua), and many others. The classifier "trochę" can be used, but is not required in Polish (in English it is obligatory).
That's why I wrote in one of my earlier posts in this thread that using the accusative is more definite than using genitive.


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