# Happy Christmas and a Merry New Year



## Rodal

This may sound like a silly question but I wonder if can we use the word happy and marry interchangeably and say Happy Christmas and a Merry New Year?
I'd like to know if there is a rule that prevents us from interchanging these two words, and if not, then why does it always have to be "Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year"?

Thank you in advance.


----------



## Cenzontle

It's not a rule; it's a tradition.
For one thing, "merry" is an archaic adjective that is hardly ever used with any noun other than "Christmas".


----------



## Rodal

Cenzontle said:


> It's not a rule; it's a tradition.



Traditions have been broken before, my question is if it would be wrong to deviate from the "tradition".


----------



## Cenzontle

"Wrong"?  No.  It would just sound odd.


----------



## Rodal

Thank you!, I will start using the unconventional form from now on.


----------



## fenixpollo

Rodal said:


> I wonder if can we use the word happy and m*e*rry interchangeably


Can we? Yes. Do we? No. I would assume that you are trying to be cute, and I would get the impression that you think you are witty and clever.


----------



## gengo

fenixpollo said:


> I would assume that you are trying to be cute, and I would get the impression that you think you are witty and clever.



Same here.

Rodal, if you just want to make people smile (or scratch their heads), go ahead and use the reverse order.  You could also say things such as "white and black," "merry birthday," and "down and up."  Languages have conventions, and when you break those, you either sound very clever (like Shakespeare) or just annoying.  Most of us aren't Shakespeare.


----------



## Rodal

I just want to be able to say the same thing in a different way and not be stuck in conventions, traditions. Etc.  As long as the message is conveyed correctly, which it is, then I don't see a problem in doing it. Thank you all for your answers.


----------



## Cenzontle

So, Rodal, are you going around greeting people with "¡Pascuas alegres!" and "¡Nuevo año próspero!"?


----------



## User With No Name

Cenzontle said:


> So, Rodal, are you going around greeting people with "¡Pascuas alegres!" and "¡Nuevo año próspero!"?


----------



## Rodal

Cenzontle said:


> So, Rodal, are you going around greeting people with "¡Pascuas alegres!" and "¡Nuevo año próspero!"?



I don't see why not, it does not sound bad in Spanish at all, in fact you can play with words in Spanish and it does not break any conventions or traditions as it does in English. Podéis decir feliz navidad, como también podéis decir alegres pascuas. Words are there to be used at your disposal, and how far you want to go with them is only up to the imagination of the writer. Why isn't this so in English? ~ I suppose English is way more conventional and structured than Spanish, but with your permission now I can start breaking this norm. So from now on may we all have a Happy Christmas and a Merry New Year!


----------



## gengo

Rodal said:


> So from now on may we all have a Happy Christmas and a Merry New Year!



In the UK, "Happy Christmas" is the standard greeting.  So in the US, you will sound British.


----------



## User With No Name

gengo said:


> In the UK, "Happy Christmas" is the standard greeting. So in the US, you will sound British.


I think that even in the US., "Happy Christmas"  would be fairly tolerable (by analogy with "Happy Holidays," for one thing.)

But "Merry New Year"? No, just no. For one thing, I don't think anybody actually uses the word "merry" outside the very specific context of "Merry Christmas."


----------



## Alundra

Rodal said:


> I don't see why not, it does not sound bad in Spanish at all, in fact you can play with words in Spanish and it does not break any conventions or traditions as it does in English. Podéis decir feliz navidad, como también podéis decir alegres pascuas. Words are there to be used at your disposal, and how far you want to go with them is only up to the imagination of the writer. Why isn't this so in English? ~ I suppose English is way more conventional and structured than Spanish, but with your permission now I can start breaking this norm. So from now on may we all have a Happy Christmas and a Merry New Year!



Pues yo no lo veo así. En España también se vería extraño que no digas las palabras "como siempre". Al igual que en inglés, no estará mal dicho, pero suena raro.
A mí, al menos, no me sonaría normal que digas: ¿Alegres Pascuas?  donde has oído eso??) y Feliz Navidad, vamos, no lo he oído en mi vida, en España, lo que todo el mundo dice es: Feliz Navidad (o Felices Pascuas) y Próspero Año Nuevo, y en ese orden, siempre, desde que soy muy pequeña.  Y todo lo que se sale de ahí, para mí no es lo típico.

Nunca he oído a nadie decir "Próspera Navidad"... Feliz Año Nuevo sí, cuando va solo, sin el "Feliz Navidad" delante.
¿Que no está mal dicho? Vale, ¿Que te apetece cambiar el orden? Vale, ¿Que estás harto de convencionalismos? Vale, cada uno puede felicitar en estas fechas como le apetezca... pero en España no puedes cambiar el orden de esa frase y decir que no rompes convencionalismos, o al menos yo no lo veo así.

Saludos.


----------



## Bevj

I think there is a logical reason for this standard greeting and I agree with everyone else that changing it is rather silly and sounds just wrong.
Being _merry_ is a temporary state of mind, which doesn't last very long.  Happiness, on the other hand, can endure for a long time.  It is quite possible to be happy for an entire year, but not so to be merry for more than a short while.  Therefore the logical conclusión is to wish someone a _happy_ new year and to hope that they feel _merry_ during the Christmas celebration.


----------



## Nomenclature

_*Respetado*_ señor @Rodal:

_*Excelentes*_ días, espero que se encuentre bien. Junto con saludar quería decirle que tengo una opinión sobre este asunto. Usted piensa que usar una u otra palabra—siempre que sean sinónimos—*proporciona *lo mismo*. *Voy a pensar esto y le comunicaré mi decisión a la *concisión*.

Saludos *cálidos*,
Nomenclature

El español es igual. "Merry new year" suena mal.

Also the elephant in the room is that with the slightest tinge of a non-native foreign accent people are just going to assume deviation from a set phrase is a language learner's mistake (unless it's a pun with a clear purpose; in which case I endorse it wholeheartedly). When I mistakenly said "en medio camino" instead of "a medio camino" a few days ago the person who I was with corrected it thankfully and knew it wasn't because I'm an avant-guard poet but rather because Spanish is not my first language.


----------



## User With No Name

Nomenclature said:


> ... the elephant in the room is that with the slightest tinge of a non-native foreign accent people are just going to assume deviation from a set phrase is a language learner's mistake


An excellent point, and one I had not thought of.

And just let me take the liberty of summarizing, in less technical language, what appears to be the consensus in this thread: If you go around saying "Merry New Year," you will sound like a dork and people will laugh at you.


----------



## Rodal

User With No Name said:


> An excellent point, and one I had not thought of.
> 
> And just let me take the liberty of summarizing, in less technical language, what appears to be the consensus in this thread: If you go around saying "Merry New Year," you will sound like a dork and people will laugh at you.



Can you think of an alternate way that would not sound like a dork?



Bevj said:


> I think there is a logical reason for this standard greeting and I agree with everyone else that changing it is rather silly and sounds just wrong.
> Being _merry_ is a temporary state of mind, which doesn't last very long.  Happiness, on the other hand, can endure for a long time.  It is quite possible to be happy for an entire year, but not so to be merry for more than a short while.  Therefore the logical conclu*sion* is to wish someone a _happy_ new year and to hope that they feel _merry_ during the Christmas celebration.



thank you Bevj, this is probably the best answer of all, that explains why merry cannot be used in Happy New year as it represents a short state of mind. Happy Christmas on the other hand doesn't sound too bad. Now if we think of Happy New Year as a short state of mind during the New Year celebration and not throughout the whole year then we could say merry, joyful, jubilant New Year, it's not completely wrong. If you come to think about it, no one can be expected to spend a whole year in a happy state of mind, therefore even the word happy is also short lived. When I say happy New year I mean the moment in time we are living now, not the entire year and I'm sure others will agree with that. Good point though.



Alundra said:


> Nunca he oído a nadie decir "Próspera Navidad"... Feliz Año Nuevo sí, cuando va solo, sin el "Feliz Navidad" delante..



Tampoco yo, no estoy buscándole sinónimo a la palabra próspero sino a merry. 
Próspero Año nuevo means Prosperous New Year and that is not what I'm trying to say.
I'm trying to find an alternate way to saying happy new year, if not merry then what would you suggest?
In Spanish, Felices Pascuas, Feliz Navidad, Feliz año nuevo, they all use the same word "feliz" to indicate happy but why not _alegre_ or _dichosa_?



Alundra said:


> pero en España no puedes cambiar el orden de esa frase y decir que no rompes convencionalismos, o al menos yo no lo veo así.
> Saludos.


 Well that's the point, I'm trying to break the norm without sounding silly. 

Perhaps, a Happy Christmas and a Jubilant New Year.


----------



## Marsianitoh

I guess you could say something like " Merry Christmas, may your coming year be filled with joy/ may the year ahead be filled with joy". However,  I would stick to the traditional " Happy New Year!'


----------



## Bevj

Personally, I often say 'all the best for the coming year', or if you want to emphasize the idea of happiness, then 'Wishing you happiness/joy for the year to come/coming year.'
I don't think that there is a short alternative to 'Happy New Year'.


----------



## Rodal

Bevj said:


> Personally, I often say 'all the best for the coming year', or if you want to emphasize the idea of happiness, then 'Wishing you happiness/joy for the year to come/coming year.'
> I don't think that there is a short alternative to 'Happy New Year'.



I like that, all the best for the coming year


----------



## dalv

Hi Rodal, I also like the traditional greeting but I don't mind if you want to say something different.  That said how about "Have a Festive Christmas"


----------



## Rodal

dalv said:


> Hi Rodal, I also like the traditional greeting but I don't mind if you want to say something different.  That said how about "Have a Festive Christmas"



Have a Festive Christmas and all the best for the coming New Year!   

I like it!


----------



## duvija

Simple 'collocations'. Stuff that we say in a certain way or order, regardless of meaning, or our feelings, or whatever you may think of.
As an example: "It's not different in any way, shape or form". If you think about this, shape and form mean the same, but we still use that fixed sentence.


----------



## elroy

There are many words you can use in the formula 

“Have a _____ New Year!” 

Off the top of my head:

_*wonderful
great
splendid
marvelous
fabulous
fantastic
terrific
joyful
magnificent 
glorious *_

Just two things:
1. You have to say “Have a.”
2. Do *not* say “merry.”


----------



## Rodal

Thank you all those who responded, now I have many options to choose from (without sounding funny).

I wish you all a Joyful Christmas and Fabulous New Year!  (I'm not saying merry ).


----------



## gengo

Rodal said:


> I wish you all a Joyful Christmas and Fabulous New Year!  (I'm not saying merry ).



The same to you, Rodal.


----------



## elroy

You too!  Also, you missed an article: 





Rodal said:


> I wish you all a Joyful Christmas and *a* Fabulous New Year!


----------



## gengo

elroy said:


> Also, you missed an article:



While I prefer your suggestion, I think Rodal's version is OK, because the first article covers both noun phrases.  That is:

_I wish you all a {Joyful Christmas and Fabulous New Year}!_

However, there is no need to capitalize the adjectives (or new year, since in this case it isn't a proper noun).


----------



## elroy

gengo said:


> I think Rodal's version is OK


 Interesting.  To me it doesn’t sound right without the second “a.”


----------



## fenixpollo

elroy said:


> Interesting.  To me it doesn’t sound right without the second “a.”


Both versions are correct. It's just a matter of style.


----------



## elroy

Again, it doesn’t sound right to me without the second “a,” and I’m sure I’m not the only one.  This is important for Rodal to know.  If something doesn’t sound right to a native speaker, then in my book it’s not just a matter of style.


----------



## dalv

Rodal said:


> Thank you all those who responded, now I have many options to choose from (without sounding funny).
> 
> I wish you all a Joyful Christmas and Fabulous New Year!  (I'm not saying merry ).


Best wishes for you as well Rodal, and Merry Christmas to all of you!


----------



## Alundra

Rodal said:


> I wish you all a Joyful Christmas and Fabulous New Year!  (I'm not saying merry ).



Igualmente, espero que pases unas felices fiestas en compañía de tus seres queridos y tengas un muy buen comienzo de año.
Saludos.


----------



## Rodal

dalv said:


> Best wishes for you as well Rodal, and Merry Christmas to all of you!


Thank you Dalv, best wishes to you too!



Alundra said:


> Igualmente, espero que pases unas felices fiestas en compañía de tus seres queridos y tengas un muy buen comienzo de año.
> Saludos.


Gracias Alundra, que así sea y que el nuevo año venga colmado de buena fortuna para todos. íUn abrazo!



gengo said:


> The same to you, Rodal.


Thank you Gengo!


----------



## taraa

Happy New Year!!!


Cenzontle said:


> It's not a rule; it's a tradition.
> For one thing, "merry" is an archaic adjective that is hardly ever used with any noun other than "Christmas".


In the movie Inception, they "a merry chase". You said it's archaic why they use it in a 2010 movie, please?
COBB Fischer’s subconscious is going to run you down hard.
ARTHUR: I’ll lead them on a* merry chase*.


----------



## elroy

Cenzontle said “hardly ever,” not “never.”


----------



## taraa

gengo said:


> In the UK, "Happy Christmas" is the standard greeting.  So in the US, you will sound British.


Happy New Year. 
Can you please explain the difference between "happy" and "merry"?



elroy said:


> Cenzontle said “hardly ever,” not “never.”



In my example is "merry" like "good", please?


----------



## gengo

taraa said:


> In the movie Inception, they *use* "a merry chase". You said it's archaic*.  W*hy *did* they use it in a 2010 movie, please?
> COBB Fischer’s subconscious is going to run you down hard.
> ARTHUR: I’ll lead them on a merry chase.



Because sometimes we like to use archaic forms, just for fun.


----------



## gato radioso

Todas las lenguas son básicamente una convención, no sólo un sistema racional.


----------



## taraa

gengo said:


> Because sometimes we like to use archaic forms, just for fun.


Thank you.


----------

