# Contradict



## LukePT

Greetings

How could I translate the phrase «linguists contradict themselves in this regard».

The word contradict is proving difficult to translate.

Many thanx


----------



## Christos1

contradict
αντικρούω
έρχομαι σε αντίθεση με


----------



## velisarius

Do you mean that linguists contradict what they have said on previous occasions, or that they do not agree with one another? A complete sentence would be useful.


----------



## LukePT

Linguists hold different views from one another, they disagree in certain questions.


----------



## velisarius

Maybe <<Οι γλωσσολόγοι έχουν αντικρουόμενες απόψεις επάνω σε αυτό το ζήτημα.>> A native speaker will be able to improve that.

I don't know which meaning you have in mind for "linguists" though - experts in linguistics, or people skilled in language-learning?


----------



## ireney

You could go with "οι απόψεις διίστανται" or a simple "οι γλωσσολόγοι διαφωνούν" and many other options. A specific example however would really, truly help. You can make it for a made up issue. Say "when it comes to the pronunciation of alpha, linguists contradict themselves". Is that what you have in mind?


----------



## LukePT

velisarius said:


> I don't know which meaning you have in mind for "linguists" though -  experts in linguistics, or people skilled in language-learning?



I mean experts in linguistics (and, why not, opinion makers) such as Mr Babiniotis for instance, who have a say in how a language is writen but are often at odds with each other.



ireney said:


> You could go with "οι απόψεις διίστανται" or a simple "οι γλωσσολόγοι διαφωνούν" and many other options. A specific example however would really, truly help. You can make it for a made up issue. Say "when it comes to the pronunciation of alpha, linguists contradict themselves". Is that what you have in mind?



Thats exactly what I meant, Ireney. 
Οι απόψεις των γλωσσολόγων διίστανται / οι γλωσσολόγοι διαφωνούν γύρω από αυτό το θέμα seems good to me. I reckon when one thinks along the lines of its own language, he finds it odd not to find a complete match.

Thx guys!


----------



## velisarius

I think "διαφωνούν"  is a perhaps a little mild for "contradict", which suggests opposite, conflicting opinions rather than simple disagreement.


----------



## Nikolaos_Kandidatos

ireney said:


> You could go with "οι απόψεις διίστανται" or a simple "οι γλωσσολόγοι διαφωνούν" and many other options. A specific example however would really, truly help. You can make it for a made up issue. Say "when it comes to the pronunciation of alpha, linguists contradict themselves". Is that what you have in mind?



I might be wrong but to me there is a difference to "contradict themselves" and "disagree". In the second case the linguists are presented as actively engaging in dialogue between themselves and disagreeing with one another's opinions, while "contradict themselves" sounds like they might or might not be even aware of each other's statements and simply issue statements which are at odds between themselves, without there necessarily being any dialogue or commenting one another's opinions. 

How about "οι γλωσσολόγοι αντιφάσκουν (μεταξύ τους) για/ως προς..." or "οι γλωσσολόγοι έχουν αντιφατικές απόψεις για..." ?


----------



## Perseas

Nikolaos_Kandidatos said:


> How about "οι γλωσσολόγοι αντιφάσκουν (μεταξύ τους) για/ως προς..." or "οι γλωσσολόγοι έχουν αντιφατικές απόψεις για..." ?



Speaking of the sentence below (which I think is the case) «αντιφάσκω» doesn't fit. This verb means "contradict oneself".


LukePT said:


> Linguists hold different views from one another, they disagree in certain questions.



Speaking of the sentence below, in its ambiguity it could fit. 


LukePT said:


> «linguists contradict themselves in this regard».


----------



## Nikolaos_Kandidatos

Perseas said:


> Speaking of the sentence below (which I think is the case) «αντιφάσκω» doesn't fit. This verb means "contradict oneself".



Thanks!  I wasn't sure it was correct and googled the phrase "αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους" and got some results like (from the first page) 

Δύο αλήθειες ποτέ δεν μπορούν να _αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους_»
ΠΑΣΟΚ: Φαιδρές εξηγήσεις που αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους
Η ύπαρξη όμως την ίδια στιγμή μέσα στο ίδιο κόμμα πολιτικών που _αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους_,
Εάν τα συγκεκριμένα έγγραφα _αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους
_
Is this an erroneous usage of the word?


----------



## Perseas

Nikolaos_Kandidatos said:


> a. Δύο αλήθειες ποτέ δεν μπορούν να _αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους_»
> b. ΠΑΣΟΚ: Φαιδρές εξηγήσεις που αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους
> c. Η ύπαρξη όμως την ίδια στιγμή μέσα στο ίδιο κόμμα πολιτικών που _αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους_,
> d. Εάν τα συγκεκριμένα έγγραφα _αντιφάσκουν μεταξύ τους
> _
> Is this an erroneous usage of the word?


No, I don't think so.
We use this verb to denote that two or more opinions logically contradict themselves, while there should be logically consistent.

a. Two views based on truth shouldn't be contradicting.
b. & c. In a political party, no matter what its members represent, there should be a common language at basic subjects.
d. I think that these documents (έγγραφα) of Yahoo refer to the same subject, and so they shouldn't contradict themselves.


----------



## Nikolaos_Kandidatos

Perseas said:


> No, I don't think so.
> We use this verb to denote that two or more opinions logically contradict themselves, while there should be logically consistent.
> 
> a. Two views based on truth shouldn't be contradicting.
> b. & c. In a political party, no matter what its members represent, there should be a common language at basic subjects.
> d. I think that these documents (έγγραφα) of Yahoo refer to the same subject, and so they shouldn't contradict themselves.



Whereas linguists in general aren't comparable to e.g. a political party and don't form a group that could a priori be expected to agree on everything? Ok, thanks for the explanation!


----------



## Perseas

Nikolaos_Kandidatos said:


> Whereas linguists in general aren't comparable to e.g. a political party and don't form a group that could a priori be expected to agree on everything?



In «διαφωνώ» is underlined the difference, the opposition among views, whereas in «αντιφάσκω» the logical inconsistency.

Something else: when we use the verb «αντιφάσκω», we usually raise a matter of reliability, credibility.


----------



## cougr

Bit late to the party but the first things that came to mind when reading the oq were:

υπάρχει αντίφαση μεταξύ των γλωσσολόγων ως προς (το θέμα) αυτό
υπάρχει αντίφαση μεταξύ των απόψεων των γλωσσολόγων.......
οι γλωσσολόγοι έχουν αντιφάσκουσες απόψεις........

Any comments welcome.


----------



## Αγγελος

cougr said:


> Bit late to the party but the first things that came to mind when reading the oq were:
> 
> υπάρχει αντίφαση μεταξύ των γλωσσολόγων ως προς (το θέμα) αυτό
> υπάρχει αντίφαση μεταξύ των απόψεων των γλωσσολόγων.......
> οι γλωσσολόγοι έχουν αντιφάσκουσες απόψεις........
> 
> Any comments welcome.



I wouldn't express it that way. Αντίφαση/αντιφάσκω/αντιφατικός seem to me to imply logical inconsistency where consistency would be expected.  Here, the intended meaning is manifestly that the matter has not been settled (yet), so that the existence of mutually contradictory opinions among specialists is perfectly normal. I would much prefer αντικρουόμενες or διιστάμενες απόψεις.


----------

