# Slovak: assault



## monalisa!

An "indecent assault" is "_trying to kiss or touching _a woman you don't know (or who is not willing)" or _"to cop a feel"_
I usually find it transalted by _"sexuálny útok_", but it sounds too harsh to me, or even by"_pokus o zn_á_silnenie_" is not that too much?

Likewise, "pinch a bottom" is translated with "štipnúť" which is idiomatic in English.
How do you say in Slovak if someone touches a girl's bottom on a crowded bus?

Also, do you happen to know what is the Slovak for "assault and battery"? Webslovnik has:*

úmyselný násilný útok so vztiahnutím ruky*

what does that mean?
battery can be a punch or a kick, do you know the right therm? usually it is translated by "ublíženie na tele", but that is "bodily harm", something more serious.
Is  a "modrina" = ublížnie na tele ?


----------



## Azori

monalisa! said:


> An "indecent assault" is "_trying to kiss or touching _a woman you don't know (or who is not willing)" or _"to cop a feel"_
> I usually find it transalted by _"sexuálny útok_", but it sounds too harsh to me, or even by"_pokus o zn_á_silnenie_" is not that too much?


I've found the following:

indecent assault = sexuálne obťažovanie, neslušný útok, pokus o sexuálne zneužitie

I think you could use "sexuálne obťažovanie" for the kind of behavior you describe. I'm not sure about the other two - "neslušný útok" - I don't think I've ever heard it, "pokus o sexuálne zneužitie" seems to be synonymous with "pokus o znásilnenie" = attempted rape.





> Likewise, "pinch a bottom" is translated with "štipnúť" which is idiomatic in English.
> How do you say in Slovak if someone touches a girl's bottom on a crowded bus?


chytiť za zadok. Maybe.





> Also, do you happen to know what is the Slovak for "assault and battery"? Webslovnik has:*
> 
> úmyselný násilný útok so vztiahnutím ruky*
> 
> what does that mean?


Never heard of it. For "assault and battery" I've found "napadnutie a ublíženie na zdraví".





> Is  a "modrina" = ublíž*e*nie na tele ?


modrina = bruise, black-and-blue mark
ublíženie na tele = bodily harm
ľahké ublíženie na zdraví / tele = actual bodily harm
ťažké ublíženie na zdraví / tele = grievous bodily harm


----------



## morior_invictus

monalisa! said:


> An "*indecent assault*" is "_trying to kiss or touching _a woman you don't know (or who is not willing)" or _"to cop a feel"_
> _"OFFENSE DEFINED.-- A person is guilty of indecent assault if the person has indecent contact with the complainant,   causes the complainant to have indecent contact with the person or intentionally causes the complainant to come into contact   with seminal fluid, urine or feces for the purpose of arousing sexual desire in the person or the complainant etc."_ (_definitions vary from state to state but yours doesn`t work in any of them_)
> Source: Pennsylvania18 Pa.C.S. § 3126
> 
> The best translation of it would be "*sexuálne násilie*" (§ 200 Zákona č. 300/2005 Z.z.Trestný zákon). But as I can see, this is not what you are looking for.
> 
> How do you say in Slovak if someone touches a girl's bottom on a crowded bus?


On this, I will answer with :


Azori said:


> chytiť za zadok.


...or "_obchytkávať niekoho zadok._"
...or a part of a sexual deviation called "frotérstvo."


monalisa! said:


> Also, do you happen to know what is the Slovak for "assault and battery"?
> usually it is translated by "ublíženie na tele *zdraví*" we don`t say "ublíženie na tele."


*Assault (attempted battery) = *"pokus o ublíženie na zdraví / vyhrážanie sa ublížením na zdraví"
*Battery = *"ublíženie na zdraví" (§ 155 Trestného zákona)
In the end, I would like to answer your question (finally ), so here it is - a perfect answer that best suits your problem:


Azori said:


> I think you could use "*sexuálne obťažovanie*" for the kind of behavior you describe.


----------



## monalisa!

Thanks, Azori, Morior.

according to Wiki, in 2003 the word "indecent" has been replaced by "sexual" and the term includes a whole range of behaviours, the worst being an _attempted _rape.

The problem is to ascertain what happens in Slovakia, can one (if caught on a bus) be charged of  "*sexuálne obťažovanie" ? *I suppose not.*As to "battery" I found *_*180 000 hits for:   
*_*Za ublíženie na tele 
dostal pokutu 1500 eur. Voči obvineniu sa odvolal a súd sa prípadom bude zaoberať 6. novembra. Autor: Pluska.sk ...

and 380 000 for

*


> *Ujmou na zdraví* sa pritom rozumie
> 
> ublíženie na zdraví,
> ťažká ujma na zdraví,( smrť),
> znásilnenie,
> sexuálne násilie a
> sexuálne zneužívanie    spôsobené trestným činom spáchaným inou osobou.



This  latter from gov.sk

 I thought that "na tele" is less serious than "na zdravi", as in the first quote the racer had punched another man.
You seem to agree that "na tele" is not used, is it old fashioned? is it synonymous?
As to the 5 offences listed, I thought  to match them as follows: (assault and *battery* has been replaced by: assault occasioning on_ (grievous) bodily harm)
_
ABH; actual bodily harm
GBH: grievous bodily harm = malicious wounding, (death)
rape
(pokus o znasinlenie) sexual assault = attempted rape
 sexual assault, ???????? = sexual abuse = ??? 

but I cannot spot the difference between :sexuálne* násilie* a sexuálne *zneužívanie
*have you any idea?, and what is the meaning of : * útok so vztiahnutím ruky ?
*


----------



## morior_invictus

monalisa! said:


> according to Wiki, in 2003 the word "indecent" has been replaced by  "sexual" and the term includes a whole range of behaviours, the worst  being an _attempted _rape.
> *Sexual assault can be called rape, child sexual abuse, incest etc., i.e. all of them are sexual assaults.*
> The problem is to ascertain what happens in Slovakia, can one (if caught on a bus) be charged of  "*sexuálne obťažovanie" ? *I suppose not.*
> I suppose so. Sexuálne obťažovanie (sexual harassment) (nevítaná sexuálna pozornosť)*  je verbálne, neverbálne alebo fyzické správanie sexuálnej povahy,  ktorého úmyslom alebo následkom je alebo môže byť narušenie dôstojnosti  osoby a ktoré vytvára zastrašujúce, ponižujúce, zneucťujúce,  nepriateľské alebo urážlivé prostredie. (§ 2a Zákona č. 365/2004 Z.z. Antidiskriminačný zákon)
> *Aj jednu* príhodu obťažovania možno považovať za sexuálne obťažovanie, *ak je* dostatočne *vážna*!!
> 
> *Ujmou na zdraví* sa pritom rozumie
> 
> ublíženie na zdraví _(__spôsobené trestným činom spáchaným inou osobou)_,
> ťažká ujma na zdraví_ (__spôsobená trestným činom spáchaným inou osobou)_,
> smrť _(__spôsobená trestným činom spáchaným inou osobou)_,
> znásilnenie _(__spôsobené trestným činom spáchaným inou osobou)_,
> sexuálne násilie _(__spôsobené trestným činom spáchaným inou osobou__)_,
> sexuálne zneužívanie_    (spôsobené trestným činom spáchaným inou osobou)_.
> *There is a lot of confusion in our Criminal Law.** This is one of them.*
> 
> You seem to agree that "na tele" is not used, is it old fashioned? is it synonymous? *No. "ublíženie na tele" is a nonsense. It seems that the barbarians are already inside the gates.*





monalisa! said:


> As to the 5 offences listed, I thought  to match them as follows: _
> ABH (actual bodily harm)_ (bruises, grazes etc.) = *ublíženie na zdraví*
> 
> _GBH (grievous bodily harm)_ (broken legs etc.) = *ťažká ujma na zdraví / ťažké ublíženie na zdraví* (doesn`t include "death")
> 
> _rape_ (forced vaginal penetration of a woman older than 15 years) = *znásilnenie *(_"kto násilím alebo hrozbou bezprostredného násilia donúti ženu k súloži alebo kto na taký čin zneužije jej bezbrannosť, potrestá sa odňatím slobody na päť rokov až desať rokov."_ § 199 Trestného zákona)
> - _attempted rape_ = *pokus o znásilnenie* (no vaginal penetration involved)
> 
> _ indecent assault _(forced oral, anal penetration and other sexual practices) = *sexuálne násilie *(_"Kto násilím alebo hrozbou bezprostredného násilia donúti iného k orálnemu styku, análnemu styku alebo k iným sexuálnym praktikám alebo kto na taký čin zneužije jeho bezbrannosť, potrestá sa odňatím slobody na päť rokov až desať rokov."_ § 200 Trestného zákona)
> 
> _(child) sexual abuse_ = *sexuálne zneužívanie* (_"Kto vykoná súlož s osobou mladšou ako pätnásť rokov alebo kto takú osobu iným spôsobom sexuálne zneužije, potrestá sa odňatím slobody na tri roky až desať rokov." _§ 201 Trestného zákona)
> 
> have you any idea?, and what is the meaning of : * útok so vztiahnutím ruky ? This is another nonsense. We may call it "fyzické napadnutie." Although we know "vztiahnuť ruku na niekoho (t.j. ublížiť niekomu, udrieť niekoho)," this is not a legal term.
> *


----------



## monalisa!

Thanks a lot, morior,
it is really puzzling that_ nonsense _should fetch 180 000 hits,

yet, your nonsense makes some sense to me. I think that "_na tele"= bodily harm, harm on the body_,  is a dated term, which has been substituted by _"na zdravì"_ since this is a more comprehensive term, and covers cases in which there is no apparent damage.
As to "vztiahnutìm ruky" I agreed it is nonsense as an idiomatic expression can't be twisted. A naive translation of the English legal term might be" assault with physical contact"

You have given an accurate description of the issue, which is really complex.
Thanks again


----------



## Azori

monalisa! said:


> it is really puzzling that_ nonsense _should fetch 180 000 hits


Please, would you be so kind and post a link to the site where you get those 180 000 hits?


----------



## monalisa!

Here you are, Azori:
https://www.google.it/webhp?source=...pw.r_qf.&fp=b1e277ef7d8a11de&biw=1092&bih=492


----------



## Azori

monalisa! said:


> Here you are, Azori:
> https://www.google.it/webhp?source=...pw.r_qf.&fp=b1e277ef7d8a11de&biw=1092&bih=492


Cool. I assumed you didn't use quotation marks in your search. I got ~160 results for "ublíženie na tele": http://www.google.sk/search?q="ublí...=717&ei=jMwsUc3tKIzJswaCuYC4BQ&start=155&sa=N


----------



## morior_invictus

Azori said:


> Cool. I assumed you didn't use quotation marks in your search. I got ~160 results for "ublíženie na tele": http://www.google.sk/search?q="ublí...=717&ei=jMwsUc3tKIzJswaCuYC4BQ&start=155&sa=N


 Yes, we need to use quotes if we want to search for an exact phrase and find only pages containing that particular phrase.

Moreover, if we excluded the results that deal with the same topic using a copy-and-paste method plus the results from the two online dictionaries that continually repeat themselves (i.e._ slovnik.azet.sk _and _webslovnik.zoznam.sk_), it would be _160 __minus __XY(Z) results__ = _ _160 __minus __XY(Z) results_. 

I surely would suggest to go with "_ublíženie na zdraví._"


----------



## Azori

I wonder if "ublíženie na tele" is really incorrect. It appears in KSSJ.


----------



## morior_invictus

Azori said:


> I wonder if "ublíženie na tele" is really incorrect. It appears in KSSJ.


Alas, I saw it today when I tried to look up that phrase in some plausible sources. So, it only means that that linguistic plague spreaded even to KSSJ – it has brought a drops of the clear salty liquid (i.e. a tears ) to my eyes when I saw it. So it`s not a nonsense but a grammatically correct nonsense. 
Anyway, I`m standing by my decision that it`s just a poor literal translation of a "_bodily harm_." Someone was probably so disgusted with that not that much pure Slovak and inexplicit translation of it ("_ublíženie na zdraví_") that decided to establish it as a "beautiful" literal Slovak phrase.  I have never heard and neither read it in my whole life. This is the first place where I came across it. "_ublíženie na zdraví_" is a set legal term and as far as I know, our law doesn`t know such a term as "_ublíženie na tele_." Regardless of the fact that some _"candidatus scientiarum in linguistics" _established it in KSSJ, my previous suggestion still applies . . .


morior_invictus said:


> I surely would suggest to go with "_ublíženie na zdraví._"


*P.S.* I`m very glad you put it in here, Azori.  Every aspect must be taken into account. From now on, it`s only up to monalisa! whether she will consider it perfect and will use it or not. I`ve done my best.


----------



## monalisa!

My search with quotes gave 120 000 hits:
https://www.google.it/webhp?source=...pw.r_qf.&fp=b1e277ef7d8a11de&biw=1241&bih=560

But what is worst is that most Slovak transaltors do*  use* this term
http://korpus.sk:8091/manatee.ks/do_query?query=ublíženie+na+tele&in_corpus=0
They seem to use it as an expression milder than the other.
That is what I found most puzzling.
Could it be an adaptation from Czech?


----------



## morior_invictus

monalisa! said:


> My search with quotes gave 120 000 hits:
> https://www.google.it/webhp?source=...pw.r_qf.&fp=b1e277ef7d8a11de&biw=1241&bih=560
> *Really?*
> https://www.google.it/webhp?source=...00&bih=1042&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&cad=b
> 
> But what is worst is that most Slovak transaltors do*  use* this term
> http://korpus.sk:8091/manatee.ks/do_query?query=ublíženie+na+tele&in_corpus=0
> They seem to use it as an expression milder than the other.
> That is what I found most puzzling.
> Could it be an adaptation from Czech?


As to the SNK translations, I don`t know if SNK translates it ex tempore or just uses an existing translations. Also, I don`t know if the version with "na tele" is an adaptation from Czech as their Criminal Code knows only "ublížení na zdraví:"


> "Kdo jinému úmyslně ublíží na zdraví, bude potrestán odnětím svobody na šest měsíců až tři léta." § 146 Zákona č. 40/2009 Sb., Trestní zákoník


Even though I found some results that contained the phrase "_ublížení na těle,_" none of them came off of a legal source.


----------



## monalisa!

morior_invictus said:


> As to the SNK translations, I don`t know if SNK translates it ex tempore or just uses an existing translations. .


That link is a collection of the English books translated in Slovakia. If you click on the number on the left, you get the details about publishers and translators


----------



## morior_invictus

monalisa! said:


> That link is a collection of the English books translated in Slovakia. If you click on the number on the left, you get the details about publishers and translators


Oh, I see. Thanks. 
I`m convinced that translating of "_Krajina rozkoše_" probably caused some mind-wandering to its translator, so she was unable to pick a correct Slovak term for it.  
So here is my final advice - a legal stuff is a specific area. Whether or not I am right about the fact that "_ublíženie na tele_" is a poor and incorrect translation of a "_bodily harm_," every improper translation of any legal term may cause a nonsense or misinterpretation from a legal point of view. Capisce?


----------



## monalisa!

morior_invictus said:


> Oh, I see. Thanks.
> I`m convinced that translating of "_Krajina rozkoše_" probably caused some mind-wandering to its translator, so she was unable to pick a correct Slovak term for it.
> So here is my final advice - a legal stuff is a specific area. Whether or not I am right about the fact that "_ublíženie na tele_" is a poor and incorrect translation of a "_bodily harm_," every improper translation of any legal term may cause a nonsense or misinterpretation from a legal point of view. Capisce?


Comprendo, you are absolutely right!
I wasn't arguing that, I did not understand (and still don't) why it sounds wrong or nonsense to you, as to my foreign ears it sounds a literal translation.
thank you again


----------



## morior_invictus

monalisa! said:


> Comprendo, you are absolutely right!
> I wasn't arguing that, I did not understand (and still don't) why it sounds wrong or nonsense to you, as to my foreign ears it sounds a literal translation.
> thank you again


I don`t know. Maybe it`s just because every time I hear (or read) "_ublíženie na *tele*_" I can only imagine a "body" (literally! No other associations, just... "telo" ), its harmed surface (broken nails, torn lips, scratched calf, bitten aah-necks  etc.) and not for instance a possible psychological injury like I imagine when I hear "_ublíženie na *zdraví*_" (I understand it more complexly). For that matter,  I also see an immediate connections to a Criminal Code because that term is perfectly known to me. Maybe I`m so "deformado profesionalmente" that I can`t accept "_ublíženie na *tele*_" as a correct translation and consider it very verbatim and therefore strange. I`m sorry.


----------

