# Superlatives of adjectives



## alevtinka

Are these sentences to express superlative correct according to Russian language grammar ? And which is the most frequently used expression of "This is the best resto in town" ?

(E is for з)

1) Eто лyчшe всегo ресторaн в гoроде.

2) Eто лyчшe всеx ресторaн в гoроде. 
(I think всеx is always used on person, всегo is used for things)

3) Eто лyчший ресторaн в гoроде.

4) Eто сaмый лyчший ресторaн в гoроде.

5) Eто сaмый хорoший ресторaн в гoроде.

(I especially can't distinguish the difference between 4) & 5))


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## carsten

> Eто лyчшe всегo ресторaн в гoроде.

Bad grammar. Лучше всего is usually used in impersonal sentences like Лучше всего сделать это   -- "it's better/best to do it" Word order isn't right as well (see below)

> Eто лyчшe всеx ресторaн в гoроде. 
> (I think всеx is always used on person, всегo is used for things)

First of all, word order isn't right. Этот ресторан в городе лучше всех would be better, but anyway sounds bad, don't know why. Usually, i can imagine лучше всех when speaking of a person, you're partly right here. Ты лучше всех! "You're best!"
I would rather say "Этот ресторан в городе лучше других/остальных". May be just my taste...

> Eто лyчший ресторaн в гoроде.

The best variant as for me. Sounds more official.

> Eто сaмый лyчший ресторaн в гoроде.
> Eто сaмый хорoший ресторaн в гoроде.         

Both are good too. Самый лучший adds some emphasis. Sounds like more informal speech (grammatically it isn't informal, but it's more common in informal & colloquial speech).

The most used one is Это самый лyчший ресторaн в гoроде. You can also say Этот ресторан -- [самый] лучший в городе.


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## carsten

> (I especially can't distinguish the difference between 4) & 5))

I can't either.


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## carsten

You can also say Лучше этого ресторана в городе нет. -- There is no better restaurant in the town (a more natural sentence, imho)


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## Maroseika

alevtinka said:


> 4) Это сaмый лyчший ресторaн в гoроде.
> 
> 5) Это сaмый хорoший ресторaн в гoроде.
> 
> (I especially can't distinguish the difference between 4) & 5))



Variant 4, being pleonastic, is more coloured emotionally, because самый лучший literally means "the most best", though is quite literal unlike its English parallel.


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## Sobakus

Maroseika said:


> Variant 4, being pleonastic, is more coloured emotionally, because самый лучший literally means "the most best", though is quite literal unlike its English parallel.



You mean it's literary?



alevtinka said:


> Are these sentences to express superlative correct according to Russian language grammar ? And which is the most frequently used expression of "This is the best resto in town" ?
> 
> (E is for з)
> 
> 1) Eто лyчшe всегo ресторaн в гoроде.



Этот ресторан лучше всего(, что есть в городе) could be used if there's a list of "все рестораны города" and you pick one from it. If there isn't any list(and hence there's no "всё->всего", you should use either "всех" (which, as *carsten* has already pointed out, sounds better with animate things) or "других".


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## Maroseika

Sobakus said:


> You mean it's literary?


Yes, sure.


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## rusita preciosa

Am I the only one here who thinks *сaмый лyчший ресторaн* sounds bad? To me, this is something a 4-year-old would say.

I'd suggest going with 3 or 5.


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## Maroseika

rusita preciosa said:


> Am I the only one here who thinks *сaмый лyчший ресторaн* sounds bad?



But why?


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## carsten

> Am I the only one here who thinks *сaмый лyчший ресторaн* sounds bad? To me, this is something a 4-year-old would say.

Same here, but it seems to be "proper" grammar. It's like более лучше, which is, on the contrary, stigmatized in educated speech...


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## Maroseika

It's a pleonasm of course, but pleonasms are not ouside the law.

А он был самый лучший из всех людей, каких она знала. [Л. Н. Толстой. Воскресение (1899)]

Это прием новый, хотя, может быть, и не самый лучший: это ведет к риску сразу потерять всякий интерес для новых знакомых. [Н. С. Лесков. На ножах (1870)]

Но, вы знаете, самый лучший алмаз требует некоторой отделки. [И. C. Тургенев. Холостяк (1849)]

Самый лучший родитель никогда не может заменить матери, нежнейшего существа на земном шаре! [Н. М. Карамзин. Рыцарь нашего времени (1803)]


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## rusita preciosa

Maroseika, 
Thank you for enriching my vocabulary with the word "pleonasm".
I never said it was against the law, it could even be grammatically correct, but *самый **лучший* to me personally sounds a bit, I don’t know, naive? That's why I mentioned that a small child would say something like this.
I might be wrong.
I would be careful with the quotes from 1800s when we talk about modern Russian.


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## Maroseika

rusita preciosa said:


> Maroseika,
> Thank you for enriching my vocabulary with the word "pleonasm".
> I never said it was against the law, it could even be grammatically correct, but *самый **лучший* to me personally sounds a bit, I don’t know, naive? That's why I mentioned that a small child would say something like this.
> I might be wrong.
> I would be careful with the quotes from 1800s when we talk about modern Russian.



I could easily find hundreds examples from the modern authors, but prefered more classical.
Well, just make sure yourself: http://search.ruscorpora.ru/search....odia=1&req=%F1%E0%EC%FB%E9+%EB%F3%F7%F8%E8%E9


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## morzh

rusita preciosa said:


> Am I the only one here who thinks *сaмый лyчший ресторaн* sounds bad? To me, this is something a 4-year-old would say.
> 
> I'd suggest going with 3 or 5.



You may be indeed the only one here in this group  who thinks so. 
I personally don't think so.


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## cyanista

"Cамый лучший" and "не самый лучший" sound fine to me. This construction seems to be quite widespread. A newspaper search also returns quite a few hits. 

http://search.ruscorpora.ru/search.xml?dpp=&spp=&spd=&text=lexform&sort=gr_tagging&lang=ru&nodia=1&req=%F1%E0%EC%E0%FF%20%EB%F3%F7%F8%E0%FF&mode=paper

I think a possible reason for its existence is that "лучший" is ambiguous. It may mean both "a better" and "the best". "Cамый лучший" couldn't be any clearer.


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## Pavel88

I've heard people in Ukraine say both, and even in other languages you can use words, which while superfluous, emphasize your point, e.g., "The best restaurant" and "The very best restaurant".


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## marco_2

I am not a native-speaker of Russian but since I started studying the language, I have always been taught that *самый лучший *is correct and I hadn't even known before I started communicating with Russian people, that you can say *самый хороший. *I can quote the first grammar book I've just found in my bookcase (it's В.И._Кононенко, М.А.Брицын, Д.И.Ганич, Русский язык. Допущено Министерством просвещения СССР в качестве учебного пособия для студентов пединститутов и т.д._) the following sentence: _Местоимение "самый" может соединяться с простой формой превосходной степени: *Труд - самое лучшее, самое радикальнейшее лекарство. Лес и охота - самые лучшие условия для здоровья. *_So no wonder I'm a bit surprised that some native-speakers object to the form *самый лучший.*


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## carsten

> So no wonder I'm a bit surprised that some native-speakers object to the form самый лучший.

I think our (mine and rusita precioca's) doubts stem from the fact that in schools we were often told that comparative forms like "более веселее", "более лучше", ""более правильнее" etc. are absolutely incorrect. Grammatically, forms like "самый лучший" and "самый радикальнейший" don't differ from them that much -- since, as I understand it, Slavic languages actually never differentiated between superlative and comparative forms. Suffix -ший meant both "more" and "most" from the beginning of times, and later, to differentiate between the two, different Slavic langauges come up with different approaches.

By the way, to add confusion, Russian has one more form: наи-  "Это наилучший ресторан в городе"  (another approach, that's common in Polish and Czech) This form isn't very widespread though and sounds like more poetic.


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