# Puzzle out



## sealbeam

Hi All

What Japanese expression gives the meaning of "puzzle out," as in "I have to puzzle out the meaning of every sentence."?

A more formal way of putting it would be something like "With great effort I have to analyze every sentence to ascertain its meaning."

Thanks
Bob


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## Wishfull

puzzle out =(なぞを）解（と）く。
 "I have to puzzle out the meaning of every sentence."　
それぞれの文章の意味を解読する必要がある。
それぞれの文の意味を解読せねばならない。


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## Aoyama

*kangae dasu* is also a possibility.
With great effort I have to ... = (hijoni) doryoku shinagara .... shinakerebanarainai


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## rukiak

解読する sounds good.


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## Aoyama

解読する is more "decode, decipher", implying that what is written is written in a "coded" or unusual way.


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## sealbeam

Hi All


If I can rely on my Kenkyusha dictionary (the Green Goddess version), it seems that 考え出す comes closest to "puzzle out."

Thanks for the suggestion.

Bob


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## rukiak

考えだす means make, create (,or start thinking as 2nd meaning).
It has not the meaning as "analyze". 

If you use 考えだす for sealbeam's example, the listener must think you create the sentence.

Actually, 解読する is usually used when you decode or decipher something. So 解読する sounds bizarre when you use it for translating a language, though it carry the meaning of "analyze".

I come up with another one, 調べ上げる. It means analyze with effort.（But it may not always used for the meaning of puzzle out. It is OK in this case.）


If you want to tell the meaning certainly, you should put adverb like 苦労して or なんとか to the verb 分析する、調査する and so on.


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## Wishfull

Hi.
I think both might work here. Though I would like to vote for rukiak and myself.

I advise you to choose the better correspondence of verb-object.
意味を→解読する
訳を→考え出す
翻訳を→考え出す

文章の*意味*をひとつずつ*解読*せねばならなかった。
文章の*訳*をひとつずつ*考え出*さねばならなかった。
文章の*訳*をひとつずつ*ひねり出*さねばならなかった。

How about ひねり出す, rukiak?

I think it can mean that he had a great struggle to earn/puzzle out the meaning/translation.


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## rukiak

I just said my opinion.

In my 国語辞典（広辞苑）, there is the explanation what I described at last post. 

Online シソーラス also implies its meaning and the use of the word.
http://thesaurus.weblio.jp/content/考え‐出す

It depends. If the sentence is some ancient one, it is hopeless to know the true meaning, under the condition, you have to create some meaning.
If it is translation of a work of some present author, there exist true meanings of the sentense, and you can't create the meaning without his permission^^.

I just thought now that 出す has nuance of make something appear which is never known or never exist. 
考え出す : 考える＋出す　, 考える is personal action of the subject, so 考えだす implies that some idea is derived from the person's mind, not from the sentence.

cf.探しだす：探す＋出す , 探す means the action of finding something existing and hiding, so 探し出す implies that you find something existing.

ひねり出す：ひねる＋出す　,ひねる：頭をひねる which is personal action of the subject, so it is same as the case of 考えだす. But ひねる is often used as the meaning of twisting something existing, so it may confuse us as if it is about something existing. As for 訳をひねり出す ,ひねり出す itself is actually rather the person's original action but the word 訳 add the meaning of translating something, so it is ...ambiguous.


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## sealbeam

How about 頭を捻る ?

Bob


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## Ototsan

sealbeam said:


> Hi All
> 
> What Japanese expression gives the meaning of "puzzle out," as in "I have to puzzle out the meaning of every sentence."?
> 
> A more formal way of putting it would be something like "With great effort I have to analyze every sentence to ascertain its meaning."
> 
> Thanks
> Bob



If you allow me, I suggest two more possibilites:

(1) 文の意味をひとつひとつ確かめながら読む
(2) ひとつひとつの文を解読しながら読む

I don't think 解読する used this way sounds as inappropriate as some people have claimed.


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## mikun

Hi,
My longman says, puzzle out is 'to solve a confusing or difficult problem by thinking about it carefully'.  So may I suggest simply
難問を解決する


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