# Polite



## ThomasK

_*Polite*_ refers to being (a) 'polished', the hard edges being rubbed off. But even in English it can be translated in several ways. 

(b) _*courteous*_: behaving like at court, I believe. 
(c) *civil*: behaving like a member of the city, not a barbarian.

There might be more, but I don't know. 

Dutch : 
(b) *hoffelijk* (_hof_ = the court)
(d) _*beleefd*_, meaning : _lived_/ experienced a lot, and having learnt good manners in that way. 

German : 
(b) _*höflich*_

French:
(a) *poli*. 

But there may be more in those languages. How about yours ?


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## rusita preciosa

Russian: *вежливый* /vejlivyi/. The root *-**веж-/-вед-* has the meaning of "knowledge / experience". 
I guess the logic is somewhat similar to Spanish for polite, "educado".


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## ThomasK

Thanks! That reminds me 

(e) _*welopgevoed*_ (wel brought up)
(f) *welgemanierd* (well-mannered)

There might be a difference: they are not the standard synonyms, they focus on different aspects of politeness with us.


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## Orlin

Bulgarian: учтив (ucht*i*v), вежлив (vezhl*i*v). Вежлив is most probably a Russism.


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## apmoy70

In Greek (a couple I could think of):
*-Polite:*
(a) «Ευγενής, -ής, -ές» (adjective: Evʝe'nis, _m., f.,_ evʝe'nes, _n._)=>_well-born, of noble birth_ (for persons). «Ευγενικός, -ή, ό» (evʝeni'kos, _m._, evʝeni'ci, _f._, evʝeni'ko, _n._); with good manners. Politeness: «Ευγένεια» (ev'ʝenia, _f._), lit. _"nobility of birth"_.

(b) «Αβρός, -ή, -ό» (adjective: A'vros, _m._, av'ri, _f._, av'ro, _n._)=>_graceful, with graceful manners_. It derives from the ancient adj. «ἁβρός» (hab'rŏs) with the same meaning, of unknown etymology. Some philologists make a connection with the feminine noun «ἥβη» ('hēbē)-->_youthful prime, youth_. Noun: «Αβρότης» (av'rotis, _f._), colloquially «αβρότητα» (av'rotita, _f._). «Αβρότης» is usually translated as _courtesy_

[ʝ] is a voiced palatal fricative
[c] is a voiceless palatal plosive


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## Awwal12

Orlin said:


> Bulgarian: учтив (ucht*i*v), вежлив (vezhl*i*v). Вежлив is most probably a Russism.


I should note that the adjective "учтивый" (ucht*i*vyi) exists in Russian as well, meaning "courteous".


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## ilocas2

Czech language:

*zdvořilý* - polite, courteous
*slušný - *polite, civil


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## ThomasK

Would you be able to explain the Czech words, ilocas? The Greek word connected with youth seems funny to me in this sense that youngsters often seem to have a hard time controlling their feelings. Or is there some other logic in your view, Apmoy?  (Thanks, both of you)


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## enoo

*French* also has "_courtois_" and "_civil_". 
And "_urbain_" (urban) also had that polite/civil meaning (but this meaning is not used anymore). I guess it meant that people from the city had better manners than the ones from the country.

I'm not sure but I would say this is also the origin of the word "poli" (from greek polis : city), and not from "polished". At least, I always understood it that way


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## apmoy70

ThomasK said:


> The Greek word connected with youth seems funny to me in this sense that youngsters often seem to have a hard time controlling their feelings. Or is there some other logic in your view, Apmoy?  (Thanks, both of you)


Well, _courteous_ is the secondary meaning of the adjective «ἁβρός» (hab'rŏs); it's main meaning was/is _graceful_ (and that's the connection with youth. Young people _are_ graceful)


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## ilocas2

ThomasK said:


> Would you be able to explain the Czech words, ilocas?


 
It's in your comments:

*zdvořilý* - hoffelijk - courteous
*slušný* - welgemanierd - well-mannered


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## ThomasK

Now I see, Apmoy. yes, that makes sense !

As for poli, Enoo: you might be right, but I checked on the English polite, and at least there did I find my hypothesis confirmed (etymonline.com)


> mid-13c., from L. _politus_ "refined, elegant," lit. "polished," pp. of _polire_ "to polish, to make smooth." Used literally at first in English; sense of "elegant, cultured" is first recorded c.1500, that of "behaving courteously" is 1762.


 
And then, as for ilocas: I get the explanation in Dutch, I notice. Do you speak Dutch somehow ?


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## hui

*Finnish:

*_kohtelias < __kohdella_ (to treat)_
huomaavainen __< huomata _(to notice)_
hyvätapainen_ ("good-mannered")
_ystävällinen _(friendly)


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## ThomasK

Some questions, if I may, Hui: 
 - how would you combine treating and noticing with politeness ? Treating other people well, giving them attention? 
 - is the friend word a real synonym of _polite_ ?


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## Outsider

Portuguese has *polido*, perhaps from French influence, but this is a seldom used high-register word, nowadays. We normally say *educado* (lit. educated) or *bem-educado* (lit. well-raised/educated).

There are also the predictable synonyms: _cortês_, _gentil_, and so on.


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## hui

> - how would you combine treating and noticing with politeness ? Treating other people well, giving them attention?


I think that is the etymology, since not treating or ignoring people would be impolite. (Actually, I am not sure that _kohtelias _is derived from_ kohdella_.) And about 50 years ago, the meaning of _huomaavainen_ was observant or alert but now that meaning is almost non-existent.

_- kohtelias = _polite
_- huomaavainen = _considerate, polite



> - is the friend word a real synonym of _polite_ ?


Define "real synonym". When I help someone by opening a door, I am being polite (= _ystävällinen, kohtelias, huomaavainen_) but not necessarily friendly (_= ystävällinen_).

Two colloquial Finnish words for polite:
_- höveli = _polite, friendly, helpful
_- höyli = höveli
_


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## ilocas2

ThomasK said:


> And then, as for ilocas: I get the explanation in Dutch, I notice. Do you speak Dutch somehow ?


 

No, I only used your first comments, where you just explained meanings of these words in English.


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## Favara

*Catalan* = _polit_
a) polished
g) beautiful, strong, physically well formed
h) clean, well dressed


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## ThomasK

Just thought for a sec that we had a Dutch-speaking Czech, ilocas ! 

Catalan: is 'polite' meaning # (i), Favara ?


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## Favara

Sorry, I don't understand your question... What do you mean by "# (i)"?

I used _polit_ since it's the most etymologically related word to EN "polite" and FR "poli". If you're asking about what word do we use to actually translate "polite", it'd be _educat_ (educated).


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## Sikaranista

In Spanish, there are a few words that can be used for polite:


cortés (courteous), usually used to describe a person

Es cortés y sencilla -- (He/she) is courteous and sincere

agradable (agreeable), often used for a way of doing something

_discurso agradable_ - polite speech

educado (educated), often used for how we would say "manners"

_mantenga un __comportamiento educado_ - use good manners -- literally, maintain an educated behaviour

_maldecir es una falta de educación_ - cursing is bad manners -- literally, cursing is a fault in (your) education.


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## enoo

ThomasK said:


> As for poli, Enoo: you might be right, but I checked on the English polite, and at least there did I find my hypothesis confirmed



Yes, and the online French etymological dictionnaries I checked also seems to tell that _poli/polite_ and _polir/to polish_ have the same origin. (I didn't had the time to check them when I wrote my message, sorry).
I wonder why I always associated "poli" and "polis" - I guess that either I made the link myself with poli/polis/urban, either I was taught this some long time ago, and it stuck in my head. (It's likely to be that 2nd solution - I more or less remember learning something like that in class ages ago).


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## ThomasK

That is precisely what I wanted to know, Favara. I was wondering whether _polit_ also meant _polite_, which it doesn't in Catalan, I now understand. Thanks.


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## bibax

Czech:

*zdvořilý* is derived from *dvůr* (gen. dvora) = court (many meanings like in English), yard, farmstead (btw Dvořák = from a farmstead)

*dvorný*

*uhlazený* from uhladiti = to levigate, to make smooth; hladký = smooth, plain, ...

Hungarian:

*udvarias* from *udvar* = court, yard (nothing in common with Budvar ;-)

Obviously of Slavic origin, u is prothetic (the Hungarian words cannot begin with a consonant cluster).


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## ThomasK

As for Enoo: no problem, and sometimes poli- refers to town as in _politics/ policy/ police_, I think, and I do see sometimes language use town as a root _word_ for the term _polite_, so it would not be improbable. You do 
have it (did...) in urbain, you pointed out - and I guess you will encouter it in _civilisation_ words, I think. 

Great additions concerning Czech, 
- the association with court and yard/ farmstead (Dvorak, now I unders/tand)
- the smoothing, which I associate with polishing (see also _beschaving/ civilisation_ in my other thread)


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## Encolpius

*Hungarian*:

*udvarias *as mentioned above

we also use: *illedelmes *from illendő (adjective, what is proper to do) from illik (verb, be proper).


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## ThomasK

Could it be that *illedelmes* is more like _decency_? It may be hard to distinguish between the two, but 
- _civilisation_ would be in my view : the whole of cultural 'fruits', the refinement, all kinds of progress in certain fields (or so they are perceived) 
 - _decency_ : (a particular way of behaving oneself according to) certain moral standards imposed by ... (some upper class, ...)
 - _politeness_ : certain standards for interpersonal communication, I think 

There are clear links between the three, but they're not the same. Yet, when we refer to propriety, we might come close to decency...


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## Encolpius

ThomasK said:


> Could it be that *illedelmes* is more like _decency_?
> ...



I have no idea. Both words are synonyms for me.


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## phosphore

Serbian:

vaspitan from vaspitati=to raise
pristojan from pristajati=to befit
učtiv (no related words)
uljudan from ljudi=men


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## ThomasK

Are those adjectives, all synonyms of _polite_, Phosphore ? (Thanks)


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## phosphore

Yes, they are all adjectives and they all mean polite in some way. The first one, vaspitan, primarily means well-raised, the other three mean just polite. There is also uglađen from gladak=smooth that I forgot to mention in the previous post. There are certainly some nuances that differentiate these words but generally they all mean polite, and among them pristojan and vaspitan are the most widely used.


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## bibax

Serbian učtiv resembles Czech uctivý (= respectful) from úcta (respect) and ctíti (= to respect).

We say zdvořilý or uctivý pozdrav (polite/respectful greeting).


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