# Sophisticated English in films



## Godfather

I love watching films with a sophisticated kind of English. I'm talking about the likes of *Clockwork Orange* ("There was nothing I hated more than to see a filthy old drunkie, a-howling away at the filthy songs of his fathers and going blurp blurp in between as if it were a filthy old orchestra in his stinking rotten guts.") or *Pirates of the Carribean* ("You need to find yourself a girl mate. Or perhaps the reason you practice three hours a day is that you already found one, and are otherwise incapable of wooing said strumpet. You're not a eunuch are you?."). I hope you get my point. Please tell me about other films in which such English is spoken.


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## Roi Marphille

I guess "The remains of the day" . That is quite sophisticated...like the novel from Kazuo Ishiguro.


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## fenixpollo

Neither of the films you mentioned are written in "sophisticated" English.  _Clockwork_ has lots of invented words and ideas, put together because they sound poetic or fun.  _Pirates_ was written with some language that was common to the period of those pirates, but neither the pirates nor their English is "sophisticated."

If you really want "proper" or "sophisticated" English, do as Roi suggests and watch any Merchant-Ivory film, or any adaptation of Jane Austen.


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## BasedowLives

A lot of kevin smith stuff uses unrealistic esoteric dialog.  perhaps not as eloquent as the aforementioned films but still good.

Clerks <--funny black and white film.  there's a funny conversation questioning the justness of the final battle in a star wars movie regarding the question of the innocence of the contracters hired to work on the death star.

i'm having trouble thinking of more, if i do i'll edit here


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## Godfather

I expected the word "sophisticated" to cause problems. Let's call the language in these films cleverly devised. More appropriate terms are welcome.

Yes, Clockwork Orange uses Nadsat (invented words) and Pirates has all these old-fashioned expressions mixed in. But that's exactly what I'm looking for. I love such English in films. But feel free to suggest "real sophisticated" films as well.


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## Roi Marphille

fenixpollo said:
			
		

> If you really want "proper" or "sophisticated" English, do as Roi suggests and watch any Merchant-Ivory film, or any adaptation of Jane Austen.


I'd say you and me meant 4th definition of *sophisticated *from WordReference dictionary.  
However, after checking the other definitions, I don't disagree with what it is been stated in the first post by Godfather.  
cheers


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## GenJen54

"Shakespeare In Love" is one that comes quickly to mind.  Of course, Shakespeare is used throughout, but much of it in a very tongue in cheek sort of way.

Additionally, the "play within a movie" concept is constructed really beautifully here.

I also agree that any Merchant-Ivory and/or Jane Austen inspired film ("Emma,"  "Sense and Sensibity," "Mansfield Park," and "Pride and Prejudice" are also brilliant.)

Finally, if it's a good mystery you desire, you might try "Gosford Park," a beautifully crafted ensemble piece set in 1940s England.


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## judkinsc

Try to find any movie based on a work by Oscar Wilde.  _The Importance of Being Earnest_ is my favorite, but I really like _The Picture of Dorian Grey_, too.
Although I still think the books are better.


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## nycphotography

Well, good witty dialog is far harder to write than sophisticated English.

If I may presume... what I think Godfather meant was "clever, eloquent, and/or creative dialog and use of language". 

In my own opinion, Comedians like *Jeff Foxworthy* and *Dave Chapelle*, while not "sophisticated" language in the propa' sense o' the wahd, are certainly clever, and sophisticated in how they perceive language and culture.

Some of my absolute favorite movies (for language):

*My Cousin Vinny* (excellent use of language as an integral element of the story, including regional accents and 'classism').

*Monty Python and the Holy Grail* (same reasons with BE instead of AE, but warning: Watch no more than once a month, lest you start craving more taped glasses, high waisted pants, and short sleeved dress shirts in your wardrobe).

*Tin Men* (excellent character development, again through language choices, and excellent excellent cultural references. This movie has my favorite turn of phrase of all time: bent weathervane).

Hmm. More clever dialog...

*Silence of the Lambs*

OHHHHHHH *Scent of a Woman* w/ Pacino. A definite must if you appreciate a good contemporary soliloquy.

And *Bulworth*. Another movie with interesting use of language and cultural references.

If you liked Clockwork Orange, and you want an edgy strange satire you _could_ try "*Female Trouble*". But the humor is weird, warped, and maybe not immediately obvious. Female Trouble I can't recommend to just everyone. You have to appreciate how hard (and funny) it can be to make a truly awful movie on purpose. It's also not for children or the faint of heart. You have to rather appreciate histrionic drama, ala Sir Elton (John) and his frequent feuds.


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## Outsider

I liked Much Ado About Nothing.


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## DAH

Wm. Shakespheare's The Merchant of Venice, with Al Pacino and Jeremy Irons

The Dresser, with Albert Finney

Taming of the Shrew or Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf, both with Burton and Taylor


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## KingSix

Blackadder!  A series based on four different time ages starring Rowan Atkinson, really well written lines.


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## Roi Marphille

KingSix said:
			
		

> Blackadder! A series based on four different time ages starring Rowan Atkinson, really well written lines.


yes! indeed!


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## Godfather

Thanks for all the answers. I'm going to have a look at some of the suggested films for sure.



			
				nycphotography said:
			
		

> If I may presume... what I think Godfather meant was "clever, eloquent, and/or creative dialog and use of language".



Exactly.


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## I.C.

“Yes Minister”,
“Yes, Prime Minister”. 
Available on DVD. You can learn a lot from these series and I’m not talking about language.

By the way, you can watch David Chapelle on one of the channels of MTV Germany , I think.


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## Mei

BasedowLives said:
			
		

> A lot of kevin smith stuff uses unrealistic esoteric dialog. perhaps not as eloquent as the aforementioned films but still good.
> 
> Clerks <--funny black and white film. there's a funny conversation questioning the justness of the final battle in a star wars movie regarding the question of the innocence of the contracters hired to work on the death star.
> 
> i'm having trouble thinking of more, if i do i'll edit here


 
I like most of his films! 




> Blackadder! A series based on four different time ages starring Rowan Atkinson, really well written lines.


 
Good one!




> *Monty Python and the Holy Grail*


 
??? I've never heard a word about this film! My preferit one of them is "Life of Brian" and "The Monty Python Flying Circus" show.

I have to look for it! Thanks!


Mei


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## JazzByChas

I will say two things:

I don't necessarily believe "sophisticated english" to be the "Brahmin" all the actors were taught in the golden era of Hollywood, when they all sounded like transplanted Brits, living in New York.

I will agree with the consensus that any film based on literature whose author was a contemporay of the 19th century or before, speaks in an English I like much more than our contemporary version. 

As mentioned by GenJen, anything by Jane Austen, or anything by Bill Shakespeare are some of my favorites, but I'm sure there are many others.

John: I agree that language and dialects are usually used to good effect when they want to reflect the way language is used in that locale and in that era. I also like that kind of thing as well...a good example would be the "hard-boiled" detective stories, by authors like "Raymond Chandler" or of that ilk...


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## Chabada

I love Woody Allen's dialogs.


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## clipper

Try also "Withnail and I" excessively flower language for humourous effect. And in my opinion one of the best English comedy films.


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## Vespasian

*Kill Bill Vol. 2* also has fantastic dialogues and monologues in my opinion. The same applies to other films directed by Quentin Tarantino like *Pulp Fiction* or *Reservoir Dogs*.


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## ireney

Mei said:
			
		

> ??? I've never heard a word about this film! My preferit one of them is "Life of Brian" and "The Monty Python Flying Circus" show.
> 
> I have to look for it! Thanks!



Oh dear! The insult "Your mother was a hamster and your father smelled of elderberries." should give you a clue.

I can only think of the thriller "Brick" and the "Frasier" series by the way. Witty dialogues in both.


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## Victoria32

GenJen54 said:
			
		

> "Shakespeare In Love" is one that comes quickly to mind. Of course, Shakespeare is used throughout, but much of it in a very tongue in cheek sort of way.
> 
> Additionally, the "play within a movie" concept is constructed really beautifully here.
> 
> I also agree that any Merchant-Ivory and/or Jane Austen inspired film ("Emma," "Sense and Sensibity," "Mansfield Park," and "Pride and Prejudice" are also brilliant.)
> 
> Finally, if it's a good mystery you desire, you might try "Gosford Park," a beautifully crafted ensemble piece set in 1940s England.


 
One film that used what Godfather meant (I gather) by "sophisticated" English is _Serenity_, where the future history uses some Chinese lexis, but also where the spoken English is quite poetic... The TV series it came from, _Firefly_ is the same....


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## fenixpollo

I'm not sure I agree with you, Victoria. The dialogue in Serenity _can_ be poetic, but there was often a "countrified" way of talking that I found stilted at times. For example:





> You all wanna be looking very intently at your own belly buttons. I see a head start to rise, violence is going to ensue. Probably guessed we mean to be thieving here but what we're after is not yours. So, let's have no undue fussing





> Love. You can know all the math in the 'Verse, but take a boat in the air you don't love, she'll shake you off just as sure as the turning of worlds. Love keeps her in the air when she oughta fall down, tells ya she's hurtin' 'fore she keens. Makes her home.


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## Victoria32

fenixpollo said:
			
		

> I'm not sure I agree with you, Victoria. The dialogue in Serenity _can_ be poetic, but there was often a "countrified" way of talking that I found stilted at times. For example:


 
You're right, it is 'countrified', but I found it charming probably because I am unfamiliar with that way of speaking (all the AE I hear in TV/Movies is very urban and contemporary..) Joss Whedon said he was thinking of the US Civil War and a kind of 1860s feel... 

My perception is that language is more sophisticated in BE films, my son and I were watching a Dr Who DVD from the 1970s, and heard something (I can't remember what!) that I don't think we'd have heard in an AE show aimed at children, not now, and maybe not in 1975, as it assumed a vocabulary that I don't think American TV would assume children as having.. 

You must be a big Serenity fan, to be able to quote dialogue! It's my favourite film in the whole 'Verse, Baz Lurhmann's Romeo and Juliet coming second, and the Blackadder series third of those mentioned here...


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## fenixpollo

I didn't quote _Serenity_ dialogue from memory... I went to an internet movie database.  I'm a language phreak, not a sci-fi geek (well... that, too  )

Dr. Who _does_ have good vocabulary... but is it a children's show?


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## Victoria32

fenixpollo said:
			
		

> I didn't quote _Serenity_ dialogue from memory... I went to an internet movie database.  I'm a language phreak, not a sci-fi geek (well... that, too  )
> 
> Dr. Who _does_ have good vocabulary... but is it a children's show?


 
Originally, yes, that's how it was conceived in 1963, as a way of teaching history/geography. It was continued to be regarded as such up until it died in 1989, but the current series, I would not think so! (Mind you, I don't like it very much...)


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## danielfranco

Yes, well, I was going to suggest Quentin Tarantino's films (don't forget "Four Rooms") as an example of how the everyday language (including profanity) can be used to express esoteric and almost mystic thoughts. But it has been previously mentioned...
Lately, one of my favorite movies because of the dialogue is the film "Closer", with Julia Roberts, Natalie Portman, Clive Owens and Jude Law. My wife would complain: "But no one speaks like that!" Exactly, I think. The movie's dialogue is great because I believe all the dialogue is in fact the subtext of each character.


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## Victoria32

danielfranco said:
			
		

> Yes, well, I was going to suggest Quentin Tarantino's films (don't forget "Four Rooms") as an example of how the everyday language (including profanity) can be used to express esoteric and almost mystic thoughts. But it has been previously mentioned...
> Lately, one of my favorite movies because of the dialogue is the film "Closer", with Julia Roberts, Natalie Portman, Clive Owens and Jude Law. My wife would complain: "But no one speaks like that!" Exactly, I think. The movie's dialogue is great because I believe all the dialogue is in fact the subtext of each character.


" "But no one speaks like that!" "

That can be an advantage in films, I think, that people can speak quite unnaturally, can be an asset in showing character, or an exotic location in space and time...


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## cj427

> Finally, if it's a good mystery you desire, you might try "Gosford Park," a beautifully crafted ensemble piece set in 1940s England.


 
Oof.  Good luck with that accent, though.  I had to put on the "hearing-impaired" subtitles...


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