# EN: X fois plus + adjectif



## DearPrudence

Hello, that's me again

I know that to say "2 fois plus de + nom", you say: 'twice as much/many' + noun (twice as much space and half as many things (if it rings a bell  ))
But how would you say for instance "10 fois plus + adjectif".
For example:
c'est dix fois plus efficace que l'autre: 
'it's ten times more efficient than the other one' ou 'it's ten times as efficient as the other one', or something else?
My guess, to say "10 fois plus grand": ten times bigger.

Thanks  

*Moderator note:* Multiple threads have been merged to create this one.


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## JazzByChas

I would have said what you first quoted: "It's 10 times more efficient than the other..."
"10 times bigger" is not quite the same thing: the latter refers to size, whereas the first refers to the respective abilities of the objects in question.


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## girofle67

hello,

could you help me ? 

I have to translate this sentence : "cela sera 4 fois plus cher mais sera 2 fois plus rapide"

It will  be 4 times more expensive but twice faster. Is it correct ?
Or may be : 4 times more expensive but twice as fast ,

 thanks for help


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## lazypunk

the second one is correct: 
"it will be four times more expensive, but (it will be) twice as fast"

 
 maja


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## crossreference

You last sentence is fine.
If you're picky about "parallel structure",
you'd have:  "That'll be 4 times as expensive, but twice as fast."


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## Saritalove

"... but twice as quick" would also be fine.


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## Lolofds

Hello hello

How to translate 5 fois plus cher in this sentence:

"[…] the twins started to develop business around the island, buying up most parts of shops and hotels for sometimes five times more expensive than their value."

Thanks !!!


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## Donaldos

Tu peux simplement dire : _five times their value_.

P.S. : il y a une certains nombres de corrections à apporter au reste de la phrase...


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## Franco-filly

You can simply say "buying..............for five times their value (/actual worth)" 

p.s. instead of few times after you might want to say "soon after" or "a short while after.."


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## Wordsmyth

To come back to your original question, Lolo





Lolofds said:


> How to translate 5 fois plus cher :
> 
> "[...] five times more expensive [...]."



I'm assuming that your "5 fois plus" is the popularly accepted present-day meaning in French (X = 100; 5 fois plus = 500).
Be careful with such numerical expressions : translating word-for-word often gives the wrong answer! 

If X is worth €100, and Y is worth €500, then* in English*:
- Y is worth *five* times *as much as* X
- Y has *five* times *the value of* X
- Y is worth *four* times *more than* X *** 

*** If X = €100, then one time *more *(i.e. adding the same amount one time), gives €200; twice *more* gives €300 ... and four times *more* gives €500.

I'm assured by a French mathematician friend that the same distinction exists in French (cinq fois autant que ..., cinq fois la valeur de ..., quatre fois plus que ...), but that in popular usage the first two are rarely used and the 'x fois plus cher' form has deviated into an "incorrect" but almost unanimously accepted meaning. He also gets quite angry with the use of the 'nonsensical' _[sic]_ use of "deux fois moins" for "la moitié" ... And beware, never translate this into English as "two times less"; it just wouldn't be understood.

Apparently the debate is still alive: http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=1218398&p=6244711#post6244711
This thread gets particularly interesting from post#9 onwards, and my mathematician friend would be pleased to see that some others understand his logic. There are also indications that the 'logical' usage was once common usage in French.

Ws


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## alexus34

Hi !

In this sentence, we use " as much as", why not " more than " ?

The pound has been known to be worth four times as much as a dollar.

thank you


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## arundhati

Parce que c'est logique : on dirait en français "quatre fois plus", mais en réalité si on *ajoute *quatre fois la même chose, on obtient cinq unités.
Avec "Quatre fois autant", on obtient bien quatre unités à la fin.


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## alexus34

Merci arundhati !


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## jann

Actually, both "as much as" and "more than" are possible in that sentence, and some people use them interchangeably.

However, the "more than" option can be ambiguous because some people say "four times more than X" when they mean "X + 4X = 5X" ... while other people use "four times more than X" to mean simply "4X."

You may find this discussion on the English Only forum to be helpful:  Three times as many/ three times more than


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## Wordsmyth

jann said:


> Actually, both "as much as" and "more than" are possible in that sentence, and some people use them interchangeably._[...]_


 Whilst I'm very familiar with the erroneous form in French (see my #10), my first reaction to your comment, jann, was that in my experience it's not that common in English, at least not in UK usage. However it seems that times are changing (for the worse!): I Googled several variations on "X times more than" and found quite a few instances (particularly in the UK tabloid press) where they really meant "X times as many/much as". 

So it seems we do have to advise people to avoid a perfectly clear and correct expression ("X times more than"), just because some people use it to mean something it doesn't mean. It pains me to say it, but it seems that this is yet another bit of our language that has been rendered useless by misuse. 

Ws


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