# Language: Constantly Changing into... ?



## tyrian

I've been wondering what makes certain words get absorbed into languages, selects foreign words, keeps new ones and changes the vowels in existing words. Is the whole process random or is it an evolving pattern (to fit in with theories of evolution on a linguistic level). Is the entire thing chaotic and if so, what are the implications of that... Does anybody have an opinion or comment to share?


----------



## maxiogee

I would suggest that words get 'absorbed' when they have been found to be useful. Much of the adoption of foreign words into English came through the overseas exertions of the British - both civilly and militarily. 
I must imagine that Britain had bungalows long before they had the word for them, but on coming across the word, English saw the need for it and the use of it, as it were, and adopted it. I presume that the same applies to other words too.


----------



## Etcetera

The Russian language adopted many words from Business English. Of course, the language could invent its own words for virtually every term, but was is necessary? I believe it's better to borrow a word then to invent a long and clumsy word to describe something.
The Russian for computer is компьютер. There was once a Russian word for it as well - ЭВМ, or электронная вычислительная машина (must be electronic calculating machine, sort of). But компьютер has proved to be more convenient a word.


----------



## LV4-26

In our globalized modern world, new objects and new techniques are invented each day. When those come from a foreign country, they're almost instantaneously adopted, long  before we've had time to find a national equivalent for their original name.
The other day I heard a French student in marketting and communication use the word "eye-tracking". The journalist had to explain what the girl meant. Obviously, French marketting companies have already used this technique for some time but it would take much longer for a French equivalent to be found. Therefore, we can bet this potential equivalent will never really exist or will never be popular because the English word will have become widespread (at least in its field of application) in the meantime.

But then, if my theory was entirely right, English speakers should say _carte à puce_ instead of _smart card. _


----------



## mjscott

When I think of language I think of my old biology films of amoeba under a microscope. It's a living creature that eats what it needs in its path and moves and changes shape as it travels through time.


----------



## Brioche

It's not usefulness alone.
There are the vagaries of fashion and snobbery - and the poseurs who think that foreign words are impressive.

In the past, French was the prestige language, so many French words relating to food, fashion and diplomacy were adopted into English.

English is a fashionable language at the moment, so many English words are being adopted by other languages. 

When the words are adopted, they often change their meaning. Tampon and douche don't have the same meaning in English that they have in French.

The Germans use the word 'clever', but in German it refers to a rather sly sort of cleverness.

Italians say "mobbing" when they mean bullying in the workplace. They say "golf" for sweater, and the Italians and the French say "footing" for jogging.


----------



## xarruc

A lot of words cannot be translated from one language to another adequately.

Most obvious is food. How does anyone translate chorizo - you can say spicy red sausage. but then chorizo can be eaten hot or cold and isn't like sausage meat. Its not alsways spicy andnot always red. Its more accurate to say "chorizo".

Business and computer terminology seems to move quickly and translating buzzwords diminishes their status - the whole idea is we have just learned this new 'foreign' concept that we are bringing with us. If we translate it people realise its the same old thing - this is true even in our own language. Eg recently I heard a doctor giving a speech about a new weapon in the "armamentarium" against AIDS. I was stumped. what did this mean. Then I realised it was the latest way to say "arsenal", which has widely been used this way for years.

There are other things. Emotions sometimes dont translate well. I often give up explaining a joke because the lengthy explanation loses the punch-line etc. Recently a newspaper here said "bullying ha aumentado en las escuelas catalanas" or something similar.

I have struggled several times to translate bullying into Spanish. I end up with a word like thug or little gangster. I guess tha journalist who wrote the headline gave up too. Hence a new spanish word. just like mobbing (harrassment), footing (jogging) etc.


----------



## übermönch

Cultural hegemony also has allways been the main reason for borrowings - at first Latin, then French, then German, now English.


----------



## LV4-26

Brioche said:


> There are the vagaries of fashion and snobbery - and the poseurs who think that foreign words are impressive.


I thought I'd let someone else get on my favorite soapbox this time. Thanks Brioche. 


> [...]and the Italians and the French say "footing" for jogging.


Don't know about the Italians but the French no longer do. They say "_jogging_" now...like everybody else


----------



## Encolpius

I'd mention the role of *the media*, too and its *censorship*.


----------



## Alxmrphi

Encolpius said:


> I'd mention the role of *the media*, too and its *censorship*.



Hi Enclo, I understand the media part, but I am not sure what you mean by censorship? I would have thought censoring something would be a way of preventing certain words from being absorbed (like if a child who didn't hear swearing at school / in the household). So when they're bleeped off TV as well these children wouldn't know what these words mean.

Can you explain? I've probably misunderstood...


----------



## Favara

Maybe Encolpius meant the media making up, making slight changes or absorbing foreign words to bypass that censorship.
As in, to avoid the banned word they use a new one, and that second one becomes popular and ends up being banned, so they use a third one, etc...


----------



## Alxmrphi

Favara said:


> Maybe Encolpius meant the media making up, making slight changes or absorbing foreign words to bypass that censorship.
> As in, to avoid the banned word they use a new one, and that second one becomes popular and ends up being banned, so they use a third one, etc...



Maybe this is something more common in continental Europe than in Britain, I can't think of any examples of this.


----------



## sokol

Alxmrphi said:


> Maybe this is something more common in continental Europe than in Britain, I can't think of any examples of this.


It isn't that common on continental Europe either; however I imagine that there exist guidelines for national TV stations of "smaller languages" (like Czech or Slovene or Hungarian) to not use a specific (colloquial) word but replace it with a (more formal) other one.

But, Encolpius, did you really refer to this, or rather the general influence of mass media (which is indeed huge, but not really planned like that)?


----------



## berndf

Alxmrphi said:


> Maybe this is something more common in continental Europe than in Britain, I can't think of any examples of this.


It is even stronger in the English speaking world than elsewhere. This form of censorship is called "PC". 

Since "cripple" isn't PC, you say "handicapped person". Once "handicapped person" has been in use for a while it inherits the meaning of "cripple" and  becomes non-PC too, so you start calling them "challenged persons". Guess how it will continue.


----------



## Alxmrphi

Ah I see._ (Dwarf -> Midget -> Little person_)
etc etc, I can see how this plays a role in the evolution of language through the media.


----------



## Encolpius

It was just an idea, I did not think of anything special. It is on you to decide if my idea is correct. I can be wrong.  But I think now we encounter new words more often through the media than from neighbours or friends. And the mass media is really powerful. Very very powerful. So why could it not effect language development, too.


----------



## Lars H

Encolpius said:


> And the mass media is really powerful. Very very powerful. So why could it not effect language development, too.



Hej
I think media really drive language development.

Two Swedish examples:
There is little demand for the old Swedish domestic vegetable called "senapskål" (literally meaning mustard cabbage). But when sold under the name "rucola", it sells good.
The day after Apple's launch of the coming iPad, it was named "Paddan" (meaning "the toad") in a Swedish computer magazine. 

New words, catchy expressions or just by making things more exotic/foreign will get the the public's interest, either in the product or in the sender!


----------

