# Cramp



## ThomasK

I think it will be a *spasm* or a *convulsion* in English. But what is your word for that, and can you use it in a figurative sense?


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## Armas

Finnish

kouristus, presumably < koura = hand when grabbing something or hand held in the form of a cup (when you take e.g. water in one hand)
kramppi (colloquial)
spasmi (medical term)

Only thing that I can think of is sydäntä kouristaa = to have heart convulsion, i.e. to be very distressed.


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## ger4

In German, _Krampf_ means 'cramp, spasm, convulsion' and can be also be used figuratively - even though, in order to express the figurative meaning, the adjective _verkrampft_ is used more often: _eine verkrampfte Atmosphäre_ can perhaps be translated as 'a tense atmosphere', _verkrampft sein_ - 'to be uptight, nervous'. The original meaning is similar to 'cramped' (though not in the sense of 'lacking space')  

Another related noun is _Verkrampfung_, which seems to emphasize the process of becoming more and more 'cramped'... but it's difficult to define the difference between _Krampf_ and _Verkrampfung. _


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## ThomasK

That is about quite the same in Dutch: _*verkrampt*_... We also have the adverb (adj.) _krampachtig_ (crampish, or something the like). _*Krampachtig* proberen_ is 'to try frenetically, almost desperately'. Like_ een krampachtige poging_ : a desperate attempt, as in a cramp.


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## Gavril

_charley horse_ = painful cramping of the arm or leg muscles


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## ThomasK

Never heard of that! Can you use it in a figurative sense, as in reacting "as in a Charley horse" ;-)?


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## Gavril

I don't fully understand your question, but I don't personally remember hearing _charley horse_ used for anything other than physical injury.

The phrase _charley horse_ may itself have originated via analogy with the limping of a horse whose limbs are injured or worn out.


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## ThomasK

I am sorry, I had just been translating fairly literally from Dutch: Can you say that someone has a CH reaction if for example he reacts as in a cramp, i.e., tense, full of fear (or ...). We can use "kramp" in that sense, and "verkrampt": not just as if your muscles are too short (cramped ?), but as if your mind is tense, as in a spasm, that does not allow you to think and react freely. You see?



Armas said:


> Finnish:
> 
> *kouristus*, presumably < koura = hand when grabbing something or hand held in the form of a cup (when you take e.g. water in one hand)
> kramppi (colloquial)
> spasmi (medical term)
> 
> Only thing that I can think of is sydäntä kouristaa = to have heart convulsion, i.e. to be very distressed.


Veyr interesting to note that that gesture is called a "cramp" then, because generally you cannot control a muscle that "goes into a spasm". The example you give of fig. use, seems perfect though. Could you use "kouristaa" in other practical ways?

(Just a hint for everyone: maybe we could *highlight* the translations...)


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## Gavril

ThomasK said:


> I am sorry, I had just been translating fairly literally from Dutch: Can you say that someone has a CH reaction if for example he reacts as in a cramp, i.e., tense, full of fear (or ...).



I edited my post above while you were typing this. Personally, I have never heard _charley horse_ used this way, but that doesn't mean that nobody has ever done so.


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## ThomasK

Please don't worry. That was just a personal note from a non-native (speaker) - and your word is confirmed at Wikipedia!

As a matter of fact, I happened to find quite some interesting names while looking up 'Charley horse' at Wikipedia. Like - I am just picking out the most interesting ones - :

_"*Pferdekuss*_ ("horse's kiss"), In southern Italy, it is called _*morso del ciuccio*_ ("donkey bite"), [...] in Finland _*puujalka*_ ("wooden leg"), and in Denmark "*trælår*" ("wooden thigh". [...] In Japan it is known as _*komuragaeri*_ (こむら返り?) ("calf cramp")."

Quite some refer to wooden legs or something like that, because a leg can feel like that. (So, thanks again, Gavril)


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## apmoy70

Greek:

Cramp: Colloquially *«κράμπα»* [ˈkramba] (fem.) < Fr. crampe.
Formally, *«σύσπαση»* [ˈsispasi] (fem.) --> _violent movement/contraction_ < Classical 3rd declension deverbal fem. noun *«σύσπασις» sŭ́spasis* --> _pulling together with violent movement_ < Classical v. *«συσπάω/συσπῶ» sŭspáō* (uncontracted)/*sŭspô* (contracted) --> _to draw together, contract_ < compound; prefix and preposition *«σύν» sún* --> _with, together with_ (with obscure etymology) + Classical v. *«σπάω/σπῶ» spáō* (uncontracted)/*spô* (contracted)
--> _to draw_ (e.g. a sword), _to pull out, tear, drag, suck in, slurp down_ (PIE *(s)pleh₂- _to draw_ cf Hitt. pippa-/pipp- _to draw, set in motion violently_; ToB pāss- _to rip off_).
The medical term is *«μυϊκή σύσπαση»* [mi.iˈci ˈsispasi] (both fem.) --> _muscular contraction_.

Edit: _Charley horse_: *«νευροκαβαλίκε(υ)μα»* [nevrokavaˈlicema] & [nevrokavaˈlicevma] (neut.) --> _a sudden, painful muscular tightening_, lit. _intertwisting of nerves with muscles_ < compound; combinatory form *«νευρο-» neuro-* of Classical fem. noun *«νευρὰ» neurā̀* --> _string of a bow, sinew_ (PIE *sneh₁-ur/n- _band, sinew_ cf Skt. स्नावन् (snāvan), _bow string, sinew_; ToB s̩n̄aura, _sinews, nerves_; Lat. nervus) + late ByzGr v. *«καβαλικεύω» kabalikeúō* --> _to ride, mount a horse, straddle_ < late Lat. caballus, _horse, packhorse_ < possibly from Gaulish/Transalpine Gaulish _caballos_. In ByzGr the loanword *«καβάλλης» kabállēs* (masc.) replaced in the vernacular the Classical *«ἵππος» híppŏs* for the horse.


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## 810senior

In Japanese it'll be expressed as 痙攣keiren meaning convulsion, twitch only used in a medical way.


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## Armas

ThomasK said:


> Veyr interesting to note that that gesture is called a "cramp" then, because generally you cannot control a muscle that "goes into a spasm". The example you give of fig. use, seems perfect though. Could you use "kouristaa" in other practical ways?
> 
> (Just a hint for everyone: maybe we could *highlight* the translations...)



My explanation must have been unclear. The gesture (if you can call it so?) is not called "cramp", it's the other way around, cramp is called "grabbing". I'll try to explain again: *koura "*hand (when grabbing, taking, holding something)" > *kouristaa* "to convulse" > *kouristus* "convulsion, cramp". So cramp is like someone grabbing (and pulling) your muscle.

I almost forgot: *suonenveto* = cramp, literally "vein pulling".


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## ThomasK

@Armas: my mistake, I am sorry. Interesting to read that you use a metaphor to describe it [-_istaa_ is probably some kind of intensifying suffix, or isn't it?). The 'vein pulling' is equally interesting. [But then: hardly any figurative use. Not for example the way I explained in #8. That is quite common in Dutch - and I'd be interested in how you describe that kind of "cramp-y" reactions...

@810sr: does the "calf cramp" sound familiar to you? (See #10)

I am just wondering whether there could be some confusion.
(1) A cramp as I mean it here is general very temporary, painful, but not fatal. For that we have other words. Are we always referring to the "average" cramp, not an "extreme" cramp?
(2) The fig.* "mind cramp*" can last lifelong because people are not aware of it, and if they feel pain, they don't realize it is the "cramp" that causes it... I certainly hope to find out how you name that lack of freedom of mind, of spontaneity, in one's attitude or reactions.


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## 810senior

ThomasK said:


> @810sr: does the "calf cramp" sound familiar to you? (See #10)


Yes we have a term about this: こむら返りkomura-gaeri(komura means a calf, gaeri to turn out inside).


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## bibax

Czech: *křeč* = spasm; adj. *křečovitý* = spasmodic;

figuratively:
křečovitá snaha (krampfhafte Bemühung, ... effort), shortly křeč: "Byla to jen taková křeč," = "It was merely such a vain effort";
křečovitý smích, úsměv (Lachkrampf, ... laugh, smile);
křečovité chování (unnatural? behaviour);

There is also *psotník* < pes = dog (not a disease of the dogs but an infantile febrile convulsion). Psotník was usually (in 99%) a registered cause of death of the infants in the 19th century. The term is now obsolete but we still say "Dostanu z tebe/z toho psotník" = _"I'll get psotník out of you/out of it."_


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## ThomasK

The association 'cramp' and '(in) vain' is to some extent common, we can say 'een krampachtige poging' indeed; yet it is not always in vain, I think, but of course when we do not try naturally, our chances become smaller. it is more like a last attempt, but it is unclear whether it will also be fruitful. But they're not synonyms in Dutch, I think. (_Verkrampt_ would be outright wrong, almost like 'malformed')

IN general it is* a mind set that does not allow to think and act freely,* that wants to be in control so much that there is no natural  flow. It is a fairly common word in this figurative sense. If anyone can give me the word/ expression for that in his/her language, please do.


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## 810senior

There's no such association in Japanese...


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## ThomasK

yet, I suppose there is a way to say that someone reacts in a non-natural, non-spontaneous, way, and therefore over-reacts/ under-reacts. It must be something like the opposite of 'flow'.


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## Gavril

ThomasK said:


> @Armas: my mistake, I am sorry. Interesting to read that you use a metaphor to describe it [-_istaa_ is probably some kind of intensifying suffix, or isn't it?).



No, -_ista_- is a suffix that derives verbs from nouns or adjectives: _vahvistaa_ "strengthen, confirm" < _vahva_ "strong", _puhdistaa_ "to clean" < _puhdas_ "clean", and so on.


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## ThomasK

Thanks for the information! (BTW: could you imagine words that correspond to what I explain in #19?)


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## Gavril

I can't imagine (at the moment) a specific English word that corresponds to what you mean. I would use a phrase, like "to react in a forced way", or similar.


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## ThomasK

That is about what I mean, indeed. We'll see, thanks!


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## mataripis

Kinisig in Souther Tagalog and  pulikat in common form.


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## ThomasK

Too bad we don't learn anything about the roots of those words, their use (their scope), etc.!


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