# Hindi, Urdu: choor and bhoor



## lcfatima

Aamchoor is a fine powder, but moTichoor laddu has a beady texture. And then there are some Indian dishes labeled bhurji or something. Paneer ki bhurji or anDay ki bhurji. How is something bhoor-ed different than something choor-ed? Are there verbs connected to these terms?


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## lcfatima

Wiki says anDay ka khaagiina is the Urdu term for anDay ki bhurji.


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## Faylasoof

We always use the term <anDay ka khaagiina >. 

Words related to <choor> are <choorā = powder/ crumbs> and <chooran = digestive powder,often with a light aroma>


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## panjabigator

Love chooran!  So tasty 

We say <bhujī> in my house.  Is <khāgīnā> spelled with a /x/?

Careful not to say <chūrā>, as that is a pejorative term for an untouchable caste.


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## Cilquiestsuens

panjabigator said:


> Love chooran! So tasty
> 
> We say <bhujī> in my house. Is <khāgīnā> spelled with a /x/?
> 
> Careful not to say <chūrā>, as that is a pejorative term for an untouchable caste.


 

Yes *<chūRā*> (with a retroflex 'R') is I think a very common insult in Punjab (I don't think it is an Urdu word). It means something like crook, or gypsy, or kanjar ! Here in PK all the chooRe have become christians.

Does this word have any connection with the word chuRail ????


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## panjabigator

Hmmm, no clue.  Many <çūṛe> in India have converted as well but the slur still lives in Panjabi.  I've heard <çuṛā kahī.n kā> many, many times.  Now imagine my shock when I go to India the first time after years and discover that many of the insults (<bha.ngī>, for example) I learned were also low castes!

Crazy.  

No clue about any connection with <chuṛel>.


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## Faylasoof

panjabigator said:


> Love chooran! So tasty
> 
> We say <bhujī> in my house. Is <khāgīnā> spelled with a /x/?
> 
> Careful not to say <chūrā>, as that is a pejorative term for an untouchable caste.


<khāgīnā> is indeed with a <x> -> <xāgīnā> - so no aspirated <k>!

Never knew about this use of <chūrā>! ... and never used it by mistake either!!


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## lcfatima

What about bhoor? Also, there are no verbs for these? So can I pair them with hona/karna?


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## panjabigator

I am unfamiliar with <bhūr>, but I believe <būr> is a word used with ripening mangos, at least in Panjabi.  Sorry I couldn't be of more help.


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## BP.

gator, I've heard a similar word. It sounds like 'boar' in English and is used for mango flowers. Unripe mangos are called *a.mbia* (_meem ghunna_ there!) and *kairi*.

The _*bhoor*_ Icf is referring to is totally novel for me. *choor* isn't of course. It's granules  (powder too?), something more coarse than a *sufoof - سفوف.* Maybe your word has a connection with *bhurbhura* - *بھربھرا*.


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## Faylasoof

Yes, an unripe mango for us too is a _kairi_ - good for making chutney and achār and stored in a <martabān> to mature. 
[مرتبان _martabān_, (masc.) A glazed, earthenware jar for keeping preserves and pickles.]


Never heard of _bhoor*.*_


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## lcfatima

What if bhoor is only with a pesh, no wow?


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## Faylasoof

It still doesn't ring a bell. Words that comes close are:
 <_bhurbhurā_> = crisp/sandy 
AND 
<_bhurbhurān__ā_> = to sprinkle a powdery substance (sugar / salt etc.)


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## panjabigator

I consulted Oxfords dictionary and it confirms Faylasoof's post.

<būr> doesn't seem to be it either.



lcfatima said:


> What if bhoor is only with a pesh, no wow?



Do you mean भुर?  If so, I'm not seeing anything in Oxford's Hindi dictionary.

What was the context of this word?


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## lcfatima

paneer ki bhurji, anday ki bhurji


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## lcfatima

Faylasoof: is there a way to say preserves/jam that is related to that word for vessel?


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## panjabigator

lcfatima said:


> paneer ki bhurji, anday ki bhurji



Ok, right.  I do remember reading that earlier.

Well I can't find <bhujī> (what we say in my house) or <bhurjī> in the dictionary...


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## Faylasoof

lcfatima said:


> Faylasoof: is there a way to say preserves/jam that is related to that word for vessel?


Yes, there is. We call all kinds of jams, compotes and preserves (including marmalades) as <murabbah (masc.) مربہ >. 

In olden times they were prepared, stored / preserved in a <martab_ā_n>. Now we have them ready-made. 

Also, many people are using English words for these as you can see here. In fact, this site specifically uses مربہ for a compote. But given that all these (jams, compotes etc.) are essentially the made the same _basic_ way , we use the term _murabbah_ for all these preparations. However, even us <Urdud_ā_n> have to use the English equivalents now in the shops as some people think a مربہ is something only <hakīms> prepare and has medicinal properties!


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## Illuminatus

The medicinal concoction is _KaDha_. Eg. Tulsi ka KaDha. Vile as hell, supposedly effective...

Something similar to _une tisane_


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## BP.

I made _murabba-e-saib _just a few days ago! In my case it was cooked so long that it became more of a _confiture_ than a _compote_.

Illum, this _kaDha_, is it extracts (Urdu: _'arqiyaat_) of say tulsi or dried/processed leaves/other plant parts? At least it's one of the two that I get when i ask for _une tisane_. A compote would be different - fruit cooked in _sheera_ or caramel for dessert.


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## Illuminatus

Yeah, extracts of medicinal leaves boiled with other stuff. Used as medication.  _Tisane _is more like Herbal Tea, I think. KhaDha has a reputation for generally being vile/pungent (enough to drive diseases away  )though it can be made tolerable.

_Une confiture = _Jam, je croix.


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## BP.

You're right about jam == confiture. _murabba_ could be less coarse and more homogeous if you make it so, hence my calling it confiture in that instance.


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## lcfatima

I guess jauhar joshanda counts as a murabba in this sense even though it is made of jaRi booTi?

I have seen murabba for preserves of fruit often (perhaps on labels), I just couldn't think of the exact word when I saw martabaan.


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## BP.

Jauhar joshaanda is a tisane. You don't see lumps of fruits in it floating around in gooey, slurpy goodness do you!


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## lcfatima

firainch nahi.n seekh raha hai koi yahaan par, please apni guftagoo urdu/hindi tak mahdood rakhiega zara


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## BP.

I thought we have these words all round. Sorry if it isn't the case.

Still, Jauhar joshanda's no murabba!
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_Joshanda


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## Qureshpor

panjabigator said:


> Love chooran!  So tasty
> 
> We say <bhujī> in my house.  Is <khāgīnā> spelled with a /x/?
> 
> Careful not to say <chūrā>, as that is a pejorative term for an untouchable caste.


As already pointed out, the "r" in this word is a retroflex (R). The word is attested in Urdu. It means "a sweeper". (And I believe in Punjabi, there is a tone involved).


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## panjabigator

You're right about the retroflex. Is it a falling tone on the first syllable? Haven't heard it in a while.


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## littlepond

panjabigator said:


> I am unfamiliar with <bhūr>, but I believe <būr> is a word used with ripening mangos, at least in Panjabi.



I don't know if ripening-of-mangoes sense for "buur" is there or not in Hindi, but otherwise "buur" (or "buuR") can be a very vulgar word in Hindi (denoting a part of female anatomy).


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## MonsieurGonzalito

Could bhuur be Bhojpuri for "dawn"?

I just found in this (BTW beautiful) Coke studio song "Iallah"

_bhuur bha'ii par voh naahii aae ...  (Dawn broke, but he didn't come)_

[Coke Studio season 11, 3:33 in the Youtube video]


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## desi4life

MonsieurGonzalito said:


> Could bhuur be Bhojpuri for "dawn"?
> 
> I just found in this (BTW beautiful) Coke studio song "Iallah"
> 
> _bhuur bha'ii par voh naahii aae ...  (Dawn broke, but he didn't come)_
> 
> [Coke Studio season 11, 3:33 in the Youtube video]



bhor means dawn. I haven’t heard bhuur used in that sense.


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