# Danish: altså



## frugihoyi

What does altså mean exactly? My dictionary says that it means "you know," but I see it used in many instances where "you know" wouldn't be used in English. When is altså used?


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## USB-anslutning

The Swedish equivalent (alltså) can also mean "thus" or "so".


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## Andreas_Jensen

"Altså" is kind of a tough one, but what USB says also applies in Danish. I've been thinking of examples and explanations for the word, but it's quite difficult... You use "altså" when you want to confirm or stress something... Or if you want something confirmed.

Examples:

Han kommer altså ikke? - So, he's not coming?

"You're fat!" - "Det er jeg altså ikke! - I am NOT!" - "Det er du altså! - You ARE!!!"

"Jeg vil gerne komme... Altså hvis jeg stadig er velkommen - I would like to come... That is, if I'm still welcome"

"Altså, jeg ved ikke hvad mine planer er for i morgen - Well, I don't know what my plans are for tomorrow"

I'm actually having problem finding an example where I would translate it by "you know"...


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## frugihoyi

Yeah, it really seems like a tough one.


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## valdo

Kansje,
Det er altså bare å akseptere det - it's just, you know, to accept it

men jeg er ikke sikker på det,


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## BoTrojan

Very good examples and guidance have already been given. I must say that I've also seen it used as a filler. That is, when an English speaker might say. "Well ...," or "Ummmm ..." a Dane could use altsaa. One (bad) example that comes to mind:

*"Hvad skal du lave imorgen?"*

*"Altsaa ... det ved jeg sgu' ikke!"*

But as I said, the other uses/examples that have been given are excellent.

God fornoejelse!


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## Andreas_Jensen

valdo said:


> Kansje,
> Det er altså bare at acceptere det - it's just, you know, to accept it
> 
> men jeg er ikke sikker på det,



I've "danified" the spelling to avoid confusion 

I perceive this sentence as "there is nothing you can to do, except to accept it". But we're talking subtleties here...


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## Andreas_Jensen

BoTrojan said:


> Very good examples and guidance have already been given. I must say that I've also seen it used as a filler. That is, when an English speaker might say. "Well ...," or "Ummmm ..." a Dane could use altså. One (bad) example that comes to mind:
> 
> *"Hvad skal du lave imorgen?"*
> 
> *"Altså ... det ved jeg sgu' ikke!"*
> 
> But as I said, the other uses/examples that have been given are excellent.
> 
> God fornøjelse!



Good example! But as this is a language forum I'll have to correct you a little bit, no matter how bad I might feel about it... 

"i morgen" should be two words... as should "i dag", "i aften", "i går" etc. I make mistakes with these things too when not thinking about it, as do thousands of natives every day. I don't know if it used to be okay to write it as one word?

"Sgu" is simply written in this way, without the apostrophe. It wouldn't be weird to me at all if the apostrophe was included in the past (instead of a "d" in "Gud").


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## Sepia

frugihoyi said:


> Yeah, it really seems like a tough one.


 

Yeah, it really seems like a tough one. = OK, det er altså virkelig en af de svære.


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## BoTrojan

Andreas_Jensen said:


> Good example! But as this is a language forum I'll have to correct you a little bit, no matter how bad I might feel about it... quote]
> 
> Don't feel bad.  It's your solemn duty to correct mistakes like this, no matter how big or small.  I would do the same for/to you were this an English language forum.  At least the substance of the post was correct, I guess!
> 
> PS:  I don't have Danish characters handy on my keyboard, so I have to use fascimiles:  aa, oe, ae, etc ...


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## frugihoyi

BoTrojan said:


> Andreas_Jensen said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good example! But as this is a language forum I'll have to correct you a little bit, no matter how bad I might feel about it... quote]
> 
> Don't feel bad. It's your solemn duty to correct mistakes like this, no matter how big or small. I would do the same for/to you were this an English language forum. At least the substance of the post was correct, I guess!
> 
> PS: I don't have Danish characters handy on my keyboard, so I have to use fascimiles: aa, oe, ae, etc ...
> 
> 
> 
> If you're using Windows XP, go in your control panel, choose Regional and Language options, click on th e Languages tab and Details... click on Add and you can add Danish. Then it is very simple to switch between English and Danish: you simply press alt+shift. When you're in Danish mode, the *;* , *'*, and *[* keys become *æ*, *ø*, and *å* respectively.
Click to expand...


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## frugihoyi

To clarify on one of the uses of "altså..."

Kan man bruge det som man gør på engelsk i begyndelsen af en sætening?
f.eks.: 
So where shall we go? -- Hvor skal vi altså hen?
So I don't know what to do nu. -- Jeg ved altså ikke hvad jeg skal gøre nu.


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## Sepia

Maybe we are all on the wrong track trying to find one universal word to substitute or translate "altsaa" in at least the majority of cases.

Maybe it would be better to describe the word as what it is doing - to help the translator to pick the right word for it in each particular situation.

I would describe it as a "pointer" - a word that implies that I consider what I am telling you almost unnecessary to say because you actually already ought to know. Or points to a logical consequense. Any better description? Or stressing a point. If I was to develop a graphic symbol for it, it would really be something like a finger pointing to something - some mental image.

At least one is bound to translate this word in a lot of different ways, depending on the context. And to chose the right word in the target-language, one has to have some universal, non-verbal concept of the meaning of the word in the source-language.


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## BoTrojan

frugihoyi said:


> Kan man bruge det som man gør på engelsk i begyndelsen af en sætening?
> 
> f.eks.:
> So where shall we go? -- Hvor skal vi altså hen?
> So I don't know what to do nu. -- Jeg ved altså ikke hvad jeg skal gøre nu.


 
My non-native opinion is this: Altså *can* be used in the ways/contexts you're suggesting and is absolutely heard/seen in the beginnings of sentences. Having said that, I think Danes would more likely use the expression "*Nåh*" in precisely the contexts you provide.

So where shall go? -- *Nåh, men hvor skal vi hen?* 

It depends a little on what would have been said just prior. I have my own opinions about the differences in practical usage and meaning between *altså* and *nåh*, (to be clear, in some contexts, they would mean very different things and in others they feel to me essentially interchangeable), but I think I'll just leave it there and look forward to hearing what the native Danish speakers think.


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## Sepia

BoTrojan said:


> My non-native opinion is this: Altså *can* be used in the ways/contexts you're suggesting and is absolutely heard/seen in the beginnings of sentences. Having said that, I think Danes would more likely use the expression "*Nåh*" in precisely the contexts you provide.
> 
> So where shall go? -- *Nåh, men hvor skal vi hen?*
> 
> It depends a little on what would have been said just prior. I have my own opinions about the differences in practical usage and meaning between *altså* and *nåh*, (to be clear, in some contexts, they would mean very different things and in others they feel to me essentially interchangeable), but I think I'll just leave it there and look forward to hearing what the native Danish speakers think.




Huh? I don't really see what the two have to do with each other. Can you give us an example where the two would be exchangable? Or what exactly are you aiming at?
In the contexts provided till now - sure you might in some of them use "*nåh"*_ in stead of _"*altså"*_, _but the meaning would be different. You wouldn't even use the same intonation.


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## Sepia

frugihoyi said:


> BoTrojan said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you're using Windows XP, go in your control panel, choose Regional and Language options, click on th e Languages tab and Details... click on Add and you can add Danish. Then it is very simple to switch between English and Danish: you simply press alt+shift. When you're in Danish mode, the *;* , *'*, and *[* keys become *æ*, *ø*, and *å* respectively.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sure, every Windows since 3.1 has that feature. Still doesn't change your reflexes while writing fast on the keyboard.
Click to expand...


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## BoTrojan

Sepia said:


> Huh? I don't really see what the two have to do with each other. Can you give us an example where the two would be exchangable? Or what exactly are you aiming at?
> In the contexts provided till now - sure you might in some of them use "*nåh"*_ in stead of _"*altså"*_, _but the meaning would be different. You wouldn't even use the same intonation.


 
My main point was that in the precise context provided:

... So, where shall we go ...

I believe you'd likely hear Danes say -- depending on lots of factors, the context, what had just been said, etc:

*Nåh ... hvor skal vi hen?*

This is really meant to be instructive for people learning the language. So imagine a scenario where a group of people agrees to meet somewhere prior to a night out on the town with no set itinerary. They do all finally meet, have some banter for a while, and then someone says: "OK, so, where shall we go?"

The question is ... how would you, as a native, express that thought in Danish? Would you be most likely to say:

*"Hvor skal vi hen, altså?" *

*or*

*"Nåh ... hvor skal vi hen?"*

or something else altogether? Might it be either, depending on a variety of factors. How precisely would the two mean different things? I'm really just asking the question. 

By the way, I believe I clearly qualified my opinion as that of a non-native speaker and also very clearly said we should hear what the natives would have to say on the subject. 

I guess I didn't qualify my statement quite enough, eh?


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## Sepia

BoTrojan said:


> My main point was that in the precise context provided:
> 
> ... So, where shall we go ...
> 
> I believe you'd likely hear Danes say -- depending on lots of factors, the context, what had just been said, etc:
> 
> *Nåh ... hvor skal vi hen?*
> 
> This is really meant to be instructive for people learning the language. So imagine a scenario where a group of people agrees to meet somewhere prior to a night out on the town with no set itinerary. They do all finally meet, have some banter for a while, and then someone says: "OK, so, where shall we go?"
> 
> The question is ... how would you, as a native, express that thought in Danish? Would you be most likely to say:
> 
> *"Hvor skal vi hen, altså?" *
> 
> *or*
> 
> *"Nåh ... hvor skal vi hen?"*
> 
> or something else altogether? Might it be either, depending on a variety of factors. How precisely would the two mean different things? I'm really just asking the question.
> 
> By the way, I believe I clearly qualified my opinion as that of a non-native speaker and also very clearly said we should hear what the natives would have to say on the subject.
> 
> I guess I didn't qualify my statement quite enough, eh?



Few people would put the words in that order:

*"Hvor skal vi hen, altså?" 
*
More likely: *"Alts**å, **hvor skal vi hen?"

*I am not saying the first one wouldn't be possible, but I can't tell for sure I've ever heard it. 

*"Nåh ... hvor skal vi hen?"

*is OK but the two are definitely not interchangable. Using "altså" would definitely indicate that you are starting to lose patience - like when you are with a group of people, you have agreed to go out on the town and people keep talking without really getting to the point and decident where you are going -  whereas starting with, 

"Nåh, men hvor skal vi hen" 

is more like "I'm humbly asking this question - maybe one of you already has an idea".

So I don't think "likely" is of any relevance here, rather than "what exactly do you want to express".


So in these examples the difference lies in

impatiene vs. humbly asking

That is an important difference, I should say.

In other cases the "pointer" may indicate other things. This is why I tend to explain that word as a pointer that is supposed to direct attention to the statement it is connected to. How to translate it then depends on the context.


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## BoTrojan

Great answer.  That will help newcomers to Danish quite a bit.


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## Sepia

BoTrojan said:


> Great answer. That will help newcomers to Danish quite a bit.


 
You are welcome. But please tell me: Was it the "graphic" description of the word that helped you more, or was it the examples - or the combination that helped you more?

I have various good reasons for wanting to know that - but if you want to answer this you'd probably better PM me because it is more or less off-topic.


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