# Dos est magna parentium virtus.



## dcx97

Hello,

Could someone translate "Dos est magna parentium virtus." for me please? If "magna" is an adjective describing "dos", then shouldn't it have been "Manga dos est parentium virtus."?
And if "parentium" is the genitive plural of "parens" (meaning "parent"), then shouldn't it have been "parentum"?

Thanks.


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## P2Grafn0l

I think it means this: 

_The dowry is the great virtue of the obedient [ones]._

*Parentium *(genitive plural adjective) = of the obedient [ones]. 
*Parentum* (genitive plural noun) = of the parents.


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## Scholiast

salvete omnes amici!

@dcx97

May we know the source, and the context, please?


P2Grafn0l said:


> The dowry is the great virtue of the obedient [ones].



P2Grafn01 in #2 has, I fear, misconstrued things_._ Of course the word _parentium_ could in theory be the genitive plural of the present participle of _pārēre_, 'to obey'; but in the context of _dos_ it is much likelier to be that of _parĕns_, 'parent'. _dos_, in the sense of 'dowry', is an essential and technical term in the formal language of Roman marital law, so _prima facie_ it should involve the _parĕntes_, the 'parents', particularly the bride's _paterfamilias_.

The words, which, though differently pronounced, will appear as homographs in modern printing, are both susceptible in the genitive plural (by a rhetorical figure called _syncope_) to reduction from _parentium_ to _parentum_, especially in verse.

Therefore without knowing more about the origin of the phrase, it is impossible to be sure.

Σ


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## P2Grafn0l

Scholiast said:


> P2Grafn01 in #2 has, I fear, misconstrued things_._



*Dowry* = _Money or property brought by a bride to her husband at marriage._

I am not that sure, but I thought it said for women 'how to be of great virtue' in such a situation. As the woman used to be obedient to the man, at that time.


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## dcx97

It just occurred to me that the if "parentium" were the genitive plural of the present active participle from "parere" meaning "to beget", it would be "parientium", because "parere" is a third conjugation -io verb. Thus "I beget" is "pario", not "paro".


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## Scholiast

Greetings once more.


P2Grafn0l said:


> *Dowry* = _Money or property brought by a bride to her husband at marriage._


I think we all know that.


dcx97 said:


> "parere" meaning "to beget", it would be "parientium"


_pario_, _parere_ does not mean 'to beget'. It means 'to give birth'. This, in most species including our own, as far as I know, is the prerogative of the female.
dcx97 has still not provided us with a context for the phrase under discussion. Perhaps in his next post he could oblige?
Σ


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## dcx97

It was written on the first page of "Ad Infinitum: A Biography of Latin" by Nicholas Ostler where he dedicates the book to his parents.


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## Scholiast

Greetings again

In that case (# 7) _parentium_ is undoubtedly '[of] parents'.

_Dos_ is not necessarily 'dowry'—it can be here better rendered as 'endowment': '[My] parents' excellence is a great endowment'.

Σ


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## dcx97

The only problem is that if it meant "of parents" it would have had to be "parientium".


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## fdb

Scholiast is right, of course. parentium is genitive plural of parens.


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## dcx97

fdb said:


> Scholiast is right, of course. parentium is genitive plural of parens.



Indeed. However, parens could not have been derived from parere, which means "to give birth to". It could only have been derived from pārēre, meaning "to appear" or "to obey".


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## Scholiast

dcx97 said:


> It could only have been derived from pārēre, meaning "to appear" or "to obey".


No it cannot. _parens _has a short _a_ (_părens_), as in e.g. Virg. _Aen. _4.365, 'nec tibi diva parens generis...' &c.
Σ


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## dcx97

The plot thickens.

By the way, "dos" can also mean "gift". Merriam-Webster's Third International Dictionary says so.


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## Scholiast

Greetings again


dcx97 said:


> The plot thickens.
> 
> By the way, "dos" can also mean "gift"



The _OLD_ (_Oxford Latin Dictionary _(1968)), more modern than L&S, states _s.v._ _parens_:

'app[arently] old aorist p[artici]ple of PARIO'.​
Which makes perfect sense. In the classical period still, there were some stems and inflexions which were somewhat 'fluid', even in mainstream writers such as Cicero or Sallust. But by this period (i.e. the 1st century BC), _parens_ = 'parent' has in any case become a noun independent of its origins. _OLD_ supplies instances from Cicero, Horace, Livy, Quintilian and others. That's good enough for me.

Σ


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## dcx97

Thank you very much!


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