# elvész, elvesz, elveszik?



## bibax

Móra Ferenc: A CSALÓ

Egyszerre aztán Pétör *elvész*, s néha öt perc is beletelik, mire újra felbukkan kócos buksija a látóhatáron.
Egyszerre aztán Pétör *elvesz*, s néha öt perc is beletelik, mire újra felbukkan kócos buksija a látóhatáron.

In my textbook (Maďarština pro samouky, 1968):

Egyszerre aztán Péter *elveszik*, s néha öt perc is beletelik, mire újra felbukkan kócos feje a látóhatáron.

Which form is correct. According to my dictionary, elv*é*sz is correct (inf. elv*e*szni, with short *e*). I suppose it means that "Péter disappears/is disappearing" (present tense) and not something else.


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## arlett

Hello bibax,

In my opinion, they are all fine to use.
Originally, the correct form is *elvész* - though I must admit, it sounds literary and somewhat old-fashioned (to me at least), but it's grammatical.
*Elvesz* is not the most natural-sounding in your example above, but it's deemed correct. 
*Elveszik* is fine and that's what I would use in normal speech (though in your example elvész sounds fine as the whole sentence is a little stilted.)

However, *elvesz* or *elveszik* can be tricky as the verbs *elveszni* (to get lost or disappear) and *elvenni* (to take away / snatch) can be conjugated similarly, so the exact meaning depends on the context.

The meanings are:

elvész - he/she disappears
elvesz - 1) he/she disappears 2) he/she takes sg away
elveszik - 1 ) he/she disappears 2) they take sg away

Even with that, I suggest that you use *elveszik* instead of *elvész *as the latter has a little old-fashioned ring to it.


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## bibax

Thanks. So Móra Ferenc originally used the form *elvész* and the author of the texbook (Blaskovics József) deliberately changed it to the more natural-sounding form *elveszik*. IMHO *elveszik* is more regular than *elvész* (elveszni: elveszek, elveszel, elveszik, ..., elvesztem, elvesznék, no other form with long *é*, only elv*é*sz), elveszni/elveszik looks like a common regular _ik_-verb.

EDIT: Now I've realized that the 1st person sing. would have to be *elveszem* (_ik_-verb), not *elveszek*. Which form is correct?


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## Torontal

I agree with arlett.
*
Elvész* is imo more archaic or literary but all 3 are correct. I think to _be/get lost _is a slightly more accurate translation, _disappear _is rather _eltűnik_.

It is not a true ikes verb, *elveszik *is considered to be a vernacular form, but to be honest, it sounds to be the most natural to my ears.

But as it is not a real ikes verb, _elveszem _is incorrect in 1st person singular.

The present indicative conjucation is:

sing:
1. *elveszek *
2. *elveszel *
3. *elvesz/elvész/elveszik* (all 3 are theoretically correct)

plural:
1. _*elveszünk*_
2. *elvesztek*
3. *elvesznek *


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