# Icelandic: Sérhljóðar teljast þessir stafir



## Alxmrphi

> *1. *   Enska stafrófið er mjög svipað því íslenska. Í því eru þó engir broddstafir og ekki heldur  íslensku stafirnir ð, þ, ö, æ. Í enska stafrófinu eru tuttugu og sex stafir.
> *
> Sérhljóðar *teljast þessir stafir*: *a e i o u (y)​          Allir aðrir bókstafir tákna samhljóð. *
> 
> ATH.* y er gjarnan  talið með samhljóðum. Það er samhljóði í upphafi orða.


In my quest to learn words related to describing language I thought I'd pick an article aimed at Icelanders about basic English, and it's thrown some questions up that I'd like to ask about.

I thought *hljóð *was a neuter word, one that wouldn't change in the plural but the bold I've put in bold has an -*ar *ending, and I don't know what that means as it's not an article (which would be -(i)ð and -(i)n) so I don't know why it's not just *sérhljóð*.

But again, in the _*Note*_ part it says "*Það er samhljóði í upphafi orða*" (It is a consonant at the beginning of a word), it almost seems as if the writer is treating it as a weak masculine noun, but I've never seen this, is it correct? It just seems so sporadic because it's back to being neuter in the part "*Allir aðrir bókstafir tákna samhljóð*"

Last thing, would the translation of *heldur *in the first line be *contain *in English?

Takk aftur.


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## Silver_Biscuit

Maybe *heldur* _does_ mean *contains*, but I initially read it as a conjunction. From what I've seen, *heldur* usually means *rather*/*but* (bókin er ekki rauð heldur græn - the book is not red but green), but in this case I think it means *either* or *nor* (and it doesn't have these Icelandic letters either / nor these Icelandic letters). I think if it was a form of *halda* then it would be more natural to have *ekki* after rather than before. Please, anyone correct me if I'm wrong, though.

I have no idea about the apparent gender switching - that does seem very odd.


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## Tazzler

_Ekki heldur_ here means _neither_. To be precise, _innihalda_ is the word for _to contain_. 

Anyway, a _samhljóð_ is a sound, a _samhljóði_ is a letter that betokens a consonant sound.


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## Alxmrphi

Tazzler said:


> _Ekki heldur_ here means _neither_. To be precise, _innihalda_ is the word for _to contain_.



Thanks Tazzler!
How would you translate the first line? There's no way I can think of that sounds good using _neither_ 



> Anyway, a _samhljóð_ is a sound, a _samhljóði_ is a letter  that betokens a consonant sound.


Thanks! Makes perfect sense! 
The article goes on to use samhljóðarframburð, would this be equal to samhljóð (i.e. representing a sound), actually I suppose I can understand the difference, one focusing more on the pronunciation of the sound and the other representing the more _auditory_ quality of it.

Thanks again for the clarification!


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## Silver_Biscuit

You could translate it as neither like this: 'In it, though, there are no accented letters and neither [are there] the Icelandic letters ð, þ, ö, æ.' It requires some slight repetition to make it work in English. Or you could jig it around and use a construction with 'either'.


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## Alxmrphi

Ah so _that's _what *broddstafir *means, I couldn't find it, I just assumed it was _letters_, thanks for that! I interpreted it as _there are no more (quantity) than in Icelandic and it doesn't contain the letters þ ð ö æ_ etc... but realising it means accented letters and using *neither*, I can see how it makes sense there.


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## kepulauan

Alxmrphi said:


> The article goes on to use samhljóðarframburð,


Hljóði is a masculine word so there is no _r_ in singular form.

For extra information, a diphthong is called tvíhljóð.


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## Alxmrphi

pollodia said:


> Hljóði is a masculine word so there is no _r_ in singular form.



Woops that's my typing error! I was thinking masculine plural and I think that I subconsciously added an *-ar*, I should have realised the singular form of *framburð* would have made it incorrect.



> For extra information, a diphthong is called tvíhljóð.


So that's the sound, does it have a masculine counterpart representing the letter that represents the sound (like sérhljóð / sérhljóði) ?
Thanks for your input!


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## sindridah

Pollodia ég er ekki alveg að skilja þar sem hljóð er auðvitað hvorugkynsorð og er þá væntanlega hljóði í þgf, er ég eitthvað að misskilja bigtime ?


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## kepulauan

sindridah said:


> Pollodia ég er ekki alveg að skilja þar sem  hljóð er auðvitað hvorugkynsorð og er þá væntanlega hljóði í þgf, er ég  eitthvað að misskilja bigtime ?


Neinei, stafurinn sem táknar hljóð(hk) er kallaður hljóði(kk), eða þannig skil ég það.




Alxmrphi said:


> So that's the sound, does it have a masculine counterpart representing the letter that represents the sound (like sérhljóð / sérhljóði) ?


That's what I've been going with.


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## Alxmrphi

> Enska stafrófið er mjög svipað því íslenska. Í  því eru þó engir broddstafir og ekki heldur  íslensku stafirnir ð, þ,  ö, æ. Í enska stafrófinu eru tuttugu og sex stafir.
> 
> Sérhljóðar teljast þessir stafir*: *a e i o u (y)​          Allir aðrir bókstafir tákna samhljóð. *
> 
> ATH.* y er gjarnan  talið með samhljóðum. Það er samhljóði í upphafi  orða.





> The English alphabet is rather similar to the Icelandic one. In it there aren't any accented characters and neither does it have the Icelandic letters ð þ ö æ. In the English alphabet there are 26 letters.
> 
> The letters that represent vowels (sérhljóðar - m,pl) are considered to be: *a e i o u (y)*.
> All other letters represent consonants (i.e. the *sounds*, samhljóð, n, pl).
> 
> *Note:* y is typically classed as a letter that represents a consonant (samhljóðum, m, pl, dative). It is a letter that represents a consonant (samhljóði, m, sg) at the beginning of a word.


Just to recap, I think I can be pretty sure of it, I hope to anyone who  might not fully understand it (i.e. reading in the future) finds this is  helpful.
The parts in the light coloured text is just to illustrate what could be said to avoid any confusion, I know by form you can't tell the plural dative of any gender, but I think I'm correct in assuming this is masculine, given it's talking about a letter that represents a sound.

I'd love it if someone can confirm my labelling of what the words are. 
Obviously in normal English it'd just be the normal coloured text, but to highlight the differences I've included the grey just to further express the difference.


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## sindridah

where is polladia ???


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## Alxmrphi

sindridah said:


> where is polladia ???



He'll be back to save us soon.


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## sindridah

i wish i could help , but i just dont have any idea of what you are asking for


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## kepulauan

All seems to add up, yes. The teacher of that course knows what he's doing apparently, I always use the masculine nouns.


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