# Congratulations to the survivors (last heroes)!



## macdevster

To express "congratulations," it's Поздравляю *кому*, right?  So to say "Congratulations to the last heroes," would this be correct: 

*Поздравляю последным героям!*

Thanks!


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## morzh

No.

Поздравлять - КОГО.

I congratulate the last heroes.

*Поздравляю последних героев!

*(it is more like "I congratulate you"). *

But - *"Congratulations to the last heroes," *Поздравления последним героям!

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*PS. Anyway, the phrase does not sound Russian at all, but grammatically it is OK. I don't think in Russia it would be put like this.


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## macdevster

Thanks!  It's just for announcing the winners of a game in class.  The game happened to be called "Survivor," although I used Последный Герой since that's the Russian Survivor equivalent.  Many thanks for your help.


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## Awwal12

> Последный Герой


"Последн*и*й", for the God's sake, since "последный" means "placental" (adj., whelping/calving term, from "послед"). 
Also "Congratulations (to...)!" is better to translate as a personal sentence: "Поздравляю / поздравляем (кого-л.)!"


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## morzh

macdevster said:


> I used Последный Герой since that's the Russian Survivor equivalent.  Many thanks for your help.



*Absolutely wrong. (*Just noticed that). Who gave you this idea?

In Russian "Hero"="Герой" and nothing else!
Survivor - Выживший.

He survived the catastrophe - он выжил в катастрофе.
He is a plane crash survivor - он пережил крушение самолета / он выжил при крушении самолета / он - выживший при крушении самолета.

SO, in your case:

*Поздравления выжившим*.

DO not use "heroes".


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## Awwal12

Morzh, you aren't completely right, since the combination "последний герой" surely gives necessary associations nowadays. But on the other hand, I'm not sure how much suitable it is to call survivors in the class game that way. That seems way too figurative, to put it mildly.
P.S.: And I insist on using either of "Поздравляю выживших!" or at least of "Мои поздравления выжившим!"  Just "Поздравления выжившим!" sounds sort of clumsy, I believe. (P.P.S.: Maybe because it's unclear is it "поздравления" or "поздравление" when you hear it.)


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## macdevster

Nope, it's actually called *Последний герой* (corrected spelling change!!!). Here's a blurb from its Wikipedia entry and a link to the page:


*Last Hero* (Russian: Последний герой _Poslednij geroj_) is the Russian version of American reality show, _Survivor_. The first season was in 2001, and the latest started on 16 November 2008.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_Hero


I don't think I was terribly clear about the origins of the name of the game.  Sorry for any misunderstanding.  (That said, I love that I have a sign up in my room congratulating our placental heros!  I'll have to replace it when I get a moment.)


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## morzh

macdevster said:


> Nope, it's actually called *Последний герой* (corrected spelling change!!!). Here's a blurb from its Wikipedia entry and a link to the page:
> 
> 
> *Last Hero* (Russian: Последний герой _Poslednij geroj_) is the Russian version of American reality show, _Survivor_. The first season was in 2001, and the latest started on 16 November 2008.
> 
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_Hero
> 
> 
> I don't think I was terribly clear about the origins of the name of the game.  Sorry for any misunderstanding.  (That said, I love that I have a sign up in my room congratulating our placental heros!  I'll have to replace it when I get a moment.)



But "Герой" is not "Survivor".

Russians are also known for funny translations of American/English movie titles, game show names etc.
So what you think is a translation, is actually "free interpretation".
I would refer you to on of the discussions in this forum, of how movie titles are translated.
Example: "*The Expendables*" - Russian title "*Неудержимые*". The latter means "*Unstoppables*".


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## Scyl_la

We'd call them winners instead of survivors; at least the most common thing I heard at such games when I was at school was "Поздравляем победителей!".


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## morzh

Scyl_la said:


> We'd call them winners instead of survivors; at least the most common thing I heard at such games when I was at school was "Поздравляем победителей!".



Well, the game is called "Survivor", so the winner - "победитель" in this gave has a particular name - "survivor". Which is "Выживший" in Russian.

Same as winners of "Конкурс Чайковского" (or winners of some prizes, like The Nobel prize) are called "лауреаты", not "победители в конкурсе на Нобелевскую премию".


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## Scyl_la

Well, in this case they will be "выжившие" )), you're right. Though it sounds a little scary in Russian.
If it goes about a very hard contest or game we can say "поздравляю тех, кто дожил до конца" though it's a bit long.
"Лауреаты" is a different case; it doesn't depend on the name of the contest or the award. Anyone who gets an award for literature, science etc. can be called with this word. If you speak about the Nobel prize there is no special contest for that so they can't be called winners ).


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## Sobakus

I don't see anything wrong with последние герои, it has become quite a stable expression already and wouldn't cause misunderstanding.


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## morzh

Sobakus said:


> I don't see anything wrong with последние герои, it has become quite a stable expression already and wouldn't cause misunderstanding.




I see nothing wrong with it either.

But the initial and the subsequent posts by the author had some misconceptions which I have been trying to correct.

I see nothing wrong with calling any game winner "A hero", or, for that matter, with painting a tank pink and calling it  "a stroller", as long as the people doing these verbal manipulations are aware of the nature of the things they are manipulating. 

Otherwise one may really think that "герой" is Russian for "survivor", and that a tank is really just a large pram.

As Jesus Christ said to someone, "If you know what you are doing, be blessed; if not - be damned".


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## Wertis

macdevster said:


> To express "congratulations," it's Поздравляю *кому*, right?  So to say "Congratulations to the last heroes," would this be correct:
> 
> *Поздравляю последным героям!*
> 
> Thanks!



*Поздравляю последних героев.* 
*Поздравления последним героям.* 

They both mean the same thing. The first one is more personal, the second one is more official. Notice, by the way, how endings and cases change.


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## macdevster

morzh said:


> I see nothing wrong with it either.
> 
> But the initial and the subsequent posts by the author had some misconceptions which I have been trying to correct.
> 
> I see nothing wrong with calling any game winner "A hero", or, for that matter, with painting a tank pink and calling it  "a stroller", as long as the people doing these verbal manipulations are aware of the nature of the things they are manipulating.
> 
> Otherwise one may really think that "герой" is Russian for "survivor", and that a tank is really just a large pram.
> 
> As Jesus Christ said to someone, "If you know what you are doing, be blessed; if not - be damned".




Hehe Thanks for your efforts.  To everyone, really.  I do love this forum.

Just for the record, I did know that герой meant "hero," but I used it to go with the TV show theme of the game we played in class.  My students get the difference as well -- it was a good lesson on cultural differences and linguistic acrobatics that adults exploit for commercial gain (at least in this case).  Not sure my 16 and 17 year old kids really grasp it, but they will someday.


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## Saluton

morzh said:


> *Absolutely wrong. (*Just noticed that). Who gave you this idea?
> 
> In Russian "Hero"="Герой" and nothing else!
> Survivor - Выживший.
> 
> He survived the catastrophe - он выжил в катастрофе.
> He is a plane crash survivor - он пережил крушение самолета / он выжил при крушении самолета / он - выживший при крушении самолета.
> 
> SO, in your case:
> 
> *Поздравления выжившим*.
> 
> DO not use "heroes".


Macdevster is not entirely incorrect because what does the phrase *последний герой* mean? It means the last one who survived, the last man standing. Not the one who survived a plane crash, perhaps, but rather the one who survived a war, or the apocalypse, or living on a deserted island. That is, one who has the right to be called a hero. Hence the name of the reality show because its winner was called the *последний герой*, i.e. the message of the name is pretty much the same as that of "Survivor".


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## Slavianophil

morzh said:


> *Absolutely wrong. (*Just noticed that). Who gave you this idea?
> 
> In Russian "Hero"="Герой" and nothing else!
> Survivor - Выживший.
> 
> He survived the catastrophe - он выжил в катастрофе.
> He is a plane crash survivor - он пережил крушение самолета / он выжил при крушении самолета / он - выживший при крушении самолета.
> 
> SO, in your case:
> 
> *Поздравления выжившим*.
> 
> DO not use "heroes".


 

Everyone who has ever worked as a translator (as your humble servant has done for the latest twenty-something years) knows that translation of a particular word or phrase depends very much on the context.

If the asker wants his 'survivors' to be understood as an allusion to the (very silly) show that is known as 'The Survivor' in the US and as "Последний герой" in Russia, that he should say: "Привет последним героям!" Otherwise his allusion will not be understood.

There is hardly a single word in any language that MUST always be translated by the one and the same equivalent in any other language.

'Our last supper with Masha' should be translated as "наш последний ужин с Машей". But an icon of Last Supper is to be translated "икона Тайной Вечери" although "last" does not normally mean "тайный". Similarly, if the word 'survivor' does not normally have the same meaning as the Russian word "герой" (and sometimes can have quite the opposite meaning!), in this particular context it has to be translated as "последний герой".

This is the ABC of translation, so let us not forget it.


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