# machista/machistas



## Mrtnswe

Hola a todos.

Estoy atorado en esta idea.
Intento escribir la siguiente frase en inglés pero no encuentro la palabra para "machista" o "machistas" ... 

La frase sería: 

"Muchas familias en latinoamerica son machistas y el machismo se acepta como algo natural; sin embargo en el ambiente laboral o de negocios una persona machista no es tan aceptado"

Mi intento sería:

"several families in Latin America are *machists(??) *and machismo is widely accepted as natural; however, in working or business environment a *machist (???)* may not be likely accepted" 

Agradezco todas las sugerencias mientras contengan las palabras que necesito en negrita.

Gracias de antemano
Saludos.


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## Guillo1

No, "machist" no es una palabra en inglés. Hoy en día en USA se entiende lo que quiere decir machismo, por lo cual traducirlo con la onda "Machismo is very common in..."
Otras opciones son "male centric", "male dominated", o usar "chauvinistic".


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## Mirlo

I will put :... *live under the* machismo custom/use the* machismo/male chauvinistic *way of living/(or a simple) *sexist* or machismo is very comong among several Latin American families...

Espero ayude,


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## Outsider

Mrtnswe said:


> "Muchas familias en latinoamerica son machistas y el machismo se acepta como algo natural; sin embargo en el ambiente laboral o de negocios una persona machista no es tan aceptado"


Could you explain a bit what you mean by _machistas_?


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## albertovidal

*"sexist", "male chauvinist"*


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## Guillo1

"several families in Latin America are *male chauvinistic *and machismo is widely accepted as natural; however, in working or business environment a *male chauvinist* may not be likely accepted"

Sin confirmación de un nativo, eso es lo mejor que se me ocurre sin apartarse demasiado de la oración original.


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## Mirlo

Con todo respeto:
I don't think you can use in that way.... 
You can say than *a person* is a male chauvinistic, but not sevral families...
male=one


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## Canela Mad

Sexist, chauvinist (see the false cognates dictionary for this one).


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## aurilla

I suggest Many Latin American families are "male-dominated", or have a "male-dominated structure."


"Many families in Latin America are* male-dominated*, a strucutre that is widely accepted as natural; however, in a work or business environment *male dominance /chauvinism* may not be likely accepted.


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## Outsider

I think "sexist" is a good choice, though it would be nice to know more about the context.


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## Mirlo

Canela Mad said:


> Sexist, chauvinist (see the false cognates dictionary for this one).


 Yes, you can use sexist or *chauvinist* but not with the "male" in it.


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## Mrtnswe

Muchas gracias a todos.
Han sido de gran ayuda.

Saludos.


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## albertovidal

Guillo1 said:


> "several families in Latin America are *male chauvinistic *and machismo is widely accepted as natural; however, in working or business environment a *male chauvinist* may not be likely accepted"
> 
> Sin confirmación de un nativo, eso es lo mejor que se me ocurre sin apartarse demasiado de la oración original.



*"male chauvinistic"(?)*


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## Guillo1

albertovidal said:


> *"male chauvinistic"(?)*



Mencionaron arriba que chauvinist solo se entiende como machismo, así que el uso del "male" no sería necesario. Yo no estoy muy seguro de eso, ya que "chauvinismo" se refiere a un nacionalismo exacerbado, un desprecio de lo extranjero. No necesariamente machismo. Pero, natives know best. A lo mejor ellos lo usan solamente en el sentido de machista.


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## Mrtnswe

Ahora estoy confundido.
Male chauvinist es redundante?!?!? ..


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## Mirlo

Mrtnswe said:


> Ahora estoy confundido.
> Male chauvinist es redundante?!?!? ..


NO male chauvinist sólo se refiere a una persona:
He is a male chauvinst
La acción se llama sexismo o machismo


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## albertovidal

No sólo es un nacionalismo exacerbado. También se utiliza como "machista".
Te paso el link
Saludos

http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexismo#Sexismo_contra_las_mujeres


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## Mirlo

Si, pero no se discute la palabra en español la cuestión es la traducción. 
No hemos coreregido su oración original en la cual se utiliza machista..
Solo digo esto para aclarar y no confundir mas a la persona.


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## albertovidal

Ok. Then let's say we can use *"male sexism"* for "machismo" and *"male sexist" *for "machista" and it would be correct.


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## Mirlo

albertovidal said:


> Ok. Then let's say we can use *"male sexism"* for "machismo" and *"male sexist" *for "machista" and it would be correct.


OMG, Alberto la oración dice *Latin American families.* El punto es no se puede usar *male sexism* para esto.


> "Muchas familias en latinoamerica son machistas...


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## albertovidal

Mirlo said:


> OMG, Alberto la oración dice *Latin American families.* El punto es no se puede usar *male sexism* para esto.



I agree. "Male sexism" is "machismo".
But I can say* "many Latin American families are male sexist"* meaning "muchas familias latino americanas son machistas"


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## Mirlo

albertovidal said:


> I agree. "Male sexism" is "machismo".
> But I can say* "many Latin American families are male sexist"* meaning "muchas familias latino americanas son machistas"


No, en inglés no se puede decir de esta manera.
En inglés es solo *sexism or chauvinism* .


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## albertovidal

Mirlo said:


> No, en inglés no se puede decir de esta manera.
> En inglés es solo *sexism or chauvinism* .



Sorry to disagree with you:

http://www.wordreference.com/es/translation.asp?tranword=sexist


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## Doval

¿Puedo dar mi aporte?





Mrtnswe said:


> Hola a todos.
> 
> Estoy atorado en esta idea.
> Intento escribir la siguiente frase en inglés pero no encuentro la palabra para "machista" o "machistas" ...
> 
> La frase sería:
> 
> "Muchas familias en latinoamerica son machistas y el machismo se acepta como algo natural; sin embargo en el ambiente laboral o de negocios una persona machista no es tan aceptado"
> 
> Mi intento sería:
> 
> "several families in Latin America are *machists(??) *and machismo is widely accepted as natural; however, in working or business environment a *machist (???)* may not be likely accepted"
> 
> Agradezco todas las sugerencias mientras contengan las palabras que necesito en negrita.
> 
> Gracias de antemano
> Saludos.


Many families in Latin America are male-dominated, and machismo is widely accepted as natural; however, in a work or business environment a male chauvinist is not well accepted.

La base de mi aporte:
"Muchas" = "many"
"Several" = "varias"

También:  Aunque Aurilla ya corrigió la primera parte de tu frase, ella dejó la última parte sin cambios.  No obstante, ese último segmento también tiene errores.

No es correcto decir "may not be likely accepted."  En inglés correcto, eso sería "is unlikely/not likely to be accepted", o sea, "es probable que no sea aceptado".

Por eso mi versión.


albertovidal said:


> Ok. Then let's say we can use *"male sexism"* for "machismo" and *"male sexist" *for "machista" and it would be correct.





Mirlo said:


> No, en inglés no se puede decir de esta manera.
> En inglés es solo *sexism or chauvinism* .


If I understand Mirlo correctly, she means to say that in English we say "sexist" or "male chauvinist," but "male sexist" sounds very odd.  I hope I got that right.


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## Mirlo

albertovidal said:


> Sorry to disagree with you:
> 
> http://www.wordreference.com/es/translation.asp?tranword=sexist


No se a que te refieres:

English: employment - chauvinist 

No: *male* chauvinist

Además lo que pones se refiere a una persona...no a muchas como aclarado.


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## Mirlo

> If I understand Mirlo correctly, she means to say that in English we say "sexist" or "male chauvinist," but "male sexist" sounds very odd. I hope I got that right.


Yes, and the fact that you can not use the word *male *when refering to a group: "Latin American families"

Thanks,


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## Outsider

It also seems to me that the phrase "male chauvinist" can only be used as a noun, while the translation of _machista_ in this case would have to be an adjective... What do others think?


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## Mrtnswe

Wow .. sigo sin tener claridad. 
Hay alguna forma de decirlo en inglés formal sin pasar por slang o particularidades de cada pais/región?? .. 

Gracias de todos modos, agradezco sus esfuerzos.
Saludos.


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## Doval

Outsider said:


> It also seems to me that the phrase "male chauvinist" can only be used as a noun, while the translation of _machista_ in this case would have to be an adjective... What do others think?


Actually, Outsider, "chauvinist" can be both a noun and an adjective. (The adjective form is either "chauvinist" or "chauvinistic.") The problem is that "chauvinist" does not mean "machista"; it means showing or tending towards extreme patriotism or partiality to one's group. Hence, "male chauvinism" is an extreme male-centric point of view. In the case of my offering, "male chauvinist" (n) is meant to be a translation of "persona machista."

Edit: It occurs to me that in the phrase "male chauvinist" (as used in my translation), "male" is an adjective and "chauvinist" is a noun. (In contrast, in the phrase "persona machista," "persona" is a noun" and "machista" is an adjective. You can conceivably have a "male chauvinist" (adj.) group, but when referring to a society or segment of a society as a unit, it's more common to say "male-dominated" or "male-centric."



Mrtnswe said:


> Wow .. sigo sin tener claridad.
> Hay alguna forma de decirlo en inglés formal sin pasar por slang o particularidades de cada pais/región?? ..
> 
> Gracias de todos modos, agradezco sus esfuerzos.
> Saludos.


La traducción que aporté yo (y otras que vi por aquí) está libre de "slang o particularidades de cada país/región".


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## Mrtnswe

Gracias por su ayuda.


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## Outsider

Doval said:


> Actually, Outsider, "chauvinist" can be both a noun and an adjective.


I meant the whole phrase, "male chauvinist", which I believe can only be used as a noun phrase, and not as an adjective phrase. And — though we never got a clarification from Mrtnswe as to what he meant — I would say that a "male chauvinist" does indeed mean _machista_. However, in this case "sexist" fits the sentence better, and means essentially the same.

I suppose there is also a valid point, that several posters have made, that in English "male chauvinist" implies or suggests a male person, while in Spanish a _machista_ can be of either gender, though this doesn't seem like too serious an objection to me.


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## Doval

Outsider said:


> I meant the whole phrase, "male chauvinist", which I believe can only be used as a noun phrase, and not as an adjective phrase. And — though we never got a clarification from Mrtnswe as to what he meant — I would say that a "male chauvinist" does indeed mean _machista_. However, in this case "sexist" fits the sentence better, and means essentially the same.
> 
> I suppose there is also a valid point, that several posters have made, that in English "male chauvinist" implies or suggests a male person, while in Spanish a _machista_ can be of either gender, though this doesn't seem like too serious an objection to me.


Outsider, I do agree that the phrase "male chauvinist" is usually used as a noun phrase.  In my case, I used it to translate another noun phrase, to wit, "persona machista."

As for your second point, I disagree with the point made principally by Mirlo, that the phrase can only be used for an individual male.  For this reason, and not so much to challenge your point, I stress that in the phrase "male chauvinist," "male" is an adjective, *not* a noun.  "Male chauvinist" does not imply a male individual any more than does "machista."  Both describe an attitude of male superiority, usually held by men over women, but both can conceivably be applied to an attitude held within a group or society as a whole.  In other words, the terms are synonymous.

According to the RAE, "Machismo" is defined thus:

*1. *m. Actitud de prepotencia de los varones respecto de las mujeres.

Compare thefreedictionary.com's definitions of male chauvinism:

the belief, held or alleged to be held by certain men, that men are inherently superior to women
*male chauvinist* _n_ & _adj_

and in their thesaurus:

*male chauvinism* - activity indicative of belief in the superiority of men over women

I don't see a difference between the Spanish term machismo/machista and the English term male chauvinism/male chauvinist.

I stress, once again, that in "male chauvinist," "male" is an adjective describing the form of cuauvinism, not a noun indicating an individual.  It just so happens that the terms "male chauvinist" and "machista" are usually used to describe men.

Finally, I point out once again that in English, when we speak of a society or organization as a whole, we usually say "male-dominated" or male-centric," not "male chauvinist."


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## Mirlo

Doval said:


> Outsider, I do agree that the phrase "male chauvinist" is usually used as a noun phrase. In my case, I used it to translate another noun phrase, to wit, "persona machista."
> 
> As for your second point, I disagree with the point made principally by Mirlo, that the phrase can only be used for an individual male. For this reason, and not so much to challenge your point, I stress that in the phrase "male chauvinist," "male" is an adjective, *not* a noun. "Male chauvinist" does not imply a male individual any more than does "machista." Both describe an attitude of male superiority, usually held by men over women, but both can conceivably be applied to an attitude held within a group or society as a whole. In other words, the terms are synonymous.
> 
> According to the RAE, "Machismo" is defined thus:
> 
> *1. *m. Actitud de prepotencia de los varones respecto de las mujeres.
> 
> Compare thefreedictionary.com's definitions of male chauvinism:
> 
> the belief, held or alleged to be held by certain men, that men are inherently superior to women
> *male chauvinist* _n_ & _adj_
> 
> and in their thesaurus:
> 
> *male chauvinism* - activity indicative of belief in the superiority of men over women
> 
> I don't see a difference between the Spanish term machismo/machista and the English term male chauvinism/male chauvinist.
> 
> I stress, once again, that in "male chauvinist," "male" is an adjective describing the form of cuauvinism, not a noun indicating an individual. It just so happens that the terms "male chauvinist" and "machista" are usually used to describe men.
> 
> Finally, I point out once again that in English, when we speak of a society or organization as a whole, we usually say "male-dominated" or male-centric," not "male chauvinist."


 
I am so glad That's what I was trying to explain..but I guess that some people think that because you are not a native speaker... But the whole point was to explain that *in English, when people speak of a society or organization as a whole, they usually say "male-dominated" or male-centric," not "male chauvinist.*

**


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## Edenlilu

Hi!
Para decir machismo siempre he oído usar la palabra "sexism" a lo mejor con eso vale, sino ¿se entendería "maleness sexism"?


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## Mirlo

No creo que maleness sea una palabra y pienso que sexism lo abarca todo sin tener que usar  el "male"..

Saludos,


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## Doval

Edenlilu said:


> Hi!
> Para decir machismo siempre he oído usar la palabra "sexism" a lo mejor con eso vale, sino ¿se entendería "maleness sexism"?





Mirlo said:


> No creo que maleness sea una palabra y pienso que sexism lo abarca todo sin tener que usar  el "male"..
> 
> Saludos,


"Maleness" es una palabra, pero no se usaría así como lo propone Edenlilu.  Basta decir "sexism".


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## Mrtnswe

Ahora si me quedo mucho mas claro. Muchas gracias a todos por sus esfuerzos y contribuciones. 
Saludos.


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