# Urdu: آموختہ



## iskander e azam

دوستو۔
اس لفظ کی تعریف  لغت  سے مجھے ملی۔
تعریف میں یہ جملہ موجود ہے کہ
"جس پر کچھ پڑھا گیا ہو "
کیا اس کا مقصد ہے کہ کس موضوع کے بارے میں کچھ پڑھا گیا ہے یا کہ کسی یا کسی چیز کے اوپر کچھ پڑھا کیا ہے مثلاً جیسے تعویذ کسی کے اوپر پڑھ جاتا ہے؟
میں آپ کی مدد کے لیے مشکور ہوں گا۔
آپ کا مخلص۔
اسکندر​


----------



## Qureshpor

P آموخته _āmoḵẖta_ [perf. part. of _āmoḵẖtan_; _ā_+rt. Zend _muć_ = S. मुच्], part. adj. Taught, learned; — s.m. That which has been learned; an old lesson: — _āmoḵẖta paṛhnā_, To read over old lessons, to revise.

"jis par kuchh paRhaa gayaa ho" appears somewhat ambiguous.


----------



## Derakhshan

One of its older meanings in Persian is "habituated" (عادت كرده).


----------



## iskander e azam

Qureshpor said:


> P آموخته _āmoḵẖta_ [perf. part. of _āmoḵẖtan_; _ā_+rt. Zend _muć_ = S. मुच्], part. adj. Taught, learned; — s.m. That which has been learned; an old lesson: — _āmoḵẖta paṛhnā_, To read over old lessons, to revise.
> 
> "jis par kuchh paRhaa gayaa ho" appears somewhat ambiguous.



جناب، مچھے خوشی ہوئی کہ کسی اور  نے بھی اس جملے کو ابہامی سمجھا۔​


----------



## iskander e azam

Derakhshan said:


> One of its older meanings in Persian is "habituated" (عادت كرده).



Sir, 

Thank you for your input. As far as I can recollect this is the first time I have had the honour of your input into a thread of mine.

Best wishes,

Alex


----------



## Alfaaz

A brief summary of the opening post in English: 

The entry in Urdu Lughat for آموختہ states: _2. __(qadiim) on which something has been read_. iskander e azam SaaHib is asking whether this means:

_a topic that has been studied_ - مدروس موضوع
_something on which_
دعاء و دم_ have been performed for blessings, etc._
سحر و جادو _have been performed to make it_ مسحور 




> ...
> *۲. (قدیم) جس پر کچھ پڑھا گیا ہو.*
> 
> اویوں بول کر چوب سر سوختہ
> سٹی ہات تھے جادو آموختہ
> ( ۱۶۴۹، خاور نامہ ، ۵۵۵)


​


			
				Qureshpor said:
			
		

> "jis par kuchh paRhaa gayaa ho" appears somewhat ambiguous.


 The single literary example provided with جادو آموختہ appears to add to the ambiguity...?!


----------



## PersoLatin

Alfaaz said:


> The single literary example provided with جادو آموختہ appears to add to the ambiguity...?!


جادو آموختہ means 'one who has learnt magic', why is this ambiguous?


----------



## iskander e azam

صاحبان۔
میں نے جادو آموختہ کوگل میں ڈالا اور صرف ایک ہی ہٹ ملی۔​


----------



## iskander e azam

Alfaaz said:


> _something on which_
> دعاء و دم_ have been performed for blessings, etc._
> سحر و جادو _have been performed to make it_ مسحور
> 
> ​


الفاظ صاحب۔
یہی بتاتا ہے جو کچھ میں تلاش کرتا تھا۔​


----------



## Alfaaz

PersoLatin said:
			
		

> جادو آموختہ means 'one who has learnt magic', why is this ambiguous?


 The ambiguity is due to it being listed as an example of the second definition (instead of the first - represented by your English translation), which is only a brief phrase that can impart various meanings.


----------



## marrish

Alfaaz said:


> A brief summary of the opening post in English:
> 
> The entry in Urdu Lughat for آموختہ states: _2.* [archaic?]* __(qadiim) *[up]*on which something has been read_._*[recited?]*_ iskander e azam SaaHib is asking whether this means:
> 
> _a topic that has been studied_ - ، [مدروس موضوع *[درس کردہ شدہ، خواندہ شدہ*
> _something on which_
> دعاء و دم_ have been performed for blessings, etc._
> سحر و جادو _have been performed to make it_ مسحور
> 
> ​ *The single literary example provided with جادو آموختہ appears to add to the ambiguity...?!*



Since the first written reference for the usage of the said word "آموختہ" dates back to 1649, the compilers of the Urdu Lughat obviously had to include this reference, but it happens that it was used in that instance in a different, secondary meaning, therefore a separate sub-meaning was created "that upon which something [a spell etc.] has been recited'.

This meaning is not to be ascribed to آموختہ at all but in this single reference.

In Urdu _paRhnaa _means both to read and to recite, to utter.

Here more context from the cited masnavi _Khawar-naamah_, the longest Urdu poem of 24,000 verses written in 1649 at the court of Bijapur, South India. Because it's old and written in the Deccani variety, I've provided glosses and I hope it clarifies any ambiguity this verse might have caused.


*او حیدر اُپر کیتی بان٘گ بلند  ______________  جو غافل ہے از روزگارِ گزند    *

او = اُس نے
اُپر = پر
کِیتی = کی
*توں کی آیا ہے سوئے ایوانِ من _____________ نہیں ڈرتا از مکر و دستانِ من*

توں = تُو
کی = کیوں
سُوئے = جانبِ
دستان = داستان
*او یوں بول کر چوب سر سوختہ ______________ سٹی ہات تھے جادو آموختہ *

او = وہ
یوں = ایضاً
چوب سر سوختہ = سر جلی لکڑی
سٹی = گری
ہات = ہاتھ
تھے = سے
*اس افسوں تھے ہوئی چوب جوں اژدہا ______________ کیا اژدہا نعرہ بھی یک رہا *

تھے = سے
جوں = کی طرح
( ۱۶۴۹، خاور نامہ ، ۵۵۵)


----------



## Alfaaz

iskander e azam said:
			
		

> الفاظ صاحب۔
> یہی بتاتا ہے جو کچھ میں تلاش کرتا تھا۔


مرش صاحب مفصل تشریح پیس کر چکے ہیں جس سے ابہام دور ہو جانا چاہیے۔ 
(امید ہے آپ کو میرا انگریزی میں جواب دینا اور آپ کی تحریر کا ترجمہ کرنا ناگوار خاطر نہیں گذرا ہوگا۔ ایسا کرنے کا مقصد یہ تھا کہ مذکورہ لفظ فارسی سے ماخوذ ہے  اور درخشان صاحب بھی تھریڈ میں شرکت کر چکے تھے ، لہذا محسوس ہوا کہ دلچسپی رکھنے والے فارسی گو ارکان کے لیے انگریزی ترجمہ مفید ہو سکتا ہے)​
_marrish SaaHib has presented a comprehensive explanation that should clear any confusion that might have been present. _
_(I hope you didn't mind that I replied in English and summarized your post in English. The reason for doing so was that the word being discussed is derived from Persian and Derakhshan SaaHib had also participated in the thread, so it seemed like a good idea to provide a summary for Persian-speaking forum members that might be interested.)_


			
				marrish said:
			
		

> This meaning is not to be ascribed to آموختہ at all but in this single reference.


Thanks for providing more context and clarifying the usage of the second meaning.


----------



## PersoLatin

Many thanks for this Alfaaz & marrish, I can also see the reason for the 'ambiguity'. 

Is it at all possible that the intended word, on that single quote, might have been آمیخته meaning “mixed” rather than آموخنه/learned?


----------



## marrish

^ I don't think so, the verse rhymesچوب سر سوختہ with جادو آموختہ 


marrish said:


> او یوں بول کر* چوب سر سوختہ ______________ *سٹی ہات تھے* جادو آموختہ *


----------



## PersoLatin

marrish said:


> ^ I don't think so, the verse rhymesچوب سر سوختہ with جادو آموختہ


Thanks, my bad I missed that line.


----------

