# chuletón



## Perdido

El fin de semana pasado, mi mujer y yo compartimos un chuletón, una pieza de carne enorme y sabroso.  ¿Cómo se traduce "chuletón"? Tenderloin?

Gracias y saludos.


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## Deloris

Hola. "T-bone steak"


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## zumac

Deloris said:


> Hola. "T-bone steak"


 
No sé traducir "chuletón", pero te aseguro que no es un "T-bone steak", porque lo he comido en España y no se parece nada al T-bone.

Saludos.


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## Deloris

zumac said:


> No sé traducir "chuletón", pero te aseguro que no es un "T-bone steak" . . .


¿De veras? 

“The huge *chuletón (T-bone steak)*, seared over charcoal and sprinkled with sea salt” (_Asador Fronton_, Madrid).
http://www.fodors.com/miniguides/mg...=madrid@95&cur_section=din&property_id=174675

“However in all the Northern regions you will find delicious roasted baby lamb and kid, an excellent *“chuleton” (“T” bone steak)*, “chuletillas” (baby lamb chops)” (_Casas Cantabricas_).
http://www.casas.co.uk/metapage.php?id=1

“Enjoy ajoarriero (cod in oil and red peppers), a *chuletón (T-bone steak)* and a variety of roast meats” (_The kingdom of fine cuisine_, Navarre).
http://www.turismo.navarra.es/eng/porque-navarra/razones/reyno+buena+mesa.htm

“The house specialty is the *T-bone steak*, a *chuletón*” (_Maribel’s Guide to the País Vasco_).
maribelsguides.com/mg_pais_vasco.pdf

*chuletón* large steak, T-bone steak
_Collins Spanish Dictionary_

*chuletón* _m_ T-bone steak
_Oxford Dictionary_


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## Filis Cañí

I was going to say T-bone steak, too, but refrained because _chuletones_ weigh in at over 2 pounds each (1-inch thick); and I've never seen a T-bone steak that big.


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## Dani California

zumac said:


> No sé traducir "chuletón", pero te aseguro que no es un "T-bone steak", porque lo he comido en España y no se parece nada al T-bone.
> 
> Saludos.


 
Hola Zumac! Quizás sí que te comiste un chuletón (pero desprovisto del hueso, hay restaurantes en que se lo quitan/quitaban por la normativa comunitaria que considera el espinazo de la vaca como material de riesgo), en todo caso yo tengo entendido que: chuletón=T-Bone steak; Entrecot=Tenderloin y solomillo=Sirloin steak.
Saludos


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## Filis Cañí

Solomillo=Tenderloin.


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## Dani California

Solomillo=Sirloin


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## Filis Cañí

Cada día me los miro con ojos grandes en el super, doña Daniela, y le aseguro que son _tenderloins_.


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## Dani California

Filis Cañí said:


> Cada día me los miro con ojos grandes en el super, doña Daniela, y le aseguro que son _tenderloins_.


 
Pues revísate la vista, ja, ja...
Solomillo: sirloin
Lomo o entrecot: tenderloin.
Saludos


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## Filis Cañí

Pues me parece que usted aún ha comido menos solomillo/tenderloin que yo, si no lo sabe reconocer por el aspecto, doña Daniela.


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## Dani California

Ok, para tí la peseta Filis 
Pero busca en el diccionario...
Saludos


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## Filis Cañí

El diccionario puede decir misa, doña Daniela. Yo he comido tanto solomillo como tenderloin y entiendo por qué es el corte más caro: porque es el más tierno. Se puede cortar con un cuchillo de mantequilla. Mientras que si te ponen un entrecot o un sirloin steak delante, más vale que te pongan también un cuchillo bien afilado. El solomillo/tenderloin es un músculo alargado y finito, mientras que el entrecot/sirloin sale del costillar.

Del solomillo/tenderloin se saca el filet mignon; sirva usted un filet mignon de sirloin steak y a ver lo que le dicen.


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## Dani California

Una ayudita:

http://www.wordreference.com/es/translation.asp?tranword=sirloin
http://www.wordreference.com/es/translation.asp?tranword=tenderloin&dict=enes&B=Buscar


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## Filis Cañí

Como si me trae una bula papal diciéndome que las naranjas se llaman apples. La vista y el paladar no engañan.

No todos los hispanohablantes llaman al tenderloin de ternera solomillo (tampoco lo llamarán entrecot), pero que me lo discuta una madrileña es de juzgado de guardia.


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## Dani California

Relájate y disfruta Filis y sobre todo.... admite otras opiniones.
Y no las mias, sino las de los diccionarios: Langenscheidt, Collins, wordreference...
Have a nice day


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## Filis Cañí

Que las naranjas no son apples no es cuestión de opiniones, doña Daniela. Y para sacarnos de dudas, ahí está el filet mignon: ¿Tiene usted alguna duda de que el filet mignon sale de lo que en Madrid se conoce como solomillo de ternera? Hey guys, how do you call the cut of meat from which you get filet mignon?

¡No hay nada que me ponga más a parir que el que me confundan los filetes!


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## sunce

Definiciones de *Filet mignon* 
A thick, boneless and extremely tender cut of beef from the tail side of the tenderloin. (Not however the most flavorful of steaks.)
www.recipegoldmine.com/glossary/glossaryF.html
A French derivative meaning small, boneless meat cut from the small end of beef tenderloin.
www.cookingschools101.com/culinary-dictionary.aspx
small steak cut from the thick end of a beef tenderloin 
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn


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## Bil

Gee, duh, I guess that’s why they call it a _“chuletón”_— a whole cut of _T-bone_ that hasn’t been carved into chuletas.

So far, whole teams of lexicographers from major publishing houses have already been cited who define the word _"chuletón" _as _"T-bone."_  And a search on the Net with the keywords _"chuletón"_ and _"T-bone steak"_ turns up at least 100 restaurant owners in Spain who are translating the _"chuletón"_ on their own menus as _"T-bone steak."

_¡Por el amor de Dios!  ¿Qué más puedes pedir?


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## zumac

Deloris said:


> ¿De veras?
> 
> “The huge *chuletón (T-bone steak)*, seared over charcoal and sprinkled with sea salt” (_Asador Fronton_, Madrid).
> http://www.fodors.com/miniguides/mg...=madrid@95&cur_section=din&property_id=174675
> 
> “However in all the Northern regions you will find delicious roasted baby lamb and kid, an excellent *“chuleton” (“T” bone steak)*, “chuletillas” (baby lamb chops)” (_Casas Cantabricas_).
> http://www.casas.co.uk/metapage.php?id=1
> 
> “Enjoy ajoarriero (cod in oil and red peppers), a *chuletón (T-bone steak)* and a variety of roast meats” (_The kingdom of fine cuisine_, Navarre).
> http://www.turismo.navarra.es/eng/porque-navarra/razones/reyno+buena+mesa.htm
> 
> “The house specialty is the *T-bone steak*, a *chuletón*” (_Maribel’s Guide to the País Vasco_).
> maribelsguides.com/mg_pais_vasco.pdf
> 
> *chuletón* large steak, T-bone steak
> _Collins Spanish Dictionary_
> 
> *chuletón* _m_ T-bone steak
> _Oxford Dictionary_


 
Deloris,
As Felis Cañi said: "El diccionario puede decir misa."
And that goes for all the references that you cited,
because my information comes from first hand knowledge.

I've eaten "chuletón" in Spain, specifically in the Basque Country,
and I've eaten T-bone steaks in many places in the USA.
I can assure you that they are not the same at all.

What more can I tell you. Perhaps you can find another person who has eaten both of these steaks, and can voice his opinion.

Meat cuts are quite different from country to country. It's very difficult to find a match from one country to another. In an effort towards completeness, many diccionaries and culinary references make an attempt to translate meat cuts as best as they can, and often without first hand knowledge.

Regards and saludos.


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## zumac

Bil said:


> Gee, duh, I guess that’s why they call it a _“chuletón”_— a whole cut of _T-bone_ that hasn’t been carved into chuletas.
> 
> So far, whole teams of lexicographers from major publishing houses have already been cited who define the word _"chuletón" _as _"T-bone."_ And a search on the Net with the keywords _"chuletón"_ and _"T-bone steak"_ turns up at least 100 restaurant owners in Spain who are translating the _"chuletón"_ on their own menus as _"T-bone steak."_
> 
> ¡Por el amor de Dios! ¿Qué más puedes pedir?


 
Bil,

Your example of the 100 Spainsh restaurants who translate "chuletón" as "T-bone steak", is a classic. They already had "chuletón" on the menu, and now they want to list the equivalent in English. So they ask around and get a quick translation of "T-bone steak", which sounds good to them, because I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts that none of them ever had a T-bone steak in the USA. Ignorance is bliss. If an American ever comes into their restaurant and orders this so-called T-bone steak, he will be in for a surprise. Who knows, he may like this "chuletón", but it certainly won't be like a T-bone that he was expecting.

Saludos.


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## Perdido

¡Jolín!  No intentaba empezar una guerra.  ¡Tranquilos, chicos!

My two cents:

The solomillo that I have eaten in Spain is like what we would call a filet mignon, not a mere sirloin.  And I think the entrecots resembled a T-bone/porterhouse (same cut, different size).  The chuletón I ate was not a T-bone.  It was like the larger cut from which you take a filet mignon, which I think (and which seems to be supported by sunce's post) is the tenderloin.  

De ahí viene mi pregunta.  Y, despues de tanta discusión, sigo inseguro.  

¿Más opiniones?


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## Patagonia116

Dani California said:


> Pues revísate la vista, ja, ja...
> Solomillo: sirloin
> Lomo o entrecot: tenderloin.
> Saludos


 

Sí, tenderloin es lomo.
Saludos.
Pat.


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## robjh22

No one has mentioned "porterhouse" yet. It may be what you are looking for.


"The *T-bone* and *Porterhouse* are steak cuts of beef. They consist of a T-shaped bone with meat on each side. The larger side contains meat from the strip loin, whereas the smaller side contains the tenderloin. T-bone steaks from the rear end of the tenderloin contain a much larger section of the tenderloin, and are called porterhouse steaks. (in British usage, followed in Commonwealth countries, only the strip loin side is called the porterhouse, and the tenderloin side is called the fillet.)
 There is little agreement among experts on how large the tenderloin must be to call a T-bone a porterhouse; some steaks with a large tenderloin may be called a mere T-bone in some restaurants and steakhouses. However, there is general agreement the tenderloin can be no thinner than the diameter of a US quarter dollar coin (24.26 mm) to be classified as a porterhouse. The US Department of Agriculture's _Institutional Meat Purchase Specifications_ states that the tenderloin must be at least 1.25 inches (32 mm) at its widest point for the steak to be classified a porterhouse. "


Either way, the cow doesn't care much.


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## Patagonia116

Hola!
No se diría "cutlet"??
Saludos.
Pat.


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## Patagonia116

Deloris said:


> Hola. "T-bone steak"


 
Hola Deloris,
En realidad T-bone steak, no sería bife de costilla?

De todos modos la traducción es complicada, ya que cada país tiene por lo general sus propios cortes de carne... 

Saludos.
Pat.


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## Bil

zumac said:


> Bil,
> 
> Your example of the 100 Spainsh restaurants who translate "chuletón" as "T-bone steak", is a classic. They already had "chuletón" on the menu, and now they want to list the equivalent in English. So they ask around and get a quick translation of "T-bone steak", which sounds good to them, because I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts that none of them ever had a T-bone steak in the USA. Ignorance is bliss. If an American ever comes into their restaurant and orders this so-called T-bone steak, he will be in for a surprise. Who knows, he may like this "chuletón", but it certainly won't be like a T-bone that he was expecting.
> 
> Saludos.


Oh, now I get it.  So what you're saying is that the people who write dictionaries as well as the restaurant owners who prepare the product are ignorant with regard to the subject.

Here's a just a handful of the menus from the world over written by naive restaurant owners:

Chuletón de buey a la brasa con sal maldon (Grilled ox t-bone steak with maldon salt) — _Restaurante Real_, Almería.

Chuletón Gallego (T-Bone-Steak) — _Molí de Can Pere_, Arenal.

Chuleton. T-bone.     £15.95 — _La Rueda_, London.

Especial del a Casa
Tenera de T Bone o Chuleton (grande) € 17.50 — _Restaurante 121_, Costa Blanca.

chuleton de buey al plato caliente (T-bone steak on a hot plate) — _Rincon de Curro_, Cadiz.

chuletón de ternera, veal T-bone steak — _Parador de Ávila_, Ávila.

CHULETÓN, CHULETA T-bone Steak — _Asador Goxoa_, Bilbao.

CHULETON DE BUEY A LA PARRILLA CON PIMIENTOS DEL PADRON Y TOMATE AL HORNO (price per weight) £15.96 per 500g
Grilled northern Spanish T-bone steak served with padron peppers and cherry tomatoes on the vine — _El Faro_, London.

CHULETÓN DE TERNERA 18,50 T-bone steak van 500 gr. — _Los Ponchos_, Belgium.

Chuletón A La Moda De Buenos Aires
T-bone steak, pasture fed, 500gsm, 750gsm or 1kg P.O.A. — _Gaucho’s Argentinean Restaurant_, Australia.

Especialidades: chuletón de buey y chateaubriand a la piedra, pescados y mariscos frescos. Vinos de las mejores regiones de España.
Specialities: T-bone steak, chateaubriand on the stone, fresh fish and seafood. Wines from the best regions in Spain. — _Los Tamarindos_, Puerto Alcúdia.

chuletón (huge T-bone steak) — _Pelotari_, Madrid.

Chuletón de Ternera del Condado (Sierra Morena/ Jaén)       24.60 E/ Kg T- Bone Steak from the Condado (Sierra Morena) — _La Mesa Segureña_, Cazorla.

T.Bone Steack
500 gramos del mejor chuletón al estilo Tejano, con patatas asadas. — _Porto Pi_, Palma de Mallorca.

CHULETÓN DE TERNERA (+500 GR.) A LA PLANCHA MARINADO CON      19,0 BÁLSAMICO Y JENGIBRE, PATATAS DEL DÍA Grilled T-bone Steak (approx. 500 gr.) in Balsamic & Ginger Marinade Served with Potatoes of the Day — _Los Dos Leones_, Málaga

Chuletón co Salsa de crema: T-Bone steak grilled and flamed in a rum and cream sauce
Chuletón Al Jerez: T-Bone steak marinated in sherry and chilli. Flame grilled with garlic and mixed pepper sauce — _Café Habana_


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## JB

1,250 fotos de chuletones
http://images.google.com/images?q=chuletón&gbv=2&hl=en&newwindow=1&imgsz=


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## robjh22

No se diría "cutlet"??

For some odd reason, we never hear "beef cutlet," though we do hear "veal cutlet" and less commonlu pork cutlet. I agree with you that there is little difference between a thin T-bone and a cutlet.

p.s. Hey, Bil, we need more proof.


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## Lagartija

jbruceismay said:


> 1,250 fotos de chuletones
> http://images.google.com/images?q=chulet%C3%B3n&gbv=2&hl=en&newwindow=1&imgsz=



HaHaHaHa!  They mostly look like beef chops (or cutlets)!  If they didn't say they were beef, they would look like a pork chop. They don't look like T-bone steaks that we can buy around here...
http://images.google.com/images?q=t...US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&sa=N&tab=wi


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## Filis Cañí

jbruceismay said:


> 1,250 fotos de chuletones
> http://images.google.com/images?q=chulet%C3%B3n&gbv=2&hl=en&newwindow=1&imgsz=


 
Those look like (are) rib eye steaks with the bone in. I have also eaten chuletones and T-bone steaks, and they are not the same. All I can conclude about the dictionaries' blunders is that translators are paid very poorly and can't afford serious carnivorous research.

(The restaurants that translate buey for ox could also be told that unless there's a famine we don't eat oxen, but steer.)


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## mariposita

> I've eaten "chuletón" in Spain, specifically in the Basque Country,
> and I've eaten T-bone steaks in many places in the USA.
> I can assure you that they are not the same at all.
> 
> What more can I tell you. Perhaps you can find another person who has eaten both of these steaks, and can voice his opinion.
> 
> Meat cuts are quite different from country to country. It's very difficult to find a match from one country to another. In an effort towards completeness, many diccionaries and culinary references make an attempt to translate meat cuts as best as they can, and often without first hand knowledge.
> 
> Regards and saludos.


 
I've had both and agree. Chuletón encompasses several American cuts. It's huge--meant for two or three people to eat. It's not a mere t-bone. Because of the (incredible) flavor and texture, I have always thought that it included parts of ribeye and porterhouse. Nearly all of the beef cuts here in Spain are not directly equivalent to American cuts. The animal is butchered differently.


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## Mate

Buenos días/tardes a todos:

En esta foto se ve un "t-bone steak". En el interior de la Argentina a este corte se lo llama "chuleta". En Buenos Aires, "bife angosto con lomo". 

Si rotamos la imagen en sentido horario, el trozo de carne que queda arriba es el bife angosto, bife de chorizo o "striploin" (_longissimus dorsi_). El que queda abajo es el lomo con cordón o "tenderloin" (_psoas major + psoas minor_). 

Si a la izquierda pegamos otro corte simétrico, veremos que en el centro queda un orificio: es el hueco por donde transcurre la médula espinal. 

Este corte no debe ser confundido con el bife ancho (con hueso) u ojo de bife (el mismo corte pero deshuesado), "rib eye" en inglés. Este último también es un corte tomado del dorso del animal pero más cerca de la cruz que los anteriores, que son más distales.

No estoy seguro de la traducción correcta de "chuletón". Se me ocurre que es un nombre de fantasía que alude a una chuleta (t-bone steak) de gran espesor o cortada a partir de un novillo (steer) de 500kg o más, es decir, bastante grande. A mayor tamaño de animal, mayor es el "ojo" de los músculos dorsales. 

Tampoco estoy seguro de que esta sea información de primera mano ya que no he tenido la oportunidad de ver un chuletón en España y, como dije, en la Argentina no se usa esa denominación.

Solo puedo agregar que soy veterinario desde hace 25 años, tengo restaurantes desde hace diez, y he exportado carne vacuna a Europa durante cuatro años. Mi función era supervisar los cortes en el frigorífico.

Saludos - Mate


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## Filis Cañí

La foto que nos trae don Mateamargo es, efectivamente, de un T-bone steak. Comparándola con esta: http://www.gastronomiavasca.net/glosario-file/164/Chuleton___Villagodio-thumbnail.jpg
se aprecia que a todas luces se trata de cortes de carne distintos. 

¿No cree usted, don Mateamargo, que la foto del chuletón muestra un rib eye steak sin deshuesar?


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## Mate

Lo que puedo decir es que, en efecto, la foto muestra un "bife de costilla", "bife ancho con hueso" o "rib eye steak". 

Es el corte que dije se hace de la parte más cercana a la cruz del animal. 

Como dato de interés puedo agregar que es muy apreciado en Francia, nuestro principal importador de dicho corte.
Es de menor valor económico que los cortes que conforman el _t-bone steak (strip loin & tenderloin)_, aunque esto es por una cuestión de demanda más que de calidad (en lo personal, es mi favorito).

Lo que no puedo aseverar es que sea o no un chuletón, ya que, como dije en mi anterior post, _"...no he tenido la oportunidad de ver un chuletón en España y, como dije, en la Argentina no se usa esa denominación."_

Saludos - Mate


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## zumac

Bil said:


> Oh, now I get it. So what you're saying is that the people who write dictionaries as well as the restaurant owners who prepare the product are ignorant with regard to the subject.
> .....


You got it right. They are ignorant with regard to this specific sibject, i.e., that "chuletón" is not a "T-bone steak." I suspect that they use this translation for expediency, and because others in the business have also used it.

Jbruceismay has posted 1250 pictures of the "chuletón". For those of us that are familiar with the T-bone steak, these pictures do not correspond to a T-bone. There is one exception, there is one picture of a T-bone with a caption of "Chuletón hueso-..." which shows an actual T-bone. However, going to the site www.tiendaslatinas.com corresponding to the picture, there is a picture of a T-bone, but no mention of the Spanish name of Chuletón. Editorial liberties on the first picture, maybe?

Subsecuently, Mateamargo posted a picture of a T-bone steak. Other pictures can also be found on the Internet. If you care to look, none of the T-bone pictures match those shown by Jbruceismay.

In addition, both Felis Cañi and Mariposita agreed with my original statement that a Chuletón is not the same as a T-bone steak.

In conclusion, we have seen photographic evidence plus the statements of several foreros who have eaten both the steaks in question. Is this not sufficient evidence, or will we continue to scout around the Internet for more erroneous translations?

Saludos.


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## Perdido

Well, well, the mods have been busy cleaning up.  

In any case, I am sure beyond the shadow of a doubt that the chuletón I ate was not a T-bone.  However, according to this link, it was not a tenderloin either, although it is a similar-looking cut.  The chart says it was a "rib steak (small end)," which I've never heard of in English either.

Learn something new every day, I suppose.

Gracias a todos por la ayuda.


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## zumac

Perdido said:


> Well, well, the mods have been busy cleaning up.
> 
> In any case, I am sure beyond the shadow of a doubt that the chuletón I ate was not a T-bone. However, according to this link, it was not a tenderloin either, although it is a similar-looking cut. The chart says it was a "rib steak (small end)," which I've never heard of in English either.
> 
> Learn something new every day, I suppose.
> 
> Gracias a todos por la ayuda.


 
Gracias a ti, Perdido, por tu paciencia.

Lástima que al final de cuentas no hemos podido encontrar un traducción definitiva para chuletón en inglés. Lo más probable, como ya algunos aquí han dicho, es que el corte de carne del chuletón no se haga en países de habla inglés. Siendo este el caso, encontraremos cortes parecidos, pero no uno igual con nombre en inglés.

Saludos cordiales.


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## Deloris

Hola.  An accurate term for a “beyond-a-shadow-of-a-doubt non-T-bone” will most likely never be encountered in a language forum.  However, Juan Manuel Pombo, Margarita Alonso, Victoria Romero-Cerro, María Jesús Fernández Prieto, Nazaret de Terán, Carol Styles Carvajal, Carlos López Beltán, Victoria Ordóñez Divi, María Luisa Chaves, Soraya Bermejo, Ana Cristina Llompart, Teresa Fuentes Peris, Beatriz Galimberti Jarman, Victoria Alonso Blanco, Clarisa Rucabado Butler, Carlos Villanueva, Margaret Jull Costa, Nieves Baranda, Francisco Segovia, Joseph Díaz, Carlos Cáceres, Pedro Cerrano, José Manuel Garnica, Ana María Postinger, María José Sánchez Blanco, José González, Lola Luengo, Sinda López Fuentes, Beatriz Oberländer, Nicola Richards, Luis Baqueriza, Soledad Pérez López, Pilar Jenkins, Isabel Carrera, María Jesús Vallejo Hernández, Isabel de Río-Sukan, Marta Giddings, Elena Giménez, Nancy Castillo, Cristina Rodríguez, Oscar Rodríguez Aguilar, Jose Antonio Sánchez, Joseph Gustaitis, Fiona Cordy, Roberto Rodríguez Saona, Ximena Castillo, Antonio Fortín, Cristina Lea, Carmen Fernández-Marsden, Virginia Masardo and Pilar Diego have all agreed that the word *“chuletón”* translates as *“T-bone steak.” *

These are the names of the editorial staff who compile the Spanish dictionary at _Oxford University Press_.  Their opinion, in turn, is corroborated by the publishers at _Collins_ and _Langenscheidt’s_, whose interpretations likewise are supported by page after page of direct translations made by writers and restaurateurs from all over the world that are easily sourced on the Internet.

Those who are disagreeing with the language authorities on this subject are offering neither an alternate translation nor a description that can be verified through published materials.  It's hardly likely, moreover, that the world is going to begin dismissing dictionary definitions in response to what Zumac has for supper.  Perhaps the meanderings encountered in this thread would be better suited under ‘Cultural Discussions’, or maybe a website forum exists where cuts-of-meat terminology shortcomings are debated.

The _DRAE_, incidentally, hasn’t been particularly helpful in these deliberations:

* chuletón, na*.
—adj. _Hond_. homosexual (con tendencia a la homosexualidad). U. t. c. s.

I think I’d rather just stick with the _Oxford_ translation.


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## Filis Cañí

I printed out this photo, which comes from the web page of a fancy restaurant in Spain, and this picture, which comes from the web page of a Spanish veterinarian, and went with them to my butcher's. He confirmed that both are the same cut, one with the bone and the other without, and that it is called what I have been saying all along: A *RIB EYE STEAK*.

I'm sure that Bil and Deloris, using half the time they spent contradicting the obvious, will take care of spreading the news to all the dictionaries' editors.


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## zumac

Filis Cañí said:


> I printed out this photo, which comes from the web page of a fancy reataurant in Spain, and this picture, which comes from the web page of a Spanish veterinarian, and went with them to my butcher's. He confirmed that both are the same cut, one with the bone and the other without, and that it is called what I have been saying all along: A *RIB EYE STEAK*.
> 
> I'm sure that Bil and Deloris, using half the time they spent contradicting the obvious, will take care of spreading the news to all the dictionaries' editors.


 
Filis,

Your point leaves no doubt, and is absolutely "contundente".

None of the long list of advocates for the translation to "T-bone steak", have shown any definitive evidence other than their names and laurels on which they rest.

Thanks again, Filis.

Saludos.


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## mariposita

The thing is, part of a chuletón is a rib eye, but a rib eye is never as big as a chuletón (at least in the US), so there is more to the steak than just that cut. But flavor and texture-wise it is closest to rib eye. In cases like this, I would leave the term in Spanish with a parenthetical explanation, something like this: chuletón (a XX ounce steak, similar to rib eye). Not mentioning the gargantuan size, does a disservice to the reader. 

Culinary translations in dictionaries are notoriously bad (I do food writing, so I know this first-hand). Gastronomy has its own jargon--like any highly refined cultural or scientific field. Spain has a very different gastronomic tradition and history from any Anglophone country, so there are bound to be major differences. Instead of offering accurate, but less concise translations, most dictionaries more often go for more pragmatic, general ones. And now I can see why. It seems that many don't accept that some things, ideas, cultural phenomena, etc. will never have an exact translation or one-word equivalent in another language or culture. 

Another egregious case of bad translations is with fish and shellfish. For example, there are four or five very different fish in Spain that get systematically translated as the ambiguous--and inaccurate--*sea bass*. The pervasiveness of this translation doesn't make it correct. When I am translating terms that pertain to sea creatures, greens, fruit, mushrooms or any other food item that is very specific to a particular geography, I always work from the Latin name. The dictionary is very often wrong or uses an umbrella term in English for what is a very specific term in Spanish.


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## Filis Cañí

To get a big rib eye steak, all you need is a big cow. To quote my butcher: "My Dad used to cut rib eyes that big, but that was Down South, and they came from cows of over 2.500 pounds. We don't get that kind of steak around here." In Spain 1 kilo _chuletones_ are not the norm either, they are more than anything a restaurant curiosity. I have always seen huge _chuletones_ referred to as _chuletones de Burgos_.

If a Spanish restauranteur wants to express both the cut and its size, I propose _Down South Rib Eye Steak_.


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## mariposita

> To get a big rib eye steak, all you need is a big cow.


 
That could be true. But when I bought rib-eyes (at the market or in a restaurant) in the US, a big one was usually around 12-16 ounces (340-450 grams). I've never seen a chuletón that small. I think what makes them different is the fact that the chuletón includes more of the fat and connecting tissue (which is good for flavor!). In the US, we tend to trim our steaks a lot more (and then age them and do all sorts of other things to improve the flavor).

See these photos:
Rib eye:
http://whatscookingamerica.net/Beef/RibEyeSteak1.jpg
http://www.londonbutcher.co.uk/images/Ribeye-steak.jpg

Chuletón
http://www.gastronomiavasca.net/glosario-file/164/Chuleton___Villagodio-thumbnail.jpg
http://www.savannah-braseria.com/graf/CHULETON%20DE%20KILO.JPG


From here on out, I will confidently translate chuletón as_ a big rib eye_ (for two). This thread is making me ridiculously hungry.


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## zumac

Mariposita,

Although I am not the OP for this thread, I nevertheless would like to thank you and acknowledge all the contributions that you made.

Best regards..... Zumac


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## Filis Cañí

Ahora falta que alguien se entere si una chuleta de ternera es el mismo corte que un chuletón pero en tamaño normal.


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## Sr. Moose

Aquí, Filis Cañi.  Parece que hay por un lado una montaña de pruebas a favor de _*“T-bone steak”*_ mientras que por el otro no tenemos nada más que esa foto de un _‘rib eye’_, _filete de costilla_, y no un _*“chuletón”*_.

Te da que pensar, ¿verdad?  

 “… lamb (asados de cochinillo y cordero), as well as the famous *chuletón* de ternera, veal *T-bone steak* from Ávila” (Turespaña).
http://www.spain.info/TourSpain/Destinos/TipoII/MasInfo/0/Avila.htm?Language=en

“*Chuletón* de ternera : Veal *T-bone steak*” (Cámara de Comercio e Industria).
www.camarahuelva.com/PDF/Menu4Idiomas/Ingles.xls

“*Chuletón* de ternera hecho a leña 1Kg Aprox. 30,0€ mínimo 2 personas
* T-bone steak* made in wood oven 1 kg minimum for 2 people” (PIZZERIA LUNAROSSA).
http://www.pizzerialunarossa.com/secondi.html

“The willow tree *T.Bone* (*chuletón* de Ternera Fresca)” (The Willow Tree, Costa Adeje, Tenerife).
http://www.thewillowtree.es/nuestromenu.htm

“*Chuletón* de Ternera. *T-Bone* veal steak” (MENÚS EXTREMEÑOS).
http://www.plasenciaweb.com/gredos/menu.htm


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## mariposita

Cada una de estas traducciones contiene otro error. Ternera no es lo mismo que "veal." Veal es ternera lechal. Pero como está en el diccionario (mal) encontrarás esta traducción en miles de cartas. Te aseguro que lo mismo pasa con chuletón.


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## Sr. Moose

mariposita said:


> Cada una de estas traducciones contiene otro error. Ternera no es lo mismo que "veal." Veal es ternera lechal. Pero como está en el diccionario (mal) encontrarás esta traducción en miles de cartas. Te aseguro que lo mismo pasa con chuletón.


¿Puedes conseguirnos un documento de buena fuente que apoya tu opinión?  Así se hace.


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## mariposita

Primero el chuletón es un corte tipicamente vasco (o castellano) de la parte del animal que se domina "el lomo alto." Esta página web es excelente para todo lo que se trata de la gastronomía vasca:

definición:
http://www.gastronomiavasca.net/hl/glosario/show-item?id=164&category_id=27

mapa de la vaca:
http://www.grupogastronomicogaditano.com/PartesVaca.jpg

A ribeye proviene de la misma parte del animal:
http://www.webefit.com/articles_100_199/ART_100_Img/Bull_Cuts.jpg

A t-bone steak viene de la parte mas atrás--the short loin/sirloin.

En cuanto a la distinción entre ternera lechal, ternera, añojo, novillo, vacuno mayor, buey, toro,etc. Esto sería otro hilo... Total, la palabra ternera se usa mucho en España como una denominación general para la carne de vaca. Veal es un término mucho más específico que refiere a un animal en sus primeros meses de vida alimentado exclusivamente con leche (ternera lechal). 

Pero, aparte de todo eso, la consideración principal es que chuletón es un corte de carne que casi siempre proviene de un animal mayor. Lo dice la pagina de la gastronomía vasca (vínculo más arriba), pero no hay que hacer nada más que ver el color rojo intenso y oscuro de la carne para saber que no se trata de un animal lechal, ni mucho menos. Por eso dije que *veal *es una mala traducción. 

Enfin, las cartas en España no representan una buena fuente para traductores buscando traducciones precisas--excepto si uno quiere reirse un poco (mi favorito: lengua estofada: stewed language).


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## Sr. Moose

Perdón, pero el "chuletón de lomo," el "porterhouse steak", no es el término el de la sola palabra "chuletón," el "T-bone steak," que se encuentra en todas partes de España—de Andalucía al País Vasco—así como a lo largo de América del Sur.  Además, en los restaurantes apenas se vende "chuletón de ternera," lo que de todos modos es simplemente un "T-bone" más caro.

Y, lo siento, pero esos 'mapas de vacas'  no se dirigen a los términos en cuestión.  Y raya en lo ridículo eso del dar por sentado que todo el mundo no conoce su propio producto.

Muchas gracias, pero voy a quedarme con la opinión de los expertos, los mismos propietarios de los restaurantes y carnicerías.


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## Filis Cañí

Sr. Moose said:


> Aquí, Filis Cañi. Parece que hay por un lado una montaña de pruebas a favor de _*“T-bone steak”*_ mientras que por el otro no tenemos nada más que esa foto de un _‘rib eye’_, _filete de costilla_, y no un _*“chuletón”*_.
> 
> Te da que pensar, ¿verdad?


 
Mucho. En este mundo no faltan funcionarios del pensamiento que no pueden aceptar que la realidad no siempre concuerda con sus manuales.


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## Harmattan

As for the discrepancies and inaccuracies of dictionaries, there are many. And it is understable as they are not and cannot be masters of everything under the sun.

In think that in this kind of discussions about physical items, pictures (as many as possible) do help a lot to clarify matters. Even if it is to make it clear that direct and short translations are not always possible as:

- English and Spanish are both languages spoken in many different countries.

- Things like meat cuts of fish names and cooking uses differ even from region to region inside one country.

The highly illustrative post of Mateamargo (and the picture attached) makes it clear what a T-Bone is (and what it is not). As for the pictures (and personal experiences of some of the posters) of what a Chuletón is, it's rather clear that it's not really a T-Bone Steak.

Because if that is a T-Bone steak, I think it's not really sold (or sold very much) in Spain (at least in Madrid), though you can ask for a chuletón with no trouble.

The differences in cuts and names for similar (but not equal) cuts is so big that the link that has been posted, for example, about Spanish meat cuts (with pictures in the PDF) mention many names I have never heard here in Spain.

That said, if I were an Spanish turistic restaurant making English menu equivalents, I'd use 'T-Bone steak' even if I knew I was being inaccurate, because I'd just be giving a quick idea to help somebody to choose. And if the clients would have any doubt, I'd show them the piece before.


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## Berenguer

Harmattan said:


> [...]
> 
> The differences in cuts and names for similar (but not equal) cuts is so big that the link that has been posted, for example, about Spanish meat cuts (with pictures in the PDF) mention many names I have never heard here in Spain.
> 
> That said, if I were an Spanish turistic restaurant making English menu equivalents, I'd use 'T-Bone steak' even if I knew I was being inaccurate, because I'd just be giving a quick idea to help somebody to choose. And if the clients would have any doubt, I'd show them the piece before.



At last a little bit of good sense and reasoning after so much vehemence and "dictionary's burning". That last sentence is the basis of the language, that is the adaptation to the context, not just the own experience and knowledge or just the dictionaries. If a foreigner ask for a T-bone steak in Madrid or in Galicia he's going to get a "chuletón". So where's the problem? 

And now in Spanish.

He leído y releído y mirado fotos y pdf y muchas páginas web y cartas de restaurantes, de asadores, de expertos en cocina y llego a la conclusión que todos y ninguno tenéis razón (el problema es que alguno(s) con su vehemencia y cabezonería y ganas de tener razón y creerse que sólo ellos tienen razón, matan a su verdad a mano de su vocerío y falta de humildad). Como bien ha introducido Harmattan (_with is warm and quiet wind of mildness_) ni siquiera en España nos ponemos de acuerdo con lo que un chuletón es. Yo al igual que otros que lo gritan a los cuatro vientos en aras de la verdad, he comido chuletones en muchos sitios de la geografía española (y europea, pero me voy a centrar en España), y no es igual el chuletón de buey que me comí en un pequeño restaurante de las cercanías de La Coruña que pesaba casi 700g, que el que me comí en Ávila que apenas llegaba a los 500g, que algunos que parecían famélicos _steaks _the poco más de 200g. Es decir, no en todos los lugares de España se llama chuletón al mismo corte de carne, o mejor dicho, al mismo steak. Hay lugares en los que el chuletón tiene hueso y se parece, y es, un T-bone steak, hay lugares en los que se asemeja más a un entrecôte, y hay lugares en los que se parece a un Rib-eye steak. Si ni siquiera en España un chuletón es llamado igual en todas las partes, ¿por qué pelearnos en como sería un chuletón en inglés? Si por lo general un chuletón es llamado T-bone steak y si un anglosajón viene y quiere comer un chuletón y pide un T-bone steak en el Asador Pepito y le dan un chuletón que era lo que él quería comer, ¿dónde está el problema? ¿Han fallado los diccionaríos? Pues no, han acertado de pleno. Y si en algún sitio en el que el cocinero resulte que sepa inglés y haya vivido en Texas y crea que un chuletón (de los que se hace en la zona que el viva) se parezca aun Rib-eye steak y en su carta ponga Rib-eye steak y llegue uno de Arkansas y pida un chuletón bajo el nombre de Rib-eye steak y quede satisfecho, ¿dónde está el problema?
Y tan sólo cosita más, estos foros están para aclarar dudas, no para encabezonarnos en nuestra verdad (que puede que encima no sea verdad), que es tan solo una parcela de la verdad general. Si todos intentamos aportar nuestro conocimiento sin intentar pisotear el del que no piensa u opina como nosotros seguramente el que abrió este foro nos lo agradecería profundamente, como yo lo hago cuando pregunto.


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## jalibusa

Es imperioso iniciar una nomenclatura oficial de cortes de carne (latín por supuesto), tal como hizo Linneo con la fauna y flora hace cientos de años; propongo; _*"Chuletus maximus Iberiae"* _para el corte que hoy nos ocupa.


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## virgenyfurioso

En el restaurante el Campero de Barbate (Cádiz) han conseguido sacarle 23 cortes diferentes al atún. Cortes diferenciados que en muchos casos no tienen nombre ni correspondencia (porque se los ha inventado el cocinero, José Melero). ¿Cómo vamos a traducir eso? Pues con el nombre español, con el que le ha puesto su creador. Si software es software en español porque no hay más cáscaras, chuletón es chuletón en inglés porque no hay un corte equivalente. Y en las cartas, en todo caso, se puede añadir en inglés la explicación, el peso, el sabor y hasta un mapa. Pero llamémoslo chuletón, exportemos una palabra que se lo merece.


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## Monsieur Ghislain

This thread is hilarious. You can't trust dictionaries when it comes to cuts of meat. Since every country has its own way of cutting-up animals, there is a lot of room for misinterpretation. Chuletón is the same cut as the French côte de boeuf and the closest you'll get to that in English is "rib steak large end" or in some cases "rib steak small end". So let's just call it rib steak.


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## fame da lupo

My three favorite steaks are: chuleton (Spain), bife de chorizo (Argentina), and the rib-eye steak (USA).  I don't think this is a coincidence:  they are different cuts from the same part of the cow.

Well, to be totally honest, my favorite is the hanger steak, aka solomillo del carnicero.  Sorry, I had a great chuleton today and am still in the mood.


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## nelliot53

http://www.chuletondebuey.com/ http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=1375435

http://www.jrcasan.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=544 http://www.elcorreogallego.es/galic...-lemos/idEdicion-2009-11-15/idNoticia-487503/


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## Monsieur Ghislain

So that's three votes for rib steak, but the España Directo clip shows what looks like top sirloin. One thing for sure is that none of them are T-bones.


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## Monsieur Ghislain

I take that back. It's not top sirloin, it's strip loin.

So it's either rib steak or strip loin with or without the bone, but it's still not a t-bone.


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