# EN: use of the ellipsis (…) - comment traduire les points de suspension



## pollycat34

This type of punctuation is used a lot in a document I am translating. I keep repeating "and so on", "and so forth". How would you translate this in English, do you have a better way, apart from "etc."?


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## arundhati

You mean it can't be kept like that in English... () ?


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## pollycat34

I am looking for how we would replace the profuse use of "..." in a French book, when translated into English. The French like using the ellipse much more than the English do, and I am looking for a good way to get around this in an English translation. No, it would not be possible to keep all the instances of "..." in English. In the context, this is a particularly French use of punctuation.


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## Moon Palace

You could also write '_etc'. _at times I believe.


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## JeanDeSponde

Apart from this "etc." usage, note that "..." if also often used to indicate that some words have been removed, e.g. for clarity sake when quoting a long sentence.
I.e. you said in your 1st post _How would you translate this in English...apart from "etc."?_
Usually, ellipsis is within brackets ("[...]"), but not always.


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## pollycat34

You're right Jean. I will see if I can keep some of the "..." and translate the others by "and so on" or "etc".


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## Nicosito

I am facing the same question as pollycat34 was about a year and a half ago regarding this "particularly French use of punctuation*"*.

I'll have to find a way around it for each individual sentence. Perhaps there are ways to insinuate something that suits the specific idea each time.

However, if anyone has any generic solution in addition to "etc." and its variants "and so on and so forth", "and all that jazz" "the rest is history" "The rest, dear reader, is for you to imagine" and anything useful that's less clichéd, I'd be grateful.

Nico.


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## xiancee

I think ... are very useful ... no? ... Suspension of disbelief... etc / und so weiter


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## Nicosito

Ok, but this particular use: to insinuate there is something more, to create mystery and incite imagination, to replace "etc." works in French but doesn't exist in English.

Whence the problem of what to replace it with in translating to English.


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## pollycat34

Hi Nicosito,

I'm glad to see someone else knows what I'm talking about. So to all of the people who replied: yes, of course, the "ellipse" is a well-known and useful form of punctuation in English too, no one is disputing that fact. However, there are some instances in French writing when it is used profusely in a particularly French style - and this is where the English text needs to find another worthy equivalent.
So yes, I am asking for English synonyms, but no, this is not a question for the "English only" forums because it is a specific translation problem when translating French (mainly literary) to English texts.


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## Nicosito

[Hi pollycat34, I felt the same way too!]

Xiancee:

Here are a couple, from the blurb on the back of a book (this also contains a third paragraph, and ALL of them end the same aforementioned way):
"Un livre de rêve, indispensable a tous les amateurs de six cordes..." [Sous-entendu: à vous faire rêver, vous les amateurs de guitares aux yeux songeurs et 50 Euros dans la poche.]


So far: "A dream book and a must for all lovers of the six strings"

"Ces guitares devinrent légendaires également parce qu'elles surent séduire de grands guitaristes qui, souvent, leur restèrent fideles tout au long de leur carrière. Ainsi B.B.King et sa Gibson ES 335 nommée Lucille, Jimi Hendrix et sa Stratocaster, George Harrison et sa Rickenbacker 12 cordes électrique, Jimmy Page et sa Les Paul…" 

[Sous-entendu: et cetera, et cetera et y il y en a d'autres et j'en passe -peut être que si tu achètes le livre tu en sauras plus? T'es curieux? Avoue!]

To date: "These guitars also became legends because they were good enough to seduce great guitarists who in many cases stayed faithful to them throughout their careers. Thus we have B.B.King and his Gibson ES 335 named Lucille, Jimi Hendrix and his Stratocaster, George Harrison and his electric, 12-string Rickenbacker, Jimmy Page and his Les Paul"

​Et voila.

Nico.


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## Uncle Bob

Hello,
It seems to me that the two samples given by Nicosito suggest that there may not be a generic solution.
For the second guitar sample one could end with:
"... are just examples."
but that wouldn't fit for the first.
Maybe I'm too pessimistic.


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## Keith Bradford

There is no fast answer. It's very rare that good English style can leave these French dots unchanged, though perhaps in some circumstances...? 

Because in English the '...' means either:

that there are words missed out ("Friends, Romans, countrymen ... I come to bury Caesar...") or else,
they trail off in teasing suspense as I did after "circumstances" above.
In English they don't mean _etc._ and can't be left untranslated.  All the above suggestions are good.


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## Nicosito

Thanks to both of you.

I might go for something like "to name but a few" for the second example, and indeed seek a tailor-made solution for each occurrence -though something tells me this text is going to have a fair number of them....

Nicholas.


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## xiancee

Do you really think that "..." really have to be translated? What about that part of mystery induced by those dreamy dots.... 
Points de suspension  ... suspense!


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## Keith Bradford

xiancee said:


> Do you really think that "..." really have to be translated?


 

Everything in a translation has to be translated. The difference is that some things, when translated, actually look the same -- words like _expansion _or _payable_ or _football_. But everything, including punctuation, ought to pass through the mind of the translator. And most punctuation changes between French and English.

the space disappears before ? and ! and :
guillemets change into inverted commas
most colons should be replaced by a semicolon or a dash
the decimal comma becomes a point
many commas should be replaced by a semicolon, others by _and_ or _or_
...and these dots often have to go!


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## Nicosito

I second Keith Bradford's emotion.

A way around that insinuation of mystery hasn't yet had a specific answer here, though there must be a way -or a multitude of ways- to obtain an equivalent effect.

Nico.


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## MYR974

Salut à tous !

Les anglophones utilisent-il les points de suspension comme en français pour éviter d'exprimer une idée qu'on ne veut pas dire ? ou pour éviter de se lancer dans de longues explications ?

Par exemple :

dans un sens ironique, comme pour signifier que c'est l'évidence même, et que si le lecteur ne comprend pas cela signifie qu'il est stupide.
"_La création artificielle de monnaie causera tôt ou tard de l'inflation. Si vous le savez pas ..._"
Voulant éviter de dire "_c'est que vous ne connaissez pas les principes les plus élémentaires de l'économie_".
dans le sens d'une évidence élémentaire :
"Tu appuies sur le bouton. Rien d'autre ..."
Voulant éviter de dire "_L'appareil fera telles et telles actions automatiquement qui t'évitent de les réaliser toi-même_" (qui seraient longues à détailler).
Merci


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## OLN

Bonjour.

L'ellipse semble consister dans tes exemples à ne pas énoncer une évidence pour l'auteur qui sera blessante pour l'autre. Ça reste inconvenant.

Sur l'emploi des points de suspension en anglais
[…] (fils fusionnés)
All About Ellipses (M-W)

Note : C'est pour moi contre-intuitif de mettre des points de suspension « lourds de sens » après  "rien d'autre" ou "c'est tout". On dirait qu'on hésite (Euh, rien d'autre ne me vient à l'esprit... Je réfléchis encore).
Plutôt : _Tu appuies sur le bouton...._
Ou alors :  _Tu appuies sur le bouton. C'est tout_ +  point ou point d'exclamation.


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## Locape

Apparemment, non :


Keith Bradford said:


> It's very rare that good English style can leave these French dots unchanged, though perhaps in some circumstances...?
> Because in English the '...' means either:
> 
> that there are words missed out ("Friends, Romans, countrymen ... I come to bury Caesar...") or else,
> they trail off in teasing suspense as I did after "circumstances" above.
> In English they don't mean _etc._ and can't be left untranslated.  All the above suggestions are good.


Donc si ces points de suspension n'indiquent pas un suspense, j'ai l'impression qu'il vaut mieux ne pas en mettre du tout.


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