# gemischtes Eis



## kriterio_abroad_uk

Good Evening,

I would like to know the proper way of saying  gemischtes Eis in "Hausgemachtes gemischtes Eis" in English as one of the items on a dessert menu.

Many thanks,


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## Frieder

kriterio_abroad_uk said:


> I would like to know the proper way of saying gemischtes Eis in "Hausgemachtes gemischtes Eis" as one of the items on a dessert menu.


"Homemade mixed ice cream".


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## exgerman

Frieder said:


> "Homemade mixed ice cream".


"Mixed ice cream" sounds very odd in English, since it's all ice cream.  "Spumoni" is the word used in the USA for ice cream containing multiple flavors.


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## Frank78

exgerman said:


> "Mixed ice cream" sounds very odd in English, since it's all ice cream.  "Spumoni" is the word used in the USA for ice cream containing multiple flavors.



"Gemischtes Eis" doesn't mean that all three must be somehow sticking together. A scoop of vanilla, chocolate and stracciatella is also a "gemischtes Eis".


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## Frieder

Or the classic _Fürst Pückler_: vanilla, chocolate, and strawberry ice cream. That's the "gemischtes Eis" par excellence.


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## elroy

Frieder said:


> vanilla, chocolate, and strawberry ice cream.


 That would be Neopolitan ice cream.

I agree that "mixed ice cream" sounds weird.  The best I can think of right now is "multi-flavored."


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## Minnesota Guy

When I google "gemischtes Eis," I get images of bowls of ice cream, each scoop a different flavor. For that, a US menu might say "Ice cream (assorted flavors)" or "Ice cream (your choice of flavors)",  perhaps with details about number of scoops, price, or flavors available. I've seen menus where a dish of three scoops of ice cream is called "trio of ice creams," though to me that seems pretentious.

If it's the case, as with _Fürst Pückler_/Neapolitan, that the flavors are combined in layers, and then served in slices, you might say "ice cream terrine," though the word "terrine" will be unfamiliar to many.

And of course, British usage may be quite different.


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## elroy

I thought of "assorted flavors" but to me that doesn't necessarily mean you get more than one flavor at once.  "Your choice of flavors" may not be accurate, as the flavors could be predetermined.  I actually like "ice cream trio," assuming there are three flavors!  "Ice cream medley" comes to mind - that has the advantage of sounding appropriate for a menu and working for an unspecified number of flavors.


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## Kajjo

This is the typical "gemischtes Eis" from German restaurants nowadays. Quite simple.

More complex ice cream beakers from Italian cafes are a different matter. If you order a "gemischtes Eis" in a better cafe, you can choose which flavors you want and the look and decoration is nicer.

How would you call this simple ice cream (picture) in English? Maybe "assorted ice cream"?


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## elroy

"Assorted ice cream" definitely doesn't work.

"Multi-flavor ice cream bowl" might work.


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## Frieder

elroy said:


> ... might work



So we agree that "gemischtes Eis" is not a dish that's being served in America. 



kriterio_abroad_uk said:


> as one of the items on a dessert menu



Why not give it an exotic name like "homemade _gemischtes Eis_". Or "homemade ice cream variations".


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## elroy

Frieder said:


> So we agree that "gemischtes Eis" is not a dish that's being served in America.


 It is!  I just don't know that there's a single established term for it. 





> Why not give it an exotic name like "homemade _gemischtes Eis_". Or "homemade ice cream variations".


 I'm not sure leaving the German untranslated is warranted; there are ways to express the meaning.

"Ice cream variations" wouldn't typically be understood to refer to flavors, but to things like consistency or style, for example (sundaes and sherbets are different ice cream variations).

My suggestions are:

"multi flavor ice cream bowl" <descriptive>
"ice cream medley" <catchy>


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## Kajjo

_scoops of ice cream with assorted flavors?
_
Probably the best way is a picture accompanying the text. That's how cafes do it in Germany.


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## elroy

"Scoops of ice cream" is weird.  "Ice cream bowl (assorted flavors)" would work.


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## berndf

elroy said:


> "Multi-flavor ice cream bowl" might work.


That would be my idea as well.

_Multi-flavour ice cream/sorbet bowl/cone.

Eis_ can mean both, _ice cream_ and _sorbet_ and it can be served in a bowl or in a cone.


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## elroy

You could just say "multi-flavor ice cream."  You can leave the rest unspecified, as in German.


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## berndf

elroy said:


> You could just say "multi-flavor ice cream."  You can leave the rest unspecified, as in German.


The remaining problem I see is that English has no common term for _ice cream_ and _sorbet_.


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## kriterio_abroad_uk

Many thanks to all of you for your comments!


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## Frank78

berndf said:


> The remaining problem I see is that English has no common term for _ice cream_ and _sorbet_.



Frozen water is also "Eis" 

But seriously, if I read "gemischtes Eis" on the menu I expect "Eiscreme". If I want a "Sorbet" I want to ready it explicitly. And I have never gotten the wrong thing.


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## berndf

Wenn ich _eine Kugel Cassis und eine Kugel Zitrone b_estelle, so ist das auch ein _gemischtes Eis/Glacé_. Und ich würde sicher Sorbet bekommen.


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## Kajjo

Fruchtspeiseeis und Milchspeiseeis sind im Deutschen halt beides Eiscreme oder einfach "Eis". Die Unterscheidung nach Rezeptur ist eher akademischer Natur für die überwältigende Mehrheit -- Schokolade oder Erdbeer in Kugelform in der Waffel sind für alle einfach zwei Eissorten, ganz egal ob man das eine nun mit Sahne und das andere nur auf Wasserbasis herstellt.

Auch in Italien, geradezu dem Mutterland guter Eiskunst, bietet eine Gelateria ja beide Arten von Speiseeisen nebeneinander an ohne die geringste Unterscheidung. Dass Milch- und Fruchtspeise-Eissorten verschiedene Grundrezepte erfordern, ist für jeden logisch.


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## djweaverbeaver

Why not just keep it simple:  *Homemade ice cream ([Your choice of] 3 scoops)*.  I see no need to mentioned that the flavors are assorted if they are listed on the menu.  I think that most people would assume that.  I also like the *Homemade ice cream trio (Your choice)*.

You'll find that some restaurants (at least in the U.S.) will opt for the _newish _word _*housemade *_(sometimes _*house-made*_, but we tend not to like hyphens) instead of *homemade*.  They make the distinction that *homemade *means made in someone's home whereas _*housemade *_means made fresh on the premises of the restaurant (i.e. made "in house" by the cooks/chefs).  _*Housemade *_can makes the product/dish seem more artisanal.  Furthermore, when the restaurant says that a certain dish is "_*homemade*_", it doesn't necessary made at the restaurant.  "*Housemade*" leaves no room for confusion; you know for certain that they've made it themselves.


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## elroy

The thing is, there's a lot we don't know about what exactly the restaurant offers:

Just ice cream, just sorbet, or both? 
How many scoops?
Does the customer choose the flavors, or are they predetermined?
This may be a case where kriterio_abroad_uk has to actually find out the specifics and adapt the translation accordingly. 

"Multi-flavor" is general enough to cover any number of scoops and either predetermined flavors or flavors of the customer's choosing.  The remaining issue, then, is the one Bernd brought up in #17: English doesn't have a term that covers both ice cream and sorbet.  If kriterio_abroad_uk finds out what the restaurant actually offers, he could choose between

homemade multi-flavor ice cream
homemade multi-flavor sorbet
homemade multi-flavor ice cream or sorbet


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## djweaverbeaver

*Eis* in German is used generically the way the way that ice cream is in English, probably even more so. People will still call that even if there is not cream in it, like sorbet/sherbet (See post #21). I think that if the distinction had been really important, they would have included it. I do not like the use of "multi-flavor". What does that mean, that one scoop can have more than one flavor, like when you pass the utensil across Neapolitan ice cream? Does it mean that the flavors are ready set and that i can't choose my own? That's not what was meant by the *gemischtes Eis* I've had in Germany.  It's far from being a clear term. That's why I didn't include such wording in my suggestions.


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## berndf

djweaverbeaver said:


> It's far from being a clear term.


I think the German meaning is rather clear. It is an ice cream and/or sorbet composed of multiple scoops of at least two different flavours.


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## Sowka

Hello 



elroy said:


> homemade multi-flavor ice cream
> homemade multi-flavor sorbet
> homemade multi-flavor ice cream or sorbet


Taking djweaverbeavers thoughts about "multi-flavor" into consideration, how about:
_
Homemade ice cream and sorbet, various/different flavors_?

Edit: After looking at several menus, I think that "gemischtes Eis" is a fixed set in many (or most?) cases. Therefore, I think I'd use "different" for a fixed set and "various" if it's the customer's choice.


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## djweaverbeaver

@berndf, I was referring to "multi-flavor", not to the German.


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## Frieder

berndf said:


> I think the German meaning is rather clear. It is an ice cream and/or sorbet composed of multiple scoops of at least two different flavours.


... and in most cases you don't have a say in what you're going to get. That's part of the deal. So why not call it an _ice-cream surprise_?


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## Kajjo

djweaverbeaver said:


> *Eis* in German is used generically the way the way that ice cream is in English, probably even more so.


Considering this clear statement, ice cream is the correct word here, no matter whether it might be indeed sorbet/sherbet or not. That's a relief and that's how I always used the word and saw it used in England.



djweaverbeaver said:


> I do not like the use of "multi-flavor".


I agree for the the same reasons. 



berndf said:


> I think the German meaning is rather clear. It is an ice cream and/or sorbet composed of multiple scoops of at least two different flavours.


Indeed. Considering now that we do not need to distinguish between ice cream and sherbet, it becomes quite simple...

I still prefer "Ice cream, assorted". It is as free of passion as the German term.


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## berndf

Kajjo said:


> Considering this clear statement, ice cream is the correct word here, no matter whether it might be indeed sorbet/sherbet or not. That's a relief and that's how I always used the word and saw it used in England.


The keyword in djweaverbeaver's comment here is _probably even more so. _I have never heard or seen the term ice cream continously being applied to a sorbet. Nor would I ever call it _Eiscreme_ in German. _Eis_, yes, but not _Eiscreme_. The way I learned the terms as a kid, _Eiscreme_ and _Wassereis_ were opposites within the category _Eis_.


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## elroy

I agree with berndf.  Sorbet is not ice cream.  I feel like you're trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.  There is simply no all-encompassing word in English for "Eis."  The only solution is to find out what the restaurant serves and translate accordingly.


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## djweaverbeaver

@elroy, My point was about the way that people talk about it. In the minds of many people, they will refer to *sorbet/sherbet* as _*ice cream*_, even though it technically isn't, being that it has no dairy (_*sherbet*_ does technically have dairy, just much less butterfat than your typical ice cream would).  Likewise, people think of _*gelato*_ as _*ice cream*_, even though the contents and the process of making are slightly different.  Of course, most restaurants are careful to make the proper distinction. There are legal definitions to abide by as well.

On the other hand, most establishments I've been to sell one type and not the other. It's rare to see _*ice cream*_ and _*sorbet*_ on the same menu, except perhaps a restaurant may offer an assortment of _*sorbets*_ as a dessert but your apple pie à la mode or hot fudge brownie will come with a scoop of _*vanilla ice cream*_ (Eine echte Kalorienbombe!).

In my experience, every time I saw *gemischtes Eis* on a menu in Germany (I don't remember in Austria and have never been to Switzerland), it referred exclusively to_* ice cream*_. I think it's safe to assume that that is still the case here.


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## berndf

djweaverbeaver said:


> @elroy, My point was about the way that people talk about it. In the minds of many people, they will refer to *sorbet/sherbet* as _*ice cream*_, even though it technically isn't, being that it has no dairy (_*sherbet*_ does technically have dairy, just much less butterfat than your typical ice cream would). Likewise, people think of _*gelato*_ as _*ice cream*_, even though the contents and the process of making are slightly different. Of course, most restaurants are careful to make the proper distinction. There are legal definitions to abide by as well.


A real sorbet is:
- water
- sugar
- fruit

Nothing else.


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## elroy

djweaverbeaver said:


> @elroy I think it's safe to assume that that is still the case here.


 If this is for an actual translation, then it's not safe to assume anything.  It is the translator's ethical and professional responsibility to render the original faithfully, accurately, and completely.  If I were translating this menu for an actual client, I would *definitely *check with the client before deciding on a translation.  Anyone who's done a fair amount of traveling has most probably come across at least one menu translation faux pas.  These can be avoided by translators who do whatever it takes to make sure their translation choices are faithful.


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## djweaverbeaver

@berndf,  I know that.  You seem to have missed the point.  I was making a distinction between the way people talk day to day and the way as an all-encompassing term and the way that it would be used in the agro-industry or a culinary setting with more precision.  These terms are legally defined in the United States.  But eEven if you browse online, you'll find that there are many people who refer to _*sorbet ice cream*_.

@elroy, yes, I'm well aware of the necessity of a translator's doing his due diligence, but even in looking a German dessert menus online, I didn't come across any in which term referred to both ice cream and sorbet together.  It seems like it would be a faux pas to mix the two together.


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## Frieder

Would you look at this: we're at # 36 and you're fighting about sorbet and/or ice cream, while the OP just wanted to know what's *gemischtes Eis*. 

Do you wonder why the OP didn't come forward yet? Do you think this is a legal issue? Just give him/her an adequate term that he/she can put on their menu.

So far you didn't like  _homemade mixed ice cream_, _homemade ice cream variations_, _ice cream surprise_, you did come up with _ice cream terrine_ (really??), _ice cream medley_ (greatest hits?) but you didn't find a suitable term for a "gemischtes Eis" yet – though you claim to know the concept of "gemischtes Eis" and it is supposedly served in America, too (a bowl of ice/icecream containing at least three scoops of different flavors – the composition of which is at the discretion of the chef).

The OP is either portuguese or of brasilian nationality. So I presume that he/she just wants to present his patrons with a bilingual (portuguese/english) menue. I don't think you should councel him/her on the legal aspects within his/her country. Just tell us *what it is* .


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## Kajjo

berndf said:


> The way I learned the terms as a kid, _Eiscreme_ and _Wassereis_ were opposites within the category _Eis_.


This is another issue altogether. 

_Wassereis_ is quite solidly frozen water (water-juice-sugar mixtures), usually on a stick to lick on.

_Fruchtspeiseeis oder Sorbet_ contains air and has a softer consistence. Typical cafes offer _Milchspeiseeis (e.g. Vanille, Schokolade, ...) _und _Fruchtspeiseeis (e.g. Erdbeer)_ in form of balls/scoops and simply call it Eis/Eiskugel. In Germany you need to be quite educated to separate the two basic recipes instead of just seeing the different flavors.


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## Frieder

My question would be: How did the OP come up with the term "Hausgemachtes gemischtes Eis" in the first place, being a Portuguese/Brasilian? Where did he/she get this from? Does he/she know what "Hausgemachtes gemischtes Eis" is? So far we didn't have any further input from the OP (maybe it's because this discussion is getting a bit too academic).

@all: PLEASE take a look at #9 and tell us what this is called in English. Can't be too hard, can it?



Kajjo said:


> In Germany you need to be quite educated to separate the two basic recipes instead of just seeing the different flavors.



Just remember: it's just the name of a dish. It can have _any _name the OP (who apparently is not a German and doesn't live in Germany) wishes it to have. He just wanted us to tell him/her what "Hausgemachtes gemischtes Eis" is IN ENGLISH. No more beating about the bush please.

I like Ice Cream Surprise because that's what you're going to get: Ice cream (surprise! there's also sorbet involved), and you don't know what flavors will be in your Cup of Wonder (another beautiful translation). No more suggestions from me though ...


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## berndf

Kajjo said:


> Typical cafes offer _Milchspeiseeis (e.g. Vanille, Schokolade, ...) _und _Fruchtspeiseeis (e.g. Erdbeer)_ in form of balls/scoops and simply call it Eis/Eiskugel.


Yes, _Eis_, but not _Eiscreme_. That term is reserved for varieties that really contain cream or another diary product (milk or yoghurt) or at the very least a vegetarian replacement product. The constituent _-creme _in _Eiscreme_ is not about the consistency of the finished product but about the ingredient (_Sahne_).


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## Kajjo

berndf said:


> Yes, _Eis_, but not _Eiscreme_. That term is reserved for varieties that really contain cream or another diary product (milk or yoghurt) or at the very least a vegetarian replacement product. The constituent _-creme _in _Eiscreme_ is not about the consistency of the finished product but about the ingredient (_Sahne_).


This might be technically true, but is not felt and known by the common consumer. Generally, too, Germans do not associate "Creme" with "Sahne", but with consistency.


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## berndf

Kajjo said:


> This might be technically true, but is not felt and known by the common consumer. Generally, too, Germans do not associate "Creme" with "Sahne", but with consistency.


I am also a consumer and I have never felt it that way.


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## Kajjo

@berndf: Google einfach mal "Eiscreme" und schaue, was da kommt. So fühlt das Volk.


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## Frieder

You made my day


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## berndf

Kajjo said:


> @berndf: Google einfach mal "Eiscreme" und schaue, was da kommt. So fühlt das Volk.


Habe ich. Und damit kannst Du Deine Auffassung schwer belegen. Du musst schon lange scrollen, bis Du unter dem Suchbegriff Eiscreme mal eine Bild von einer Kugel Sorbet findest und wenn, dann in Kombination mit Eiscreme oder/und im Text stehen beide Suchbegriffe, _Eiscreme_ und _Sorbet_.

Und sonst bist Du es doch, der auf "korrektem" Sprachgebrauch besteht, auch wenn eine "falsche" Ausdrucksweise weit verbreitet sein sollte. Ich bin erstaunt, dieses Argument gerade von Dir zu hören.


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## Kajjo

@berndf: Wenn ich nur das Wort "Eiscreme" als Bilder google, dann ergibt sich folgendes Bild der Suchergebnisse, das, so denke ich, keinem Normalbürger irgendwie zu denken geben würde. Erdbeer- und Zitroneneis wird nicht anders betrachtet als Schokolade oder Malaga.

Du hast aber völlig recht, dass ich auf korrekte Begriffe großen Wert legen und ich diskutiere ja auch nicht darüber, dass es korrekt, sinnvoll und wünschenswert ist, Milchspeiseeis und Fruchtspeiseeis sowie Wassereis voneinander zu unterscheiden.

Gleichwohl lege ich natürlich auch Wert darauf, die alltagssprachliche Verwendung von Begriffe realistisch darzustellen und dazu gehört, dass ein gemischtes Eis sowohl Fruchtspeise- wie auch Milchspeisesorten beliebig enthalten kann und, leider (!), auch das Wort Eiscreme nicht beschränkt auf Milchspeisevarianten verwendet wird, auch wenn dies unschön sein mag.

An unsere englischen Muttersprachler: Wird denn in England und den USA wirklich so streng zwischen Erdbee- und Vanilleeis unterschieden? Wie verbreitet ist denn "sorbet/sherbet" wirklich im Sprachgebrauch? Würde sicher kein Engländer zu einer Kugel Erdbeereis "a scoop/ball of strawberry ice cream" sagen?


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## berndf

Kajjo said:


> Wird denn in England und den USA wirklich so streng zwischen Erdbee- und Vanilleeis unterschieden?


Von den Erdbeereiskugeln in den Fotos ist keine ein Erbeersorbet. Es handelt sich bei allen um Eiscreme mit Erdbeeraroma. Bei drei violetten Kugeln könnte es sich um Heidelbeer- oder Cassissorbet handeln. Ich kann es aber nicht mit Bestimmtheit sagen, die Bilder sind zu klein.

Erdbeersorbet sieht so aus.


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## Kajjo

Wie bezeichnest du denn Fruchtspeiseeis ohne Milchanteil? Typischerweise enthalten Fruchtspeisesorten wie Zitroneneis eben KEINEN Milchanteil.


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## berndf

Zitroneneis ist meist Sorbet und insofern auch keine Eiscreme. Es gibt aber auch Eiscreme mit Zitronenaroma. Wettbewerbsrechtlich ist der Begriff Eiscreme an das Vorhandensein von mindestens 10% Fett in der Masse gebunden. Sorbets dürfen darum im Handel auch nicht als _Eiscreme _angeboten werden, wohl aber als _Eis_.

Viele (eigentlich sogar die meisten) industrielle Eiscremesorten enthalten dieses Fett in Form von Palmöl und enthalten keine Milchprodukte.

Da, anders als z.B. in Frankreich, Sorbet im gesamten Eisangebot sowohl in Deutschland als auch in den meisten englischsprachigen Ländern eher von untergeordneter Bedeutung ist, ist die Ungenauigkeit bei der Übersetzung _Eis > ice cream_ vielleicht auch eine, mit der man leben kann. Meine Bemerkung in #17, an der sich diese Diskussion entzündet hatte, sollte insofern nicht überdramatisiert werden. Ich wollte nur, das wir uns dessen Bewusst sind, das _Eis_ und _ice cream_ nicht dasselbe ist.


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## djweaverbeaver

@Kajjo, to answer your question, which will perhaps complicate things, the frozen dessert exists in all three forms with strawberries: *strawberry ice cream, strawberry sherbet, *and* strawberry sorbet*. 

The *strawberry ice cream* is the one you are most likely to find. It's a flavor that is part of Neapolitan ice cream, and of the three, it has the highest dairy content. 

The *strawberry sherbet*, to my knowledge, doesn't exist in the UK, where *sherbet* means something entirely different. Here in the US, *sherbet* (very often mispronounced as "sherbert", which I've probably heard more often than the correct "sher-bit"), unlike ice cream, is always fruit-based, either from the actual fruit or fruit juice. However, it has a much lower dairy content, which is defined by law.  Sherbet, especially, strawberry-, peach-, watermelon-, mango- or lime-flavored, is a very common ingredient in some punch recipes at parties or floats in the summertime (both are beverages).

*Strawberry sorbet* is, perhaps IMO, the one that historically has been the least common, but it has recently grown in popularity over the last 20-30 years, along with *sorbet* in general. Like sherbert,  sorbet is always fruit-based, but unlike it, sorbet has no dairy.

I think there are actually many people who don't know the difference between *sherbet* and *sorbet*. Dairy-based ice creams are still more popular in the United States,  but I think that *sorbet* and *gelato* evoke something perhaps a little foreign and artisanal, which means they can be sold at a slighter price, even if they all mean different things and difference processes of production. 

As to the question in the OP, I still think that saying "*Ice Cream, X scoops*" is the least ambiguous way of saying it, especially if you're giving the customer a list of flavors to choose from.


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## Kajjo

@djweaverbeaver: Thank you for the explanation.


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## elroy

I just saw this on a menu: “ice cream and sorbet *sampler*.”  “Sampler”!  I can’t believe no one thought of this word.  It’s perfect in this context.


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## JClaudeK

A “ice cream and sorbet *sampler*.” seems to be much more sophisticated than a simple "gemischtes Eis" (- das „Nullachtfuffzehn“-Dessert _par excellence_!)


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## Demiurg

JClaudeK said:


> A “ice cream and sorbet *sampler*.” seems to be much more sophisticated than a simple "gemischtes Eis" (- das „Nullachtfuffzehn“-Dessert _par excellence_!)


Genau. Im Deutschen wären da mindestens zwei Präpositionen fällig:

_Variationen von Sorbet an Waldfrüchten der Saison_


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## berndf

Das ist Haute-Cuisine-Sprech: Französisch mit deutschen Wörtern.

_Variations de sorbet aux fruits des bois._


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## JClaudeK

berndf said:


> Das ist Haute-Cuisine-Sprech


In "besseren" Lokalen ist das nun mal so üblich, da steht kein "gemischtes Eis" auf der Karte.


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## elroy

A “sampler” in English can be anything; it doesn’t have to be fancy or sophisticated. The word is very commonly used in American gastronomical parlance.  I think it’s a good fit.


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## Schlabberlatz

berndf said:


> Das ist Haute-Cuisine-Sprech: Französisch mit deutschen Wörtern.
> 
> _Variations de sorbet aux fruits des bois._


Daher kommt also dieses gruselige „an“. Wieder was gelernt hier im Forum, danke für den Beitrag.


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