# تصبح على خير



## linguist786

السلام عليكم

I have a quick question. Does تصبح على خير mean "Good night" or "Good morning"?  

I've always thought it meant "Good night", but somebody just suggested to me that it means "Good morning" because the first word "tuSbi7" comes from "Sabaa7".
I thought he had a good point!

But then I thought the phrase may means something poetic like "may you reach the morning safely" or something 

So.. ?

شكرًا جزيلاً


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## CarlosPerezMartinez

It is good night. And you are right, the meaning is something like (I hope) you will wake up (in the morning) well.


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## linguist786

That's great 

Can somebody explain where "tuSbi7" comes from and what its literal meaning is?
I take it it's being used as a verb here?


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## CarlosPerezMartinez

The verb is أصبح (aSba7a). The meaning: wake up, get up, awake, arouse... Check: http://qamoos.sakhr.com


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## linguist786

That's excellent! Thanks so much.

So the whole phrase would mean something like:
"(may) you wake up (i.e. in the morning) with goodness"

(correct me if I'm wrong)


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## CarlosPerezMartinez

linguist786 said:


> That's excellent! Thanks so much.
> 
> So the whole phrase would mean something like:
> "(may) you wake up (i.e. in the morning) with goodness"
> 
> (correct me if I'm wrong)


 
Exactly


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## elroy

Actually, the verb does not technically mean "wake up" but something like "greet the morning."  99% of the time, this is done by waking up, and that's why the distinction has been blurred.  However, you would not use this verb if you took a nap in the afternoon and woke up at, say, 4 p.m.


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## Sidjanga

But why does it mean "wake up" or "greet the morning"? (like in an imperative or wish)

What verb forms are تصبح\تصبحين\تصبحون here?


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## Josh_

All the forms are you -- تصبح, masculine singular; تصبحين, feminine singular; تصبحون, masculine plural; تصبحن, feminine plural;  تصبحان, masculine/feminine dual.  I don't think it is used in the first and third persons.

I'm not sure I understand your first question.  Are you asking if it is an imperative or a wish?  If so, it expresses a wish or a hope (an optative construction) -- may you wake up/greet the morning with goodness.


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## Sidjanga

Thanks, Josh.





Josh_ said:


> I'm not sure I understand your first question.  Are you asking if it is an imperative or a wish?  If so, it expresses a wish or a hope (an optative construction) -- may you wake up/greet the morning with goodness.


Yes - and it was actually meant to be just one question, though in two parts. 

I mean, apart from the situational context, how can I tell that it's meant to be a wish or hope?
What makes the expression an "optative construction", and how do I recognise it in other contexts?
I thought the verb forms used are just مضارع مرفوع - but maybe they aren't?


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## Saudi Muslim

> But then I thought the phrase may means something poetic like "may you reach the morning safely" or something


 
you are totally right

Good morning: صباح الخير
Good evining:مساء الخير
Good night: تصبح على خير /ليلة سعيدة


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## Sidjanga

Sidjanga said:


> I mean, apart from the situational context, how can I tell that it's meant to be a wish or hope?
> What makes the expression an "optative construction", and how do I recognise it in other contexts?
> I thought the verb forms used are just مضارع مرفوع - but maybe they aren't?


Hm.., تصبحين, تصبح aren't impertatives, are they?


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## clevermizo

Sidjanga said:


> Hm.., تصبحين, تصبح aren't impertatives, are they?



They are not imperatives, that's right.

I think you should understand this as a fixed expression. Perhaps abbreviated for إن شاء الله تصبح على خير or something else.


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## elroy

clevermizo said:


> Perhaps abbreviated for إن شاء الله تصبح على خير or something else.


 Perhaps, but there are other expressions in which the present tense without _b-_ is used with a subjunctive meaning.

Some examples: الله يباركك، (الله) يعطيك العافية، تروح وتيجي بالسلامة.

It's the equivalent of the Spanish "_que _+ [subjunctivo]."


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## Sidjanga

elroy said:


> ..., but there are other expressions in which the present tense without _b-_ is used with a subjunctive meaning.
> 
> Some examples: الله يباركك، (الله) يعطيك العافية، تروح وتيجي بالسلامة.
> 
> It's the equivalent of the Spanish "_que _+ [subjunctivo]."


So it's as simple as that?
So تصبح على خير  is simply (always?) عامية anyway - and not (ever?) MSA, where, as far as I understand, that clear distinction between indicative and subjunctive meaning wouldn't be possible here, or at least not like this?


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## clevermizo

elroy said:


> Perhaps, but there are other expressions in which the present tense without _b-_ is used with a subjunctive meaning.
> 
> Some examples: الله يباركك، (الله) يعطيك العافية، تروح وتيجي بالسلامة.
> 
> It's the equivalent of the Spanish "_que _+ [subjunctivo]."



Of course, but I thought we were talking about Fus7a (I thought that was Sidjanga's question). Yes, in colloquial Levantine, if you leave off the b- prefix you can create an optative clause so there are lots of examples of this, plus a few threads too I think.


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## Sidjanga

clevermizo said:


> Of course, but I thought we were talking about Fus7a (I thought that was Sidjanga's question)..


Well, I too _thought _that was my question  - _if _تصبح على خير exists in MSA proper, that is.


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## elroy

Yes, it exists in MSA, as far as I know.  Usually, this meaning is expressed using the _past tense_ in MSA (باركك الله), which is theoretically ambiguous as well but in practice context makes the meaning clear.


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## Abu Rashid

> Actually, the verb does not technically mean "wake up" but something  like "greet the morning."



Technically doesn't it mean "became"? As in "what state did you find yourself in this morning" or "what has become of you today"?


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## elroy

Abu Rashid said:


> Technically doesn't it mean "became"? As in "what state did you find yourself in this morning" or "what has become of you today"?


 I don't think so.  I think that in this context, the word is related to صباح ("morning").


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## Abu Rashid

From my understanding of the following hadith, the two meanings are not so distinct, and merge in a sense. The question appears to have been understood (by the one questioned) to be inquiring about his state that day or even in general.

*فقال رسول الله  صلى الله عليه وسلم :  كيف أصبحت يا حارثة؟ قال :  أصبحت والله مؤمناً حقاً*


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## elroy

Well, obviously the verb أصبح also means "to become."  I just think that in this particular context, it has another meaning.  "Become" wouldn't really make sense.  If that were the meaning, then you be able to use the expression at any time of the day to refer to any other time of the day.  Also, "may you become okay" would imply that you are not okay now.  But the expression just means "May you be okay in the morning (when you wake up)."


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## Abu Rashid

> Well, obviously the verb أصبح also means "to become."


I'm just suggesting that perhaps the meanings in Arabic are not so distinct. That's the way I was taught the meaning of this word anyway. That it covers the meaning of "started the day" and "became" in one, since these two concepts share a similar meaning.

In the hadith, it seems the question asked was more approaching "How's your morning?" or "How did you wake up?", whilst the answer approaches more the meaning of "I have become...".



> But the expression just means "May you be okay in the morning (when you  wake up)."



I agree, but was just trying to expand on your point about the "technical meaning of the verb".


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## Josh_

Sidjanga said:


> Thanks, Josh.Yes - and it was actually meant to be just one question, though in two parts.
> 
> I mean, apart from the situational context, how can I tell that it's meant to be a wish or hope?
> What makes the expression an "optative construction", and how do I recognise it in other contexts?
> I thought the verb forms used are just مضارع مرفوع - but maybe they aren't?


Sorry to not respond earlier.  Others have already responded in the meantime, but I thought I would respond with my own response anyway.  I think you could tell if a sentence is optative if the verb is used like it is an imperative (directed at "you"), but is not conjugated like an imperative.  However, I imagine context would still be needed in many cases (at least in written texts) as it still may not be clear that the verb is meant to be a hope/wish, except in the set expressions like تصبح على الخير and الله يبارك فيك and others.



Abu Rashid said:


> Technically doesn't it mean "became"? As in "what state did you find yourself in this morning" or "what has become of you today"?


Yes, the meanings are related, but أصبح and other أخوات كان (as well as other deficient verbs) are used in two ways -- they are used as أفعال ناقصة deficient verbs to express the idea of الصيرورة becomingness (or other functions) and as أفعال تامّة full verbs used to express the idea of the root.  Below, I offer an Arabic explanation of this (along with my translation):

أَصْبَحَ:
١. فِعل ماضٍ ناقص مِن أَخوات كان يَدْخل على الجملة الاسمية فيَرفَع المبتدأ ويُسمَّى اسمه ويَنصب الخبر ويُسمَّى خبره: *أصبح المَطَر غَزيرًا*. هذا الفعل يتصرّف تَصَرُّفًا تامًا.
٢. فِعل تامٌّ إذا جُرِّدَ مِن معنى الصيرورة: *أَصْبَحَ أي دَخَلَ في الصَباح*.


aSbaHa:
1. A deficient past tense verb belonging to the sisters of _kaana_.  It is added to a nominal sentence and puts the _mubtada_ in the _raf3_ case, which is then called its _ism_, and puts the _khabar_ in the _naSb_ case, which is then called its _khabar_: The rain became abundant. This verb is fully conjugated.

2.  A full verb, if stripped of the meaning of becomingness: _aSbaHa_ (he/it started/came/reached (in) the morning), i.e. he/it entered in the morning.

Now, as far as its use as a deficient verb is concerned, originally, the meaning was probably "to become in the morning" so that أصبح المَطَر غَزيرًا would have originally meant "The rain became abundant in the morning" but that now it simply means "become."

Other verbs that express "becomingness" (e.g. أمسى، بات، أضحى، صار) are like this as well -- they are used as deficient verbs to express الصيرورة and as full verbs to express the meaning of the root:

أمسى الجوُّ باردًا 
The weather became cold.
(Perhaps originally "The weather became cold in the evening.")

أمسى زيدٌ فَسَهِرَ
Zeid reached the evening and stayed up for the night.

أضحى القمح خبزًا
The wheat became bread.

أضحيتُ وأنا مريضٌ
I reached/started the early morning sick.

بات زيدٌ ساهرًا
Zeid became/remained awake at night.

بات القائدٌ في خيمة 
The leader spent the night in a tent.

صار وُدّ الناس خِبًّا
The people's affection became [an act of] dissimulation.

صارت القضية عند المسؤول
The matter got to the responsible party.


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## Faylasoof

I’m coming to this late but thought I might add something here  ... and I see Josh has already posted(!) so I have trimmed mine.

As I recall it -and this is going back a long time- the earlier expression might have been: لِتُصبح على خير

There was even a suggestion that earlier still it might have been used as part of a longer expression that employed the ending clause: فَلتُصبِح عَلى خَير

Over time, however, it became just تُصبِح عَلى خَيرٍand this how we use it now.

Certainly both the subjunctive المضارع المنصوب and the jussive المضارع المجزومcan take the introducing particle لِ, so we have, for example: 

لِیَفرَح طُولَ حَیاتِهِ
May he rejoice throughout his life.

Same construct as لِتُصبح على خير.

Any thoughts on all this Josh? 

Also, as Elroy and Josh (with copious examples!) have already elaborated, أصبح has more than one meaning:
أصبح = to enter upon in the morning,  do in the morning, be / become / happen _in the morning_; awake; to become / reach a state, to be / turn / grow.

أصبح على خير is usually idiomatically translated as: 
To have a good morning / To begin the day well.

تُصبح على خير = May you be well in the morning / May you be well tomorrow.


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## Josh_

That sounds plausible to me.  I even thought that it sounded similar to adding either a لـ or a فلـ in front of a verb form, which is an indirect command of sorts which could express hope or wish.


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## Sidjanga

By the way, is there a particular reply to تصبح على خير ?


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## AndyRoo

Sidjanga said:


> By the way, is there a particular reply to تصبح على خير ?


 
Yes - it's:

وأنت من أهله
wa-'anta min 'ahluh
which means "and you are one of its [goodness's] people"


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## Faylasoof

Josh_ said:


> That sounds plausible to me.  I even thought that it sounded similar to adding either a لـ or a فلـ in front of a verb form, which is an indirect command of sorts which could express hope or wish.


  Yes, that is how we make a jussive المضارع  المجزوم. So most likely it started as a bona fide jussive, then mutated to its present form!


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