# τα περί



## ianis

When τα appears unrelated to the elements of a sentence like in τα περί and both followed by a noun in the genitive like τα περί ανθρώπου, can this convey the meaning of "things concerning man", that is can τα mean "the things" or "the aspects", or is this to be taken as an idiomatic use of the word that doesn't need to be in conformity with the rest (which in this to be honest would render the sentence a bit confusing)?


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## dmtrs

The article ο, η, το (in plural also), when used with a word (that is not a noun) or an expression, turns that word/expression into a 'noun' : το αύριο (='the' tomorrow -as a noun) / το λέγε λέγε (='the' repeating some proposition etc.).
The article might also remain when the noun it used to accompany is omitted (same thing in English, I believe) giving the false idea that it accompanies the 'wrong' thing:
οι επάνω (=the [people] upstairs -consider 'the above' in English).
Therefore 'τα περί ανθρώπου' should be understood as 'τα περί ανθρώπου [πράγματα/απόψεις κλπ.]' as you very well understood. Τhe negative article sometimes replaces the other genders (οι περί ανθρώπου απόψεις > τα περί ανθρώπου).


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## ianis

dmtrs said:


> The article ο, η, το (in plural also), when used with a word (that is not a noun) or an expression, turns that word/expression into a 'noun' : το αύριο (='the' tomorrow -as a noun) / το λέγε λέγε (='the' repeating some proposition etc.).
> The article might also remain when the noun it used to accompany is omitted (same thing in English, I believe) giving the false idea that it accompanies the 'wrong' thing:
> οι επάνω (=the [people] upstairs -consider 'the above' in English).
> Therefore 'τα περί ανθρώπου' should be understood as 'τα περί ανθρώπου [πράγματα/απόψεις κλπ.]' as you very well understood. Τhe negative article sometimes replaces the other genders (οι περί ανθρώπου απόψεις > τα περί ανθρώπου).


Thank you very much dmtrs, only one objection, previously it only seemed to me, the "very well understood" was only after your detailed explanation.


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## dmtrs




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## Helleno File

So it would be "Πάντα σκέπτομαι για *το* εδώ όταν θέλω να χαλαρώσω στην Αγγλία". Or even "για το να 'μαι εδώ", connecting with a recent thread - "about [me] being here"


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## dmtrs

Helleno File said:


> So it would be "Πάντα σκέπτομαι για *το* εδώ όταν θέλω να χαλαρώσω στην Αγγλία". Or even "για το να 'μαι εδώ"



Both sentences are right. The word 'για' though is not necessary (in both phrases); it would be probably omitted by a native speaker.


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## Helleno File

Thanks dmtrs. I'm shocked to find I'd never realised σκέπτομαι is transitive and so doesn't need για.  I've checked all my dictionaries including Τριανταφυλλίδης on line and a long entry in Σταυρόπουλος Ελληνικό-Αγγλικό and there is not one example with για. Another case of continuing to to "think" in English!


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## Perseas

Helleno File said:


> I've checked all my dictionaries including Τριανταφυλλίδης on line and a long entry in Σταυρόπουλος Ελληνικό-Αγγλικό and there is not one example with για.


"Σκέφτομαι" is mainly used as transitive, but the construction with "για" is not unusal.
For example: Mε σκέφτεσαι; vs Τι σκέφτεσαι για μένα;


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## Helleno File

Thanks  Perseas. That gives me a bit of a feel for it.


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## Perseas

Helleno File said:


> Thanks  Perseas. That gives me a bit of a feel for it.


You're welcome, Helleno File.

Just a note more:
Με σκέφτεσαι; -- The object of the verb is "Με" and it is in accusative.
Τι σκέφτεσαι για μένα; -- The object is "Τι" (in accusative) and "για μένα" is a prepositional phrase stating reference/relation (I am not sure for the English word, in Greek it's αναφορά).


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## Yiagos

Something VERY, yeah VERY important!!!!!

You cannot translate word by word (not from English to Greek, but from any other language to other one).....
When you say => με σκέφτεσαι; (note the semicolon indicates question) the word με could be translated to me => Αre you thinking me?
In Greek grammar με is a preposition and all Greek prepositions are single (no plural=πληθυντικός).
Tι could be translated such as what => τι έπαθες κι είσαι θυμωμένος; => what's the matter with you and you are angry?


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## dmtrs

Yiagos said:


> In Greek grammar με is a preposition



In the phrase "με σκέφτεσαι;" 'με' is NOT a preposition; it is a (weak form of) the personal pronoun (εγώ, εμένα/μου, εμένα/με) and, of course it can be in plural (εμείς, εμάς/μας, εμάς/μας).


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## Yiagos

Σωστά είναι προσωπική αντωνυμία (personal pronoun) για το παράδειγμα που λες (γράψε λάθος)  και οι αντωνυμίες έχουν πληθυντικό.

Όμως => I doubt the words and phrases in red => Aμφιβάλλω για τις λέξεις και τις φράσεις με κόκκινο χρώμα => εδώ είναι πρόθεση (preposition).


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