# Ipse / Suus



## bluetoonwithcarrotandnail

'I denied myself' is the reflexive (Me) 

the intensive counterpart should be 

'You yourself denied me' (Ipse) 

Correct? 

Further, if you change 'They will fight to the death,' from the intensive 
to the reflexive you should get: 

'They will fight themselves to the death' 

in which case 'themselves' is reflexive 

If the sentence was 

'They will fight themselves and ourselves to the death' 

then 'themselves' is reflexive and 'ourselves' is intensive 

Correct? 

Thanks.


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## jazyk

I think it is, but it would help if you put some examples in Latin, since different languages have different ways of doing things.


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## bluetoonwithcarrotandnail

bluetoonwithcarrotandnail said:


> 'I denied myself' is the reflexive
> the intensive counterpart should be
> 'You yourself denied me'
> 
> Further, if you change 'They will fight to the death,' from the intensive
> to the reflexive you should get
> 'They will fight themselves to the death'
> in which case 'themselves' is reflexive
> 
> If the sentence was
> 'They will fight themselves and ourselves to the death'
> then 'themselves' is reflexive and 'ourselves' is intensive



Attempting to translate into Latin

'I see myself' is reflexive 'ME SPECTO'

The reflexive counterpart is

'You yourself see me' or 'IPSE SPECTO'

Further, the sentence 'They will fight to the death' from intensive
to reflexive you should get 

'They will fight themselves to the death' or 'SUUS AD MORTEM PUGNANT'

In which case 'themselves' is reflexive (SUUS)

If the sentence was 'They will fight themselves and ourselves to the death'
then it is

'SUUS AD MORTEM ATQUE NOBIS PUGNANT'

in which case 'themselves' is reflexive (SUUS) and 'oursevles' is intensive 
(NOBIS)

Correct?

Thanks.


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## jazyk

Attempting to translate into Latin

'I see myself' is reflexive 'ME SPECTO' 

The reflexive counterpart is

'You yourself see me' or 'IPSE SPECTO' 
Tu ipse me spectas.

Further, the sentence 'They will fight to the death' from intensive
to reflexive you should get 

'They will fight themselves to the death' or 'SUUS AD MORTEM PUGNANT' 

Suus is a possessive adjective (his, her, its, theirs). The verb without _themselves_ should be used (I at least can't think of a better way): Ad mortem pugnabunt.


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## bluetoonwithcarrotandnail

jazyk said:


> 'They will fight themselves to the death' or 'SUUS AD MORTEM PUGNANT'
> 
> Suus is a possessive adjective (his, her, its, theirs). The verb without _themselves_ should be used (I at least can't think of a better way): Ad mortem pugnabunt.



If AD MORTEM PUGNABUNT is correct then what if you add 'ourselves' into it
to say, 'They will fight themselves and ourselves to the death'?

Is it 'AD MORTEM ET NOS PUGNABANT'

Thanks.


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## jazyk

I think you'd have to use the preposition cum (with) in Latin: Ad mortem et nobiscum pugnabunt.


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## bluetoonwithcarrotandnail

jazyk said:


> Suus is a possessive adjective (his, her, its, theirs). The verb without _themselves_ should be used (I at least can't think of a better way): Ad mortem pugnabunt.



Can you give me an example of a sentence which has 'Suus' and 'Ipse'
both in it instead of the the problems we ran into with 'AD MORTEM
PUGNABUNT' where neither of the two pronouns was seen?

Thanks.


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## jazyk

Ipse rex equites suos portavit. The king himself brought his own horsemen.


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