# Κατ’ αρχήν / κατ’ αρχάς



## larshgf

Κατ’ αρχήν / κατ’ αρχάς
- any difference in meaning of these two expressions?
- what i κατ΄ an abreviation for?


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## ioanell

larshgf said:


> Κατ’ αρχήν / κατ’ αρχάς
> - any difference in meaning of these two expressions?
> - what i κατ΄ an abreviation for?


Κατ’ αρχήν: it means: in principle (Lat. in principio), in the basic points, as a general idea or plan, e.g. "το νομοσχέδιο ψηφίστηκε κατ΄ αρχήν" / "the bill passed in principle", that is "it was accepted in its basic points" or "Η κυβέρνηση συμφώνησε κατ' αρχήν σε αύξηση των μισθών" / "the government agreed in principle to raise wages". Also in the meaning: "According to one's own basic beliefs", e.g. "Κατ΄αρχήν διαφωνώ έντονα μ΄αυτήν την ιδέα" / "As a matter of principle I strongly disagree with this idea".

Κατ΄αρχάς: it means: in the beginning, firstly (in a narration which describes successive time phases), “Κατ΄αρχάς ήταν νευρικός, μετά όμως ηρέμησε και άρχισε να συζητά” / “In the beginning he was nervous, but then he calmed down and started talking”

The preposition _κατά _undergoes an elision and becomes _κατ΄_as the following word starts with a vowel.


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## larshgf

Thank you so much ioanell!


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## Helleno File

Are there less formal ways of saying both of these?  I think στην αρχή for in the beginning is right.


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## διαφορετικός

According to im Prinzip - Deutsch-Griechisch Übersetzung | PONS , "in principle" can also be translated as "στην ουσία". Well, probably it doesn't mean exactly the same, but in principle, the difference does not matter.


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## ioanell

διαφορετικός said:


> "in principle" can also be translated as "στην ουσία".


Such a meaning (στην ουσία) of the phrase "κατ΄αρχήν" does not exist in the Greek language.
The opposite of this meaning (στην ουσία=στην πράξη) exists in the English language as the phrase "in principle" is equivalent to "theoretically" and can be translated in Greek as "θεωρητικά / στη θεωρία ≠ στην πράξη". See 1.1  IN PRINCIPLE | Meaning & Definition for UK English | Lexico.com


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## sotos

Helleno File said:


> Are there less formal ways of saying both of these?  I think στην αρχή for in the beginning is right.


Κατ' αρχήν can be "για λόγους αρχής", but not when used in legal context.
Κατ' αρχάς can be replaced with "Για αρχή".  "Στην αρχή" can be used in some cases, but not always. 
.


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## διαφορετικός

ioanell said:


> Such a meaning (στην ουσία) of the phrase "κατ΄αρχήν" does not exist in the Greek language.
> The opposite of this meaning (στην ουσία=στην πράξη) exists in the English language as the phrase "in principle" is equivalent to "theoretically" and can be translated in Greek as "θεωρητικά / στη θεωρία ≠ στην πράξη". See 1.1  IN PRINCIPLE | Meaning & Definition for UK English | Lexico.com


In the English and the Greek language respectively, these expressions seem (according to your comment) to be used in a less sloppy way than the German expression "im Prinzip", which should, in principle, mean the same.


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## ioanell

διαφορετικός said:


> these expressions seem (according to your comment) to be used in a less sloppy way


In my opinion, yes.


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## Helleno File

Thanks everybody, great answers.  Looks like κατ' αρχήν if I'm happy with being formal, otherwise θεωρητικά covers it in quite a lot of situations.


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## ioanell

Helleno File said:


> otherwise θεωρητικά covers it in quite a lot of situations.


When I wrote θεωρητικά above Ι simply contradicted the meaning "στην ουσία/στην πράξη" that the dictionary Deutsch-Griechisch Übersetzung erroneously proposed for "in principle" and said that this phrase ("in principle") can have exactly the opposite meaning, that is "theoretically/θεωρητικά", in English, but not in Greek. I must apologise, if I misled you in a way. I refer you to my comment in #2 above as it stands, along with your correct suggestion for a less formal rendition of _κατ΄αρχάς_, that is _στην αρχή_.


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## Helleno File

Thanks Ioanell - you haven't misled me! It depends on what kind of principle we are talking about in English. Strictly, as I think your comment above seems to be based on, a principle is a guiding belief, moral rule etc (Wiktionary).  Θεωρητικά is very unlikely to be right for this, as you suggest. When we say "in principle" in everyday speech, however, we are not usually thinking of "first principles" (does Greek have this phrase?). It sums up a thought process that is probably just beginning and designates the accompanying statement as the speaker's current position on the matter subject to further information or experience. Θεωρητικά works well for this. Example:

_My neighbour_ (recently) to me: "Can I park my car on your drive  next week while the workmen fixing my roof park on mine?" 

_Me_: "Yes, in principle. But I may have someone needing to park on one of the days." 

We also say "_on_ principle" which is much more in the area of a moral argument: "I'm against smacking children on principle". There is some discussion about this on the English Only forum, for example here.


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