# The "ν" sound after "μ" + nonsyllabic "i"



## panettonea

Αγγελος mentioned that words in which μ is followed by an "i" sound that has lost its syllabic value, such as μια, have an "ν" sound after the "μ."  Assuming I understood him correctly, that would mean that _μια_ should sound like _mnya_.  

However, I find it difficult to pronounce the word that way.  Pronouncing it _mya_ is so much easier.  Is it wrong to say it that way, or  is the "ν" sound so subtle that you can hardly hear it anyway?


----------



## Perseas

You can hear the pronunciation of _μια_ here, just click on the right arrow next to Audio: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/μια


----------



## panettonea

Perseas said:


> You can hear the pronunciation of _μια_ here, just click on the right arrow next to Audio: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/μια



Thanks, Perseas.  Well, do some Greeks pronounce it differently?  Here are some examples in which I cannot hear the "ν" sound at all:

*http://tinyurl.com/muxnze5
**http://tinyurl.com/ld4bqdo
* 
And two instances of μια on this page:

https://www.greekpod101.com/greek-word-lists/?page=1


----------



## Perseas

Maybe in "my link" the sound of "n" (which is actually *ɲ*) is a bit stronger but I can hear this sound in the other examples too. 
In this example I hear rather μία than μια:http://el.forvo.com/word/ένα_θέμα_το_οποίο_απαιτεί_μια_απάντηση/#el
Here in the second example it is clearly μία (ώρα), not μια (ώρα):    https://www.greekpod101.com/greek-word-lists/?page=1
(In all the other examples I hear the sound *ɲ*)


----------



## panettonea

Perseas said:


> Here in the second example it is clearly μία (ώρα), not μια (ώρα):    https://www.greekpod101.com/greek-word-lists/?page=1
> (In all the other examples I hear the sound *ɲ*)



Really?  Perhaps one has to be a native speaker of Greek to hear the "n" in those clips then, because I really can't hear it.  Maybe that means that even if I can't hear _myself_ saying the *ɲ*, a native speaker could.   

Incidentally, this page lists both _mɲa _and _mja, _but perhaps the latter is not "official."

http://vocing.com/Greek-English/μια

This reminds me a bit of English.  Most English dictionaries will tell you that the vowel sound in "bat" is the same as the vowel sound in "bank."  Nonsense.  I don't know anybody who pronounces those vowels the same.  Maybe in other places they do, but not in the U.S.


----------



## panettonea

This is interesting.  I asked my mother how she pronounces μια.  To give some background, when my grandparents were growing up in rural Greece (over 100 years ago), education was rare.  At most, children got about a second- or third-grade education, and often the girls got none.  So, my grandparents spoke uneducated peasant Greek.  For instance, my maternal grandmother, who was never allowed to go to school at all, used to pronounce έτσι _etch_.  My parents were born in the U.S., so their Greek was second-generation uneducated peasant Greek , which unfortunately they didn't even pass on to their children.     

Anyway, my mother clearly pronounces the ν in μια, but with an interesting twist--she adds a vowel between the μ and the ν:  _*min*ya_.  I guess folks in Greece would get a kick out of that one.


----------



## Αγγελος

As long as the vowel she inserts is more in the nature of an ι than of an ου...


----------



## panettonea

Αγγελος said:


> As long as the vowel she inserts is more in the nature of an ι than of an ου...



It definitely is.  And with the help of a dictionary, I think I understand your concerns.


----------

