# Dwoje Dzieci or Dwójka dzieci?



## stelingo

Dwoje Dzieci or Dwójka dzieci

Are these 2 expressions interchangeable or is there a difference in meaning. And is dwójka declined like a regular feminine noun?

Thanks


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## LilianaB

I would say: _dwoje dzieci_, but many people say _dwójka dzieci_. I think the second one is more coloquial, or a regional variation.
Please wait for other opinions as well. I don't believe they are totally interchangeable.


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## Roger1

Forma zależy to od sytuacji w której się stosuje to określenie. Wydaje mi się, że „dwójka dzieci” jest bardziej potoczną formą (IMHO).


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## dreamlike

I can't think of any difference between these two other than the register. As it has been rightly suggested, "dwójka" is less formal. Note how using those have a bearing on the sentence:

_W klasie była tylko dwójka dzieci.
W klasie było tylko dwoje dzieci. _


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## Thomas1

stelingo said:


> Dwoje Dzieci or Dwójka dzieci
> 
> Are these 2 expressions interchangeable or is there a difference in meaning. And is dwójka declined like a regular feminine noun?
> 
> Thanks


There may be a difference depending on how you use them.
For instance: Uczestnicy zabawy byli podzieleni na grupy. Były cztery dwójki dzieci z dwoma opiekunami i dwie trójki z jednym. [The participants of the play were divided into groups. There were four twos of children with two carers and two threes with one [carer].]
Here 'dwoje dzieci' doesn't work.


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## R.O

In most contexts, though, that is when the number refers to the actual number of children, not groups of them, I've been taught that "dwójka" (and "trójka", "czwórka", etc.) is not even less formal but incorrect. Whether or not that's the case, it is quite popular among people. I myself, however, try to never use it.

EDIT: http://poradnia.pwn.pl/lista.php?id=12746


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## marco_2

I think that more Poles would say e.g. *Po śmierci męża została sama z dwójką dzieci* than *z dwojgiem dzieci *- it sounds more natural and is easier to pronounce.


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## R.O

I'm inclined to agree with you, but only with the first part. To me "dwojgiem" sounds more natural.


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## dreamlike

R.O said:


> In most contexts, though, that is when the number refers to the actual number of children, not groups of them, I've been taught that "dwójka" (and "trójka", "czwórka", etc.) is not even less formal but incorrect. Whether or not that's the case, it is quite popular among people. I myself, however, try to never use it.



I can see where they're coming from, those who think that 'dwójka', as used in this thread, is incorrect, but I wouldn't go so far as that...I think it's perfectly permissible in colloquial speech, but saying that in more formal settings would strike me as sloppy use of language.


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## Thomas1

R.O said:


> In most contexts, though, that is when the number refers to the actual number of children, not groups of them, I've been taught that "dwójka" (and "trójka", "czwórka", etc.) is not even less formal but incorrect. Whether or not that's the case, it is quite popular among people. I myself, however, try to never use it.
> 
> EDIT: http://poradnia.pwn.pl/lista.php?id=12746


I don't think threre's anything inherently wrong with 'dwójka', 'trójka', etc. and would be interested to see some elaboration on that point.
Compare: 


> Kiedy się wypełniły dni
> i przyszło zginąć latem,
> prosto do nieba czwórkami szli
> żołnierze z Westarplatte.
> Gałczyński, Konstanty, Ildefons, _Pieśń o żołnierzach z Westerplatte_, 1939
> http://galczynski.kulturalna.com/a-6592.html


The only restriction that I'd make here, and this is a very much personal matter, is that I find 'dwójka', 'trójka', 'czwórka', and 'piątka' to be OK in the everyday language, I vacilate about 'szóstka' and wouldn't be inclined to use the rest of them (that is, from 'siódemka' on) very often, maybe with the exception for 'setka'. It might be different in written language, though.

As to the sentence given by Marco, I'd also tend to use "z dwójką dzieci", but I wouldn't bat an eyelid at the other option.

EDIT: I don't find 'dwójka' colloquial either.


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## BezierCurve

I see it as Thomas does, except I wouldn't stop at six. Why should we? After all "nasza jedenastka" scores over 5.000 results in Google. 

I also don't see any big difference between "dwójka" and "dwoje", except "dwójka" seems a bit "depersonalizing", as it can be used to almost any type of objects.


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## Thomas1

Bezier, since you mention it, 'jedenastka' is OK to me too when it means 'the national football team'. I gues it's because it is used frequently in media.

However, as I said it's personal, and I think it depends much on what I am used to. For example:
_z dwójką dzieci_ rather than _z dwojgiem dzieci_
_z trójką dzieci_ rather than _z trojgiem dzieci_
_z czwórką dzieci _rather than _z czworgiem dzieci_
_z piątką dzieci_ rather than _z pięciorgiem dzieci_
_z szóstką dzieci_ rather than _z sześciorgiem dzieci_
but
_z siedmiorgiem dzieci_ rather than _z siódemką dzieci_
_z ośmiorgiem dzieci_ rather than _z ósemką dzieci_
_z dziewięciorgiem dzieci_ rather than _z dziewiątką dzieci_
_z dziesięciorgiem dzieci_ rather than _z dziesiątką dzieci_


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## R.O

"Nasza jedenastka" to me means the national football team.
As for the poem, I don't see how czworgiem could work there. Czworka is much better. 
Mind you, however, that it doesn't refer to the actual number of people but to groups of them.


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## Thomas1

I see what you mean R.O.
Nevertheless, the question: 
why 'dwójka', 'trójka', etc. "when the number refers to the actual number of children, not groups of them [...] is  not even less formal but incorrect"? 
still remains open.


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