# ここはまかせとき



## Deminox

Can some one help me break the phrase down? I know ここはまかせとき means something like "leave it to me", but I would like to understand what it's actually saying and how in a more literal sense. ここ here seems to mean more like "this" than "here", and I don't get what とき is doing here.

(I edited the whole thing because I got my stuff mixed up, and what I was asking before had no sense. I apologize for any inconveniences.)


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## SoLaTiDoberman

ここはまかせとき。
<--- ここはまかせときなさい。
<--- ここはまかせておきなさい。
<--- ここ（＝この現場、この状況、今回の出来事）は私に任せておきなさい。＝Leave it to me.


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## Flaminius

Deminox said:


> ここ here seems to mean more like "this" than "here"


Yes, ここ is like "this" but the referent is more abstract and wider than これ, which tends to be more concrete.


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## gengo

Deminox said:


> Can *someone* help me break the phrase down? I know ここはまかせとき means something like "leave it to me", but I would like to understand what it's actually saying and how in a more literal sense. ここ here seems to mean more like "this" than "here", and I don't get what とき is doing here.
> 
> (I edited the whole thing because I got my stuff mixed up, and what I was asking before had *made* no sense. I apologize for any inconveniences.)



(tener sentido = to make sense)

As said above, ここ means "this" in your context, but the word can also translate to "now."  
Ex.
ここが我慢のしどころだ = Now's [This is] the time to show patience
ここからが本当の勝負だ = Now comes the real test

The word is also often used with units of time.

Ex.
ここ十年来 = These last ten years

As for とき, it is a common contraction when て is followed by おき.  Also:  放っといて = 放っておいて = let it be.

In addition to the まかせておきなさい mentioned above, it could also be まかせておきな.  Adding な to the stem form of a verb is another way to form an imperative.


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## Flaminius

One last thing to be said about とき (< ておき) is that it is a dialectal imperative.  This is a feature of Japanese varieties that span from Kansai to Northern Kyushu.  While the standard imperative ておけ (> とけ) is really macho, the dialectal imperative isn't.  Women can say とき without stigmatizing themselves.


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## Deminox

Mmm... The character that I got the phrase from, and some of his peers, use sometimes this piece of language, じまう/ちまう, which my 10ten extension says it's Kanto dialect, might be related? If so, maybe I should try finding some good resources that help me to get better aquinted with some Kanto language peculiarities and such, if I am to be encountering it often.


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## KLAUSED

I'm pretty sure the character is not portrayed as someone from Kanto. I can't imagine someone from Kanto saying "ここはまかせとき". The use of じまう/ちまう, on the other hand, is probably not limited to Kanto.


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## Flaminius

The speech traits of a fictional character are not always good clues for locating them in the actual Japanese geography.  The scene of the story may not be the real world (even though characters all speak Japanese).  If that is the case, the creator can mix up features from different dialects to achieve effects they want; as long as the concoction does not jar the ears of readers, that is.

A dialectologist observes that ちゃう made inroads into Osaka in the later 80s and 90s; no mention on ちまう, its close cousin.  Another researcher says that ちまう is a feature of working class speech in Tokyo, and has been on the course of obsolescence after WWII.  It is quite unlikely that ちまう is used natively in Osaka or Kyushu.


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## KLAUSED

ちまう is not used in the Kansai dialects I'm familiar with and I do associate it with the east but a cursory search shows that it might also be used in Yamaguchi dialect.

Two instances on an online forum where ちまう is used in posts which appear to be written in Yamaguchi dialect.
To the question 「っちまった」は東京方言ですか？, one person responds:
山口県の方言です。 ＃５さんが挙げた「汚れちまった悲しみに」の中原中也は、山口で少年時代を過ごしました。 日本陸軍では「ちまった」が横行し、東京方言で「ちゃった」などと言えば、ひどく叱られました。それは、山口出身の幹部が多かったから、と言われています。 ＮＨＫの連続テレビ小説（たしか「鳩子の海」？）で、この山口弁がたくさん出てきました。
​


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## Flaminius

Other dialectal features in Chuya Nakahara's poetry include 彼女の心はまっ直い, and あれはとおいい処にあるのだけれど.  So, it is quite plausible that 汚れつちまつた悲しみに is from the speech of Yamaguchi.

Hmm, the OP's character is likely from Yamaguchi.


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## KLAUSED

中原中也は18で上京、処女詩集山羊の歌の出版が27の時なので「汚れつちまつた～」は東京方言の影響を受けて書かれた可能性もありますが、
山口で「ちまう」と「とき」が実際に使われるのかは山口方言に詳しい人に聞いてみないとなんとも言えませんね・・・


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## Flaminius

山口方言ではない気がします。というのも、仮に山口方言を話す人物造形なら、関東方言とかなり違うので、質問者は他の特徴についても質問してくるのではないかと思うのです。

二階に上げて梯子を外すようで申し訳ありませんが、私も今気づいた論点です。今のところ標準語からややずれた口語の特徴を複数の方言から寄せ集めた創作方言である可能性が高いと思っています。


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## KLAUSED

そうですね。山口方言をしゃべるキャラクターというのはかなり可能性が低いと思います。

質問者の「ここはまかせとき」と言ったのと同じ人物が「〜ちまう」という表現も使うという説明とは相容れませんが、同一人物だというのは質問者の記憶違いで、関西弁話者と関東弁話者が登場する漫画というのが一番ありえそうです。


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## Deminox

I see, thank you for the valuable info, I'll keep it in mind.


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## Flaminius

It just occurred to me but didn't the character actually まかせときな?  Then, it would perfectly suit a macho type from Kanto.

Edit:
Grammatically, it is a sentential particle for the adverbial form, 連用形, not the imperative.  明鏡 says it was the reduced form of なさい.


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## Deminox

Nop, no な; that's his complete sentence.


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## Flaminius

Oh, then we are left with the question where the person is from.


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## SoLaTiDoberman

I think quite many Japanese people are familiar with the expression, "なあ～にぃ～～！やっちまったなぁ！"
I thought ここはまかせとき is quite an ordinary/mediocre expression all over the nation, too.
Not only someone in fiction but also real-world people can intermingle to use these two expressions, I think.

I beg Deminox to provide us with the context and background more in detail in order to get the right answer.
Where did you quote these expressions from? Give us the title.


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