# 必ずやそう遠くない時期



## Steven2

中国のバブルの崩壊は必ずそう遠くない時期にくるのではないでしょうか。 Doe it mean "The collapse of the bubble in China is a sure thing, but it seems it won't happen in the near future"? What does 必ずそう遠くない mean? How to break this sentence down?
My breakdown is:
中国のバブルの崩壊は必ずそう遠くない時期にくるのではない  でしょうか。
中国のバブルの崩壊は必ずそう遠くない時期にくるの ではない  
中国のバブルの崩壊は必ずそう遠くない時期にくる  の
中国のバブルの崩壊は   必ずそう遠くない時期に    くる


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## rukiak

>中国のバブルの崩壊は必ずそう遠くない時期にくるのではないでしょうか。 
This is a poor Japanese.

It must mean
"中国のバブルの崩壊は*必ずや*そう遠くない時期にくるのではないでしょうか。 "


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## Steven2

What does "中国のバブルの崩壊は*必ずや*そう遠くない時期にくるのではないでしょうか。 " mean?


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## rukiak

'm afraid the collapse of the bubble in China will happen in the not so distant future.


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## Flaminius

*Steven2*, I see that you are stuck with this expression:
Xのではないでしょうか

This is a formula for presenting the statement X (that the Chinese bubble will collapse soon) as one's idea while at the same time seeking concurrence from the audience (or from the public).  It comes in handy where a humble but determined assertion is needed.


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## Mahakaoli

中国のバブルの崩壊は/ 必ずや/ そう遠くない時期に/ (*)くるのではないでしょうか。
the collapse of the bubble in China / probably, certainly, or almost certainly / not in the distant future / (*)

* Flaminius has explained clearly and accurately.


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## Wishfull

Flaminius said:


> *Steven2*, I see that you are stuck with this expression:
> Xのではないでしょうか
> 
> This is a formula for presenting the statement X (that the Chinese bubble will collapse soon) as one's idea while at the same time seeking concurrence from the audience (or from the public).  It comes in handy where a humble but determined assertion is needed.



I agree.

"ではないでしょうか”　はrhetorical device (or rhetorical question)ではないでしょうか。

_今（入学試験直前の２月末）は遊んでないで、勉強をすべき時ではないでしょうか。
健康のためには運動をすべきではないでしょうか。_

These are "negative questions" superficially.
But these don't have negative meaning. Affirmative meaning.

/////////
What happened? Why are you going now?
*Don't you want to stay this happy and wonderful party until its end?*

This question is a negative question, but the speaker thinks that he wants to stay, but unfortunately he have to go for some reason. 

Superficial meaning and true meaning is different in case of rhetorical device or sarcasm, isn't it?
In this thread case, there is no sarcasm. So I think it is rhetorical device/question.
Am I correct?


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## Aoyama

But then, if you think of it_ rhetoretically_ , this sentence can be a bit puzzling for a non Japanese reader : 
中国のバブルの崩壊は*必ず*そう遠*くない*時期にくるの*ではない*でしょうか
something like : Doesn't it seem likely that the collapse of the Chinese bubble is sure to happen in a not so distant time ? (English will use _future _but this is not the word used here).


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## Wishfull

Aoyama said:


> But then, if you think of it_ rhetoretically_ , this sentence can be a bit puzzling for a non Japanese reader :
> 中国のバブルの崩壊は*必ず(や)*そう遠*くない*時期にくるの*ではない*でしょうか
> something like : Doesn't it seem likely that the collapse of the Chinese bubble is sure to happen in a not so distant time ? (English will use _future _but this is not the word used here).



The underlined sentence is exactly what I am thinking.

The sentence might be a bit puzzling for a non Japanese reader.
The reason is not because it is rhetorical, but because it looks as though it has "double negative" sentence structure.
Superficially there are two ない, but I don't think it is a double-negative-sentence.
Because　そう遠くない時期に is a one-phrase-idiom,　which means 近い将来に(in the near future). 
そう遠くない時期　and 近い将来 is almost identical. The difference is that the former is indirect expression than the latter.
As is often the case with other humble expressions, そう遠くない時期 is a typical Japanese-ish, indirect expression.

So you had better just think そう遠くない時期に＝in the near future, and you had better not think about "double negative" structure in this context.

I tried to explain why this sentence is not "double-negative".
In other words, if I rewrite the Japanese;
中国のバブルの崩壊は必ず（や）近い将来に起きるの*ではない*でしょうか

You see? Isn't it simple?
どうでしょう。簡単ではないでしょうか。
どうでしょう。むずかしくないのではないでしょうか。（←This is double negative. Isn't it not-so-difficult?)


Edit;
Hi, Aoyama.
I didin't recognize the bold ”必ず（や）”. 
Do you mean that 必ず（や）　plays an important role to make a sentence core structure, such as 必ず（や）～～ない　or 必ずしも～～しない？

Well, my opinion is, in this context, 必ず（や）　is just an adverb, which means "for sure", and it is independent of core structure of the sentence.
My paraphrasing Japanese would be;
中国のバブルの崩壊は近い将来に起きるの*ではない*でしょうか。間違いなく！

どうでしょう。簡単でしょう。　まちがいなく。（You see? It's simple. I'm sure it is.)


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## Aoyama

I agree with Wishfull explanation, and the bit about "double negation" (which it is not here).
I underlined (bold)* 必ず* because there is here an apparent paradox. Something like "isn't it sure that ... ?" But Japanese has this kind of idiosyncratic_ iimawashi _like "machigai nai ja nai [no]/desuka" (it's not wrong isn't it ?).
As for 中国のバブルの崩壊は近い将来に起きるの*ではない*でしょうか。間違いなく! It may be fine in spoken Japanese, maybe not in a written article (newspaper).
What about :中国のバブルの崩壊は近い将来に起きるのkanouseiga takai to omottara okashikunai. (Sorry, no Japanese on this PC here).
近い将来 is closer to English than 遠くない時期, but then , 遠くない将来 could also be possible, but maybe not "very Japanese" ...


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## Wishfull

Hi.
Thank you for your comment.


Aoyama said:


> I underlined (bold)* 必ず* because there is here an apparent paradox. Something like "isn't it sure that ... ?" But Japanese has this kind of idiosyncratic_ iimawashi _like "machigai nai ja nai [no]/desuka" (it's not wrong isn't it ?).
> *Oh, I see your point.
> 確かにそれはidiosyncraticな言い回しじゃないかと思います。（I　agree).*
> 
> 
> As for 中国のバブルの崩壊は近い将来に起きるの*ではない*でしょうか。間違いなく! It may be fine in spoken Japanese, maybe not in a written article (newspaper).
> *Exactly. It should not be in a written article.*
> 
> 
> What about :中国のバブルの崩壊は近い将来に起きるの可能性が高いと思ったらおかしくない。
> *A little funny. I would say
> 中国のバブルの崩壊は近い将来に起きる可能性が高いと思ってもおかしくないでしょう。
> 中国のバブルの崩壊は近い将来に起きる可能性が高いと思って間違いないでしょう。*
> 
> 近い将来 is closer to English than 遠くない時期, but then , 遠くない将来 could also be possible, but maybe not "very Japanese"
> *「遠くない将来」??ムムムム？　たぶん、「遠くない未来」の方が自然な日本語だと思います。*
> ...


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## Aoyama

Right, thank you for your comment.
As for *「遠くない将来//「遠くない未来」の方が自然な日本語だと思います。*
Yes, that has to do with English having only one word for "future", whereas French has two : "futur"将来 and "avenir" (à venir = to be coming, not yet come)未来...
In the same vein,*遠い未来* is more in use than *遠い将来* ...


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## Wishfull

Hi.
遠い未来　＆　遠い将来　are both fine to me.

遠くない未来　＆　遠くない将来　might be both fine, but I prefer to 遠くない未来.
It sounds a little more natural to my ear.
(Gradually I've lost my confidence which is better.) They are very close.


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## Aoyama

*遠い未来* is more in use than *遠い将来*, more in use but the other option still possible.


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