# O'clock



## astlanda

مَرْحَبَا

Is the following correct for:
one O'clock
eleven O'clock
twelve O'clock

فِى السَّاعَةِ الأُولَى 
فِى السَّاعَةِ الحَادِيَةَ عَشْرَةَ 
فِى السَّاعَةِ الثَانِيَةَ عَشْرَةَ


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## chflb

Hello again astlanda,
Yes right !
but for "one O'clock" it's more common to use 
 في السَّاعَةِ الواحدة بعد منتصف الليل 
after midnignt =بعد منتصف الليل

There is another way to express the exact meaning of "O'clock" : .. في تمام الساعة 

@+


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## cherine

chflb said:


> Hello again astlanda,
> Yes right !
> but for "one O'clock" it's more common to use
> في السَّاعَةِ الواحدة بعد منتصف الليل


Not necessarily. It can الساعة الواحدة ظهرًا (In most Arab countries, to my knowledge, people don't use 13h, 14h...23h, 24h) but go for 1AM, 1PM, 2AM, 2PM.
The AM is صباحًا and the PM is either ظهرًا or مساءً according to the time.


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## chflb

Yes, you're right Chérine,
In Tunisia, we use french in professional life, so I use, rather part of the time 13h, 14h...23h, 24h)
that's why I m not well expressed (because 1h refers to me on the first hour after midnight),
@+


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## astlanda

Thanks!

Is the difference between  ظُهْرًا and مَسَاءً regional or does it rely on the hours referred? 
Are the diacritics of فِى السَّاعَةِ الثَانِيَةَ عَشْرَةَ correct?
I wonder if الثَانِيَةَ may end with fat7a ?


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## cherine

chflb said:


> In Tunisia, we use french in professional life, so I use, rather part of the time 13h, 14h...23h, 24h)
> that's why I m not well expressed (because 1h refers to me on the first hour after midnight).


Yes, I thought so, this is why I thought I'd mark the difference 


astlanda said:


> Is the difference between ظُهْرًا and مَسَاءً regional or does it rely on the hours referred?


It's more of the hour. For example, if it's 9PM it would be more logical to say that it's التاسعة مساءً rather than التاسعة ظهرًا


> Are the diacritics of فِى السَّاعَةِ الثَانِيَةَ عَشْرَةَ correct?
> I wonder if الثَانِيَةَ may end with fat7a ?


Yes, it's a fat7a. The rule for the i3raab of numbers from 11-19 (except for 12) is: مبني على فتح الجزئين wich means that whatever the case of the number may be (nominative, genetive...) it's always أحدَ عشرَ، ثلاثةَ عشرَ، أربعةَ عشرَ (or عشرةَ according to the gender of the counted word).


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## astlanda

Thank you!

But  الثَانِيَةَ عَشْرَةَ  is 12 - i.e. the exception  ?
And what about 3 o'clock AM (03:00)? Is it  صباحًاalready?


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## Mahaodeh

Some may use صباحا, others فجرا and another group بعد منتصف الليل; while the last seems to be the most accurate (and in fact the most used), you must consider that in the summber 3:00 a.m. can actually be فجرا!


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## astlanda

Moreover I found a sentence فِي السَّاعَةِ أَلْخَامِسَةَ عَشَرَةَ  خَرَجَ مِنْ الْبَيتِ 
 . Does it sound too formal to a native speaker?


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## Xence

About the first _PM hours_ you can also use زَوالاً or بَعْدَ الزَّوال

As for السَّاعَة أَلْخَامِسَةَ عَشرَةَ I personally never use it and find it a bit strange.


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## cherine

astlanda said:


> But الثَانِيَةَ عَشْرَةَ is 12 - i.e. the exception  ?


Ooops!!! Sorry about that. Please ignore my previous explanation, I was talking about eleven, twelve... not eleven*th*, twelf*th*.
In this case, it's incorrect to say في الثانيةَ عشرةَ it should be في الثانيةِ عشرةَ .


> And what about 3 o'clock AM (03:00)? Is it صباحًاalready?


As Maha said, in some months of the year, it can be morning already, in other times, you can say الثالثة فَجرًا .


astlanda said:


> Moreover I found a sentence فِي السَّاعَةِ أَلْخَامِسَةَ عَشَرَةَ خَرَجَ مِنْ الْبَيتِ
> . Does it sound too formal to a native speaker?


 First, it won't be understood in non-francophonic countries (Morocco, Tunisia, Algeria...)
Second, الخامسة is written without a hamza.
Thirdly, if you say: خرج من البيت في الثالثة ظهرًا/عصرًا it won't be formal at all, just normal.


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## astlanda

Thank you again!

In my textbook, there was a sentence فِي الْيَوْمِ أَلثَّالِثِ عَشَرَ . So I just generalized.

Is there a simple explanation, why it should be ا instead of أَ ?
(The textbook is printed in Russia, another one is British and I have some books made in China as well. So they all may have mistakes.)

May I use both of the following sentences?
فِي السَّاعَةِ الوَاحِدَةِ بَعْدَ مُنْتَصَفِ اللَّيْلِ
and
فِي السَّاعَةِ الوَاحِدَةِ بَعْدَ نِصْفِ اللَّيْلِ


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## Mahaodeh

astlanda said:


> Thank you again!
> 
> In my textbook, there was a sentence فِي الْيَوْمِ أَلثَّالِثِ عَشَرَ . So I just generalized.
> 
> Is there a simple explanation, why it should be ا instead of أَ ?


 
Because it's ال التعريف which never has a hamza (at least not in MSA and I believe in Classical too), your book is wrong, الثالث does not have a hamza either.


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## astlanda

Oops!

Do you mean, that  أَلثَّالِثِ  is a totally impossible form?
They have printed a whole set with hamza.


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## evanovka

> أَلثَّالِثِ  is a totally impossible form?


yes, the hamza is impossible there.

... seems to be a typical copy-paste error propagation


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## aurelien.demarest

cherine said:


> Yes, it's a fat7a. The rule for the i3raab of numbers from 11-19 (except for 12) is: مبني على فتح الجزئين wich means that whatever the case of the number may be (nominative, genetive...) it's always أحدَ عشرَ، ثلاثةَ عشرَ، أربعةَ عشرَ (or عشرةَ according to the gender of the counted word).



is this rule valid also for ordinal numbers?

Like: الآن السعةَ الحَادِيَةَ عَشَرَةَ or الآن السعةُ الحَادِيَةَ عَشَرَةَ


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## Matat

aurelien.demarest said:


> Like: الآن السعةَ الحَادِيَةَ عَشَرَةَ or الآن السعةُ الحَادِيَةَ عَشَرَةَ


الْآنَ السَّاعَةُ الْحَادِيَةَ عَشْرَةَ.


astlanda said:


> In my textbook, there was a sentence فِي الْيَوْمِ أَلثَّالِثِ عَشَرَ . So I just generalized.


It should be في اليومِ الثالثَ عَشَرَ (with a fatha on the last ث).


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## aurelien.demarest

Thanks Matat I just realized that I miss placed the damma..
I wanted to ask if we say الآن السعةُ الحَادِيَةُ عَشَرَةَ or الآن السعةُ الحَادِيَةَ عَشَرَةَ but I think you already understood that..

So I think then we should say الآن السعةُ الحَادِيَةَ عَشَرَةَ correct?


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## Matat

aurelien.demarest said:


> So I think then we should say الآن السعةُ الحَادِيَةَ عَشَرَةَ correct?


الساعةُ, not السعةُ.
َعشْرة, not َعشَرة.
It would be as I originally wrote it.


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## aurelien.demarest

Thanks


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## Matat

You're welcome.



cherine said:


> In this case, it's incorrect to say في الثانيةَ عشرةَ it should be في الثانيةِ عشرةَ .


 في الثانيةَ عشرةَ is correct. في الثانيةِ عشرةَ may possibly be a correct variation also (not sure if there are differing opinions which accept this), but I don't think so.


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