# Urdu, Persian: Khurd/Kalaan



## Qureshpor

*In my current place of abode, there are many places with the word "Little" and "Great" attached to them. Interestingly, in the neighbourhood of my previous residence, words with the same meaning, namely "Khurd" and "kalaaN" (the n was nasalised) were also attached to place names. 

Both these words seem to be out of fashion, at least in Urdu (apart from Khurd-biin/microscope). Do you know of place names with these suffixes in your area? Should these and other such like words be "resuscitated"?
*


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## BP.

renaalah khurd, probably near OkaRa, comes to mind.

If people-names work for you, then I have a friend couple where the son looks exactly like his mum, and I call them 'beena aur khurd beena'.


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## Faylasoof

QURESHPOR said:


> *
> In my current place of abode, there are many places with the word "Little" and "Great" attached to them. Interestingly, in the neighbourhood of my previous residence, words with the same meaning, namely "Khurd" and "kalaaN" (the n was nasalised) were also attached to place names.
> 
> Both these words seem to be out of fashion, at least in Urdu (apart from Khurd-biin/microscope). Do you know of place names with these suffixes in your area? Should these and other such like words be "resuscitated"?
> *



Well, there is Khurda / Khordha, a city in Orissa. What I can't say if the _kh_ represents a fricative or aspirated _k_. We've been using the former.

... and I'm all for reviving both _khurdah / xurdah_ and _kalaaN_.


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## Qureshpor

*In the Punjab (on both sides of the border), there are many places with Khurd and kalaaN attached to them. Perhaps, Persian has had a greater influence in Punjab than in other areas. We don't seem to be using "Khurd-o-kalaaN" for "Little and Large". "All creatures great and small" does n't seem to end up as "tamaam maKhluuq, kalaan-o-Khurd..". Alexander the Great (Sikandar-i-kalaaN"...??*


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## Dib

Qureshpor said:


> *In the Punjab (on both sides of the border), there are many places with Khurd and kalaaN attached to them.*



Actually it extends much further to the East and South - especially for xurd/khurd, though I am very sceptical about the Khurda in Orissa (apparently spelt "khorddhaa" *ଖୋର୍ଦ୍ଧା* in Oriya - if that has any bearing to the question). I believe, that's outside the expected region. Anyways, there is Koshi KalaaN just south of Delhi. And khurd/xurd is the second element in lots of village names. Almost by random place name+khurd search I found Madanpur Khurd in Eastern UP, Sultanpur Khurd in Maharashtra and Bihar, etc.


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## Qureshpor

^ bahut bahut shukriyah Dib Jii. Interesting thing is that these words seem to be used with place names only, not for instance with animal names or natural features (as in astronomy... xirs-i-kalaaN or ...maahii-i-kalaaN dar birkah-i-xurd).


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## Treaty

Regarding the 2006 census of Iran, there are only a handful of villages with کلان in their name; they are not necessarily pronounced same as "big" کلان, or even if they are, they may not mean "big". There are also two villages with خرده in their name. So, we can say کلان and خرد are rare in place names in Iran (compared to بزرگ and کوچک, each in around 200 place names).

The usage of کلان in Persian is almost limited to monetary terms (e.g., مبلغ، پول، کلاهبرداری، حقوق) and sometime as a calque for "macro" in humanities (e.g., سیاست کلان, اقتصاد کلان). The usage of خرد (as "small") is even more limited to solely the opposite of the second usage of کلان.


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## HZKhan

The usage of کلان and خورد is more common in the Afghan and the Tajik Persian.


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## Qureshpor

I searched for kalaan in the works of some of the Classical Persian poets and only had 24 returns. A couple of examples with both kalaan and xurd are noted here.

عدو را بکوچک نباید شمرد
که کوہ کلان دیدم از سنگ خرد

bostaan-i-sa3dii

مرد و زن خرد و کلان حیران شدند

masnavii-i-ma3navii-maulavii


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## Qureshpor

An example from prose.

(امیر چنان کلان شد که همه شکار بر پشت پیل کردے . (تاریخ بیهقی


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## PersoLatin

Treaty said:


> The usage of کلان in Persian is almost limited to monetary terms (e.g., مبلغ، پول، کلاهبرداری، حقوق) and sometime as a calque for "macro" in humanities (e.g., سیاست کلان, اقتصاد کلان). The usage of خرد (as "small") is even more limited to solely the opposite of the second usage of کلان


We also have:
خردسال for a child,
خرد کردن - to break anything break into parts, money (change into small denomination), glass, even bones/head/teeth. 
خرده ‏نون/شیشه *broken bits* of bread/glass - Colloquial 
کلانتری*/*kalântari for police station or 'place of کلانتر' with کلانتر meaning 'the elder',

خردبین in Persian means small-minded.


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## Alfaaz

Qureshpor said:
			
		

> _… _Both these words seem to be out of fashion, at least in Urdu (apart from Khurd-biin/microscope). _…_


 خرد and کلاں appear to be extremely productive in Urdu scientific/technical vocabulary for translating English prefixes _micro-, etc._ and _macro-_, _mega-_, _hyper-, etc._). There is a کلاں و کبیر number of entries in Urdu English Dictionary, and many of these are also attested in Urdu Lughat and قومی اردو انگریزی لغت. A few examples are listed below.

خُرد

خرد بینی – _microscopic_, خرد پیما – _micrometer_, خرد تراش – _microtome_, خرد چشمی – _microphthalmia_, خرد تجربہ – _microanalysis_, خرد نگاری – _micrography_, خرد سیارچہ – _microsatellite_, خرد عملیہ/ خردکار پرداز – _microprocessor_, خرد حاسب – _microcomputer_, خرد مالیہ – _microfinance_, خرد شنو/مکبر الصوت – _microphone_, خرد نبات – _microphyte_, خردیات / علم خرد بینی – _micrology_, خرد تدریس – _microteaching_, خرد موج – _microwave_, خرد معاشیات – _microeconomics_, خرد نامیہ/جسمیہ – _microorganism_, خرد پا – _micropodal_, خرد نویسی – _micrographic/micrography_, خرد سالی – _pupillary, etc._ ​کلاں

کلاں بینی – _macroscopic_, ثربِ کلاں – _greater omentum_, کلاں سالمہ – _macromolecule_, کلاں خور – _macrophage_, کلاں پارہ – _macromere_, کلاں سنگی – _megalithic_, کلاں سری – _macrocephaly_, کلاں انگشتی – _dactylomegaly_, کلاں پا – _megapode_, عرشہ کلاں – _main deck_, کلاں پری – _macropterous_, کلاں ترسیم – _macrograph_, کلاں نمائی – _magnification_, کلاں ناخنی – _hyperonychia, etc._ ​
خردہ گیر - _captious, critical, etc._

خردہ فروش - _huckster, peddler, etc. _


			
				Qureshpor said:
			
		

> … We don't seem to be using "Khurd-o-kalaaN" for "Little and Large". …


نئے سر سے جواں ہوا ہے جہاں 
عیش و عشرت کے محو *خرد و کلاں* 

میر تقی میر

مرد و زن طفل و جواں *خورد و کلاں* پیر و فقیر 

نظیر اکبرآبادی​


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## Treaty

PersoLatin said:


> خرد کردن - to break anything break into parts, money (change into small denomination), glass, even bones/head/teeth.


I meant as an standalone word. This is a good example (and also پول خورد). Thanks.


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## PersoLatin

Treaty said:


> (and also پول خورد)


You had that covered here though. 


Treaty said:


> (e.g., مبلغ، *پول*، کلاهبرداری، حقوق)


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## PersoLatin

Alfaaz said:


> خردہ گیر - _captious, critical, etc._
> 
> خردہ فروش - _huckster, peddler, etc._


Good examples. You also hear it as in خردہ ریزه.

As you appreciate examples with خرد meaning _micro _are scientific and not used in day-to-day- conversation.


Also different spellings & pronunciations are used, خورد/xoord for more colloquial and خرد/xord for bookish words (??)


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## Derakhshan

An obvious one is خرده "a bit", like ده سال و خرده‌ای.

In Larestani we say _xord_ for "petite" (of a person), opposite of _dorošt_.


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## PersoLatin

Derakhshan said:


> An obvious one is خرده "a bit", like ده سال و خرده‌ای.


This is used in Tehran too for age, weight, distances and time, as you said.



Derakhshan said:


> In Larestani we say _xord_ for "petite" (of a person), opposite of _dorošt_.


This is great use of it and a good replacement for ‏ریز‏نقش, also ریز which is also used for petite stature.


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## Derakhshan

We say ریز too but it's for certain inanimate things like grain, fruit, etc. And the opposite is درشت for these too.


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## Qureshpor

Thank you @Alfaaz for your input in post #12. Also thank you @Treaty, @PersoLatin and @Derakhshan.


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## Alfaaz

PersoLatin said:
			
		

> Good examples. You also hear it as in خردہ ریزه.
> 
> As you appreciate examples with خرد meaning _micro _are scientific and not used in day-to-day- conversation.
> 
> 
> Also different spellings & pronunciations are used, خورد/xoord for more colloquial and خرد/xord for bookish words (??)


 Thanks. 

Does that mean خود is considered the more appropriate spelling for the word meaning _small _and_ minute_, while خورد might be preferred for the word related to _eating_ (as in خورد برد کرنا - _to defalcate, embezzle, etc._)?


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## PersoLatin

Alfaaz said:


> Does that mean خود is considered the more appropriate spelling for the word meaning _small _and_ minute_, while خورد might be preferred for the word related to _eating_


This خورد has nothing to do with _eating._

This can be confusing, خورد which is mainly pronounced as _xoord (xord _too) is another way of spelling خرد which is the correct spelling & is pronounced _xord_, meaning small, tiny.

Example: پول ‏خورد/pule _xurd/xoord_ means, small change, coins or notes, its formal version is پول ‏خرد/pule _xord_.


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## Alfaaz

PersoLatin: Thanks for the explanation.


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