# Her (Jej/Swój) numer telefonu



## gvergara

Hi,

This is my first time ever on here (the Polish forum, I mean), so I will start out by sending out a big hello to everyone around. I started learning Polish like six weeks ago, so my level is close to zero, so do not expect sophisticated questions which will require that you delve into the nitty-gritty of the Polish language. I appreciate in advance your understanding and kind help.

Well, this is it. If I say:

_Moja córka mieszka z mamy. *Her *_(= My daughter's) _numer telefonu to 98435839405_

, is there a way to express this using a possessive? I mean, either way (_Jej _or _Swój numer telefonu_) I get the impression that the possessive is ambiguous and could be referring either to my daughter or her mum. Also, if I wanted to refer to her mum's telephone number, my doubts remain the same. Finally, I am not even sure whether the reflexive possessive _swój _(and its inflected forms in the nominative case) can be used in the subject of a sentence. Thanks a lot in advance.

G.


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## rotan

Since the daughter is the subject, the following pronoun should logically refer to the subject, shouldn't it?

That being said, _jej _would clearly refer to the daughter

You can either use _jej _or even leave the word out, because the context still makes it quite obvious

The main point is a way of contacting the daughter; we don't care who owns the number, we care that we can stay in touch with the daughter, so we assign the number to her anyway

And no, _ swoj_ doesn't work here


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## gvergara

Dziękuję. And since _jej _makes it absolutely clear that I am talking about my daughter's telephone number, how would your answer change if I wanted to refer to my daughter's *mother*'s telephone number?


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## rotan

gvergara said:


> I am talking about my daughter's telephone number,


You're not - you're just assigning the number to her because it allows you to contact her, but in actuality it could be her mother's
It's just that it doesn't really matter who's the owner here, which this example still actually reveals on its own, because if the daughter used another number allowing you to contact her freely, what's the point of saying that she lives with her mother?
So how I see it is that it's more the context itself which indicates whose number it is rather than the pronoun
But at first sight it refers to the daughter, because your first thought is "how to contact the daughter", not "who owns the number"


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## Panceltic

gvergara said:


> _Moja córka mieszka z mamy._



Did you mean _Moja córka mieszka z mam*ą*_? The preposition _z_ takes the instrumental case in this instance.

Anyway, regarding your question, only _jej_ is possible. Which should not be a surprise, because English and Spanish alike can’t differentiate between who _her_ or _su_ refers to in this sentence.


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## Ben Jamin

In the XX century Polish there was a clear rule: only swój could be used to denote a possesive relation to the acting subject of the sentence: 
Tomasz spotkał swojege ojca = Tomasz met his (own) father. The pronoun jego/jej couldn't be used, as this was ambiguous whose father he met. The standard supposition was it was another person's father. Now, under the destructive influence of English many Polish speakers don't understand this distinction and use "jego/jej" instead of "swój".


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## rotan

Ben Jamin said:


> The pronoun jego/jej couldn't be used, as this was ambiguous whose father he met.


Has this actually changed?
Without any background information, the sentence "Tomasz spotkal jego ojca" still doesn't really tell me whose father he met


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## Ben Jamin

rotan said:


> Has this actually changed?
> Without any background information, the sentence "Tomasz spotkal jego ojca" still doesn't really tell me whose father he met


Of course, you are right, but tell it to those who speak and write this wrong way. Native speakers are generally unconscious to such creeping changes in their language, and the prescriptive grammarians still attack only old enemies like "włanczać".


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## gvergara

Hi again,

In English who the partner is in the sentence _Anna will go to the party with her mother and *her *husband _is imprecise, as the second _her _can either refer to Anna or to Anna's mother. Could this be avoided in Polish by using the appropriate possessive?

_Anna pójdzie na imprezę z mamą i *jej*/*swoim* mężem_, where _jej_= Anna's mother's husband and _swoim_= Anna's husband?
** *Sorry if the verb choice _pójdzie _is not correct. I am really struggling to understand the difference between _iść _and _jechać_, let alone their respective perfective/imperfective versions.


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## Drakonica

_- Anna pójdzie na imprezę z mamą i *jej* mężem._
It is not clear, it may means:
- with Anna's husband
- with husband of Anna's mother
but rather the second version.

_Anna pójdzie na imprezę z mamą i *swoim* mężem._
It means only:
- with Anna's husband


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## Drakonica

iść - on your feet
jechać - on wheels, on skids, on animal legs
płynąć - on water
lecieć - in air, in outher space

poruszać się - to move in general (rather in scientific context)
przesuwać się - to move on a surface, also an abstract surface like a sky or a coordinate system


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## Henares

To me, „_Anna pójdzie na imprezę z mamą i *jej* mężem” means only “the mother’s husband”. _I use “mój, jej, twój” only if I want to emphasize that it does not refer to the sentence‘s main object subject.


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## Henares

Drakonica said:


> iść - on your feet
> jechać - on wheels, on skids, on animal legs
> płynąć - on water
> lecieć - in air, in outher space
> 
> poruszać się - to move in general (rather in scientific context)
> przesuwać się - to move on a surface, also an abstract surface like a sky or a coordinate system


“Iść“ can be more general. To me, it doesn’t mean that Anna and the other people are going to go to the party on foot. It is not uncommon to say “idę do lekarza/ pracy/ na wesele/ zakupy“, even if, in fact” one will use a car/train etc.


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## jasio

Drakonica said:


> _- Anna pójdzie na imprezę z mamą i *jej* mężem._
> It is not clear, it may means:
> - with Anna's husband
> - with husband of Anna's mother
> but rather the second version.


To me it's clearly the second meaning, and I can hardly imagine the first meaning.
Compare:


> Anna pójdzie na imprezę z Robertem i jej mężem.


To me it sounds massively awkward.


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## Ben Jamin

"Jechać - on wheels, on skids, on animal legs"

Rather ride an animal (horse, donkey, camel, elephant), but not "jechać on animal legs".


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