# Hindi, Urdu: -wala



## rusita preciosa

Not sure this question belongs in this forum...

In Slumdog Millionaire the game host calls the protagonist "chai-walla" beacuse he serves tea at an office. I think I saw this word elswhere, in a book where "cigarette-walla" was the owner of a small kiosk selling magazines, cigarettes and sweets.

- Is *-walla* a derogatory word (or suffix)?
- does it mean something like "merchant" or servant?


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## Faylasoof

No, it isn't derogatory per se, though one could use it in some context that way! 

<-waalaa> = seller / vendor, but also possessor of certain sorts.

So, if one is using it as a statement of fact then it should not be treated as something derogatory. 

In common language (both Hindi and Urdu) we refer to a rich person  _payse / paise waalaa_ - the latter literally with a lot of / possessor of _paysah / paisah_ = money. Same as <_maaldaar_> where the suffix <_daar_ (Persian)> means the same as _this_ _specific_ usage of <waalaa> = possessor.


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## Lozenger60

Hello! 
I agree with Faylasoof. It is not necessarily a derogatory term and its meaning depends on the context. It is a very useful word for distinguishing between items, especially if you have limited vocabulary. For inanimate objects, I would translate it as being equivalent to the English "one", in the sense of "the green one" or "the big one". So say for example if you ask for a paratha (fried flat bread), and in reply they ask "kaunsa chahiye?" you could simply say "ghee wala", or "meetha wala", (the butter one, or the sweet one, Or the Butter kind, or the sweet kind).

Hope that helps! It's a great word to know, and the more you hear it, the more you'll understand its utility and diversity


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## bakshink

Very good examples Lozenger60 "wala" can help you everywhere.
yah vaalaa- this one
vo vaalaa- that one
dil vaalaa- magnanimous
himmat vaalaa- courageous
pahale vaalaa- the one before
kal vaalaa- yesterday's one
With colours neelaa vaalaa- the one that is blue, peelaa vaalaa- the one that is yellow and so on.


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## Lozenger60

Thanks Bakshink! That's exactly what I was getting at! It's an endlessly useful word, especially if you're still learning, and you're having trouble explaining yourself


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## Faylasoof

In the examples above <waalaa> again is used to mean <having / possessing / pertaining to / concerning>.

This <waalaa> should not be confused with the one that you see in <janaab-e-waalaa>
- here it means <exalted / eminent / lofty / high / highness.


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## Lozenger60

Isn't it janab e aali?  جناب عالی 

It means something like "his excellency" and is of Persian origin

http://urduseek.com/dictionary/excellency?nolog=1

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/جناب_عالی

 I can't find any independent definition for waala in this context. From what I can understand, in common use, this has at times warped from janab e aala... or janab e waala, through pronunciation.

the "aali" (عالی) in janab e aali, comes from the arabic (عالی) - pronounced "aala" - (since the ی in arabic is pronounced "aa" and in persian it's pronounced "i" - this explains the two different pronunciations) the meaning of which is "exalted" 

http://en.wiktionary.org/عالی


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## Faylasoof

That too! Let me explain.

_3aalii _(عالی) -Arabic = _waalaa _(والا) - Persian.  We use both. 

From Platts. 
P والا _wālā_  वाला [i.q. _bālā_; & prob. akin to Zend _upairi_, or _upara_;  S. उपरि or उपर], adj. Exalted, eminent, respectable, high, superior, &c.:—_wālā-jāh_, or _wālā-shān_, adj. Of elevated rank or dignity:—_wālā-qadr_, adj. Of high worth or excellence; of high dignity:—_ḥuẓūr-ě-wālā_, Your Highness.

[P = Persian]

 Apart from the above examples we also use it in other compound nouns:

<_janaab saami3iin-e-waalaa_ جَناب سامعینِ والا= esteemed listeners / audience>
<_janaab naaZiriin-e-waalaa_ جَناب ناظِرینِ والا= esteemed spectators>. 

- both of the above can also be used without <_janaab_ جَناب >, i.e. saami3iin-e-waalaa سامعینِ والا  and naaZiriin-e-waalaa ناظِرینِ والا.  All of these forms are high register Urdu but the addition of  <_janaab_ جَناب > gives added formality and politeness.


والا _waalaa / wālā_ वाला  is also used when something is about to happen and also in describing a profession:

<_woh kitaab paRhne waalaa hai_>

He is about to / going to read the book

[Depending on the context, this could also refer to someone who serves as a “reader” (_kitaab paRhne waalaa_) on a regular basis].

<_woh kaam shuroo3 karne waalaa hai_>

He is about to / going to start working

Similarly, expressing an action that is about to take place in general: 

<_yeh hone waalaa hai_>

This is about to / going to happen.

 <_yeh to hone hii waalaa hai_>

 This is bound to happen 

Used in a compound noun to describe a category or a profession:  

<_kaam karne waalaa / waale_  = employee / employees OR worker / workers.>

<_bijlii kaa kaam karne waalaa_ = an electrician =  maahir-e- / kaariigar-e-aalaat-e-barq 
ماہر \  کاریگر آلات برق.>


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## Qureshpor

Split from here.



Jabir said:


> Thank you very much, marrish SaaHib. What does "waale" means in your last sentence?



To help marrish SaaHib with some of your load..!

vaalaa/feminine vaalii (masculine plural vaale) = The one who is associated with something.

Few examples from C.M.Naim's Urdu Grammar.

ghar-vaalaa = head of the household/husband
ghar-vaalii se = with the mistress of the house or the wife
baaje-vaale ko = to the person with the musical instrument

jaane-vaaloN ko = those who are going
pakaane-vaaloN ke = of those who cook

Examples of coloquial usage "generally not found in standard texts".

achchhii-vaalii kitaab = the good book
baazaar-vaalaa khaanaa = the food brought from the market
aane vaaloN ne kahaa = Those who came, said.
jaane vaale chale ga'e = Those who were going have left

gaaRii jaane-vaalii hai = The train is about to leave


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## tonyspeed

Jabir said:


> Thank you very much, marrish SaaHib. What does "waale" means in your last sentence?



Although used in many ways, waalaa as used in that way to mean can be translated as "one".

vah waalaa - that one
yah waalaa - this one
baDaa waalaa - big one
laal waalaa - red one
meraa waalaa - "my one"? or I guess more correctly "my own"


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## marrish

tonyspeed said:


> Although used in many ways, waalaa as used in that way to mean can be translated as "one".
> 
> vah waalaa - that one
> yah waalaa - this one
> baDaa waalaa - big one
> laal waalaa - red one
> meraa waalaa - "my one"? or I guess more correctly "my own"


Yes, Urdu knows it, with the exception that we say voh/vuh_ waalaa, yeh/yih waalaa, baRaa waalaa_ respectively. For _meeraa waalaa _I'd go for that one of me (to explain the meaning).


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## BP.

QURESHPOR said:


> ...
> ghar-vaalaa = head of the household...


The khudaawand thread reminded me that this one could possibly also be translated _rabb ul manzil_. That's as majestic as it gets in a household context!


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## marrish

BelligerentPacifist said:


> The khudaawand thread reminded me that this one could possibly also be translated _rabb ul manzil_. That's as majestic as it gets in a household context!


Very nice - I'm sure I'd use it one day, but _ghar-vaalaa_ itself means a husband of course. Other heads of the household there might be than a mere husband, it is mostly the _xaatuun-e xaanah_!


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## Qureshpor

In a post belonging to "Representation of English present and past participle" Alfaaz SaaHib has hinted at the verb + vaalaa (karne vaalaa/hone vaalaa/khele jaane vaale etc) construction having a past meaning. The reality is that it has past, present and future significance depending on the context.

Present Perfect

 marne vaale marte haiN, fanaa hote nahiiN
vuh Haqiiqat meN kabhii ham se judaa hote nahiiN

Iqbal

(Those who have died..)

Past

ek tum hii nah mil sake varnah
milne vaale bichhaR bichhaR ke mile

Nasir Kazimi

(Those who met..)

Present

kyaa aap dil meN samaa jaane vaale ko'ii ash3aar hameN sunaa sakte haiN?

(Can you tell us any couplets that make their home in our hearts?)

Future

ab ham bhii jaane vaale haiN, saamaaN to gayaa

DaaGh

(Now we too are about to depart, our belongings have already gone!)


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## Alfaaz

QURESHPOR said:
			
		

> In a post belonging to "Representation of English present and past participle" Alfaaz SaaHib has hinted at the verb + vaalaa (karne vaalaa/hone vaalaa/khele jaane vaale etc) construction having a past meaning. The reality is that it has past, present and future significance depending on the context.


(In that specific case--comparing Hind and Urdu usage, media, and providing a possible explanation for why certain media/speakers might lean towards khela jaa raha instead of khele jaane vaala)
Agree (except might disagree with some of the English translations...will ask later if time permits)


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## Qureshpor

Alfaaz said:


> Agree (except might disagree with some of the English translations...will ask later if time permits)



I too have doubts about my English renderings!


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## greatbear

QURESHPOR said:


> In a post belonging to "Representation of English present and past participle" Alfaaz SaaHib has hinted at the verb + vaalaa (karne vaalaa/hone vaalaa/khele jaane vaale etc) construction having a past meaning. The reality is that it has past, present and future significance depending on the context.
> 
> Present Perfect
> 
> marne vaale marte haiN, fanaa hote nahiiN
> vuh Haqiiqat meN kabhii ham se judaa hote nahiiN
> 
> Iqbal
> 
> (Those who have died..)
> 
> Past
> 
> ek tum hii nah mil sake varnah
> milne vaale bichhaR bichhaR ke mile
> 
> Nasir Kazimi
> 
> (Those who met..)
> 
> Present
> 
> kyaa aap dil meN samaa jaane vaale ko'ii ash3aar hameN sunaa sakte haiN?
> 
> (Can you tell us any couplets that make their home in our hearts?)
> 
> Future
> 
> ab ham bhii jaane vaale haiN, saamaaN to gayaa
> 
> DaaGh
> 
> (Now we too are about to depart, our belongings have already gone!)



According to me, you are confusing a lot with lot! In all your examples except the future tense one, "vaala" is adjectival and doesn't in itself carry a temporal sense.


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## marrish

greatbear said:


> According to me, you are confusing a lot with lot! In all your examples except the future tense one, "vaala" is adjectival and doesn't in itself carry a temporal sense.


The topic is very interesting because "vaalaa" is used so often and seems very polyvalent but I've to confess that I don't understand how "vaalaa" in the instances above should be adjectival. Could you perhaps offer a translation of these forms so that the adjectival meaning is expressed?


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## Qureshpor

زہریلی شراب پینے کے نتیجے میں ہلاک ہونے والوں کی تعداد چالیس ہوگئی ہے۔
zahriilii sharaab piine ke natiije meN marne vaaloN kii ta3daad chaaliis ho ga'ii.

The number of *those who have died* as a consequence of drinking poisonous alcohol has reached forty. ​


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## marrish

QURESHPOR said:


> زہریلی شراب پینے کے نتیجے میں ہلاک ہونے والوں کی تعداد چالیس ہوگئی ہے۔
> zahriilii sharaab piine ke natiije meN marne vaaloN kii ta3daad chaaliis ho ga'ii.
> 
> The number of *those who have died* as a consequence of drinking poisonous alcohol has reached forty. ​


QP SaaHib there's discrepancy between the Urdu text and the transliteration.


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## Qureshpor

marrish said:


> QP SaaHib there's discrepancy between the Urdu text and the transliteration.



Agreed, but there is no difference in meaning!! You have passed the "being awake" test and I have failed!!


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## marrish

QURESHPOR said:


> Agreed, but there is no difference in meaning!! You have passed the "being awake" test and I have failed!!


Yes, the meaning is the same, indeed. Normally it is the other way round with this test!


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## Stranger_

To Qureshpor SaaHib (or anyone who can answer on his behalf):

You said:


> The reality is that it has past, present and future significance depending on the context.



But how do we know what the intended tense of "waalaa" is if no more context is given? as in these two examples you quoted:


> jaane-vaaloN ko = those who are going
> pakaane-vaaloN ke = of those who cook



=================================================

From Faylasoof SaaHib's post:


> Used in a compound noun to describe a category or a profession:
> <_kaam karne waalaa / waale_ = employee / employees OR worker / workers.>


Does حکومت کرنے والا in the following sentence mean "ruler"?



> *آل طاہر (فارسی: سلسله طاهریان) 821ء سے 873ء تک شمال مشرقی ایرانی علاقے خراسان پر حکومت کرنے والا ایک خاندان تھا جس کی حکومت میں موجودہ ایران، افغانستان، تاجکستان،ترکمانستان اور ازبکستان کے علاقے شامل تھے*



Just want to make sure I have got it right.

Finally, I have noticed that some of you write "waalaa" and some others write "vaalaa". So, are there two pronunciations for this word? if yes, then which one is the most common one in Urdu?


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## Qureshpor

jaane-vaaloN ko = those who are going
pakaane-vaaloN ke = of those who cook

Yes, on a stand alone basis one could impart such meanings as..

The "goers", the ones who go, the ones going, the ones who have gone,  the ones who went, the ones who will go..

But how often are you going to come across a "stand alone" scenario. The examples that I quoted and their translations (which you have quoted) are directly from Professor Na'im's book.

Hukuumat karne vaalaa does mean "ruler". But in the sentence quoted it is acting as an adjective...therefore "a ruling family".

Urdu "vaa'o" is neither the English "v" (as in victory) nor the English "w" as in "water". It is something in between. I write using a v. Others use a w. It's juist personal taste.


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## Stranger_

*Thanks a lot. It turns out there is only one "vaa'o"!! I always thought there are two. In Devanagari it is represented by only this letter "**व" as a consonant right?​*


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## Qureshpor

^ Yes, it is a consonant. [I shall reply to your PM when I have some spare time].


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## Stranger_

Could someone translate "jaane valii zaban" in this sentence?



> برصغیر پاک و ہند کے اکثر علاقوں میں بولیاور سمجھی جانے والی زبان جس کے لغات میں پراکرت نیز غیر پراکرت، دیسیلفظوں کے .........ساتھ ساتھ



from UrduLughat


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## Qureshpor

Stranger_ said:


> Could someone translate "jaane valii zaban" in this sentence?
> 
> from UrduLughat


It is not "jaane vaalii zabaan" but "bolii (aur samjhii) jaane vaale zabaan". The language spoken (and understood).

kushtan > kushtah shudan

zan-i-kushandah = The killing/killer woman (The woman who is a killer) = maarne vaalii 3aurat

zan-i-kushtah shavandah = The killed woman (The woman who is killed) = maarii jaane vaalii 3aurat

bolnaa (active) > bolaa jaanaa (passive) = to be spoken

samajhnaa (active) > samjaa jaanaa (passive) = to be understood

Someone


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## Stranger_

Thanks a lot Mr Someone, you can always be relied on for help.  

This is the first time I am seeing the usage of "valaa" in the passive voice. Good that you explained it, otherwise I would have assumed it to mean "a progressing/moving language = zabaan-i ravaan, yaa zabaan-i ravandah(رونده)!"


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## Qureshpor

Stranger_ said:


> Thanks a lot Mr Someone, you can always be relied on for help.
> 
> This is the first time I am seeing the usage of "valaa" in the passive voice. Good that you explained it, otherwise I would have assumed it to mean "a progressing/moving language = zabaan-i ravaan, yaa zabaan-i ravandah(رونده)!"


An example from the net.

احمد فراز کی لال مسجد پر لکھی جانے والی نظم

Ahmad Faraz's nazm written on the subject of the Red Mosque

zabaan-i-ravaaN would mean "flowing/fluent language" in Urdu.

ravaaN saal = current year


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## marrish

Qureshpor said:


> It is not "jaane vaalii zabaan" but "bolii (aur samjhii) jaane vaale zabaan". The language spoken (and understood).


As this thread is on "wala/vaalaa etc." perhaps there's a typo crept in here.


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