# cold / warm (variants)



## ThomasK

I'd like to know what kind of variants you distinguish in your language as for cold and warm. I could imagine: 
- cold &very cold, 
- not very warm &chilly [cool?]/slightly too cold,
 "(in)humanly/metaphorically cold",  
And about the same thing for warm...

Dutch:
- *koud/ warm,*
-* ijskoud/ heet* (bloedheet,...) : icecold*/* hot (bloodily hot or ...)
- *fris(jes)/ ...  (?)* ): not very warm (a little chilly, lit.)*/*...
- *koel*, *kil/ ....* (*gezellig*) ? : slightly too cold, colder but not extremely cold/ .... (cosy, fig. warm)
- [metaphorically]  *k*_*oel*_, emotionless, not kind - _*kil*_: colder but not extremely also : harsh, unfriendly (_- sfeer_/ chilly [?] atmosphere); *ijzig*/icy
Verbs:
- (intrans.) *afkoelen/ opwarmen*: to cool down/ to warm up
- (trans.) *afkoelen/ verwarmen, opwarmen (verhitten): *id. *(to heat) >>> hartverwarmend (*_heart-warming_*, *_endearing_

I suggest we do not mention freezing and boiling separately, because that might make it too complex.


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## Yendred

*French *adjectives, from hottest to coldest (more or less):
_bouillant _(water, character) = _boiling _(water) _/ fiery/passionate/impulsive _(character)
_ardent _(love, sun) = _ardent/blazing
torride _(love, sun)_ = torrid/scorching
caniculaire_(*) (atmosphere)_ = scorching
brûlant _(food, drink, surface, sun) = _burning
chaud _(generic, drink, food, atmosphere) = _hot/warm
tiède _(food, drink, character) = _warm/tepid/lukewarm
frais _(drink, atmosphere) = _cool/fresh
froid _(generic, drink, food, character) = _cold
glacé _(drink, food, wind) = _iced/icy
glacial _(character, atmosphere, wind) _= chilly/icy_

*French *verbs:
_refroidir/(ré)chauffer _(food, drink, atmosphere)_ = to cool down / to warm up_

(*) the etymology of _canicule _(Spanish _canicula_, Italian _canicola_, English _scorching heat/heat wave) _is interesting: it comes from Latin _canicula _(literally _little dog_), a name given by the Romans to Sirius, a star from the constellation of _Canis Major__. _Considered as the star of heat, as it appeared at the sunset or sunrise during summer.


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## ThomasK

Liste parfaite! Maybe your list is better, way clearer, than mine... 

I do have some questions:
-  which ones are pejorative, or strictly *pejorative*? (Is u_n amour torride _as passionate as_ un amour arden_t? ;-) )
-  I added some questions in green... 
Thanks a lot, excellent information! I'd suggest everyone uses Yendred's list. I'll do it for Dutch below. 



Yendred said:


> *French *adjectives, from hottest to coldest (more or less):
> _bouillant _(water, character) = _boiling  -  _*how how could you describe the metaphorical meaning?  Impulsive, full of temperament? Mainly pos.?*
> _ardent _(love, sun) = _ardent/blazing
> torride _(love, sun)_ = torrid/*scorching*
> caniculaire_(*) (atmosphere)_ = _*scorching*
> _brûlant _(food, drink, surface, sun) = _*burning*
> 
> chaud _(generic, drink, food, atmosphere) = _hot/warm
> 
> tiède _(food, drink, character) = _warm/tepid  > Can an applause/enthusiasm be _tiède
> 
> _frais _(drink) = _cool  *(any connotation?)*
> froid _(generic, drink, food, character) = _cold  > *descriptive but pejoriative in the fig. sense?*
> glacial _(character, atmosphere, wind) = _chilly/icy > *pejorative in fig. sense ?*
> glacé _(drink, food, wind) = _iced/icy  _
> 
> *French *verbs:
> _refroidir/(ré)chauffer _(food, drink, atmosphere)_ = to cool down / to wam up_
> 
> (*) the etymology of _canicule (scorching heat/heat wave) _is interesting: it comes from Latin _canicula _(literally _little dog_), a name given by the Romans to Sirius, a star from the constellation _Canis major. _Considered as the star of heat, as it appeared at the sunset or sunrise during summer. Great!!!


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## Awwal12

Russian (general adjectives):
ледяной (ledyanóy) - ice-cold (lit. "icy", from "lyód" - ice);
холодный (kholódnyi) - cold (lit. "coldy", derived from the basic noun);
прохладный (prokhládnyi) - cool (derived from the noun "prokhláda" - cool(ness), from Church Slavonic);
тёплый (tyóplyi) - warm;
горячий (goryáchiy) - hot;
раскалённый (raskalyónnyi) - burning hot; "heated so much that it glows" (literally or figurally; this past participle is formed from the perfective verb "raskalít" - "to incandesce by heating").

A couple of sidenotes:
1. Some of these may also take modifying morphemes, chiefly the suffix -ovat- (with the meaning "a bit too..." or "slightly...").
2. Describing weather, air or some other substances may make some of these nouns inapplicable and demand different adjectives to be used instead.


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## ThomasK

Dutch the French (better) way - and I added "to chill" at the bottom! [@Yendred: thanks!]
If you can, please mention figurative use (in red for example)

djectives, from hottest to coldest (more or less):
_bouillant _(water, character) = *kokend *(only descriptive, not about character)
_ardent _(love, sun) = *brandend *(burning)_ 
torride _(love, sun)_ = id. (not neg.)
caniculaire_(*) (atmosphere)_ = _*verhitte *_(fig., negative: heated atmosphere)
brûlant _(food, drink, surface, sun) = *brandend hee*t (scorchingly hot)
*heet *(hot, very warm, almost or always too warm)
_chaud _(generic, drink, food, atmosphere) = _*warm*

tiède _(food, drink, character) = *lauw*_/tepid/ lukewarm  > An applause/enthusiasm can be _*lauw *

_frais _(drink) = *koel* _*(*connotation: -e sfeer *= *not warm enough),  
glacial (character, atmosphere, wind)* = kil *(fig. way too cold)*, ijzig*
froid _(generic, drink, food, character) = *koud*_> * pejorative in the fig. sense especially, but also lit., I guess?*

glacé _(drink, food, wind) = ijzig, ijskoud

*French *verbs:
_refroidir/(ré)chauffer _(food, drink, atmosphere)_ = *afkoelen, verwarmen*  (opwarmen : warm up, rechauffer)_
? - *CHILLen *(to chill)


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## ThomasK

Thanks! /Spasiba??/ But some questions in red, if I may...



Awwal12 said:


> Russian (general adjectives):
> ледяной (*ledy*anóy) - ice-cold (lit. "icy", from "lyód" - ice); character?
> холодный (*khol*ódnyi) - cold (lit. "coldy", derived from the basic noun); character, atmosphere?
> прохладный (prok*hlád*nyi) - cool (derived from the noun "prokhláda" - cool(ness), from Church Slavonic); cool drink, cool atmosphere (pos.)?
> 
> тёплый (tyóplyi) - warm;
> горячий (goryáchiy) - hot;
> 
> раскалённый (*rask*alyónnyi) - burning hot; "heated so much that it glows" (literally or figurally; this past participle is formed from the perfective verb "raskalít" - "to incandesce by heating"). - Burning love?
> 
> A couple of sidenotes:
> 1. Some of these may also take modifying morphemes, chiefly the suffix -ovat- (with the *meaning "a bit too..." or "slightly..*.").
> 2. Describing weather, air or some other substances may make some of these nouns inapplicable and demand different adjectives to be used instead.


 INteresting to learn that you can change the meaning slightly by adding suffix. I could imagine a parallel with English *-y*/ Dutch *-ig*...


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## Yendred

Trying to answer your questions one by one  


ThomasK said:


> Is u_n amour torride _as passionate as_ un amour arden_t?



Well it's not totally obvious, but in this context, _torride _has some sexual connotation, while _ardent _is rather on the sentimental level, but I guess it must be the same in English between _torrid _and _ardent_.



ThomasK said:


> _bouillant _(water, character) = _boiling  -  _*how how could you describe the metaphorical meaning?  Impulsive, full of temperament? Mainly pos.?*



Concerning the character, depending on the context, _bouillant _may be positive or negative.
_fiery/passionate _(pos.) / _impulsive _(neg.) should translate it properly.



ThomasK said:


> which ones are pejorative, or strictly *pejorative*?



Concerning the sun/atmosphere/food/drink,_ torride_/_caniculaire_/_brûlant_ are quite negative. They mean a too hot temperature.



ThomasK said:


> _frais _(drink) = _cool  *(any connotation?)*_



_frais _is quite positive concerning drinks, like the English _cool/fresh drink_.

I must add the atmospheric context though:
_- "il fait un peu frais ce matin" _(_it’s a bit cool this morning_) is rather negative,
- but _"en période de confinement, on a besoin d'un peu d'air frais"_ (_in time of lockdown, we need a little fresh air_) is quite positive.



ThomasK said:


> _froid _(generic, drink, food, character) = _cold  > *descriptive but pejoriative in the fig. sense?*
> glacial _(character, atmosphere, wind) = _chilly/icy > *pejorative in fig. sense ?*_



Indeed yes, in the figurative sense (a person's character), it's quite negative, if not pejorative.



ThomasK said:


> _tiède _(food, drink, character) = _warm/tepid  > Can an applause/enthusiasm be _tiède



Yes indeed, we may say "_le public s'est manifesté par de tièdes applaudissements_" (_the audience gave a lukewarm applause_).


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## ThomasK

Interesting and very important addition! --- Take all the time you need, I am simply grateful for your answers!


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## Welsh_Sion

Welsh:

_boiling _- berwedig, berw
_ardent/blazing - _tanbaid, chwilboeth, poeth
_torrid/scorching_ - crasboeth, tanbaid, chwilboeth
_caniculaire_*
_burning_ - poeth, chwilboeth, eirias, eiriasboeth, gwynias, tanllyd, tanbaid, twyntan (sw), purboeth (sww)
_hot_ - poeth (nw), twym (sw)
_warm -_ cynnes, twym (sw)
_tepid_ - claear, claearaidd, lled dwym, lled gynnes, gweddol gynnes, gweddol dwym
_lukewarm -_ llugoer, claear, laodiceaidd
_cool/fresh - _claear, oeraidd, oerllyd, lled oer, go-oer, oerbraidd, braidd yn oer; (air,shade,breeze): oer iach, oerbraf, go-oer;
_cold_ - oer
_chilly/icy_ - rhewllyd,  rhynllyd, fferllyd, iasoer, iasol, _Lit:_ rhewoer;
_iced/icy - _rhewoer, iasoer, yn rhew (nw)/iâ (sw) i gyd

_*caniculaire_ = dyddiau cŵn = dog days (for the same reason as Yendred gives.)

That should keep you amused over the weekend/during the lockdown, ThomasK! 

Figurative meanings later


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## ThomasK

Now, looking forward to the figurative meanings, but this is impresssive already: I see three to eight equivalents per concept!!!  Is Welsh - in the most positive sense - extraterrestrial??? Looking forward!

I did some weekendwork already,,checked your list and seemed to find some *roots *or *endings*... Could you comment on them? 
Strange that the same word can be used for both hot and lukewarm, no? 



Welsh_Sion said:


> _boiling _-* berw*edig, *berw*
> _ardent/blazing - _tanbaid, chwilboeth, *poeth*
> _torrid/scorching_ - cras*boeth,* tanbaid, chwilboeth
> _caniculaire_*
> _burning_ - poeth, chwilboeth, eirias, eiriasboeth, gwynias, tanllyd, tanbaid, twyntan (sw), pur*boeth* (sww)
> _hot_ - poeth (nw), twym (sw)
> _warm -_ cynnes, twym (sw)
> _tepid_ - *claear*, claearaidd, lled dwym, lled gynnes, gweddol gynnes, gweddol dwym
> _lukewarm -_ llugoer, *claear*, laodiceaidd
> _cool/fresh - _*claear*, oeraidd, oerllyd, lled oer, go-oer, oerbraidd, braidd yn oer; (air,shade,breeze): oer iach, oerbraf, go-oer;
> _cold_ - oer
> _chilly/icy_ - rhew*llyd*,  rhynllyd, ffer*llyd*, iasoer, iasol, _Lit:_ rhewoer;
> _iced/icy - _rhew*oer*, iasoer, yn rhew (mw)/iâ (sw) i gyd
> 
> _*caniculaire_ = dyddiau cŵn = dog days (for the same reason as Yendred gives.)
> 
> That should keep you amused over the weekend/during the lockdown, ThomasK!
> 
> Figurative meanings later




@Yendred: thanks, everything seems clear now!


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## Welsh_Sion

We could work in partnership (subject to my large translation for Facebook atm …)

Geiriadur yr Academi | The Welsh Academy English-Welsh Dictionary Online

(Best unidirectional Eng > Wel dictionary. And it's free on-line.)


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## ThomasK

FB atm? (Just taking a break now, but will be back in 4 hours…)


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## Welsh_Sion

FB = Facebook
ATM (in this context) = At the moment.

Sorry for using txt spk. (Text speak)!

_______

I would hope a fellow Welshy could help here - there are about 3/4 million of us, after all!


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## Awwal12

ThomasK said:


> ледяной (*ledy*anóy) - ice-cold (lit. "icy", from "lyód" - ice); character?


No, it won't work. Although it may be applicable to a look (given to somebody), for example.


ThomasK said:


> холодный (*kholód*nyi) - cold (lit. "coldy", derived from the basic noun); character, atmosphere?


Will work in most contexts where "cold" does.


ThomasK said:


> cool drink, cool atmosphere (pos.)?


Even a cool reception (although холодный may be preferable here). Just not "cool" in the slangish meaning.


ThomasK said:


> Burning love?


No. "Раскалённый" is rather associated with being _painfully_ hot. You can use "горячий" or adjectives and participles like ~"flaming".


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## Circunflejo

From hotter to colder (adjectives)

Tórrido (torrid)
Ardiente, quemador, abrasador (burning)
Ferviente (rarely used) (boiling)
Canicular (adjetive derived from canícula; dog day in English).
Achicharrador (scoching)
Bochornoso (sultry)
Cálido, caluroso, caliente (hot/warm)
Templado, tibio (mild)
Fresco (cool)
Frío (cold)
Helador (freezer)
Gélido (gelid)

Some nouns without a related adjective: Calorina (strong hot), biruji (cold wind) and sofoco (just for women during menstruation)


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## ThomasK

Awwal12 said:


> No, it won't work. Although it may be applicable to a look (given to somebody), for example.
> Will work in most contexts where "cold" does.
> Even a cool reception (although холодный may be preferable here). Just not "cool" in the slangish meaning.
> No. "Раскалённый" is rather associated with being _painfully_ hot. You can use "горячий" or adjectives and participles like ~"flaming".


Thanks!

@Circunflejo: which of these can be used metaphorically (and in a pejorative sense perhaps)?



Circunflejo said:


> From hotter to colder (adjectives)
> 
> Tórrido (torrid)
> Ardiente, quemador, abrasador (burning)
> Ferviente (rarely used) (boiling)
> Canicular (adjetive derived from canícula; dog day in English).
> Achicharrador (scoching)
> Bochornoso (sultry)
> Cálido, caluroso, caliente (hot/warm) - I suppose: mainly positive
> Templado, tibio (mild, not lukewarm?)
> Fresco (cool)
> Frío (cold)
> Helador (freezer) - but not an adj., I suppose
> Gélido (gelid)
> 
> Some nouns without a related adjective: Calorina (strong hot), biruji (cold wind) and sofoco (just for women during menstruation)[under-fire ????]


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## Circunflejo

Caliente used as in s/he is very hot.
Tibio-lukewarm.
Helador is indeed an adjective but I guess I translated it wrongly. It would be freezing. There's a freezing cold=hace un frío helador (metaphorically, hace un frío que pela. Pelar=to lose the hair, skin, Shell...)
Fresco can be used as synonym of shameless but I'm not sure it originated from something related with temperature or something unrelated with it.
Tórrido. Un tórrido romance.
Ferviente. Un ferviente seguidor=an enthusiastic follower (literally: a boiling follower).
Bochornoso can be an adjective related with embarrassment (or something similar; not sure how they say it in English).
Helador can be used as synonym of astonishing.
Sofoco comes from Latin (Literally under the (upper part of the) throat) and the meaning in Spanish related with the subject of the thread would be the warmth feeling that have many women during menstruation.


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## ThomasK

Thanks a lot again, Circunflejo, but I added some questions. Thanks in advance - but enjoy your weekend first!


Circunflejo said:


> _Caliente _used as in _s/he is very hot_.
> Tibio-lukewarm.
> 
> _Helador _is indeed an adjective but I guess I translated it wrongly. It would be *freezing*. There's a freezing cold=h_ace un frío helado_r (metaphorically, _hace un frío que pela_. *Pelar=to lose the hair, skin, Shell... OK, but does the frost lead to losing hair? *_Helador _can be used as synonym of astonishing
> 
> _Fresco _can be used as synonym of shameless but I'm not sure it .originated from something related with temperature or something unrelated with it. o you mean: *This way of behaving of yours is fresco? *
> _Tórrido_. _Un tórrido romance_.
> 
> _Ferviente_._ Un ferviente seguidor=_an enthusiastic follower (literally: a boiling follower). We have that *in Dutch *even: *een fervente aanhange*r. But most people are not aware of the literal meaning. If we used vurig/ fiery, it would be clear. *Can ferviente be used literally and figuratively?*
> 
> _Bochornoso _can be an adjective related with embarrassment (or something similar; not sure how they say it in English). Your behaviour is _bochornoso_?
> 
> _Sofoco_ comes from Latin (Literally under the (upper part of the) throat) and the meaning in Spanish related with the subject of the thread would be the warmth feeling that have many women during menstruation_. I__ checked at Google T and there it was linked to suffocation. Correct? I could see a link between throat and breathing somehow_


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## Penyafort

In *Catalan*: (only adjectives here)

*VERY HOT
bullent *(water, oil, blood...) = boiling
*ardent *(sun, passion, desire, thirst...) = burning
*ardorós -osa* and *xardorós -osa* = same as above, more literary
*abrusador -a* (sun, fire) = blazing
*tòrrid -a* (weather, place, passion...) = torrid
*roent *(iron, oil...) = red-hot, burning
*candent *- same as above
*xafogós -osa* (day, weather) = scorching
*canicular *(day, heat) = canicular, midsummer-hot

*HOT - WARM
calent -a* = hot
*calorós -osa* (weather, day, discussion, welcome) = hot, warm
*càlid -a* (weather, country, colour...) = usually/typically hot/warm, mild

*LUKEWARM, TEMPERATE*
*tebi tèbia *(water and liquids, attitudes...) = tepid, lukewarm, mild
*temperat -ada* (climate, area) = temperate

*COOL*
*fresc -a* = cool, fresh
*fresquívol -a* (place, _literary_) = cool, chilly

*COLD 
fredós -osa* = rather cold
*fred -a* = cold
*fredorós - osa* = chilling

*VERY COLD, ICE-COLD, FREEZING, GLACIAL
glaçat -ada
gelat -ada
gèlid -a
geliu -ida
congelat -a
glacial
frígid -a*


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## nimak

*Macedonian*


*свежо *(svéžo) adj. adv. lit. "fresh"; "cool"; (weather)
*ладно *(ládno) adj. adv. "cold"; (weather, water...)
*студено *(stúdeno) adj. adv. "cold"; (weather, water...)
*мраз* (mraz) n.m., adv. "ice", "ice-cold"; _Example_: *Надвор е мраз.* _lit._ "Outside is ice."; "It's ice-cold outside."; (weather, water...)
*камен студено*/*ладно* (kámen stúdeno/ládno) _lit_. "stone-cold"; (weather, water...)


*млако *(mláko) adj. adv. "lukewarm"; (water...)
*топло *(tóplo) adj. adv. "warm"; (weather, water...)
*жешко *(žéško) adj. adv. "hot"; (weather, water...)
*врело *(vrélo) adj. adv. "hot", "boiling"; (water... rarely weather)
*изгор (жешко)* (ízgor (žéško)) _lit._ "burning hot"; (weather)


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## ThomasK

@nimak: I added some titles and questions in it...


nimak said:


> *Macedonian*
> *COLD ; as far as I can see, no metaphorical use? *_Chilly atmosphere among people?_
> 
> *свежо *(svéžo) adj. adv. lit. "fresh"; "cool"; (weather)
> *ладно *(ládno) adj. adv. "cold"; (weather, water...)
> *студено *(stúdeno) adj. adv. "cold"; (weather, water...)
> *мраз* (mraz) n.m., adv. "ice", "ice-cold"; _Example_: *Надвор е мраз.* _lit._ "Outside is ice."; "It's ice-cold outside."; (weather, water...)
> *камен студено*/*ладно* (kámen stúdeno/ládno) _lit_. "stone-cold"; (weather, water...)
> *LUKEWARM **& **WARM* : no metaphorical use either? _Burning love?  _
> 
> *млако *(mláko) adj. adv. "lukewarm"; (water...)
> *топло *(tóplo) adj. adv. "warm"; (weather, water...)
> *жешко *(žéško) adj. adv. "hot"; (weather, water...)
> *врело *(vrélo) adj. adv. "hot", "boiling"; (water... rarely weather)
> *изгор (жешко)* (ízgor (žéško)) _lit._ "burning hot"; (weather)


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## ThomasK

Thanks for the addition of colour and the very complete list, Penyafort!

I marked metaphorical use in green and asked some questions in red... Thanks in advance!


Penyafort said:


> In *Catalan*: (only adjectives here)
> 
> *VERY HOT
> bullent *(water, oil, blood...) = boiling
> *ardent *(sun, passion, desire, thirst...) = burning
> *ardorós -osa* and *xardorós -osa* = same as above, more literary
> *abrusador -a* (sun, fire) = blazing
> *tòrrid -a* (weather, place, passion...) = torrid (but could it be that 'torrid' is also a synonym of dry?)
> *roent *(iron, oil...) = red-hot, burning (does the word refer to red or to burning, I wonder...)
> *candent *- same as above
> *xafogós -osa* (day, weather) = scorching
> *canicular *(day, heat) = canicular, midsummer-hot
> 
> *HOT - WARM
> calent -a* = hot _(not a calent lady?)_
> *calorós -osa* (weather, day, discussion, welcome) = hot, warm (a warm welcome, een warm/ hartelijk [heart-y] welkom)
> *càlid -a* (weather, country, colour...) = usually/typically hot/warm, mild
> 
> *LUKEWARM, TEMPERATE*
> *tebi tèbia *(water and liquids, attitudes...) = tepid, lukewarm, mild
> *temperat -ada* (climate, area) = temperate ( a temperate character?)
> 
> *COOL - **no metaphorical use at all? *
> *fresc -a* = cool, fresh
> *fresquívol -a* (place, _literary_) = cool, chilly
> 
> *COLD
> fredós -osa* = rather cold
> *fred -a* = cold
> *fredorós - osa* = chilling
> 
> *VERY COLD, ICE-COLD, FREEZING, GLACIAL
> glaçat -ada
> gelat -ada
> gèlid -a
> geliu -ida
> congelat -a
> glacial
> frígid -a*


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## Circunflejo

Pelar is to lose your external part so to speak. Hair isn't involved in hace un frío que pela. But skin may be involved because ice may burn you so you lose part of your skin. However, there's a theory that says the origin of that senteces was that some mountaineers had a drop of temperatures in the Himalayes and found that nuts became easier to _open _(easier de pelar) with the cold.

Regarding fresco, I should say that the meaning related with cold isn't as an adjective but as a noun. As an adjective to describe a behaviour, desvergonzado is usually used instead of fresco. However, fresco/a is used to talk about people with a meaning close to shameless, impudent.

Ferviente, as I said on my first post, is rarely used with the meaning of boiling. The most usual use is the one that I quoted on my previous post: un ferviente seguidor, defensor or whatever.

Yes, your behaviour can be bochornoso.

Yes, there's a link with suffocation.

@Penyafort's post recalled me of some more ones in Spanish (same use that in Catalan):


Penyafort said:


> *ardorós -osa*


In Spanish, ardoroso/a.


Penyafort said:


> abrusador


In Spanish, abrasador/abrasadora.


Penyafort said:


> candent


There's candente too in Spanish but it isn't used so much to express heat but the result of the heat. Something becomes candente due to heat. Metaphorically, a question is candente if it heats up the discussion.


Penyafort said:


> congelat


In Spanish, congelado/a.


Penyafort said:


> glacial


Identical in Spanish.


Penyafort said:


> frígid


In Spanish, frígido/a but it's a cultism.


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## Yendred

Circunflejo said:


> hace un frío que pela



Yes we have a similar idiomatic and colloquial expression in French: _ça pèle ! (= it's freezing!), _from the verb_ peler = to lose one's skin._
Although hair is not involved in the Spanish/French verbs meaning, _pelar/peler_ indeed come from Latin _pilus = hair_.

I just saw English has an equivalent colloquial expression: "_it's brass monkeys!_".
I'd be interested if an English speaker can explain this colourful expression.


----------



## Penyafort

ThomasK said:


> I marked metaphorical use in green and asked some questions in red... Thanks in advance!



If we refer to _un estiu *tòrrid*_ (a torrid summer), we can infer that the summer is very hot and supposedly dry too. But generally speaking, _tòrrid _only refers to the strong heat. Catalan is usually more accurate for the adjective dry in that there are two words: a general one for dry (_sec_) and one for things which were wet and have been dried (_eixut_). 

*Roent *refers to something which is burning hot to a shining point, that is, acquiring a red-hot or white-hot quality. This is why it's mostly used with burning metals, specially iron, with nails, or with liquids such as oil. But it can also be used with skies, clouds, or in general, anything that seems to burn like fire at a particular moment.

*Calent *does not have the meaning of 'sexually attractive' (but rather of 'aroused').
If you mean to translate 'a hot lady' and say _una dona calenta_, you don't get the same meaning in Catalan. 
What a Catalan speaker would understand with it, depending on the context, would probably either be _una dona [de sang] calenta_, that is, _a hot-blooded woman_ (passionate on a regular basis), or _una dona [que va] calenta_, which is a _woman who feels horny_ (sexually aroused now).

In other words, Catalan, as happens with other Romance languages, makes a difference between:
- (things) the bread is hot, the sand is hot - _el pa està calent, la sorra està calenta_ [to "be hot"]​- (the weather) it is hot - _fa calor_ [to "make heat"]​- this boy is hot, this girl is hot -​- 1, (feels the heat) _aquest/a noi/a té calor_ ["has heat"]​- 2, (is sexually attractive) _aquest noi està bo, aquesta noia està bona_ [to "be good", which is distinguished from the moral quality, that would use the verb "_és_" and not "_està_", and distinguished from the state of health, that would use the adverb "_bé_" (well) and not "_bo/bona_" (good)]​
*Temperat *can also mean _moderate_, yes. It is referred then to attitudes, behaviours, policies...

If you mean if '_cool_' has the meaning of 'great!' in Catalan, no, it doesn't. The word '_*fresc fresca*_', apart from the literal sense of 'cool' and 'fresh', can also mean 'cheeky, sassy' in a figurative sense.


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## ThomasK

I think I understand the expression now: we can say that something can be _frozen *off*_... 

@Penyafort: I checked the etymology of _*roent*_, and if I am not mistaken, it is based on Latin _rubere_, which is "to be red, to blush), but the red is of course due to the heat. The idea about* t*_*he dones (...) calentes  *_and_* calente*_ in *gener*_*al *_is quite clear now. Thanks a lot for the excellent explanations!


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## kaverison

In Tamil country, where the seasons are mild to hot summer (we do have winter season which is like spring elsewhere), we probably have more words for hot than cold.


*Hot*

hot = சூடு - suudu
hotness = வெம்மை - vemmai
hot = வெக்கை; also perspiring
hotness, state of being hot, temperature = வெப்பம் - veppam

boil = கொதி - kodhi, காய்ச்சு - kaaychu
burn (v) = எரி - eri;
எரிச்சல் - ericcal then points to irritation due to burn. It also refers to being irritated (mentally) 

luke warm = வெது வெது/வெத வெத - vedhu vedhu/vedha vedha


*Cold*
cold = குளிர் - kuLir

cold = தண்மை - cold, not hot, room temperature
தண் = prefix to mean cold, mild
coldness/state of being cold = தட்பம் = state of being cold (again, not cold as in snow countries)

தண்மை also refers to character as in calm, collected

nowadays, we use the term cil - சில் to refer to cold too.
சில்லிடுதல், சில்லிட்டு - cilliduthal/cillittu  = to become cold
சிலுசிலுப்பு - cold (as in a breezy condition)
Don't know the origin. It is possible, the root is chill in English. But, I won't be surprised, if this word existed even before.

In literature, we have நளிர் - naLir to refer to cold. Also, refers to shaking/trembling because of fear. By similarity, it probable came to refer to cold (shiver).

When it is extremely cold, we say
கடுங்குளிர் - kadum kuLir = severe/harsh cold
நடுக்கும் குளிர் - nadukkum kuLir = shivering cold

We have பனி - pani to refer to dew, ice, snow etc. uRai pani - உறை பனி to mean frozen snow.

*Atmosphere*
வெய்யில் - veyyil = hot as in a day, sunlight

தட்ப வெப்பம் is a modern coinage that refers to temperature/climate. தட்ப வெப்ப நிலை refers to temperature.

(Probably from Sanskrit usage of சீதோஷ்ணம் - siithooshNam before with similar meaning/formation. There is also வானிலை - vaanilai (literally state of the sky) to refer to weather.)

If sun is burning, we say அனல் கக்குது - anal kakkuthu = spitting fire

*Water*
water = நீர் - niir
also,
தண்ணீர் - thaN niir -> தண்ணி - thaNNi 
தண்ணீர் literally cold (room temperature) water

hot water = வெந்நீர் - venniir

Drinking water = குடி நீர்  - kudi niir

boiled water = காய்ச்சிய குடி நீர் - kaaycciya kudi niir
colloquially, காய்ச்சின தண்ணி - kaayccina thanni

also, கொதிக்கிற தண்ணி - kodhikkira thaNNi

In terms of food, we say 

வேக வை - vEga vai - to steam (as in vegetables)
சுடச் சுட - cudac cuda to refer to hot food

*Human body*

when you are running high fever, your body will be "boiling".
you have (fever) temperature = (உன்) உடம்பு கொதிக்கிறது - (un) udambu kodhikkiRathu

வெக்கை - vekkai = being hot, perspiring
வியர்வை - viyarvai = perspiration
வியர்க்கிறது - viyarkkiRathu = sweating

*Other*
to cool down = ஆறு/ஆற்று - ARu/ARRu. 
சூடு ஆறட்டும் - cuudu ARattum = let it cool down

Also, 
சூடு தணியட்டும் - cuudu thaniyaddum - let it cool down
சூடு அடங்கட்டும் - adangattum - let is subside
சூடு குறையட்டும் kuRaiyattum = let it lower

We also use these in human feelings. 
கோபம் தணியட்டும் - kObam thaniyaddum - reduce anger

The root வெம் for heat probably shares root for other words like வெள்ளை = white color, வெளிச்சம் = light/brightness, and probably வெடி = explode. and also words for some feelings like anger, agitated, envy etc.


----------



## ThomasK

Thanks a lot, but this will take a week to study all of this! ;-). Some simple questions first (red about meaning, green about fig. use). But I stopped halfway because I did not see "t° words" anymore, or reference to heat or cold. Could you comment a little on the structure?



kaverison said:


> In Tamil country, where the seasons are mild to hot summer (we do have winter season which is like spring elsewhere), we probably have more words for hot than cold.
> 
> *Hot*
> hot = சூடு - suudu
> hotness = வெம்மை - vemmai *hot/ hotness: not the same root? *
> hot = வெக்கை; also perspiring (sweaty?)
> hotness, state of being hot, temperature = வெப்பம் - veppam -- *b**ut not the same as suudu? C**an these be used figuratively?*
> 
> boil = கொதி - kodhi, காய்ச்சு - kaaychu - *same root? Kaaychu: boiling?*
> burn (v) = எரி - eri; *how about burning? *
> எரிச்சல் - ericcal then points to irritation due to burn. It also refers to being irritated (mentally) --- *but is that strictly speaking a word related with heat? The heat is the cause but "irritating" is a "t° word", I'd say...  **Can these be used fig. ? *
> 
> luke warm = வெது வெது/வெத வெத - vedhu vedhu/vedha vedha
> 
> 
> *Cold*
> cold = குளிர் - kuLir
> 
> cold = தண்மை - cold, not hot, room temperature
> தண் = prefix to mean cold, mild
> coldness/state of being cold = தட்பம் = state of being cold (again, not cold as in snow countries)
> 
> தண்மை also refers to character as in calm, collected - = G*oogle T says: "colourless". Lukewarm? *
> 
> nowadays, we use the term cil - சில் to refer to cold too.
> (VERB சில்லிடுதல், சில்லிட்டு - cilliduthal/cillittu  = to become cold)
> சிலுசிலுப்பு - cold (as in a breezy condition)
> Don't know the origin. It is possible, the root is chill in English. But, I won't be surprised, if this word existed even before.* Figurative use? *
> 
> In literature, we have நளிர் - naLir to refer to cold. Also, refers to *shaking/trembling because of fear*. By similarity, it probable came to refer to cold (shiver). But then the main/ original meaning is fear?
> 
> When it is extremely cold, we say
> கடுங்குளிர் - kadum kuLir = severe/harsh cold
> நடுக்கும் குளிர் - nadukkum kuLir = shivering cold. *Figurative use?*
> 
> We have பனி - pani to refer to dew, ice, snow etc. uRai pani - உறை பனி to mean frozen snow.*Figurative use?
> 
> Atmosphere*
> வெய்யில் - veyyil = hot as in a day, sunlight --- So a word different fromt he above literal words?
> 
> தட்ப வெப்பம் is a modern coinage that refers to temperature/climate. தட்ப வெப்ப நிலை refers to temperature. = cold?
> 
> (Probably from Sanskrit usage of சீதோஷ்ணம் - siithooshNam before with similar meaning/formation. There is also வானிலை - vaanilai (literally state of the sky) to refer to weather.)
> 
> If sun is burning, we say அனல் கக்குது - anal kakkuthu = spitting fire --- like scorching?
> 
> *Water*
> water = நீர் - niir
> also,
> தண்ணீர் - thaN niir -> தண்ணி - thaNNi
> தண்ணீர் literally cold (room temperature) water
> 
> hot water = வெந்நீர் - venniir
> 
> Drinking water = குடி நீர்  - kudi niir
> 
> boiled water = காய்ச்சிய குடி நீர் - kaaycciya kudi niir
> colloquially, காய்ச்சின தண்ணி - kaayccina thanni
> 
> also, கொதிக்கிற தண்ணி - kodhikkira thaNNi
> 
> In terms of food, we say
> 
> வேக வை - vEga vai - to steam (as in vegetables)
> சுடச் சுட - cudac cuda to refer to hot food
> 
> *Human body*
> 
> when you are running high fever, your body will be "boiling".
> you have (fever) temperature = (உன்) உடம்பு கொதிக்கிறது - (un) udambu kodhikkiRathu
> 
> வெக்கை - vekkai = being hot, perspiring
> வியர்வை - viyarvai = perspiration
> வியர்க்கிறது - viyarkkiRathu = sweating
> 
> *Other*
> to cool down = ஆறு/ஆற்று - ARu/ARRu.
> சூடு ஆறட்டும் - cuudu ARattum = let it cool down
> 
> Also,
> சூடு தணியட்டும் - cuudu thaniyaddum - let it cool down
> சூடு அடங்கட்டும் - adangattum - let is subside
> சூடு குறையட்டும் kuRaiyattum = let it lower
> 
> We also use these in human feelings.
> கோபம் தணியட்டும் - kObam thaniyaddum - reduce anger
> 
> The root வெம் for heat probably shares root for other words like வெள்ளை = white color, வெளிச்சம் = light/brightness, and probably வெடி = explode. and also words for some feelings like anger, agitated, envy etc.



-


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## Circunflejo

kaverison said:


> Human body


That reminds me of febril (febrile in English).


----------



## Welsh_Sion

Yendred asks about this. (I notice that you use the polite version!)

I just saw English has an equivalent colloquial expression: "_it's brass monkeys!_".
I'd be interested if an English speaker can explain this colourful expression.

_________

See here: What Is The Origin Of The Term "Brass... | Lexico

_____

Sorry for lack of Welsh but really my Facebook translation is a very very big job! $0+ translators working on it now ...


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## ThomasK

Circunflejo said:


> That reminds me of febril (febrile in English).


Interesting: our body can be hot in, erh, two ways indeed!


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## Circunflejo

ThomasK said:


> Interesting: our body can be hot in, erh, two ways indeed!


Other terms related with body temperature: hipertermia (high body temperature) and hipotermia (low body temperature). Both of them are nouns. The adjectives would be hipertérmico and hipotérmico. There's also the noun febrícula (hot but not as hot as someone febrile).


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## ThomasK

I hesitate with regard to these two because they are no longer strictly temperature-related, or only medically. I am most interested in metaphoric and I cannot imagine those two being used metaphorically. Or do you have a different point of view on that?


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## Circunflejo

ThomasK said:


> do you have a different point of view on that?


No, I don't. They are basically medical terms.


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## kaverison

ThomasK said:


> Thanks a lot, but this will take a week to study all of this! ;-). Some simple questions first (red about meaning, green about fig. use). But I stopped halfway because I did not see "t° words" anymore, or reference to heat or cold. Could you comment a little on the structure?



@ThomasK  Thank you so much for taking the time to go through it and for valuable comments. Tamil is a pretty old, classic language. It has wealth of vocabulary, but as it is being modernized, there are too many wannabe Tamil amateur linguists (more like enthusiasts, including myself . It's all in a flux. We still don't have a standardized Roman script. Nor do we have a body mediating new words like we have for English. Hence, Google T may not always be accurate. Hopefully, as more formally trained modern linguists come up, it will standardize.

As for the different words on *Hot*, sorry I was a bit lazy there. Like I said, there are many forms to mean heat (we are a hot country!). They have different roots, but they all come to mean heat (which in turn from roots for pain, harsh etc) in some way. Some may have figurative meaning. Let me try to answer your questions/comments *(in blue)*.

As for later text, I got carried away with the context. I will clean up.. Thanks again for keeping this forum interesting and making me think harder about my language.

*Hot*

1. sudu/cudu, suudu/cuudu
root cud/sud relates to be hot or burn (probably relates to the root cur/sur - stinging)
cudu/sudu (v) = heat (v), burn
(short vowel u as in p*u*t)

cuudu/suudu (n) = heat
(long uu as in sh*oo*t)

சூடான - suudaana = that; hat which has heat; like in hot milk = suudaana paal
(colloquially, we just say suudu paal)

சுடு நீர்/சுடு தண்ணீர் - s*u*du niir/sudu thaNNi = hot water
(short u)
This means "heated" water (actually in this form it refers that which was heated, which is heated, will be heated - transcends tense)

And there is a clear past tense form:
சுட்ட  - sutta/sudda = heated


2. There is a separate set of words out of the root *vE/vem*

hotness = வெம்மை - vemmai *hot/ hotness: not the same root? From the root vE/vem*
hot = வெக்கை; also perspiring* (sweaty?)*
*Yes. Since Tamil is agglutinate language, words form meanings when combined with other parts of sentence. Here வெக்கையாக இருக்கிறது would mean being sweaty*)

hotness, state of being hot, temperature = வெப்பம் - veppam -- *b**ut not the same as suudu? **C**an these be used figuratively?*

*suudu and veppam both relate to heat but used in different contexts. colloquially we use suudu more. veppam comes in formal situations like literature, speeches or TV news more. Also, vemmai is from classic Tamil. veppam is used in contemporary literature.*

I have seen suudu used figuratively - suuttai kiLapputhu - to mean something like the English expression "is it me or is it hot in here" or "she is hot". or suda suda/cuda cuda seythigal = hot off the press (seythigal is news)

vE root is used in வேக வைத்த முட்டை - vEga vaitha muttai - boiled egg

3. There is a 3rd set of words that come from root kaay - to become hot/to dry up.
This is often used in the context of boiling or brewing. Like I said, kaaychina kudi niir = hot water.

boil = கொதி - kothi,
boil = காய்ச்சு - kaaychu - *same root? Kaaychu: boiling?*

*kaaychu *is to boil (v), heat, fry, bake etc. Figuratively, fever is termed காய்ச்சல் - kaaychal.

*kothi *is the bubbling stage it gets to. Now, we are 100% sure it is boiled to 100 deg . கொதி நிலை - *kothi *nilai then refers to boiling point. உடம்பு கொதிக்கிறது - udambu kothikkiRathu = body boiling to mean high fever. kothikkiRathu also can be used to "piping hot". 

Apart from this, there is anal, azhal, thaNal etc referring to heat or heat source (like sun or fire). eri is to burn like lighting up fire.

4. burn (v) = எரி - eri; *how about burning? if you mean burning as in sensation, then எரிச்சல் - ericcal/erichal. If you mean the burning building, then எரிகின்ற கட்டிடம் - erikindRa kaddidam.*

எரிச்சல் - ericcal then points to irritation due to burn. It also refers to being irritated (mentally) --- *but is that strictly speaking a word related with heat? The heat is the cause but "irritating" is a "t° word", I'd say... Can these be used fig. ?*

Figuratively, yes. Both giving acute pain like being burned. We also have an expressions such as 

வயிறு எரியுது - vayiRu eriyuthu = stomach burning to refer to being upset (mentally). 
வயிறு எரிச்சல் - vayiRu erichalto mean someone burning up due to jealousy. 

Agreed, this is off topic on Heat/Cold. I will remove it.

luke warm = வெது வெது/வெத வெத - vedhu vedhu/vedha vedha
in literature, we refer to this as இளம் சூடு - mild heat.

*Cold*
cold = குளிர் - kuLir

cold = தண்மை - cold, not hot, room temperature
தண் = prefix to mean cold, mild
coldness/state of being cold = தட்பம் = state of being cold (again, not cold as in snow countries)

தண்மை also refers to character as in calm, collected - = G*oogle T says: "colourless". Lukewarm? *

*தண்மை refers to coolness or mild/gentleness. In poetry, they always use it in context of Moonlight. Colourless doesn't make sense. I wonder if someone typed up coolness with a typo. I will look it up. *

(As an aside, we have 3 N sounds in Tamil. N as Night (ந்) - comes only at the beginning of words, N as in kiln (ன்)  and N as in gurney American pronunciation.(ண்). தன்மை means property. Google T says opacity. Doesn't make sense. Will try to correct it)


nowadays, we use the term cil - சில் to refer to cold too.
(VERB சில்லிடுதல், சில்லிட்டு - cilliduthal/cillittu = to become cold)
சிலுசிலுப்பு - cold (as in a breezy condition)
Don't know the origin. It is possible, the root is chill in English. But, I won't be surprised, if this word existed even before.* Figurative use?*
I think this has literal meaning. However it is in an expression like கை சில்லிட்டது kai cillittathu = hand became cold to mean fear.

In literature, we have நளிர் - naLir to refer to cold. Also, refers to *shaking/trembling because of fear*. By similarity, it probable came to refer to cold (shiver). But then the main/ original meaning is fear?
Original word is நளி - naLi = Cold. naLir probably was formed similar to kuLir.

When it is extremely cold, we say
கடுங்குளிர் - kadum kuLir = severe/harsh cold
நடுக்கும் குளிர் - nadukkum kuLir = shivering cold. *Figurative use? 
Yes, but can be literally too. You should see our teeth typing in cold weather . 
(*We say teeth are sending telegram - பற்கள் தந்தி அடிக்கும் (younger folks here may not understand this!)



We have பனி - pani to refer to dew, ice, snow etc. uRai pani - உறை பனி to mean frozen snow.*Figurative use?
Hmm. uRai is freeze as well as cover. It could be figurative.

Reference:
Starling etymological dictionary for Dravidian Languages*


----------



## ThomasK

Thanks a lot. I added some extra question in blue or green. I am sorry, that got complicated. But I think I understood most of it! 





kaverison said:


> @ThomasK
> As for the different words on *Hot*, sorry I was a bit lazy there. Like I said, there are many forms to mean *heat *(we are a hot country!). They have different roots, but they all come to mean heat (*which in turn from roots for pain, harsh etc) i*n some way. Some may have figurative meaning. Let me try to answer your questions/comments *(in blue)*.
> 
> As for later text, I got carried away with the context. I will clean up.. Thanks again for keeping this forum interesting and making me think harder about my language.
> 
> *Hot*
> 
> 1. cudu/sudu (v) = heat (v), burns - root cud/sud relates to be hot or burn (*probably relates to the root cur/sur - stinging*)
> சூடான - *suudaana = that; hat which has heat*; like in hot milk = suudaana paal
> (colloquially, we just say suudu paal)
> 
> சுடு நீர்/சுடு தண்ணீர் - s*u*du niir/sudu thaNNi = hot water, "*heated" water* (actually in this form it refers that which was heated, which is heated, will be heated - transcends tense)
> 
> 2. There is a separate set of words out of the root *vE/vem*
> 
> hotness = வெம்மை - vemmai *hot/ hotness: From the root vE/vem*
> hot = வெக்கை; also perspiring* ;** being sweaty*)
> hotness, state of being hot, temperature = *suudu and veppam *Also, vemmai is from classic Tamil. veppam is used in contemporary literature.both relate to heat but used in different contexts. colloquially we use suudu more. veppam comes in formal situations like literature, speeches or TV news more.
> 
> I have seen suudu used figuratively - *suuttai kiLapputhu - ... or "she is hot*". or
> suda suda/cuda cuda seythigal = *hot off the pre*ss (seythigal is news)
> *But then *_boil, burn, hea_*t can be translated using the same stem, i guess. That would a little uncommon around here, but... *
> 
> 3. There is a 3rd set of words that come from root *kaay - to become hot/to dry up. *This is often used in the context of *boiling or **brewing*. interesting addition. *kaaychu *is to boil (v), heat, fry, bake etc. Figuratively, fever is termed காய்ச்சல் - kaaychal. *(fever: blood boiling?)*
> kothikkiRathu also can be used to "piping hot".
> 
> Apart from this, there is
> *anal, azhal, thaNal* etc referring to heat or heat source (like sun or fire).
> *eri* is to burn like lighting up fire. _*to set on fire*_
> if you mean* burning as in sensation, *then எரிச்சல் - *ericcal/erichal. (burning love?)*
> 
> எரிச்சல் - ericcal then points to irritation due to burn. It also refers to being irritated (mentally) giving acute pain--- *but is that strictly speaking a word related with heat? The heat is the cause but "irritating" is a "t° word", I'd say... vayiRu eriyuthu = stomach burning to refer to being upset (mentally). *- vayiRu erichalto mean *someone burning up due to jealousy*.
> 
> luke warm = வெது வெது/வெத வெத - vedhu vedhu/vedha vedha. in literature, we refer to this as இளம் சூடு - mild heat. Any link with *VE/vem aboven?  Vedhu vedhu *any reason forthis reubplication (repetition)?
> 
> *Cold*
> cold = குளிர் - kuLir > cold = தண்மை/ transcription : kuLir ....?  - cold, not hot, room temperature
> *தண் = prefix to mean cold, mild **(so a cold that is not too cold? )*
> coldness/state of being cold = தட்பம் = state of being cold (again, not cold as in snow countries)
> 
> தண்மை also refers to character as in calm, collected - *தண்மை refers to coolness or mild/gentleness. In poetry, they always use it in context of Moonlight. *
> nowadays, we use the term cil - சில் to refer to cold too.
> (VERB சில்லிடுதல், சில்லிட்டு - cilliduthal/cillittu = to become cold)
> சிலுசிலுப்பு - cold (as in a breezy condition)
> Don't know the origin. It is possible, the root is chill in English. But, I won't be surprised, if this word existed even before.* Figurative use?*
> e *கை சில்லிட்டது kai cillittathu = hand became cold to mean fear.*
> 
> In literature, we have நளிர் - naLir to refer to cold. Also, refers to *shaking/trembling because of fear*. By similarity, it probable came to refer to cold (shiver).
> 
> When it is extremely cold, we say
> கடுங்குளிர் - kadum kuLir = severe/harsh cold
> நடுக்கும் குளிர் - nadukkum kuLir = shivering cold. *Figurative use?
> Ye*s, but can be literally too. You should see our teeth typing in cold weather *. (typing or tapping? I guess: tapping)*
> *(We say **teeth **are sending telegram ** (???)* - பற்கள் தந்தி அடிக்கும் (younger folks here may not understand this!)
> 
> We have பனி - pani to refer to dew, ice, snow etc. uRai pani - உறை பனி to mean frozen snow.*Figurative use?
> Hmm. uRai is freeze as well as cover. It could be figurative.
> 
> Reference:
> Starling etymological dictionary for Dravidian Languages*


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## kaverison

@ThomasK thanks for the interest and the questions. Helps with my own understanding (or lack of) of the language.. I must admit, it is overwhelming even for me. You really got me thinking about a lot of these.

In doing this, I realized how the thinking process is different in certain context and that decides how the words or expressions are formed.
This may be the reason for my mixing of heat/hot/temperature as well. Lost in translation .

In English the sentences form around a subject. In Tamil, it may be the object's action that more prevalent. The equivalent of "She is hot" would be "அவள் சூடாக உள்ளாள்" = she be hot, which is literally she is (temperature) hot, not the figurative meaning.
சூட்டைக் கிளப்புது refers to "that increases hotness".. Here the act resulted from looking at the subject!



> *But then *_boil, burn, hea_*t can be translated using the same stem, i guess. That would a little uncommon around here, but...*



True. vEm room leads to veppam (heat), vEka, vEkum (steaming/baking/cooking, also us cooking in sweat), vekkai = sweat.

I left out,
veyyil = sunlight
vEnil = summer
veyarvai, viyarvai = sweat

As for the "hot" in human context, vEtkai = (burning) desire, used more in old literature. vekuLi = anger/rage, vekundu - in anger/rage.




> *(fever: blood boiling?)*



Here kaaychal = fever is just from the heat.
Blood boiling = ரத்தம் கொதிக்கிறது becomes figurative speech for being angry/upset



> if you mean* burning as in sensation, *then எரிச்சல் - *ericcal/erichal. (burning love?)*



Like I said, vEtkai from vE root has the desire meaning. Here it is literally, erichal = annoyance, irritation




> uke warm = வெது வெது/வெத வெத - vedhu vedhu/vedha vedha. in literature, we refer to this as இளம் சூடு - mild heat. Any link with *VE/vem aboven? Vedhu vedhu *any reason forthis reubplication (repetition)?



That's an interesting observation about the connection to root vE. I think you are right. But, the word is vedhu vedhu is used as a double word (see note at the bottom ** ).

The real usage is vedhu vedhuppaana, where aana is a suffix to mean "that which makes" or "that which is like". I am guessing, this expression makes it "like heat" and thus, somewhat hot = warm. I really couldn't find any reference to this, but is an educated guess based on my limited knowledge.




> *தண் = prefix to mean cold, mild (so a cold that is not too cold? )*


Yes. To mean real cold in the modern sense (we got to see what's missing in weather, after fridge and AC), we use:
குளிர்ந்த தண்ணீர்

குளிர்ந்த is adjective to mean cool.




> *Ye*s, but can be literally too. You should see our teeth typing in cold weather *. (typing or tapping? I guess: tapping)
> (We say teeth are sending telegram (???)* - பற்கள் தந்தி அடிக்கும் (younger folks here may not understand this!)



I used typing figuratively (like the way old mechanical typewriter taps)
We used telegram (தந்தி) to mean teeth will tap as the mechanical device was tapped to send a telegraphic message. In either case, I guess it is referring to the tapping noises our teeth make when it's extremely cold. Our language is filled with such dramatic visualizations.

*NOTES: 
** Double words (not double meaning : *Such repetition is something we use a lot in Tamil for emphasis - sometimes as an adverb, sometimes just for rhyme. It is standardized in grammar as *இரட்டைக்கிளவி - irattai kiLavi = *literally double word.  This wiki page has a lot of examples.
There is also echo words, used purely for rhyme or as fillers. We have a word kal = stone. In conversation, we may say kallu killu (kallu = kal, killu has no meaning).

For reference, the romanization I used here is similar to the one U. Penn uses on their site.


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## apmoy70

Greek:

-*«Βραστός, -τή, -το»* [vrasˈtɔs] (masc.), [vrasˈti] (fem.), [vrasˈtɔ] (neut.) --> _boiling-hot, (liquid) boiling, cooked slowly in water_ < Ancient Gr. v. *«βράσσω» brắssō* --> _to shake violently, agitate, boil (up), winnow_ (of uncertain etymology, perhaps cognate with Lith. murdyti, _to break_).
One usually *«βράζει»* [ˈvra.zi] (3rd p. sing. present tense of MoGr v. *«βράζω»* [ˈvra.zɔ] < Ancient «βράσσω» brắssō) --> _boils_ over anger.
-*«Καυτός, -τή, -τό»* [kafˈtɔs] (masc.), [kafˈti] (fem.), [kafˈtɔ] (neut.) --> _very hot, scorching_ < Αncient Gr. deverbative adj. *«καυστός» kau̯stós* (idem) < Ancient v. *«καίω» kaí̯ō* --> _to kindle, set on fire, burn_ (possibly from PIE *keh₂u- _to burn_ and with possible cognates the Lith. kūlës, _firewood_, Persian سو‎ (su), _light_).
The summer heat-wave is (MoGr) *«καύσωνας»* [ˈkaf.sɔ.nas] (masc.) < Ancient Gr. 3rd declension masc. noun *«καύσων» kaú̯sōn* (nom. sing.), *«καύσωνος» kaú̯sōnŏs* (gen. sing.) --> _heatwave, hot wind_ < Classical v. *«καίω» kaí̯ō* (see earlier). Also* «καυτή»* [kafˈti] (fem.) is the heated discussion.
-*«Kαυτερός, -ρή, -ρό»* [kaf.teˈɾɔs] (masc.), [kaf.teˈɾi] (fem.), [kaf.teˈɾɔ] (neut.) --> _hot, spicy_ < Byz. Gr. adj. *«καυτερός» kau̯terós* (idem) < Ancient Gr. deverbative 3rd declension masc. *«καυτήρ» kau̯tḗr* (nom. sing.), *«καυτῆρος» kau̯têrŏs* (gen. sing) --> _cauterizing apparatus_ < Classical v. *«καίω» kaí̯ō* (see above).
With *«καυτερός»* we desribe any spicy food: *«καυτερή πιπεριά»* [kaf.teˈɾi pi.perˈʲa] (both fem.) --> _spicy/hot pepper_.
-*«Ζεστός, -τή, -τό»* [zesˈtɔs] (amsc.), [zesˈti] (fem.), [zesˈtɔ] (neut.) --> _hot, warm_ < Ancient deverbative *«ζεστός» zĕstós* --> _seething, hot_ < v. *«ζέω» zéō* --> _to seethe, boil_ (PIE *ie̯s- _to boil, foam_ cf Skt येषति (yes̩ati), _to boil up, bubble_, Av. yaēšiia, _to boil_, Alb. ziej, _to simmer, boil_).
*«Ζεστός»* is the "warm" person (with a "warm" heart), or the cosy apartment.

-*«Χλιαρός, -ρή, -ρό»* [xli.aˈɾɔs] (masc.), [xli.aˈɾi] (fem.), [xli.aˈɾɔ] (neut.) --> _tepid, lukewarm_ < Ancient Gr. deverbative *«χλιαρός/χλιερός» kʰlĭărós* and *kʰlĭĕrós* (idem) < v. *«χλιαίνω» kʰlĭaí̯nō/kʰlīaí̯nō* (note that the _iota_ is either short or long for metric reasons) --> _to warm, soften_ (PIE *ǵʰlei(d)- _gleaming, clear_ cf Proto-Germanic *glaimiz > Ger. glimmen, Eng. gleam/glimmer; OIrish glé, _bright_; OWelsh gloiu, _bright_).
*«Χλιαρός»* is the indifferent person; in the Christian Bible, «χλιαρός» is the lukewarm person that God will eventually deny: (Revelation 3:16) «ὅτι *χλιαρὸς* εἶ, καὶ οὔτε ζεστὸς οὔτε ψυχρός, μέλλω σε ἐμέσαι ἐκ τοῦ στόματός μου» - "so then, because you are *lukewarm*, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth" (NKJV).

-*«Δροσερός, -ρή, -ρό»* [ðrɔ.seˈɾɔs] (masc.), [ðrɔ.seˈɾi] (fem.), [ðrɔ.seˈɾɔ] (neut.) --> _cool, dewy, refreshing_ < Ancient adj. *«δροσερός» drŏsĕrós* (idem) < Ancient masc. noun *«δρόσος» drósŏs* --> _dew_ (of unknown etymology, possibly Pre-Greek).
Used for young and beautiful girls.
-*«Κρύος, -α, -ο»* [ˈkri.ɔs] (masc.), [ˈkri.a] (fem.), [ˈkri.ɔ] (neut.) --> _cold_ < Ancient Gr. *«κρυόεις, -εσσᾱ, -εν» krŭóei̯s* (masc.), *krŭóĕssā* (fem.), *krŭóĕn* (neut.) --> _icy cold, chilling_ (with obscure etymology).
The metaphor *«κρύος»* for unfriendly and unsympathetic person is universal.
-*«Ψυχρός, -ρή, -ρό»* [p͡sixˈɾɔs] (masc.), [p͡sixˈɾi] (fem.), [p͡sixˈɾɔ] (neut.) --> _cold_ < Ancient Gr. adj. *«ψυχρός p͡sŭkʰrós* (idem), possibly related together with the v. *«ψύχω» p͡súkʰō* --> _to blow, cool down, dry (in the wind)_ to the fem. noun *«ψῡχή» p͡sūkʰḗ* --> _aspiration, breath, soul, spirit, life, vitality_ (of unknown etymology).
With *«ψυχρός»* we usually describe a distant and reserved person.
-*«Παγωνιά»* [pa.ɣɔˈɲa] (fem.) is the _very cold weather_ < Ancient *«πάγος» pắɡŏs* (masc.) --> _ice, hoarfrost, frost, pinnacle, hill, cliff_ (PIE *peh₂ǵ- _to make fast, coagulate_ cf Skt. पज्र (pajra), _solid_, Lat. pāgus, _district_, pāgina, _column_).
-*«Χιονιάς»* [çɔˈɲas] (masc.) --> _very cold, snowy weather_ < Byz.Gr. neuter diminutive *«χιóνιον» khiónion* --> _snow, blanket of snow_ < Ancient 3rd declension fem. noun *«χιών» kʰiṓn* (nom. sing.), *«χιόνος» kʰĭónŏs* (gen. sing.) --> _snow, blanket of snow, snow-water_ (PIE *ǵʰ(e)i-m- _winter_ cf Skt. हिमा (himā), Hitt. gimmi-, Lat. hiems, Arm. ձմեռ (jmer), Alb. dijën, Proto-Slavic *zima > Rus./Ukr. зима, Cz./Pol./Svk. zima, OCS зима > BCS зима/zima, Slo. zima).


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## Awwal12

kaverison said:


> *Double words (not double meaning) : *Such repetition is something we use a lot in Tamil for emphasis


On a sidenote, colloquial Russian uses intensifying reduplication comparatively frequently with adjectives and adverbs (холодный-холодный "very cold", горячий-горячий "very hot" etc.), but it's not a *lexical* feature and therefore I naturally didn't mention that.


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## kaverison

> On a sidenote, colloquial Russian uses intensifying reduplication comparatively frequently with adjectives and adverbs (холодный-холодный "very cold", горячий-горячий "very hot" etc.), but it's not a *lexical* feature and therefore I naturally didn't mention that.



Thanks for the aside! Interesting to know it only exists colloquially. In Tamil, I see people use such words as fillers, as tend to speak faster than thought. Do you have other ways of expressing the same formally (like comparative words?).

I think a similar usage exists in Tamil too. The grammatical unit I mentioned, *இரட்டைக்கிளவி,* is well defined. Here individual word doesn't have any meaning until it is repeated like that. But there are also situations people repeat words, where individual words themselves mean the same. We use *கொதிக்க கொதிக்க = boiled boiled/hot hot* to mean really hot. மெள்ள மெள்ள = slowly, slowly, I think to mean very slowly. பார்த்து பார்த்து = looking, looking. To mean very carefully looking.. சொட்ட சொட்ட = drippy, drippy to mean really drenched (like in rain).

I heard in In Malay (and Indonesian), they repeat to mean plural.


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## ThomasK

Quite true, this is not lexical, and moreover, I think those terms are never used metaphorically… My starting-point was mainly: what common "t° words" ;-) are used metaphorically? My first idea was chilly vs. warm (welcome, …), but then I tried to generalize a bit, which made it more complex...


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