# de fructu vero ligni



## Tom Greenhill

Hi guys,

I just have a question concerning the sentence:
_*
de fructu vero ligni* quod est in medio paradisi praecepit nobis Deus ne comederemus et ne tangeremus illud ne forte moriamur.
_
"*But of the fruit of the tree* which is in the midst of paradise, God hath commanded us that we should not eat; and that we should not touch it, lest perhaps we die." (Genesis 3:3)

What's the meaning of "de" here? Does it mean "of (the fruit of the tree)"?
Also, what does "vero" mean in this context? I've looked it up from Wiktionary, and I found that it could mean both "in particular" and "but", so I was confused.

Was it like this?
But of the fruit of the tree
de fructu vero ligni

And if this is the case, was the word "but" omitted?

Thank you very much in advance!


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## wandle

Tom Greenhill said:


> What's the meaning of "de" here? Does it mean "of (the fruit of the tree)"?


Yes.

_Vero _does mean 'but', as the translation indicates. However, it never starts a sentence or clause: it is always placed following another word. In this case, the words _de fructu _are linked so closely in syntax that they are treated as if they were one word.


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## Glenfarclas

wandle said:


> However, it never starts a sentence or clause: it is always placed following another word.



_Autem_ and _enim_ are the other most common examples of words with that property.


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## Tom Greenhill

wandle said:


> Yes.
> 
> _Vero _does mean 'but', as the translation indicates. However, it never starts a sentence or clause: it is always placed following another word. In this case, the words _de fructu _are linked so closely in syntax that they are treated as if they were one word.



Thank you!

I can see that _de fructu_ is treated as one word, so are you saying that _vero_ is actually serving as the "but" in this sentence?

Like:
But of the fruit of the tree
de fructu vero ligni


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## wandle

wandle said:


> _Vero _does mean 'but', as the translation indicates.





Tom Greenhill said:


> Like:
> But of the fruit of the tree
> de fructu vero ligni


Yes.
It could alternatively be translated as 'however'.


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## flljob

fructu es ablativo sngular de fructus -us
vero es ablativo singular de verus -a -um
ligni es genitivo singular de lignum -i

del fruto verdadero del árbol, que resulta ambigua, cuando menos en español.

"de" me parece que indica un partitivo.


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## Glenfarclas

flljob said:


> del fruto verdadero del árbol



Como podrás ver del texto hebreo de ese versículo (por ejemplo, acá en traducción interlineal), no hay nada que en lo más mínimo se asemeje a "verdadero". Es algún prefijo o elemento de esa palabra (no me alcanza mi escasísimo conocimiento del hebreo como para decirte cuál) que lleva el sentido "pero".


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## Scholiast

Greetings all



flljob said:


> del fruto verdadero del árbol, que resulta ambigua, cuando menos en español.



In strong support of both wandle and Glenfarclas, _vide _this from L&S, s.v. _verus_, II B (_vērō_):

*2.* *Transf.*, as a strongly corroborative adversative particle, _but in fact_, _but indeed_, _however_ (always placed after a word).​Σ


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## fdb

vero translates δὲ of the Septuagint (ἀπὸ δὲ καρποῦ τοῦ ξύλου…). As Glenfarclas has remarked, there is nothing corresponding to it in the Hebrew.


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