# bien



## tortue_magique

My teacher said that when you want to say you like something You'd have to say j'aime bien, what does it mean if i only say j'aime chocolat? instead of j'aime bien chocolat?, I then looked in the phrase book and it said that  there was no j'aime bien, only j'aime (which meant to like) so is my teacher right or the book?


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## fetchezlavache

fist off, you have to say 'j'aime -ou j'aime bien- *le * chocolat'.

j'aime bien = i like
jaime = i love

so you can perfectly say 'j'aime le chocolat' !


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## tortue_magique

I dont get it, howcome you need "le" ?  Doesn't it mean the chocolate?

I like the chocolate?


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## fetchezlavache

you have to stop trying to translate literally. in french we need articles. either le/la/les, either un/une/des. it's like that.


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## Login

fetchezlavache said:
			
		

> I hardly think that a nation that eats snails and would go to bed with the kitchen sink if it put on a tutu is in any position to preach couthness.


 
 I cant' picture the sink with a tutu 
Ca vient d'où ?


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## fetchezlavache

Login said:
			
		

> I cant' picture the sink with a tutu
> Ca vient d'où ?




blackadder. je me régale..http://www.bbc.co.uk/comedy/blackadder/


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## Tsarina

Fetchez, je veux clarifier ---

En francais, alors, c'est plus fort dire simplement, J'aime qqc...    que J'aime bien qqc...?   C'est un peu contre-sens d'anglais. Normally, in English, I like/love something a lot is stronger than I like/love something. Perhaps I am confused as to the sense of bien ---

Merci en avance.


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## Nywoe

Tsarina said:
			
		

> Normally, in English, I like/love something a lot is stronger than I like/love something.


 
I do believe you forgot a word in that first example...maybe "really"...


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## Lora

Yeah, just wanna see if I have this clear in my head:

j'aime bien - I like
j'aime - I love

So *j'aime M. X* is 'I love Mr. X'? Is *j'aime bien M. X *the same as saying 'I like Mr. X?'

So how would you said 'I like you a lot' as opposed to 'I love you'?


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## Nico5992

Lora said:
			
		

> Yeah, just wanna see if I have this clear in my head:
> 
> j'aime bien - I like
> j'aime - I love
> 
> So *j'aime M. X* is 'I love Mr. X'? Is *j'aime bien M. X *the same as saying 'I like Mr. X?'
> 
> So how would you said 'I like you a lot' as opposed to 'I love you'?


 
You have perfecty understood.
There's no perfect translation for 'I like you a lot'.
Maybe 'Je t'aime beaucoup'.
What you have to remember is that the strongest expression is 'Je t'aime'.
Adding adverbs after 'aimer' (like 'bien', 'beaucoup', 'vraiment', 'fort'...) makes the expression weaker.


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## Lora

Really, oh right that's interesting...see it's kind of the opposite in English.

But maybe that's why French is the most romantic language in the world.

I love you. What else needs to be said other than that?

That's for clarifying that for me...and putting me in a slushy romantic mood


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## Nico5992

NB: The expression "I like him/her" is often translated into "Il/Elle me plaît".


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## fetchezlavache

Tsarina said:
			
		

> Fetchez, je veux clarifier ---
> 
> En francais, alors, c'est plus fort dire simplement, J'aime qqc...    que J'aime bien qqc...?   C'est un peu contre-sens d'anglais. Normally, in English, I like/love something a lot is stronger than I like/love something. Perhaps I am confused as to the sense of bien ---
> 
> Merci en avance.



i never said that 'j'aime bien' = i like *a lot.*

if you want to say 'a lot' you have to use 'j'aime *beaucoup'*.


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## Tsarina

Nico5992 said:
			
		

> You have perfecty understood.
> There's no perfect translation for 'I like you a lot'.
> Maybe 'Je t'aime beaucoup'.
> What you have to remember is that the strongest expression is 'Je t'aime'.
> Adding adverbs after 'aimer' (like 'bien', 'beaucoup', 'vraiment', 'fort'...) makes the expression weaker.



This really makes it clear for me. As Lora says, it's different in English, certainly on the surface. Piling on adverbs is supposed to strengthen the feeling, but probably the French are right, the simplest word does it best.


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## Nico5992

Tsarina said:
			
		

> This really makes it clear for me. As Lora says, it's different in English, certainly on the surface. Piling on adverbs is supposed to strengthen the feeling, but probably the French are right, the simplest word does it best.


 
Nevertheless, "Je t'aime passionnément" or "Je t'aime à la folie" are stronger than "Je t'aime".
Saying to someone that you love him/her is an art in French!


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## Nywoe

Where would "Je t'adore" fit into this hierarchy of nuances??


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## Nico5992

Nywoe said:
			
		

> Where would "Je t'adore" fit into this hierarchy of nuances??


To my mind, "Je t'adore" is lesser than "Je t'aime"...
But it's pretty close.


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## timpeac

In Eurydice by Anouilh there is a scene which perfectly describes the difference between j'aime and j'aime bien. Forgive me if I get the quote wrong, but I read the play over 10 years ago and no longer have the book.

Eurydice is explaining to her boyfriend that she has met someone new and that she knows this is the love of her life, and she says to her soon-to-be-ex "je t'aime bien, mais lui je l'aime." I think we've all been on the receiving end of a phrase starting "I really like you but.." <sob>


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## Tsarina

Quote from Timpeac:
Eurydice is explaining to her boyfriend that she has met someone new and that she knows this is the love of her life, and she says to her soon-to-be-ex "je t'aime bien, mais lui je l'aime." I think we've all been on the receiving end of a phrase starting "I really like you but.." <sob> [/QUOTE]

Bravo, Timpeac! Oh, the heartbreak ---


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## Tsarina

Nico5992 said:
			
		

> Nevertheless, "Je t'aime passionnément" or "Je t'aime à la folie" are stronger than "Je t'aime".
> Saying to someone that you love him/her is an art in French!



Et bien, il me semble que les francais commencent tres jeunes a apprendre cet art. For instance, when children tell fortunes by pulling the petals off daisies (does anyone do this anymore, or is it another example of Il etait une fois...?), the French rhyme went something like this: Il m'aime un peu, beaucoup, a la folie, pas du tout. Mais en anglais il y a seulement une choix: He loves me, he loves me not...


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## Cath.S.

> Il m'aime un peu, beaucoup, a la folie, pas du tout. Mais en anglais il y a seulement u*n* choix: He loves me, he loves me not...


I think it goes/went "_Un peu, beaucoup, passionnément, à la folie, pas du tout_"


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## Tsarina

egueule said:
			
		

> I think it goes/went "_Un peu, beaucoup, passionnément, à la folie, pas du tout_"



Tant mieux, une nuance de plus!


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## Danielle

Reading all these made me think of a song " J' t'aime tout court" by Nicolas Ciccone. 
The title says it all... I think! Not so poetic, simply heartfelt


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## Zoléalie

In this case, heartfelt is very romantic !  This song title does magnificently illustrating what everyone was saying about weakening "iamer" by addig word to it ! good find  

and pour mettre mon grain de sel  


Nywoe, to answer your question about : je t'adore. 

Nico is right, it is, nowadays and in certain situations, lesser than "je t'aime", but only for people, not things.

In fact, _adorer_ was a very strong word, a verb used in the sense : _to worship_ a god or a godess. 

Later, it has been used in every day language and has two different uses : ( well, plenty, but  )

1) for things : _J'adore le chocolat_ will be stronger than _j'aime le chocolat._
( I love chocolate, vs I adore chocolate, or I luuuurve chocolate  )

2) for people : when you like someone but do not love them, you are always carefull either to add something to lessen the verb "aimer", or to use another verb ( as someone explained very well with _"je t'aime bien")_

saying : "_je t'adore_" to someone is not as strong as "_Je t'aime_". 
Imagine, you're a girl and one of your best male friends is in love with you. If you say to him, _je t'adore_, it's a kind way of saying : I'm extremely fond of you, you're my best friend, but I don't _love_ you.

So *any word stronger than "aimer", will stay stronger for things, but be weaker in a romantic context*. Nothing is as strong as "aimer" in a romantic context... see ?


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## Nywoe

Ah!!   Yes I do, thank you very much Zoléalie for the clarifications!!  Much appreciated. I wouldn't want to go saying the wrong phrase to anyone


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## Tsarina

Zoléalie said:
			
		

> In this case, heartfelt is very romantic !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ZOLEALIE
> So *any word stronger than "aimer", will stay stronger for things, but be weaker in a romantic context*. Nothing is as strong as "aimer" in a romantic context... see ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> En voila! Merci --- (j'adore le chocolat, I luuuuuuuve chocolate.yum)
Click to expand...


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## Zoléalie

LOL, perhaps I should have written : J'adôôôôôre le chocolat !


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## Lora

This thread has positively made my day. How romantic and sweet and lovely.

J'aime le français!  Pun intended.

Merci!


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## Login

Lora said:
			
		

> Really, oh right that's interesting...see it's kind of the opposite in English.


What do you mean exaclty ? Isn't "I love you" the strongest way to say "je t'aime" ??

Login confused today... Must be the fiever


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## Benjy

Login said:
			
		

> What do you mean exaclty ? Isn't "I love you" the strongest way to say "je t'aime" ??
> 
> Login confused today... Must be the fiever



YESH it is


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## Lora

Oooh sorry - what I mean is that in English 'I love you' can be strengthed by saying,
'I love you a lot'
'I really love you'

Whereas in French, words like 'bien' or 'beaucoup' apparently weaken the meaning of 'aimer' this isn't the case in English.

Sorry for the confusion there


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## Login

Lora said:
			
		

> Oooh sorry - what I mean is that in English 'I love you' can be strengthed by saying,
> 'I love you a lot'
> 'I really love you'
> 
> Whereas in French, words like 'bien' or 'beaucoup' apparently weaken the meaning of 'aimer' this isn't the case in English.
> 
> Sorry for the confusion there


 
Do other English natives agree with that ?


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## Zoléalie

Hum, although I'm not an english native, I would have thought : I really love you strengthens the word love, but in french also : je t'aime vraiment. (usually said if the person you love doubts it ) 

As for : I love you a lot, I don't know why but to me it weakens the romantic meaning of the concept "love"... I'd say I love you a lot to my parents, child, friend.. to a lover I'd simply say I love you....( madly  ) 
Is my french side leading me astray here ? 

Oh, and concerning the sentence : " j'aime le français" ( pun intended) I thin you should know there is no pun ( although I see where you're coming from, here) because you can indeed use the word love for things.


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## Benjy

Login said:
			
		

> Do other English natives agree with that ?



yesh. 

nb. but i love you tout court is not a "weak" thing to say. if that makes any sense.


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## Tsarina

As a native English speaker: yes, adverbs can strengthen the force of to love --- especially "really", "passionately". Adore is even stronger, for people as well as things. Then we can progress to "I'm mad about you" --- (a la folie).

So there is a difference ----

But in English also, as in French, a simple I love you can mean the world. Everything depends on the actual situation, words are not the only means of language here!  NYwoe, you're on your own ---


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## Lora

Yeah I agree, 'I love you' is not a weak thing to say - argh I'm not getting my point across very well...I just mean that while 'bien' is making 'aimer' weaker it's sort of the opposite in English.
That's why I said French is so romantic. The notion that you don't always need loads of words to convey something as strong as love. So it could be argued that 'I love you' is the strongest...but words such as 'really' certainly add to its strength, in certain contexts.

Probably best to ignore everything I said as it's all rubbish. I know what I mean though, honest.

And the pun thing...I know you can use 'aime' with things....
j'aime le français - I love French (the strongest way of saying it) hence why I said it was a pun...I'm sure that was the wrong thing to say...but still.

By the way: Having thought about it 'I love you a lot' sounds a bit....wrong. I love you lots maybe....


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## Danielle

It seems that a straight "Je t'aime" or "I love you" (tout nu, pas de bas!) is the naked truth. 
Just when it comes out of your mouth and you can't believe you actually said it out-load!
it's the feeling without the 'lingerie' to cover anything.

Turns out that it's hard to explain!!!  and yet uncontrolable at times!

see: http://cureuil.free.fr/jtaime_tout_court.html


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## xanana

The dummies guide to french says that "j'aime bien" is equivalent to "I prefer".


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## Lora

xanana said:
			
		

> The dummies guide to french says that "j'aime bien" is equivalent to "I prefer".


 
The Dummies Guide to French - now that is what I need!
Think I probably need that for English too hehe


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## Nywoe

If I would want to strengthen "I love you" in English, I would not use really...or even a lot...It's just my opinion, but doesn't sound...hmm...sincere or romantic to me....I would instead use "I love you like crazy", "I'm madly in love with you"...I just noticed that it seems that I believe that to strengthen "I love you", I would add something to get across the idea that I am so in love that I am loosing reason. But this is just my opinion...nothing technical...

N.


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## fetchezlavache

xanana said:
			
		

> The dummies guide to french says that "j'aime bien" is equivalent to "I prefer".




well, if it says that, it is totally stupid.

i prefer is je préfère.


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## Zoléalie

yes, the dummies guide to french is not helping, here...

are you sure it wasn't "j'aime mieux"? That, in spoken french, would indeed mean I prefer.


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## Kila

So what would " j'aime beaucoup Jane " translate to? I am confused... I am just starting to learn.


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## RODGER

Hi Kila, 
I would translate "j'aime beaucoup Jane" as "I really like Jane". The trouble is, I could translate "j'aime Jane" as "I like Jane" or "I love Jane" depending on the context. In fact though, thinking about it, if I really wanted to express the fact that I loved Jane I wouldn't say "j'aime Jane" , I would say "Je suis amoureux de Jane" et voilà !

Rodger


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## Michel R

When you say "J'aime bien le chocolat", I think you like more than "J'aime le chocolat". Both are good but if you like more you add "bien".


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## mcfadden_ronan

Also if you're referring just to a friend who you like in a non-romantic way, you can also say "Il est gentil / sympa / etc." so as not to confuse "love" with "like"


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## irka_hcmc

Bien = good, well, alright

C'est bien = it's good
Tu es bien = You're alright
Bien, on va passer à autre chose = Well, let's do something else
Bien être = well being


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## Icetrance

Zoléalie said:


> Hum, although I'm not an english native, I would have thought : I really love you strengthens the word love, but in french also : je t'aime vraiment. (usually said if the person you love doubts it )
> 
> As for : I love you a lot, I don't know why but to me it weakens the romantic meaning of the concept "love"... I'd say I love you a lot to my parents, child, friend.. to a lover I'd simply say I love you....( madly  )
> Is my french side leading me astray here ?
> 
> Oh, and concerning the sentence : " j'aime le français" ( pun intended) I thin you should know there is no pun ( although I see where you're coming from, here) because you can indeed use the word love for things.



I can say "Je t'aime bien" to mean "I love you."

When "Abbé Pierre" died,  people held a sign up that read " On t'aimait bien".  It didn't mean "You were liked, but rather *loved.* Remember that they are different kinds of love.

Also, you could say "J'aime beaucoup maman" to mean "I love mom a lot."

Athough "aimer bien"  often means simply "to like", it can be used to mean "love."  I've never heard it used with immediate family members, but I suppose it could be used to be show that you really don't love that person.


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