# carni bianche condite



## anglomania1

Hi there, 
I'm translating a text for a winery and this part is the pairing with food:
Ideale l’abbinamento con primi piatti mediamente saporiti, *carni bianche condite *o carni rosse alla griglia e formaggi di media stagionatura.

What exactly does "condito" mean in this sentence, referring to white meat?
Could it be "well-seasoned" or "spicy"?
Any suggestions?
Thanks, 
Anglo


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## alfaalfa

Ciao,
penso voglia significare qualsiasi cottura  NON alla griglia.


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## Fooler

Hi anglo,

As far as I know they might be referred to white meats served with a separate sauce such as bell peppers, ratatouille or stuff like that. Or simply grilled with herbs and/or infused spicy oil: garlic, thyme, chives, oregano, rosmary and so on. If this helps you......


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## Ciprianus

Io direi _"seasoned white meats"_.


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## london calling

_Condite_ here doesn't just mean seasoned (which means basically with added salt and pepper): as alfaalfa said it could mean anything apart from grilled meat and fooler has provided further examples, which 'seasoned' does not describe. 

Difficult to render. You may have to paraphrase it/translate it loosely, Anglo: white meat dishes, for example (not great, I know).


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## Ciprianus

I have found a lot of wine recommendations like "...Suggested pairings include [well/lightly] seasoned white meats..."


" seasoned white meats" - Google Search


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## alfaalfa

london calling said:


> _Condite_ here doesn't *just* mean seasoned


In effetti "condito" non significa nulla; di "scondito" conosco solo pasta/riso e insalata e la carne scondita (con il vino) non esiste. A "naso" anche con gli altri abbinamenti avevo pensato a carne non grigliata. Ma potrei sbagliare.


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## Tellure

Forse si intende questo:

"La nota complementare 6 a) del capitolo 2 della nomenclatura combinata allegata al regolamento (CEE) n. 2658/87 definisce le «carni insaporite non cotte» come carni «non cotte, il cui insaporimento viene effettuato in 
profondità o sulla totalità della superficie del prodotto ed il cui condimento è percettibile ad occhio nudo o nettamente percettibile al gusto»."
https://www.google.it/url?sa=t&sour...FrOqOcs9o6ROUjsrQ&sig2=dJZSkfXAYBkmB9QzMxioOA


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## alfaalfa

Giusto! Avevamo scordato la marinatura


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## anglomania1

Hi there and thanks, everyone,
from your varied answers I presume "condito" in this case means everything and nothing!!
"seasoned white meats" certainly seems to be used, as the link posted by Ciprianus shows.
Just out of interest, why is it that only grilled meat can't be "condito"? The "condimento" could be added after grilling the meat!! Couldn't roast meat be "non condito" (just bunged in a tin and chucked in the oven with nothing?), or boiled meat? Boh! Maybe I'm just being picky!! It's just that I often add spices to chicken and then grill it!
Thanks, 
Anglo


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## london calling

Exactly, Anglo. If you say _carni bianche condite_ it means any dish made using meat  which 'not just grilled', as the others have said above. _Seasoned_ in English does not cover that at all: the fact that it is used merely indicates that people don't know how to translate 'condito' as it is meant in Italian, which is understandable as I can't think how to translate it either if not loosely, as I said above.


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## johngiovanni

I would say that the wine goes well with flavo(u)rsome white meats.  (With the "u" in the UK, without the "u" in the USA).
As in: "A white with a great personality and complexity, it goes well with flavorsome white meats and intensely-flavored fish dishes such as creamed salted codfish."
So, basically, I am suggesting "flavo(u)rsome".


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## Odysseus54

Sinceramente faccio anch'io fatica a capire.  'Condire' generally means 'season', a technique that does not involve cooking - you are either doing it to raw meat (e.g. carpaccio - which is a red meat, and I can't think of a white meat carpaccio) or to boiled or roasted meat, as a finishing touch.  Vitello tonnato, chicken salad, arista di maiale seasoned with whatever you want.  

Could it be 'seasoned white meat cold cuts' ?


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## london calling

_Condite _can mean all the recipes Fooler mentions in his post 3 (and more). _Seasoned_ does not. If I season something I add salt or pepper to it (or possibly some herbs). 

For example Fooler mentions  'white meats served with a separate sauce such as bell peppers': that is not what I would classify as 'seasoned white meat', under no circumstances.


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## Fooler

I presume that here the difference is between the two types of cooking and recipes too. I mean, _condite_ could stand for those white meats such as chicken, turkey, rabbit, hare etc that perhaps are mainly cooked as a stew (eg _spezzatini, _or_ salmì_ with tomato gravy sauce and potatoes) or baked rather than grilled as the red meat (eg beef steaks etc). Here it's quite confusing too as I don't understand what kind of _condimento_ they refer: before grilling/baking ? or as a marinating sauce ? infused oil to drop over the white meat ? before or after their cooking ? and so on. Anyway, as we all natives here say, the word is quite ambiguous.


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## anglomania1

Hi there, 
I agree with LC, "season" is just adding salt, pepper and maybe a dash of oil, and surely "condire" is quite similar - I mean you "condisci l'insalata", which is just adding seasoning and oil, not cooking it!
So if the verb "condire" has all the meanings in Fooler's recipes, when it is used for salad it means one thing, but with meat it takes on a whole new meaning!!
So how to translate it??
Well, we don't have a single word in English and I can't list a load of recipes, so maybe JG's suggestion of "flavoursome" is the best, or perhaps "*white meat in a sauce*" or "*white meat with herbs or spices*"?? 
Thanks to everyone
Anglo


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## Fooler

johngiovanni said:


> I would say that the wine goes well with flavo(u)rsome white meats.  (With the "u" in the UK, without the "u" in the USA).
> As in: "A white with a great personality and complexity, it goes well with flavorsome white meats .............."
> So, basically, I am suggesting "flavo(u)rsome".





Due to the ambiguous and general word, this is what I would suggest too.


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## anglomania1

Thanks, Fooler!


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## Tellure

anglomania1 said:


> Hi there,
> I agree with LC, "season" is just adding salt, pepper and maybe a dash of oil, and surely "condire" is quite similar - I mean you "condisci l'insalata", which is just adding seasoning and oil, not cooking it!
> So if the verb "condire" has all the meanings in Fooler's recipes, when it is used for salad it means one thing, but with meat it takes on a whole new meaning!!
> So how to translate it??
> Well, we don't have a single word in English and I can't list a load of recipes, so maybe JG's suggestion of "flavoursome" is the best, or perhaps "*white meat in a sauce*" or "*white meat with herbs or spices*"??
> Thanks to everyone
> Anglo


"Spiced white meat" non è stato proposto da nessuno. Forse in inglese si intende "molto speziato"?
Comunque, riporto un riferimento dalla rete:
"This wine is an ideal match for oriental food, seafood with light spice and spiced white meat."
Old School Wines :: Details of Torrontes 'Fantasia' Lorca.

Edit:

"Specific Food Match: This is smoked salmon territory, cool and crisp enough to offset the oiliness without being too thin. Also great with cold meats and lightly spiced white meat and fish dishes."
Pinot Gris | WineTubeMap


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## Paulfromitaly

Tellure said:


> "Spiced white meat" non è stato proposto da nessuno


Da cosa deduci che "condito" = "speziato" ?
Magari la carne è condita con olio e limone..
L'originale è assolutamente ambiguo quindi ogni traduzione specifica è un azzardo.


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## Odysseus54

london calling said:


> _Condite _can mean all the recipes Fooler mentions in his post 3 (and more). _Seasoned_ does not. If I season something I add salt or pepper to it (or possibly some herbs).
> 
> For example Fooler mentions  'white meats served with a separate sauce such as bell peppers': that is not what I would classify as 'seasoned white meat', under no circumstances.



I disagree with Fooler's #3.

From the Treccani :

_Condire : 1. Rendere più saporito e più sostanzioso un cibo con l’aggiunta di sostanze adatte (dette appunto condimenti): c. i maccheroni col sugo; c. il radicchio, l’insalata (con sale, olio, aceto, ecc.)._

"Condire i maccheroni col sugo".  That's right.  You would not say "condire le scaloppine con i funghi" or "condire il risotto con cipolla e salsiccia".

In the action of 'condire' you are not blending ingredients by cooking them together.  You are combining a base and a seasoning, both either pre-cooked separately or raw.


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## Tellure

Paulfromitaly said:


> Da cosa deduci che "condito" = "speziato" ?
> Magari la carne è condita con olio e limone..
> L'originale è assolutamente ambiguo quindi ogni traduzione specifica è un azzardo.


Giusto. Io comunque con "spiced" intendevo "insaporito" come sinonimo di condito, ma forse sbagliando.

"Seasoned" dovrebbe bastare, allora:

*1. *To improve or enhance the flavor of (food) by adding salt, spices, herbs, or other flavorings.
 (American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fifth Edition)

*15. *(Cookery) (_tr_) to add herbs, salt, pepper, or spice to (food)
(Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged, 12th Edition 2014)

*8. *to give flavor to (food) by adding condiments, spices, or the like.
(Random House Kernerman Webster's College Dictionary, © 2010 K Dictionaries Ltd.)

season


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## anglomania1

Paulfromitaly said:


> Da cosa deduci che "condito" = "speziato" ?


Hi Paul,
Fooler's link in his first post contains lists of spices!! That's where I thought it might come from.
Tellure's post confirms that "season" can also be to add spice - though I agree with LC, where season means only adding salt and pepper!
There doesn't seem to be any consensus in either language!
I never realised that such a relatively simple word would set off all this discussion! It just goes to show how we use meaningless words everyday!
Anglo


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## Paulfromitaly

If I ordered "carni condite" in a restaurant, I'd have no clue what they'd bring me..
I know you are supposed to come up with a translation, but I'd ask them what they mean instead.


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## pebblespebbles

Hello Anglomania,
First of all I have to say that this generic description of "carni bianche condite" doesn't sound very appealing(nor tasty)....but, given the fact that white meat can be cooked in thousands way, maybe "cooked in several tipe of sauces", or something like that, could work.
Ciao


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## Tellure

"Ideale l’abbinamento con primi piatti mediamente saporiti, *carni bianche condite *o carni rosse alla griglia e formaggi di media stagionatura."

Non sono un'intenditrice di vini e di abbinamenti, e non conosco il vino in questione, ma leggendo tutto il periodo vedo che si tratta di un vino da abbinare a piatti dai sapori non troppo forti e decisi, per cui adatto ad accompagnare primi piatti *mediamente* saporiti, carni rosse (normalmente più grasse e saporite) cotte *alla griglia*, formaggi di *media* stagionatura, carni bianche (*più magre e dal sapore delicato*) condite. In questo caso, quindi, non credo si intenda "condite" semplicemente con olio, sale e pepe - o non solo in questo modo. "Seasoned" mi sembra una buona soluzione. Comunque, come suggerisce Paul, al posto tuo chiederei lumi agli autori del testo per maggior sicurezza.


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## Fooler

Paulfromitaly said:


> L'originale è assolutamente ambiguo quindi ogni traduzione specifica è un azzardo.



 As previously said, I still agree. And it seems to be ambiguous in English (at least AE) too. Or now, I can even think they want to mean with _condimento_ sides or dressing too or more generally sauces.

Still confusing all of us then, even for my chef friend whom I spoke about . The word can mean everything and nothing.


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## pebblespebbles

Hello anglomania, 
Is the text you are translating the label for a bottle of wine?
Such a description, so generic, I can imagine it to be only something like that. 
The even "carni bianche condite" could make a little bit more sense.


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## anglomania1

Paulfromitaly said:


> If I ordered "carni condite" in a restaurant, I'd have no clue what they'd bring me..*They wouldn't know what to bring you either!!*
> I know you are supposed to come up with a translation, but I'd ask them what they mean instead.


Thanks everyone - it's either a wine label or the tech sheet.
Sounds like a good idea, Paul!


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## london calling

Paulfromitaly said:


> Da cosa deduci che "condito" = "speziato" ?
> Magari la carne è condita con olio e limone..


Appunto.

PS My son, who is bilingual, is a chef in London. He confirmed that _condito_ and _seasoned_ are not the same at all.


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