# 光栄は父と子と聖神に帰す､今も何時も世々に､アミン



## icapelliperte

Hello,

I am studying Japanese in my spare time and I am also an Orthodox Christian, so I thought I would try to combine the two. When I came across a website with Orthodox prayers in Japanese, I thought it was extremely neat, but they were written in romaji. I would like to have this prayer written in kanji and kana, but I don't know enough of either to type it out yet. 

Here is the prayer: 





> Koei wa chichi to ko to seishin ni kisu, ima mo itsumo yoyo ni. Amin



If anyone could help me out, I would appreciate it greatly. Thanks!

Regards,
Andrew


----------



## Ocham

The Japanese version is wrong.
It is usually translated into Japanese as follows:

栄光は父と子と聖霊に。はじめのように、今も いつも 世々に。アーメン。

栄光eikou＝glory
聖霊seirei＝holy spirit
世世にyoyo ni＝a generation after a generation
*Amen: We Japanese usually pronounce Amen "a-men (a sound of 
army)"


----------



## Flaminius

> The Japanese version is wrong.


No it isn't.  This short liturgical form traditionally known as _gloria Patri_ has many variations/translations scattered along ages and denominations.  Japanese versions are no different.  [Which Christianity denomination endorses the version you offered, *Ocham*?]

The one used in the Japanese Orthodox Church, according to Wikipedia, is:
光栄は父と子と聖神に帰す､今も何時も世々に､アミン。

It is somewhat odd that the page does not cover other Japanese translations.  Wiki looks like a partial friend of yours, *icapelliperte*.


----------



## Ocham

I don't know much about Christianity. I just said it was wrong because
栄光は...アーメン has 654 Google hits while 光栄は...アミン only 177 hits and 
we modern Japanese never say アミン. Most Japanese don't know 光栄 nor 
帰する. These two words are too old and don't make any sense to modern 
ordinary Japanese people. I thought the version would mislead people 
who don't know Japanese.


----------



## Bakamono

Flaminius said:


> The one used in the Japanese Orthodox Church, according to Wikipedia, is:
> 光栄は父と子と聖神に帰す､今も何時も世々に､アミン。



In this site: http://www.orthodox-jp.com/liturgy/prayerbook/Greatlent/ForgiveVes.htm you can find the same phrase:



> (...)
> 主憐めよ。(三次)
> *光栄は父と子と聖神ﾟに帰す、今も何時も世世に、「アミン」。*
> 天に在す我等の父よ、願くは爾の名は聖とせられ、爾の国は来たり、爾の旨は天に行はるるが如く地にも行はれん、我が日用の糧を今日我等に与へ給へ、我等に債ある者を我等免すが如く、我等の債を免し給へ、我等を誘に導かず、猶我等を凶悪より救ひ給へ。
> 
> 司祭 蓋国と権能と光栄は爾父と子と聖神°に帰す、今も何時も世世に。


(That's also what I had posted in my deleted message, but not being a native japanese makes things difficult and... in 99.999% of cases, one is not completely sure... of nothing )


By the way, why is a circle superscripting the 「神」 kanji?


----------



## Starfrown

Could someone give the English translation of the prayer?


----------



## Ocham

One of its versions is: 

Glory be to the Father 
And to the Son 
And to the Holy Ghost. 
As it was in the beginning, 
Is now, and ever shall be; 
World without end. Amen.


----------



## lammn

Ocham said:


> And to the Holy Ghost.


Should be Holy Spirit, not Holy Ghost.
Ghost will never be holy.


----------



## Ocham

the Holy Ghost＝聖霊


----------



## lammn

Oops, sorry!

King James version uses "Holy Ghost" for 聖霊.
NIV and many other "modern" versions use the word "Holy Spirit".


----------



## Aoyama

> *Amen: We Japanese usually pronounce Amen "*a-men*


which is incidentally the way it should be pronounced.
Not  _A-min _(!?) or _Ey-men_ ...


----------



## Flaminius

アミン is apparently from Russian аминь.  The Japanese Orthodox Church has a lot of Slavicisms (such as イオン for ヨハネ, or John) as it was introduced to Japan by the Russians.


----------



## Starfrown

lammn said:


> Oops, sorry!
> 
> King James version uses "Holy Ghost" for 聖霊.
> NIV and many other "modern" versions use the word "Holy Spirit".


I attended a protestant church regularly when I was young, and I remember both terms being used quite regularly in both sermons and a variety of literature.


----------



## lammn

Thanks for the info!

My church's sermons are conducted in Cantonese, not English.
It is very striking for me to hear the term "Holy Ghost" in use.


----------



## Aoyama

> アミン is apparently from Russian аминь


A good information ...
The verb (as we know) being "la'am*i*n/ma'am*i*n", that can be a/the reason ...


----------

