# また土掘りかい



## nandato_91

Hello,

I'm French and I'm trying to translate the following sentence : 

また土掘りかい  we'll translate into "digging in the soil again" in english.

From : a 1995-video game
Context : a teenager found a treasure in a cave and came back to his village ; he's talking with a woman in the village, who said the above sentence.

What does "ren'you-kei + ka(i)" mean exactly in japanese, and what is the difference between また土掘りかい? and また土掘ってるかい or また土掘ったかい for a japanese native speaker?

Thanks in advance...


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## Derselbe

What do you mean by "ren'you-kei". Is this related to 土掘り? I'd read the Kanji as つちぼり。


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## nandato_91

The 連用形 ren'you-kei is the japanese name related to "the -masu form of a verb without the verbal suffix -masu" ; ex : *iku* --> *ikimasu*, and the ren'you-kei (kei = form) is *iki*.
Here, 掘り is the ren'you grammatical form of the verb 掘る ("to dig") ; this form has a noun-value, and lots of nouns are derived from this grammatical form, but in the dictionnary, I didn't find 土掘り and 掘り.
So here, I don't know if the sentence is また土を掘りかい？ (を often removed) or また土掘りかい？
If it's the second case, 土堀り acts as a noun, even if it is not in the dictionnary  (you found 土掘り in the dictionnary).
My question is what is the difference between また土掘りかい？and sentences like また土掘ったかい ?


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## Derselbe

I see. I didn't know that was called 連用形. Very interesting. I am locking forward to hearing the answer from a native. I had the feeling that Japanese tends to use 連用形　quite often. 

PS: No I did not find it in a dictionary.


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## Wishfull

1. Are you riding a horse again?　また　馬に　乗っていますか
2. Are you doing a horse-riding again?　また　馬乗り　ですか
3. Are you repeating a horse-riding?　また　馬乗り　ですか

Which is the most natural sentence?
I don't know which. The meaning is, I believe, almost the same. The sentence structure is different. They are paraphrasing of the same concept.
Yet, native English speaker might have the tendency which sentence to choose.

I think it is the same thing in Japanese, too.

・・・・・・・・
If you could not find "riding" in your dictionary, it is no wonder. You have to find the original form; "ride".
If you could not find "horse-riding" in your dictionary, it is the matter of course. You have to find "horse" and "ride".

掘る　is a verb. English equivalent is "dig."
堀り　is 連用形　of 堀る. English equivalent is "dig*ging*".
A dictionary usually shows only the original form, although the dictionary for learners sometimes kindly shows us derived-form-words.
So it is not the matter, if you can't find 掘り　in your dictionary.
・・・・・

山堀り＝mountain-digging
土堀り＝soil-digging
墓堀り＝grave-digging
落とし穴堀り＝falling-hole-trap digging

These are words example, which might not appear in your dictionary.
You have to analyze and check each parts separately.

・・・・・・・・・

The question maker particle かい　has the preference to attach to noun or 連用形.
また土堀りかい OK.
また土掘ったかい　is a little awkward.
また土掘った*の*かい　is better, because of "の”, which is noun-maker-particle.


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## nandato_91

Thanks both of you.

Wishfull, thank you. Just one thing before continuing : I know all the forms are not in the dictionary ; it's the same for all the languages. Obviously.
But since I'm not bilingual at all in japanese, I can't be sure of my opinion. Of course 土掘り seems to sound like a noun here, but that may be 土を掘り as well (を often removed in unformal language) and how to know whose option is the good one ? I can't, because I have been learning japanese only for 2 years and I have never gone to Japan yet. That's why I posted this message.

Ok, so in conclusion 土掘り is a noun derived from 土 and 掘る, and we can often translate a "noun derived from a verb + desu ka" by "are you doing to do the action of the specified verb ?". And it seems there is no distinction between 土掘りですか and 土掘っていますか.
Thank you.


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## Wishfull

Derselbe said:


> What do you mean by "ren'you-kei". Is this related to 土掘り? I'd read the Kanji as つちぼり。



Hello.
I pronounce it as つちほり.

Hello, nandato91.
If you want to use"を”, you have to change the sentence structure.
土を掘りかい　is unnatural. 土堀りかい　is natural.  土*を*掘る*の*かい OK.
山を登りかい wrong. 山登りかい　OK.  山*を*登る*の*かい OK
たからを探しかいwrong. たから探しかいＯＫ．　 宝*を*探す*の*かい　OK.

The meaning is the same, even whichever structure is chosen.


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## Starfrown

I'd just like to point out that the best English translation for this phrase would probably be: 

"Digging again?"


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## wathavy

Starfrown said:


> I'd just like to point out that the best English translation for this phrase would probably be:
> 
> "Digging again?"


Perfectoh!(In Japanese sounds.)


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## nandato_91

Arigatô minna...
Thanks Wishfull for this precision.
Yep Starfrown, "digging again ?" seems to be closer to the japanese sentence, than "digging in the soil again ?". Thank you too.


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