# kani-basami



## darrenlooby

There is a throw in Judo and Ju Jutsu named _kani-basami_ in Japanese.

There are various translations as per usual. 'Flying scissors' or 'scissor throw' seem to be the most popular.

Can anyone help me better understand the Japanese etimology in play here? All I get in the dictionaries so far, is that _kani_ can mean 'crab'. Thus far I have no luck with _basami._


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## cheshire

かにバサミ、は柔道の技を指す語としては、リアリズムを重視してないです。もし的確な描写を目指したネーミングだったら、「カニ絞め」という用語を選択していたでしょう。「カニばさみ」にしたのは、ご推察のとおり、面白さを重視したからです。カニのはさみ、と足ではさむ、をかけた（pun）のです。
柔道の技なら「絞め」に相当する英単語を調べてください。「はさむ」だけだと、力を入れなくても「はさむ」ことができるので、不適切といえば不適切です。
ところで、「はさみ」が「ばさみ」になるのは連濁という文法現象です。リエゾンみたいなものです。
カニバサミといえば池野めだかですが、これは蛇足でした。


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## darrenlooby

Thank you very much for your response.

I've put your answer into a translator and believe I have the general feeling for what you are trying to say. However, should it be possible, and you have the time; could you also reply in English.

Thank you very much.


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## Flaminius

As a purely linguistic answer, _kanibasami_ is from _kani_ (crab) + _hasami_ (pinching, scissors, pincer etc.).  The _hasami_ undergoes sequential voicing (_rendaku_), a phonological phenomenon that affects the second element of a compound.


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## darrenlooby

Thank you both very much. Is has proved to be very useful learning.


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## darrenlooby

I was just thinking. We also have the throw _de-ashi-barai_.

The _barai_ is often freely exchanged with _harai_ to give a slightly different feeling to it. Is this the same thing doing on, i.e. sequential voicing?

If so, does that mean that the propper way would be do keep _de-ashi-barai_ as is (due to the suffix)?

We use _harai-goshi_ as well, which would demonstrate the sequential voicing as a prefix, would it not?


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## Flaminius

darrenlooby said:


> The _barai_ is often freely exchanged with _harai_ to give a slightly different feeling to it. Is this the same thing doing on, i.e. sequential voicing?


Not that _barai_ is freely exchanged with _harai_ but _harai_ can be replaced by _barai_ when sequential voicing occurs.



> If so, does that mean that the propper way would be do keep _de-ashi-barai_ as is (due to the suffix)?


Do you mean you hear _deashi-harai_ as well?  _Budō_ people may find it a useful locution to convey certain nuances but lay people, including yours truly, would find it odd.



> We use _harai-goshi_ as well, which would demonstrate the sequential voicing as a prefix, would it not?


When two morphemes A and B are joined to make a compound, sequential voicing may occur (the exactly exact conditions are not known) on the first consonant of the second element.  Here;
AAAA | *B*BBBB

In _harai-goshi_, _goshi_ is the result of sequential voicing.  The Japanese word for "waist" is _koshi_.


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## darrenlooby

Yes, I believe it is used to convey a nuance of the throw. Deashi-barai is often used to mean a more violent form of deashi-harai. In the throw there is a sweep and one gently trips, whereas the other smashes the leg out of the way.

But to be honest, I'm not sure that that is because it is done natively; more a miss understanding when shown two different throws with the same name.

Koshi/goshi is the first sequential voice affect I learnt, and the only one via my usual learning route i.e. English jutsuka. I think I should have used a different throw, that didn't have a word compound with a sequential voice.

But thank you, you've really helped me take a very big step in my understanding of the language.


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## cheshire

> Deashi-barai is often used to mean a more violent form of deashi-harai. In the throw there is a sweep and one gently trips, whereas the other smashes the leg out of the way.


Who taught you so? It's totally untrue. Both means the same, one is the phonetically altered version of the other.




> かにバサミ、は柔道の技を指す語としては、リアリズムを重視してないです。
> "Kani-basami" could have been better named if realism had been more important than joking.
> 
> もし的確な描写を目指したネーミングだったら、「カニ*絞め*」という用語を選択していたでしょう。「カニばさみ」にしたのは、ご推察のとおり、面白さを重視したからです。
> 
> It should have been named "Crab *strangle*" to be more appropriate. Kani-basami was so named for the sake of pun.
> 
> カニのはさみ、と足ではさむ、をかけた（pun）のです。
> 柔道の技なら「絞め」に相当する英単語を調べてください。「はさむ」だけだと、力を入れなくても「はさむ」ことができるので、不適切といえば不適切です。
> 
> "ashi de (wo) hasamu" can mean "place your feet around something." That doesn't have to be squeezing or strangling. 絞める　is better.
> 
> ところで、「はさみ」が「ばさみ」になるのは連濁という文法現象です。リエゾンみたいなものです。
> カニバサミといえば池野めだかですが、これは蛇足でした。


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## Flaminius

darrenlooby said:


> Yes, I believe it is used to convey a nuance of the throw. Deashi-barai is often used to mean a more violent form of deashi-harai. In the throw there is a sweep and one gently trips, whereas the other smashes the leg out of the way.



Not being a _budō_ disciple, I confess that I have never heard of implications of _deashi-barai_ vs. _deashi-harai_.  I suspect this distinction is particular to your school, if not a more wider _budō_ circle.  It is, however, interesting to note that the voiced stop is perceived as more rugged and gruff than the voiceless counterpart, which perception is shared by most of the Japanese speakers.


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## darrenlooby

You've both been a great help.

Yet again, this forum is providing me with much more insite and I'm being able to move away from some of my current teachings. I'm glad I can do this, as most of the people I've trained under have no idea about the Japanese langauge. Not of course, that I do. But at least I'm doing my research - which is why my student prefer to be in my class.

Thank you both so much.


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