# birthright



## Romis

existe la palabra "birthright"??
gracias 
saludos
romis


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## clevclov

si, derecho de nacimiento (como el de los reyes a reinar por ser hijos de otros reyes)


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## Slyder

*Brithright: *primogenitura

*Primogenitura**. *

*1. *f. Dignidad, prerrogativa o derecho del primogénito.


_Real Academia Española © Todos los derechos reservados_ 
_Saludos,_

*Slyder *


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## Sailorsun

y porque no sale esta palabra en el diccionario wordreference?


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## Xiroi

Birthright no siempre está relacionado con la primogenitura. Son derechos adquiridos por el mero hecho de haber nacido en una familia o lugar o circunstancias determinadas, no necesariamente por haber nacido el primero de los hijos.

El diccionario de WR sigue en expansión, puedes sugerir las palabras que consideres necesarias.


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## Sailorsun

si "birthright" existe como tal en inglés debería estar en el diccionario.
de todas formas yo amo wordreference.com 

estoy de acuerdo con tu aclaración ya que en el contexto en donde lei brithright se referería un derecho por el mero hecho de haber nacido.

Gracias!


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## chick

*primogenitura
*


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## Xiroi

Chick, si no estás de acuerdo con mi mensaje anterior, sería de agradecer que explicaras en qué te basas y no sólo poner esa misma palabra que yo rebato en letra más grande.


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## chick

En la Santa Biblia es la palabra que se usa.


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## Xiroi

Que la Biblia lo use en ese sentido no quiere decir que sea la única manera de traducirlo. Son textos religiosos, no un diccionario de sinónimos.


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## Slyder

Xiroi said:


> Que la Biblia lo use en ese sentido no quiere decir que sea la única manera de traducirlo. Son textos religiosos, no un diccionario de sinónimos.


 
Disculpa, pero "derecho de nacimiento" es solo la forma más común de entenderse, pero en realidad el verdadero significado de Brithright es Primogenitura, que es el derecho del primogénito, como el derecho del nacimiento que es el más conocido.

Respecto a la Biblia, precisamente el origen y las desviaciones de significado comienzan a partir de textos antiguos, La biblia es un texto como muchos otros, y te darás cuenta que muchas palabras ya no se emplean, pero otras sí.


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## Xiroi

Discrepo ya que que el derecho de nacimiento no sólo se refiere a la primogenitura. La primogenitura se refiere a los derechos del primogénito. Los derechos de nacimiento también pueden ser extensibles a toda la progenie, así que lo mismo no es. Además en el mensaje 6 Sailonsun ya explicó que en su contexto no se hablaba de derechos de los primogénitos, de ahí que no me extrañara que se insistiera en primogenitura sin mayor aclaración.


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## Slyder

Bueno yo digo lo que dicen muchos diccionarios. Ahora en estos tiempos  se ha generalizado esta palabra con el significado de derecho de nacimiento, y en algunos diccionarios también lo incluyen. Pero está mal negar que no exista primogenitura como su significado, porque sí lo es.


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## Xiroi

No lo he negado en ningún momento pero tampoco parece muy coherente insistir en darla como única opción sin tener en cuenta el contexto de la pregunta que estamos tratando y los comentarios previos que es de lo que trata este hilo.


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## Rafael Estrada

parece que se refiere a esa situación que en español llamamos ABOLENGO, que es aquello que por nacimiento les llega como un derecho "regalado".


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## chicanul

Hi,

I've heard "We all have one common birthright" translated in a news piece as "Tenemos un derecho común al nacer...."


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## hermenator

Coincido con Xiroi. Sería limitado inferir que una palabra podría tener una única y verdadera acepción/traducción. El contexto es el que manda.

Además de progenitura, ya se ha manejado: derecho(s) de/del nacimiento.
Sin embargo, por la naturaleza formal de la materia legal (acotando por contexto) y para evitar ambigüedades, propondría el cambio de la preposición "de" por la de "por". Si yo digo derecho de nacimiento, estaría hablando del derecho que todos tenemos "de/a" nacer, algo así como el derecho a la vida. Sin embargo, si digo derechos por nacimiento, estaría implicando que dichos derechos fueron adquiridos "por" la vía del nacimiento.

Ejemplo: "birthright" citizenship = nacionalidad "por nacimiento".

Saludos


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## renacentista

A todo arriba, pregunto a nosotros si se puede traducir la palabra "patrimonio" a "birthright" en el sentido figurativo, por un legado o herencia no monetario, sino espiritual o moral, como de haber vivido honradamente?


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## sandpiperlily

Just chiming in to agree that in modern English, "birthright" usually means "a right that one acquires upon birth" (for example, birthright citizenship as mentioned above, or as referenced by the organization by the same name, the right of diaspora Jews to travel to Israel).  

It can still refer to primogeniture (the right of the first born) in some contexts, especially historical ones.  For example, you might read a historical document where a young man, first born in his family, says something like, "I will inherit my father's estate and title; it is my birthright" by which he means, he acquired that right at birth precisely because of the laws of primogeniture.


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## hermenator

sandpiperlily said:


> Just chiming in to agree that in modern English, "birthright" usually means "a right that one acquires upon birth" (for example, birthright citizenship as mentioned above, or as referenced by the organization by the same name, the right of diaspora Jews to travel to Israel).
> 
> It can still refer to primogeniture (the right of the first born) in some contexts, especially historical ones. For example, you might read a historical document where a young man, first born in his family, says something like, "I will inherit my father's estate and title; it is my birthright" by which he means, he acquired that right at birth precisely because of the laws of primogeniture.



Sandpiperlily:
Very interesting quote and historical contribution!

Renacentista:
I don't think it's appropriate to translate "patrimonio" for birthright, but instead for "heritage" if you mean intangible traits (character, spirit, genes, etc.) or "estate and title" if you mean tangible assets (land, personal property, etc.)


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## Cpt. Sqweky

hermenator, I think renacentista was talking about translating "patrimonio" into English as "birthright" and not the other way around. In that sense, yes, I think that (depending on context, obviously) it would be an acceptable translation, since one's birthright/inheritance can be something intangible.


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## eno2

Interglot:


"birthright": 

 personal characteristics that are inherited at birth1
 a right or privilege that you are entitled to at birth1
free public education is the birthright of every American child1
 
 an inheritance coming by right of birth (especially by primogeniture)1


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## renacentista

Thanks to both of you, Sandpiperlily and Hermenator. Gracias mil, me ayudaron mucho.  Saludos!


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## eno2

Slyder said:


> *Brithright: *primogenitura
> 
> *Primogenitura**. *
> 
> *1. *f. Dignidad, prerrogativa o derecho del primogénito.
> 
> 
> _Real Academia Española © Todos los derechos reservados_
> _Saludos,_
> 
> *Slyder *


Primogenitura is only one specific case of birthright.


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## hermenator

eno2 said:


> Primogenitura is only one specific case of birthright.



My pleasure, Renacentista.

I agree with Eno2 on this one. Primogenitura does not comprise all meanings of birthright, thus, is only a partial and incomplete synonym. But, it could work with in right context.


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## renacentista

Gracias, and I thought I'd already thanked both of you. but now I don't see my reply as part of the page, so in case it did not go through, please accept my apologies and thanks again!


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## 221BBaker

Depends on the context. Sandpiperlily explained it perfectly!
De hecho muchos han dado la respuesta correcta usando palabras diferentes. ¡El OP no tendrá queja de lo colaborativos que somos todos!


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## renacentista

Oh, sorry, now I see it, way up there! Pardon the multiple posts. To finish this, though, I went back to my context, which was a letter from a young man to his brothers and parents, encouraging them as he encouraged himself, to stay strong because they all worked hard and lived honorably, so they deserved to reach their goals and live in peace, comfort, etc. Referring to that in Spanish, he said, "Ello es tanto patrimonio de Uds. como de nosotros". It seems that somewhere along the way in our dialog here, folks started thinking I was translating "birthright" into Spanish and I appreciate all your efforts to delineate the difference among Spanish words. However, somehow we got away from the intangible nature of what was in the letter. This is not a technical or legal kind of patrimonio or legado but a spiritual one, and in English "birthright" can have that kind of connotation. I'm translating "patrimonio" into English, so Capt. Sqeky, you are right. Heritage is good but I'm circling back to "birthright" because, in the context of this letter, heritage sounds more cultural and the original writer meant that he and his family were born with the right to succeed if they lived in harmony with natural law, not because of their culture. I hope I'm making sense to all of you! Thanks again.


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## hermenator

renacentista said:


> Oh, sorry, now I see it, way up there! Pardon the multiple posts. To finish this, though, I went back to my context, which was a letter from a young man to his brothers and parents, encouraging them as he encouraged himself, to stay strong because they all worked hard and lived honorably, so they deserved to reach their goals and live in peace, comfort, etc. Referring to that in Spanish, he said, "Ello es tanto patrimonio de Uds. como de nosotros". It seems that somewhere along the way in our dialog here, folks started thinking I was translating "birthright" into Spanish and I appreciate all your efforts to delineate the difference among Spanish words. However, somehow we got away from the intangible nature of what was in the letter. This is not a technical or legal kind of patrimonio or legado but a spiritual one, and in English "birthright" can have that kind of connotation. I'm translating "patrimonio" into English, so Capt. Sqeky, you are right. Heritage is good but I'm circling back to "birthright" because, in the context of this letter, heritage sounds more cultural and the original writer meant that he and his family were born with the right to succeed if they lived in harmony with natural law, not because of their culture. I hope I'm making sense to all of you! Thanks again.



Heritage has the broadest meaning. It does not have to be cultural. It can be blood-related, land property, intangibles, cultural, or any kind.

Legacy is less broad, however, is as versatile in context as heritage.

Birthright is the least broad in meaning. However, you can use it if you please. 

In the end, it's a matter of style, given that the 3 terms may fit in.

Regards,


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## renacentista

Gracias, Hermenator, I like the way you've analyzed the terms from the most to the least broad, and see your point about style! Brilliant. 

Saludos cordiales,


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## hermenator

renacentista said:


> Gracias, Hermenator, I like the way you've analyzed the terms from the most to the least broad, and see your point about style! Brilliant. Saludos cordiales,



Gracias, renacentista. Es un placer!

Por cierto, interesante mote el que escogiste. En especial, en esta era de modernidad. 

¿En qué país naciste?

Saludos,


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