# wiele pokoi



## pacadansc

Hello to all,
In the sentence,
" Ten hotel ma wiele ładnych pokoi" ,
pokoi seems to be in the genitive rather than the accusative case.
Is this sentence correct? If so, why would pokoi be in the genitive form?
Dziękuję !


----------



## jasio

Indeed, it's a Genitive case. 
I would personally prefer "Ten hotel ma wiele ładnych *pokojów*", but in fact both "pokojów" and "pokoi" are correct forms of plural Genitive (pokój – Wikisłownik, wolny słownik wielojęzyczny, pokojów czy pokoi? - Poradnia językowa PWN). It's a numeral "wlele" which creates confusion, because indeed, in this kind of senteces you would normally expect Accusative case ("Ten hotel ma ładne pokoje").


----------



## zaffy

I would also say 'pokojów'


----------



## pacadansc

Thank you !


----------



## Poland91pl

Yes, as the previous speakers stated above - both forms are correct, however, to me, "pokojów" sounds awkward to me. I would probably say "ten hotel ma wiele pokoi "


----------



## pacadansc

Poland91pl said:


> Yes, as the previous speakers stated above - both forms are correct, however, to me, "pokojów" sounds awkward to me. I would probably say "ten hotel ma wiele pokoi "



Thank you. It is interesting to know that both are acutally used. Perhaps a regional difference? or generational? I do see that wiktionary offers both without any preference noted.


----------



## Poland91pl

pacadansc said:


> Thank you. It is interesting to know that both are acutally used. Perhaps a regional difference? or generational? I do see that wiktionary offers both without any preference noted.


Yes, it mat be regional difference.


----------



## zaffy

Possibly 'pokoi' indeed sounds better to me.


----------



## Ben Jamin

For me "pokojów" sounds old fashioned and even a little weird, I always say "pokoi" when I speak about 'rooms', but "pokojów" when I speak about 'peace' in plural.


----------



## Ben Jamin

pacadansc said:


> Is this sentence correct? If so, why would pokoi be in the genitive form?
> Dziękuję !


You always use genitive after collective qualifiers like "wiele" (many), "mnóstwo" (plenty), "szereg" (a set of), "grupa" (group) and similar, and all numerals bigger than 4 (5 to 21) and all numerals not ending in a digit from 2 to 4.


----------



## Marco de Varsovia

pacadansc said:


> Thank you. It is interesting to know that both are acutally used. Perhaps a regional difference? or generational? I do see that wiktionary offers both without any preference noted.


General rule is "ów".
strój - strojów
nabój - nabojów
słój - słojów
wuj - wujów
But in the coloquial language sometimes is possible to say, ending the words with "i", but only a few of them, which is the older form.
In Poland nearly everybody says "pokoi".


----------



## Ben Jamin

Marco de Varsovia said:


> But in the coloquial language sometimes is possible to say, ending the words with "i", but only a few of them, which is the older form.
> In Poland nearly everybody says "pokoi".


It is actually the other way round. The ending with '-i' is new. It is a projection of the regular ending of the singular and plural of the feminine nouns ending with '-ja', like zbroja/ zbroi.
That's why the form pokoi is only accepted in colloquial language. Note also that only nouns used very often have this form. Besides, it is not used with words denoting persons .


----------



## Marco de Varsovia

Nie wiem, czy warto się spierać, ale historycznie "j" było miękkie. Z tego powodu mówiono np. odetchni, a nie odetchnij (odpocznij). Dodanie na końcu miękkiego "j" nie miało sensu. Chcąc natomiast by brzmiało twardo, dodawano "y" i tworzyła się końcówka "yja" (refleksyja) w mianowniku lub "yj" (reflaksyj) w dopełniaczu. Z tego okresu pochodzi dopełniacz pokoi (słoi, stroi).
Z biegiem czasu "j" twardniało i zaczęło być wymawiane tak, jak obecnie. Zaczęliśmy mówić "odpocznij" z wyraźnie słyszalnym, stwardniałym "j" na końcu czy "refleksji" z wyraźnie słyszalnym "j" w środku. Twarde "y" przestało być potrzebne i zniknęło. To stwardniałe "j" zamienia się w dopełniaczu na "ów". Jest to forma młodsza.


----------



## Ben Jamin

Nie bardzo wiem, czy można porównywać zmiany w końcówkach rzeczowników i czasowników według tych samych reguł.
Poza tym trzeba popatrzeć na aspekt czasu. Te formy, o których piszesz są bardzo stare i raczej całkowicie zapomniane, natomiast przejście z "-ów" na "-i" jest całkiem nowe (XX wiek).


----------

