# Different accents on vowels



## Whodunit

Hi, 

Just recently, I noticed that there's a grave accent on the _a _(á) and an acute accent on the _e _(é). From French, I know that this is nothing unusual, but then I read that the _ Institut d'Estudis Catalans _prefers the writing _angl*è*s_, but the  _Acadèmia Valenciana de la Llengua_ suggests _angl*é*s_.

This makes me wonder what the real accents of Catalan are. What about other vowels like _i_, _o_, and _u_?


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## Outsider

The accentuation rules of Catalan are quite simple and elegant.

Stress in non-accented words can be predicted from the spelling. When stress is not otherwise predictable, a graphic accent marks the stressed vowel.

The accent used is the acute if the stressed vowel is close:

_é, í, ó, ú_ = [e], _, [o], 

and the grave accent if the stressed vowel is open:

à, è, ò = [a], [ɛ], [ɔ]

I've never seen an á in Catalan. Are you sure what you saw wasn't à?_


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## ernest_

Whodunit said:


> Just recently, I noticed that there's a grave accent on the _a _(á) and an acute accent on the _e _(é). From French, I know that this is nothing unusual, but then I read that the _ Institut d'Estudis Catalans _prefers the writing _angl*è*s_, but the  _Acadèmia Valenciana de la Llengua_ suggests _angl*é*s_.



Grave accents are used with open vowels, and acute accents with closed vowels. That's why they are also called open and closed accents, which is more intiutive.

Regarding the "a" written with a closed accent (á), I think it must have been a misspelling, because "a", being an open vowel, only admits an open accent (à). In the case of "e", in Catalan there are two e-like sounds, one open "e" [ɛ] and one closed "e" [e], so an "e" can have either type of accent, depending on the actual vowel the letter "e" represents. What happens is that e-vowels are not consistent across the whole territory. For example, somebody mentioned here a while ago, that people from Valencia pronounce the word "València" with a closed "e", whereas in Standard Catalan is pronounced with an open "e". I think that that might be the case of the word "anglès" too. So this is why the AVL may be suggesting "anglés" with a closed accent.



> This makes me wonder what the real accents of Catalan are. What about other vowels like _i_, _o_, and _u_?


Letters "i" and "u" represent always closed vowels _ and  respectively, therefore they may only carry a closed accent. But letter "o" is like "e", it may be open ([ɔ]) or closed ([o]), so it can carry either type of accent._


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## Whodunit

Perfect, thank you both, Outsider and Ernest, for your informative replies. 



Outsider said:


> Stress in non-accented words can be predicted from the spelling.



Does that mean that always the first syllable is stressed, if an accent doesn't tell otherwise? For example, would "angles" be stressed on the first syllable while "anglés" (the correct version) is emphasized on the second?



> I've never seen an _á_ in Catalan. Are you sure what you saw wasn't _à_?



I'm sure that I made a mistake. 

See my post:



> I noticed that there's a *grave *accent on the _a _(á) and ...



Of course I meant to write (à), my keyboard simply tricked me. 



ernest_ said:


> Regarding the "a" written with a closed accent (á), I think it must have been a misspelling, because "a", being an open vowel, only admits an open accent (à). In the case of "e", in Catalan there are two e-like sounds, one open "e" [ɛ] and one closed "e" [e], so an "e" can have either type of accent, depending on the actual vowel the letter "e" represents. What happens is that e-vowels are not consistent across the whole territory. For example, somebody mentioned here a while ago, that people from Valencia pronounce the word "València" with a closed "e", whereas in Standard Catalan is pronounced with an open "e". I think that that might be the case of the word "anglès" too. So this is why the AVL may be suggesting "anglés" with a closed accent.
> 
> Letters "i" and "u" represent always closed vowels _ and  respectively, therefore they may only carry a closed accent. But letter "o" is like "e", it may be open ([ɔ]) or closed ([o]), so it can carry either type of accent._


_

All right, that's what I wanted to know. I just wondered why you spelled it "cantaré", but then "cantaràs", although both "he" and "has" (from which the future form is derived) are unaccented. But I get it now. _


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## Outsider

Whodunit said:


> Does that mean that always the first syllable is stressed, if an accent doesn't tell otherwise? For example, would "angles" be stressed on the first syllable while "anglés" (the correct version) is emphasized on the second?


It's very similar to Spanish. You have to look at the ending of the word:


If the word ends with a vowel or with vowel + _s_, then it's stressed on the syllable before the last.

If the word ends with vowel + another consonant, or with a consonant cluster, then it's stressed on the last syllable.
Thus, _angl*es*_ would be stressed on the "a". The syllables are counted a bit differently than in Spanish, though. For instance, the ending _-ia(s)_ is treated as two syllables (a hiatus), rather than one.


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## Elessar

Les diferències d'accentuació entre el valencià normatiu respecte del català general no són gaire difícils de memoritzar. Els valencians hi som ben avesats, i no suposa cap conflicte amb la llengua general. A grans trets, em vénen al cap:

En valencià, paraules agudes acabades en _e(s)_, com _cafè, anglès, francès, polonès_ es poden escriure amb accent tancat *café, anglés, francés*... alguns participis també, com per exemple* atés, entés, distés*... o la 3ª persona del singular _*atén, entén, distén*_... d'acord amb la pronúncia valenciana.

Els verbs en *-èixer*, com _conèixer_ o _parèixer _també s'escriuen amb accent tancat (*conéixer*,* paréixer*)

Després hi ha* doblets*, paraules on es pot posar tant l'accent tancat com l'obert, és el cas de _sèpia / sépia _(_=sípia_)_, séquia / sèquia, o interés / interès.

_En paraules molt comunes que formen part de "l'esquelet" de la llengua, com en la conjunció *perquè*, s'ha preferit escriure l'accent obert per no marejar, malgrat que la seua pronúncia en valencià siga tancada. En el cas de topònims de llocs importants com _València_, va haver alguna proposta de escriure l'accent obert, que no ha reeixit. En el cas de la ciutat de Dénia, per exemple, l'ortografia respecta la seua pronúncia tancada.


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## Whodunit

Now I get it, Outsider and Elessar. Thank you both for your thorough explanations.


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## Elessar

Em corregisc: 

_En el cas de topònims de llocs importants com València, va haver alguna proposta de escriure l'accent *tancat*, que no ha reeixit_


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## worldflavor

What is the difference in sound of a closed and open vowel? Is is the same or the opposite of French accents? To me, in French, grave è is closed and é is open, but it seems the opposite in Catalan. Please enlighten me. Thank you.


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## Wilva

Hola worldflavor 

El català distingueix entre e oberta i e tancada, i o oberta i tancada.
En francès diria que també es fa aquesta distinció. No sé com van els accents en aquesta llengua, però si és com expliques, en català és gairebé al contrari.
En català, l'accent greu o obert (ò,è) només s'utilitza amb les vocals obertes, que són la a [a], la e [ɛ] i la o [ɔ].
Els altres sons vocàlics, [e] [o] _  corresponen a ñes vocals tancades, i només porten accent greu o agut (é,ó).
El so de la vocal neutra [ə] que es pot representar amb a o e, no s'accentua mai.
Que els sons de les vocals e i o siguin oberts o tancats no vol dir que s'hagin d'accentuar sempre, però normalment l'accent cau sobre la vocal que es troba a la síl·laba tònica; hi ha unes regles per accentuar les paraules, depenent de si són planes, agudes o esdrúixoles.
-M*ò*bil (o oberta), contrucci*ó *(o tancada), caf*è* (e oberta) portar*é* (e tancada).
La diferència, principalment, és que per pronunciar la e oberta has d'obrir una mica més la boca.
Per entendre'ns, la e oberta del català, en anglès seria força propera a la e de s*e*t,  mentre que la e tancada s'assemblaria més a la e de th*e*y, però sense el so de la 'y'.
_


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## worldflavor

Gracies molt, Wilva! Doncs tancat és al contrari al francès. M'ajuda moltíssim!


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## ManPaisa

worldflavor said:


> What is the difference in sound of a closed and open vowel? Is is the same or the opposite of French accents? To me, in French, grave è is closed and é is open, but it seems the opposite in Catalan. Please enlighten me. Thank you.



In French it's actually the other way around: è is open and é is close, just as in Catalan.


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