# Because of / Thanks to



## Staarkali

Hello all,

I'm looking to find Chinese ways to differenciate the two expressions below; here are my best shots:
Because of (you) 因为(有了你)
Thanks to (you) 多亏(有了你)

Thanks in advance for any bit of advice!


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## twinklestar

Staarkali said:


> Hello all,
> 
> I'm looking to find Chinese ways to differenciate the two expressions below; here are my best shots:
> Because of (you) 因为(有了你)
> Thanks to (you) 多亏(有了你)
> 
> Thanks in advance for any bit of advice!


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## eVanix

to Staarkali
Great translate!


> Because of (you) 因为(有了你)
> Thanks to (you) 多亏(有了你)


Because of you could be 都是因为你 depend on which tone you speaking and it could be good or bad. 
I'd like to improve your Mandarin.You can find my contact in personal information.


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## lcsern

Staarkali said:


> Hello all,
> 
> 多亏(有了你)



I guess in most cases, this(  多亏) is for negative expression.
Thanks to (you) could also mean 多谢(你).


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## Staarkali

lcsern said:


> Staarkali said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hello all,
> 
> Thanks to (you) 多亏(有了你)
> 
> 
> 
> I guess in most cases, this( 多亏) is for negative expression.
> Thanks to (you) could also mean 多谢(你).
Click to expand...

You mean that the following:
1/ We can enjoy the use of fridge, washing machine and PC thanks to electricity
2/ He passed the exam thanks to his hardworking
3/ Thanks to you, my life is so much merrier than ever before (I guess this example is an expression of my romantic side  )
would be translated in:
1/ 多谢电力，我们享受冰箱洗衣机和电脑的使用。
2/ 他考过了多谢他的努力学习。
3/ 多谢你，我的生活充满阳光了（I don't know how to express *more than ever before* in Chinese)
[...]?


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## twinklestar

Staarkali said:


> You mean that the following:
> 1/ We can enjoy the use of fridge, washing machine and PC thanks to electricity
> 2/ He passed the exam thanks to his hardworking
> 3/ Thanks to you, my life is so much merrier than ever before (I guess this example is an expression of my romantic side  )
> would be translated in:
> 1/ 多谢电力，我们享受冰箱洗衣机和电脑的使用。
> 2/ 他考过了多谢他的努力学习。
> 3/ 多谢你，我的生活充满阳光了（I don't know how to express *more than ever before* in Chinese)
> [...]?


 
You've gilded the lily. Your orginal translation is excellent. As a Chinese native speaker, I assurre you that 多亏了doen't contain any negative connotation at all as lcsern indicated wrongly. 多亏了 is 100% positive. 

The equivalant expression in Chinese to 'thanks to' is 多亏... ...
The application of 多谢... ... is okay in the sentence 1 and 3, but it sounds unnatural in Sentence 2. 

Here's the definition of 多亏from the Chinese dictionary -Xinhua Dictionary.


> 拼音：duō kuī解释：表示由于别人的帮助或某种有利因素，避免了不幸或得到了好处：～你来了，否则我们要迷路的。


 
http://xh.5156edu.com/showciyu.php?id=209069


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## lcsern

Sorry, i repeated the same posting


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## twinklestar

lcsern said:


> I did not mean 多亏 is 100% negative, but in most cases, people tend to use it for negative or sarcastic statement.
> 
> e.g. 多亏了你, 所以我才考到这样的成绩。
> 
> Perhaps i am wrong.


 
Yes, I think your assumption about the phrase is wrong. I never heard about the 多亏 even contains 0.00001% negative connotations in all my life in the mainland of China. And I never read any Chinese dictionaries refer to the phrase has any negative meanings. 

It is okay that you stick to your gun. But I just hope you can offer any authoritive source to vindicate your explanation about this since you guide other people here.


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## lcsern

Staarkali said:


> You mean that the following:
> 3/ 多谢你，我的生活充满阳光了（I don't know how to express *more than ever before* in Chinese)
> [...]?



I guess, more than ever before = 更加
多谢你，(你让)我的生活更加充满了阳光.

I did not mean 多亏 is 100% negative (it can be positive too), but i most cases, people tend to use it for negative or sarcastic statement.

e.g. 多亏了她的婆婆， 所以他们才离婚的。 
      多亏了你， 所以我才考到这样的成绩。 

In my opinion, sentence 2 is definitely acceptable.

Perhaps i am wrong, i am not native speaker.


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## twinklestar

lcsern said:


> I guess, more than ever before = 更加
> 多谢你，(你让)我的生活更加充满了阳光.
> 
> I did not mean 多亏 is 100% negative, but i most cases, people tend to use it for negative or sarcastic statement.
> 
> e.g. 多亏了她的婆婆， 所以他们才离婚的。
> 多亏了你， 所以我才考到这样的成绩。
> 
> In my opinion, sentence 2 is definitely acceptable.
> 
> Perhaps i am wrong, i am not native speaker.


 
Do you seriously read my words? I mean in positive tone, the words never sound negative. *Not even a case. *

Even almost every word might sound sarcastic, if people say it in a sarcastic way. As a native speaker, I have unmistakably told my viewpoint time and again with the corroboration of authoritative Chinese dictionary. 

e.g. 多谢她的婆婆，所以他们才离婚。(This also sounds sarcastic enough.) 

All right, I have made myself clear. That is it.


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## lcsern

Twinkestar, are you getting impatient, please dont. This is only a discussion. 



twinklestar said:


> D
> e.g. 多谢她的婆婆，所以他们才离婚。(This also sounds sarcastic enough.)



This sentence is definitely flawless, but as a non-native speaker, we tend or prefer to use 多亏 in this sarcastic context.

亲爱的， 多谢你一路来的支持， 所以我才有今天的成就。
In this context, we prefer not to use 多亏 , although it is not wrong to use it.


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## Staarkali

In fact, I have to admit this is a confirmation question, because my ex girlfriend who is Shanghainese already told me that *thanks to* is translated by *多亏* (she told me also *幸亏* is possible), thus the "excellent translation of mine"


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## samanthalee

lcsern said:


> This sentence is definitely flawless, but as a non-native speaker, we tend or prefer to use 多亏 in this sarcastic context.



I'm not sure why... but I tend to think both "Thanks to you" and "多亏你" sound sarcastic too. It could be a regional difference in speech habit.

Of course, in order for a phrase to sound sarcastic, it must be a positive phrase to start with. A negative phrase used in a negative sense is no sarcasm at all.


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## BODYholic

samanthalee said:


> I'm not sure why... but I tend to think both "Thanks to you" and "多亏你" sound sarcastic too. It could be a regional difference in speech habit.
> 
> Of course, in order for a phrase to sound sarcastic, it must be a positive phrase to start with. A negative phrase used in a negative sense is no sarcasm at all.



I have the same thought initially. But as I went through a few examples, I came to conclude that it really depends on the context.

E.g. 多亏了陈老师, 我才能顺利升上大学. (reported speech)

The above example is definitely not sarcastic. It sounds strange to say "*多谢了*陈老师, 我才能顺利升上大学." in reported speech. 

On the other hand, in direct speech, I will prefer to say this - "*多谢*陈老师, 我才能顺利升上大学." right in front of the teacher.

Staarkali,
Back to your question and my take is, one uses:
"Because of"  when you are relating your thought to someone else. (Indirect)
"Thanks to" when you express your appreciations to the person concerns. (Direct)

Eventually both sentences convey the same meaning, but the intention differs its usage.


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## twinklestar

*#1 多谢=/= 多亏了*

*#2 多谢：非常感谢 = many thanks*

多谢了陈老师 （我才考上大学） =Mr. Chen, thank you very much. 

(Actually, we mainlainders hardly express this with "多谢了”。Sounds odd to us)



> duo xie
> 1.[Polite] many thanks; thank you very much; thanks a lot; much obliged


 
http://hk.dictionary.yahoo.com/search.html?s=%A6h%C1%C2


*#3 多亏了：因为有了你*



> 多亏了
> 1.thanks to; it is fortunate that


 
http://hk.dictionary.yahoo.com/search.html?s=%A6h%C1%AB

*#4 thanks to* 



> thanks to sb/sth
> because of someone or something:
> It's thanks to Sandy that I heard about the job.
> DISAPPROVING The baby is awake thanks to your shouting.


Source:The Cambrige Dictionary


Again, any colourless words or even positive words, if you say or write it in a sarcastic tone, sure thing, it becomes sarcastic.

E.g. 看看那个武大郎，他可长得真帅啊！

帅 means handsome; is a positive word, but in this context, it is definitely sarcastic.


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## Andrés Wang

Because of (you) 因为(有了你)，因為你、因為你的緣故…、正因為你…
Thanks to (you) 多亏(有了你)，幸亏有你、托你的福…，由於…

參考看看


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## twinklestar

Andrés Wang said:


> Because of (you) 因为(有了你)，因為你、因為你的緣故…、正因為你…
> Thanks to (you) 多亏(有了你)，幸亏有你、托你的福…，由於…
> 
> 參考看看


 
Right on!


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## Staarkali

Information in this thread becomes even more accurate with the time, and go far beyond all initial expectations 



BODYholic said:


> [...]
> Back to your question and my take is, one uses:
> "Because of" when you are relating your thought to someone else. (Indirect)
> "Thanks to" when you express your appreciations to the person concerns. (Direct)


 
That would explain the usage. And I should prefer the usage of 多亏 when talking directly to the concerned one. By the way, I'd like to confirm we are still talking about Chinese here (because what's in the above quote does absolutely not apply for English).


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## twinklestar

多亏 is acceptable;but most mainlanders would tend to say 多亏*了*.


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## BODYholic

Staarkali said:


> Information in this thread becomes even more accurate with the time, and go far beyond all initial expectations
> 
> That would explain the usage. And I should prefer the usage of 多亏 when talking directly to the concerned one. By the way, I'd like to confirm we are still talking about Chinese here (because what's in the above quote does absolutely not apply for English).



Yes, I am referring to Chinese.

Unlike English, we say "Thanks" right to the face of the concerned person. While relating an incident to some 3rd parties, (1)多亏 is translated as "If not because of ..." which sounds very strange if it were to use on the person whom one is indebted to.


(1)note: I ain't sure if anyone has yet dissected the word 多亏,
          多 - many
          亏 - is a negative word on its own which has generic meaning of losses, debt & the likes.
           多 + 亏 = many debts = indebted to (gratitude or money).

Hope this helps you understand better.

Edited: I have to reiterate that 
1. These is how the words are *normally* employed. Having said that, I don't think it is grammatically incorrect even if one interchanges these words.
2. As much as I believe it should not, I've heard and read Chinese uses 多亏in direct speech to the person whom one is grateful to. It's ok but it just made the sentence sounds a bit milder (due to shyness? perhaps).


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## lcsern

twinklestar said:


> 多亏 is acceptable;but most mainlanders would tend to say 多亏*了*.



Not in southern part of China.


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## twinklestar

lcsern said:


> Not in southern part of China.


 
Are you kidding? I am just from the south of China.  I am also native Hokkien speaker.


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## patrick_socal

lcsern said:


> Twinkestar, are you getting impatient, please dont. This is only a discussion.
> 
> 
> 
> This sentence is definitely flawless, but as a non-native speaker, we tend or prefer to use 多亏 in this sarcastic context.
> 
> 亲爱的， 多谢你一路来的支持， 所以我才有今天的成就。
> In this context, we prefer not to use 多亏 , although it is not wrong to use it.




Hi to everyone,
I have noticed an interesting phenomenon in English as it becomes widely used as a second language.
Groups of non-native English speakers develop their own idioms that native speakers never use.
For example I work with many Philipinos who speak English and use the adjective "green" to mean "sexual suggestive" or "bawdy".  They think I am ignorant or a little slow mentally if I don't understand this meaning.
However, in USA native speakers of English never use this meaning, green has a completely unrelated connotative meaning.

The point being that with globalization of language use, our native languages may cease to be our sole possession as native speakers.

Patrick


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## twinklestar

patrick_socal said:


> The point being that with globalization of language use, our native languages may cease to be our sole possession as native speakers.
> 
> Patrick


 
Hear, hear!  

Seasonal greetings to you, Patrick!


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## Staarkali

patrick_socal said:


> [...]The point being that with globalization of language use, our native languages may cease to be our sole possession as native speakers.[...]


One of the point I have always defended, which in my opinion is part of the discussion about the local aspects of languages; this is especially true for English, and in a lesser extent to Chinese or French, Mandarin may have some specifities in Mainland that appear different in Singapore or Malaysia, and a language is a tool that belongs to the one who uses it (although one may make many grammar mistakes or may lack of oral fluency).


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