# дохуя (Vulgar)



## PatrickK1

All of those Russian "хуй"-derived words usually go over my head. Could someone translate this nice little phrase I came across?

"ты чё свинья ебать, умный дохуя?"

I don't quite understand the grammar of the first clause ("Why do you fuck pigs?" "Do you fuck pigs?"), and is дохуя a noun? What does it mean in this case? Also, I think I've seen "до хуя"...what's the difference?

Thanks


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## Garbuz

It's not just 'vulgar', it's the worst garbage you could ever find.  No offence meant but I would remove the post.


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## PatrickK1

This is a language forum...and I'm quite sure that includes ugly language as well.


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## Garbuz

PatrickK1 said:


> This is a language forum...and I'm quite sure that includes ugly language as well.



When you come to a restaurant you don't expect a waiter to put a piece of shit on your plate though I'm sure there are crazy people who would say 'What a treat!'


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## WordOrder

_What the fuck are you thinking 'bout yourself, pig! Think you so smart!_


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## Maroseika

PatrickK1 said:


> This is a language forum...and I'm quite sure that includes ugly language as well.


Yes, but not to that extent. Faeces is a fantastic thing for the scatologists but not for the public places. 
Just keep in mind these Russian words are incomparably worse than their English parallels.


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## PatrickK1

Maroseika said:


> Yes, but not to that extent. Faeces is a fantastic thing for the scatologists but not for the public places.
> Just keep in mind these Russian words are incomparably worse than their English parallels.



Definitely! I wouldn't speak like this, but I am learning Russian and this is a part of the language. If I told an English-learner not to ask what "fuck" means, they probably wouldn't like it either...


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## Awwal12

> Just keep in mind these Russian words are incomparably worse than their English parallels.


Yes. ) As I said in another topic, mat is a purely Slavic phenomenon; and it just has no equal analogue in English. However, I anyway disagree that the topic should be deleted. This phenomenon is linguistic one after all, and in some communities (for instance, in the army) it even serves as just a spoken language, whether we like it or not.


> I don't quite understand the grammar of the first clause


It lacks two commas: "ты чё, свинья, е*ать, умный до*уя?"
"свинья" is an address
"е*ать" is just an interjection here
So, you could just throw these words away and get "ты чё (i.e. чего), умный до*уя?"

P.S.:


> Also, I think I've seen "до хуя"...what's the difference?


Usually, there is no difference (however, "до хуя"  can be also used in the most literal meaning, but I just cannot imagine such a context). Obviously, there is no literary standard for writing such words, but I believe, these two words should be written as a solid word, since it is a stable expression, semantically independent and serving as an adverb or adjective (syn. "очень (много)", "слишком (много)", "чересчур (много)", "крайне (много)").


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## Garbuz

Awwal12 said:


> Yes. )  However, I anyway disagree that the topic should be deleted. This phenomenon is linguistic one after all, and in some communities (for instance, in army) it even serves as just a spoken language, whether we like it or not.



This 'phenomenon' is also ethical, and using that kind of language on a public forum is violating the ethical norms of a civilized society. Yes, it is spoken 'in some communities'. I think if somebody is interested in that vocabulary let them go and join those communities and get themselves enlightened there.


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## Maroseika

PatrickK1 said:


> Definitely! I wouldn't speak like this, but I am learning Russian and this is a part of the language. If I told an English-learner not to ask what "fuck" means, they probably wouldn't like it either...


Sorry for saying that, but giving this English example you're just proving you don't understand the difference.


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## Awwal12

> This 'phenomenon' is also ethical, and using that kind of language on a public forum is violating the ethical norms of a civilized society.


We don't use it, we discuss it. I'm sorry that you see no difference.


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## Maroseika

Awwal12 said:


> We don't use it, we discuss it. I'm sorry that you see no difference.


Discuss for what if not for using? The topicstarter wants to know it to be able to participate in the chat like the one he has cited.


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## Awwal12

> Discuss for what if not for using?


For understanding it!
Of course, you always can just ignore the existence of mat and of "uncivilized societies" as well, but they nevertheless really exist and therefore should be examined and understood.


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## Maroseika

In due place and in due way.


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## Awwal12

Maroseika said:


> In due place and in due way.


Obviously, but I personally find a linguistic forum to be the most appropriate place for that. In other places it can be anything but a mere rational examination.


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## Maroseika

Well, now that we have known the point а view of each other, let's call it a day.


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## Garbuz

Awwal12 said:


> We don't use it, we discuss it. I'm sorry that you see no difference.



Intentionally or not, you are propagating this language under the guise of 'discussing' it. There are taboos that cannot be broken. One can't say those words in public whatever the situation is. The starter of this thread didn't realize that because he isn't Russian. You do. So why do you persist in encouraging him?


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## Awwal12

> Intentionally or not, you are propagating this language under the guise of 'discussing' it.


That's something new, I swear... So each time when you, for instance, discuss homosexuality in any way, you propagate it? Strange enough.


> There are taboos that cannot be broken.


Maybe you insist on tabooing of any researches on this subject? 


> One can't say those words in public whatever the situation is.


So foreigners are just forbidden to know them?


> The starter of this thread didn't realize that because he isn't Russian.


I hope it was explained to him quite clearly, and I myself accentuated that the Russian mat has no close analogues in English. However, his question in the beginning of this thread still was asked, and so it was answered as well.


> So why do you persist in encouraging him?


Where do you see any encouraging there? I myself either mark such words with two (!) "warn" signs, or just censor them with asterisks.


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## cyanista

*Moderator note*:

If I may just cite Rule 9 of this forum:



> *Keep your language clean and decent.*
> Discussion of offensive words and phrases is permitted, but the  conversation  must remain respectful and serious. You may discuss offensive words, but  you may  not use them with malicious intent.



It might be quite useful to demonstrate to the learners of Russian that _mat_ is highly tabooed and often harshly condemned... but as long as it is used in everyday speech learners may still need to be familiar with this language aspect. In fact, this knowledge may prove very important in order to assess a conflict situation. 

I understand that it's a delicate issue but I must ask the participants to remain civil and respectful.


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## Garbuz

Awwal12 said:


> That's something new, I swear... So each time when you, for instance, discuss homosexuality in any way, you propagate it? Strange enough.
> 
> *Depends upon how you discuss it. Especially if you show pictures or videos, yes. *
> 
> Maybe you insist on tabooing of any researches on this subject?
> 
> *What kind of research are you talking about? It's a subject for psychopathology.*
> 
> So foreigners are just forbidden to know them?
> 
> *I believe it's the last thing they need to know about the Russian language.*



It drives me up the wall that I have to explain such obvious things.


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## Garbuz

cyanista said:


> *Moderator note*:
> 
> If I may just cite Rule 9 of this forum:
> 
> 
> 
> It might be quite useful to demonstrate to the learners of Russian that _mat_ is highly tabooed and often harshly condemned... but as long as it is used in everyday speech learners may still need to be familiar with this language aspect. In fact, this knowledge may prove very important in order to assess a conflict situation.
> 
> I understand that it's a delicate issue but I must ask the participants to remain civil and respectful.



In my opinion this what you call 'language aspect' is nothing but language pornography. Those who are interested in the latter are usually addicted to the respective images. The more you look into the meaning of those words, the better you visualize what they denote. According to NLP, language programs a person's mind, so words can induce certain physiological (somatic) states. What we say has an impact on our physical and mental health. 

If you hear such words in a certain situation, you don't have to know their exact meaning to understand that the person saying them intends to insult people around him. What important information can they convey?


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## Awwal12

> Depends upon how you discuss it. Especially if you show pictures or videos, yes.


Discussion about mat expressions with foreigners is pointless until you mention those words anyway. Otherwise it strongly reminds a discussion about colours with a blind.


> What kind of research are you talking about? It's a subject for psychopathology.


Since when a sociolinguistic phenomenon is a subject for psychopathology? Do you believe that all people who use mat in their speech are mentally ill? Well, I doubt.


> I believe it's the last thing they need to know about the Russian language.


That's not up to us to decide anyway. The only thing we really should do is a warning, but we cannot forbid anybody to know something.

P.S.:


> If you hear such words in a certain situation, you don't have to know their exact meaning to understand that the person saying them intends to insult people around him. What important information can they convey?


As I mentioned above, in some communities it is a purely functional (!) spoken language. Sad, but true. Quite long phrases can exist there which are composed of mat words only (or with a slight admix of syntactic words) and still have no special insulting meaning.


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## Garbuz

Awwal12 said:


> Discussion about mat expressions with foreigners is pointless until you mention those words anyway. Otherwise it strongly reminds a discussion about colours with a blind.
> 
> *Disagree. You can discuss this, like you put it, socio-linguistic phenomenon, referring to it as русский мат without specifying the words as such. By the way, that's exactly what we are doing now. *
> 
> Since when a sociolinguistic phenomenon is a subject for psychopathology? Do you believe that all people who use mat in their speech are mentally ill? Well, I doubt.
> 
> *Depends upon how much addicted to that language they are. If they use it every time they open their mouth, I'm sure they are. If they do it from time to time, they are on the way to it. *
> 
> That's not up to us to decide anyway. The only thing we really should do is a warning, but we cannot forbid anybody to know something.
> 
> *Seek and you shall find. The question is what's their goal. Those who seek dirty words, verbal pornography, will find them anyway, with or without our help but why should we help them in this search? *
> 
> As I mentioned above, in some communities it is a purely functional (!) spoken language. Sad, but true. Quite long phrases can exist there which are composed of mat words only (or with a slight admix of syntactic words) and still have no special insulting meaning.
> 
> *So what? Are the learners of Russian as a second language who are on this forum eager to join those communities? What do they need that language for?
> *



If I were a moderator I would transfer this discussion to the General Discussion forum so that more people could express their opinion on the subject.


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## cyanista

*Moderator note*

If you feel this discussion needs to be continued please feel free to contribute to any of the existing threads to the subject in "Comments and suggestions" - or open a new one if you have a brand new angle to offer.

*palabrotas - bad words
**Using bad language--curbed?*
*Asterisks in threads titles*

Further posts that don't deal with the question in the starting post will be deleted.


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## Q-cumber

In a word, "до ху*я*" warn means "много" - "plenty", "lot", "in large quantities" and so on. It goes without saying that the word to be avoided.  The softer variants are "до фиг*а*", "до хрен*а*".

_У меня и так проблем до хуя. _ <I've got a lot of problems>

The verbatim translation would be "up to the cock (level)"... a great pile of something.


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## Awwal12

> In a word, "до хуя" () means "много" - "plenty", "lot", "in large quantities" and so on.


Sorry, but I'm afraid that it still should be written as a solid word (in the same way as ниху*я* , п*о*хуй  etc.) in this meaning. Look at Wikipedia, for instance.


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## Q-cumber

Awwal12 said:


> Sorry, but I'm afraid that it still should be written as a solid word (in the same way as ниху*я* , п*о*хуй  etc.) in this meaning. Look at Wikipedia, for instance.



Does it really matter?  Anyway, I wouldn't use Wikipedia as reference. It's not a reliable source of information.


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## PatrickK1

Cyanista, my question was usage related (specifically about дохуя)...Should I make a new thread somewhere?


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## cyanista

PatrickK1 said:


> Cyanista, my question was usage related (specifically about дохуя)...Should I make a new thread somewhere?


Dear PatrickK1, 

If you think your specific linguistic question hasn't been sufficiently dealt with you are welcome to pose additional questions.

If you are interested in discussing the cultural implications and the social acceptance of mat, then I am afraid the Russian forum with its narrow linguistic scope is not the right venue for that. Our new subforum Culture Café may embrace this subject (provided it is discussed in a civil manner). Please remember that you cannot post links to the Culture Café elsewhere on the forums because only senior members with a 6-month membership have access to it.


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## incoder

The semantic translation of "ты что свинья ебать - умный дохуя" will be "what the fuck, are you fucking fish - very fucking smart?". Pig in this context means - some non slovenly person, or drinker (as far as I know the english analog is fish) дохуйя means -  "a lot" or "very" depending on context. The sentance is also was written without punctuation marks, wich are necesary in this case, maybe that's why you didn't get it.


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## incoder

Also there is an Russian Joke. If you would walk from Moskow to Vladivostok by railway line, and you will count a sleepers - then half of theirs count would be -"заебись", and theirs count would be "дохуя"


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## morzh

incoder said:


> Also there is an Russian Joke. If you would walk from Moskow to Vladivostok by railway line, and you will count a sleepers - then half of theirs count would be -"заебись", and theirs count would be "дохуя"




How about using  this with words like these. It is a requirement here.


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## rusita preciosa

Mod note
This topic was discussed al length, I do not believe there's much to add . The thread is now closed.


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