# voting



## gorbatzjov

Hello, 

Does your country have a RIGHT of vote or an OBLIGATION to vote? Which one is better do you think?

Belgium has an OBLIGATION to vote for everyone over 18 years old.


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## *Cowgirl*

US
 over 18 you have the right to vote, and though not required, it is strongly encouraged.


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## diegodbs

In Spain we have the right to vote, not the obligation.
And I prefer rights to obligations.


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## irisheyes0583

In the USA, we have the right to vote. I think this is better because I don't want uninformed voters at the polls (unfortunately, we seem to have many of them anyway! ). Also, freedom to me means not just the freedom to choose, but the freedom to *not* choose. That said, I can't imagine why people choose not to vote. But that's just me (and I'm very opinionated! ).


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## cuchuflete

*Cowgirl* said:
			
		

> US
> over 18 you have the right to vote, and though not required, it is strongly encouraged.


 And to be clear, though it is strongly encouraged, the percentage of those eligable to vote who exercise that right is not very large.



> During the last six presidential *elections*, participation of eligible voters averaged 52.9%. Largest voter turnout was the last presidential election in 2004 where 55.10% of the voters participated. The smallest turnout was in 1988 with 50.10% of the eligible voters participating.


http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache:1Dfcoll6oCIJ:indiesareus.blogspot.com/2005_12_18_indiesareus_archive.html+US+elections+%22voting+percentage%22&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=4

Why do so few vote? Perhaps many are lazy, or maybe the candidates don't inspire them


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## SpiceMan

In Argentina is compulsory. However, in last October for instance 29% of the voters didn't vote and there's a customary pardon given by the President the next day of any given election. (I voted obligation, as that's how everyone feels and I've rarely found someone who knew about the pardon thing haha)


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## lauranazario

gorbatzjov said:
			
		

> Does your country have a RIGHT of vote or an OBLIGATION to vote? Which one is better do you think?


In Puerto Rico, people over the age of 18 have a right to vote.

As a population, we certainly feel an obligation to vote, as evidenced in these year 2000 electoral maps which show voter participation is predominantely in the 80% to 89% range.

This 2004 electoral table again shows voter participation remains in the high 80s percentile.

Saludos,
LN


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## blancalaw

SpiceMan said:
			
		

> In Argentina is compulsory. However, in last October for instance 29% of the voters didn't vote and there's a customary pardon given by the President the next day of any given election. (I voted obligation, as that's how everyone feels and I've rarely found someone who knew about the pardon thing haha)



Being obligated to vote can be a good way to encourage people to the polls, but I favor the obligation approach, where the people are expected to be responsible enough to research the candidates and then make an educated choice.  I agree that some people in the USA are lazy.


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## Vanda

> Being obligated to vote can be a good way to encourage people to the polls, but I favor the obligation approach, where the people are expected to be responsible enough to research the candidates and then make an educated choice.


 
Blancalaw I'll have to cordially disagree with you about that. 
Voting is mandatory over 18 years old here and you have no idea what happens when it's time of election - like this year! Having a huge semi-literate as well as iliterate (?) population (that in the end will define the results of a national  election), most of them are easily mislead and -worst of all - some sell (literally) their votes for any amount of money or any favor. (A person has only to know how to sign his/her name to vote. He/she doesn't have to prove being able to read and write.)
In my parents' town, one mayor won an election giving dentures  , paying electricity bills of very small values (less than 5 dollars to give you the idea) and some other exchange their votes (now the astute ones) for positions that otherwise they wouldn't be able to reach, occupying places at the public administration that are reserved by law to those who pass through a public contest. It's all about a game of personal interest that has anything to do with the well-fare of the country. I'm ok I don't care about the rest is a sort of philosophy. 
Anyway, it's very difficult to nail all the implications about this issue in a country in which people are obliged to vote, but are not taught to think and be able to discern the power of their action. Those are the same that won't do anything to change the situation when the persons they have ellected decide to do whatever 1001 night dreams they have to confiscate money, rights of the ordinary people and to give themselves skyrocketting salaries and rights that anyone outside our reality has no idea that could possible happen!


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## Mei

diegodbs said:
			
		

> In Spain we have the right to vote, not the obligation.
> And I prefer rights to obligations.


 
Me too.

Mei


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## Alundra

diegodbs said:
			
		

> In Spain we have the right to vote, not the obligation.
> And I prefer rights to obligations.


 
True. And I think, it makes people's answer be largest... Is it possible? In Spain the most of the people vote though it be a right... perhaps (as we are so obstinate  ) we wouldn't go to vote so happy if it was a obligation.. I think... and young people are wishing to be 18 for exercising their right...


Alundra.


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## gorbatzjov

Hello

thanks for all the replies. I have to say that I prefer the obligation to vote. That you CAN vote means you're living in a democracy and it is, at least to my opinion, for the best interest of a country that as many people vote as possible and so form a government that is as the majority of the people want it. However there are a lot of people who will vote extremist parties because they are against all "established" parties and since they have to vote, they'll do an "anger-vote". 
In the defence of pro-obligated voting. Political parties may not care much about communities or minorities that don't vote massifly. This can create a negative circle: Politicians don't find those people "attracting" enough, people don't find politicians to be interested in them so don't bother to vote.
Plus, it's a good time to see your entire town at one location and meet people you haven't seen in years


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## gorbatzjov

blancalaw said:
			
		

> Being obligated to vote can be a good way to encourage people to the polls, but I favor the obligation approach, where the people are expected to be responsible enough to research the candidates and then make an educated choice. I agree that some people in the USA are lazy.



Why is there a registration need? Wouldn't it be better that those who don't want to vote should un-registrate themselves in other to prevent a fine when they don't vote?


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## Outsider

In my country, we have a right to vote, but we are not obliged to do so. I don't have an opinion on which is best.


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## Mutichou

diegodbs said:
			
		

> In Spain we have the right to vote, not the obligation.
> And I prefer rights to obligations.


It is the same in France. People can vote when they are 18, but they don't have to.


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## anything

Mutichou said:
			
		

> It is the same in France. People can vote when they are 18, but they don't have to.


Same in the UK too.


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## lampiao

As Outsider said, in Portugal we have the _right_ to vote. It is considered a civic duty, although it is not an obligation.

I think it is better having it as right. You can wave your right to vote if you want. 
Sometimes the cadidates are all so appalling that you don't really prefer any of them...


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## Outsider

You could always put in a blank vote, though...


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## lampiao

> I have to say that I prefer the obligation to vote. That you CAN vote means you're living in a democracy and it is, at least to my opinion, for the best interest of a country that as many people vote as possible and so form a government


 
Gorbatzjov, I disagree with you on this matter.
Indeed it is in the best interest of a country that as many people as possible vote. However, I think that voting should be something people do because they want to, not because they'll be fined if they don't.
Sure there is the hazzard of having (too) many people not voting, but that's another task for our politicians: Encourage people to vote. Not just by saying that you should vote because you should, but rather by doing things that'll make a difference in these people's lifes.


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## Philippa

I think it's so depressing that in Britain so many people don't bother to vote. Every election the percentage is lower  
I've always thought it would be great to have the obligation to vote, but also to have people who were genuinely undecided or disilusioned to be able to abstain. I'm really disappointed to hear that in Argentina everyone expects this pardon and so knows there's no real obligation to vote!
Saludos democráticos
Philippa  
P.S. Where did I hear about funny spoiled votes? Is that Argentina? (my Spanish teacher is Argentinian) Is that a sort of protest against being forced to vote?


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## elroy

In Israel, voting is a right for all citizens, but it is not obligatory.

I believe this was also the case in the recent Palestinian elections.


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## tigger_uhuhu

diegodbs said:
			
		

> In Spain we have the right to vote, not the obligation.
> And I prefer rights to obligations.


 
In Mexico is just like this...
Cheers


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## Chaska Ñawi

In Canada it's a right, not an obligation.

Nevertheless, on one occasion I made the effort to get to a poll just to spoil my ballot - this was during a national referendum which was worded in such a way that I couldn't in good conscience vote.

Re voter apathy - the last time I ran a polling booth, which would have been in '98, I think, the young people were much more conscientious about exercising their franchise than the older ones.  Perhaps the novelty hadn't worn off yet, but I don't think so.  

Certainly my children and my students are showing far more interest in our recent election than many adults I know .... but maybe I'm corrupting them.


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## SpiceMan

Philippa said:
			
		

> P.S. Where did I hear about funny spoiled votes? Is that Argentina? (my Spanish teacher is Argentinian) Is that a sort of protest against being forced to vote?


Spoiled votes? Like voting a slice of ham or a picture you did in photoshop? Yes, some people do that to express they don't like _any_ of the candidates. Other just for the sake of it (A friend voted for "salami", ie: he put slice of salami in the envelope).


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## pablopaul

Philippa said:
			
		

> I think it's so depressing that in Britain so many people don't bother to vote. Every election the percentage is lower
> I've always thought it would be great to have the obligation to vote, but also to have people who were genuinely undecided or disilusioned to be able to abstain. I'm really disappointed to hear that in Argentina everyone expects this pardon and so knows there's no real obligation to vote!
> Saludos democráticos
> Philippa
> P.S. Where did I hear about funny spoiled votes? Is that Argentina? (my Spanish teacher is Argentinian) Is that a sort of protest against being forced to vote?


 
In Argentina, the installation of the obligatory vote was the first democratic vindication, at the beginning of the XXth century. This resulted in the election of the first really democratic government in 1916. Since then, throughout the years, we have fluctuated between democratic periods and military coups. 

The reinstallation of democracy in 1983 -after a 7-year bloody military dictatorship- created great expectations in all the society. 
However, the failure of the successive governments brought about a deep disrepute to political parties and politicians. 

Thus, the obligation to vote resulted in -as Philippa says- funny null votes as a protest, and almost 50% of the people not even bothering to vote (despite the obligation!). This was called "voto castigo" (punishing vote). The irony is that this should have been called "masochist vote", since this attitude favored the disreputed politicians and their corrupted ways of "buying" votes from the poorer people.

At present we have a system of obligatory vote, but since there are so many citizens that do not vote, the State cannot reinforce this obligation... or is not interested in doing so...


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## SpiceMan

Philippa said:
			
		

> I'm really disappointed to hear that in Argentina everyone expects this pardon and so knows there's no real obligation to vote!


 I overlooked this. People usually don't know this. In fact I've met only two people so far that did know this, and one is the one who told me in the first place, so he doesn't count . Yes I did research, yes it is true.

Despite being brazilian and not being able to vote, I was a militant for a party for roughly 5 years, and _did_ raise the topic and often asked people if they knew they were given a pardon after elections. People usually think that you can not-vote despite being compulsory and "get away with it" because "no one gives a damn", and usually get kinda surprised to find out about the pardon story.


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## natasha2000

diegodbs said:
			
		

> In Spain we have the right to vote, not the obligation.
> And I prefer rights to obligations.


 
Same in Serbia y Montenegro.


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