# schon geht's los!



## Soarinxg32

Hello. I got this out of 2 versions of the same video game manual.


German manual sentence:
_Entscheide Dich mit dem Steuerkreuz, wohin der Vogel Dich fliegen soll, dann drücke entweder den A-, B-, X- oder Y-Knopf... schon geht's los!_


English manual sentence:
_Press the D-Pad to select a number from 1 to 8 for the place you want to go, then press either the A, B, X or Y button to go there._


My attempt to translate the German sentence:
Decide with the Control Pad where the bird is to fly you, then press/push either the A, B, X or Y Button... already go it off!


I know that _schon geht's los_! is supposed to be the same as "Es Geht Schon Los" and "Schon geht es los", which means something like "then off you/we go!". I'm just having trouble understanding how this makes sense grammatically.


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## bearded

Hello
My opinion:  'es geht los' is impersonal, like in English ''now it starts'' (it = the game, the fun..).


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## Dan2

It's not clear to me what your question is.


Soarinxg32 said:


> German manual sentence:
> _... schon geht's los!_
> 
> My attempt to translate the German sentence:
> ... already go *goes *it off!


What's the point of this word-for-word translation?  Surely you know that you can't go from one language to another that way.


Soarinxg32 said:


> I know that _schon geht's los_! is supposed to be the same as "Es  Geht Schon Los" and "Schon geht es los", which means something like  "then off you/we go!". I'm just having trouble understanding how this  makes sense grammatically.


As in English you can move an adverb to initial position (I saw it today -> Today I saw it).  Similarly "schon" has been moved to initial position.  As you know, German requires the conjugated verb to be in second position.  That gives you "Schon geht es los".  A colloquial contraction takes "geht es" to "geht's".  Does that help it "make sense grammatically?


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## Soarinxg32

Basically my root question is with the _schon geht's los _portion of the sentence.

I have been told somewhere that _Es Geht Schon Los _has a slightly different meaning from _schon geht's los. _

Someone wrote to me that this sentence can mean:
... schon geht's los! = ...(And) off you go!

But the grammatical question I had meant that I don't understand how this can make sense. My dictionary has "schon" as meaning "already". And "Los geht's!" means "Here/Off we go!" I know a word for word translation of languages is unsuitable, so is it that _schon geht's los _is an expression? Because translating _... schon geht's los! _literally would be _already here/off we go_!, and that doesn't sound like natural English. 
If _schon geht's los _is an expression, how come I haven't seen it in my paper dictionary nor in WR or any other German-English dictionary websites?


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## Soarinxg32

I guess it is going to come down to me having to solve my own question. I hope that WR does not take offense to what I am doing, since I am merely trying to make sense of the question that I posed, seeing that I am not receiving much help.

Running _...schon geht es los! _through google translate I get  [...off you go!, ...away you go!]. Based on this info, and the fact that _Geh schon! _means _Off you go_!, {definition taken from http://www.dict.cc } it will be safe for me to assume that the German manuals' sentence is omitting ...(_und) _schon geht's los! simply because German grammar allows _and_ to be omitted at times.

Therefore in conclusion, the meaning of this sentence and the most intelligible translation would be:
_... schon geht's los! _= ...and off/away you go!

In my opinion WR should include _Geh schon_! into the dictionary database under the following definitions:
Go on!  Go ahead!  Come on!  Off you go!
Provided these terms are reviewed by a native German speaker of course!


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## Liam Lew's

You should be more patient. We do our best to help, but that can take some time.

"Geh schon" is wrong here. "Schon geht's los" is not about someone to go away. 
Google translate is probably the worst source for translations.

"Schon geht's los" expresses that it's not complicated to get the game started. It's not a long way and doesn't take much time. You just have to decide where you want the bird (plane?) to fly, and then press one of the buttons. *That's all and the game gets started. That's all and the game is already about to start.* <--[That's all what the phrase "schon geht's los" says.]

The "schon" is kind of emphatic. It expresses the simplicity, the shortness and easiness. It also expresses imminence. 
"Schon geht's los" --> Schon geht es los. "es" = the game.    Decide where you want the bird (plane?) to fly, press one of the buttons, and off goes the game/and the game starts.

You can add "und".

I'm afraid, there's no equivalent for "schon" as in the German sentence in English. I would omit it. Just for you to know. It's functions as an intensifier, as a word referring to the previous mentioned and emphasising its easiness, shortness.
_
[Edit: cross-posted with Schimmelreiter, I like his suggestion, it's a pretty good one]
_


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## Schimmelreiter

_losgehen - to start_

_Schon geht's los. - It's starting already.
_


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## ayuda?

Soarinxg32, your German is good; you intrinsically know what is meant.
I see it like Dan2 does.
You’re trying to fit that square peg into a round hole [Du versuchst das quadratische Klötzchen in das runde Loch zu kriegen].
At some point early on in German you hit that wall, and you learn it “ain’t gonna” happen!

They have gone with the _sense and the feel _of to go there [… schon geht’s los]. […and you’re off/there you go/there you are, etc.]

The grammar is this: Es geht *schon *los = schon geht’s los [*schon,* taken from the Middle Field displaces *es*,which is shortened to *‘s*. Schon is a filler word [Denkwort] and is something equivalent to “just” and is simply and extra and not always necessary in cases like that (e.g., Was machst du schon?).]

To really get a general sense of grammar, [not that you don’t in general] first, you have to develop that very solid grammatical background; then, you need to read comparative translations of German magazine, books, etc.                                                               
—anything and everything—and later not try to think literally and to just go with the feel of it and not be locked in by looking for something that is exact because German will defy literal interpretation so much more often than you would believe. That’s what they did.
 To me, it seems to be easier to get a literal interpretation of something in English from Spanish, French or Italian, rather than it is in German. At some point you learn to break the chains and_ think_ in German.

As far as I am concerned,  German is unique in the respect that it defies word-for-word translation so frequently. You would think that English, being a Germanic language also, would not present such a difficulty. It might give us an edge in relation to, say, the Romance languages—but not always.
To speak and write German naturally probably takes a lot of memorization of patterns, real dedication, and years of study for us native English speakers to be able to do that. I add to my understanding every day.

[Just my personal opinion and respectfully submitted—from one _Deutschliebhaber _to another] 


*Note:*  If you are not already familiar with it, this Linguee dictionary is indispensible for complete phrase translations. 
http://www.linguee.com/english-german/search?source=auto&query=schon+geht%27s+los [schon geht’s los]


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## Soarinxg32

I'm thankful to everyone who has responded to my post so far.
I have particularly taken interest in Liam Lew's response. 
However I still feel I was right on the response I posted when I attempted to solve this for myself, and I'll explain why.

I've heard that context can alter translations entirely and I feel I haven't put enough for adequate understanding.
It's not that the "game" starts or goes underway, rather the manual is explaining that this bird, which your character [Link] summons _while in the game_ by way of blowing into a magic flute, suddenly appears and comes down in a swoop, grabbing you and flying off to another section of the map that you desire to go.

_Es_, in many dictionaries that I've seen, means "it". The definition of "it" in an English dictionary is:
{pronoun used to represent a person or animal understood, previously mentioned, or about to be mentioned whose gender is unknown or disregarded.}

Based on this I can assume that the _es_ in _schon geht's los_ can mean a person.
And there's not much difference in my opinion between "...and off you go." and "...and and off goes the game/and the game starts.", just that its your character that flies off and not the game "starting or commencing".


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## Liam Lew's

Soarinxg32 said:


> _Es_, in many dictionaries that I've seen, means "it". The definition of "it" in an English dictionary is:
> {pronoun used to represent a person or animal understood, previously mentioned, or about to be mentioned whose gender is unknown or disregarded.}
> 
> Based on this I can assume that the _es_ in _schon geht's los_ can mean a person.
> And there's not much difference in my opinion between "...and off you go." and "...and and off goes the game/and the game starts.", just that its your character that flies off and not the game "starting or commencing".


 No, it doesn't work this way. The German "it/es" is different in that it can't refer to a person. That is because German nouns have genders. Neuter, feminine and male. "Es" is neuter. You can only refer with "Er" or "Sie" to a person, not with "es". Also, you can't refer to a bird using "es". You have to use the pronoun equivalent to the grammatical gender of the noun. For bird (*der* Vogel) it would be "er". So, if you suggest that "the game starting or commencing" doesn't make sense in your context, I'd suggest that es refers to "the starting flying off of your character". But it's still the process what "es" refers to, it can't be the character itself.


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## Soarinxg32

Thanks for responding Liam Lew's.  

There is a section on about.com, which was written by a native German speaker, http://german.about.com/od/grammar/a/German-Personal-Pronoun-Es.htm, there in the lesson of the section titled, *German Personal Pronoun 'Es'*

*Part I: Similarities with 'It"*

the writer of the lesson states, "The German personal pronoun "es" is the English equivalent of "it" and has similar functions. It is mostly a substitute for a noun and can:
2. *Act as an object, therefore be in the accusative case.*

_Das Kind weint. Ich beruhige es - The child is crying. I'm consoling him/her._


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## Liam Lew's

*Das *Kind weint.         Ich beruhige es.*
Der *Junge weint.       Ich beruhige ihn.    Ich beruhige es.*
Die* Mutter weint.       Ich beruhige sie.    Ich beruhige es.
Marla weint.               Ich beruhige sie.
Liam weint.                Ich beruhige ihn.

So, you can't use "es" to refer to a person. You refer neuter nouns with "es", to male nouns with "er" and to female nouns with "sie". Since "das Kind" is a neuter noun you have to use "es" hier. If the child was called by name you'd either have to use "er" or "sie".

So as you see there are similarities but also differences.


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## Soarinxg32

Your response makes a lot of sense. I now see that I was close but not correct. _Schon geht's los _describes a more abstract idea, not necessarily referring to people but rather a concept.

Going by your example, I think this sentence can thus be translated to:
_Entscheide Dich mit dem Steuerkreuz, wohin der Vogel Dich fliegen soll, dann drücke entweder den A-, B-, X- oder Y-Knopf... schon geht's los!

_Decide with the Control Pad where the bird is to fly you, then press/push either the A, B, X or Y Button_... (and) the act/occurrence of flying off simply/immediately starts!_


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## Schimmelreiter

No offence, but why all this exegesis when _Schon geht's los _simply means_ It's starting already_​ (_losgehen - to start_, see my post #7)?


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## Soarinxg32

Schimmelreiter said:


> No offence, but why all this exegesis when _Schon geht's los _simply means_ It's starting already_​ (_losgehen - to start_, see my post #7)?



If what you are saying is correct, then I am now under the assumption that maybe the manual tried to act explanatory, then broke off into a first-person narrative. To explain:

During this sentence, the manual was written like any other manual, so the reader reads the information as a bland statement,
_Decide with the Control Pad where the bird is to fly you, then press/push either the A, B, X or Y Button__...
_
Then it seems to break off into the first-person, 
..._It's starting already!_
As if the manual was watching the event unfold and thus describing the action that was taking place.


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## Schimmelreiter

What is first-person about _It's starting already_​?

Edit
I'm quite uneasy with this discussion. Learners of German may well be getting the impression how so very big a mystery German is. But it isn't. Not normally. And certainly not when it comes to _schon geht's los._

It's impersonal _es_ _(geht'*s*)_, which translates into impersonal _it._
It's third person singular, which translates into third person singular.
It's _losgehen_, which translates into_ start.
_It's _schon_, which translates into _already._

We should realise when life's easy, for a change.


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## Soarinxg32

Schimmelreiter said:


> What is first-person about _It's starting already_​?
> 
> Edit
> I'm quite uneasy with this discussion. Learners of German may well be getting the impression how so very big a mystery German is. But it isn't. Not normally. And certainly not when it comes to _schon geht's los._
> 
> It's impersonal _es_ _(geht'*s*)_, which translates into impersonal _it._
> It's third person singular, which translates into third person singular.
> It's _losgehen_, which translates into_ start.
> _It's _schon_, which translates into _already._
> 
> We should realise when life's easy, for a change.



Maybe my first-person narrative suggestion was wrong, but the reason I keep searching for a valid definition of ..._schon geht's los! _is because I have never heard a sentence in English end that way. If you were to end an English sentence with [...It's starting already!], I don't think anyone would understand you and they would most likely ask you what you are talking about. I guess it's difficult for non-native speakers of English to understand that, but ending a sentence like that just wouldn't make any sense at all and would leave your English conversational partner very confused.


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## bearded

'schon geht's los'  corresponds to  'jetzt geht's los', in my view.  On board of a US aeroplane some years ago, immediately before starting off the Pilot said to passengers through the loudspeakers:  ''And there we go!''.  I think it roughly corresponds to the German phrase, which doesn' seem to be so difficult.


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## Liam Lew's

Soarinxg32 said:


> Maybe my first-person narrative suggestion was wrong, but the reason I keep searching for a valid definition of ..._schon geht's los! _is because I have never heard a sentence in English end that way. If you were to end an English sentence with [...It's starting already!], I don't think anyone would understand you and they would most likely ask you what you are talking about. I guess it's difficult for non-native speakers of English to understand that, but ending a sentence like that just wouldn't make any sense at all and would leave your English conversational partner very confused.


 To me "It's already starting" is a pretty good description of what "schon geht's los" expresses literally. But it's not more than a description. I agree with you that this doesn't make that much sense in English and doesn't convey the same as the German phrase. That's why explained to you what the phrase means and which connotations it has. I think it's not translatable without losing some meaning and emotion, which is conveyed by the phrase. Your post #13 shows to me that you've understood what the phrase is to express.


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## Soarinxg32

Liam Lew's said:


> To me "It's already starting" is a pretty good description of what "schon geht's los" expresses literally. But it's not more than a description. I agree with you that this doesn't make that much sense in English and doesn't convey the same as the German phrase. That's why explained to you what the phrase means and which connotations it has. I think it's not translatable without losing some meaning and emotion, which is conveyed by the phrase. Your post #13 shows to me that you've understood what the phrase is to express.



I have seen instances in other languages where some words have such a cultural nuance that it is almost untranslatable, kind of like _Sensei _in Japanese. I guess that's why they say to learn what another language is conveying one must think in that language.

Thanks for letting me know that one of my posts was at least somewhat on the spot. Usually one of my complaints here on WR is that I will make a suggestion like in #13 and nobody will bother to even tell me if I was right or wrong.


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## ayuda?

*Just one small point:*
---schon geht’s los 
I personally would not translate schon in the English version. That is something that is more specifically German and more akin to a _Denkwort_ here, as far as I am concerned.
Already sounds awkward in English in this case.
http://www.linguee.com/english-german/search?source=auto&query=schon+geht%27s+los  [schon geht’s los]

By the way, “German is a very big mystery ” wrapped in a mystery at times. I don’t know if a German speaker can understand how difficult it is in the beginning to master certain patterns and the subtilty of word order, plurals, preposition, cases and endings, etc. It is a struggle initially. German_ is_ a difficult language—far more difficult, in my opinion the Spanish or French, which is usually taught in this country, where you don’t have to deal with all these things to such a large degree. I think other Americans might agree with that also—maybe not so much in this case. 

Any beginner tries to make sense of it the way they can.  I have great respect for that, and it always deserves nothing less than a polite response. The same applies to any response by a forum menber, like it or not. Never any reason for anything else. [Incidentally, I'm always right. ]


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## Dan2

ayuda? said:


> I personally would not translate schon in the English version.


I agree.  The uses of "already" are a distinct subset of the uses of "schon".  (SR might be able to google-justify his use of "already" here, because this overuse of "already" is sometimes heard in American English, but I think this is regarded as German or Yiddish influence, and most Americans will reject it.)


ayuda? said:


> By  the way, “German is a very big mystery ” wrapped in a mystery at times.  I don’t know if a German speaker can understand how difficult it is in  the beginning to master certain patterns and the subtilty of word order,  plurals, preposition, cases and endings, etc. It is a struggle  initially. German_ is_ a difficult language—far more difficult,  in my opinion the Spanish or French


At the risk of going even further off-topic: I agree that, overall, German is more difficult for English speakers than the Romance languages, and would go so far as to say that in _some _respects, English looks more like a Romance language than a Germanic language.  HOWEVER... I think ayuda might be misunderstood as claiming that German is uniquely difficult among languages. But the Slavic languages, to give one example, are much more difficult for English speakers than German is, and there are languages on other continents that make Slavic and English look like closely related dialects.


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## ayuda?

Dan2 said:


> I agree.  The uses of "already" are a distinct subset of the uses of "schon".  (SR might be able to google-justify his use of "already" here, because this overuse of "already" is sometimes heard in American English, but I think this is regarded as German or Yiddish influence, and most Americans will reject it.)





*I agree with *Dan2:
I was going to mention before that schon, included in… _schon geht’s los, _is definitely something that has a Yiddish bent to it_,_ as in “You’re off _already_” in this specific example . You will hear it here in that kind of context and sometimes with a special emphasis. The use of already like that is something you would come across on TV or generally to give something that particular _unmistakable _Yiddish flare. Many times is has a sort of comic effect because it can be used almost any time for anything without it having any real meaning  at all in English, and in that way it just says Yiddish; it is somewhat comparable to the frequent use of schon in German that we don’t always translate as such, like in this case. 
You would normally only hear “and you’re off”/ “and there you go,” etc., without the “already.”


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## berndf

Schimmelreiter said:


> No offence, but why all this exegesis when _Schon geht's los _simply means_ It's starting already_​ (_losgehen - to start_, see my post #7)?





Schimmelreiter said:


> I'm quite uneasy with this discussion. Learners of German may well be getting the impression how so very big a mystery German is. But it isn't. Not normally. And certainly not when it comes to _schon geht's los._


The problem is not _es_ but _schon_. These flavouring participles are indeed a mystery in German and I fully agree with Ayuda and Dan that _already_ does not represent the function of _schon_ here at all.


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## Schimmelreiter

berndf said:


> The problem is not _es_ but _schon_. These flavouring participles are indeed a mystery in German and I fully agree with Ayuda and Dan that _already_ does not represent the function of _schon_ here at all.




Man braucht bloß folgendes zu tun


Soarinxg32 said:


> _Entscheide Dich mit dem Steuerkreuz, wohin der Vogel Dich fliegen soll, dann drücke entweder den A-, B-, X- oder Y-Knopf_


und dann braucht man nichts weiter zu tun, denn das Spiel startet *bereits/schon*.


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## Soarinxg32

Schimmelreiter said:


> Man braucht bloß folgendes zu tun
> 
> und dann braucht man nichts weiter zu tun, denn das Spiel startet *bereits/schon*.



The problem with ", denn das Spiel startet *bereits/schon.*​", is that just like I posted in post #9, it's not that the "game" starts or goes underway, since you have already inserted the game into the console, turned it on and are already playing, rather this bird grabs you and flies you off.

So maybe its that the _Flug _[flight] goes underway... or is already starting.


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## Schimmelreiter

You are right of course. I was not referring to the game starting in a technical sense with the DVD starting to rotate in the console. I was referring to _Spi__el _in the sense of _Spielen_. 
_Das Spiel/Das Spielen geht bereits los_, once the person has determined the flight direction and pressed one of the mentioned buttons.


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## berndf

*Moderator note: In response to deleted post above. Replying to the request to provide a translation rather than an explanation.
*
The translation you gave already in your original question, something like "and off you go".


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## Soarinxg32

berndf said:


> The translation you gave already in your original question, something like "and off you go".



I've tried to state that as a translation, but when I did, I got:

Liam Lew's    post #6
"Schon geht's los" is not about someone to go away.

Schimmelreiter post #7
"_Schon geht's los. - It's starting already."

_Liam Lew's post #10
"The German "it/es" is different in that it can't refer to a person."
"I'd suggest that es refers to "the starting flying off of your character". But it's still the process what "es" refers to, it can't be the character itself."

Liam Lew's post #12
"So, you can't use "es" to refer to a person."

Schimmelreiter post #27_
"Das Spiel/Das Spielen geht bereits los, once the person has determined the flight direction and pressed one of the mentioned buttons."_

So how can the translation I gave originally be right when there are so many contradictions as cited above?


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## Liam Lew's

How do you understand "and off you go", Soarinxg? What does it mean to you in English?
And where do you see contradiction here?


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## Soarinxg32

Liam Lew's said:


> How do you understand "and off you go", Soarinxg? What does it mean to you in English?
> And where do you see contradiction here?



_You _is a pronoun, you clearly stated on posts #6, #10 and #12 that "you" can't be used here.

I did however, take note to what else you wrote on your #6 post.

Combining both our translations, I see:

Decide with the Control Pad where the bird is to fly you, then press/push either the A, B, X or Y Button... *That's all and the game gets started. */* That's all and the game is already about to start.
*
This sounds like decent translation, although I would like it if some native German speakers would OK it, or if they could give me their opinions as to why this would be correct or not.


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## Liam Lew's

Soarinxg32 said:


> Decide with the Control Pad where the bird is to fly you, then press/push either the A, B, X or Y Button... *That's all and the game gets started. */* That's all and the game is already about to start.
> *
> This sounds like decent translation, although I would like it if some native German speakers would OK it, or if they could give me their opinions as to why this would be correct or not.


That's what I feel when hearing "schon geht's los". It was rather meant as a description. I wouldn't use it as translation though, because it's too long a sentence. The "schon geht's los" isn't that important.

And maybe "and off you go" can be used here. That's why I asked you what it means to you in English. If it's an expression which isn't used literally it might work. But that's something I don't know.


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## Soarinxg32

To not use this as a translation simply because it makes the sentence too long does not seem like such a concern to me. If it takes adding a couple extra words to give a coherent translation, I say add it, even if it makes a translation seem lengthy.

As far as "and off you go", what I make of this is that there is a significant difference between saying, "and off you go/and off the game goes/and off goes the flight." All three have different insinuations, and therefore can not be used interchangeably.


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## berndf

Soarinxg32 said:


> So how can the translation I gave originally be right when there are so many contradictions as cited above?


As Liam has pointed out he is unsure about the meaning of the English expression _off you go_. In my understanding, the use cases for the idiomatic expressions _off you go_ and _los geht's_ have very similar use cases.

I would say, Schimmelreiter interpreted _los geht's_ in a somewhat too literal sense. Plus he tried to fit in the flavouring particle _schon _which in my mind is impossible, at least if you try convey the literal meaning _schon_, viz. _already_. In English PR lingo for technological products, you often hear the exclamation _It's that easy!_ appended to an explanation of how to do certain things with the advertised device or software. That's roughly what the _schon_ expresses here, maybe a bit less ballyhooing.


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