# Serbo-Croatian, Bosnian : između boce



## harakiri

> kako obršćeni i sto puta gaženi trn iskraj puta diše, otvara meki pupoljak što se zeleni između boce i upija u sebe svetlost avgustovskog podneva

I don't quite get this phrase. "između boce". "boce" is genitive & plural. 
boca - Wiktionary

Well, but how should we understand "između boce" here? If translating this sentence without "između boce", it is mostly as the following; 
as if harvested, and 100 times trampled thorn beside the street breathes, opens a soft bud, which is green -----, and absorbs the light of August noon


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## QuasiTriestino

Can we have a little more context? Is this poetry? Or a book that deals with growing plants....? Or some metaphysical combo of both? 'Boca' can also mean 'gourd' - see here. But again, context would help.


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## harakiri

Oh, gourd... I got it then. Yes, it seems so. In Belgrade I didn't taste it at all, but in the countryside on the south I had something similar, I suppose. I will check things even in that recnik web later. Grazie! 

It's from "CRVENI PETAO LETI PREMA NEBU" written by Miodrag Bulatović.This phrase is not quite like poetry, though the story itself is like that. Comparing with the translation in English, the original version is much richer. So I enjoy it. Comparing the original with the translation (though I have only the Japanese one translated from the English) nowadays. I highly recommend non-native students to enjoy this original book.


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## Vukabular

boca = trn = thorn
boca, bode, bocka, boc-boc


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## The Mountain Wreath

Vukabular said:


> boca = trn = thorn
> boca, bode, bocka, boc-boc



I do not think so, since the form that is used is "između boce" which is singular. It is not "između boca" which would be plural.
I would say *QuasiTriestino *is right. Of course, maybe "boca" (singular) here is a collective noun.

http://www.pesticidi.org/korovi/boca-obicna


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## Vukabular

how  breathes eaten (by animals), and 100 times trampled thorn (bush) beside the street? Opens a soft  bud, that turns green between  thorns, and absorbs the light of August noon


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## Vukabular

The Mountain Wreath said:


> "između boce" which is singular


How something can be between something in the singular?


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## The Mountain Wreath

Vukabular said:


> How something can be between something in the singular?


Exactly my thought, boce (whatever that may stand for) must be a plural form. Sorry if I made you think otherwise.


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## harakiri

Well, grammatically it seems that "boca" is not thorn here as The Mountain Wreath pointed out. 

However, the understanding of Vukabular is very essential and exact. If checking the link advised by The Mountain Wreath, the "Opis" seems explaining things in details. 

Opens a soft bud, that turns green among "gourds with thorns". So I do get what Vukabular feels as well. Yes, "boca (the fruit, "plod")" is with many thorns (s bodljama). This is what Bulatovic imagined in this sentence, I suppose now. 

Hvala vam!


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## harakiri

Or do I misunderstand something?


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## The Mountain Wreath

The meaning of the word "gourd" (M. Benson, Standard English-SerboCroatian, SerboCroatian-English Dictionary: A Dictionary of Bosnian, Croatian, and Serbian Standards) 

*gourd* [gü(r)d], [a] n tikva; sud od tikve; vrg


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## harakiri

Hvala!


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## The Mountain Wreath

Nema na čemu


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## Vukabular

harakiri said:


> Opens a soft bud, that turns green among "gourds with thorns"


Forget about gourds, there are no gourds. I'll explain. In serbian gourd is *tikvica* (lit. small pumpkin) but there is another plant called the same *tikvica* or *boca *('bottle') or *duduk* or *crpka *('pump') or *kutlača *('dipper')... It is a small pumpkin with long neck wthout thorns and  when dried, the bark becomes hard as wood and it is hollow inside so when the top is cut off and the seeds are thrown out, it becomes a *boca* ('bottle'). If it cuts off the top and drills a hole in the bottom it becomes a *crpka* ('pump').  If it cuts off the top and  bottom and drills  holes in the neck it becomes a *duduk* ('a clarinet or trumpet-like musical instrument'). If it cuts off the top and one side it becomes *kutlača *('dipper').


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## Vukabular

Vukabular said:


> If it cuts off the top and one side it becomes *kutlača *('dipper').


There is no reason to cut off the top


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## Vukabular

The Mountain Wreath said:


> The meaning of the word "gourd" (M. Benson, Standard English-SerboCroatian, SerboCroatian-English Dictionary: A Dictionary of Bosnian, Croatian, and Serbian Standards)
> 
> *gourd* [gü(r)d], [a] n tikva; sud od tikve; vrg


Mr. Benson has no knowledge of Serbian ethnology.


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## harakiri

There are several more cute words such as boca... ;-)

Yes, I left "gourds", since it sounded odd in the context. And the Bulatovic talked about "obicna boca"... When I was in Serbia, I saw this on the street. Not in the center of Belgrade, but in the suburb, if I remember things. 16 years ago... So maybe my memory is sometimes wrong. 

> boca = trn = thorn, 
> boca, bode, bocka, boc-boc 

boca = a bunch of thorns, which holds seeds inside
"izmedju boca" leaves are opening to taste O2 & the sun light. Yummy! and it looks green. Фотосинтеза (photosynthesis)

obicna boca : 
Xanthium strumarium
Obična boca (Xanthium strumarium) - ratarstvo.net

No pumpkins. Too big. Just quite rather small fruits, which are only with needles, and hold seeds inside. (Though even pumpkins have the same structure). 
I got things like this yesterday.


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## The Mountain Wreath

Vukabular said:


> Mr. Benson has no knowledge of Serbian ethnology.



it is the meaning of the word *gourd*, as simple as that.


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## harakiri

Not essential, but I realized, not pumpkin but squash. XD English is not mine. There's always a kinda gap. Well, but that's why we can enjoy learning something new for each of us.


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