# I'm going to study. /ai mə nə stədi/



## homotopy07

Is it OK to pronounce *I'm going to* as */ai mə nə/* when it is followed by a bare infinitive?

*I'm going to study.
/ai mə nə stədi/*

Incidentally, I've heard that, in American English, there is no need to distinguish between */ʌ/* and */ə/*, so I wrote */stədi/* instead of */stʌdi/*.


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## Uncle Jack

I don't recognise the /ai/ sound - did you mean /aɪ/?

It sounds like you are saying "I'm in a study" (well, it would if you used the /ʌ/ vowel). I have no idea how you have arrived at this from "I'm going to study". I cannot think that the hard "g" sound at the beginning of "going" ever disappears, in any accent or dialect.


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## dojibear

homotopy07 said:


> Is it OK to pronounce *I'm going to* as */ai mə nə/* when it is followed by a bare infinitive?



No. The phrase "I'm 'un a study" is a sloppy pronunciation of "I'm gonna study" which is a sloppy pronunciation of "I'm going to study."

This is heard in AE in some places, but is not common, or correct, or used everywhere in AE.


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## london calling

homotopy07 said:


> Is it OK to pronounce *I'm going to* as */ai mə nə/* when it is followed by a bare infinitive?


Not if I'm reading it correctly. Where's the 'g' in '*g*oing'?


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## Roxxxannne

Uncle Jack said:


> It sounds like you are saying "I'm in a study" (well, it would if you used the /ʌ/ vowel). I have no idea how you have arrived at this from "I'm going to study". I cannot think that the hard "g" sound at the beginning of "going" ever disappears, in any accent or dialect.


I think whether Americans use */ʌ/* or */ə/* depends on their accent: whether they say their a-type vowels closer to the front or farther back in their mouth.
If you say  */aɪ mə nə stədi/* slowly and clearly, it does sound like "I'm in a study" or "I'm on a study."  That would make no sense to an American listener.  To pronounce */aɪ mə nə stədi/* the way I've heard it, you have to say it very quickly, moving the various parts of your mouth as little as possible. It's an extremely sloppy pronunciation.
A slightly more clear way of saying it includes the hard -g-: '*/aɪm gɔ: nə stədi/*
I also hear */aɪm gɔɪndə stədi/.*
I recommend saying 'I'm going to study' as clearly as possible,


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## homotopy07

Thank you all.  


Uncle Jack said:


> I have no idea how you have arrived at this from "I'm going to study".


A certain native speaker of American English says in his book that it is OK in informal American English to pronounce *I'm going to* as */ai mə nə/* when it is followed by a bare infinitive.


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## london calling

God help us. Where is the English language going?


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## PaulQ

homotopy07 said:


> Is it OK to pronounce *I'm going to* as */ai mə nə/* when it is followed by a bare infinitive?


The answer is "For you, "No". It isn't OK." Non-native speakers invariably have an accent and people expect that they will speak more-or less standard English. If they fail to do this, then your listeners will be puzzled.

More than this, such sentences are usually used in a specific context, and the chances are that the non-native speaker will use the wrong context and, again, be misunderstood (or given a meaningful look.)


homotopy07 said:


> A certain native speaker of American English says in his book that it is OK in informal American English to pronounce *I'm going to* as */ai mə nə/* when it is followed by a bare infinitive.


Others will remark that my AE is very bad, but, the more I say "*/ai mə nə stədi/*" the more it sounds as if your mystery author (Why is he a mystery? Name him/her and their book!) is probably correct.


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## london calling

PaulQ said:


> Others will remark that my AE is very bad, but, the more I say "*/ai mə nə stədi/*" the more it sounds as if your mystery author (Why is he a mystery? Name him/her and their book!) is probably correct.


But only if he's talking about *his* dialect.


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## Hermione Golightly

I'm sure we would all like to know who this person is and the title of his book if that's what he's suggesting. If it's meant for students he's doing  them a huge disservice. When you can speak well and correctly you can then decide what casual/sloppy/slang speech forms you want to adopt and when it is appropriate.


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## PaulQ

london calling said:


> But only if he's talking about *his* dialect.


I don't read it that way.


homotopy07 said:


> A certain native speaker of American English says in his book that it is OK in informal American English


I think he has quite a sharp ear.


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## london calling

PaulQ said:


> I don't read it that way.


No? How many people do you know that pronounce *I'm going to* as */ai mə nə/* that speak anything even approaching  standard English?


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## Loob

PaulQ said:


> I think he has quite a sharp ear.


I'd expect a /g/ in there somewhere.


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## PaulQ

I thought so too, but, no, after saying it a few times, it need not be there; it is the 'n' that is persistent.


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## london calling

Not in my brand of English. I always pronounce the 'g' in *g*oing.


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## PaulQ

homotopy07 said:


> A certain native speaker of American English





london calling said:


> Not in my brand of English.


Nor mine, but that is not what said.


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## alexl57

Yes, you can pronounce it like that in American English. Be careful, though. It only works with *I*; you cannot reduce it like that with other pronouns or nouns.
It is possible to omit the I as well and just say /'*mənə* /. 
There's a video from Rachel's English explaining it nicely. Look it up.


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## Loob

PaulQ said:


> I thought so too, but, no, after saying it a few times, it need not be there; it is the 'n' that is persistent.


Intriguing! I'm not familiar with any variety of English that would elide the /g/. Can you point us to one, Paul?


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## PaulQ

Yes, it is in that book by the native American speaker.
Say /aɪmənə stədi frɛntʃ/ a few times quickly... then say it to someone else.


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## Loob

I'm still intrigued - what dialect is it, exactly, that omits the /g/?


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## london calling

As I said then, in *his* dialect, not in standard English.


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## homotopy07

Hermione Golightly said:


> I'm sure we would all like to know who this person is and the title of his book if that's what he's suggesting. If it's meant for students he's doing  them a huge disservice. When you can speak well and correctly you can then decide what casual/sloppy/slang speech forms you want to adopt and when it is appropriate.


I think there is no point in naming the book because it is written in Japanese and went out of print long ago. (I bought it secondhand.) The writer wrote it with the assistance of a Japanese person.


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## london calling

An American who wrote a book in Japanese? About what, pronunciation?


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## Loob

homotopy07 said:


> I think there is no point in naming the book because it is written in Japanese


OK.
But I think most of us are saying "Most native speakers of English have an initial /g/ in "going to".
And I think all of us are saying 'If you are a second-language speaker of English, do not omit the initial /g/ in "going to" '.


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## PaulQ

Loob said:


> I'm still intrigued - what dialect is it, exactly, that omits the /g/?


You will understand that I have not read the mystery book, nor can I be sure that the book actually gives the dialect. To that extent, you are asking a question upon which I cannot have data.  

I see this as "general American English" casually but quickly spoken - I tried it out on my son and wife1, and neither saw anything to remark upon. I then pointed out that there was no /g/ sound as might be expected, and both shrugged. 

1Neither has any US connections at all


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## london calling

I can believe they understood "I'm 'un a study" but surely none of them actually say it that way?


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## Loob

Re post 25

Sorry, Paul. I still can't think of any English dialect which omits the initial /g/ in "going to".
But even if there is one - which there may well be - my advice in post 24 still stands:


Loob said:


> If you are a second-language speaker of English, do not omit the initial /g/ in "going to".


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## PaulQ

Loob said:


> my advice in post 24 still stands:


Which all but echoes mine in #8.


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## london calling

Therefore, in the end you agree this is dialect, not standard English?


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## velisarius

I'm guessing here, but isn't it possible that the American wrote that book to help learners decode varieties of spoken English that they might hear? It would indeed be strange to suggest that a learner try to imitate it.


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## dojibear

We understand bad pronunciations from natives, because everything else matches our language. If a non-native imitates bad pronunciations *plus *has their own set of imperfections (all non-natives have some), they are harder to understand.



velisarius said:


> isn't it possible that the American wrote that book to help learners decode varieties of spoken English that they might hear?



I like that idea. Understand it, but don't use it.


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## homotopy07

london calling said:


> An American who wrote a book in Japanese?


The author drew up the draft in English. A Japanese person translated it into Japanese.


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## london calling

And it was about what, exactly? In what context does the book talk about the pronunciation of "I'm going to study"? What does the author say about the pronunciation he suggests? Does he say it's from anywhere in particular?


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## JulianStuart

dojibear said:


> I like that idea. Understand it, but don't use it.


 I learnt the concept of active (to be used) and passive (to be understood but not used) vocabulary after joining the forum 
I have heard* I'm'n'a {verb} as a fast casual informal version of I'm going to {verb}.  Not so much and accent or dialect but someone in a situation  where and for whom elocution is not critical - between friends but not in a public speech, for example.
My favourite example of this "crushing" words together is "Yomseh?" ("You know what I'm saying?")  This one is particular to African American fast speech but I'm'n'a X is broader than that.

* And since I can remember it, it's likely to have been in the US


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## srk

JulianStuart said:


> ... someone in a situation where and for whom elocution is not critical - between friends ....



I'm quite sure I've said "I'm'n'a {verb}" at least a few times in my life.


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## Loob

Oh, Julian! I wish you could remember where you've heard "I'm going to" with no /g/...
I'm willing to believe it exists, I really am ... I just want to know where!


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## tunaafi

PaulQ said:


> the more I say "*/ai mə nə stədi/*" the more it sounds as if your mystery author (Why is he a mystery? Name him/her and their book!) is probably correct.


I agree, and I have  an accent very close to RP. My son, who has a vaguely estuary accent sometimes comes out with something very like */ai mə nə/*, with no trace of a /g/. Like others, I would not recommend that learners try to copy this, but they're gonna (!) hear it from some native speakers. Yes, I know it's not appropriate to write 'gonna', but I use it in informal conversation - like many native speakers (some of whom claim they don't). I don't* think* I ever say */ai mə nə/*, but I can't be 100% sure.


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## london calling

I want to know where too, hence my question to the OP in my post 33.

Tunaafi, my accent is also  very close to RP but I really can't say I've ever said it that way. I even have trouble pronouncing it the way it's written in the OP and yet as someone who speaks a couple of foreign languages I'm good at imitating sounds and accents in general.


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## homotopy07

london calling said:


> And it was about what, exactly?


It is about "real American pronunciation".


london calling said:


> In what context does the book talk about the pronunciations of "I'm going to study"?


No context. */ai mə nə/*  is in a list of reduced pronunciations of words/phrases.


london calling said:


> What does the author say about the pronunciation he suggests?


I do not think that the author 'suggests' anything. It seems that the book was written in order to help Japanese learners of English 'understand' real American English.


london calling said:


> Does he say it's from anywhere in particular?


No.


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## JulianStuart

Loob said:


> Oh, Julian! I wish you could remember where you've heard "I'm going to" with no /g/...
> I'm willing to believe it exists, I really am ... I just want to know where!


Within my experience in the US.  Precisely geographically where would be well beyond the resolution of my cranial hard drive, fragmented as it is  Perhaps towards the end of a social gathering/party where at least a little alcohol might havebeen consumed: I'm'n'a go home now...


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## london calling

homotopy07 said:


> It is about "real American pronunciation".
> 
> No context. */ai mə nə/*  is in a list of reduced pronunciation of words/phrases.
> 
> I do not think that the author 'suggests' anything. It seems that the book was written in order to help Japanese learners of English 'understand' real American English.
> 
> No.


Oh well, thanks anyway.


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## Loob

The bottom line, homotopy07, is that even if such a pronunciation  exists in certain dialects, you should not copy it.


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## JulianStuart

Loob said:


> The bottom line, homotopy07, is that even if such a pronunciation  exists in certain dialects, you should not copy it.


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## tunaafi

One of the problems I have encountered in my career, especially  as a teacher trainer is that many native speakers, especially teachers and would be teachers, have little real idea of how they actually speak in informal situations. Many of us use far more contractions, elisions, glottal stops, intrusive */r/*s, etc, than we realise. I often had to point out to my trainees that they were trying to get their learners to speak _too_ precisely - and unnaturally.


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## Loob

Very true, tunaafi.

EDIT. But I still don't think second-language speakers of English should be encouraged to say "going to" without a /g/.


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## homotopy07

Loob said:


> The bottom line, homotopy07, is that even if such a pronunciation  exists in certain dialects, you should not copy it.


Thanks, Loob.   I am not going to copy it. I am currently trying to 'understand' something like these:

_Whassamadder?
Whaddaya say?
Zat a pen?_


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## london calling

tunaafi said:


> One of the problems I have encountered in my career, especially  as a teacher trainer is that many native speakers, especially teachers and would be teachers, have little real idea of how they actually speak in informal situations. Many of us use far more contractions, elisions, glottal stops, intrusive */r/*s, etc, than we realise. I often had to point out to my trainees that they were trying to get their learners to speak _too_ precisely - and unnaturally.


Yep. I was a TEFL teacher for 10 years. I and my fellow teachers  at one point waged a war on the use of what at the time was called 'teacher-speak' in English classes, held in the local university, by a group of 'assistants' who had had no training whatsoever and were 'spoon-feeding' the students, to the point where we'd go into a class to follow up on lessons by the 'assistants' and the students couldn't understand our pronunciation.  

Ha ha, homotopy. Are those from the same book?


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## JulianStuart

Loob said:


> Very true, tunaafi.
> 
> EDIT. But I still don't think second-language speakers of English should be encouraged to say "going to" without a /g/.


   

We even frown on teaching ANYONE to say "gonna" (omitting the second g in going to) - I wish we could get the message to those writing subtitles, but that's an old complaint.  Listing common contractions in a book is a good thing for increasing a learner's passive vocabulary and comprehension but they should be clearly labeled as "Do not use these yourself"


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## Loob

homotopy07 said:


> Thanks, Loob.   I am not going to copy it. I am currently trying to 'understand' something like these:
> 
> _Whassamadder?
> Whaddaya say
> Zat a pen?_


All of those are fine, as representations of how people actually pronounce those sentences.
I still think *ai mə nə *is decidedly odd as a representation of how people say "I'm going to".


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## JulianStuart

Loob said:


> All of those are fine, as representations of how people actually pronounce those sentences.
> I still think *ai mə nə *is decidedly odd as a representation of how people say "I'm going to".


Please believe me it is not uncommon in casual informal AE......


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## Loob

OK, Julian - I believe you!


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## tunaafi

JulianStuart said:


> Please believe me it is not uncommon in casual informal AE......


.... or casual informal BrE, especially among younger speakers.


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## homotopy07

alexl57 said:


> There's a video from Rachel's English explaining it nicely. Look it up.


Thanks, alexl57.  



Loob said:


> All of those are fine, as representations of how people actually pronounce those sentences.


Thanks, Loob.


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## srk

Loob said:


> I still think *ai mə nə *is decidedly odd as a representation of how people say "I'm going to".


I don't know anyone who would fail to understand it.  I just tried it on my wife with "I'm'n'a {slightly unlikely choice of activity}," and she replied "Really!" without batting an eye.


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## Loob

I wouldn't fail to understand it.
But I wouldn't say it.


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## london calling

Loob said:


> I wouldn't fail to understand it.
> But I wouldn't say it.


That's what I  meant above.


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## kentix

PaulQ said:


> I see this as "general American English" casually but quickly spoken - I tried it out on my son and wife, and neither saw anything to remark upon. I then pointed out that there was no /g/ sound as might be expected, and both shrugged.




Definitely. It's not a regional dialect, it's just very casual, real-life pronunciation you _could_ encounter anywhere among American English speakers.

_I'm-(g)un-a-go-to-bed-now. Good night._



JulianStuart said:


> Please believe me it is not uncommon in casual informal AE......




Of course, not everyone would say it but I can easily imagine my mother saying it, for instance. So it's not necessarily a "young person" thing. My mother and father live four states away so I can't confirm it but it sounds plausible.

[I-munna go to bed now.]


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## Loob

Interesting.


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## kentix

I think the thought above, that's it's teaching you about things you _might_ hear, not things you _should_ say, is on target. No one is taught to say that and no one would write it that way, but it's definitely something you might hear among people speaking very casually to people they know. Just like "Whattaya mean?" (Where is the d sound? Or is it the t sound that is missing?)


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## Roxxxannne

kentix said:


> Definitely. It's not a regional dialect, it's just very casual, real-life pronunciation you _could_ encounter anywhere among American English speakers.
> 
> _I'm-(g)un-a-go-to-bed-now. Good night._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Of course, not everyone would say it but I can easily imagine my mother saying it, for instance. So it's not necessarily a "young person" thing. My mother and father live four states away so I can't confirm it but it sounds plausible.
> 
> [I-munna go to bed now.]


I'm not only a mother but a grandmother, and I'm sure I've said _I'm-(g)un-a- _many many times in my life.  I mainly use it when I want to say something like  'I'm (g)unna take out the compost.' or 'I'm gonna be back around 4:30.' It's a kind of future tense marker for an announcement where the crucial words are what comes after _'m-(g)un-a-._


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## kentix

longlegs said:


> One may even reduce it to just "Imma"


That's a whole additional level of reduction that I think is far, far less common.


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## Root of All Things

kentix said:


> That's a whole additional level of reduction that I think is far, far less common.


Memes aren't proper English, but I'd argue that the recent "ight imma head out" macro indicates that the reduction is _understood_ if not in use among youths. I far more often use */aɪ mə/ *followed by a verb phrase, than */ai mə nə/ *followed by the same.


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## kentix

All I'll say is that my mother would never say that one, I'm sure.  (And I wouldn't either.)


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## homotopy07

alexl57 said:


> a video from Rachel's English explaining it nicely


That's exactly what I need. I can't thank you enough, Alex. 

The I'M GONNA Reduction - Rachel's English


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## RM1(SS)

srk said:


> I'm quite sure I've said "I'm'n'a {verb}" at least a few times in my life.





JulianStuart said:


> Please believe me it is not uncommon in casual informal AE......


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