# عيسى روح الله



## brooke_len_21

I need a translation, but I don't have the sandscript, maybe someone could help me.

Isa ruhu-lah 'alaihis-salat was-salom
nastagh-firuka ya Hakam
Ya Dhal-Jalali wal-Ikram
Isa ruhu-lah 'alaihis-salat was'salam
ya Halim, ya Qahhar
ya Muntaqim, ya Ghaffar!
la Ilaha ilallahu, Allahu Akbar

Thank you.

*Moderator Note: Please give your threads informative and meaningful titles, so as to facilitate searches and location of threads.*


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## elroy

Welcome to the forum. 

My suggestion:

_Isa (is?) the Spirit of God, on him be (a) prayer (of blessing) and peace.
We ask for forgiveness, O Judge
Who art full of glory and honor.
Isa (is?) the Spirit of God, on him be (a) prayer (of blessing) and peace.
O Patient, O Conquerer,
O Avenger, O Forgiver.
There is no god but God, God is the greatest*._
____

*The Arabic literally means "God is greater" but the assumed meaning is "God is the greatest."


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## linguist786

حليم/حليما = forbearing
(Urdu - برداشت كرنے والا/والى)


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## elroy

linguist786 said:


> حليم/حليمة = forbearing


 "Forbearing" is a synonym of "patient."  Either would work as a translation here.


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## linguist786

Yes, absolutely. I just thought I'd mention it since that's the first word that came to my head when I saw "7aliim" 

Thanks for the correction too!


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## brooke_len_21

Thank you very much, you are all very knowlegable, and I am appriciative.


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## somethingisnttaken

The Arabic line spoken throughout the song translates to

Jesus Christ, peace, we pray, be upon you
(”alayhi wasalaam” meaning “peace be upon him” a formality when speaking the name of Jesus. “salat” meaning a prayer)

In the last paragraph, wherever there’s a capitol O or The, it’s one of the names for God.  There are 99 such names written in the Qur'an

we ask for Your forgiveness, O Judge
O Lord of Majesty and Generosity
Jesus Christ, peace, we pray, be upon you
The Patient One, The All Compelling Subduer
The Avenger, The Ever Forgiving
there is nothing worthy of worship except God, God is the greatest!


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## elroy

Welcome to the forums. 

"Isa" (or "Issa") is the Islamic name for Jesus Christ.  The translation of Jesus Christ is يسوع المسيح.  That's why I left "Isa" untranslated.


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## mansio

Elroy

Btw, I have always wondered where the Muslim name 3iisaa of Jesus comes from.

It is built on a 3-s-y root whereas the original Hebrew name Yeshu3a is a compound between an abbreviation for God "Ye-" and a verb meaning to save (whose root is y-sh-3).

The two names have the same components in their root but the 3ayn is last in the Hebrew name and first in the Muslim name.

It may be a case of metathesis (modification in the order of phonemes in a word).


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## cherine

mansio said:


> I have always wondered where the Muslim name 3iisaa of Jesus comes from.
> 
> It is built on a 3-s-y root whereas the original Hebrew name Yeshu3a is a compound between an abbreviation for God "Ye-" and a verb meaning to save (whose root is y-sh-3).


I wouldn't say that 3iisa is build on a three-letters root, because it's not an Arabic name. Same as Yusuf يوسف (Joseph), Ibrahim إبراهيم (Abraham)....
By the way, the Arabic Christian name of Jesus is Yasuu3 يسوع so it's closer to the Hebrew one.


> The two names have the same components in their root but the 3ayn is last in the Hebrew name and first in the Muslim name.
> 
> It may be a case of metathesis (modification in the order of phonemes in a word).


It could very well be the case.
There's a thread in the Hebrew forum about the name Joshua, which is another form of Jesus. Most important, concerning your question, is post 16.


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## mansio

Thanks Chérine.

Post 16 in your link does not deal with Muslim Arabic 3iisaa but with the Aramaic name, which has the same root as the Hebrew one but with different vowels.


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## Abu Bishr

Hi Guys

The following I found in the 30 volume Tafsiir by the famous Morrocon Quranic Exegete, Ibn 'Aashuur on the Arabic word ('Iisaa):

وعيسى اسم معرب من يشوع أو يسوع وهو اسم عيسى ابن مريم قلبوه في تعريبه قلبا مكانيا ليجري على وزن خفيف كراهية اجتماع ثقل العجمة وثقل ترتيب حروف الكلمة فإن حرفي علة في الكلمة وشينا والختم بحرف حلق لا يجري هذا التنظيم على طبيعة ترتيب الحروف مع التنفس عند النطق بها فقدموا العين لأنها حلقية فهي مبدأ النطق ثم حركوا حروفه بحركات متناسبة وجعلوا شينه المعجمة الثقيلة سينا مهملة ...​
This my translation of the passage:

["Iisaa" is a name arabacized from "Yashuu'" or "Yasuu'", and is the name of Jesus ('Iisaa), the son of Mary. They (i.e. the Arabs) performed a metathesis (switching two consonants around), so that it occurs on an easy / light pattern due to the fact that they disliked the union (coming together) of the heaviness (difficulty) resulting from foreign (words) and the heaviness resulting from the order of the letters in the word. This is the case because two weak letters in a word as well as a Shiin and ending with a pharyngeal / guttural (on top of it), this system / arrangement does not occur to the natural order of the letters whilst taking a normal breath at the time of pronouncing them (at least not for the Arabs then), so they placed the "'Ayn" before (the Yaa' / Yod) because it is pharyngeal, such that it sits at the start of pronunciation. Then they vowelled the letters with appropriate and suitable vowels, and made its heavy dotted Shiin into an undotted Siin ...]


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## elroy

On a more pragmatic level, I would leave عيسى untranslated in this context to clearly show that He is being addressed by a Moslem as a prophet, and not by a Christian as Jesus *Christ*.  We Christians do not call him عيسى, and as far as I know Moslems do not call him "Jesus *Christ*" (يسوع المسيح).


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## mansio

Abu Bishr

I read in a German article on Islam that the linguistic origin of 3iisaa was not known, and I knew that the only similar name in the Bible was that of Esau, 3esav (or 3esaw) in Hebrew, which has nothing to do with Jesus.

So I thought that it could just be a case of metathesis, although consonantal skeletons of Semitic words are very strong.

The explanation you give from a Moroccan scholar confirms the metathesis, but I find it hard to believe his theory that Arabs had a problem with pronouncing an 3ayn at the end of a word.
I don't think that Christian Arabs have a problem pronouncing Yasuu3.
Besides all those Hebrew names in the Quran cannot be considered as "foreign" names as they are Semitic too and can easily be arabized.


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## Abu Rashid

> We Christians do not call him عيسى, and as far as I know Moslems do not call him "Jesus *Christ*" (يسوع المسيح)


I think if you look at older Arabic Christian texts you'll find they did use the form 3esa. It's only in recent times, largely since the fall of the Ottoman Caliphate and the introduction of the missionary movements into the Arabic lands with large Christian populations (simultaneous actions which occured in an orchestrated fashion) that Arab Christians started to reject the name 3esa as being "Islamic" and re-transliterating direct from Hebrew. If you think about it, when Muhammad (saw) delivered his message to the Arabs in Arabia, there were Christians and Jews amongst them, and his use of the form 3esa was obviously addressed to them. If they weren't using the form 3esa then his message wouldn't have really been understood by them, but it was. For instance the cousin of Khadijah (ra) who was a Christian was well aware what Muhammad (saw) was talking about. So this is a rather recent movement by Arab Christians to detach themselves from the Muslims.

As for the title al-Masee7 it is used in the Qur'an and ALL Muslims recognise 3esa as al-Masee7 (or Jesus *Christ*) without exception.


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## elroy

I am not aware of the historical developments - and frankly, I'm not interested in speculation - but the fact remains that today we do not call Him عيسى, whatever the reason may be.

Thanks for the info about المسيح.


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## Malki92

Abu Rashid said:


> I think if you look at older Arabic Christian texts you'll find they did use the form 3esa. It's only in recent times, largely since the fall of the Ottoman Caliphate and the introduction of the missionary movements into the Arabic lands with large Christian populations (simultaneous actions which occured in an orchestrated fashion) that Arab Christians started to reject the name 3esa as being "Islamic" and re-transliterating direct from Hebrew



With all due respect, this is not based on a shred of historic evidence. The oldest manuscripts we have of the Bible in Arabic come from around the 9th century AD (we know this because in the actual manuscripts, for example in Arabic 151, the colophon reads that it was copied "... in the year 272 of the years of the Arabs." and Vatican Arabic MS 71, the colophon reads "... Of the year 272.") We have an 11th century translation of the Diatessaron into Arabic as well. You won't find the name عيسى anywhere in these Arabic-Christian Bibles. This is all before the Ottoman Empire even existed! 

So, how is it that pre-fall/before the creation of the Ottoman Empire Arabic-speaking Christians all used the same name يسوع, without the aid of these so-called missionary movements with ill intents? I must say that this view can only be held with and alongside an incredible ignorance of Christian history in the Middle East.

We have so much Christian literature written in Arabic, translated works from Greek and Syriac into Arabic and etc, all before the fall of the Ottoman Empire and what you're saying is just not true at all.


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## fdb

Abu Rashid said:


> I think if you look at older Arabic Christian texts you'll find they did use the form 3esa. It's only in recent times, largely since the fall of the Ottoman Caliphate and the introduction of the missionary movements into the Arabic lands with large Christian populations (simultaneous actions which occured in an orchestrated fashion) that Arab Christians started to reject the name 3esa as being "Islamic" and re-transliterating direct from Hebrew.


This is completely wrong.

Edit: overlap with Malki's excellent comment.


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