# Evolution of Latin prefix CIRCVM-



## Testing1234567

Did the Latin prefix CIRCVM- survive in any Romance languages by inheritance? The learned borrowings (e.g. Latin CIRCVMVENĪRE > French *circonvenir*) do not count. I'd also be interested if it was borrowed into Proto-Germanic.


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## irinet

Hi,
There are 'circumscris' (in Math), 'circumcizie' (in Medicine), 'circumferința' (of the circle), 'circumvoluție', 'circumscripție' (Police quarter), 'circumspect' (it's an adjective, meaning 'suspicious') in Romanian.


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## ahvalj

There is a number of verbs that have an aspect of early loans or relatinizations of the inherited lexemes (only the first _i_ tells that they are not directly inherited):

_circumcīdere > _French _circoncire_
_circumdūcere_ > Italian _circondurre_
_circumflectere_ > Italian _circonflettere_
_circumscrībere > _French _circonscrire,_ Italian _circoscrivere_
_circumvenīre > _French_ circonvenir, _Italian _circonvenire_
For the fate of pure loans compare _circumnāvigāre_ > French _circumnaviguer,_ Italian _circumnavigare._


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## Testing1234567

irinet, ahvalj, thank you for your input. I am mainly interested in *directly inherited* words though.


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## ahvalj

For the words in my list one can't say whether they had been lost and reacquired at some early period or inherited but corrected after the Latin prototypes. The inherited prefix should have looked like **_cercon-_ in Italian, French, Spanish and Portuguese: it is absent in the standard languages as far as I can tell, but perhaps dialects could have preserved occasional non-relatinized forms like _**cercondurre._


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## Testing1234567

It might as well have been shortened to something like _*ceron-_ or even _*cen-_, being in the pretonic position. Just my two cents.


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## robbie_SWE

None that I am aware of. 

However, there is a word in Romanian - *ciorchine *("cluster, raceme") _> _possibly from Latin *_circulina _- which seems to indicate that words inherited from Latin CIRCVM- underwent drastic morphological changes. 
If this presumed etymology is correct, it only goes to show that the prefix wasn't viable enough to survive in most Romance languages.


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## Nino83

The only common word is _circondare_ (sorround, encircle, enclose).
The other ones seem to be more literary.


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## Testing1234567

robbie_SWE said:


> However, there is a word in Romanian - *ciorchine *("cluster, raceme") _> _possibly from Latin *_circulina_


Any idea where the "o" is from?


Nino83 said:


> The only common word is _circondare_ (sorround, encircle, enclose).


This seems borrowed to me.


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## robbie_SWE

Testing1234567 said:


> Any idea where the "o" is from?



Well, the other hypothesis is that the term, with variants *ciorchin *and *ciorchină*, is in fact derived from *cioc* ("beak", of imitative origin) + suffix *-ină*, with _r_ as an infix.
Both theories are more or less plausible (I personally have a hard time adhering to the _cioc _theory), but with that said the 'o' in _cioc _might have influenced a primative derivative of Latin *_circulina_.

The sudden appearance of mysterious vowels is not that uncommon in Romanian - for instance a structurally similar word from a completely different source is *ciur* ("sieve, sifter, strainer"), from Latin _*cibrum,_ Vulgar form of _cribrum._


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## Testing1234567

My hypothesis is that the extra vowel in both *ciorchine* and *ciur* is inserted in order to help pronounce the *r*, but I made it up just now.


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## aum34

Spanish:

CIRCVM > Circun

Circunscribir-> Circunscrito
Circundar
Circuncidar -> Circunciso / Circuncisión
Circunnavegar
Circunferencia
Circunstancia / Circunstancial
Circunspecto
Circunvalación


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## Testing1234567

@aum34 Thanks for your contribution. However, I believe that your examples are examples of borrowing instead of examples of inheritence, since Spanish was largely influenced by Latin (i.e. Relatinization).


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## Testing1234567

robbie_SWE said:


> a structurally similar word from a completely different source is *ciur* ("sieve, sifter, strainer"), from Latin _*cibrum,_ Vulgar form of _cribrum._


On second thought, the *u* should be from lenition of *b*.


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## aum34

Testing1234567 said:


> @aum34 Thanks for your contribution. However, I believe that your examples are examples of borrowing instead of examples of inheritence, since Spanish was largely influenced by Latin (i.e. Relatinization).



CIRCVM and CIRCA itself gave in Spanish:

-CERCA which means near:  La casa de mi amigo está cerca / My friend's house is close.
-ACERCA (from lat. AD CIRCA) which means About /concerning / regarding
-ACERCAR (verb) to get closer
-DE CERCA: closely

*Latin*
*Etymology*
A later form for _circum_, or from _circum_ + _eā_.

*Adverb*
*circā*

around; about
*Preposition*
*circa* + accusative case

around; near; about
regarding, concerning


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## danielstan

Romanian _*ciorchine *_seems speculative to come from a reconstructed Latin *_circulina _(which implies another reconstruction: **_circlina_).
I noticed some Romanian dictionaries do propose this etymology, but the most reliable (DEX) concludes: "et. nec." (= "etimologie necunoscută" = unknown etymology):
dexonline

Let's see what normally would have been derived from this Lat. *_circulina _(> Lat **_circlina_).
Short answer:
Lat. **_circlina _> Rom. *_cerchină  _(fem.)

Other Romanian words inherited from Latin related words (use dexonline.ro for etymologies):
Rom. _cerc _< Lat. _circus_
Rom. _a cerca_ < Lat. _circare _(see also: It. _cercare_, Fr. _chercher_, Provensal _cercar _etc.)
Rom._ a cerceta_ < Lat. _circitare_

Other proposed etymologies ("_cioc_" + suffix _ină _+ an accidental "r" for _cioc > *ciorc_ like in other Romanian words) - seem even more speculative, as they don't have cognates in other Romance languages and seem to be rare phonetic accidents during word evolution, while the change in semantic from _cioc _to _ciorchine _is huge.

I noticed one proposed etymology for Rom. _*ciorchine *_notes the Italian cognat _*ciocca*_, but Italian etymological dictionary gives a non-Latin etymology for it: Etimologia : ciocca;


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