# "Tej", gwara Poznańska



## dreamlike

Od niedawna mieszkam w Poznaniu i zdążyłem trochę poznać tutejszą gwarę. Najbardziej zainteresowało mnie wtrącane, zazwyczaj na koniec zdania, słowo "tej". Jest to jak pewnie wiecie forma zwracania się do drugiej osoby.

"No co robisz, tej?" ("tej" bardzo zaciągane)
"Gdzie idziesz, tej?" ("tej" bardzo zaciągane) 

Przyznam, że wydaje mi się to trochę pretensjonalne i niegrzeczne, jakby nasz rozmówca się na nas obrażał. Oczywiście Poznaniakom weszło to po prostu w nawyk, i nic takiego nie mają na myśli, chyba że kontekst wskazuje inaczej. Pomimo tego, że zdaję sobie z tego sprawę, cały czas odnoszę takie wrażenie. 

A Wy co o tym sądzicie?


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## LilianaB

Co to ma znaczyć -- ty (you), or tyj (tea)? Co robisz, ty? Tak? (w gwarze)


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## dreamlike

Tak, to znaczy tyle co "ty", chociaż może przybiera też inne znaczenia. 
Umieszczają to najczęściej na końcu zdania, i jak to usłyszałem pierwszy raz to nie miało dla mnie zupełnie sensu.


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## LilianaB

They have something like that in Silesia, but usually at the beginning of the sentence. "Te, pódź sam.", Te, co tam robiysz? It must be the same usage although, a different pronunciation. (come here, what are you doing there).


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## dreamlike

I'd be more inclined to think that "Te" and "Tej"  are two distinct words that may mean the same thing.


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## LilianaB

Ok. Whatever you want. They both mean "you".


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## BezierCurve

http://www.poznan.pl/mim/slownik/words.html?co=word&word=tej

Czyli jest to "ty", ale w wołaczu.


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## dreamlike

A czy ktoś z Poznania (chyba ktoś jest na forum) mógłby rzucić trochę światła na to w jakich kontekstach najczęściej jest to używane?
Czy wyraża zdenerwowanie?


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## Thawt

nie oznacza samo w sobie zdenerwowania to po prostu zawołanie coś jak Oi Mate in BE ale rzeczywiście raczej bywa używane kiedy komuś sie zwraca na coś uwagę, np. tej co ty tam robisz


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## LilianaB

Hi. Is it full _tej_, or just more like te (bordering on y -- it is really hard to describe it).


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## dreamlike

No, it's simply "tej", althogh they say it in a rather distinctive way. If you haven't heard of it, it's no wonder - it's rather a recent thing.


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## ryba

Hi.





dreamlike said:


> No, it's simply "tej", althogh they say it in a rather distinctive way. If you haven't heard of it, it's no wonder - it's rather a recent thing.


It may be new to you, but it does not mean it's a recent thing.  I'd say its use covers (at least part of) the semantic areas of (General Polish) _hej_ and _ej_ (the latter being typical of the conversational language of shoolkids, at least in my part of Wielkopolska: Turek). It does not intrinsically convey irritation or impatience, why would it? It obviously can, as in  "O chuj ci chodzi, tej?" (the verb getting the prosodic stress, a stress pattern typical of questions in big part of Wielkopolska), depending on the context, but its basic role is emphatic and phatic.


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## dreamlike

Hi Ryba, thanks for your insight.

I might have gone a tad too far saying that it's a recent thing (but at the sime time I think there's no telling as to how far does it actually date back). I've been living in Poznań long enough to know that it doesn't not necessarily convey irritation with the speaker, but that was simply the first impression I got. There was no need for you to quote Wikipedia, I'm perfectly familiar with the defitinition of phatic expression.


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## wolfbm1

It's the first time I've heard about the word "tej" and it's emphatic use in Poznań. Wikisłownik says that it is a form of "ty". http://pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/tej


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## LilianaB

ryba said:


> Hi.
> It may be new to you, but it does not mean it's a recent thing.  I'd say its use covers (at least part of) the semantic areas of (General Polish) _hej_ and _ej_ (the latter being typical of the conversational language of shoolkids, at least in my part of Wielkopolska: Turek). It does not intrinsically convey irritation or impatience, why would it? It obviously can, as in  "O chuj ci chodzi, tej?" (the verb getting the prosodic stress, a stress pattern typical of questions in big part of Wielkopolska), depending on the context, but its basic role is emphatic and phatic.



I don't think so. I would agree that it is the same as _Te (you)_ in Silesian that has nothing to do with _hej_ and _ej_. Poznanian dialect and Silesian have a lot in common.  _Hey *you*_, sort of. (contracted to _you_) The repetition of _you_ may be an influence from Germanic languages -- I am pretty sure something similar is done in some Germanic languages. It migtht be worth investigating.


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## ryba

LilianaB said:


> I don't think so. I would agree that it is the same as _Te (you)_ in Silesian that has nothing to do with _hej_ and _ej_. Poznanian dialect and Silesian have a lot in common.  _Hey *you*_, sort of. (contracted to _you_) The repetition of _you_ may be an influence from Germanic languages -- I am pretty sure something similar is done in some Germanic languages. It migtht be worth investigating.


You don't think what? In no place did I challenge any previous statement on the word's etymology and its congnate status with regard to the Silesian _te_. I can even add that I've heard the final _-j_ in _tej_ is just the effect of an adjustment of an original [te:] (which is said to be still alive in certain areas around Poznań) to the General Polish rules of pronunciation. I only referred to semantics and pragmatics. Note that the original question was about use rather than etymology.


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## LilianaB

It does not come from _hej_ or _ej_.  This was my first impression -- that this was what you were claiming. Ok. Then you just believe that the j is a result of the adjustment to some Polish expressions similar to "hej" and"ej" Possible.


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## Ben Jamin

dreamlike said:


> Hi Ryba, thanks for your insight.
> 
> I might have gone a tad too far saying that it's a recent thing (but at the sime time I think there's no telling as to how far does it actually date back). I've been living in Poznań long enough to know that it doesn't not necessarily convey irritation with the speaker, but that was simply the first impression I got. There was no need for you to quote Wikipedia, I'm perfectly familiar with the defitinition of phatic expression.



But not all the readers do.


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## Ben Jamin

LilianaB said:


> It does not come from _hej_ or _ej_.  This was my first impression -- that this was what you were claiming. Ok. Then you just believe that the j is a result of the adjustment to some Polish expressions similar to "hej" and"ej" Possible.



How do you know the origin? Any sources?


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## dreamlike

Please, would you mind stop derailing my thread? As Ryba has rightly pointed out, my question aimed at finding more about the use of the word, not its etymology, which is of completely no interest to me -- and I don't want it to lead to yet another heated discussion on this forum....


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## LilianaB

Ben Jamin said:


> How do you know the origin? Any sources?



Professional intuition. Unfortunately there are not too many dictionaries related to Silesian, and some other dialects.I wish there were, so everything could be scientifically proven; unless you know of any (related to Silesian and the Poznanian dialect).

We can continue the dictionary discussion in a different thread -- not to derail Dreamlike's discussion.


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## dreamlike

Going back to the topic -- in my experience, "tej" is very likely, but not not limited to, to be used by low-lifes.
 Every other time I'm strolling around Poznań, smoking a cigarette, some dodgy people tend to ask me _"Tej, masz ćmika?"_ -- _"Hey you, do you have a cigarette?".
_
Also, it might prove extremely difficult for a person who normally lives outside Poznań to pronounce it - they utter it in a very distinctive way. I've been told by Poznaniaks that it sounds funny coming from someone from outside Poznań, someone trying hard to mimic them


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## marco_2

It's because of their rising-falling intonation at the end of almost every sentence. And, according to the book _Mowa mieszkańców Poznania _by M.Gruchmanowa, M.Witaszek-Samborska and M.Żak-Święcicka _/.../ Częstą formą jest także *tej, *czyli ogólnopolskie *ty, *używane w funkcji wołacza. Przyczyną tej cechy jest wielkopolska właściwość, polegająca na dodawaniu *j *do samogłoski *y, *na przykład: *małyj, białyj, dołyj, trawyj *(mały, biały, doły, trawy)." _I have to add that the form *te *was /is widespread not only in Silesia, but also in Central Poland, e.g. in Warsaw *(Te, koleś!) *in pre-war times.


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## dreamlike

marco_2 said:


> It's because of their rising-falling intonation at the end of almost every sentence.p


Yes, that would probably account for it.


marco_2 said:


> I have to add that the form *te *was /is widespread not only in Silesia, but also in Central Poland, e.g. in Warsaw *(Te, koleś!) *in pre-war times.


It might have made its way to the Polish language then, but I think it's alive up until this day, althouth most of the people would most likely say "Ej!".


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## vatrelin

LilianaB said:


> They have something like that in Silesia, but usually at the beginning of the sentence. "Te, pódź sam.", Te, co tam robiysz? It must be the same usage although, a different pronunciation. (come here, what are you doing there).


Well it's not like that. I live in Silesia and we don't talk to each  other "te,...." becouse it's very rude and unpleasant. Of course there  are people who say that, but ... you don't want to talk with these  people  I heard so many times this answer when someone say "te" - "na TE na tramwaj staje".


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## dreamlike

vatrelin said:


> [...] "na TE na tramwaj staje".


We tend to say the same thing here where I (normally) live, in Lublin voivodeship


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## vatrelin

A może drodzy Rodacy porozmawiamy tutaj po polsku? Nie żeby tytuł do czegoś zobowiązywał ;P podejrzewam, że sporo osób uczących się polskiego chętnie poczyta nasze komentarze w oryginalnym wydaniu.


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## dreamlike

Jak najbardziej. Podejrzewam tylko, że temat został wyczerpany


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