# Before I say this to him



## FlyingBird

Before i say this to him,i need to be sure that he won't be mad.


How would you translate this text,would this below be correct?

*Ona merhaba diyorum önce,o kızgın olmayacak benim emin olmam lazım*


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## schimdi

"Bunu ona söylemeden önce, kızmayacağından emin olmam lazım."


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## FlyingBird

schimdi said:


> "Bunu ona söylemeden önce, kızmayacağından emin olmam lazım."


i don't get word 'söylemeden'

İ know 'söylemek' mean 'to tell' but why do you put 'den/dan' suffixes in such case and remove last word 'k'?

İ know den/dan mean 'from' 

And also how would you say 'after he say' if 'söylemeden' mean after i say?

What suffixes did you add?


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## schimdi

You can decompose it as "söyle-me-den"

-me/-ma
söyle-mek = to say
söyle-me = saying (so basically the suffixes -me/-ma convert a verb into a noun)

Some examples:
yürümek - yürüme 
yürüme mesafesi = walking distance

oturmak - oturma
oturma pozisyonu = sitting position

-den/-dan = from
Like we would use in
ev-den = from the house
akşam-dan = from the evening

-den/-dan önce = before
akşam-dan önce = before the evening
gelme-den önce = before coming
uyuma-dan önce = before sleeping

Therefore,
söyle-me-den önce = before saying


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## Rallino

I don't agree with it being a noun. If it were a noun, then the -den would be stressed, but it's not the case.

söyle*me* : saying (noun form)
söy*le*me : don't say (negative imperative)
_
Söylemeden _has the stress on the "le" syllable: söy*le*meden, which suggests that it's actually in negative form.
In the end, it doesn't really matter, though. _X-meden_ means before X-ing.


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## schimdi

Rallino said:


> I don't agree with it being a noun. If it were a noun, then the -den would be stressed, but it's not the case.
> 
> söyle*me* : saying (noun form)
> söy*le*me : don't say (negative imperative)
> _
> Söylemeden _has the stress on the "le" syllable: söy*le*meden, which suggests that it's actually in negative form.
> In the end, it doesn't really matter, though. _X-meden_ means before X-ing.



I agree that the intonation is misleading. However, within the context of this sentence, there is no need for this verb to have a negative meaning. The action of "saying" has not taken place yet. 
The suffixes -me,-ma can be found on the "Suffixes that make nouns out of verbs" list. 

http://tr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yapım_eki


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## FlyingBird

How would you say 'before he say it to him/her'?


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## schimdi

You begin the sentence in the same way because the first part of the sentence has nothing to do with the subject I/you/he/she/we/you/they..... 
"Bunu ona söylemeden önce" = before saying this to him/her

...but the second part changes according to the subject:
...kızmayacağından emin olma*sı* lazım. = ...*he* needs to be sure that he/she won't be mad.


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## Reverence

schimdi said:


> ...kızmayacağından emin olma*sı* lazım. = ...he needs to be sure that *he/she* won't be mad.



Rather, "...*he *needs to be sure that he/she won't be mad."


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## schimdi

Reverence said:


> Rather, "...*he *needs to be sure that he/she won't be mad."



Agree, thank you. I edited the post accordingly.


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## Muttaki

To me when saying söylemeden it sounds like the part 'me' has to do with negativeness. It is like söylemek has "not" been done yet. And "-meden/-madan" is another suffix. -meden/-madan turns a verb into an adverb giving negative meaning. Bilmeden = without/before knowing
Gitmeden = without/before going

I am sure that 'me' part in -meden comes to give that negative meaning. It is not the other suffix that makes the verb a noun.


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## FlyingBird

can somebody please explain the word 'kızmayacağından' all suffixes you added to this word?

Öncelikle cevabınız için teşekkür ediyorum şimdi yeni cevabı bekliyorum


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## Muttaki

kız-ma-y-aca(k)-ın-dan
kız- = to be angry or to get mad (it is actually kızmak, '-mak' makes it an infinitive; when adding a suffix to the verb, i.e. kız-, you take the suffix off, you know this probably)
ma- = not (this is privative)
y- = this letter has no meaning, it is just to make the word a reasonable Turkish one 
acak- = this is future tense suffix, but after this if there is a vowel last letter 'k' becomes 'ğ' by magic ; you should know this it is important. (another example would be ağaç and ağacı, in this case 'ç' becomes 'c'; the rule for this is very simple, I can tell if you don't know yet)
ın- = this is the most challenging part I think. I can't be sure exactly but my guess is that it is possessive suffix. It tells that s/he or you won't get mad.
dan- = of or because, it depends on the meaning (if you say "Onun bana kızmayacağından emin olmak istedim / I wanted to be sure that s/he won't get angry at me", if we can think of "to be sure" in this sentence as "to be sure of something", then "of" in English corresponds to "-dan" in Turkish. But you can also say "Babam bana sabah kızmayacağından, gece rahat uyuyabileceğim/Because my father won't get angry at me in the morning, I will be able to sleep this night in peace". This time "-dan" comes to mean "because".

It might look complex but when you see similar examples of similar suffix you will surely get to understand all this easily.


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## Reverence

Muttaki said:


> kız-ma-y-aca(k)-ın-dan
> 
> ın- = this is the most challenging part I think. I can't be sure exactly but my guess is that it is possessive suffix. It tells that s/he or you won't get mad.



It's -ı (definition suffix which is added to the determined part in a noun clause) plus -n (buffer).


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## Muttaki

Reverence said:


> It's -ı (definition suffix which is added to the determined part in a noun clause) plus -n (buffer).



Yeah, this makes more sense.


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