# bribes / refrescos / propinas / muñecas / ?



## capaul1977

In your country:

When a police officer asks for money in order for him to not give a ticket for breaking a law: 

What is this transaction called in your country? 
What are some appropriate responses which will *not* get the driver into trouble? 
How are police officers who do this generally viewed? 
How are people who pay the police officer generally viewed? 
How would the answers to these questions change if one is stopped at a police checkpoint and simply asked for money?


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## SDLX Master

Soborno (bribe)
OK, but this is all I have.
Corrupted.
Irresponsible and corruptible.


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## curlyboy20

To add to SDLX Master's response:

1) We also call it a "coima" (KOH-ee-mah").
2) I'm not sure here. I've never bribed a cop or been with someone who has. 
3) Very corrupted. Criminals with a badge.
4) Irresponsible.

Male police officers in this country tend to be more corrupted than their female counterpart. I don't know what the reason behind it is.


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## HUMBERT0

What is this transaction called in your country? 
Soborno, colloquially mordida "a bite"
 
What are some appropriate responses which will *not* get the driver into trouble? 
I don't know, when I got stopped I just tried to explain to the officer that I wasn't going that much over the limit considering that it was driving downhill and other cars drove past us much faster... hoping to get a warning, but I accepted the ticket, thought I think he wanted money because he kept repeating that it was a steep fine... but I think bribing is corruption, and I did had to pay a hefty fine...
 
How are police officers who do this generally viewed? 
Corrupt
 
How are people who pay the police officer generally viewed? 
By me... corrupt, they enable corruption and are them self corrupt, with no sense of responsibility to a community "they are not playing by the rules". 
People at large, I think rationalize that behavior as inevitable... as in, why follow rules which are unjust or that many don't follow


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## capaul1977

Here were my personal experiences (which I did not want to corrupt the initial responses):

My family travelled to Honduras last year. As we pulled out of the San Pedro Sula airport in a rented truck we started to hear a strange noise from the engine. We pulled off the road, onto a sidewalk, and lifted the hood to check. A truck with several police stopped and one of the officers wanted to give us a ticket for parking on the sidewalk. I explained the problem, but he still seemed to want to give us a ticket. We argued for several minutes, and they finally told me they would take $5.00US to forget the matter. I did not know whether I had actually broken any laws and I did not know what would happen if we got the ticket, or even how or where to pay a ticket. I chose to pay him.

Later in the week we were later stopped at a police check point and simply asked for money. With the encouragement of a local friend I said I could not pay and they allowed me to continue. 

I was not in Honduras to change the culture or to teach the Honduran police department moral lessons. I had work to do and a family to keep safe. Not knowing the level of corruption of individuals, I am hesitant to push issues. Honduran police have in recent years looted passengers of an airliner which crashed in the capital city, and kidnapped a prominent businessman for ransom. 

Does this change your initial perception? What would you have done differently(realistically)? As my family will be travelling to various Latin American countries in the future, how might we do things differently?


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## HUMBERT0

Yes it does...
We are talking about two different things; my response was about an everyday situation in which people try to dodge a fine and a corrupt cop exploiting a situation to mutually benefit by doing something outside de law. What you’re referring to is extortion, in which case you can’t do much about especially if you’re a foreigner, it’s a difficult situation even for a citizen of a country… its worst if you’re perceived as an outsider in places where this kind of practices are a common occurrence, because you don’t have the same rights, you do know your rights, you don’t know the repercussions of doing or not doing something, etc.

My advice try not to look like a foreigner, research beforehand how things are run so you’ll know what you will be up against, and try to keep safe and if that means bribing so be it, you can’t change the system of a community, always travel with locals especially when traveling away from the more larger cities…

I've seen foreigners get sucked in into legal technicalities and people taking advantage of their situation, though extortions happens to locals to…


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## mirx

HUMBERT0 said:


> I've seen foreigners get sucked in into legal technicalities and people taking advantage of their situation, though extortions _*happens to locals to*_…



It totally does. In México the cops know immediately when someone is from a different state by looking at the plates, because traffic laws may change between state and state, tourists sometimes don't know if they have breached any rules and so become an easy target for cops, who a lot of the time will extort them.


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## Grop

I really don't think it happens in France; that would be called _faire du racket_ or _racketter_ (this word was loaned from English).

Also, if you suggested giving money to the cops without their asking, there is a serious risk they could feel insulted.

Edit: Oh, of course it would get you into trouble, because bribing the cops is illegal.


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## federicoft

Grop said:


> Also, if you suggested giving money to the cops without their asking, there is a serious risk they could feel insulted.



I rather think there is a serious risk they could arrest you.

It is called _corruzione_ in Italian Law if someone tries to bribe a police officer and _concussione_ if the police officer exact fees to someone. Anyway I don't think it happens here either, at least at such low levels.


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## JamesM

I would be completely surprised if a police officer asked me for money to forget a ticket. I would also expect to be charged with attempting to bribe an officer (along with getting the ticket) if I offered money. I suppose it's possible that it might happen on some rare occasion (never say "never"  ) , but I have never heard of it happening to any of my friends or family. Any officer who did such a thing would be considered corrupt and "dirty" and soon to be fired, if not arrested himself.

The offer to the officer would be called a "bribe" and the demand by the officer would be called "extortion."


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## curlyboy20

Bribing a cop in the USA is definetely not a good idea and, like JamesM said, it won't end up pretty. However, this isn't the case in Latin America and most third world countries, where the police can't be trusted because they're so corrrupted. 

It seems like the police officers in the States have a sense of pride in being cops and serving in the force. Maybe that's why they don't ask for/take bribes. This is not the case in Latin America, though.


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## sokol

> When a police officer asks for money in order for him to not give a ticket for breaking a law


 

What is this transaction called in your country? This never happens. Really - never: it is almost unthinkable that a cop would ask such a thing. Technically the thing is called *"Korruption"*, or more precisely "Bestechung" which however only could be used by the one receiving the advantage - thus, a driver is committing "Bestechung" if he offers a bribe, but a policemen is "korrupt" if he makes an offer to the driver to bribe him: even though this, technically, would be "Bestechung" there's a linguistic problem involved with usage of this noun.

What are some appropriate responses which will *not* get the driver into trouble? As it is highly unlikely that you will ever be in such a situation in Austria there are no appropriate responses. *If *however you happen to meet a police officer who suggests you bribe him then I think you are safe wether you take that offer or refuse it.

How are police officers who do this generally viewed? I think most Austrians think such police officers do not exist here.  (Our view of police officers generally is that they enjoy to write tickets.) But if you ask anyone on the street how they think of corrupt police officers I have little doubt that the vast majority would see them as criminals.

How are people who pay the police officer generally viewed? Again, difficult to say as I think this happens only on very rare occasions; still I do think that people who think they can pay off police officers are thought of lowly, or if they are V.I.P.'s then people still would think that it is unfair to do so and that they only could pull this off (the bribing of our police force) because they're V.I.P.'s.


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## ExMax

A nice questionnaire... 
OK... In Russia:
1. The Russian word for 'a bribe' is 'vziatka' (взятка). A couple dozen other words can be used as well 
2. The best response is, "Man, do you know that my uncle is your boss?" (if any, of course!) . Another one: "Officer, this amount is very high... Let's discuss the deal... " 
3. An extortioner. A blackmailer. A racketeer. 
'The Rank of Public Respect' for the traffic police ('GAI') is not low, but negative (i.e. 'below zero'). A common practice in our everyday life though...
4. A victim of extortion.

_In addition._ I cannot evaluate the accuracy of the absolute rank of Russia in all these "Global Lists of Corruption Indices" (2006 - 2.5 of 10, 2007 - 2.3 of 10, 2008 - 2.1 of 10), but the trend is estimated correctly, I think.


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## Revontuli

Ah, a wonderful thread.

This is how the police system works here in Turkey: If you don't want to get into trouble, you'll have to pay. The more you pay, the more you'll get appreciated. The officer will put the money in his pocket and say: "OK, now get away".

Or, let's say your mobile is stolen and you, naturally, go to the police station. They'll say: "Normally it's a long process to determine the identity of the robbers and to find your phone etc but we can make it much shorter for you...". So you just give some "reward" to encourage the officer. And it's needless to say they know who might have done it.

1. It's called "bribery"(in Turkish "rüşvet"). It's of course illegal but the most common way.

2. The best answer is to bribe the officer. No other word could save you.

3. They're of course corrupt but nobody takes action either. When you do that, you can easily be accused of condemning a police officer and will be punished. Besides, I'd be very surprised if I saw an honest police officer. And I must add it's the organisation that I least/never trust in my country.

4. At that moment you're just obliged to bribe. People hate it but also do it. Nobody blames you.


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## conar

JamesM said:


> I would be completely surprised if a police officer asked me for money to forget a ticket. I would also expect to be charged with attempting to bribe an officer (along with getting the ticket) if I offered money. I suppose it's possible that it might happen on some rare occasion (never say "never"  ) , but I have never heard of it happening to any of my friends or family. Any officer who did such a thing would be considered corrupt and "dirty" and soon to be fired, if not arrested himself.
> 
> The offer to the officer would be called a "bribe" and the demand by the officer would be called "extortion."


I'd say what James has written above would be an accurate description of the situation in the UK too.


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## Pedro y La Torre

In Ireland, it would be extremely rare for the above case to happen. I doubt any police officer (or gardaí as we call them) would risk their livelihood for a bribe which would be worth very little in the long run.

That being said, corruption is (or at least used to be) a big problem in this country, so the idea of police officers being bribed is not particularly shocking. It would have to be something bigger than a simple traffic stop however.


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## capaul1977

Pedro y La Torre,

You say "used to be".  Has something happenned in Ireland which has been effective in changing the situation?


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## elirlandes

[xxxxx]

I think that it is fair to say that the police force (Garda Síochána) are pretty clean, and there is certainly no bribing going on at a low level regarding traffic offences etc. I find that they are a little more leniant than in other countries - if you talk respectfully and in a friendly manner, they will try to give you the benefit of the doubt.

_[xxxxx]
_


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## ordira

What is this transaction called in your country? 
"mordida", "mochada", "ponerse la del Puebla"

What are some appropriate responses which will *not* get the driver into trouble? 
For speeding it might be "I gotta poop."  It has worked for many people.

How are police officers who do this generally viewed? 
Like dogs looking for a bone.  That's why everybody says they're always ready to bite.

How are people who pay the police officer generally viewed? 
Clever if they had the arguments to be out of the problem without paying a single penny.


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## PABLO DE SOTO

capaul1977 said:


> In your country:
> 
> 
> When a police officer asks for money in order for him to not give a ticket for breaking a law:






This situation you describe is very rare in Spain.
Most citizens have never experienced a situation like that.
Generally speaking, the Police is not corrupt in Spain.
The only cases I have read or heard are related to inmigration officers helping  mafias to get inmigrants or drugs into the country.
I am afraid that any Spaniard would be surprised if an officer asks for money to avoid a fine. We are not used to it and I believe almost no one would pay for that.


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## shawnee

Corruption is endemic in Australian police departments. However, it does not operate at the street level of crime or misdemeanor. I think the term 'graft' is also used in connection with illicit gain by abuse of privilege or office. There is a colloquial expression "to grease someone's palm," I'm not sure of the origin, perhaps money sticks to a greasy palm. One might initiate a bribe by asking "how much will it cost to make something go away." But I've only heard it in the movies.


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## Sepia

I have heard of a few cases in Germany where cops were convicted for this crime - I don't know anyone who was ever blackmailed by cops in any Western European country over the past 20 years.

I know that things were pretty bad in the US, and especially in New York earlier. Police department IADs and in New York, the Knapp Commission, took severe measures to curb this.

But I wonder how a US cop would go about this today if he wanted to blackmail a citizen - I mean, he's got a video camera running, when he pulls someone over. Can he switch that off, or is it running constantly? Delete it? Probably not, because then a perpetrator who had just shot him could just take the tape out and get rid of it somewhere.


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## JamesM

Sepia said:


> I know that things were pretty bad in the US, and especially in New York earlier. Police department IADs and in New York, the Knapp Commission, took severe measures to curb this.


 
To put this in perspective, the Knapp Commission's investigation was nearly forty years ago.  New York often has unique problems not shared by other parts of the country.  I would not generalize this to "things were pretty bad in the U.S."


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## cycloneviv

shawnee said:


> Corruption is endemic in Australian police departments.



I find that a bit of an extreme statement. I would have said that there was a degree of corruption in the Australian police force nationwide but there are definitely more problems in some states - Victoria (where shawnee is based) being one that is frequently in the news, with NSW not far behind. Of course, the Queensland police force had major corruption issues in years past.

I would not expect to be asked for money in order to get out of a speeding fine. If I were asked, I would report the officer immediately and would expect that they would be stood down.


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## shawnee

You're right cycloneviv my comment came out a bit stronger than intended. perhaps I should have said that there were elements of corruption ..............
Are you implying that WA is free of corruption?


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## tvdxer

JamesM said:


> I would be completely surprised if a police officer asked me for money to forget a ticket. I would also expect to be charged with attempting to bribe an officer (along with getting the ticket) if I offered money. I suppose it's possible that it might happen on some rare occasion (never say "never"  ) , but I have never heard of it happening to any of my friends or family. Any officer who did such a thing would be considered corrupt and "dirty" and soon to be fired, if not arrested himself.
> 
> The offer to the officer would be called a "bribe" and the demand by the officer would be called "extortion."



I agree.  Corruption in the form of bribes and "kickbacks" exists at higher levels, but I would be extremely surprised if an officer asked me to pay to get out of a speeding ticket (for example).  

Perhaps it's more an issue of how much officers are paid: in the U.S., police officers generally have good salaries, enough for a family to live at a decent standard (though perhaps a second income is required in many areas).  As far as I know, in many of the countries where bribing is common, police officers make barely enough to survive, if that.  I can't really say I would be outraged if a police officer, say, in Guatemala or Nicaragua pulled me over and asked me for $5 or $10.


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## cycloneviv

shawnee said:


> Are you implying that WA is free of corruption?



Not at all.  As I said, there is a degree of corruption nationwide, ranging from mild irregularities to distinctly dodgy behaviour. The WA police force has certainly had its problems in the past and is not "squeaky clean", but it is largely law abiding (!) nowadays. 

I'd be surprised if there was not _some_ corruption in police forces worldwide. I think Australia has a pretty good system, on average. My impression is that it has improved a fair amount during the past 30 years.


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## curlyboy20

tvdxer said:


> Perhaps it's more an issue of how much officers are paid: *in the U.S., police officers generally have good salaries,* enough for a family to live at a decent standard (though perhaps a second income is required in many areas). As far as I know, *in many of the countries where bribing is common, police officers make barely enough to survive, if that*. I can't really say I would be outraged if a police officer, say, in Guatemala or Nicaragua pulled me over and asked me for $5 or $10.


 
 A friend from the states told me that cops make around 50 thousand dollars a year which isn't much more than a school teacher makes. I don't know if that is true or not or perhaps it is in a certain region of the United States.

Yes, most cops in third world countries barely make enough money to make it through the month (and most of them have families to support) and thus they need the extra cash witch they get from taking bribes from people. Not all Peruvian cops take bribes but, alas, the vast majority does. ONe thing I find interesting is that the female cops here do not take bribes and if someone offers to bribe them, they get very upset. The males on the other hand will take bribes all the time. I often wonder why one gender won't take bribes and the other will. Perhaps most male officers have families to feed than their female counterpart.

Peruvians know that the police are corrupted and it's always in our minds to offer a bribe to avoid getting a ticket. Foreigners are targets here, just as much as they are in other nations I'm sure. I have heard from lots of people from other countries who live here that they will be asked for money by the police right off the bat!!!!!!!! Sometimes the police will pull vehicles over for no reason whatsoever. I was a passenger in a vehicle once and my friend from the states was driving. We went through a green light that went red after we were through the intersection and the cop pulled us over to tell us we had run the red light! We argued only to be immediately asked for money. The amount we paid the cop was (drumroll).........10 soles (3.25 USD).

The police force in this country needs to be overhauled. We need to weed the corrupted cops out and get honest people in, and that goes from the highest rank to the lowest one, for corruption is spread all over the place. Getting rid of corrupted folks is hard in a poor country with very few resources, nevertheless.


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## Neuromante

Aunque no se da en España quisiera advertir que se está proponiendo "soborno" como respuesta y no es correcto.
Soborno sería cuando "ofreces" dinero, pero se está preguntando como se dice cuando te "exigen" dinero: Eso es "chantaje" o, más apropiado en este caso "*extorsión"*


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## Jacobtm

New York law provides for an interesting situation which is the legal equivalent of a bribe.

The way the law works is this:

The money from a speeding ticket goes to the NY state government. The money from "failure to obey a traffic control device", such as running a stop sign or a red light, goes to the town in which you did that.

So local cops in areas that aren't very rich are often very attentive for drivers who're speeding, but pretty much everyone knows that if you get a speeding ticket the court will allow you to "plead it down" to a minor traffic violation. The fine is less for the driver, and the money goes to the town. Further, you're not actually convicted of speeding, and therefore your insurance costs don't go up like they would (one speeding ticket can lead to increased insurance rates for years, costing thousands of dollars).

I've actually been pulled over on a highway with no "traffic control devices at all" and gotten a ticket for that. It's better than a speeding ticket, but obviously legal BS.

Of course, people are only getting pulled over if they're actually speeding to begin with.





curlyboy20 said:


> A friend from the states told me that cops make around 50 thousand dollars a year which isn't much more than a school teacher makes. I don't know if that is true or not or perhaps it is in a certain region of the United States.



Salaries for police officers vary significantly depending on where you are. Our system of government gives the individual States and even individual cities/towns much of the responsibility for maintaining things like schools and police forces. So the situation is essentially that in quiet, rich towns police are paid generously and retire early. In dangerous areas, which are usually poorer, they're not paid nearly well enough and work much harder.


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## SDLX Master

Interesting what you say, considering the fact that many an American terror or drama movie, usually depict small town cops as being the kings of their little ponds, using and abusing the power they were conferred when these very same movies put city cops in pedestals as being the incorruptible ones, when the truth is, you find them all rotten apples everywhere. 




Jacobtm said:


> New York law provides for an interesting situation which is the legal equivalent of a bribe.
> 
> The way the law works is this:
> 
> The money from a speeding ticket goes to the NY state government. The money from "failure to obey a traffic control device", such as running a stop sign or a red light, goes to the town in which you did that.
> 
> So local cops in areas that aren't very rich are often very attentive for drivers who're speeding, but pretty much everyone knows that if you get a speeding ticket the court will allow you to "plead it down" to a minor traffic violation. The fine is less for the driver, and the money goes to the town. Further, you're not actually convicted of speeding, and therefore your insurance costs don't go up like they would (one speeding ticket can lead to increased insurance rates for years, costing thousands of dollars).
> 
> I've actually been pulled over on a highway with no "traffic control devices at all" and gotten a ticket for that. It's better than a speeding ticket, but obviously legal BS.
> 
> Of course, people are only getting pulled over if they're actually speeding to begin with.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Salaries for police officers vary significantly depending on where you are. Our system of government gives the individual States and even individual cities/towns much of the responsibility for maintaining things like schools and police forces. So the situation is essentially that in quiet, rich towns police are paid generously and retire early. In dangerous areas, which are usually poorer, they're not paid nearly well enough and work much harder.


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## winegrower

While having to bribe a civil servant for a favor is not uncommon in Greece, the particular situation with a police officer asking for money is very rare. It would be called ladoma (oiling) or fakelaki (little envelope). The obvious reaction would be to take the ticket, refuse to bribe and threaten to report him or take the whole thing to the police station. The cop himself is absolutely corrupt and should be fired. People who pay are probably blameful for encouraging such a morbid practice.


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