# laboratorio artigianale



## SevenVeils

Ciao a tutti !!!

Avrei bisogno di sapere come si traduce in inglese "laboratorio artigianale", cioè un laboratorio in cui vengono prodotti generi ALIMENTARI (non so, prodotti di pasticceria piuttosto che salumi, formaggi e quant'altro) con processi artigianali e NON industriali.

Grazie mille!!


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## Tegs

Ciao e benvenut@! 

Ti va di tentare di fare una traduzione, poi ti aiutiamo?


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## SevenVeils

Certo!!! 
Diciamo che il problema è riuscire a combinare il concetto di "hand-made" o "home-made" con il concetto di "workshop" (anche se workshop non mi dà il senso di alimentare....) 
aiuto!!!


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## Tegs

Hm, forse bisogna usare la parola "kitchen" invece di "laboratory" in inglese? In un laboratorio, non si fanno cose "home-made", che voul dire "fatto a casa"...

Hand-made si usa per descrivere come si fanno arti e mestieri, piuttosto che cibo. 

Hai un po' più di contesto? Per esempio, la frase entera nella quale vuoi mettere il termine?


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## SevenVeils

Allora, la frase intera recita così:

"Offriamo solo i prodotti migliori, attraverso un’accurata selezione di laboratori artigianali su tutto il territorio".

Avevo iniziato a tradurre così:

"We only offer the best products, through an accurate selection of laboratori artigianali all over the region".

Purtroppo non ho proprio trovato niente che si avvicinasse a questo concetto, sia per quanto riguarda laboratorio (si tratta di piccoli produttori), che artigianale (metodologia). 

Grazie mille!


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## pescara

Forse: We only offer the finest products, selected carefully from artisanal producers throughout the region.

Ciao.


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## SevenVeils

pescara said:


> Forse: We only offer the finest products, selected carefully from artisanal producers throughout the region.
> 
> Ciao.




Grazie, era esattamente questo!! 
E grazie anche per avermi fatto capire che allora la parola artisanal esiste e funziona!!


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## MR1492

SevenVeils said:


> "Offriamo solo i prodotti migliori, attraverso un’accurata selezione di laboratori artigianali su tutto il territorio".
> 
> "We only offer the best products, through an accurate selection of laboratori artigianali all over the region".



È possible che questo è un gioca di parole?  In inglese ci chiama un _oxymoron _(ossimoro_ ?__)_.

Did they mix "_laboratori_" and "_artiginali_" to be humorous?

Just a thought.

Phil


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## london calling

MR1492 said:


> È possible che questo è un gioca di parole? In inglese ci chiama un _oxymoron _(ossimoro_ ?__)_.
> 
> Did they mix "_laboratori_" and "_artiginali_" to be humorous?
> 
> Just a thought.
> 
> Phil


Hello, Phil. 

If and when I buy "made" cakes or whatever (very rarely, I prefer to make them myself) I go to a "laboratorio artigianale":  definitely not a play on words.. Basically, it's a place which sells what they call "home-made" cakes, biscuits, that sort of thing .


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## Tegs

london calling said:


> Hello, Phil.
> 
> If and when I buy "made" cakes or whatever (very rarely, I prefer to make them myself) I go to a "laboratorio artigianale":  definitely not a play on words.. Basically, it's a place which sells what they call "home-made" cakes, biscuits, that sort of thing .



When I see posts like this, it makes me think we need to have a  real-life reunion of forum members. That way we could try people's  home-made cakes, rather than just read about them and get hungry 

PS  Interesting how 'laboratorio' works in this context in Italian - I can see, from  the English perspective, why Phil thought it was weird.


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## london calling

Tegs said:


> PS Interesting how 'laboratorio' works in this context in Italian - I can see, from the English perspective, why Phil thought it was weird.


If you want my opinion, these people's cakes are still "industriali", I don't care what they say!.


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## -Linda-

Salve, riprendo questa vecchia discussione per chiedere un ulteriore precisazione. MI "scontro" con persone che mi dicono che ARTISANAL LABORATORY non esiste. Dovrei tradurre su di un cartellone interno la dicitura italiana "Laboratorio artigianale" inteso come quel luogo dove si producono / cuociono biscotti artigianalmente.
Non riesco a trovare la forma più giusta .... mi potreste aiutare??


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## Teerex51

_Artisanal Bakery _should work


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## -Linda-

Bakery!! Perchè non ci ho pensato prima!! Grazie mi piace!! 
Great! Thank you for your support!


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## Teerex51

Sure, anytime. 

PS: Here you can see if the "G" entries match your "laboratorio"


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## GavinW

Teerex51 said:


> _Artisanal Bakery _should work



Hmm, not so sure, sorry. Is this maybe a AE/BrE split? Artisanal bakery sounds like a bit of a mouthful to me (excuse the pun...). Generally, "artisanal" is considered a bit cumbersome, I'd say. 
Why not go for "Traditional Bakery", for example? This would suggest a) the small scale of production; and b) the fact everything is hand-made (ie not mechanized).


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## Teerex51

Hi Gavin, while "traditional" has its merits, this guy in Brighton, this one in Uxbridge and several more (just to mention the UK) seem to be happy with _artisanal_.


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## GavinW

Sorry, I still don't like it! ;-)


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## curiosone

Then there are two of us who don't like it, Gavin.   So I guess it's not a BE/AE thing.  I realize "artisinal" exists in the dictionary, but it is isn't as frequently used (in English) as it is in Italian, and it sounds (to me) like an Italian was translating.

I checked the  Oxford dictionary, and "artigianale" is translated as "made by hand; (hum) amateurish".  And when I looked at the English definition of "artisanal" it said (referring especially to food or drink): "made in a traditional or non-mechanized way." 
So I think "_traditional bakery_" is a perfect fit.  An alternative might be "_old-fashioned bakery_" (where everything is "made by hand").


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## Teerex51

curiosone said:


> ...but it is isn't as frequently used (in English) as it is in Italian, and it sounds (to me) like an Italian was translating.


Sheesh, who's gonna tell all those businesses in the UK and Stateside who used it in their names?  There's a a link in post #15, why don't you check it out?


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## curiosone

Teerex51 said:


> Sheesh, who's gonna tell all those businesses in the UK and Stateside who used it in their names?  There's a a link in post #15, why don't you check it out?



I did click the link, Tex, and (with one exception) found bakeries with Japanese and Spanish names in front of them.  What I'm trying to say is that "artisanal" is not so widely used by mainstream English speakers.  So it sounds a bit contrived, the sort of word that non-natives would carefully choose from the dictionary, but which most natives wouldn't, with the single exception (on the page that your link opened) of a specialized gluten-free bakery whose owners are likely more erudite than a traditional baker.

At any rate I respect your view on the matter - but feel no obligation to like it.


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## mr cat

I'm afraid I have to agree with those who think 'artisanal' sounds like a literal translation. I'm not sure I can even pronounce it correctly without checking! 
 I see nothing wrong with just writing 'artisan producers' rather than 'artisanal'.


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## Teerex51

curiosone said:


> At any rate I respect your view on the matter - but feel no obligation to like it.


By all means, Curio. We're here to express our opinions and suggest viable, present-day translations. _Enforcing_ them is not part of the game. 

_Traditional bakery_ is without a doubt a mainstream term, but _artisanal bakery_ seems to be a modish alternative. If bakeries as far apart as Nova Scotia and NW London have chosen to call themselves "artisanal", Linda – our OP – has the proverbial "right to know". She'll then decide which suits her best—and we will have done our job offering her a choice of alternatives.


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## curiosone

mr cat said:


> I'm afraid I have to agree with those who think 'artisanal' sounds like a literal translation. I'm not sure I can even pronounce it correctly without checking!
> I see nothing wrong with just writing 'artisan producers' rather than 'artisanal'.



I like "artisan" better than "artisanal" too, so checked in Oxford dictionary whether this noun could be used as an adjective, and found the confirmation that it is used as a modifier when speaking of food or drink (example:  artisan cheeses).  So I think "artisan bakery" would work better than "artisanal bakery" (if we wish to be modish ).


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## Tegs

I think it depends on what sort of vibe the OP wants to give the bakery customers. Artisan/artisanal bakery, like TR said, is modish, i.e. posh and very likely expensive. Traditional bakery = we bake the stuff your grandmother used to bake.


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## GavinW

Tegs said:


> Artisan/artisanal bakery, like TR said, is modish...



This is crucial information that escaped me earlier on. In view of the fact the term is modish, we can probably regard it as a neologism, to all intents and purposes. My ignorance of the recent fashion in using the term explains why it felt uncomfortable. The OP should also, therefore, be aware that it is in some sense a niche expression.


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## chipulukusu

I am not talking about other English speaking countries, but if I'd see an _Artisanal Bakery _in the UK, I'd probably think that the owner is not a native speaker. I find more British _Traditional Baker,_ as suggested by Gavin and Curiosone, or, as an additional option, "_Homestyle Bakery_".


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## Sere8Sere

Ciao a tutti! Riapro il thread di "laboratorio artigianale" per chiedere un vostro parere. 
Sto traducendo il titolo di un articolo che parla di un LABORATORIO ARTIGIANALE che realizza borse e accessori in pelle.

Io l'ho tradotto cosí, ma non ne sono certa : 
*Hand-Crafted Laboratory for Leather Bags and Accessories
*
Avete dei suggerimenti da darmi? Grazie infinite!


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## Benzene

_*Ciao Sere8Sere!*

Propongo due opzioni:
_
_1) "handcraft workshop offers/manufatures bags, complements designed and made with leather";_

_2) "original natural leather bags, accessories designed and handcrafted in the/our craft workshop"._
_
Bye,
_
*Benzene*


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## london calling

Sere8Sere said:


> Ciao a tutti! Riapro il thread di "laboratorio artigianale" per chiedere un vostro parere.
> Sto traducendo il titolo di un articolo che parla di un LABORATORIO ARTIGIANALE che realizza borse e accessori in pelle.


Laboratorio artigianale si dice 'workshop', come ha detto Benzie. Visto però che è solo un titolo ti suggerisco qualcosa di questo tipo:

_Hand-crafted leather goods/bags and accessories_

Non ho aggiunto 'workshop perché proprio non ci sta, ma  anche perché immagino che si parla del 'workshop' nel corpo dell'articolo, no? Tipo questo che ho trovato un sito web inglese (non posso postare il link, perché è un sito commerciale), che nella descrizione dice:

_Welcome to Jane Hopkinson Bags where you will find an extensive range of luxury leather handbags to suit your every need. We have been part of the English leather trade industry, designing and making ladies’ leather handbags, since 1980. Our collection includes leather tote bags, across body bags, leather shoulder bags, satchels, and bags for weddings and special occasions such as Glyndebourne and Ascot. *These luxury leather goods are designed and handcrafted by us here in our worksho*p in Ditchling, East Sussex, nestled in the picturesque South Downs National Park_.

Il neretto è mio.


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## Lorena1970

Sere8Sere said:


> Sto traducendo il titolo di un articolo che parla di un LABORATORIO ARTIGIANALE che realizza borse e accessori in pelle.
> 
> Io l'ho tradotto cosí, ma non ne sono certa :
> *Hand-Crafted Laboratory for Leather Bags and Accessories *



E la* frase originale / titolo originale *dell'articolo quale sarebbe????


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## Sere8Sere

Il titolo originale è: 
*Laboratorio Artigianale Borse e Accessori in Pelle *

E poi l'articolo inizia dicendo: 
È un laboratorio al 100% Made in Italy: ci occupiamo di design, progettazione e produzione di borse in pelle e accessori di alta qualità.

Forse potrebbe funzionare la versione di London Calling


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## london calling

Confermo quello che ho detto. Inserire la parola 'workshop' nella frase inglese non va (suona male...). E poi in ogni caso puoi infilare 'workshop' nella prima frase dell'articolo (un laboratorio al 100% Made in Italy).


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## Sere8Sere

Grazie infinite London!


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## MR1492

Sere8Sere said:


> *Hand-Crafted Laboratory for Leather Bags and Accessories*



One quick, additional comment, Sere8Sere.  As written, it says that the laboratory is hand-crafted and is, presumably, a good place for leather bags and accessories.  When adjectives directly precede the noun, they modify that noun.  So, "hand-crafted" modifies laboratory and not leather bags.

I only add this because I'm certain my Italian sentences are written quite badly and I appreciate it when little things like this are pointed out.

Phil


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