# Michelle looks beautiful and the bridesmaids do, too.



## DeBesteMan

Hallo I am going to try and deliver the first paragraph of my best mans speech in dutch.
I have got as far as introducing myself and I think I'm ok with complimenting the bride and bridesmaids. But when I get on to taking about ether groom giggled translation seems to disagree with other tools. "he looks smart" for example translates back as he is malignant!

Has anyone tried anything like this before?


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## NewtonCircus

The question is a bit vague to me. I assume that you want to know if one of us has had a bad (or should I say hilarious) experiencies with online translators. Right?

Yes I have. I have seen someone entering German comments from software developers into these tools. Believe me, I had a good laugh after reading the output (English). 

These tools are very useful if you want to "understand" a foreign document but are are too inaccurate for a correct translation. There's in my opinion also no software yet which is able to fully master the complexities of grammar.

Groetjes Herman


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## DeBesteMan

Hi NewtonCircus,

You are right I was a bit vague, sorry.  I am trying not to trust the computer translation fully which is why I wanted somewhere I could get it sanity checked 

Here is an example:
Ik denk dat u er allemaal over eens Michelle ziet er prachtig uit vandaag ook kijken en de bruidsmeisjes ook heerlijk.

Does that make sense if I wanted to say that the Bride looked beautiful and also the bridesmaids do as well?

As I know that "uit" means from.  However I do not know if it is normal in Dutch to say that someone looks nice "from today" rather than "today".

I hope that is a good example.

Thanks
Chris


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## Arrius

This translation looks pretty bad even to this engelsman. _uitzien_ is a separable verb meaning to look/appear/seem, so the _uit_ is not connected to _vandag_, but _kijken_ is to _have a look at something,_ not _to look_ in the same sense as _uitzien._


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## DeBesteMan

Haha.  Thanks Arrius.
I found an alternative tool by SDL.  But that may be giving me different wrong answers 
What would be a good way then to say, "I think you would all agree that Michelle looks beautiful and the bridesmaids do too"?
I appreciate that you may need to change the English to form a better sentence in Dutch.


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## NewtonCircus

*The bad news.* To date there are no tools which are able to translate without errors I believe. The sentence is actually comprehensible for anyone who masters Dutch but contains nevertheless errors. 

*The good news.* There's always this website with plenty of helpful souls and all free of charge.

I corrected it for you. 

*"Ik denk dat u het er allemaal over eens bent, Michelle ziet er prachtig uit vandaag en de bruidsmeisjes natuurlijk ook"*

Groetje Herman


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## NewtonCircus

*"uit" *can mean a lot of things, both on its own or in combination with other words.

*uitrit:*         Exit (motorway)
*uitgang:*     Exit (building)
*uitvinden:*  To invent
*uit:               *from, out of, off...  (Example: *I kom uit België:* I am from Belgium)
*uitzien*:      To appear, to look (good) 
*uitkleden:*   To undress 
...........

Some verbs have to be split when conjugated. *Uitzien* is one of those verbs
You look very good: *Jij ziet er goed uit. * 

Groetjes Herman


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## DeBesteMan

Ahh, ok  cool, I think I get it now.  Is it a bit like "aus" in German?  

Without actually getting too deep into grammar (as I have to confess we were taught very little English grammar at school so my knowledge of the terms is poor) am I correcting in thinking it is a "preposition"?


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## Arrius

Dutch _uit_ and German _aus_ are basically prepositions, but called particles when used in separable verbs such as _uitzien_ and_ aussehen_ both of which mean to _look/seem_. English, also a Germanic language, has a verb of similar form but different meaning, _to look out_, but it is called a _phrasal verb_. I hope I haven't gone too deep.


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## DeBesteMan

Yes, that makes sense.  Dankuwel beiden.

So far I have

==================
Goedemiddag

Mijn naam is Chris, de beste man.

Ik denk dat u het er allemaal over eens bent, Michelle ziet er prachtig uit vandaag en de bruidsmeisjes natuurlijk ook.

<middle part not yet translated >

Op* de bruid en bruidegom. Dat ze samen nog lang en gelukkig mogen leven.

Ik hoop dat jullie het niet erg vinden dat ik nu in een eenvoudigere taal doorga.

Dankuwel


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## Arrius

The new part looks good to me, but wait for a native to check. There remains the problem of pronunciation which this Wikipedia link may help you with. The phonetic symbols may be unfamiliar but it is also possible to hear the sounds, and if I could make it work, anybody can.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_phonology
You will need a moist pharynx to pronounce the guttural G, stronger than the Spanish J in Juan or even the German ch in ach and Achtung - but don't make it too moist, mind you!


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## NewtonCircus

*"Op de bruid en bruidegom".* I assume that you've the intention to utter a toast at the same time you're reading this sentence? In that case it is correct. 

*"Dat ze samen nog lang en gelukkig mogen leven".* This is also correct, just a bit "stiff" and old-fashoned I believe. Maybe there's other people around with "cooler" phrases.

Groeten Herman


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## DeBesteMan

NewtonCircus said:


> *"Op de bruid en bruidegom".* I assume that you've the intention to utter a toast at the same time you're reading this sentence? In that case it is correct.
> 
> *"Dat ze samen nog lang en gelukkig mogen leven".* This is also correct, just a bit "stiff" and old-fashoned I believe. Maybe there's other people around with "cooler" phrases.
> 
> Groeten Herman



Thanks Herman,

Yes I was going to say the first sentence as I propose a toast.
I would welcome any suggestions you have for a more relaxed dedication to the Bride & Groom.  

Chris


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## Kayla321

DeBesteMan said:


> ==================
> Goedemiddag
> 
> Mijn naam is Chris, de beste man.
> 
> Ik denk dat u het er allemaal over eens bent, Michelle ziet er prachtig uit vandaag en de bruidsmeisjes natuurlijk ook.
> 
> <middle part not yet translated >
> 
> Op* de bruid en bruidegom. Dat ze samen nog lang en gelukkig mogen leven.
> 
> Ik hoop dat jullie het niet erg vinden dat ik nu in een eenvoudigere taal doorga.
> 
> Dankuwel


I would NOT use "de beste man", because that means that you are quite a nice guy, not that you are part of a marriage. In Dutch, the word for that "job" is _getuige_ (literally: witness).

The last sentence is basically ok, but it sounds a little strange to me. I would say _Ik hoop dat jullie het niet erg vinden dat ik nu doorga in een taal die ik beter beheers/spreek._ (I hope you don't mind that I continue in a language that I "control"/speak better.) If you say "eenvoudigere taal", you seem to say that the other language is easier than dutch, not that you can speak this <other language> better than dutch. (Am I making myself clear? : )


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## DeBesteMan

Hi Kayla,

Thanks for that I will update best man to witness. (Although "getuige" is a lot harder to pronounce  )

I understand that second recommendation too and will change to that. As it does make more sense rather than implying one language is easier (although to me English is easier...we need a French person or neutral to decide which is truly easier  )
 ...


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## Kayla321

You could pretend to be an import-Limburger and pronounce the GetuiGe with a "soft G". 

LOL  I don't think anyone can be really neutral! And if anyone is neutral, I think this person probably doesn't know enough about the language te judge the difficulty. Impossible mission!


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## NewtonCircus

- Is *"een getuige"* actually the correct translation for best man? 

*"Een getuige"* generally only witnesses the solomnisation of a marriage, just like the name says, (*"getuigen" *is to witness) while the role of a best man is much wider.

There's probably no real equivalent for best man in Dutch since the person who holds the speech is most of the time someone else (even two or more) at this side of the channel. I could be mistaken but I think this is no different in the Netherlands .

- There's actually websites with sample speeches in Dutch if you google a bit with 
*"Trouwspeech voorbeelden".*

Groetjes Herman


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## Arrius

Oddly, despite strong English influence, my Afrikaans dictionary, which language derives most of its vocabulary from the Dutch, doesn't give a word for *best man* either, and German has only _Trauzeuge_, meaning both _best man _and_ witness_, corresponding to your_ (trouw)getuige_. I wonder if some Flemish dialects have _eerenman_* or _eerenjong_* as a loan-translation of French _garçon d'honneur? _
_* hypothetical forms._


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## Kayla321

Maybe _ceremoniemeester _is the word you are looking for? This is the person who takes care of -well- everything before and during the wedding.


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## NewtonCircus

Kayla321 said:


> Maybe _ceremoniemeester _is the word you are looking for? This is the person who takes care of -well- everything before and during the wedding.


 
*Dankjewel Kayla, je nam de woorden recht uit mijn* *mond* ("You took the words right out of my mouth". Sounds like Meat Loaf ). I guess this is the closest match with the exception that a best man is generally a close friend or family member. 



Arrius said:


> I wonder if some Flemish dialects have _eerenman_* or _eerenjong_* as a loan-translation of French _garçon d'honneur?_


 
Not that I know of however _Babylon _says: *B**ruidsjonker (een vriend van de bruid en bruidegom die hen naar het altaar brengt). *This word is archaic and I can't recall hearing this word before. 

You may use the word though if you want to sound like Pieter Breugel the Elder, which of course also adds some flavour to the speech.

Groetjes Herman


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## Kayla321

NewtonCircus said:


> *Dankjewel Kayla, je nam de woorden recht uit mijn* *mond* ("You took the words right out of my mouth". Sounds like Meat Loaf ). I guess this is the closest match with the exception that a best man is generally a close friend or family member.


*looks at words from NewtonCircus' mouth* Yeck! There's still some drool on those words. 

All the ceremoniemeesters that I have "met" were good friends or familymembers of the bride/groom.


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## Thomas14

The best translation for 'best man' is in my opinion 'een getuige'. It's a man who witnesses the matrimony. This word can also be used as a feminine equivalent.
Furthermore, I'd like to say that it sounds more natural when you say "Ik denk dat u het er allemaal over eens bent dat Michelle er vandaag prachtig uitziet en de bruidsmeisjes natuurlijk."


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## Kayla321

I would add "ook" at the end of Thomas14's sentence.


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## Thomas14

Whoops, I completely forgot to add 'ook' at the end. You see, I was copying and pasting with the phrase. Then, the phrase would be: ''Ik denk dat u het er allemaal over eens bent dat Michelle er vandaag prachtig uitziet en de bruidsmeisjes natuurlijk ook.''
I hope we helped you


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## Timidinho

I always use "bruidsjonker" or "getuige".


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## lainedain

bruidsjonker or bruidmeisjes doens't mean the same as getuige (witness) to me.
It could be the same, but it doesn't need to be, am I right?


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## Kayla321

I don't know about _bruidsjonker_, but since _bruidsmeisjes _are usually very VERY young, I'm quite sure _bruidsmeisjes _are never official witnesses.


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## Suehil

The problem here is that there are different customs in the different countries.  

In the Netherlands you have getuigen, bruidsmeisjes en bruidsjonkers and in the UK you can have bridesmaids, a matron of honour, ushers, pages and a best man - none of whom is a witness because you just don't have witnesses.

Pages and bridesmaids can be translated, the rest have to be described.


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