# 小姐 / 姑娘 (young lady)



## indigoduck

Hi all,

I'm not sure if the characters turned out okay.

I'd like to know when addressing a young lady... is it better to use 小姐 (gu niang) or 姑娘 (xiao jie)

For example: 陈小姐 or 陈姑娘

If it depends on the context then please briefly describe the contexts that they can be used in, or what context they can't be used in or context considered inappropriate.

Or is there another word more suitable ?

Thanks in advance.


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## Jerry Chan

Oh, please use 小姐. Don't call a young lady 姑娘 - it's outdated.
It will sound funny, just like calling your wife 娘子

Note that 姑娘 may have different meanings in dialects though.

In Cantonese, for instance, 姑娘 is a female nurse or someone working in a charitable organization.


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## indigoduck

Jerry Chan said:


> Oh, please use 小姐. Don't call a young lady 姑娘 - it's outdated.
> It will sound funny, just like calling your wife 娘子
> 
> Note that 姑娘 may have different meanings in dialects though.
> 
> In Cantonese, for instance, 姑娘 is a female nurse or someone working in a charitable organization.


 
i was told that some of these could mean 叫技 (jiao ji) in mainland.  is this true elsewhere - in hk, tw, singapore, for example ?


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## Jerry Chan

indigoduck said:


> i was told that some of these could mean 叫技 (jiao ji) in mainland.  is this true elsewhere - in hk, tw, singapore, for example ?



You mean 叫妓? 叫雞?
Yes, 小姐 could mean a sex worker.
It has been discussed in this thread.


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## Ghabi

Strictly speaking, 小姐 is a nightclub hostess in HK Cantonese. With the decline of the nightclub business in HK, the expression has also gained a distinct "old-school" ring, at least to my ears.

The contemporary slang word for a prostitute in HK Cantonese is leoi4leoi2/neoi4neoi2 (usually written as 囡囡). Traditionally, this is an affectionate word for "daughter" (e.g. 你囡囡今年幾大呀? "how old is your daughter"), but during the last decade (I think) it's acquired the new meaning of "hooker" in slang, and in recent years some people, perhaps unaware of its real meaning in slang, also use it for "chicks/gals" or "girlfriend". By analogy, some people use zai4zai2 囝囝, originally "son", to mean "boys (for dating)" or "boyfriend". Sounds so confusing, no?


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## Razzle Storm

Jerry Chan said:


> Oh, please use 小姐. Don't call a young lady 姑娘 - it's outdated.
> It will sound funny, just like calling your wife 娘子
> 
> Note that 姑娘 may have different meanings in dialects though.
> 
> In Cantonese, for instance, 姑娘 is a female nurse or someone working in a charitable organization.



I think this might be a regional difference?

姑娘 is still used pretty frequently in Beijing, or even 小姑娘 when calling a waitress or the like. Although, the 小姑娘 obviously only works for people maybe 30-years-old or older.

小姐 is also used though, and it's pretty clear when you're calling someone a sex worker and when you aren't, so the OP should feel free to use that too.


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## Jerry Chan

Razzle Storm said:


> I think this might be a regional difference?
> 
> 姑娘 is still used pretty frequently in Beijing, or even 小姑娘 when calling a waitress or the like. Although, the 小姑娘 obviously only works for people maybe 30-years-old or older.



It's not that common in South China. (at least in cities like Shenzhen or Guangzhou) Here we call a waitress 服務員, 小妹 or even 靚女 (in Mandarin)


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## Mugi

> I think this might be a regional difference?
> 姑娘 is still used pretty frequently in Beijing, or even 小姑娘 when calling a waitress or the like. Although, the 小姑娘 obviously only works for people maybe 30-years-old or older.


If you're in your 20s to 40s, how acceptable is it presently to address a woman in the same age bracket as 姑娘? The reason I ask is that when I lived in Beijing in the mid 90s it sounded quite condescending (like, "hey, girl"), unless perhaps you were old enough to be the woman's father or grandfather. Just curious to know if there has been a shift in acceptablility in the last 15 or so years. Of course, it was common to refer to young(ish), and most often single, women as 姑娘, just not address them as such.
小姑娘 didn't sound so condescending, but it was reserved for someone clearly still in their teens (i.e., a "girl" rather than a "woman"). Has there been a shift here too?


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## BODYholic

Jerry Chan said:


> In Cantonese, for instance, 姑娘 is a female nurse or someone working in a charitable organization.



I think we also call nun 姑娘.


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## Daffodil100

Jerry Chan said:


> It's not that common in South China. (at least in cities like Shenzhen or Guangzhou) Here we call a waitress 服務員, 小妹 or even 靚女 (in Mandarin)


 
靓女 is Cantonese who address a young lady, who is supposed to be pretty. Well, you might flatter a girl even she is ordinary looking.

I hardly heard mainlanders call a young girl 靓女 in the other parts of Southern China, except for Cantonese-speaking areas. It sounds very stilted for me who is from the South. In Mandarin speaking areas, I heard about people adddress a girl 美女 informally.


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## Daffodil100

It is most appropriate to address a young woman 小姐, specially with her last name, for example, 黄小姐， 李小姐. Nobody will think the title refers to a sex worker. 

小姐 is slang for sex worker, who has to be applied to the certain context. In English slang, john can refers to a toilet, but there are numerous people 
named John. 

In the southern coastal China, generally few people would address a young girl 姑娘, but it is quite common for people from the North, such as Shangdong, Liaoning, Beijing to address a young girl as 姑娘。Even in Shanghai, many people address a young girl as 小姑娘。

In a nutshell, 小姐 is the better.


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## indigoduck

Jerry Chan said:


> It's not that common in South China. (at least in cities like Shenzhen or Guangzhou) Here we call a waitress 服務員, 小妹 or even 靚女 (in Mandarin)


 
How to say 靚女 in mandarin ?  Does it sound more like 亮女 or 金女 ?


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## Jerry Chan

indigoduck said:


> How to say 靚女 in mandarin ?  Does it sound more like 亮女 or 金女 ?



亮女
It's clearly influenced by Cantonese.


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## wfxincheng588

i think 姑娘is better, for Miss * 小姐 is diferent meaning in china now!*


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## Razzle Storm

Mugi said:


> If you're in your 20s to 40s, how acceptable is it presently to address a woman in the same age bracket as 姑娘? The reason I ask is that when I lived in Beijing in the mid 90s it sounded quite condescending (like, "hey, girl"), unless perhaps you were old enough to be the woman's father or grandfather. Just curious to know if there has been a shift in acceptablility in the last 15 or so years. Of course, it was common to refer to young(ish), and most often single, women as 姑娘, just not address them as such.
> 小姑娘 didn't sound so condescending, but it was reserved for someone clearly still in their teens (i.e., a "girl" rather than a "woman"). Has there been a shift here too?



This seems to still be the case. I would refer to my roommate as a 姑娘 when talking about her to someone else, but I would just call her by her name if speaking with her. 小姑娘 is still for "girl" rather than woman, and I've heard it used for waitresses who looked maybe 16 or 17?


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## Mugi

Thanks for the feedback!


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## marsbeing

在下经常叫女生“姑娘”。e.g. 这位姑娘贵姓？“敢问姑娘芳名”？


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## lijingfeng

小女孩 best Younger, 小姐 is more polite called, 姑娘 is a more direct called.


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## bamboobanga

小姐 sounds like a hooker .  hmm

but 陈小姐 sounds fine


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## old5

Under certain circumstances, 小姐 means female sex worker, and there is no second name ahead of 小姐, just say 小姐.
Generally, we say 小姐 in business greetings, like “你好！陈小姐。” or “再见，王小姐。”
In informal language, we can say “嗨，美女”（Hi,gorgeous）.


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## Zhengke

知道对方的姓的情况下加上姓，比如“陈小姐”，“李小姐”。
不知道对方姓的情况下直接用“小姐”。

这么多年我一直都是这么过来的


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