# Slovene: overuse of "pa"



## Irec

Can someone explain why "pa" is used nearly everywhere in Slovene sentences?

I'll give you some examples and I apologise if any of them are vulgar or use chat-speak (they're friends on Facebook and Slovene gaming forums).

"ja kaj *pa* jas sem? xD"

"Tudi jaz ne pridem prav pogosto čez 15, kaj šele 25. Lahko *pa* konstantno pobijam po 3, 4 nasprotnike, brez da bi umrl in zato so moji scori včasih tak visoki."

I've been told before that it can mean "and" or "but", but when translated directly it doesn't make much sense.

Hope someone hear can enlighten me to this lingual conundrum.


----------



## sokol

To use "pa" like that is considered bad style - or colloquial language; I guess your examples are from chats? (The first one - "ja kaj *pa* jaz sem? xD" - at least seems to be chat.)

In this case "pa" really doesn't mean anything in particular, you can leave it untranslated or translate it with other particles in the target language used similarily (in German for example "ja" would be such one, meaning literally "yes" - this also is used extensively in spoken language without carrying any special meaning; in English probably to insert "y'know" all the time could be considered similar - ?!?).


----------



## *cat*

> Can someone explain why "pa" is used nearly everywhere in Slovene sentences?


Because it seems very natural to use it in our dialects and because it's a conjuction.
_
"ja kaj *pa* jas sem? xD"_

In this sentence, "pa" doesn't mean anything special (just like sokol said). 
It means "What about me?" or "And what am I?". We're using this as a sarcasm. An example: You're with A, B and C. A gives to C and B a lollipop, but not to you, so you ask him "And what am I?" You're offended.
My dialect would be - very informal, just for chat rooms or between friends:
"Ja ke pa te jaz sm?" 

But you have to know that "pa" is also a conjuction like "in" and "ter".
Jaz pa ti. = Me and you.

Then your second sentence.
_"Tudi jaz ne pridem prav pogosto čez 15, kaj šele 25. Lahko *pa* konstantno pobijam po 3, 4 nasprotnike, brez da bi umrl in zato so moji scori včasih tak visoki."_
Here "lahko pa" means but (I can).

BTW, I didn't correct mistakes in those two sentences, because they're from chat rooms (where everything is allowed).


----------



## Irec

So is "pa" an emotional / emphatic word? I read a thread where sokol talked about ja and pa before I made this thread and someone mentioned that it could be used for emphasis. What I don't get is, if it is indeed used for emphasis then why do people stick it into every spoken sentence? I thought emphasis was created though contrast, not continuity?


----------



## *cat*

Irec said:


> So is "pa" an emotional / emphatic word? I read a thread where sokol talked about ja and pa before I made this thread and someone mentioned that it could be used for emphasis. What I don't get is, if it is indeed used for emphasis then why do people stick it into every spoken sentence? I thought emphasis was created though contrast, not continuity?



Yes, "pa" is also for emphasis. I gave you an example - you're offended and you emphasize the fact that you are there, but you didn't get a candy.
But I think that you are exaggerating when you state that we "stick "pa" into every spoken sentence". Maybe it seems that way to you, because your "only" touch with Slovene is through chat rooms, where mostly dialects are used.

Look in the SSKJ.

And, welcome to the forum Irec! 
_*Pa *dobrodošel na forumu Irec!_


----------



## Irec

"Every spoken sentence" was a very big exaggeration but I guess it's just because I see the word that often and don't understand it that it stands out more than other common words.

e.g. "no no zdaj pa še boš nasilna ... prvo me nočeš poznat zdaj pa še hočeš nasilje nad mano izvajat ..."

I heard this phrase a lot when I was gaming "Pa dej no model" and I would translate it to "Awk, man. Come on!". Again, emphasis, so that makes sense 

My next question is about where to place it in a sentence because I've never really understood Slavic sentence structure that well.


----------



## TriglavNationalPark

Irec said:


> e.g. "no no zdaj pa še boš nasilna ... prvo me nočeš poznat zdaj pa še hočeš nasilje nad mano izvajat ..."


 
In this case, *pa* is a conjunction. In Slovenian, *pa* can serve as an all-purpose conjunction (coordinating and otherwise) with various meanings, including "and" and "but".

If you understand Slovenian, THIS dictionary entry will give you some idea of just how versatile this word is -- even in formal speech, let alone streetwise slang.

EDIT: Whoops! I just noticed that *cat* already posted this link. Sorry!


----------



## skye

What everyone else said.  

And: some sentences just sound very unnatural without pa - especially in dialects.

In schools they used to teach us to try and avoid it as much as we can. I always had difficulties crossing it out. It seemed like the sentence was missing something.


----------



## Irec

*cat* said:


> _*Pa *dobrodošel na forumu Irec!_



Najlepšja hvala, *cat*  Samo znam govorit malo slovenkso *pa* I'll do my best.

Presis.amebis.si here I come!


----------



## Duya

I suppose, the nearest English equivalent is "so". If you wish, you can stick it in virtually every sentence, but overdoing it crosses the border of colloquial and good style. 

(Of course, you cannot translate every "pa" with a "so".)


----------

