# What's your first perception of oriental culture?



## CrazyIvan

Dear All, 

I am wondering what people would perceive oriental culture, whether they have been here or not.

I would like further narrow down my question to the cultures I am rather familier with, which are Chinese/Japanese/Korean cultures. Lots of my western friends keep telling me that we look the same, act the same...and the major difference they could tell is food D , that is not ture)

With the our presence in international economy, I believe people start getting to know some national icons. For example, China as a manufacturing center and Yao Ming.....Japanese....mmm...they have a lot in the world, from Sony to The Last Samurai...Korean....mmm, LG/Samsung... But more than these, what do you think about these cultures...?

No matter have you come here or not, please share some experience/opinion ... Thank you


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## danielfranco

I have always found the oriental cultures fascinating and exotic, and the more I learn about them, the more I understand that it would really require a paradigm shift of my personal beliefs as a western person in order for me to understand the subtext of many aspects of the eastern cultures. However, at least I'm now able to perceive the many differences in each particular culture (japanese, chinese, korean, etc.), and to appreciate how many aspects of their culture would be beneficial to us westerners. For example, the respect to elders and high regard of ancestors is not precisely advocated in our modern western culture, but it would be a worthy adaptation to our culture. It would probably be ruinous for the senior homes business, though, if our families started taking care of our elders ourselves instead...


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## luis masci

My perception about oriental culture is in general terms the same that Danielfranco has mentioned. Also their respectful for tradition, religion, honor… are things that we have lost since long time ago.
But with globalization phenomenon what worry me most, is the fact that far western people to incorporate these oriental values, seems the opposite. Oriental people are gaining all the capitalist crap.


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## KateNicole

Whenever I think of Asian cultures, respect is the first thing that comes to my mind, like many people have already mentioned. I had a lot of Japanese and Korean classmates in college and I always admired how much they cherished their education. Their discipline always astounded me. Also, I perceive Korean and Japanese people (and I'm sure people of many other Asian nations) to be very, very healthy eaters.  And finally they were always very sociable and friendly to me and seemed to keep an open-mind.


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## vince

the positive things that come to mind are respect for others, respect for elders, and motivation to do well

the negative things that come to mind are materialism, the place and roles of women, and closedmindedness/disrespect/intolerance towards the outside world and people who are different (e.g. homosexuals, foreigners)


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## TimeHP

I only know Chinese and Japanese culture. My impression is that Asian culture is more spiritual than ours. I think that there are a lot of difference between Japanese and Chinese people. Both deep thinkers, but Japanese people seem more hedonistic and a bit more complicated. 
It's a very difficult subject to explain...
Ciao


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## CrazyIvan

Thank you all for the responses, but they are a bit different from my expectation. 

It seems that those are the perception while you know oriental culture a little bit...however, could you recall your "very first" perception while you think of eastern world...?

Or, are those your very first perception already?   ( maybe I got the wrong expectation..)


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## CrazyIvan

TimeHP said:
			
		

> I only know Chinese and Japanese culture. My impression is that Asian culture is more spiritual than ours. I think that there are a lot of difference between Japanese and Chinese people. Both deep thinkers, but Japanese people seem more hedonistic and a bit more complicated.
> It's a very difficult subject to explain...
> Ciao


 
This is a very interesting comparison, while you mentioned Japanese are more hedonistic and a bit more complicated than Chinese. I hope I did not misunderstand the meaning of hedonistic.... 

I always have the feeling that people under Chinese culture influence are not allowed to have happy times. My parents always remind me that, "Do not get too happy therefore tragedy happens," or as our old saying "樂極生悲,"which means tragedy comes along with great happiness.  However, we are asked to bear the suffering/things we dislike for the future, and it seems there is endless hope in the future for all the suffering at present.


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## maxiogee

I wouldn't dream of lumping the numerous "oriental" countries into one culture. I know only enough to know that I don't know enough as to make generalised statements of any country.


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## Ilúvënis Tinúviel

Well, I did a project last year about oriental countries and sorry but I have to say that I prefer Japan, China and India because I´ve felt attracted to the culture of those places and also because I love manga and anime shoujo series and j-pop (pop music from Japan) but I think that are plenty of good things to learn from oriental culture ^^


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## joseluisblanco

My first impression was (when I was a child) That oriental people were very strict and frightening. Even though I've learned something about oriental cultures (mainly japanese, and some chinese), I kept that feeling nowadays. I have two friens who are sons of Japanese people, and I keep joking on them by telling that their parents educated them by hitting too much them.
I find it funny, but may be there is some real approximation. I am trying to practice Japanese calligraphy, and just to learn that there is kaisho (standard), gyoosho (semi-cursive, still readable) and soosho (cursive and not readable to most japanese), and the subtle differences in their concepts, and the hard work needed to achieve some acceptable results, and the years necessary to that, it really comes to me an image of the sensei hitting me to make me understand it finally!
O how can they be so obssessive with a discipline? And that's fascinating at the same time.


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## Outsider

Oriental cultures have changed so much, so fast, that it's difficult to have any idea of what they are from afar. I wouldn't say that they're all the same, though. Japan seems to stand out with a culture all its own, both the traditional culture and the modern culture. 
From this forum, I know that South Korean soap operas are increasingly popular in the East.


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## Cereth

in Mexico is very common that people think that all the orientals are chinese, i have japanese friends that when are walking in the streets usually hear "hola chino" -hello chinese boy-.

i don´t say we all think that, specially young people that are familiar with manga/anime.

for what i know and my experience, chinese people is very warm and proud of their culture. Japanese people is more calm and quiet, i would like to know more about korea and other asian countries, because the truth is that here is not so common to hear about those countries just china and Japan.

by the way oriental poeple don´t look the same to me, and i have a question for you CrazyIvan: mexicans, peruvians, colombians, etc, do they all look the same to you?


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## Korena

Whenever I think about Asain culture, I always think about how well most people are educated. It's so amazing how students focused students are on school (or at least, that is what I'm lead to believe). And, the only thing that I don't like about the Asian culture is the food. I prefer European and Latin foods best.
-Korena


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## Pivra

i must admit that even some Thai people think that the fareastern cultures are the same.  This maybe due to our physical appearence, which Thais have a darker complexion and wider eyes (I don't mean this as an offense ) and many people can't tell the difference between Korean, Chinese, and Japanese alphabets. I'm fine with the fareastern cultures but it is hard for me to conform sometimes.


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## tvdxer

I think of Oriental culture as that of the Chinese (Han?) people and those who were influenced by them...e.g. the Vietnamese, Koreans, and Japanese.  The first trait to come to my mind is the Confucian or Confucian-like value system.


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## vince

Pivra said:
			
		

> i must admit that even some Thai people think that the fareastern cultures are the same.  This maybe due to our physical appearence, which Thais have a darker complexion and wider eyes (I don't mean this as an offense ) and many people can't tell the difference between Korean, Chinese, and Japanese alphabets. I'm fine with the fareastern cultures but it is hard for me to conform sometimes.



There is no Chinese alphabet 

Japanese has phonetic hiragana and katakana in addition to Chinese characters (kanji), whereas Korean is fully phonetic with its Hangul system


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## natasha2000

Due to my work, I learnt to distinguish Korean, Japanese or Chinese signs, and more or less, to distinguish their faces... I have to admit, I have more difficulties in distinguishing Koreans and Chinese than Japanese people.

Apart from that, I have a very little knowledge of oriental culture. Recently I was told that there are Cristians in Korea, which I haven't known until now. I always thought all oriental peoples are budhists.

I have been always fascinated by contradictions of these cultures... And which are also so different from our European culture (I cannot say western, since I do not belong to the "western capitalistic" culture, but anyway, my culture is very similar to it)...

Japanese with their so strict code of honor, kamikaze, harikiri (did I write it correct?), which I consider so cruel in the first place to themselves, and all the other with their martial arts (no martial art comes from Europe, does it?), their obsession with small feet of women that resulted in painful ways of preventing the women's feet from growing... I know that all of this maybe (I don't know, but this is what I suppose) balongs to the past, but it is also a part of a culture...

On the other hand, the very same people who practices all these "cruel" things which are so inimaginable for us, Europeans, also developed affinity to miniaturism, which requires a special sensibility and above all, patience. 

And everything they do is followed by a deep philosophy of life. Both kamikaze and artist who writes "War And Peace" in a grain of rice have a wise philosophical explanation for why are they doing what they are doing... 

I think these cultures are fascinating and attractive to most of us precisely because we do not know much about them...


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## toscairn

> their obsession with small feet of women that resulted in painful ways of preventing the women's feet from growing



Their being "Chinese," not Japanese. Nor do Japanese eat dogs and cats. Your perception of Japanese culture being strict is surprising. Don't you play video games, or watch animes? True, there are some who follow varied Taoism, some adhere to Judo, Karate-do, ("do" means "Taoism"). Most of us don't, and live a hedonistic life.


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## natasha2000

toscairn said:
			
		

> Their being "Chinese," not Japanese. Nor do Japanese eat dogs and cats. Your perception of Japanese culture being strict is surprising. Don't you play video games, or watch animes? True, there are some who follow varied Taoism, some adhere to Judo, Karate-do, ("do" means "Taoism"). Most of us don't, and live a hedonistic life.


 
Sorry, somewhere on the way, the word Chinese has been lost. I do know that this goes for Chinese and not for Japanese.

As I already said, I do know very little about the oriental cultures, and I was giving my first "perception" of it, as it was asked in the original post. I do realize that everything I have written might provoke reactions in you, the same ones that happen in for example, Spanish people when somebody identifies their culture with bull fighting, flamenco, Julio Iglesias and nothing more. I am sure there is so much more in oriental culture than this, and I for sure did not mean to ofend anyone..

And no, I do not play any video games because I don't like them, and I don't like manga, shin chan nor any other japanese cartoon. Sorry.

For me, harakiri or kamikaze IS strict, although I am aware that you might see this in other way. This is the beauty of it: differences in perception and interpretation.


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## Outsider

natasha2000 said:
			
		

> Japanese with their so strict code of honor, kamikaze, harikiri (did I write it correct?)


No, it's spelled _seppuku_.



			
				natasha2000 said:
			
		

> which I consider so cruel in the first place to themselves, and all the other with their martial arts (no martial art comes from Europe, does it?)


It depends on what you mean by "martial art". How about boxing and wrestling?


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## natasha2000

> It depends on what you mean by "martial art". How about boxing and wrestling?[/


quote]

Hmmm... My perception of a term "martial art" is always connected to a kind of fighting that includes some kind of philosophy, which I would dare to say, does not exist in boxing. As far as wrestling is concerned, I always thought that the roots of this sport are in sumo wrestling which also comes from orient.
But, hey, I just might be wrong, too....


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## natasha2000

Outsider said:
			
		

> No, it's spelled _seppuku_.


 
From the very same link you gave:



> Seppuku is also known in English as *hara-kiri*


 
I am writting in English, not in Japanese.


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## Outsider

From the same link you will also see that the term _harakiri_ is considered vulgar, in Japanese.



			
				natasha2000 said:
			
		

> Hmmm... My perception of a term "martial art" is always connected to a kind of fighting that includes some kind of philosophy, which I would dare to say, does not exist in boxing. As far as wrestling is concerned, I always thought that the roots of this sport are in sumo wrestling which also comes from orient.
> But, hey, I just might be wrong, too....


Wrestling is a very old sport in the West. It was a part of the original Olympic games.
I do see your point about there being no philosophy behind Western combat sports (though the Olympic games, and Roman gladiator fights, originated in religious rituals). But how about medieval chivarly, with its code of honour that Cervantes made Don Quijote follow?


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## danielfranco

Speaking of which, I heard or read or imagined once upon a time that someone might have said that "hara-kiri" is not the term one uses in polite company, and that "seppuku" is the more refined term. Is that correct? Because now that I'm learning about other cultures I would like to avoid offending someone out of ignorance...
...Okay, and also out of malice. 
Dan F


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## natasha2000

Outsider said:
			
		

> From the same link you will also see that the term _harakiri_ is considered vulgar, in Japanese.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You're completely right. I have just read it. I'm not ashamed to cite Socrates: Scio me nihil scire... and I know that one never stops learning, so I learnt today one interesting thing more...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wrestling is a very old sport in the West. It was a part of the original Olympic games.
> I do see your point about there being no philosophy behind Western combat sports (though the Olympic games, and Roman gladiator fights, originated in religious rituals). But how about medieval chivarly, with its code of honour that Cervantes made Don Quijote follow?[/
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I admit this is an interesting topic, but unfortunately, it does not have much to do with the original quiestion of this thread and requires the opening of a new thread.
Click to expand...


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## natasha2000

Outsider said:
			
		

> But how about medieval chivarly, with its code of honour that Cervantes made Don Quijote follow?


 
I cannot resist, but I have to reply to this. Mods are free to delete it if they consider it too way off topic.

Don't foget that the philosophical part was put by the very same Cervantes by laughing to that "code of honor" through the character of Don Quijote, not to magnify it. The point of Don Quijote (among many other things, of course) was to laugh to and to show how ridiculous and old fashioned was that "code of honor" you are talking about, as well as the chivarly and bucolic novels of that time. So, I doubt that there is any deep philosophy in medieval chivarly, rather just a plain code of behaving.


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## Just_Wil

I don't kno w much about it, but it seems very attractive to me.


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## Jhorer Brishti

Outsider said:
			
		

> From the same link you will also see that the term _harakiri_ is considered vulgar, in Japanese.


 
Hi, Outsider. I'm familiar with both terms but am more accustomed to using Hara-Kiri. Although it may be a vulgar way to denote such a "noble" act as seppuku in Japanese, in English it is perfectly fine seeing that we don't really identify so strongly with Japan's practices or emotional past(and I don't see how one could unless they happened to live in that country for an extended period of time)..


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## Pivra

Surprisingly, Karate was originated in India not Japan, so is the martial art of the Chinese and probably Korean's too. They were brought in along with Buddhism.


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## Jhorer Brishti

Pivra said:
			
		

> Surprisingly, Karate was originated in India not Japan, so is the martial art of the Chinese and probably Korean's too. They were brought in along with Buddhism.


 
Original versions of Snakes and Ladders, Chess, Karate, Judo, Playing Cards, and Polo were first developed in India. Of course just like modern Chess has evolved quite a lot from its original forms(the Queen was originally a Vizier for example), so too has Judo and Karate...

Here's a website in case anyone is interested:http://www.crystalinks.com/indiasports.html

EDIT To Add My Take On East Asian Cultures:

And I find Oriental cultures(Japanese,Korean,Chinese) to be very alluring. As people have mentioned, the strictness and traditionalism is admirable and most people who adhere to that culture are sincere,educated, and kind but I do realize that there exists a certain level of adherence to laws/decrees that overrode morality in the case of Japan during World War II(of course the same can be said of Europe/Germany at the time).

One particular instance that still affects me deeply is the gruesome murder of Queen Min of Korea by Japanese assasins before Korea was forced to yield itself to the imperial domination of Japan:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empress_Myeongseong_of_Joseon


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## Pivra

Jhorer Brishti said:
			
		

> Original versions of Snakes and Ladders, Chess, Karate, Judo, Playing Cards, and Polo were first developed in India. Of course just like modern Chess has evolved quite a lot from its original forms(the Queen was originally a Vizier for example), so too has Judo and Karate...
> 
> Here's a website in case anyone is interested:http://www.crystalinks.com/indiasports.html


 
In Thai chess, we still call it Vizier(What does it mean anyway.. viceroy?) Like we call it either [Uparaj] or [Med] not [Rajini]. And the most important cultural export of the subcontinent is Buddhism (although it turned my country from Hinduism to Buddhism and we became minority lol) and its architecture.

"_Chess originated in ancient India and was known as Chatur-Anga - Meaning 4 bodied, as it was played by 4 players. From this name we have its current name Shatranj. One such instance is in the Mahabharata when Pandavas and Kauravas play this game. Yudhistira the eldest of the Pandavas places his bets on his kingdom, his wife Draupadi and all other material possessions. And by a malevolent trick he loses to the Kauravas everything that he had placed his bets on. Consequently to humiliate the Pandavas, Dushasana one of the evil Kaurava brothers takes hold of Draupadi whom Yudhisthira has lost to the Kauravas, and tries to disrobe her in front of the assembled court. The Pandavas though powerful are helpless as they have lost Draupadi and according to the rules of the game they have no claim on her anymore_. "

In this part of the Epic, in the Thai version of Mahabharata, we call that game *Ska *and my dad told me that it's a game of dice, and was a kind of gambling.


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## Outsider

Jhorer Brishti said:
			
		

> Hi, Outsider. I'm familiar with both terms but am more accustomed to using Hara-Kiri. Although it may be a vulgar way to denote such a "noble" act as seppuku in Japanese, in English it is perfectly fine seeing that we don't really identify so strongly with Japan's practices or emotional past(and I don't see how one could unless they happened to live in that country for an extended period of time)..


Absolutely. I'm usually not one to be pedantic about these things ("Eskimo" vs. "Inuit", "Persian" vs. "Farsi", etc.) I just thought that, since the thread was about oriental cultures, it was an interesting tidbit/nitpick to add/make.


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