# mulato



## chaves

eiste una forma simplificada para traducir mulato al inglés, sin tener que recurrir al "person of mixed race". entiendo que "mulatto" tiene alguna connotación peyorativa. 

cualquier ayuda es buienvenida, gracias.


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## jacinta

No hay una sola palabra.  Se dice "he is of a mixed race".  Hay tantas razas, especialmente en los EE.UU., que sería imposible tener una palabra para referirse a todas mexclas.
Nunca se oye "mulatto".


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## diegodbs

chaves said:
			
		

> eiste una forma simplificada para traducir mulato al inglés, sin tener que recurrir al "person of mixed race". entiendo que "mulatto" tiene alguna connotación peyorativa.
> 
> cualquier ayuda es buienvenida, gracias.


 
"Half caste" is a person of mixed race, but I don't know if it is a derogatory term.


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## mhp

diegodbs said:
			
		

> "Half caste" is a person of mixed race, but I don't know if it is a derogatory term.



Yes, very much so. I would not use mulatto either. Use the longer expression


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## jacinta

I've never heard of "half caste".  Sounds strange to me.


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## buddingtranslator

"Half caste" used to be used to describe a mullato person, although it now has negative connotations. In England at least we would say something like "a person of mixed origins/race" even though it sounds long-winded. There's not really any other "politically correct" way of saying it. Sorry.


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## swift_precision

uyy de acuerdo con jacinta.  Si alguien dice "mulatto" se suponerá que está hablando de esclavos durante el siglo XVIII.  Se oye el término "biracial" pero esto no se refiere exclusivamente a una persona de ascendencia africana y española así que creo que puede decir "mixed" o "biracial" algo asi o sencillamente "half black/half white" aunque éste es un poco ambiguo en sí.


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## diegodbs

buddingtranslator said:
			
		

> "Half caste" used to be used to describe a mullato person, although it now has negative connotations. In England at least we would say something like "a person of mixed origins/race" even though it sounds long-winded. There's not really any other "politically correct" way of saying it. Sorry.


 
Why are there so many problems with "politically correct" words in English?


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## buddingtranslator

Hi Diego,

There was a thread about this recently. Basically, a word is "politically correct" becuase it doesn't want to cause any offence to sectors of society. For example, the word "Negroe" is now considered an insult, and although it is permissible to say "black" we would now say something like "person of African origin". It's just to avoid racism, sexism or even ageism.


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## chaves

bueno, me quedo pues con "a pwrson of mixed race". muchísimas gracias a todos.


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## gisele73

buddingtranslator said:
			
		

> Hi Diego,
> 
> There was a thread about this recently. Basically, a word is "politically correct" becuase it doesn't want to cause any offence to sectors of society. For example, the word "Negroe" is now considered an insult, and although it is permissible to say "black" we would now say something like "person of African origin". It's just to avoid racism, sexism or even ageism.



I know the word "negroe" or "nigger" is considered offensive, and I really can't understand why. In the same was that it is not offensive to use the word "white" to describe the race of a person. I have the impression that the "politically incorrect" thing has been brought out of proportions in some countries.
Once I heard part of a speech of Nelson Mandela and he used the word "nigger" or "negroe" (I think it was the first one).

As for "mulato", as far as a I know it's the mix of black and white, not the mix of other races, but the mix of those two.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

Take care everybody


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## Kmanx

you are right   mulato is just a mix of black and white

btw   why is mulato considered offensive?


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## mhp

diegodbs said:
			
		

> Why are there so many problems with "politically correct" words in English?



 ...Perhaps because racial integration is much more real in some English speaking countries. It’d be quite interesting to see what “politically correct” terms will emerge in the continental countries.


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## thuja

gisele73 said:
			
		

> I know the word "negroe" or "nigger" is considered offensive, and I really can't understand why. In the same was that it is not offensive to use the word "white" to describe the race of a person. I have the impression that the "politically incorrect" thing has been brought out of proportions in some countries.
> Once I heard part of a speech of Nelson Mandela and he used the word "nigger" or "negroe" (I think it was the first one).
> 
> As for "mulato", as far as a I know it's the mix of black and white, not the mix of other races, but the mix of those two.
> 
> Correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> Take care everybody




There is a vast difference in tone between "nigger" and "negro".  "Nigger" is deeply offensive, at least when uttered by persons who are not black. Do not use this word. It could get you hurt or insulted. People who are not black will think you ignorant and prejudiced if you use it.

"Negro", as has been noted, was the "proper" term a number of years back--for example in the early 1960's. Nowdays it has a quaint, old-fashioned sound, like 30-year-old slang. But it is not offensive in the way that "nigger" is. For example, a number of geographic names, e.g., "nigger creek", have been changed officially to "negro creek", which is considered acceptable.

As for whether Mandela used "nigger" or "negro", I assume it was the latter. It's also worth knowing that blacks will use both of these words amongst themselves in a friendly way, as kind of a humorous in-group signal. "Nigger, you come on over here!",  that kind of thing. But if you are not black you better not say that to a black person, unless you want to get in a fight.

In english, it's spelled "mulatto", not "mulato". "Mulatto" means half white, half black. There were other such words, like "quadroon" (a quarter black) and "octaroon" (one eighth black).  They would have been used in places like New Orleans in the nineteenth century, where it was very important for mixed-race people to know precisely their racial makeup.


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## Kmanx

so if a black person call another black person nigger is ok but a white person can't...   isn't that been racist?  I mean   that's discrimination based on the race, so it is racism


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## look

thuja said:
			
		

> There is a vast difference in tone between "nigger" and "negro". "Nigger" is deeply offensive, at least when uttered by persons who are not black. Do not use this word. It could get you hurt or insulted. People who are not black will think you ignorant and prejudiced if you use it.


I totally agree. It has absolutely nothing to do with political correctness in this instance.


			
				thuja said:
			
		

> In english, it's spelled "mulatto", not "mulato". "Mulatto" means half white, half black. There were other such words, like "quadroon" (a quarter black) and "octaroon" (one eighth black). They would have been used in places like New Orleans in the nineteenth century, where it was very important for mixed-race people to know precisely their racial makeup.


Agree again. For me, the term "mulatto", and the other ones you mentioned, are words from another (less enlightened) time when, in certain places, people were defined just by their racial background.


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## gisele73

thuja said:
			
		

> There is a vast difference in tone between "nigger" and "negro".  "Nigger" is deeply offensive, at least when uttered by persons who are not black. Do not use this word. It could get you hurt or insulted. People who are not black will think you ignorant and prejudiced if you use it.
> 
> "Negro", as has been noted, was the "proper" term a number of years back--for example in the early 1960's. Nowdays it has a quaint, old-fashioned sound, like 30-year-old slang. But it is not offensive in the way that "nigger" is. For example, a number of geographic names, e.g., "nigger creek", have been changed officially to "negro creek", which is considered acceptable.
> 
> As for whether Mandela used "nigger" or "negro", I assume it was the latter. It's also worth knowing that blacks will use both of these words amongst themselves in a friendly way, as kind of a humorous in-group signal. "Nigger, you come on over here!",  that kind of thing. But if you are not black you better not say that to a black person, unless you want to get in a fight.
> 
> In english, it's spelled "mulatto", not "mulato". "Mulatto" means half white, half black. There were other such words, like "quadroon" (a quarter black) and "octaroon" (one eighth black).  They would have been used in places like New Orleans in the nineteenth century, where it was very important for mixed-race people to know precisely their racial makeup.



Hi,

I know I shouldn't use thew word "nigger", since it's considered offensive. And as for what Mandela said, I have to check that, to make sure what word he used.

But my point is, for example, many times I've heard people say "colored person" when talking about a black person, or "African-American" as if it was a race, and it isn't, I have the feeling they came up with those definitions in order to avoid being considered racists or something, but to me it sounds much worse to say that, it's like trying not to say "black" and using other words instead, when there is nothing to be ashamed of if a person is black.

P.S. I wrote mulato in Spanish, with one "t", thank you for correcting me, I didn't know it was with two "t" in English


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## look

I don't know about in the USA, but in the UK someone who is black = black.


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## gisele73

look said:
			
		

> I don't know about in the USA, but in the UK someone who is black = black.




Maybe it is just in US that people refer to black people as "African-American", or things like that....I've never heard "African-British", or "African-European" to describe a race.

I think it can sound even more racist to say "African-American".


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## look

Hi Gisele, I really can't see why that term is _racist._
It is just a descriptive term (i.e. an American with African heritage) in the same way that "black" is.


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## gisele73

look said:
			
		

> Hi Gisele, I really can't see why that term is _racist._
> It is just a descriptive term (i.e. an American with African heritage) in the same way that "black" is.




Yes, but I think it is used to avoid saying "black", as if being black was something wrong.


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## look

I don't think so. I think that people call themselves "African-American" because it is a more accurate description of how they see *themselves*.


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## gisele73

look said:
			
		

> I don't think so. I think that people call themselves "African-American" because it is a more accurate description of how they see *themselves*.



I really don't think is accurate, at least not when referring to a race. Of course they are African-American, but that is not a race. Well, that's my opinion.


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## look

I think it's generally accepted that there is no such thing as "races", anyway.
It would be strange that anyone considered African-American as a "race".
I am white, I am also a British European << that is not a race, it's just a more accurate description.
Ditto for African-American.


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## diegodbs

gisele73 said:
			
		

> I really don't think is accurate, at least not when referring to a race. Of course they are African-American, but that is not a race. Well, that's my opinion.


 
I agree with you that it is not very accurate since the term "African American" is only used (I guess) to refer to black people.
I wonder if people in the U.S. use that politically correct term to refer to white people from South Africa or Moroccans, Egytians, Algerians, who are not black.
So, in the end, African American is not "any person with an African origin", but only "a black person".


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## gisele73

look said:
			
		

> I think it's generally accepted that there is no such thing as "races", anyway.
> It would be strange that anyone considered African-American as a "race".
> I am white, I am also a British European << that is not a race, it's just a more accurate description.
> Ditto for African-American.



Hi again 

Yes, I agree with you on that. "African-American" would be the same as saying "British-European", but I do think there are races.

The thing is I have never heard (or maybe very few times) in the US people saying "a black man was found ...", but "an African-American", but they do say "a white man....", that's the thing I don't get.

Well, well, this story would never end, it has much to do with personal opinions anyway.


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## gisele73

diegodbs said:
			
		

> I agree with you that it is not very accurate since the term "African American" is only used (I guess) to refer to black people.
> I wonder if people in the U.S. use that politically correct term to refer to white people from South Africa or Moroccans, Egytians, Algerians, who are not black.
> So, in the end, African American is not "any person with an African origin", but only "a black person".




Exactly. I don't say about myself I am a "European-American" or "Irish-Spanish".


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## look

diegodbs said:
			
		

> I agree with you that it is not very accurate since the term "African American" is only used (I guess) to refer to black people.


Yes, it is the term adopted by black people in the USA to refer to THEMSELVES (this seems to be the point being conveniently ignored). Do a Google search for Malcom X. 


			
				diegodbs said:
			
		

> I wonder if people in the U.S. use that politically correct term to refer to white people from South Africa or Moroccans, Egytians, Algerians, who are not black.
> So, in the end, African American is not "any person with an African origin", but only "a black person".


Yes, for the reason mentioned above.


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## diegodbs

gisele73 said:
			
		

> Exactly. I don't say about myself I am a "European-American" or "Irish-Spanish".


 
Since "African American" is not a very accurate term, may I humbly suggest an even more politically corrrect term?

Black person = an African American whose ancestors lived in certain parts of Africa where people, on the average, have slightly darker skins than ours, but we, nevertheless, consider them to be human beings just as we are. 

Bear in mind, however, that this kind of politically correct thought really means: WE are white people, and you are.....whatever.

Another option:

Do not change the name "black" to whatever a white person wishes. Change the word "white" instead.


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## look

gisele73 said:
			
		

> Hi again
> 
> Yes, I agree with you on that. "African-American" would be the same as saying "British-European", but I do think *there are races*."


Hi Gisele, look here: http://www.aaanet.org/stmts/racepp.htm


			
				gisele73 said:
			
		

> The thing is I have never heard (or maybe very few times) in the US people saying "a black man was found ...", but "an African-American", but they do say "a white man....", that's the thing I don't get.


I have never been to the USA so I can't comment about that.


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## gisele73

diegodbs said:
			
		

> Since "African American" is not a very accurate term, may I humbly suggest an even more politically corrrect term?
> 
> Black person = an African American whose ancestors lived in certain parts of Africa where people, on the average, have slightly darker skins than ours, but we, nevertheless, consider them to be human beings just as we are.
> 
> Bear in mind, however, that this kind of politically correct thought really means: WE are white people, and you are.....whatever.
> 
> Another option:
> 
> Do not change the name "black" to whatever a white person wishes. Change the word "white" instead.



That's the impression I have as well. I find the term "African-American" as discriminating. If it was in fact black people who started calling themselves this way, must be because they felt forced to do so, in a way, since they were discriminated for being black, but I don't think it should be used anymore.


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## look

diegodbs said:
			
		

> Bear in mind, however, that this kind of politically correct thought really means: *WE are white people, and you are.....whatever.*


The original discussion was about the word "mulatto", and that particular term, as well as others such as "quadroon" and "octaroon", would fit perfectly with what you've said above.


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## irisheyes0583

Ok, getting back on topic (not that the above discussion isn't extremely interesting--it is--but it belongs in the culture forum)... among younger people in the US, at least, we say "mixed". As in, "He's mixed.". This always means mixed black (A-A) & white, even though the term mixed doesn't specify that by definition. Hope that helps.


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## gisele73

look said:
			
		

> Hi Gisele, look here: http://www.aaanet.org/stmts/racepp.htm
> 
> I have never been to the USA so I can't comment about that.



Thank you for the link look 

It must be a very interesting read. We'll read later when I get home...I'm at work now.


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## gisele73

irisheyes0583 said:
			
		

> Ok, getting back on topic (not that the above discussion isn't extremely interesting--it is--but it belongs in the culture forum)... among younger people in the US, at least, we say "mixed". As in, "He's mixed.". This always means mixed black (A-A) & white, even though the term mixed doesn't specify that by definition. Hope that helps.



Thanks for your input. And it's true, this thread, as for the was it has developed, would fit better in the Cultural Discussions forum.


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## irisheyes0583

gisele73 said:
			
		

> Thank you for the link look
> 
> It must be a very interesting read. I'll/Will read (it) later when I get home...I'm at work now.



Just a small correction... hope you don't mind?


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## gisele73

irisheyes0583 said:
			
		

> Just a small correction... hope you don't mind?



Thanks, it was a typo, I wrote too fast...my boss is around


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## look

irisheyes0583 said:
			
		

> Ok, getting back on topic (not that the above discussion isn't extremely interesting--it is--but it belongs in the culture forum)...


I agree. Maybe the title could also be changed to "Misconceptions about supposedly politically correct/racist terms in the English language, and general bad feeling towards anything connected with the USA" ...or something like that.


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## look

gisele73 said:
			
		

> Thank you for the link look
> 
> It must be a very interesting read. We'll read later when I get home...I'm at work now.


No worries, Gisele.
I actually found that link in another thread about a similar topic in this forum.


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## diegodbs

look said:
			
		

> and general bad feeling towards anything connected with the USA" ...or something like that.


 
It's not just that simple. In Spanish too "politically correct" terms do exist, and the words "personas de color" meaning black people, are sometimes used. I dont´t like it either, white people are not transparent, so we are all "personas de color".


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## look

diegodbs said:
			
		

> white people are not transparent, so we are all "personas de color".


I agree. Funnily enough, as most of my family are Irish, I would have been considered "black" in certain places not such a long time ago... but that's a whole discussion in itself...


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## swift_precision

Hello Foreros,

If we can all stick to the question at hand that would be great. If you wish to see more on the second topic mentioned in the thread (which has been discussed in immense detail) please see this thread.

Thank you all,

Swift


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## gian_eagle

gisele73 said:
			
		

> Hi,
> But my point is, for example, many times I've heard people say "colored person" when talking about a black person, or "African-American" as if it was a race...


 
Is it spelled "color person" or "colored person"??


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## gisele73

thuja said:
			
		

> There is a vast difference in tone between "nigger" and "negro". "Nigger" is deeply offensive, at least when uttered by persons who are not black. Do not use this word. It could get you hurt or insulted. People who are not black will think you ignorant and prejudiced if you use it.
> 
> "Negro", as has been noted, was the "proper" term a number of years back--for example in the early 1960's. Nowdays it has a quaint, old-fashioned sound, like 30-year-old slang. But it is not offensive in the way that "nigger" is. For example, a number of geographic names, e.g., "nigger creek", have been changed officially to "negro creek", which is considered acceptable.
> 
> As for whether Mandela used "nigger" or "negro", I assume it was the latter. It's also worth knowing that blacks will use both of these words amongst themselves in a friendly way, as kind of a humorous in-group signal. "Nigger, you come on over here!", that kind of thing. But if you are not black you better not say that to a black person, unless you want to get in a fight.
> 
> In english, it's spelled "mulatto", not "mulato". "Mulatto" means half white, half black. There were other such words, like "quadroon" (a quarter black) and "octaroon" (one eighth black). They would have been used in places like New Orleans in the nineteenth century, where it was very important for mixed-race people to know precisely their racial makeup.


 
Hi, in that speech the word that was used was "negro" and it was a Martin Luther King's speech, not Nelson Mandela's as I said.

Here's the link:

http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/ihaveadream.htm


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## gian_eagle

is there a problem of using "mulatto" in this case or not?


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## irisheyes0583

gian_eagle said:
			
		

> is there a problem of using "mulatto" in this case or not?



In which case? In general, yes, ABSOLUTELY there is a problem with using this word. The _only_ case in which it would be acceptable is if you are talking about specific terminology 1800s/early 1900s America. Do not use it in today's day & age to describe someone of mixed race, or you will offend.


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## xebonyx

A word that is catching popularity among those of mixed race--in particular I refer to those who are radical activists-- is "bi-racial". I have many friends who self-identify as that, and who I refer to as such.


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## xebonyx

diegodbs said:


> It's not just that simple. In Spanish too "politically correct" terms do exist, and the words "personas de color" meaning black people, are sometimes used. I dont´t like it either, white people are not transparent, so we are all "personas de color".



I'm sorry, but it's assumptions like these that the term has mostly clung to esoteric circles or for strategic reasons. "People of color" doesn't refer to only Black people. It's a much more complex term that outlines colonialism and skin/race privilege (for starters) and as defining factors.


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## funfun86

3 years later... I wanted to point out that nowadays in the northeastern US, the "appropriate" term for someone of 2 or more mixed races is "interracial". I suppose you could say "biracial" but it sounds a bit weird to me. As for black people, I use the term "black", but never "blacks", "colored" or "negro"--those sound antiquated, discriminatory and ignorant. Many people are more comfortable saying "African American".

Tricky, isn't it! In my opinion the cause for this is judgmental, discriminatory people using the words negatively thus changing the connotation, which requires a new term to be used.


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## xebonyx

funfun86 said:


> 3 years later... I wanted to point out that nowadays in the northeastern US, the "appropriate" term for someone of 2 or more mixed races is "interracial". I suppose you could say "biracial" but it sounds a bit weird to me. As for black people, I use the term "black", but never "blacks", "colored" or "negro"--those sound antiquated, discriminatory and ignorant. Many people are more comfortable saying "African American".
> 
> Tricky, isn't it! In my opinion the cause for this is judgmental, discriminatory people using the words negatively thus changing the connotation, which requires a new term to be used.


 
Just to add, it's not what "sounds weird" to someone, it's what that person prefers to be called by that should be respected.


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## ORL

> "bi-racial"


 
Xebonyx, it may indeed sound weird to Spanish speakers, since the concept of "race" is a bit old fashioned. "Race" is used to talk about the human race. All others are "etnias".


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## saore

"Mulato" is originally a Spanish noun, and it means quiet literally the mix of a Spaniard and a black slave.  There is no appropriate translation for the word into English because of the specific racial mix it was intended to describe.  Although it could very well be used now a days to the mix between a white and black couple.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

Saore


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