# 科瑞 (Cory)



## Salem Saberhagen

I heard that when sometimes when foreign names are translated into Chinese, they are rendered into characters that sound similar regardless of meaning.

Is that the case with 科瑞 and Cory? What do the characters in 科瑞 mean? Could it ever be a native name?


----------



## zhg

I've never met a native whose family name is 科,but just because I haven't seen it doesn't mean it couldn't be a family name, I mean it certianly _could be_ a family name but the chance of seeing it in native Chinese families is extremely small. And if you want to get a name that sounds native, I think it's better to use 柯, another common family name in Chinese, which is pronounced exactly the same way.

柯瑞 seems more likely to be a native Chinese's name.


----------



## yuechu

Hello Salem,
The characters 科 and 瑞 mean:
科： branch of study; administrative section; division; field; branch; stage  directions; family (taxonomy); rules; laws; to mete out (punishment); to  levy (taxes etc); to fine somebody [aside note: one of my first associations is “science" but that is simply because it is part of the word "科学" science in Chinese]
瑞: lucky; auspicious; propitious; rayl (acoustical unit)
（definitions are from "Yellowbridge" Chinese dictionary)

Although I am not a native speaker, I agree with zhg that 柯瑞 looks more like a Chinese name while still having the same pronunciation, if that is what you are looking for. （a bit like "名侦探*柯*南".. ?)

EDIT: both 科瑞 and 柯瑞 are pronounced ke1rui4 in Mandarin.


----------



## Daffodil100

Hello!

Yes! 科瑞＝Cory

Chinese translate Western names focusing on their pronunications. i.e. Clinton is 克林顿 ；Putin is 普京 These Chinese name generally make little sense to Chinese.


It seems to me that it make little sense that a Westerner adopts a Chinese name which sounds very native to the ear of Chinese as few people care about it, and you cannot change your Western looks. 

What will really impress to me, and most Chinese I supposed are the proficiency of Chinese you grasp or others instead of a very Chinese name simply, with which many Chinese have little affinity. Likewise, Barack is not a native English name, but Mr. Obama still won the election twice. 


Though, I agree 柯瑞 sounds like a native Chinese name.


----------



## Salem Saberhagen

Thank you everyone! I can use the second one, but I think I should clarify, I'm speaking about a given name, not a family name. Does that make any difference? 



> It seems to me that it make little sense that a Westerner adopts a Chinese name which sounds very native to the ear of Chinese as few people care about it, and you cannot change your Western looks.



It's to do with a story I made up. (I should have said this first.) A Chinese dragon is adopted by a young American boy as an egg. He names it the western name "Cory," but as it gets older I thought the (male) dragon would want a Chinese name that sounded similar... It's just a little complicated.


----------



## zhg

In Chinese when we are asked about our names we nomally reply with  a given name and a family name together. So if someone tells me that his name is 科瑞 I will automatically assume his family name is 科 his given name is 瑞. 

I think one way to avoid that confusion is through giving the dragon a family name ,like 李科瑞，王科瑞, however it's arguable to give a dragon such a decent Chinese name.


----------



## Salem Saberhagen

zhg said:


> In Chinese when we are asked about our names we nomally reply with  a given name and a family name together. So if someone tells me that his name is 科瑞 I will automatically assume his family name is 科 his given name is 瑞.
> 
> I think one way to avoid that confusion is through giving the dragon a family name ,like 李科瑞，王科瑞, however it's arguable to give a dragon such a decent Chinese name.



You're right, I knew about name orders and should have been clearer... 

I've made up many dragons, they disguise themselves as humans and tend to simply use a word for "dragon" in accordance to their nationality as surnames. Example, an English dragon with the surname "Drake." 

So I guess this dragon would be named 龍柯瑞? Though the surnames you suggested are also quite fitting.


----------



## zhg

Yes that's a cool surname for a Chinese dragon. And I believe I have seen some people who have 龙 as their surnames though it's not as common as other major surnames.


----------



## Salem Saberhagen

zhg said:


> Yes that's a cool surname for a Chinese dragon. And I believe I have seen some people who have 龙 as their surnames though it's not as common as other major surnames.



Then I think that about covers this question except for one thing... What is the difference between 龍 and 龙? According to google translate they're both pronounced the same way, but seem to have different connotations...


----------



## yuechu

龍 is traditional Chinese, used in Taiwan, Hong Kong, overseas Chinese  communities, etc. 龙 is simplified Chinese, used in Mainland China,  Singapore, etc. Even though I usually use the simplified version, I  think the traditional version looks better.


----------



## zhg

> Even though I usually use the simplified version, I think the traditional version looks better.



So does one of my Chinese teachers who also has 龍 in his name,and he always uses traditional Chinese when he signs. It's possible that some of educated elder people from Mainland China are still stuck to using tradtional Chinese when it comes to few things like names. But generally speaking I totally agree with baosheng


----------



## Salem Saberhagen

I see. I think traditional probably works better for my purposes. So unless anyone sees an unnoticed problem, it looks like my dragon's name is 龍柯瑞, and the question is resolved.

Thank you very much, zhg, baosheng, and Daffodil100!


----------



## SuperXW

Salem Saberhagen said:


> You're right, I knew about name orders and should have been clearer...
> 
> I've made up many dragons, they disguise themselves as humans and tend to simply use a word for "dragon" in accordance to their nationality as surnames. Example, an English dragon with the surname "Drake."
> 
> So I guess this dragon would be named 龍柯瑞? Though the surnames you suggested are also quite fitting.



The Chinese surname 龍 does exists, although quite rare, they does sound quite cool... People with this surname often appear as martial-artist in Wu-xia novels...
Some facts you may need to know:
1. In Chinese we don't follow the order of "Nemo The Fish", "Siegfried The Dragonslayer". We'd rather refer them as 小魚尼莫 (Fish Nemo), 屠龍者齊格佛里德 (Dragonslayer Siegfried). “Conan the Barbarian” is 野蠻人柯南(Barbarian Conan) and 名偵探柯南 is Detective Conan... *Title or class first, name last.*
2. *Chinese hate one-character word!!!* (in modern contexts.) 龍科瑞 sucks if you mean "Cory The Dragon". We'll think 龍 is a guy's family name, rather than a fierce dragon.
If it's not his family name, we almost always find a two-character word (or words with more characters) for the title, such as 巨龍科瑞 (Huge Dragon Cory), 猛龍科瑞 (Fierce Dragon Cory), 無敵狂龍科瑞 (Matchless Violent Dragon Cory...)


----------



## Salem Saberhagen

> 2. *Chinese hate one-character word!!! **(in modern contexts.) 龍科瑞 sucks if you mean "Cory The Dragon". We'll think 龍 is a guy's family name, rather than a fierce dragon.
> If it's not his family name, we almost always find a two-character word (or words with more characters) for the title, such as 巨龍科瑞 (Huge Dragon Cory), 猛龍科瑞 (Fierce Dragon Cory), 無敵狂龍科瑞 (Matchless Violent Dragon Cory...)*



In this case, he's presenting 龍 as a family name.  If it were a title, I might use 龍皇科瑞 instead? (Intended meaning: Cory, Emperor of Dragons) 

Matchless Violent Dragon Cory? XD Cory's actually a fairly gentle dragon, but I really like the sound of that... Sounds like a title a character in a video game might have.


----------



## SuperXW

Salem Saberhagen said:


> In this case, he's presenting 龍 as a family name.  If it were a title, I might use 龍皇科瑞 instead? (Intended meaning: Cory, Emperor of Dragons)
> 
> Matchless Violent Dragon Cory? XD Cory's actually a fairly gentle dragon, but I really like the sound of that... Sounds like a title a character in a video game might have.


龍皇科瑞/柯瑞 sounds decent.  There are also 龍王(dragon king). For a not so "violent" dragon, we usually have 神龍 (divine dragon), 天龍/海龍/火龍 (sky/sea/fire dragon with different elements...), 飛龍 (flying dragon), 青龍/白龍/黃龍/紫龍 (dragon of different colors...) All of these are decent and popular.

Oh by the way, 科瑞/柯瑞 sounds modern and foreign. I don't know your story setting, just want to remind you, in case you want to name a really old Chinese dragon, better not use 科瑞. Ancient Chinese names have different preferences (for example, they LOVE single characters, especially hard-writing, no-one-recognized ones...), just like those English fantasies, you have to be careful with each name. 

Oh, by the way again, many ancient Chinese scripts have recorded more details of variants of dragons. 
For example, according to baidu: according to different classical texts: some are flying no-leg snakes called 螣蛇; dragon with scales are 蛟龍; with horns are 虬龙; no horns are 螭龍; with wings, 應龍, blah blah...
Pieces of descriptions are not consistent. They often use hard characters to name them which we don't even recognize today. But they just sound really cool...
These difficult names and details often appear in Chinese Wu-xia RPGs, where the ancient Chinese culture are romanticized as the background.


----------



## Salem Saberhagen

> Oh by the way, 科瑞/柯瑞 sounds modern and foreign. I don't know your story setting, just want to remind you, in case you want to name a really old Chinese dragon, better not use 科瑞. Ancient Chinese names have different preferences (for example, they LOVE single characters, especially hard-writing, no-one-recognized ones...), just like those English fantasies, you have to be careful with each name.



Cory's story is an example of the story imitating the writing of it... As an egg he's adopted by an American youth and given the western name Cory, but when he gets older he starts using a Chinese name that sounds roughly similar when he tries to learn more about his background. Picking this name was the main point of the thread. Since Cory is born in 2000AD and was raised outside his homeland it might be ok to have a name that sounds modern/foreign, as it acknowledges his unusual upbringing. But a name that sounds the same (or even closer to his western name) and is traditional might be even better, if such a name could be found... 

I'm thinking I should avoid "神龍," as there are some very popular dragons with that name around, LOL. But I'll keep your other examples in mind in case I want to make additional dragons, I really like the way some of them sound.


----------

