# Ça pardonne pas



## Juju333

Je viens juste de lire le titre d'un article "25-Year-Old Model Got Her Lip Ripped Off by a Pit Bull" et je me suis naturellement dit dans ma tête "Aie, ça pardonne pas". (aie = ouch)

J'aimerais savoir comment dire ça en anglais dans ce contexte très précis.

Merci beaucoup.


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## guillaumedemanzac

You can't forgive that

That's unforgivable!

(except that you can't say that to a dog)

- the full version in French should be: "Cela ne se pardonne pas"  -- though I still think you can't blame the dog for an unforgivable act : I think the writer is blaming the owner for allowing a pit bull terrier free in public with no safeguards.


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## Juju333

No it's not what the expression mean. It means something like "This sort of thing, when it happens, can only do you a lot of harm, it doesn't do you any favor quite the extreme opposite". Pretty hard to explain the meaning I must say. But it has nothing to do with the act of forgiving the dog.

Another example:

- La tasse était brulante et elle a décidé de mettre son doigt à l'intérieur! Il était complétement brulé!
- Ah oui ça pardonne pas! (de faire ça)

It means the act of doing that doesn't spare you any harm followed.


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## Livsnjutare

"(Yep) it's unforgiving".

(eg: "The Venus flytrap may be named after the Roman goddess of love, but its bite is unforgiving.")

You can add qualifiers such as "pretty damn" if you want to underscore the fact that you don't mess around with these things!


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## tartopom

Can we say

It's fatal
?


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## Topsie

FrançaisAnglais*ne pas pardonner⇒* _vi_*be fatal* _vtr + adj_If you set off at 180 km/h and you hit a patch of black ice, that's fatal!


Suggestion (not quite the same register tho'): There's no condoning that!

Cross-posted @tartopom!


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## Juju333

Thank you everybody. Can you say "Ouch. It doesn't spare you!". I guess not but I just want to make sure


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## broglet

tartopom said:


> Can we say
> 
> It's fatal
> ?


Only if it results in death.


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## broglet

Various possibilities:

What a nightmare!/ ... a catastrophe!/ ... a disaster!
How horrific!


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## tartopom

broglet said:


> Only if it results in death.


Hmm, but we can also use the adjective when we speak about sth having a very bad effect. Correct? It's not always linked with sb's death.


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## Juju333

Apparently it is (given his response).


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## broglet

tartopom said:


> Hmm, but we can also use the adjective when we speak about sth having a very bad effect. Correct? It's not always linked with sb's death.


True but as always it depends on context.  Applied to an inanimate object or concept it means "completely destructive".  Applied to a living creature, plant, person or organism it means "causing death".


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## Juju333

Could you say "Ouch, it's full of consequences!"?


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## JClaudeK

Juju333 said:


> Pretty hard to explain the meaning I must say.


See *here*:


> Définition "ne pas pardonner"
> 
> Ne pas épargner, avoir de fâcheuses conséquences. Un coup du sort qui ne pardonne pas.


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## wildan1

guillaumedemanzac said:


> I think the writer is blaming the owner for allowing a pit bull terrier free in public with no safeguards.


Exactly. And to such an irresponsible person I would say _That's unconscionable!_


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## Juju333

I actually don't think there is a proper translation to this...


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## sound shift

"That's terrible!"


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## Juju333

wildan1 said:


> Exactly. And to such an irresponsible person I would say _That's unconscionable!_


But that's not what "Ca pardonne pas!" means.



guillaumedemanzac said:


> I think the writer is blaming the owner for allowing a pit bull terrier free in public with no safeguards.


The writer of what? I'm the one who thought "Ca pardonne pas!" when I read ""25-Year-Old Model Got Her Lip Ripped Off by a Pit Bull". And it's not what I meant at all. I know French ^^


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## sound shift

sound shift said:


> "That's terrible!"


Or "That must have been terrible for her."


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## Juju333

Thank you a lot for all the suggestions but it really doesn't convey the same meaning.


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## sound shift

OK .....

"An attack like that's bound to have dreadful consequences!"


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## broglet

Juju333 said:


> Could you say "Ouch, it's full of consequences!"?


You could but it would be a remarkably mild reaction to someone having their lip ripped off by a dog - un peu comme "ce n'est pas très bon, ça" (and it is not very clear what it means).


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## JClaudeK

Justement, ici, "ça ne pardonne pas" peut paraître comme une remarque un peu sarcastique.

Edit:
J'ai un ami australien qui dit parfois "Ce n'est pas bon, ça !" dans des situations où un Français pourrait dire "ça ne pardonne pas !"
Serait-il donc possible de le traduire par  "That's not good!" ?


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## Juju333

JClaudeK said:


> Justement, ici, "ça ne pardonne pas" peut paraître comme une remarque un peu sarcastique.


Ah? Peut-être que ça pourrait mais dans mon cas non... Peut-être parce que j'ai assez peur des pitbulls d'ou le "aie ça pardonne pas" de se faire mordre par ce type de chien qui sont souvent impressionnants et peuvent être dangereux (sans vouloir rentrer dans le débat "pour ou contre les pitulls")...


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## broglet

JClaudeK said:


> Justement, ici, "ça ne pardonne pas" peut paraître comme une remarque un peu sarcastique.
> 
> Edit:
> J'ai un ami australien qui dit parfois "Ce n'est pas bon, ça !" dans des situations où un Français pourrait dire "ça ne pardonne pas !"
> Serait-il donc possible de le traduire par  "That's not good!" ?


Yes - or maybe "That's not ideal, is it?"


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## Lauretess

broglet said:


> Only if it results in death.


"Can be fatal" maybe


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## Livsnjutare

Juju333 said:


> Thank you a lot for all the suggestions but it really doesn't convey the same meaning.



Mine does (#4)...

Je saisis évidemment le sens du français (expression très utilisée) et l'équivalent anglais est celui que je t'ai donné, en #4 donc, avec un example.


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## joelooc

No second chance    ?


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## Juju333

Livsnjutare said:


> Mine does (#4)...
> 
> Je saisis évidemment le sens du français (expression très utilisée) et l'équivalent anglais est celui que je t'ai donné, en #4 donc, avec un example.


Thank you Livsnjutare but I'm not sure it's really idiomatic, is it? "It's unforgiving" makes sense to my french ears but I'm not sure an English native speaker will understand that. What do they think about this one? Anyone?


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## Livsnjutare

They would absolutely understand the same in that context (your example in #1), in BE anyhow, just like "ça (ne) pardonne pas". See my example (lifted from the net).

Another one from the Net: "_Pit bulls are unpredictable and their bite is unforgiving._"


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## Juju333

Livsnjutare said:


> They would absolutely understand the same in that context (your example in #1), in BE anyhow, just like "ça (ne) pardonne pas". See my example (lifted from the net).
> 
> Another one from the Net: "_Pit bulls are unpredictable and their bite is unforgiving._"


But here it's used in a full sentence. Not sure if you heard "The little girl stepped over the fence and the tiger mauled her to death" you could just say "Ouch, it's unforgiving". What do you think?


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## rrose17

Juju333 said:


> But here it's used in a full sentence. Not sure if you heard "The little girl stepped over the fence and the tiger mauled her to death" you could just say "Ouch, it's unforgiving". What do you think?


To me it would sound very strange, far too understated for the context. Unforgivable maybe? But then you’re blaming someone, not the little girl.


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## Juju333

Could you say "Ouch there's no going back from that"?


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## rrose17

You could but that would probably get “You think?” or “thank you Captain Obvious!” in response.


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## Juju333

rrose17 said:


> You could but that would probably get “You think?” or “thank you Captain Obvious!” in response.


Hum ok. I'm running out of ideas.


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## le chat noir

"she never got a chance" ?


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## rrose17

A little better is "She never had a chance".
She never _got_ a chance sounds like in her short life she never had any opportunities to make things better.
She never _had_ a chance means it was game over as soon as she climbed over that fence.


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## wildan1

Juju333 said:


> "It's unforgiving"


That expression is used in a completely different context in English--often said about a recipe, plant or a computer program or app that you must be very precise with or you fail.

I don't see it used in the same contexts as _Ça (ne) pardonne_ pas is used in French.


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## guillaumedemanzac

That sort of mistake is not easily forgotten.

You can't/won't forget that for the rest of your life.

( and you're right,* pardonne* is not the right word in English.   "You'll have to live with that for the rest of your life"


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## JClaudeK

Juju333 said:


> Je viens juste de lire le titre d'un article "25-Year-Old Model Got Her Lip Ripped Off by a Pit Bull" et je me suis naturellement dit dans ma tête "Aie, ça pardonne pas". (aie = ouch)


En fait, il manque un chaînon dans ce raisonnement,  c'est sans doute pour ça qu'on a du mal à trouver la bonne formule:

"Avoir la lèvre arrachée par un pitbull, ça ne pardonne pas (= ça entraîne  de fâcheuses conséquences)."  

"Jouer avec un pitbull / s'approcher d'un pitbull, ça ne pardonne pas."  => parce que ça entraîne/ ça peut entraîner de fâcheuses conséquences : avoir la lèvre arrachée, par exemple.


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## wildan1

JClaudeK said:


> (= ça entraîne de fâcheuses conséquences)."


Ok, perhaps that clarifies the previously somewhat opaque explanations for this French expression.

_You dare to play with a pitbull, you get what you ask for!_


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## tswsots

JClaudeK said:


> "Jouer avec un bitbull / s'approcher d'un pitbull, ça ne pardonne pas."  => parce que ça entraîne/ ça peut entraîner de fâcheuses conséquences : avoir la lèvre arrachée, par exemple.



In that case, it would mean something like, "you can't get away with it," "it's bound to end in disaster."

So then, for Juju333's example, I might say,

"Yikes, she didn't get off easy."/ "Yeesh, she couldn't catch a break!"



Juju333 said:


> - La tasse était brulante et elle a décidé de mettre son doigt à l'intérieur! Il était complétement brulé!
> - Ah oui ça pardonne pas! (de faire ça)


"Yeah, you can't get away with doing that."

"Well, yeah, that's _going_ to hurt." (i. e., il est inévitable que ça fasse mal).


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## elroy

_That's what I call irreparable damage! _


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## JClaudeK

Voici quelques exemples où "ça ne pardonne pas" est employé judicieusement:




















Edit:
A mon humble avis, c'est "*be fatal*" proposé par Topsie (#6) qui correspond le mieux.



> fatal
> very serious and having an important bad effect in the future:


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## mollisha

Ouch! That hurts!
Ouch, that's brutal!

(if it's not actually fatal)


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## elroy

JClaudeK said:


> A mon humble avis, c'est "*be fatal*" proposé par Topsie (#6) qui correspond le mieux.


I don't that that works in the original context.  If you said that, you would be implying that she was going to die.


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## JClaudeK

elroy said:


> I don't that that works in the original context.


Mais dans le contexte original, l'expression n'est justement pas appropriée!
En le corrigeant (_"Jouer avec un pitbull / s'approcher d'un pitbull, ça ne pardonne pas/ ça finit forcément mal"_) ça pourrait marcher, non?
cf.:


JClaudeK said:


> "Avoir la lèvre arrachée par un pitbull, ça ne pardonne pas (= ça entraîne de fâcheuses conséquences)."
> 
> "Jouer avec un bitbull / s'approcher d'un pitbull, ça ne pardonne pas."  => parce que ça entraîne/ ça peut entraîner de fâcheuses conséquences : avoir la lèvre arrachée, par exemple.


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## elroy

Even in your version, if you say "it's fatal" it means it leads to death when it happens.

The meaning of "fatal" depends on the context.


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## JClaudeK

Et "this will fatally take a bad turn"?


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## Ikwik64

How about "Poor girl, she's f****d!" ? (Sorry, but I can't think of polite way of saying it.)
Excusez-moi également si je n'ai pas bien compris la signification précise de l'idiome français.


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## JClaudeK

Ikwik64 said:


> How about "Poor girl, she's f****d!" ?


 

Edit: 
Cela correspondrait à "Elle est foutue, la pauvre."


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## elroy

JClaudeK said:


> Et "this will fatally take a bad turn"?


That's not idiomatic, I'm afraid.


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## Topsie

JClaudeK said:


> Edit:
> A mon humble avis, c'est "*be fatal*" proposé par Topsie (#6) qui correspond le mieux.


Et @tartopom en #5 !

Mais pour revenir au contexte précis de @Juju333, ça serait probablement plus naturel pour un anglophone de dire "OMG (or even WTF) how horrendous!" ou quelque chose de ce genre...


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## elroy

Topsie said:


> ça serait probablement plus naturel pour un anglophone de dire "OMG (or even WTF) how horrendous!" ou quelque chose de ce genre...


The version I thought of is "That's brutal!"
But I don't think any of these are really translations of the French expression.  I tried to approximate the meaning (as I had understood it) with "irreparable damage."


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## tswsots

JClaudeK said:


> Et "this will fatally take a bad turn"?


"This will take a fatally bad turn."

Or "This will inevitably take a bad turn."

I don't think we're going to find one English expression that works for all situations.

For choosing a confidant, maybe "It's unforgiving," "There's no margin for error," "Getting this right is critical."

For the cop who's imagining getting someone with a hammer, "It's usually fatal," "There's generally no recovering from that." "It usually does the trick."

For the knife fight, "It proves fatal," "It's his undoing."

For the sun exposure, "It's a recipe for disaster." "It's bound to end badly."


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## Juju333

JClaudeK said:


> Mais dans le contexte original, l'expression n'est justement pas appropriée!
> En le corrigeant (_"Jouer avec un pitbull / s'approcher d'un pitbull, ça ne pardonne pas/ ça finit forcément mal"_) ça pourrait marcher, non?
> cf.:


Alors, dans mon exemple, quand je pense "aie ca pardonne pas" c'est la version courte de "*aie ca pardonne pas* *si on se fait mordre par un pitbull*" car les conséquences vont forcément être dramatiques (et là c'est bien le cas avec pour résultat ses lèvres arrachées).


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## JClaudeK

Oui, mais cette "version courte" n'était visiblement pas comprise par tout le monde.


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## Ikwik64

Si j'ai bien compris "ça pardonne pas" veut dire (1) qu'il s'est passé quelque chose d'affreux, et (2) qu'on n'en reviendra jamais. C'est ça?
Je ne connais pas d'expression anglaise de trois mots pour dire tout ça (à haute voix en tout cas).


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## Juju333

Oui j'aurai dû mieux expliquer dans mon premier poste ce que ça signifiait mais l'expression n'est pas inappropriée dans mon contexte.


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## JClaudeK

Juju333 said:


> .......  mais l'expression n'est pas inappropriée dans mon contexte.


Pour la "version longue" (#57), c'est vrai.


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## JClaudeK

Ikwik64 said:


> Si j'ai bien compris "ça pardonne pas" veut dire (1) qu'il s'est passé quelque chose d'affreux, et (2) qu'on n'en reviendra jamais. C'est ça?


Pas tout à fait:
"ça (ne) pardonne pas" veut dire (1) qu'il s'est passé quelque chose* (pas forcément d'affreux**) (2) qui est/ peut être lourd de conséquences.

Cf.: #14 et #45

Comme ici*: (1) Elle s'est fait mordre par un pitbull (2) et à cause de ça (_ça ne pardonne pas!_), elle est défigurée à vie.

ou**: (1) A peine en vacances, les gens des bureaux se sont exposés au soleil toute la journée (2) et à cause de ça (_ça ne pardonne pas!_), ils ont attrapés de douloureux coups de soleil.


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## Juju333

JClaudeK said:


> Pour la "version longue" (#57), c'est vrai.


Mais je pense que n'importe qui qui connaît l'"expression" (en tout cas les Français natifs), comprendra naturellement ce que j'entends par "aie ça pardonne pas" (version courte) dans ce contexte. La version longue c'est les explications pour ceux qui ne connaissent pas bien le français c'est tout.


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## ain'ttranslationfun?

wildan1 said:


> Ok, perhaps that clarifies the previously somewhat opaque explanations for this French expression.
> 
> _You dare to play with a pitbull, you get what you ask for!_



"Playing with a pitbull is asking for trouble.", peut-être? Or in a lower register "You mess [f***] with a pitbull, it's your a**!"


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## Lauretess

broglet said:


> Only if it results in death.


so what about "can be fatal" ?


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## lentulax

The general idea seems to be ' you don't come back from that,', 'there's no way back from that', 'there's no answer to that', 'there's nothing you can do about that', 'you don't get over that!' (avoiding any suggestion that the person involved has any kind of complicity in the event which has disastrous consequences). However, in the very specific circumstance proposed by the OP, I wouldn't say that any of these are entirely idiomatic responses ; I rather agree with those above who've suggested that something like ''Agh! That's nasty!' or 'Agh! Not good!' would be as near as you'd get.


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## JClaudeK

lentulax said:


> The general idea seems to be ' you don't come back from that,', 'there's no way back from that', 'there's no answer to that', 'there's nothing you can do about that', 'you don't get over that!'


Dans les cas où quelqu'un s'est imprudemment exposé à un danger, je dirais "the bill will come due/ he'll/ you'll pay the price".


Mais


tswsots said:


> I don't think we're going to find one English expression that works for all situations.


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## wildan1

broglet said:


> Only if it results in death.


so what about "can be fatal" ?

As broglet said, only if the result really will be death or the undoing of a person, as in _He made a fatal error _(and it resulted in the experiment blowing up, his losing his job, his being arrested, etc.)

But because the context given is a situation requiring medical attention, we wouldn't say _fatal_ unless the physical condition would result in death.


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## ain'ttranslationfun?

But isn't 'fatal' also used figuratively, like in "That error dealt a death blow to his hopes." ?


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## wildan1

That was the point I was making above--yes, in a figurative sense--as my examples reflected.

However, when dealing with a situation of a serious wound, calling it _"fatal" _when a dog bite would not be fatal (unless rabies were suspected) could be confusing.


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