# All dialects: برضو barDo



## clevermizo

What is this word I keep hearing? Maybe it's obvious but I just don't get it . Someone I know used it in conversation recently but I didn't question it then. It sounds as though it were 'برضو'. I can't think of the sentence now, but here is an exemplar from that Rania Kurdy song:

شايف نفسك، برضو شايفة نفسي.

It's also the name of some café in Beirut. 

Thanks as usual.


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## Nikola

Clevermizo,
It is a colloquial word for also.


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## cute angel

شايف نفسك، برضو شايفة نفسي

It means here you see your self I see my self too

It's an Eghyptien word means also or too


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## elroy

It is used in Palestinian Arabic too.  I'm surprised you didn't know it, Clevermizo.   It's extremely common. 

When I saw the title of the thread, I thought you were going to ask about the etymology, which has puzzled me for a while now.  I've asked several people, but no one has been able to give me an answer.

So I guess I'll take advantage of this thread to ask here and see if anyone can enlighten me.

What does "bardo" come from?  Does it have an Arabic root, or it is a loan word?  If so, what language does it come from?


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## clevermizo

^Haha, I know it's extremely common! I just had no idea what it meant and never asked.

I will edit this if I can dig anything up as to its origins.

ُEdit:

I have found this on an internet forum:


***الكرملي:**** ما قولكم في كلمة برضو المصرية العامية بمعنى أيضًا؟ قيل هي تحريف بأرضه وعندي أنها تحريف بعرضه فما رأيكم؟


***تيمور:*** *الأقرب أن تكون كلمة برضو أو (بردو العامية محرفة عن بأرضه والبعض يرى أن الأقرب أن تكون محرفة عن الكلمة التركية بردَه المستعملة بمعنى أيضًا والمختصرة من كلمة بردَخي).


I don't know if any of this is the case or not, of course. I'm not sure about the connection 'In his land' to 'also'. I also can't vouch for this alleged Turkish word 'bardah' or perhaps 'barde' that is mentioned. According to Logos, the Turkish word for 'also' is just 'de'.



cute angel said:


> شايف نفسك، برضو شايفة نفسي
> 
> It means here you see your self I see my self too


Actually, I would argue that شايف نفسه is the same idiom as شايف حاله which means someone who is conceited, or full of themselves, I think.

That's a digression from the topic, but I thought it worthy to point out. In the song she's basically saying that if this guy can act this way, it's ok for her to act that way too.


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## cherine

elroy said:


> When I saw the title of the thread, I thought you were going to ask about the etymology, which has puzzled me for a while now.


I thought the same, Elias 

Maybe the Turkish origin can make sense. Specially that بأرضه doesn't make sense as a possible origin. This word is used to mean "also" and "pronoun+too" (e.g. me too "ana bardo", you too "enta bardo...).

Some people in Egypt pronounce this word as bardak instead of bardo. Maybe we should ask in the Turkish forum. Maybe we need to check for the Turkish words for "also, too, equally, as well..."



clevermizo said:


> It's also the name of some café in Beirut.


Maybe off-topic, but I thought I'd tell you that this word doesn't have much sense as a name for a café, it could be the name of the French actress Bardot


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## Josh_

I like the word ‘barDu’ because it is such a versatile word in which any English equivalent is lacking. I like words in a foreign language when I can understand their meanings, but can’t completely express it in English, my native language. Anyway, in addition to its usage as an equivalent to “also” and “too” it can be used in the sense of the English “nevertheless,” “still,” or “even so:”

fii gunuud amriikaan kitiir fi-l-3iraa2 wi-barDu mafiish 2amn.
There are many American soldiers in Iraq but still no security.

mish 3ayzak tiruuH il-Hafla.
raayiH barDu!
I don’t want you to go to the party.
Even so, I’m still going / I’m going nevertheless.

Ana fa2iir wa-3andi 3iyaal, nazzilli at-taman, win-nabi.
barDu, ma2darsh anazzilhuulak
I’m poor and have children, lower the price for me, please.
Even so, I can’t lower the price.

It can also be used as an intensifier:

mish kida barDu?
Isn’t that so?

The idea of intensity is closely related to the concepts of “nevertheless” and “even so.” Take for example my sentence:

mish 3ayzik tiruuH il-Hafla.
raayiH barDu!

In the response the speaker is emphasizing the fact that he is going no matter what the other person says.

Anyway, given the fact that the word has usages other than the simple “also” it is understandable that it may not be completely understood at first. I would think that the word occurs in these other contexts as much as it occurs in the context of also.


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## elroy

Josh, I assume you're talking about Egyptian Arabic. Palestinian Arabic usage isn't quite the same.


Josh_ said:


> fii gunuud amriikaan kitiir fi-l-3iraa2 wi-barDu mafiish 2amn.
> There are many American soldiers in Iraq but still no security.


 This is possible, but we would be more likely to use "lissa": "Fii ktiir ijnuud amerkaan bil3iraaq, bas lissa fish 2amaan."


> mish 3ayzik tiruuH il-Hafla.
> raayiH barDu!
> I don’t want you to go to the party.
> Even so, I’m still going / I’m going nevertheless.


 This would not be said in Palestinian Arabic.


> Ana fa2iir wa-3andi 3iyaal, nazzilli at-taman, win-nabi.
> barDu, ma2adarsh anazzilhuulak
> I’m poor and have children, lower the price for me, please.
> Even so, I can’t lower the price.


 Hmm. If this were said in Palestinian Arabic, it would sound incredibly insensitive. It sounds like "I really don't care how poor you are. My prices are inflexible."

It also occurs to me that "bardo" would most likely be used if a previous reason had been given, in which case it has the "also" connotation.


> mish kida barDu?
> Isn’t that so?


 This is another usage that we don't have (although I have to say, I'm not entirely sure what "bardo" is supposed to express in this sentence. More context would be helpful).


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## cherine

Josh with his usual sharp eye for things unnoticed by natives  

Allow me few comments, mostly on usage by Egyptians (as this is the dialect you're using).


> fii gunuud amriikaan kitiir fi-l-3iraa2 wi-barDu mafiish 2amn.
> There are many American soldiers in Iraq but still no security.


Usually we say 3asaaker rather than gonuud. In a sentence like this, the idea may be even expressed like this:
el amrikaan malyiin el 3eraa2, we barDo mafiish amn.
الأمريكان ماليين العراق، وبرضه مافيش أمن.


> mish 3ayzak tiruuH il-Hafla.
> raayiH barDu!


I'll take the male to female form (reminds me of a man talking to his wife or his daughter ) :
mesh 3ayzik tiruu7i'l-7afla
BarDo raya7a
Notice that we start by "barDo"; it gives more emphasis to the insistence/challenge but this doesn't mean we can't say it the other way round, or BarDo 7aruu7.

P.S. Elroy's post reminded me of something important: This defying answer (yes, here it's very defying) is considered impolite if said to your parents. So, only used between spouses who don't mind a domestic fight 


> It can also be used as an intensifier:
> mish kida barDu?
> Isn’t that so?


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## Josh_

elroy said:


> This is another usage that we don't have (although I have to say, I'm not entirely sure what "bardo" is supposed to express in this sentence. More context would be helpful).


As I said, it is an intensifier, it just gives emphasis. Think of it in terms of the English word 'ever' in the sentence:

"This is the best party ever."

What does 'ever' express in this sentence? How does the sentence differ from the same sentence without ever?:

"This is the best party."

They both have the same meaning.  "Ever" doesn't add anything new, it just intensifies the previous statement.


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## elroy

cherine said:


> BarDo raya7a
> Notice that we start by "barDo"; it gives more emphasis to the insistence/challenge but this doesn't mean we can't say it the other way round, or BarDo 7aruu7.


 Indeed, it sounds much better with "bardo" first.  I should point out, though, that "bardo raaye7!" in the context presented by Josh would be *very* defiant. I would *never* say that to my parents.



Josh_ said:


> As I said, it is an intensifier, it just gives emphasis. Think of it in terms of the English word 'ever' in the sentence: "This is the best party ever."


 I'm sorry, but the "ever" example doesn't really help.  I can't use "ever" in your other example, and furthermore, are you saying that in Egyptian you would say "Di a7la 7afla bardo" to mean "this is the best party ever"?

I think an example in Egyptian Arabic would be more helpful.


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## Josh_

I wasn't saying that barDu is used in the same way that 'ever' is used, just to think of it along those lines -- no new meaning added, just emphasis. I don't think it can be used in any situation just certain ones like "mish kida bardu?," "huwwa da kalaam bardu" (is that any way to talk?), etc. Maybe Cherine or another Egyptian forum member can give more examples.


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## cherine

"Mesh keda bardo" is a set expression, so there's no much we can do about it  This is the way we use it: bardo is an intensifier to "mesh keda?" (=Isn't that so?/ n'est-ce pas?)

- el gaww 7arr awi 'n-naharda, mesh keda bardo?
- aywa fe3lan

Here's another example of the use of bardo in the middle of a question for no particular reason  :
- enta mesh bardo olt ennak gayy en-naharda? (didn't you say that you're coming today?)
- aywa bass(e) raa7et 3alayya noma (yeah, but I oversletpt)


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## elroy

Thanks for the further info. 

I can confirm that in Palestinian Arabic we would not say "mish heek bardo?" like that, and we would not randomly use "bardo" as in the second context presented by Cherine.   If we used it, it would mean "Didn't you *also* say...?".  

"Huwwa da kalaam bardo?", however, is familiar to me.  I must have herard it in an Egyptian movie or something.   In Palestinian Arabic, we could use "ay" for emphasis: "Ay haada kalaam (bin7aka)?"

I think we can conclude that in Palestinian Arabic the uses of "bardo" is not as numerous as in Eygptian Arabic, although it's not strictly limited to a simple "also." 

(By the way, Cherine, "raa7at 3alayyi noome" = "I *over*slept.")


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## Andrew___

A person once told me that this is of Turkish origin, as some of you suggest above.


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## ayed

Yes, the word "bardo" is from the Turkish word"*bir de*"which means " as well, also, in addition to"


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## djamal 2008

Does_ Bardo ma aja_ mean he hasn't come yet or he hasn't come either?


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## WadiH

ayed said:


> Yes, the word "bardo" is from the Turkish word"*bir de*"which means " as well, also, in addition to"



That's the first explanation I've heard that makes sense.  It's used in Mecca and Jeddah also (and of course in many other dialects nowadays as a modern borrowing from Egyptian speech).


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## Mahaodeh

djamal 2008 said:


> Does_ Bardo ma aja_ mean he hasn't come yet or he hasn't come either?



I understand it as either.


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## Abu Fahm

I was listening to Levantine arabic phone conversation recordings and I keep hearing the word *bardu*  I am sorry I cant give a better context. My understanding of the recordings is not complete to pinpoint when this word comes up.

Regards


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## L.2

برضو means also


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## Werdan

Bardhu is a very common word in Egyption Arabic rather than Levantine Arabic. We never use it, at least in Syria (you might be talking about a different word though); the Egyption word might mean different things according to its context, but generally it would mean _also, as well _or _again etc.
_However, I'm sure an Egyptian will definitely be better than me in explaining this


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## Abu Fahm

I definetely hear a word atleast similar to that one very friquently in Levantine recordings that I have. In Jordanian conversations for sure.


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## Mahaodeh

Yes, Palestinians and Jordanians use it generally with the same meaning as Egyptian but not as common. It's used but not that much and other words are also used.


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## elroy

In my experience (as a speaker of Palestinian Arabic), the word is extremely common.  It's a run-of-the-mill, everyday word that isn't linguistically marked or anything.


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## Sidjanga

So what's the difference - in meaning or usage - between بردو\برضو and كمان for "also" in PA?


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## elroy

I think you can generally use كمان where you would use بردو, but the opposite is not true, so the uses of كمان are broader.  Specifically, it can mean "(one) more/another/any other" ("noch [mehr/andere]" in German).

Do you want another piece?
Willst Du noch ein Stück?
بدك كمان شقفة؟

Do you have any other brothers?
Hast Du noch andere Brüder?
عندك كمان إخوة؟


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## arabiya123456

Last time I was in Egypt I notised that sometimes برضك was used as an alternative for برضو

Can somebody enlighten us on the difference? And is برضك also used in other dialects?


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## Ghabi

برضك  is the form with the pronoun _-ak_ attached.


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## arabiya123456

^That was what I thought. But does that mean that other pronoun attached varieties exist? And is the meaning different from برضو?


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## cherine

BarDak is just a different form, the -ak is invariable (I wouldn't say to a girl "barDik" nor "barDoko" to a group of people).
The difference between barDak and barDo is just a matter of pronunciation variation, depending maybe on regions or education. You can choose one of them; both are correct.

But I think barDo is more common.


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## djara

ayed said:


> Yes, the word "bardo" is from the Turkish word"*bir de*"which means " as well, also, in addition to"



Bravo Ayed! I submitted "bir de" to Google translate from Turkish to English and this is the result:
adverb: in addition; on top of it; besides; moreover; by the same token; on the side; into the bargain; to boot; item; on the top of it; yea
preposition: plus


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## طالب

Hello 

I'd like to check that *برضه *or *برضو* means _at the same time_ and whether or not it has any other meanings in the dialects where it's present (I know it's used in EA and PA).

شكرا مرة تانية

Here's an EA example:

وبناءً عليه الحكومة بتحاول تساعد في المشكلة دي.  بس لازم برضه الناس تساعد


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## Sidjanga

برضو or بردو generally means "also/too" (see the rest of  this thread).


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## clevermizo

طالب said:


> وبناءً عليه الحكومة بتحاول تساعد في المشكلة دي.  بس لازم برضه الناس تساعد





Sidjanga said:


> برضو or بردو generally means "also/too" (see the rest of  this thread).



Yes, in this context it means "also" - "But the people also need to help."


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## Sidjanga

clevermizo said:


> Yes, in this context it means "also"...


So does it have more than one meaning?


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## clevermizo

Sidjanga said:


> So does it have more than one meaning?



Well, I didn't want to jump to conclusions, but in these posts from the earlier part of the thread:



Josh_ said:


> mish 3ayzak tiruuH il-Hafla.
> raayiH barDu!
> I don’t want you to go to the party.
> Even so, I’m still going / I’m going nevertheless.





elroy said:


> Indeed, it sounds much better with "bardo" first.  I should point out, though, that "bardo raaye7!" in the context presented by Josh would be *very* defiant. I would *never* say that to my parents.



So apparently in (at least) Egyptian Arabic it has at least this other meaning (of a defiant, emphatic contradictory reply to a question). In English we would also say something like "I'm going anyway!" or "No matter what you say, I'm going!". In those contexts we can't use "also" in English.

Now I have a new question along these lines. Suppose my answer to a question was more commentary and less defiance. In Levantine Arabic (such as in PA), could I use barḍo rāye7? Such as a conversation between person A and person B:

A: Lēš biddak itrū7 3a 7aflet fulān? Inte la bit7ibbo w-la 2aṣ7ābo.
ليش بدّك تروح ع حفلة فلان؟ إنت لا بتحبه ولا أصحابه
B: Barḍo rāye7. Ba3ḍ 2aṣ7ābi kamān birū7u w mish ra7 2anijber 2a7ki ma3 in-nās illi ma ba7ibbhom.
برضو رايح. بعض أصحابي كمان بيروحو ومش راح أنجبر أحكي مع الناس اللي ما بحبّهم

Or does barḍo in this sort of construction always imply defiance or disobedience and would otherwise be inappropriate in this situation?


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## cherine

clevermizo said:


> So apparently in (at least) Egyptian Arabic it has at least this other meaning (of a defiant, emphatic contradictory reply to a question). In English we would also say something like "I'm going anyway!" or "No matter what you say, I'm going!". In those contexts we can't use "also" in English.


This is true.
And there's another meaning too, something like "I'd still do that" which is not meant as a defiant reply. I think it would depend on the context -as usual - and the tone, to determine what exactly is meant.
And I think this answers your second question, Mizo, at least in Egyptian Arabic. I believe it's the same in Levantine.

Another example of the "still..." is what we find in this rubaa3iyya of Sala7 Jahin (and Egyptian poet -who wrote in 3ammeyya- and caricaturist):
يا طير يا عالي في السما طُظ فيك
ما تفتكرشي ربنا مصطفيك
برضك بتاكل دود وللطين تعود
تمص فيه يا حلو ويمص فيك

It's a bit hard to give a translation as good as the Arabic text, but note the "barDak" (I think Jahin wrote this in the 60s or 70s, so maybe the time context has an influence, because barDak is becoming less common these days). 
As for the meaning, I think we can translate it as "you still eat worm" = you're not that noble after all.

And there's this other one:
الحلو يَمِّ اليَمّ صابح رايح
سارح في حضن المية سابح سايح
الحلو داب في البحر. قلت أدوقه
وجدت لسة البحر برضك مالح
which roughly means that even though sweetness melted in the sea, the sea still tasted salty.

And there's another usage for barDo: we say كدة برضو to blame someone for doing something. Example:
كدة برضو تسيبني ملطوعة في الشارع (blaming you for making me wait for you -for a long time- in the street)
كدة برضو ما تعملش اللي طلبته منك 

Or without the "keda":
A mother/father could blame a child for playing with another child they disapprove of, saying something like:
برضو بتلعب مع الولد دا؟! أنا مش قلت لك ما تلعبش معاه تاني


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## sarllou18

Hello all,
I have heard this term used a lot in Egyptian conversations and arent sure of what it means exactly, so would appreciate any information on where this word is used and what it means,
Many thanks.


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## AlJaahil

Hi, all -

Resurrecting a dead thread, don't kill me.  (And hopefully this is the right one to reopen?)

I've been listening to Samira Said's song Kollena Ensan and there's a line with bardo that I'm not quite sure how to translate.

The line is transliterated as "_fat7een a7dana 2olobna beyotna we bardo 2aleel_," and translated in various places as "we opened our hearts and our houses and that is not little," or "Opening our arms, our hearts, our homes a little." Would a better translation perhaps be, "Opening our arms, our hearts, our houses and a little more"? I'm slowly working through the song, as it seems to be good 3ammeyya and I love the song (and Samira Said).

Alf shukr!


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## cherine

Hi,

A better translation could be "we're opening our hearts and houses but this is still not enough". It means: we'd love to do more for our guests.
I'm not able to translate فاتحين أحضاننا but it's a welcoming sign.


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## Hemza

Wadi Hanifa said:


> That's the first explanation I've heard that makes sense.  It's used in Mecca and Jeddah also (and of course in many other dialects nowadays as a modern borrowing from Egyptian speech).



Ahlan,

Sorry, I know this thread is old, but don't you think that "bardhu" as it's used in Urban 7ijazi is borrowed from Turkish rather than being borrowed from Egyptian, since 7ijaz was also part of the Ottoman empire? I can't assure you that it's used in Bedouin 7ijazi (the one I speak) as I never went to Saudi Arabia, but at least my mother use it, like "inta bardhu" (you too).


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## WadiH

I think you misunderstood.  I meant that dialects _other than_ Urban Hijazi (e.g. Nadji or Gulf dialects) borrowed it more recently from UH or Egyptian.  That doesn't mean it wasn't borrowed by UH from Turkish, although it's curious why only Egyptian and UH seem to have borrowed it and not Syrian.


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## Hemza

Ohhhhh I'm sorry, you're right, a complete misunderstood from me .


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