# Haber in the infinitive, non-auxiliary!!



## Moxy1030

This thread was previously posted under the title "Haber" but I am now looking for something a little different and more specific, does anyone have thoughts on how Haber would translate into English in the infinitive,  as a *NON-AUXILIARY VERB?*


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## Bilma

There is 
There are


There is a book Hay un libro
Therea are books Hoy libros


In the infinitive would be *There be*


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## mhp

Hay una cosa = There is one thing
Hay dos cosas = There are two things
hay que ser optimista = you/we/they/one must be optimistic;

There is also (haber de) but that can be considered auxiliary form.

Do you have any particular sentence in mind?


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## Outsider

Although it can be used in some idioms, as Mhp has shown, the most common translation of "haber" as a standalone verb is "there to be" (_not_ "to have").


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## Soy Yo

I agree with Outsider; if you mean the infinitive for the meaning of "hay"... the infinitive in English is "there to be."


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## Bilma

Soy Yo said:


> I agree with Outsider; if you mean the infinitive for the meaning of "hay"... the infinitive in English is "there to be."


 

I always thought the infinitive was *there be* not *there to be*.


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## Outsider

In English, the citation form of a verb includes "to". The only exceptions are defective verbs like the modals "must", "can", "should", and so on.


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## Bilma

It was a serious question....no need to make fun


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## Bilma

Outsider said:


> In English, the citation form of a verb includes "to". The only exceptions are defective verbs like the modals "must", "can", "should", and so on.


 

Thanks 

I thought or I was taught there be was an exception too. I guess I have been wrong all these years


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## Outsider

I have always read "there to be" in textbooks...


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## Bilma

Thanks Learned!


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## Moxy1030

I am looking for a translation that makes sense in English, I understand what you are trying to say by "there to be" but does that really make sense?


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## mhp

Moxy1030 said:


> I am looking for a translation that makes sense in English, I understand what you are trying to say by "there to be" but does that really make sense?



But what is the sentence that you want to translate? Please give an example of a sentence that is giving you trouble.

  For example:
Para que haya una mañana, tenemos que actuar hoy
For there to be a tomorrow, we must act today


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## vince

Puede haber un error = There may be an error


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## gwrthgymdeithasol

Moxy1030 said:


> I am looking for a translation that makes sense in English, I understand what you are trying to say by "there to be" but does that really make sense?



No! Translating 'haber' in its infinitive non-auxiliary form depends on what other verbs it's used with, but roughly it will usually be equivalent to 'be', just as its 'present' tense equivalent 'hay' implies 'is' (the 'there' in 'there is' is only a grammatical 'dummy').


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## Outsider

However, "to be" and "there to be" are different verbs, with different meanings.


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## gwrthgymdeithasol

Outsider said:


> However, "to be" and "there to be" are different verbs, with different meanings.



But 'there to be' isn't a verb (and it's an unusual phrase)...And although it would be wrong to translate '(to) be' as 'haber', I agree, what I meant was it would usually be right to translate 'haber' (occurring in that form, and if you really needed to translate it at all) as 'be' .


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## Outsider

gwrthgymdeithasol said:


> But 'there to be' isn't a verb [...]


What makes you say that? 



gwrthgymdeithasol said:


> And although it would be wrong to translate '(to) be' as 'haber', I agree, what I meant was it would usually be right to translate 'haber' (occurring in that form, and if you really needed to translate it at all) as 'be' .


I cannot think of any case where a standalone "haber" is not translated as "there" + some form of the verb "to be".


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## gwrthgymdeithasol

Outsider said:


> What makes you say that?



Simply because verbs don't begin with 'there' 



Outsider said:


> I cannot think of any case where a standalone "haber" is not translated as "there" + some form of the verb "to be".



Hay que haber excepciones!


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## mazbook

Hola Outsider:





Outsider said:


> I cannot think of any case where a standalone "haber" is not translated as "there" + some form of the verb "to be".


In that case, how would you translate the very common «No hay.»?

Saludos desde Mazatlán


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## Outsider

Literally, "There is none," or "There aren't any", etc., although in some cases "We haven't got any" might be a better translation. 
(Unless that's a Spanish idiom I wasn't familiar with yet, of course... )


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## mazbook

Hola Outsider:

Although your literal translations make sense, it's the ordinary way of saying, "I/We don't have any/it." in México.  "We haven't got any." would be a very British way of saying it, but "haven't got" is considered poor English in the U.S. 

The reason that "There is none." or "There aren't any." is NOT a correct translation is that those are both general/global, meaning, to a native English speaker, "Nobody has any." or "There aren't any...*anywhere.*", which is a very different meaning.

Saludos desde Mazatlán


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## heidita

Mazbook, I hope Outsider could follow you because I am lost here.

_No hay_ is always said in a contest, just as _there isn't/aren't_

So the equivalent in Spain for :

No hay leche (en casa).

would be

There is no milk (in the house).

I can imagine somebody going to the fridge. Saying : Listen, there is no milk here as you said. No hay leche.

I don't get your point.


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## mhp

mazbook said:


> The reason that "There is none." or "There aren't any." is NOT a correct translation is that ...


Words don’t have a fixed translation. The general meaning of “No hay” is “There is not”. Any additional nuance depends on the context.

no hay día en que no pienso en ti
(not a day goes by without my/me thinking about you)
no hay como un masaje en la espalda
(there’s nothing like a good back rub) 
no hay quien lo aguante 
(he’s absolutely unbearable)


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## Marias-espanol

Moxy1030 said:


> I am looking for a translation that makes sense in English, I understand what you are trying to say by "there to be" but does that really make sense?


 
Hola,
No this does not make sense in English. I can not think of a sentense that you would say "there to be".

Haber-there to be
Hay-there is; there are (This is how I would use it in English.)
Habrá-there will be
Había-there was, were, used to be

Hope this helps!
Maria


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## Marias-espanol

heidita said:


> Mazbook, I hope Outsider could follow you because I am lost here.
> 
> _No hay_ is always said in a contest, just as _there isn't/aren't_
> 
> So the equivalent in Spain for :
> 
> No hay leche (en casa).
> 
> would be
> 
> There is no milk (in the house).
> 
> I can imagine somebody going to the fridge. Saying : Listen, there is no milk here as you said. No hay leche.
> 
> I don't get your point.


 
Yes that is correct in Spanish.
No hay leche (en casa).
In English that would be. There is not any milk in the house.
Maria


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## mhp

Marias-espanol said:


> Hola,
> No this does not make sense in English. I can not think of a sentense that you would say "there to be".



What's your objection to my translation in message #13?
"For there to be a tomorrow, we must act today"


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## nelliot53

Marias-espanol said:


> Hola,
> No this does not make sense in English. I can not think of a sentense that you would say "there to be".
> 
> Haber-there to be
> Hay-there is; there are (This is how I would use it in English.)
> Habrá-there will be
> Había-there was, were, used to be
> 
> Hope this helps!
> Maria


 

María, how about "There is to be a party tonight."=Va a haber una fiesta esta noche.


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## Marias-espanol

Hola,
 Yes you are right.  I was not thinking about useing it that way.
Sorry.  That is like in the future isn't it?



mhp said:


> What's your objection to my translation in message #13?
> "For there to be a tomorrow, we must act today"


Maria


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## Marias-espanol

Hola,
No that is not proper English. It should be "There will be a party tonight." or "There is a party tonight." or "There is going to be a party tonight."



nelliot53 said:


> María, how about "There is to be a party tonight."=Va a haber una fiesta esta noche.


 
Maria


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## Marias-espanol

Hola,
I just have not used it that way, but I have heard it like that.
Check this site out! It was sent to me and it has helped me with Spanish.
VERBLIST-There is a site that tells all the "Spanish Verb Forms".
I can't post it because I have not made 30 post.
If you click on my name and go to "find threads started by Marias-espanol"
and then click on dijo, digo, then to post #4 This is the Verbs. 

I hope it helps!
If you don't find it let me know and after I have posted 30 post I will send it to you.

Maria


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## Askaks

A ver, a ver, expliquense porque ya me hicieron pelotas 

El *haber* venido a este foro a explicar como usar "*haber*" nos da idea que tiene que *haber* conexión lógica en sus respuestas. A ver si entendí.
*Haber* muchas respuestas no ser correcto porque entonces sonar raro, cierto? 
Pero puede *haber* una que otra que le guste a alguien.
A ver si me entienden 
¡Ahí se ven!


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## jess diane

You could translate it very loosely with "to exist"  or "to be"...
hope it helps


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## POPmuzik

Soy Yo said:


> I agree with Outsider; if you mean the infinitive for the meaning of "hay"... the infinitive in English is "there to be."


 
which is the correct sentence?

I agree or a I am agree?


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## Askaks

"I agree" is the correct form.


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## vince

Here's a use of "there to be" in English:

"I want there to be 3 gifts" = "Quiero que haya 3 regalos" (haya is part of haber)



heidita said:


> Mazbook, I hope Outsider could follow you because I am lost here.
> 
> _No hay_ is always said in a contest, just as _there isn't/aren't_



Just a small correction:

contest (english) = concurso
e.g. "I won $500 in a contest"

I think you mean "response".


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## heidita

Marias-espanol said:


> Yes that is correct in Spanish.
> No hay leche (en casa).
> In English that would be. There is not any milk in the house.
> Maria


 
..is the same as: there is no milk in the house.


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## heidita

vince said:


> Here's a use of "there to be" in English:
> 
> "I want there to be 3 gifts" = "Quiero que haya 3 regalos" (haya is part of haber)
> 
> 
> 
> Just a small correction:
> 
> contest (english) = concurso
> e.g. "I won $500 in a contest"
> 
> I think you mean "response".


Vince, typo.


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## heidita

Marias-espanol said:


> Hola,
> No that is not proper English. It should be "There will be a party tonight." or "There is a party tonight." or "There is going to be a party tonight."
> 
> 
> 
> Maria


 
Resultados *1* - *10* de aproximadamente *2.470.000* de *"there is to be"*. (*0,51* segundos

So much to "there is to be" isn't "_proper English_"


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## gwrthgymdeithasol

heidita said:


> Resultados *1* - *10* de aproximadamente *2.470.000* de *"there is to be"*. (*0,51* segundos
> 
> So much to "there is to be" isn't "_proper English_"



Yes, it is indeed 'proper' English. Nothing wrong with 'there is to be a party tonight', apart from the fact that it sounds a rather too formal way to announce something so, er, teenage.

As for the rest of the thread, the point's been lost somewhere along the way. LOL


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## heidita

gwrthgymdeithasol said:


> Yes, it is indeed 'proper' English. Nothing wrong with 'there is to be a party tonight', apart from the fact that it sounds a rather too formal way to announce something so, er, teenage.
> 
> As for the rest of the thread, the point's been lost somewhere along the way. LOL


 
True, very true.

I also think it is a very formal way of speaking.


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## geostan

Bilma said:


> I always thought the infinitive was *there be* not *there to be*.



Here is an example:

I want there to be no misunderstanding.


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## Soy Yo

Bilma said:


> I always thought the infinitive was *there be* not *there to be*.


 
Creo que "there be" = subjuntivo de "there to be"...pero puede que esté equivocado.


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## Marias-espanol

Hola,

This is the site that I promised to you.
http://users.ipfw.edu/juhle/VERBLIST.HTM 
I hope it helps.
Maria


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