# pays / région / état



## Soleil_Couchant

*Moderator note: *This discussion has been separated from the original discussion here.

This is about pays vs. états. Okay, so three times now, I've had a French person ask me "quel pays ?" after I tell them I'm from the United States. That's like asking me:
 "What country are you from?"
"United States!"
 "Oh really? What country?"
"..."

or if you want the French equivalent / l'inverse to show you how it "sounds" on my end, if someone where to ask you:  "Quel est son pays d'orgine ?" "France !" "Ah bon, quel pays ?" "..uh.."


I've gotten slightly confused every time before realizing they're asking me what state within the US I'm from. Are these people just mistaken? Or are people in France taught to say "pays" for each state in the US (like Texas, Maryland, etc.)? I would assume it's état, not pays. The US is one country...not a country of countries...


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## Reynald

Next time, tell them you're from America so they can ask the right question... 
But seriously, I have never heard such a mix-up. We do use "État" today.
(You will find "pays" in old texts [le_ Pays des Illinois_, for example]. But it refers to the territory of the tribe, not to the State in the modern sense).


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## Soleil_Couchant

That's actually what happened today...I said "America"...and he was like "quel pays?" and I was like "oh, uh, Etats-Unis?"...and he was like "I know, but what..." I was like "oh, état ?" haha. The other times, I'd said "Etats-Unis..."

Anyway, it's weird because it's happened with three different people! And even still, within the US, "America" is shorthand for United States of America, but I know people outside of the US don't seem to share that opinion lol. (It's not like we're saying "North America!")


Edit: To the last line you added, okay thanks. I also wondered if it's a regional thing. I never heard people making that mistake when I lived in Paris. But now in the center-west-ish of France, I've heard it three times. So maybe it developed regionally as a result of some ancient usage?


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## Reynald

There is another sense of _pays_:


> *2. [Dans une accept. restreinte] *
> a) Partie plus ou moins étendue d'une nation: province, région, canton. Habitudes, traditions d'un pays; vin* de pays. Le ciel (...) sourit toujours en Touraine, où les automnes sont magnifiques. Dans ce pays hospitalier...


www.cnrtl.fr/definition/pays

So yes, it may be a regional way of speaking. They may use _pays_ more commonly than _région_ where you live.


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## tartopom

S_C you're meeting funny guys !! If your answer was ' the US / the USA ' they should have asked 'what state'.

If you replied ' America or American' now it's another kettle of fish. Because America is a continent too. Canadians are American and Peruvians too. Am I saying some rubbish ??
I'd probably say ' Je suis Etasunienne' if I wanted to say 'I'm from the US'.

Funny that one people has taken the name of a whole continent !!!


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## Soleil_Couchant

Ma petite pomme, no, there is no continent called America! There is North America (Amérique du Nord) which includes Canada, the USA, Mexico, the Caribbean islands, etc.  Then, a separate continent, is South America (Amérique du Sud). This contains Peru, Brazil, Argentina, Venezuela, and many others.

In English, we're called Americans. That's just what it is. Never United States-ians or anything else. American = person from the US. I'd be shocked to hear a Mexican or Canadian calling themselves American!  In my high school French classes, we were taught to say "je suis américain/e"....  So, if you hear someone saying they're from America, or are American, they mean the US. We don't all ourselves "North American..." (to mean USA. Now_ that _would be "one people taking a whole continent").

It was only when I left the North American continent (haha) that I noticed some people found it weird to call Americans, well, American. I'm like, but, that's what we're called! America is merely a shortened form of The United States of America.

(Now, "Latin America" is another thing...but I'll stop here haha)


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## tartopom

Wow !! I was sure ' Amérique' was a continent !!!!! Like 'Europe' and 'Afrique'. I didn't know it didn't work in English. Thanks for teaching me that.

So I guess that if you say " Je suis Américaine" some people - specially me !! and maybe just me in fact !!!!  - could think you're from ' le continent américain". And not just from the States. Maybe from Argentine or Mexico.  Can you follow my brain ??


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## Soleil_Couchant

I don't think it's just you...it seems other people (outside of North America) make this mistake, too. But rest assured, if someone says "je suis american/e" they mean they are from the United States. I can follow your brain, I guess maybe you weren't taught to distinguish North America and South America in school? Maybe that big blob over to the west is just considered "America"? But definitely, South America and North America are completely different continents!

Now, I can't vouch for how Latin Americans refer to themselves to other Spanish-speaking countries...they might say "americano" or something to refer to "the Americas" (north and south) to distinguish being from Spain or Europe, for example. But that's another ball of wax that I'm ignorant about since I don't speak Spanish and am not Latin American. Latin America is not an actual country/continent, but is a certain grouping of countries in North and South America. Maybe that's where some of the confusion comes from.


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## tartopom

Interesting S_C.
I didn't know there were 2 continents i.e. North America and South America.

Edit: Then the inhabitants are North Americans ?? I mean for example a Canadian is a North American ??


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## Blougouz

Soleil_Couchant said:


> Now, I can't vouch for how Latin Americans refer to themselves to other Spanish-speaking countries...they might say "americano" or something to refer to "the Americas" (north and south) to distinguish being from Spain or Europe, for exampl


Not really sure how to understand your question here...

I confirm that from France, America is one very big continent, including North/Center/South parts of America. (The term "America" is italian roots name Amerigo).

The inhabitants of America are: the natives from there, and also those coming from other continents like Europe, or Africa...

In fonction of the langage they are speaking in their American country, Americans says they are: Americans, Américains, Americanos... Because they speak different languages...

And when you say you are from this continent, logically you are asked from which country. And then you would answer United-States (of America).
In French you could say you are " Étasunienne".
Your neighbour would say he is Mexican (Mexicain) //or Bresilian (Bresilien), on the top to be North American for one or South american for the other one. (If they say it in English or French). They would say it in spanish if they are talking in spanish language.

Like for example I wouldn't say to you: "I am Européenne" just because I am Frenchspoken, but I would say the whole thing in English... Right?

I hope I've helpt you...?


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## Seeda

It has to be a regionalism. I've met some pretty dense people in my life but I can't think of anyone who would ask _De quel pays ?_ in reply to _Je viens des États-Unis_, unless they misheard you or they were just fucking with you.
Regarding _l'Amérique_, in French it does encompass the whole section of land going from Canada to Chile. L'Amérique du Nord et l'Amérique du Sud sont des *sub*continents.


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## Soleil_Couchant

*Seeda* -- Okay, well, in North America, we're taught that there are seven continents. So no, we are not one big giant one called America with two subcontinents...to us, that does not exist. That's not how it works and is never what we are taught. So it's clearly a different thing we're taught in school. That's actually something I learned today from this conversation...not every country is taught the same thing about how many continents there are.  I wrongly assumed that was the same worldwide (that everyone is taught there are seven continents). Clearly not, and that would explain why Europeans get confused with how we talk about America. (we use the word "America" as a shorthand way of saying "The United States of America." You use it to describe the big mass of land comprised of North and South America!!)

And, I swear these three people were not f-cking with me at all. The first two, when they asked where I'm from, I said "États-Unis." And they asked, right after, "Quel pays ?" I swear on the Bible. I'd give them a blank stare and repeated "États-Unis"...I remember one girl in particular, after I repeated "États-Unis" with a confused look, she kind of stuttered and was like "oh, uh...quelle... ville ?" It's like she had no idea that the word was supposed to be "état" and had used "pays" by accident.  And then today, it was some older guy...and this time, yes, I said I was "American" after he guessed that I was English. When he said "Quel pays?" I assumed he must have been confused about the whole "America = North & South America" that Europeans evidently think, so I answered with "États-Unis!" And he immediately was like, "_Yes,_ I know_,_ but ... what ...uh..." and I was like "état?" And he was like "ETAT! Yes!" And so I said my state (let's say it's Idaho) and he was like "Idaho, okay!" So really, it's like they don't know what word they're supposed to use.


*Blougouz* -- as far as all my talk about America and Latin America and South America, etc...there was no question there. That was a sidetrack in response to tartopom thinking America is a continent (in English, it's not...we have two separate continents there, North America and South America...see my first comment to Seeda). My original question was why some French people refer to the states of the United States (such as Texas, California) as "pays" and not "états."


*tartopom *- Yes, Canadians are North Americans, or "from North America." They are not Americans. Americans are people who live the USA, aka America. (In English, anyway.) For example, if you hear terms like "anti-American sentiment" they're talking about people being anti-USA. Poor Mexico and Canada aren't dragged into that, let alone Peru or Brazil!...


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## Blougouz

Soleil_Couchant said:


> My original question was why some French people refer to the states of the United States (such as Texas, California) as "pays" and not "états."


I suppose that French people could maybe be confused since their own country is a state and their state a country?...

In French it is certainly not so easy to ask: "tu habites dans quel état?", as the État is more a concept than a location? Specially for those who don't speak any English...
?

Or because of a double-meaning with: "dans quel état je suis?!"


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## Blougouz

Soleil_Couchant said:


> anti-American sentiment" they're talking about people being anti-USA. Poor Mexico and Canada aren't dragged into that, let alone Peru or Brazil!...


Very good point!


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## Soleil_Couchant

Blougouz said:


> I suppose that French people could maybe be confused since their own country is a state and their state a country?...
> 
> In French it is certainly not so easy to ask: "tu habites dans quel état?", as the État is more a concept than a location? Specially for those who don't speak any English...?



Right, that could be it. There's got to be something to it....in English, we call them "states." But after three different people called them "pays"...I was wondering if maybe in French it's different (as far as what they call Maryland, Texas, California, Philadelphia, etc.; i.e.)

Okay, look, on this page (talking about driver's license exchange), they call them Etats. (I knew to check here because if you have a driver's license from certain states in the US, you're able to automatically switch those to a French license. But it varies by state). Note also the use of "américain" here to refer to our driver's licenses, not Etatsunisienne...

Le permis de conduire - France in the United States / Embassy of France in Washington, D.C.

and here (at the very bottom) Peut-on circuler aux États-Unis sans le permis de conduire américain ? | France-ESTA.fr

In any case, maybe there's not much need to describe American "states" for some people in France (not a ton of exposure to Americans), so the word isn't right there in their minds?


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## Blougouz

French people are definitely supposted to know about États/states (not countries) of the US, no doubt on that!
In the French mind (and philisophy) _l'État_ is often link to _l'État de droit_, a political concept, like an ideal... And the _country_ is considered as your _fatherland_. (Patrie) so I suppose there could be a confusion in how to interprete the symbolic. (?) as I wrote earlier, hard for French people to consider that you live in a "état". And from our "small" country, the States of US are seen quite similar to "countries".

I've had a look on the embassy stuff... I noticed a lot of anusual orthographic or meaning mistakes, heavy style... For me it looks to be a poor translation, that I suppose to be from a not fluent French spoken US citizen...

Also an other point... Everyone knowing that only US citizen are calling themselves as American, they could have understood you  better... Or... Absent minded!

But by the way: why US citizen call themselves Americans like the continent?


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## Reynald

S_C, do you make a liaison when you answer these people? (It's a compulsory liaison, and with an article you have two compulsory liaisons: Étazuni / lézétazuni / je viens des zétazuni).


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## Soleil_Couchant

Reynald, yes. I make the liaison when I speak. I don't says "Eh-tatz ... You-ni". I say "Lezetazuni." They always know what I'm talking about (USA), if that's what you're implying... the problem is they are using the word "pays" when trying to ask what state I'm from.



FrenchymcB said:


> But by the way: why US citizen call themselves Americans like the continent?



Sigh, they don't. As I thought I made clear...in English, there is no continent called America. We have two: North America and South America. In English, "America/Americans" = refers only to The United States of America. That's how it is. On the contrary, in Europe, you use "America" (which we use as shorthand for one country, the USA) to described two entire continents.


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## Reynald

Si l'on suit la piste d'une façon de parler courante, mais locale, ils te demandent peut-être de quelle ville des É-U tu viens.
En effet, dans le _Dictionnaire du monde rural,_ de M. Lachiver, outre le sens déjà mentionné de "région, contrée _(pays plat_, pays de plaine)", on trouve celui de "village, commune. _Habiter le pays_, être né dans le pays", ou celui de petite ville : "_Aller au pays_, se rendre au chef-lieu de la commune quand on habite un hameau".


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## Soleil_Couchant

Reynald, that very well could be!  It's probably a matter of the idea of "Etats" being a bit strange to the French (like blougouz said) and maybe not making a clear distinction between the concepts of states (like Louisiana) and cities (like New Orleans). They're probably just trying to ask what "general area/place" are you from without making all the distinctions in terminology like we do in the US. Which is obviously understandable, b/c it doesn't really have daily relevance to them. So, in the future I'll just assume they're asking "what area/city/state/whatever are you from" when they ask that. (It probably doesn't help that something like "New York" could refer to the state or the city, haha)


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## tartopom

Or Washington !!


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## jekoh

Reynald said:


> There is another sense of _pays_:
> 
> www.cnrtl.fr/definition/pays
> 
> So yes, it may be a regional way of speaking. They may use _pays_ more commonly than _région_ where you live.


I agree with this post, they were probably asking which region you were from, S_C, not which state specifically.

My mother's friend was from the Pays de Caux (NW France), and I remember he would always say _pays_ when meaning _région, _it would appear they say that in your _pays_ as well.


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## Soleil_Couchant

Voilà ! That must be it. Thanks Reynald and jekoh!


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## Reynald

P.S. Il me revient aussi que les Cadiens _(Cajuns)_ de Louisiane, dont les ancêtres étaient majoritairement du Poitou, emploient toujours ce mot dans ce sens aujourd'hui. On le retrouve aussi bien dans de vieilles chansons transmises oralement que dans des chansons de musiciens contemporains. Quelques exemples :

Chère petite, joli coeur
Tu m'as laissé pour t'en aller
Avec un autre, mais chère petite fille
*Dans l'pays de la Louisiane*
(_Jolie Blonde_, Harry Choates)

Les petites Cadjines de la Louisiane
*Les meilleures cuiseuses du pays,*
(_Dedans le Sud de la Louisiane_, Alex Broussard)

*On a trouvé notre pays
La Louisiane *notre Paradis
Les prairies et les marais
La meilleure place pour habiter
(_Acadie à la Louisiane_, Bruce Daigrepont.
Bonne chanson, en passant. )


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## Soleil_Couchant

AHAAahhahaaaa there you go, because I am in the Poitou region! So it is a thing here!! Okay! Thank you for finding that! Well next time it happens, I'll certainly remember this whole conversation and I won't just repeat "les Etats-Unis" with a confused look on my face when they ask "quel pays ?"


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## Nicomon

Soleil_Couchant said:


> And even still, within the US, "America" is shorthand for United States of America, but I know people outside of the US don't seem to share that opinion lol. (It's not like we're saying "North America!")


  I do share that opinion.  If I hear _America_ by itself without the added North/South,  I immediately think USA.
I might understand differently if the person said _Amérique_ in French, instead of _États-Unis. _

Same goes if I hear_ Americans / Américains _(in both English and French).  I think they're from USA.   I can't get used to _Étasuniens. _Don't like the sound. 
As a _Quebecer/Canadian_, I would never say _I'm American _and probably not even _North American. 
_
If I say _Québécoise,_ you know I'm from the province (not state or country) of Quebec.
If I say _Canadienne_,  I mean the country... Canada.  But you'll probably guess from my accent that I'm not from Vancouver, BC. 

This confirms what you wrote earlier, S_C. 





> In the US, many students are taught that there are seven continents on Earth which are Africa, Asia, Australia/Oceania, Antarctica, Europe, South America,
> and North America. However, in many other parts of the world, a different definition is taught.


 Source : Does the World have 6 or 7 continents?

When I learned geography, way back when, the teachers said *5* : _Afrique, Amérique,  Asie,  Europe,  Océanie_. 
I think they have since added _Antartique_ in schools.


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## Soleil_Couchant

*YES* Nicomon, thank you!! I needed someone to back me up here, especially someone else from North America who isn't an American/(which, I repeat, means, someone from the USA lol)!


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## Philippides

Je trouve la suggestion de Reynald au #28 assez rassurante : un régionalisme poitevin !
Car sinon, comme tous les intervenants de ce fil je trouve l'emploi du mot pays extrêmement curieux


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## Paname

Je pense que cet emploi est également générationnel.
J'ai fréquemment entendu des personnages âgées (nées dans les années 10, 20 ou 30 à vue de nez) utiliser "pays" pour désigner une ville ou une région. Je ne crois pas que certaines étaient poitevines.


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## Soleil_Couchant

Thanks, Paname!


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## Philippides

Paname said:


> Je pense que cet emploi est également générationnel.
> J'ai fréquemment entendu des personnages âgées (nées dans les années 10, 20 ou 30 à vue de nez) utiliser "pays" pour désigner une ville ou une région. Je ne crois pas que certaines étaient poitevines.


Une ville ou une région, oui, sans aucun doute.
Mais un Etat des Etats-Unis, alors même que le terme Etat se retrouve dans le noms du pays, c'est vraiment étrange.


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## Paname

Je suis d'accord.
Mais il ne me semble pas que Soleil couchant soit certain que les personnes aient voulu dire "état". C'est une interprétation qu'il a faite, non ?


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## Nicomon

Soleil_Couchant said:


> *YES* Nicomon, thank you!!


  My pleasure.     I just added something to my post.


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## Soleil_Couchant

Paname, what I'm thinking now is that people were just asking me from what area I was from...probably not making the distinction of a "state" in their minds. In the US, the notion of a state is a very important and concrete thing. A natural question would be to ask someone from the US "what state are you from?" Because that's how things are broken down there. But, again, I'm thinking now that perhaps this concept isn't carrying over in French/France. I mean, I'll ask you, what would you call an American state? As in, Maryland, Florida, California, Vermont, Alaska, Delaware, Texas, Oregon, Illinois...? These are states, there are 50 of them that make up the country (i.e., United States...Etats-Unis). What are they called in French? (if anything?)


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## Philippides

They are definitely called "Etats" and that's why we all find weird that someone may use the word "pays" in this context. Especially if the notion of american state is unclear to them because they consider that the USA make a single entity just as France, where as someone mentioned above, you can't really tell between le Pays, la Nation, l'Etat, why would they ask the question?
The regionalism explanation is the only one that makes sense to me.


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## Oddmania

I once met a Frenchman who insisted that Texas was a _country _(un pays), and that therefore the United States was a _continent_. Boy, did I cringe.


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## jekoh

Presumably they ask you what region you are from, rather than which State, because like most people in Europe they only have limited knowledge of where each individual State actually is. Makes perfect sense.

I mean, if an American were to ask you where you live, would you assume the name of your _département_ is the expected answer?


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## Soleil_Couchant

jekoh, _is_ the department what I should respond with if someone asks where I live (in France)? I usually just say the city or the general area, but, let me know if that's wrong 



Oddmania said:


> I once met a Frenchman who insisted that Texas was a _country _(un pays), and that therefore the United States was a _continent_. Boy, did I cringe.



Haha, I feel like a Texan would be very pleased to hear that (considering they tried it before). The first part, anyway (being their own country). But not that the US was a continent...


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## jekoh

No, I'm saying it's only natural to ask about the general region rather than someting more specific like _départements _or states (or German Länder, etc.), because US states and especially _départements _have little relevance to people halfway around the world.


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## Reynald

Pour confirmer tout ce qui précède et


Paname said:


> Je pense que cet emploi est également générationnel.
> J'ai fréquemment entendu des personnages âgées (nées dans les années 10, 20 ou 30 à vue de nez) utiliser "pays" pour désigner une ville ou une région. Je ne crois pas que certaines étaient poitevines.


une référence supplémentaire :
Dans le _Vocabulaire du français des provinces _(éditions Garnier), qui est un  « dictionnaire des provincialismes ou des régionalismes »  qui retient « ce qui demeure aujourd'hui vivant, en usage dans une conversation en langue française », on trouve, noté comme régionalisme, sans précision sur une région particulière :

PAYS - Région, contrée, ville où l'on est né, patrie // Petite localité, village. _C'est la fête au pays_.


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## Nicomon

Gilles Vigneant a écrit :   _Mon pays ce n'est pas un pays, c'est l'hiver._

En parlant du Québec - ou plus particulièrement de la ville où il est né, dans la région nord du Québec.  
Mais je crois qu'il faut lire aussi entre les lignes que le Québec n'est toujours pas un pays, mais une province du Canada.


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## Soleil_Couchant

Reynald, okay, thanks. So, when they ask me "quel pays," it is indeed a regional thing (using "pays"), and they aren't really specifically asking about the state but just asking me (in general) where in the US I'm from. I will know next time how to respond.

I had to laugh a little to myself (inwardly)...I was at a train station today and someone began a conversation with me. All in English, though. At first she thought I was from England, but when I told her "United States" her instant next question was "Oh? What state?"  I was like YESSS this person gets it!  When I told her the state, she was like "Oh okay, so that's north of xyz..." I did the math in my head and was like, "why yes, you're right!" semi-surprised and definitely impressed. Then she told me she had actually lived in the US for several years a while back...so then it made sense. And she was from Ile de France, so you know. But still. I had to laugh because it reminded me of all these things we were discussing on this thread.


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## DrChen

It must be generational, I think that people of my generation (late twenties) use all words exactly the same way American people do. If we were to say "en Amérique", we would definitely mean "the US" ("aux Etats-Unis" works perfectly well too of course). If you were to say that you have, say, traveled from Canada to the US and then Mexico, you could say "j'ai fait toute l'amérique du nord".
Also, I have often heard "les Amériques" to refer to both continents. (I'm not sure whether you guys say "the Americas" too though)


Soleil_Couchant said:


> I've had a French person ask me "quel pays ?" after I tell them I'm from the United States.


I could never imagine anyone *my age* asking that question  to be frank, I would think they are ignorant.


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## Soleil_Couchant

DrChen, we do say "the Americas" sometimes. I mean, not often. But yes, I've heard that used as a broad way to refer to both continents (North and South America). I was wondering about the generational thing some, but not sure what generation is at play (I don't know everyone's age!) When I was in Paris back in 2005, it never seemed to be a question. It was like you said, America/Americans were known to be the US/people in the USA. As mentioned, I was taught to say "americain(e)" in my high school French classes (and beyond) to refer to our nationality. In general, we were taught américain(e) (for US), anglais(e) for English, canadien(ne) for Canadians, japonais(e), for ppl from Japan, etc. There was no question. Etasunien was never mentioned. And when I was in Paris, no one questioned it...they knew what I meant when I said that. Now I will say, in 2018, I noticed an example school paper talking about an American guy, it called him "Etatsunien." When I first read it, I honestly thought it meant he was Estonian or referring to something Slavic...I was really confused. That's how unfamiliar that term was to me. So the whole "America = two continents" is new to me, seems to be something I've heard of only recently. So, thanks for your comment. I've never felt a French person wince or be confused when I say "americain/e"....it seems they have understood. Maybe it varies by school in France, what people are taught as far as continents?


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## jekoh

Soleil_Couchant said:


> I've never felt a French person wince or be confused when I say "americain/e"....it seems they have understood. Maybe it varies by school in France, what people are taught as far as continents?


No, it does not vary. _Américain_ typically refers to citizens of the USA specifically, _Amérique_ typically does not refer to a specific country but to the entire continent. And if anything, referring to the USA as _l'Amérique_ is typical of elderly people.

Perhaps you can say you're an _Amerloque_ just to clear any confusion.


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## Kecha

Soleil_Couchant said:


> Paname, what I'm thinking now is that people were just asking me from what area I was from...probably not making the distinction of a "state" in their minds.


I also think they meant "pays" as in area or city. 
Most French people would be at a loss to place Delaware or Vermont on a map out of the blue, I know I probably can't. I guess most people would manage to locate California, Florida, roughly New York, maybe Texas because of the distinctive shape, but that's about it, unless they have a PhD in American Studies, or work in a field requiring that sort of knowledge.
FYI: États des États-Unis — Wikipédia
Mostly the same (but frenchified pronounciation). Just noticed how New Mexico is Nouveau Mexique but the other "new" states are still "new", haha, confusing I guess.


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## Soleil_Couchant

jekoh, okay thanks. What you said aligns with what I learned in my (American) French language classes. We're called américains, the country is called Les Etats-Unis, donc oui. Same in English, basically, except the English word "America" is also synonymous with the US. For what it's worth, in French classes we were never taught that Amérique = US. (we're never taught "Amérique" by itself at all.)  But in English, America = US. If that makes any sense, lol!  I laughed again to myself today in one class...this teacher kept calling Americans "Etats-Uniens" ...so this seems to vary by person. At least his version had a hyphen! I'm on alert now for the américan vs. Etatsunien thing (paying attention to what French people choose to say).

Oh and Kecha, half of the Muricans don't know where the heck all the states are either. I mean. I get fuzzy on the location of all the ones in the middle (North Dakota, South Dakota, Colorado, ... uh...Idaho, etc.) I definitely don't expect most French people (or non Americans) to know where "Delaware" is, or "Maryland" etc.  When people ask in general where I'm from, I usually just start with "côte d'est," and it goes from there depending on how curious they are. If they say "Oh, so near New York?" I'll be like... "Uh, yeah, about a 5-hour drive from there..." etc. I often also say "près de la capitale"...though that also brings confusion because some people think New York is the capital (it's Washington D.C.) In any case, I'm trying to give some general reference to grasp on to...you know, if you ever see the White House on TV...that.... That's in the capital/Washington D.C. So I'm close-ish to that. Lol.

Another anecdote, I had a tutor in Paris who did ask what state I was born in. I said "La Virginie-Occidentale"....and she was quick to say "You don't need to say "occidentale"...I was like mais non...that's the actual name of the state, West Virginia. Different from Virginia. I was like "I can show you my birth certificate translation if you want..." haha. But no, I totally understand that....I don't expect non-Americans to know all that!


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## Blougouz

Paname said:


> Je pense que cet emploi est également générationnel.
> J'ai fréquemment entendu des personnages âgées (nées dans les années 10, 20 ou 30 à vue de nez) utiliser "pays" pour désigner une ville ou une région. Je ne crois pas que certaines étaient poitevines.


You're right, Paname! @soleilcouchant: you need to know that prior to the division in "départements", France was divided in "pays", a bit wider than "départements", with strong identities, culture, and usually with a specific language called "patois" . The division in départements, not following the borders of the "pays" leave every one in a deep mourning.
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By the way: are you really sure  you didn't say: "je viens d'Amérique"?
Then their question "from which country" is totally understandable!
(Because anyway, beside flakiness, no one would say "pays" for US States!!!)


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## Soleil_Couchant

Blougouz said:


> By the way: are you really sure  you didn't say: "je viens d'Amérique"?



Yes, I am 100% sure. I never say that in French. "Amérique" (in French) by itself is not something we are ever taught in French; it wouldn't even enter my brain. The first two times I said "Etats-Unis" and then got the "quel pays?" response. And so I repeated "uh, Etats-Unis?" Haha. The last time, I said "America" in _English_ (because this guy was switching back and forth from French to English).  When the guy said "quel pays?" after that, I thought oooh okay, this must be the whole "America = everything and not just USA" thing. So I quickly said, "Etats-Unis!" He looked frustrated and said "Yes, I _know_, but what....uh...??? [or something like "Oui, je sais cela ... mais quel.....?]" searching for the word. I said "état" and he was like "ETAT! yes!" So that last guy even seemed to know that America = USA, but he still said "quel pays."

Anyway, thanks!! The fact that France was divided into "pays" at one point (before départements) I think answers my original question.


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