# Table & chair



## ThomasK

I would simply like to know what your words for these are, and what kind of words are based on it (as derivations, or etymologically), not so much compounds as they are probably fairly predictable.


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## ThomasK

I have found these translations via Google: taulukko, tuoli. 

Some questions then: do they have some common root (t-l)? Can you derive other words from these t-l words?


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## Hakro

The main translation for table is _pöytä_, meaning the piece of furniture, like _tuoli_. 

_Taulukko_ means table like time table, chart etc., not a piece of furniture.

_Taulukko_ and _tuoli_ have a common root only so that both are loan words from Swedish. _Tuoli_ is "stol" in Swedish, and _taulukko_ derives from _taulu_, "tavla" in Swedish.

Derivations:
_taulukoida_ (v) = to tabulate
_taulukoiminen_ (s) = tabulation, tabulating
_tuolittaa_ (v) = a very special term meaning to fasten railway tracks in a certain way. I have no idea what it could be in English.

Edit:
Nowadays _tuolittaa_ usually means "to provide (a hall) with chairs".


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## DrWatson

_Taulukko_ is table as in "a means of arranging data in rows and columns" (Wikipedia). It is a derivative of _taulu_ 'painting, picture; board' which is a Germanic loan (cf. Icelandic _tafl_). Table as in a piece of furniture is _pöytä_, which is a loan from Germanic as well (PG _*beudaz_). _Tuoli_ is, not surprisingly, also from Germanic (cf. Swedish_ stol_, German_ Stuhl_).


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## ThomasK

Thanks a lot for this information. Isn't that amazing that those very basic words are loans? But that is too broad a topic for this thread... I would like to find out more about this Proto-Germanic *_beudaz _though, but so far my research has not led to anything.

But could you go into this _pöytä_? I mean: is the basic meaning furniture and has it been narrowed down to 'table' (or 'chair')? Are any derivations common?


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## DrWatson

Apparently, the Proto-Germanic stem is *_beuđa- _(> Gothic _biuþs_ 'table', Old English _béod_, Old High German _beot_, Old Norse _bjóð _'table'). The stem appears in modern English verb _bid_ and German _bieten_ (< PG *_beudan_).

In modern Finnish, _pöytä _has the primary meaning 'table'. It does appear figuratively in the compound word _jalkapöytä_ 'instep (of a foot)', literally "foot-table". The Estonian cognate _pöid _only has this meaning (table in Estonian is _laud_).


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## Gavril

ThomasK said:


> Thanks a lot for this information. Isn't that amazing that those very basic words are loans?



Is it?

English _table _< French _table_ < Latin _tabula_
English _chair _< French _chaise_ < Greek _cathedra_


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## ThomasK

Gavril said:


> Is it?
> 
> English _table _< French _table_ < Latin _tabula_
> English _chair _< French _chaise_ < Greek _cathedra_


I suppose you are right, I had been thinking about this Latin or Greek background, but then thought that is *evolution, not loan*. But I suppose that distinction will be hard to hold... As for 'cheese' for example I understood that the old word was supplanted by a new one as that new _caseus _technique became more popular than the old cheese-making. In that case I'd consider it a loan.  But I had launched a thread about that at EHL, unsuccessfully though ;-(...


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