# Azerbaijani: Xanım sındıranın səsi çıxmaz.



## seitt

Greetings

The grammar of “Xanım sındıranın səsi çıxmaz.”  seems to be quite different from the grammar of the Turkish of Turkey.

Is the idea that the lady who breaks something says nothing, or that nothing is said by anyone?

Best wishes, and many thanks,

Simon


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## Rallino

Hi, Simon.
Is there any chance you can provide some context? I don't think the sentence makes sense as it is – that is, unless _xanım sındırmaq_ is some street slang in Azerbaidjan.


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## ancalimon

The grammar is very similar to Turkish.

The one who assumes a humble attitude towards the wife remains silent. ("sesi çıkmaz" literally means "his voice does not come out") ;  Direct translation would be: The voice of the one who assume a humble attitude towards the wife does not come out.

Turkish would be:  Hanım sindirenin sesi çıkmaz.

I think sındırmaq (sindirmek) here probably means "assume a humble attitude".  We usually use "alttan almak" in Turkish"..  sindirmek also means "to accept that the person is right..


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## seitt

Much obliged to you both.

Re context, I'm afraid that's all I have. It's just something my friends told me. They themselves were convinced that it meant that if anyone else but the lady of a house breaks a plate etc. they get told off, but if the lady herself does it, no one says a word.

Indeed, if “sındırmaq” means “sindirmek”, things are much simpler grammatically. However, I was told by my Iranian friends that it meant “kırmak”. Still, my friends are from Orumiye (Iranian West Azerbaijan), which, they themselves admit, is a lot less Turkish (including linguistically) than the area around Tabriz (Iranian East Azerbaijan).

The Ötüken Türkçe Sözlük does give “kırmak, parçalamak” as one of the meanings of “sındırmak”, describing it as Ottoman dialect.


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## ancalimon

Here are the meanings of sıntırmaq:

http://www.turuz.com/sozluk.aspx?dict=arin&q=sıntırmaq

Yes sındırmak also means kırmak, parçalamak...  But the sentence doesn't make sense then.

http://www.seslisozluk.net/?word=sındırmak&lang=tr-en

If that is case, it would mean:

The voice of the person that breaks the wife does not come out.

If it were something like:  "Hanım sındıranda~sındırdığında ses çıkmaz"  it would mean "when the wife breaks, no voice comes out (everybody stays silent)


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## seitt

Many thanks, indeed you make a very good point.


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## cecillian

Hi,
But as far as I know this is a kind of metaphor meaning the one who has more power[here xanim] even if does the wrong [ sındırmaq] will confront no objection. Xanim means wife but here it means even further than a usual wife. It means the master of a house, a Lady.


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## seitt

Many thanks, excellent.


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## Gemmenita

seitt said:


> Much obliged to you both.
> 
> Re context, I'm afraid that's all I have. It's just something my friends told me. They themselves were convinced that it meant that if anyone else but the lady of a house breaks a plate etc. they get told off, but if the lady herself does it, no one says a word.
> 
> Indeed, if “sındırmaq” means “sindirmek”, things are much simpler grammatically. However, I was told by my Iranian friends that it meant “kırmak”. Still, my friends are from Orumiye (Iranian West Azerbaijan), which, they themselves admit, is a lot less Turkish (including linguistically) than the area around Tabriz (Iranian East Azerbaijan).
> 
> The Ötüken Türkçe Sözlük does give “kırmak, parçalamak” as one of the meanings of “sındırmak”, describing it as Ottoman dialect.



 Also azaris say  “Xanım sındıran _kabın_ səsi çıxmaz.”


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## seitt

Many many thanks, truly most helpful indeed!

Just a thought - might it not be better to spell the word for dish with a Q? I.e. Xanım sındıran qabın səsi çıxmaz


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## ancalimon

Chaton.marchande said:


> Also azaris say  “Xanım sındıran _kabın_ səsi çıxmaz.”



So, how would we say this in Turkish?


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## Gemmenita

seitt said:


> Many many thanks, truly most helpful indeed!
> 
> Just a thought - might it not be better to spell the word for dish with a Q? I.e. Xanım sındıran qabın səsi çıxmaz



You're most welcome! 
You are right about spelling, since I know both versions ( Azari and Turkish) I mixed unconsiously the spelling and wrote " k" instead of "q" ! 



ancalimon said:


> So, how would we say this in Turkish?



Hanım kıran kabın sesi çıkmaz!


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## ancalimon

Chaton.marchande said:


> You're most welcome!
> You are right about spelling, since I know both versions ( Azari and Turkish) I mixed unconsiously the spelling and wrote " k" instead of "q" !
> 
> 
> 
> Hanım kıran kabın sesi çıkmaz!



It means "The voice of the cup that breaks a lady does not come out."

Hanım kıran kap : the cup that breaks a lady.

How does the cup break the lady here? 

If the sentence was something like "Hanımın kırdığı kabın sesi çıkmaz" (the noise of the cup which is broken by the lady is not heard),  it would mean a lot. But in this form it sounds wrong.


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## Gemmenita

Hanım kıran kabın sesi çıkmaz![/QUOTE]



ancalimon said:


> It means "The voice of the cup that breaks a lady does not come out."
> 
> Hanım kıran kap : the cup that breaks a lady.
> 
> How does the cup break the lady here?
> 
> If the sentence was something like "Hanımın kırdığı kabın sesi çıkmaz" (the noise of the cup which is broken by the lady is not heard),  it would mean a lot. But in this form it sounds wrong.



Haklısın! You're right. "*Hanımın kırdığı *kabın sesi çıkmaz" , was the first sentence coming to my mind to write for you in #12, but it seemed for me a kind of direct explanation of the expression rather than an idiomatic equivalent, so I looked for it here to give you a better and more exact equivalent! (although it seemed odd to me, too, because of having _azari structure_ in " Hanım kıran" )

And I should add that "kap" in turkish doesn't mean here "cup" like in "cup of tea" but in general any kind of objects like "plate" or "kâse" (with _the same meaning in azari_)


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