# Classical Arabic: Spain



## Drink

What was Spain and the Spanish language called in classical times?

Could it have been إسبانيا? It sounds like a much newer word to me, but I may be wrong.


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## analeeh

I'm pretty sure إسبانيا is from Hispania, which is a Roman-era name for the region, so it's quite old. But the classical texts that I've read, when they refer to Spain, tend to call it الأندلس, as you'd expect. Not sure if إسبانيا existed as a term for the Iberian Peninsula then, though.


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## Drink

analeeh said:


> But the classical texts that I've read, when they refer to Spain, tend to call it الأندلس, as you'd expect.



Thanks! That seems to be exactly the word I was looking for. Did they also refer to the Spanish/Portuguese language as الأندلسية or لغة الأندلس, or did they use a different word?


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## analeeh

That's a good question. It's possible that *القشتالية *(i.e. Castilian) and similar terms were used. In some texts where writers weren't that bothered about distinguishing I think I've seen لغة الروم used for any given Christian language (or لغة النصارى), although the Ruum are usually Greek-speaking Christians. A quick glance around the internet suggests that لاتين or similar terms were in use, at least amongst the people of Andalus itself.


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## Hemza

Hello,

My Arabic teacher who is Syrian (she speaks Arabic, Aramaic, French and English) told us that "España" comes from the Phenician "sp" (I might have missed a consonnant, she told it us a while ago) which means "the West" (similar to "المغرب"/"the Maghreb") since Spain.

I don't know about how it was called in Arabic a while ago but I presume "ispaña" being a very old word (and not coming from Roman-era) and it might have been used.


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## Drink

I think what analeeh meant is that the word was already around in the Roman era, which it certainly was, even if it did originally come from Phoenician. But even if the word was used in other languages, that does not mean it was used in Arabic.


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## Hemza

Oups, sorry for my misunderstood. You're right. I meant that if it was used in Phoenician, it might have been used in Arabic, who knows?


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## Abu Rashid

Spain was called: al-Andalus

Spanish language was called: al-Lughat ul-Latiniyyah (Latin).

Keep in mind that modern Spanish did not really begin to differentiate itself from Latin until about the 9th. century, about 150 years after the Muslims arrived. So when the Arabic speakers first came into contact with Spanish speakers, they still considered their language to be Latin.

And by the time Spanish speakers realised their language was no longer really Latin anymore, the Arabic speakers were already gone.


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## fdb

Abu Rashid said:


> Spanish language was called: al-Lughat ul-Latiniyyah (Latin).



Do you have any references for this? I have never seen the word "Latin" in a classical Arabic text.


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## Abu Rashid

No I don't, but I do remember reading somewhere it was just called Latin.

According to wikipedia it was called اللغة المستعربة which is the equivalent of the English Mozarabic.


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## rayloom

It was called اللسان اللطيني. You can find several sources from that era using this name. 
المستعربة was a later naming, and refers I think to the newer language after the advent of the Arabs.


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## analeeh

No, اللغة المستعربة is not a contemporary term - it's a back-translation into Arabic of the Spanish term Mozarabic, which only came into use during the 19th century when Spanish academics applied the term مستعرب (which originally referred to people in the Mashriq who spoke Arabic but were not from Arabian stock, IIRC) anachronistically to Christians under Muslim rule in al-Andalus. It isn't used in texts from the time. When it is used in modern texts it refers to the Romance languages spoken in Islamic Spain (as opposed to in the Christian kingdoms in the north), whilst 'Mozarab' (= مستعرب) is used to refer to the Christian population of al-Andalus. I think the strange disconnect between the Mozarabs and the speakers of Mozarabic - which included lots of non-Christians - comes from the 19th-century Spanish historiography which liked to imagine that almost nobody converted to Islam and that the 'occupied' Spanish population was romance-speaking and Christian whilst the 'occupiers' were exclusively Berbers and Arabs.


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## Abu Rashid

According to wikipedia the English term was borrowed from Andalusi Arabic.



			
				wikipedia said:
			
		

> The word Mozarab is a loanword from Andalusi Arabic_musta'rab_, مُستَعرَب, Classical Arabic_musta'rib_, meaning "who adopts the ways of the Arabs".


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozarabic_language


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## analeeh

Yes, but if you read a little bit further down:



> The name Mozarabic is today used for many Romance dialects like the Lusitanian,[3] Murcian, Sevillian, Valencian.[4] The native name (autonym or endonym) of the language was not "Muzarab" or "Mozarab" but "Latina" (Latin). Mozarabs themselves never called their own language "Mozarabic" but instead by a word that meant "Latin" (i.e. Romance language). They did not call themselves "Mozarabs" either.


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## Abu Rashid

That doesn't contradict what I posted.

You stated the Arabic was a back translation from the term Mozarabic, the wikipedia article says the opposite.

Yes it's an endonym, but that means it's not a native Mozarabic name for their own language, that doesn't have anything to do with whether Arab speakers called it that or not.


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## Drink

To complicate the question further: What would an Arab in Syria in 15th century have called the Spanish language?


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## WadiH

Just stumbled upon this old thread:

Medieval Arabs were indeed familiar with the name 'Spain' and rendered it إشبانية, though they described it as the name used by the Franks for Al-Andalus rather than a name they would use themselves.


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