# Una voce poco fa by Rossini (Il Barbiere di Siviglia - Opera)



## listamadre

I need help with an Italian phrase that is in an Aria.

The song is Una Voce Poco Fa

the phrase I need help with is:

il tutor ricussero (there should be an accent over the o)
the guardian ?



the other phrase:


Io l'ingegno aguzzero (again an accent over the o)
I the ingenious ?



and lastly:


faro giocar (once again an accent over the o)
? to play



thank you so much for your help!!!


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## lauranazario

Seeing that this is the Spanish-English forum, I'm going to transfer your thread to the Italian-English forum.... I'm sure they will provide the answers you need!

Saludos,
Laura


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## listamadre

I think this aria was written in the 1800's, I can't remember exactly right now.  I don't know if the words just aren't used any more, or if they were changed for lyric purposes.


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## Alfry

ricusserò is a word I don't know, sorry

Io l'ingegno aguzzerò = I'll sharpen my talent

farò giocar = I'll make something/someone play (I need more context)


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## listamadre

thanks alfry!  Here is a little of the context:



> amorosa, mi lascio reggere, mi lascio reggere, mi fo guidar, mi
> 
> Love, my leave to hold my leave to hold My ? To guide my
> 
> ? ?
> 
> 
> fo guidar; ma se mi toccano dov’e il mio debole, saro una vipera
> ? To guide But if my touch where the my weak, I will be One snake
> 
> ? ?
> 
> 
> saro, e cento trappole, prima di cedere, faro giocar, faro giocar; e
> ? And hundred traps, At first of surrender, ? To play ? to play and
> 
> ?
> 
> 
> Cento trappole, prima di cedere, faro giocar, faro giocar; e cento
> Hundred traps At first or surrender, ? To play ? To play And hundred
> 
> 
> trappole prima di cedere, e cento trappole, faro, faro giocar.
> traps At first of surrender and hundred traps ?


I've written the Italian, and then the word for word translation underneath.  I'll paraphrase it later right now I'm just trying to get the literal/exact translation.

Thanks for helping, it is SOOOO appreciated


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## Alfry

amorosa, mi lascio reggere, mi lascio reggere, mi fo guidar, mi 
with love, I let you hold me, I let you hold me, I let you lead me  

mi fo guidar; ma se mi toccano dov’e il mio debole, saro una vipera 

I let you lead me,  but if someone touches me where my pain is, I will act as a snake (viper)

e cento trappole, prima di cedere, faro giocar, faro giocar; 
and I'll set (use) 100 traps befor I'll give up

e Cento trappole, prima di cedere, faro giocar, faro giocar; 
and I'll set (use) 100 traps befor I'll give up


e cento trappole prima di cedere, e cento trappole, faro, faro giocar.
(the sense is the same as before, words are only scrambles)


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## Silvia

dov’e il mio debole = where my weak point is


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## Alfry

I translated it with "pain = dolore" because it seemed too odd "debole = weak" to me.


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## danalto

WOW! Stiamo scoprendo la vena poetica degli utenti del forum!
 bravi ragazzi!


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## Silvia

alfry said:
			
		

> I translated it with "pain = dolore" because it seemed too odd "debole = weak" to me.


 Alfry, where's your weak point? Let's find it and then let's see if you're going to feel any pain 

P.S.: now don't get mad at me like the lady in the song


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## Alfry

HIHIHIHI... ACCIDENTI AL CAPS LOCK... now it's better
i can tell you my weak points....
1- my neck!!!
2- my 3 neurons in my head... too many


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## danalto

Mmm...that's why you only use ONE?


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## Alfry

the problem is to stop the other two...


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## danalto

*squeeze them and vacuum-pack them!* 
 (abbastanza trucida come immagine?)


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## Alfry

si, ormai ci sono affezionato... faccio loro solo un po di solletico


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## Silvia

alfry... now I'm curious! What about your neck? 

Stavo per dire una cosa... no, no!


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## danalto

dai dai silvia go on and say it! pliiiiiiizzzzzzzz


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## Alfry

sia come hai maliziosamente inteso tu sia dal punto di vista dell'essere deboli fisicamente
non riesco a difendere bene il mio collo. se qualcuno mi tocca il collo mi mette fuori uso


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## Silvia

Aaahhh, al riparo dai succhiotti


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## Alfry

si anche.... (giusto manca proprio quella con l'aureola)


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## lsp

_trucida?_  When you guys get going there aren't enough dictionaries to keep up!


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## danalto

LOL  isp! Don't tell me you understood SUCCHIOTTI and u didn't understand TRUCIDA! 

 ciao! 
 dany


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## Silvia

Ok, lsp, fair enough.

Here's a short summary of what's been said so far.

I suggested our alfry to mention his weak point, since he was claiming that a weak point gives you pain. Then he said his weak points are too much brain (3 neurons in all!) and his neck, so about the latter we all were wondering why and how... 
Dan told him how to deal with his neurons and said that sounded like a dreadful picture. He replied that he's used to his neurons after all and tickles them.
As for me, after all this nonsense, I was about to say something, but I kept myself from that. But Dan invited me to say what I had to say.
Then alfry explained why his neck is his weak point, there was a double meaning: it's weak either from a healthy point of view (I guess sore throat) and emotionally (if someone touches it, he's KO ). So I assumed it was because of hickeys  and he confirmed (stating a smiley with a halo would do).

Are you still with us?


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## danalto

Oooh, thanks to Silvia today I learned a very useful word: HICKEY. 

  Silvia, dici che adesso sono autorizzata ad andarmene in giro per il mondo a dispensare succhiotti? 
  No, sai com'è, ora che so come si dice...

  (eheheh)
  baci
  (e non succhiotti)
  dany


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## walnut

lsp said:
			
		

> _trucida?_  When you guys get going there aren't enough dictionaries to keep up!


 'Trucida' comes from the italian verb 'trucidare' (to slay, to murder ). 
'Abbastanza trucida come immagine' (please correct me Danalto if I'm wrong!  ) = è abbastanza forte/splatter come immagine?
'Trucida/o/ona/one' is very common Rome jargon but should be understood in the rest of the contry as well. A trucido is a boor, the opposite of a person with refined matters/clothes/speech. Each italian region has a word to describe that concept. In Milan 'Tamarro/a' was a classic expression, now getting a bit old-fashioned. 'Truzzo/a' is more modern.

These words are quite funny, of common use and totally informal, not to be used in embassy dinners. 

Ciao  Walnut


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## danalto

walnut said:
			
		

> 'Trucida' comes from the italian verb 'trucidare' (to slay, to murder ).
> 'Abbastanza trucida come immagine' (please correct me Danalto if I'm wrong!  ) = è abbastanza forte/splatter come immagine?
> 'Trucida/o/ona/one' is very common Rome jargon but should be understood in the rest of the contry as well. A trucido is a boor, the opposite of a person with refined matters/clothes/speech. Each italian region has a word to describe that concept. In Milan 'Tamarro/a' was a classic expression, now getting a bit old-fashioned. 'Truzzo/a' is more modern.
> 
> These words are quite funny, of common use and totally informal, not to be used in embassy dinners.
> 
> Ciao  Walnut


  Yes, walnut, you are absolutely right.
 According to me it is useful to learn these words, in every language I mean, 'cause they are commonly used and sometimes knowing them you can easily talk with everyone, and everywhere (EXCEPT IN EMBASSY DINNERS!)

  About TRUZZO, you're teaching me something I didn't know! Where did you learn it?

  ciao
  dany


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## walnut

danalto said:
			
		

> About TRUZZO, you're teaching me something I didn't know! Where did you learn it?


 It's widely used here in Milano for trucido... A curiosity: trucido and buzzicone mean exactly the same?  Walnut


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## danalto

walnut said:
			
		

> It's widely used here in Milano for trucido... A curiosity: trucido and buzzicone mean exactly the same?  Walnut


  Allora TRUZZO è una scopiazzatura (_bad copying_ ) di TRUCIDO.

  The same old story ROME VS MILAN!  (joking, I'm not that kind of grrrrrl!)

 No, walnut, buzzicone di solito (oddio, azzardo perché io non sono romana di nascita, anche se vivo a Roma da sempre) è una persona "molliccia" (_let's say flabby_) di solito grande e grossa (mi viene in mente il tipico ragazzone che vive ancora a casa con mamma) mentre trucido è il COATTO (_this is a very important word to know, when you come here in Rome! Don't forget about it!_ LOL) versione cattiva (becero! _vulgar person_...)
  ciao!
  dany


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## walnut

danalto said:
			
		

> Allora TRUZZO è una scopiazzatura (_bad copying_ ) di TRUCIDO.


    o una raffinata traslitterazione... 



			
				danalto said:
			
		

> No, walnut, buzzicone di solito (oddio, azzardo perché io non sono romana di nascita, anche se vivo a Roma da sempre) è una persona "molliccia" (_let's say flabby_) di solito grande e grossa (mi viene in mente il tipico ragazzone che vive ancora a casa con mamma) mentre trucido è il COATTO


 Grazie! W.


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## lsp

I'm proud (or should I be embarrassed   ) to admit I followed the whole thread except for the one word, trucida! I thought it might mean _too graphic_. We use that now to describe things that are too descriptive visually - like films rated for mature audiences because of graphic violence or graphic sexual situations, even graphic language.  

Learning these words (especially the roman ones, like coatto and sola which I already knew) is my favorite part. As we say, _I get a kick out of it."_

As you can now tell about me, I don't spend much time in the embassies when I visit!


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## Alfry

lsp said:
			
		

> As you can now tell about me, I don't spend much time in the embassies when I visit!


That's why I never saw you there


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## walnut

lsp said:
			
		

> I thought it might mean _too graphic_. We use that now to describe things that are too descriptive visually - like films rated for mature audiences because of graphic violence or graphic sexual situations, even graphic language.


 Hi lsp! It's hard for me to understand the meaning of 'graphic 'in this context... I work with graphics and your explanation made me really curious about this way of using that word!  Ti va di fare qualche esempio? Ciao!  Walnut

PS Ci sono! Grafico = pittoresco (sul mio vocabolario). PIttoresco è un po' old fashioned, ma ora il concetto mi è piu chiaro = esplicito, lapidario, etc.


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## lsp

It refers to the first bolded parts of this definition:
*1.  [adj]  describing nudity or sexual activity in graphic detail; "graphic sexual scenes"
	2.  [adj]  evoking lifelike images within the mind; "pictorial poetry and prose"; "graphic accounts of battle"; "a lifelike portrait"; "a vivid description"*
	3.  [adj]  written or drawn or engraved; "graphic symbols"
	4.  [adj]  relating to or presented by a graph; "a graphic presentation of the data"
5.  [adj]  of or relating to the graphic arts; "the etchings, drypoints, lithographis, and engravings which together form his graphic work"- Brit. Book News

examples:
Many parents won’t permit their children to watch TV late at night because the language and sexual references have become too graphic. 
The ratings and content descriptions of video and computer games issued by the entertainment industry define games that are suitable only for adults due to graphic depictions of sex or violence.

Does that describe it graphically enough?


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## walnut

lsp said:
			
		

> Does that describe it graphically enough?


  Sarò esplicita: Yes! 

Grazie lsp  Walnut


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## lsp

Of course. Explicit. I could have summed it up with just that one word. Brava, Walnut!


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## walnut

lsp said:
			
		

> Of course. Explicit. I could have summed it up with just that one word. Brava, Walnut!


  Where is the blushing smiley?!?!? Thank you! 

One more question: graphic va bene anche per figurato (in senso figurato = literally, according to the literal meaning of the word/sentence)? La parola italiana ha una radice simile (figura = immagine, rappresentazione grafica). E' interessante perché si usa nello stesso modo di graphic, ma il significato è diverso.

Ad esempio:
Sono morto di sonno, muoio di sonno = I'm so sleepy
in senso figurato vorrebbe dire che sto morendo VERAMENTE 
Posso anche dire: sto morendo di sonno, in senso figurato! per dare molta enfasi al concetto. 

Ciao   Walnut


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## danalto

walnut said:
			
		

> Hi lsp! It's hard for me to understand the meaning of 'graphic 'in this context... I work with graphics and your explanation made me really curious about this way of using that word!  Ti va di fare qualche esempio? Ciao!  Walnut
> 
> PS Ci sono! Grafico = pittoresco (sul mio vocabolario). PIttoresco è un po' old fashioned, ma ora il concetto mi è piu chiaro = esplicito, lapidario, etc.


 Anche io all'inizio ho avuto difficoltà a _staccarmi _dal senso letterale del termine *graphic*, walnut, troppo simile all'italiano!
 Forse noi diremmo "IMMAGINI FORTI" o come hai detto tu "ESPLICITE"
 (ma quanto siamo bravi???)


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## walnut

danalto said:
			
		

> Anche io all'inizio ho avuto difficoltà a _staccarmi _dal senso letterale del termine *graphic*, walnut, troppo simile all'italiano!


 E' vero, è così simile che il cervello si incanta e non si muove più di lì - è una di quelle espressioni falsamente amichevoli, come si chiamano, false friends o qualcosa del genere...  mai fidarsi... Ciao! Walnut


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## danalto

walnut said:
			
		

> E' vero, è così simile che il cervello si incanta e non si muove più di lì - è una di quelle espressioni falsamente amichevoli, come si chiamano, false friends o qualcosa del genere...  mai fidarsi... Ciao! Walnut


 Beh, se proprio vogliamo, ci sono altri FALSE FRIENDS di cui non è il caso di fidarsi! eheheheh


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## lsp

walnut said:
			
		

> Where is the blushing smiley?!?!? Thank you!
> 
> One more question: graphic va bene anche per figurato (in senso figurato = literally, according to the literal meaning of the word/sentence)? La parola italiana ha una radice simile (figura = immagine, rappresentazione grafica). E' interessante perché si usa nello stesso modo di graphic, ma il significato è diverso.
> 
> Ad esempio:
> Sono morto di sonno, muoio di sonno = I'm so sleepy
> in senso figurato vorrebbe dire che sto morendo VERAMENTE
> Posso anche dire: sto morendo di sonno, in senso figurato! per dare molta enfasi al concetto.
> 
> Ciao   Walnut


It might not be the most common usage. But certainly it means the same here.


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## walnut

lsp said:
			
		

> It might not be the most common usage. But certainly it means the same here.


 Grazie  W.


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## Silvia

Actually, I thought you could compare tamarro from Milan and burino from Rome.

Anyway, for me 'truzzo' and 'tamarro' are both oldfashioned... what about tarro?

By the way, shouldn't be AT a dinner and not in a dinner?


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## danalto

silviap said:
			
		

> Actually, I thought you could compare tamarro from Milan and burino from Rome.
> 
> Anyway, for me 'truzzo' and 'tamarro' are both oldfashioned... what about tarro?
> 
> By the way, shouldn't be AT a dinner and not in a dinner?


 TARRO? Another new one!


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## lsp

silviap said:
			
		

> By the way, shouldn't be AT a dinner and not in a dinner?


 At is definitely more correct.


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## Scopa Nuova

I just recently came across this forum and don't know if there is still interest in translating 'Una voce poco fa" but I think I can help give a meaningful translation.

Of course this is one of the most popular arias sung by Rosina from one of Rossini's most popular operas "The Barber of Seville" composed in1816. Also, keep in mind that this is "Opera" Italian, not conversational Italian and as such many liberties are taken with the language in the name of making the words fit and rhyme with the music, just as we do in American Musicals.

Well, here is my shot at the 1st half of Una voce poco fa.

ROSINA
Una voce poco fa
qui nel cor mi risuono';
A voice echoes in my heart

il mio cor ferito e' gia',
My heart is already wounded

e Lindor fu che il piago'.
And Lindor is the one who wounded it

Si', Lindoro mio sara';
Yes, Lindoro will me mine

lo giurai, la vincero'. 
I swear it, I will win him

Il tutor ricusera',
My guardian will object

io l'ingegno aguzzero'.
I will sharpen my wits.

Alla fin s'acchetera'
In the end he will calm down (give in)

e contenta io restero'
and I will be left happy

Si', Lindoro mio sara';
lo giurai, la vincero'.

Io sono docile, son rispettosa,
I am docile, I am respectful

sono obbediente, dolce, amorosa;
I am obedient, sweet, loveable

mi lascio reggere, mi fo guidar.
I am held down, I will take control

Ma se mi toccano dov'e' il mio debole
But if they hold me back where I have a partiality(Literal translatiion) 
If I’m thwarted (more meaningful translation) 

saro' una vipera e cento trappole
I will be a viper and have a hundred tricks

prima di cedere faro' giocar.
Before giving up I will make fools of them.

Si' si', la vincero'. Potessi almeno
Yes, yes, I will win him. If I at least will be allowed (have the chance).


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## listamadre

aaaah Scopa, where were you before I did my graduate audition?   That's a wonderful translation...thanks.  I intend to write it down with my copy of the aria for future reference.  The translation I had was good enough so that I could sing with the character that I wanted.  YOUR translation would have flowed easier in my mind though. SIGH...I'll have to email you next time I have a question.


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## Scopa Nuova

Listamadre, Glad I could be of at least belated help.  I'm not expert at Italian translation but I am an Opera lover and grew up in an Italian family, though I didn't learn how to speak Italian very well.  However, I have a gut feeling for what the words really mean in english especially a phrase that can't be taken literally.

If you want to see/hear a top notch performance of "Una voce poco fa" get the KULTUR D2101 DVD of the opera performed at the Glydebourne Festival Opera with Maria Ewing (an American who sings superbly in Italian) as Rosina.  Good luck with your singing.


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## motobliquo

Sì, ma...una cosa non mi è mai stata chiara: 
in quale modo è possibile far giocare una trappola? 
lo so che non è il forum adatto, ma...sapete com’è...trovandoci in argomento...
Vi abbraccio tutti!
Raffaele


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## fetchezlavache

mi fo guidar = i will take control ?

i think it means i let others take control of me.. but i may be wrong... (because i think it means mi faccio guidar)...


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## motobliquo

fetchezlavache said:
			
		

> mi fo guidar = i will take control ?
> 
> Yes, it’s somethimg like «I let other people guide me, but when/if  they bother me, I change into a viper»


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## listamadre

Scopa Nuova said:
			
		

> If you want to see/hear a top notch performance of "Una voce poco fa" get the KULTUR D2101 DVD of the opera performed at the Glydebourne Festival Opera with Maria Ewing (an American who sings superbly in Italian) as Rosina. Good luck with your singing.


are you a singer yourself?


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## Scopa Nuova

As I said, I'm no expert in Italian translation and both motobliquo and fetchezlavache are undoubtly better at it than me.  I appreciate the revisions to my attempts.  Too bad that all of this input to listamadre was not available in December when she needed it.  I welcome any input because I would like to get an accurate translation of Cesere Sterbini's Libretto to Rossini's Opera.


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## Scopa Nuova

Listamadre, No I am not a singer just a classical music lover.


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