# Tamil: Tips for learning



## Thomas F. O'Gara

I checked over the previous threads, and I don't see where this has come up specifically.  Can anybody recommend material to learn Tamil?  Most of the websites I'e run across are pretty inadequate, at least for an adult learning the language.

I realize that there is "Colloquial Tamil", with CD's.  However, I understand that the book does not cover the written language at all - not even the alphabet.  Since I understand that Tamil is well-known for having a considerable gulf between the written and spoken forms of the language, I don't know whether I want to commit to that kind of study material.  Is anybody aware of any suitable material out there?  I presume that most of what would be available would be for English speakers, but I'll entertain other options; since Pondicherry was French for a couple of hundred years, maybe there is some good material available in French.


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## panjabigator

I dont have a copy of all the Tamil sites I would browse on, but I suggest that you contact universities that teach Tamil.  Contact a professor and see what they recommend and what to stay away from.  Have you looked on other book sites and read reviews?


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## Setwale_Charm

http://lrrc3.sas.upenn.edu/tamilonline/
http://www.learntamil.com/
http://www.unc.edu/~echeran/paadanool/
http://www.languageshome.com/English-Tamil.htm
http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/plc/tamilweb/


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## Thomas F. O'Gara

Thanks to both of you, Panjabigator and Setwale!


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## starsiege

Thomas F. O'Gara said:


> I checked over the previous threads, and I don't see where this has come up specifically.  Can anybody recommend material to learn Tamil?  Most of the websites I'e run across are pretty inadequate, at least for an adult learning the language.
> 
> I realize that there is "Colloquial Tamil", with CD's.  However, I understand that the book does not cover the written language at all - not even the alphabet.  Since I understand that Tamil is well-known for having a considerable gulf between the written and spoken forms of the language, I don't know whether I want to commit to that kind of study material.  Is anybody aware of any suitable material out there?  I presume that most of what would be available would be for English speakers, but I'll entertain other options; since Pondicherry was French for a couple of hundred years, maybe there is some good material available in French.



There is a Tamil department in the University of California: Berkely. 

It has a lot of non-Indian students who learn Tamil, and an American professor who is considered a Tamil scholar!. You might want to check that out. Maybe they might have some teleclasses/online classes as well.


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## thalapathi

hi!

  if you can speak i have a nice idea for you 
இது ஒரு ஆரம்பம் இனிமேல் தான் ஆட்டம்

ஒரு தடவை சொன்னா நூறு தடவை சொன்னா மாதிரி

see all these i just typed using the quillpad tool..

 if you can speak tamil,, then not only learning to write and read is easy but ,,,at the same time you can also start blogging in tamil 
   using this tool will be very helpful for you,,,just try it out..you will enjoy


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## siddusom

lol thalapathi, thats a nice exercise.

I have some good news and bad news for those who want to learn Tamil.
good news:
The alphabet is perhaps the simplest system ever, it uses phonetic characters, and is far easier than one would think.
For example, beach in English is of course spelled b e a c h, but is pronounced beech.
But in Tamil it's the same, beech in Tamil characters is what is correct and doesn't have any other additional characters.

bad news:
There is a big rift between spoken Tamil and written Tamil.
In novels and such, a combination of both is used where dialogue is present and such.
But if you know what your target is,
say you want to be a scholar on tamil,
then you would study the more proper literary Tamil which universities teach.
Or if you want to interact with Tamil people,
then you learn how to talk.
Trust me the spoken version is easy, especially for English speakers,
because colloquial borrows a lot of English words in speech.

Good luck to those who embark on this task.


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## panjabigator

Is the Tamil alphabet comparable to the Devanagri one, I.E., would it be as easy to learn (and therefore as difficult)?


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## siddusom

punjabigator,
I'd say it comes from the same lineage as Devanagari,
but the writing structure seems a lot easier.
I wikipedia'ed the intricacies of the script. I learned
it a long time ago in elementary school and have forgot it since.
I know tidbits spoken-wise from bollywood and such in Hindi.

But looking at the article,
the compound consants, multiple consonant versions for basically
the same sound, and different aspirations are all close to absent in Tamil.

I think the alphabet is learnable in less than 2 weeks for the average adult, who has no knowledge of south Indian scripts.
And word formulation in the two weeks after.


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## palomnik

I've tried my hand at a bit of Tamil, and I would like to continue. What holds me back at this point is not the writing system, nor the gulf between the written and spoken forms.

The problem is I can't get my arms around the pronunciation - not of individual sounds, but the suprasegmental phonemes. It seems to me that Tamil is an extreme case of a mora-timed language with certain features of stress timing; short vowels are practically completely dropped out in the spoken language. This, coupled with the fact that there seems to be no actual stress on a syllable, outside of maybe some stress on the long vowels, makes it difficult to move from learner's mode to just understanding average speech.

I'd really like to learn the language, since I hope to travel there soon. Does anybody know of any good resources for describing the phonology? Wikipedia is no help whatsoever on the timing of the language.


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## siddusom

palomnik said:


> I've tried my hand at a bit of Tamil, and I would like to continue. What holds me back at this point is not the writing system, nor the gulf between the written and spoken forms.
> 
> The problem is I can't get my arms around the pronunciation - not of individual sounds, but the suprasegmental phonemes. It seems to me that Tamil is an extreme case of a mora-timed language with certain features of stress timing; short vowels are practically completely dropped out in the spoken language. This, coupled with the fact that there seems to be no actual stress on a syllable, outside of maybe some stress on the long vowels, makes it difficult to move from learner's mode to just understanding average speech.
> 
> I'd really like to learn the language, since I hope to travel there soon. Does anybody know of any good resources for describing the phonology? Wikipedia is no help whatsoever on the timing of the language.


 
palomnik,
You brought up a really good point. And I think it goes back to its history.
Our language in its original construction, long back, was really elaborate with long words and sentences for small things.
This is apparent in the literary language, which is long winded and elaborate, and extremely inconvenient for spoken manners.
So what is spoken Tamil, you ask?
It's our efforts of shortening those long words to make it more conversational and succinct at the same time.
It's like how good night, became ga-nite, g'nite, then finally nite.
So, the vowel timings and phonetics are off because certain sounds are swallowed (not literally).
And there are accents, that is the choice of what sounds are omitted (or swallowed) and what sounds are stressed, between regions and even between social classes.
It's like the same advice when I was studying French, you've gotta live there or keep on listening and practicing, it
doesn't come easy it all.


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## palomnik

Thanks, siddusom, and welcome to the forum!

I guess I'll just have to memorize dialogues, for openers.  I do have a fairly detailed text for Tamil - it's from India, actually - and based on what you say I think that getting some familiarity with the written language may clear up how the sound system came to be the way it is.  Sometimes Tamil seems to have some phonetic similarities with Japanese, not in the sounds themselves, but in that vowels will drop out in regular speech in certain environments, and doubled consonants are common in some classes of words.  If you know the traditional writing system in Japanese it helps you know when to expect these.  Maybe that will work for Tamil as well.


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## siddusom

palomnik said:


> Thanks, siddusom, and welcome to the forum!
> 
> I guess I'll just have to memorize dialogues, for openers.  I do have a fairly detailed text for Tamil - it's from India, actually - and based on what you say I think that getting some familiarity with the written language may clear up how the sound system came to be the way it is.  Sometimes Tamil seems to have some phonetic similarities with Japanese, not in the sounds themselves, but in that vowels will drop out in regular speech in certain environments, and doubled consonants are common in some classes of words.  If you know the traditional writing system in Japanese it helps you know when to expect these.  Maybe that will work for Tamil as well.



Good luck on your approach.


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