# FR: (in order) to + infinitive



## frenchie911

I want to say "in order to do this"

I have "pour que fasse ca" followed by verbs that arent conjugated in the subjunctive.

should is it be pour que faire + plus the subjunctive?

*Moderator note:* Multiple threads merged to create this one.


----------



## tilt

_In order to do this_ = _pour faire ça_ […]


----------



## Lafemmefrancaise22

Comment dit-on en français "In order to" comme la phrase "In order to take this class..."
Merci beaucoup!


----------



## verbivore

"Pour"...


----------



## Cath.S.

_Pour_ is correct

_pour assister à ce cours_


----------



## lordterrin

Hello,

I'm wondering if someone can help me with this grammatical question.

In English, it's perfectly okay to say 

_I've been reading the Wordreference forums to help myself study

_Since I speak Spanish, I'm used to there being a connecter word (por) in between the two clauses

_I've been reading the WR forums
_
and
_
to help myself study

_yet we don't really use one in English, other than "in order to," but that's pretty subjective to the speaker's wishes.  Is there a word that is used to connect two clauses in French?  Is it always the same one?  I have been using _pour_ to do it, but I'm not sure if this is right, since my influence is coming from Spanish.

I'll give an example in French as well, something like:

_Je vais au supermarché [     ]  acheter de la nourriture._

Thanks for your help!

Brian


----------



## calembourde

I think 'pour' works in that example, and it's also what's suggested at the beginning of this thread (try a search for 'in order to', there are many other threads but I did not read them all to see whether they were relevant.)

You could also say 'afin de' to mean 'in order to' but for some reason I don't think that sounds quite right for the example you gave.


----------



## Cheung Mo

I would use "pour" there. It's very hard for me to explain the distinction even though I make one when I speak and write in French, which is odd because I'm a non-native speaker of French and therefore speak by rote rather than by instinct. 

It's almost as though "afin de" implies a positive consequence of fulfilling a duty or obligation.

"Je vais a Futureshop pour acheter des hautes-parleurs pour mon ordi."
"Il va falloir que vous payez vos factures afin de conserver vos services telephoniques."


----------



## lordterrin

Thanks, both of you.  I had done a search on "in order to," but I want to understand it more from a grammatical position rather than simply a "how do I say this" position.  I wonder if anyone has links to a somewhere that would teach me that grammatical principle so I don't have to wait for my French class to get to it...


----------



## calembourde

I was thinking about this when I wrote my other post, and I think that the difference between _pour_ and _afin de_ is roughly the same as the difference between simply saying 'to' or 'in order to'.

Je vais au supermarché pour acheter de la nourriture.
I'm going to the supermarket to buy food. (I'm just mentioning what I'm going to do there)

Je vais au supermarché afin d'acheter de la nourriture.
I'm going to the supermarket in order to buy food. (There's more an implication that I need to buy some food, so I have to go to the supermarket to get it.)


----------



## lordterrin

I see, I see.  So, gramatically speaking, do you always need a connector word (whether it be _pour_ or _afin de_) to connect two clauses in this manner?  Or can you ever say something along the lines of:

_Je vais au supermarché acheter de la nourriture.


_


----------



## Maître Capello

Your sentence is perfectly sound. So, no, a connector word is not *always* required… But most of the time you need one…

Anyway the two sentences don't have exactly the same meaning:

_Je vais au supermarché acheter de la nourriture._ → You're going to buy food at the supermarket.
_Je vais au supermarché pour acheter de la nourriture._ → You're going to the supermarket in order to buy food.


----------



## lordterrin

I see.  So to break it down (again) grammatically, by using the connector word, I am saying that the REASON for the second clause is the first clause:

so that _I can buy food, _I am _going to the supermarket._

whereas without the connector word there, (be it _pour_ or something else), the entire sentence itself is one idea:

_I'm going to buy food at the supermarket_ (as you said)


If I can understand grammatical rules instead of just "yeah that word goes there" I can teach myself a lot faster 

Does this principle of being able to use pour or _not_ use pour have... some type of rule?  Can I always omit it and have it be grammatically correct?

Thanks EVERYONE for all your help so far!


----------



## Maître Capello

lordterrin said:


> I see.  So to break it down (again) grammatically, by using the connector word, I am saying that the REASON for the second clause is the first clause: so that _I can buy food, _I am _going to the supermarket._
> whereas without the connector word there, (be it _pour_ or something else), the entire sentence itself is one idea: _I'm going to buy food at the supermarket_ (as you said)


Yes, you got it. 



> Does this principle of being able to use pour or _not_ use pour have... some type of rule?  Can I always omit it and have it be grammatically correct?


No. As I said, you usually need a preposition such as _pour_. You can omit it only when the main verb is one of _aller, faire, laisser_ or similar verbs.

_J'allume la lampe *pour* lire mon livre. 
__J'allume la lampe lire mon livre. _
_Je *vais* lire mon livre dans la chambre. 
__Je *vais* *pour* lire mon livre dans la chambre. 
__Je *vais* __dans la chambre *pour* __lire mon livre . _
_J'ai *fait* réparer ma voiture. 
__J'ai *laissé* brûler le rôti. _


----------



## Archilocus

I agree with most of Maitre Capello, but "_J'ai *fait* réparer ma voiture_" and "_J'ai *laissé* brûler le rôti_" are different. You will never say "j'ai fait pour réparer ma voiture" or "j'ai laissé afin de brûler mon rôti". It doesnt work with "laisser" or "faire". I am trying to find another verb than "aller" with which it could work, but actually i wonder if "Aller...pour/afin de" is not the only exception for which you can avoid the preposition...


----------



## Maître Capello

Indeed! (I was merely looking for verbs that can be followed by an infinitive without any preposition…)


----------



## calembourde

To follow on from Archilocus's comment, even with _aller_, I think it's grammatically quite different depending on whether you have a destination mentioned immediately after _aller_.

_Je vais lire mon livre dans la chambre._

is the _futur proche_, 'I am going to read my book in the bedroom' where _vais_ (and correspondingly 'going') has a different function and meaning from in this sentence:

_Je vais dans la chambre pour lire mon livre_
 I am going to the bedroom to read my book

Here going is actually about going somewhere, not just saying what you will do in the future. Well, I guess both sentences could have this meaning, but, at least in English, the first one is more likely to be interpreted as being about the future.


----------



## 82riceballs

Bonjour,

Si je ne me trompe pas, il y a une façon de dire "(in order) to" en français juste en utilisant l'infinitive du verbe.

Donc je me demande quelle est la différence entre les phrase suivantes?

It's been raining hard recently. My sister and I like to sit by the window to watch and listen to it.
1) […] Ma soeur et moi, on aime *s'asseoir devant la fenêtre la regarder et l'écouter*.
2) […] Ma soeur et moi, on aime *s'asseoir devant la fenêtre pour/afin de la regarder et l'écouter*.

Toute aide serait appréciée! Merci d'avance!


----------



## Maître Capello

The preposition is required in French:

_On aime s'asseoir devant la fenêtre la regarder et l'écouter. 
On aime s'asseoir devant la fenêtre *pour/afin de* la regarder et l'écouter. _


----------



## tilt

Il existe en effet des cas où on peut ne pas utiliser de préposition : _je viens l'écouter_ = _je viens [pour/afin de] l'écouter_.

Mais cela n'est possible qu'avec des verbes "semi-auxiliaires".
On ne peut donc pas dire _Je m’assois l'écouter._


----------



## miyamoto.musashi

Il y a aussi dans le but de


----------

