# Beat around the bush



## ThomasK

Can you tell me what expression(s) you use to express this idea of "not being upfront" or something the like? 

Dutch: "*(als een kat) om de hete brij [heen] lopen*" (run around the hot mash (like a cat)), [Belgian Dutch, Flemish]* "rond de pot draaien"* (turn around the pot).


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## Yendred

In French, we use the equivalent expression: _tourner autour du pot_


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## Dymn

*Spanish*:
_andarse con rodeos _("to walk with detours")
_irse por las ramas _("to go around the branches")


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## apmoy70

Greek:

1- *<<Κρύβομαι πίσω από το δάχτυλό μου >>* [ˈkri.vɔ.me ˈpi.sɔ aˈpɔ tɔ ˈða.xtiˌlɔ mu] --> _to hide behind one's finger_

2a- *<<Κάνω την πάπια>>* [ˈka.nɔ tiɱ ˈba.pça] --> _to play the duck_
2b- *<<Ποιοῦμαι τὴν νῆσσαν>>* [piˈu.me tin ˈni.san] --> _to play the duck_
(2a) is the MoGr variation of (2b) which is older. Despite the archaic language though, it's no more than a century old (Katharevousa Greek).


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## Circunflejo

I guess that Spanish irse por los cerros de Úbeda (to go around Úbeda's hills) and salirse por la tangente (to exit/get out through the tangent) may also fit.


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## Yendred

Circunflejo, do you know why this city of Úbeda conjures up detours and hesitation?


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## ThomasK

Just BTW: a rodeo? That is the same word that is used in American, I suppose, as rodere seems to mean (have meant) "turn around" - and creating a pen for the cattle thus


apmoy70 said:


> Greek:
> 
> 1- *<<Κρύβομαι πίσω από το δάχτυλό μου >>* [ˈkri.vɔ.me ˈpi.sɔ aˈpɔ tɔ ˈða.xtiˌlɔ mu] --> _to hide behind one's finger_
> 
> 2a- *<<Κάνω την πάπια>>* [ˈka.nɔ tiɱ ˈba.pça] --> _to play the duck_
> 2b- *<<Ποιοῦμαι τὴνamp νῆσσαν>>* [piˈu.me tin ˈni.san] --> _to play the duck_
> (2a) is the MoGr variation of (2b) which is older. Despite the archaic language though, it's no more than a century old (Katharevousa Greek).


 @apmoy: could you explain the idea behind the "hiding behind one's finger": fearing confrontation? As for the duck: what do Greek ducks typically do, I wonder?


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## merquiades

Circunflejo said:


> I guess that Spanish irse por los cerros de Úbeda (to go around Úbeda's hills) and salirse por la tangente (to exit/get out through the tangent) may also fit.


_Go off on a tangent_ is what we're not supposed to do in these fora.  Instead of staying on topic a speaker goes off in another direction and starts telling a story that has nothing to do with what he is supposed to be talking about.
_Beat around the bush _is when you are hesitant to do something (or address an issue) and you not quite sure how to go about it.




> Circunflejo, do you know why this city of Úbeda conjures up detours and hesitation?


As per Úbeda, it was a town in Andalusia. There was a legend during the reconquest of Úbeda that some of the soldiers disappeared before the battle and then reappeared when it was all over and the city had fallen. Their excuse what they went off on a path, got lost in the hills around town and couldn't find their way back.  Sounds like a wise decision


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## ThomasK

The "tangent" expression is not quite the same as beating around the bush, or is it?


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## merquiades

ThomasK said:


> The "tangent" expression is not quite the same as beating around the bush, or is it?


No, not quite, but sometimes close if we want them to be.  In the precise context of talking, "beating around the bush" is avoiding saying something you don't want to say,  "going off on a tangent" is going off topic during the talk.
She wanted to announce to her husband she was expecting but she kept beating about the bush because she had no idea what his reaction would be.
When the professor was supposed to be talking about the history of Úbeda he went off on a tangent and told the students about all his trips to Andalusia when he was young and how he met his wife.

But "beat around the bush" can be used in other contexts when there is no talking,  like when you are hesitant about doing anything.


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## ThomasK

I had understood well and then concluded that the second is not a real synonym, as this person is not avoiding the topic deliberately, but maybe just goes on rambling because he is that enthusiastic. No?


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## merquiades

ThomasK said:


> I had understood well and then concluded that the second is not a real synonym, as this person is not avoiding the topic deliberately, but maybe just goes on rambling because he is that enthusiastic. No?


Well, I guess you could technically go on rambling because you want to avoid addressing the main issue.....


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## Dymn

merquiades said:


> No, not quite, but sometimes close if we want them to be. In the precise context of talking, "beating around the bush" is avoiding saying something you don't want to say, "going off on a tangent" is going off topic during the talk.


Then this seems more appropriate for Spanish:

_andarse con rodeos = _beating around the bush
_irse por las ramas _= going off on a tangent


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## Circunflejo

merquiades said:


> As per Úbeda, it was a town in Andalusia.



It still exist (in fact, it's an UNESCO World Heritage site), so it's a town.



merquiades said:


> Their excuse what they went off on a path, got lost in the hills around town and couldn't find their way back.



In order to fully understand it, I would add that the hills around Úbeda are tiny and harly anyone can get lost there.



merquiades said:


> _Beat around the bush _is when you are hesitant to do something (or address an issue) and you not quite sure how to go about it.



Thank you for the clear explanation.



Dymn said:


> Then this seems more appropriate for Spanish:
> 
> _andarse con rodeos = _beating around the bush
> _irse por las ramas _= going off on a tangent



And _irse por los cerros de Úbeda_ would be on the later group too. Although, as it has already said, going off on a tangent can be a way of beating around the bush. In order words, you are hesitant about (how to do) something and you end doing something unrelated instead.
_Dar largas _might fit too but not necessarily. Dar largas means to delay a decision with any excuse, but you can delay it because you are hesitant about how to do it or, for example, because you forgot to make it but don't want to say it to the client...


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## symposium

The Italian equivalent is "menare il can per l'aia" = to walk the dog around the courtyard.


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## ain'ttranslationfun?

To intentionally change the subject ("(essayer de) noyer le poisson") is not the same as "y aller par quatre chemins/tourner autour du pot" ("to beat around the bush"). "To go off on a tangent" isn't necessarily an _intentional_ attempt to change the subject (In My Opinion).


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## Zareza

In Romanian

a se da după cireș = to hide behind the cherry tree
a se da după piersic = to hide behind the peach tree

a o lua pe ocolite = to take the long way around


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## merquiades

ain'ttranslationfun? said:


> To intentionally change the subject ("(essayer de) noyer le poisson") is not the same as "y aller par quatre chemins/tourner autour du pot" ("to beat around the bush"). "To go off on a tangent" isn't necessarily an _intentional_ attempt to change the subject (In My Opinion).


  I agree.  Some people _go off on tangents_ quite naturally and easily.  It can be a personality trait. _ Beating around the bush_ too.
Interesting.  I have heard  _N'y pas aller par quatre chemins,  (_get to the point, ir al grano), which is actually the opposite of beating the bush.  _Noyer le poisson_ is pretty cruel.



Circunflejo said:


> _Dar largas _might fit too but not necessarily. Dar largas means to delay a decision with any excuse, but you can delay it because you are hesitant about how to do it or, for example, because you forgot to make it but don't want to say it to the client...


 _Dar largas_ might be procrastinating?  Is it mean to _dar largas_ to someone? It's intentional. Is it used like _marear la perdiz_?


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## ThomasK

I am beginning to see the light: the hiding has to do with not having to face facts and people... _(I am sorry, I had not associated that idea with beating around the bush)_

I suddenly wonder about detours vs. [...] around. There might be a subtle difference in the sense that the turning around sticks to the topic (remains near) whereas detours may lead people further off-topic. Of course the concept of detours might be different in various languages: see here...


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## Circunflejo

merquiades said:


> Is it used like _marear la perdiz_?



Dar largas isn't (necessarily) intentional. Marear la perdiz is intentional. Example: in a court, a lawyer trying to make the trial as long as possible with judicial appeals and any other legal ways available to make it longer can be mareando la perdiz but it's not dando largas. On the other hand, if the verdict is announced to be ready in two weeks time but a delay is announced and another one is announced for the new date and another one is announced for a new date for no clear reason (or you suspect that the reasons given aren't the real reasons), or if a delay is announced and no new date is given and every time you ask when it will be ready, you don't get a clear answer but evasives or vague answers (like soon -but they've been saying it for months-, it's almost ready -but it has been that way for a long time and never ends-...) they are _dando largas_.


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## ain'ttranslationfun?

merquiades said:


> I have heard  _N'y pas aller par quatre chemins,  (_get to the point, ir al grano), which is actually the opposite of beating the bush.



Yes, I believe it's usually used in the negative: "Il n'y va pas/Je ne vais pas y aller par quatre chemins."


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## eno2

Dymn said:


> _irse por las ramas _("to go around the branches")


Esto es divagar = to digress. No es lo mismo que andarse con rodeos (( rodeos de rodear que puede significar ( DLE) 5. intr. Andar alrededor., to walk around something))

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I read here about 'procrastinate'. That's delay or postpone action; put off doing something. Tourner autour du pot, rond de pot draaien would rather be  TO  PREVARICATE'  *= r*esponder con evasivas (collins)


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## eno2

ThomasK said:


> Can you tell me what expression(s) you use to express this idea of "not being upfront" or something the like?
> 
> Dutch: "*(als een kat) om de hete brij [heen] lopen*" (run around the hot mash (like a cat)), [Belgian Dutch, Flemish]* "rond de pot draaien"* (turn around the pot).


What do you think of  'draaikonten'  Literally  to turn your cunt around.
Would you ever use om de hete brij [heen] lopen, Thomas?  Me no.


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## ThomasK

I know, the "hete brij" is more common in the Netherlands.... _Draaikonten _is more like changing opinions all the time, no? To that is different. They might have something in common in that you do not know what they really think. Don't you think?


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## eno2

Yes


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## bibax

ThomasK said:


> Dutch: "*(als een kat) om de hete brij [heen] lopen*" (run around the hot mash (like a cat)) ...


German: *um den heißen Brei (herum)schleichen (wie die Katze)*
Hungarian: *kerülgetni a forró kását (mint a macska)*
Czech: *chodit kolem horké kaše (jako kočka)*
Slovak:  *chodiť okolo horúcej kaše (ako mačka)*

Exactly the same meaning: _to go around the hot porridge (like the cat)._


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## elroy

Palestinian Arabic: تلف وتدور (~ “to turn and to spin”) — basically, two synonyms that mean “to go around”


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## ThomasK

So the idea of "going around" is present. Too bad we have no Asian or African contributors these days...


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## Armas

bibax said:


> Exactly the same meaning: _to go around the hot porridge (like the cat)._


Finnish also has it: _kiertää kuin kissa kuumaa puuroa.
Kierrellä_ "to go around and around"
_Kierrellä ja kaarrella_ "to go around and around and move in curves", I can't find better translation
_Kautta rantain_ "by the shores" (avoiding straight route)


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