# رمضان مبارك



## Drink

I'm a little confused about the grammar of the phrase رمضان مبارك. I was thinking that either this is short for something like "قد يكون رمضانُ مباركاً لك" (May Ramadan be blessed for you), or for something like "قد يكون لك رمضانُ المباركُ" (May you have a blessed Ramadan). But I cannot think how مبارك can be used without changes to the spelling, other than the simple statement "رمضانُ مباركٌ" (Ramadan is blessed), which I don't think is the intent of the expression.


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## analeeh

Well, firstly Ramadan Mubarak is not a very common Arabic phrase - it's much more common outside the Arabic-speaking parts of the Islamicate world.

Secondly, bear in mind that many of these expressions - even within the Arabic world - are most used and constructed according to colloquial structures, where cases don't exist. So the far more common رمضان كريم does not take case markings. (And the ambiguity is played on by the response الله أكرم).


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## Matat

Drink said:


> But I cannot think how مبارك can be used without changes to the spelling, other than the simple statement "رمضانُ مباركٌ" (Ramadan is blessed), which I don't think is the intent of the expression.


Actually, رمضانُ مباركٌ is the intent. Nominal sentences can be used to express wishing and greeting in Arabic. The famous Muslim greeting السلام عليكم is another such example.


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## Drink

But that could be interpreted as short for "قد يكون السلامُ عليكم" (May peace be upon you). You're not trying to say "Peace _is_ upon you".


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## Matat

Drink said:


> But that could be interpreted as short for "قد يكون السلامُ عليكم" (May peace be upon you).


السلام is not a فاعل لفعل محذوف. It is a مبتدأ. 


Drink said:


> You're not trying to say "Peace _is_ upon you".


This is actually what is being said. السلام عليكم isn't merely a wish, but it's a statement. رمضان مبارك is the same way.


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## elroy

Matat said:


> This is actually what is being said. السلام عليكم isn't merely a wish, but it's a statement.


 I disagree.  It means, and is routinely translated as, “Peace *be* upon you.”


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## Matat

elroy said:


> I disagree. It means, and is routinely translated as, “Peace *be* upon you.”


What's your i3raab of السلام عليكم?


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## elroy

مبتدأ وخبز


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## Matat

I agree with both your translation and your i3raab. What's the disagreement?


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## elroy

You said it was “Peace *is* upon you” and that it was a statement not a wish.  My translation is “Peace *be* upon you” (wish).


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## Matat

I said it's not merely a wish (it is still a wish), but also a statement. What I meant by that is that in its technical form, it's an equational sentence ("Peace is upon you") since it's a مبتدأ وخبر, though idiomatically, it is meant and understood as "Peace be upon you".


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## elroy

Here's how I analyze it:

*Syntactically*, it's a مبتدأ وخبر.  
*Semantically*, it's a wish. 
*Pragmatically*, it's a greeting. 

The syntactic structure does not tell us anything about its semantics or pragmatics.

I do see where you're coming from, but the way you've presented/analyzed it is misleading.  

Here's an analogy: 

In the sentence حفظك الله, the verb is in the past tense, but the _meaning_ is "May God protect you," not "God protected you."


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## Matat

I agree.


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## Ibn Nacer

elroy said:


> In the sentence حفظك الله, the verb is in the past tense, but the _meaning_ is "May God protect you," not "God protected you."


Yes I think you're right but now I'm wondering how to say "God protected you " ? Does it depend on the context?


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## elroy

Yes, it would be the same, and context would disambiguate the meaning.


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## Ibn Nacer

Ok merci.


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