# guro ng ...



## Qcumber

Magandáng umága sa inyóng lahát. 

Starting from the phrase
gúrò ng [nang] matemátiká = math(ematics) teacher
are the following variations acceptable?

A: Nag-ááral akó ng origami.
B: Mayroón ká báng gúrò? = Do you have a teacher?
A:
1) Dalawá: isá pára sa pagpílì ng papél at isá pá pára sa pagtutupî. = Two: one for choosing paper and another for folding it.

Also when you use terms like áwit "sing/song" and sayáw "dance", is the gerund preferable?

2) isáng gúrò ng áwit = a singing teacher
3) isáng gúrò ng pag-áwit = ditto
4) isáng gúrò ng pang-aáwit = ditto [for professional training]

5) isáng gúrò ng sayáw = a dance teacher
6) isáng gúrò ng pag-sayáw = ditto
7) isáng gúrò ng pananayáw = ditto [for professional training]

8) May dalawáng gúrò akó: isá pára sa pang-aáwit at isá páng pára sa pananayáw. = I have got two teachers: one for singing and another for dancing.


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## kios_01

*gúrò ng nang matemátiká* = math(ematics) teacher

("ng" is different from "nang"; same pronunciations yes, but diff. uses.)

But:
*Siya ang guro ko sa matematika.*
= She is my math teacher.

I guess when you use it simply as "math teacher" or "science teacher," you can use "ng" but in most cases, I think, we prefer to use "sa."

*Nag-ááral akó ng origami.  *

*Mayroón ká báng gúrò?  *

*Dalawá: isá pára sa pagpílì ng papél at isá pá pára sa pagtutupî.  *

*isáng gúrò ng áwit*
= a music teacher (emphasis on song music composing)
NOT = a singing teacher

*isáng gúrò ng pag-áwit*
= a music teacher (emphasis on voice training)
NOT = a singing teacher

To refer to a music teacher as a "guro ng awit" or "guro ng pag-awit" would sound rather poetic. I guess in everyday conversation, we use "sa" instead of "ng."

Now if you mean "a singing teacher" as in a teacher who can sing and who sings now and then, then you can say:

*isáng gurong umaáwit*

So yes, the gerund is preferable. Otherwise, meaning is changed.

*isáng gúrò ng pang-aáwit*
= can't figure out the meaning

*isáng gúrò ng sayáw*
*isáng gúrò ng pag-sayáw*
= a dance teacher  

Again, "sa" is preferred.

*isáng gúrò ng pananayáw*
*= *can't figure out the meaning

*May dalawáng gúrò akó: isá pára sa pang-aáwit at isá páng pára sa pananayáw.  *
*May dalawáng gúrò akó: isa para sa pag-awit at isa pa para sa pagsayaw. *
*May dalawa akong guro: isa para sa pag-awit at isa pa para sa pagsayaw. *
= I have two teachers: one for singing and another for dancing.


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## moonshine

Just to add:
*guro ng <subject> = teacher of <subject>*
e.g. guro ng agham = teacher of science

This is used for the regular subjects (mathematics, arts, social studies, music) as you  use the regular form in Tagalog (matematika, sining, araling panlipunan, musika)

*guro sa <subject> = teacher in <subject>*
e.g. guro sa pag-arte = teacher in acting

This is used for the -ing subjects (dancing, singing, sculpting, acting) as you use the pag- form in Tagalog (pagsayaw, pagkanta/pag-awit, paglilok, pag-arte)


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## mylasalle

I also feel that "guro" has somehow lost its place in common usage and has been replaced by the more familiar "titser" which somehow demonstrates the powerful onslaught of English in the Tagalog vocabulary.

In the surrounding provinces of Manila though we see a variety of Tagalog that retains indigenous vocabularies which, admittedly, gives their dialect a more classical sound and sheen. A pleasure to the ears I must admit.


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## Qcumber

Thanks a lot for your answers. 

As regards the vocabulary. I thought the *mang-* verbal forms for these professional activities were used.

I have just checked them in my dictionnary (Vicassan's). This is what I found. The terms in bold letters are entered in the dictionary.  The others, with an asterisk, are not. Apparently, if they ever existed, they are no longer found in current usage.

*áwit* "song"
*mang-áwit ang [subject] = [subject] to work as a singer / to be a professional singer
*pang-aáwit = singing (gerund)
*mang-aáwit* = singer (agent noun)

*sayáw* = dance
*manayáw ang [subject] = [subject] to work as a dancer / to be a professional dancer
*pananayáw = dancing (gerund) 
*mánanayáw* = dancer (agent noun)

In brief, the *mag-* verbal form is the preferred one for professional activities and the *mang*- one is quietly pushed under the carpet. 

__________

What follows is not important.

Whether the term is *gúrò* or *títser*, the structures are the same. 

A "singing teacher" is not a "music teacher". They teach students of the performing arts how to sing. They don't teach them music. A "dance teacher" could also be called a "dancing teacher".

As regards *ng [nang]*, I merely recall the pronunciation of this modern abbreviation for casual readers who don't know Tagalog and could believe it is pronounced [õ] (I noticed that a couple of times in the past.)


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## mylasalle

I must admit I feel truly amazed at your analyses Qcumber. I do believe kios 01 and Moonshine feel likewise. I'm sure they also feel flattered an Englishman would express such a keen interest in the Tagalog language. And your thoughts are oh so astute!

I do know a number of foreigners here studying the Tagalog language. What I would like to do is to invite them here and participate in the discussion. They surely will find inspiration in you.

In the meantime, I have a new thread coming. It sounds pretty simple but it eventually drove me to confusion. The thread was a topic I actually used for a term paper. Hope to get your thoughts on it, as well as that of my countrymen.

Until then, Godspeed!


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## Qcumber

moonshine said:


> *guro ng <subject> = teacher of <subject>*
> e.g. guro ng agham = teacher of science
> *guro sa <subject> = teacher in <subject>*
> e.g. guro sa pag-arte = teacher in acting


Thanks a lot for this rule, Moonshine.
So it's  ng + noun, sa + gerund.


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