# British way of life.



## Kmyyy

Hello everybody!

What do the Puerto Ricans 180 times, the French 110 times and the British never?

No, not fornication... not drink coffee... try to find !
The answer is to touch somebody else !  

I read that in a tabloid this morning and I was really choqued ! Are the British really so ? Do they consider that looking sb eyes to eyes in the underground or touching sb because the train is full is an attack to their private life ? Why do they ever feel sorry ? How would they feel if a frenchman kissed him every morning and evening (as it's usually done in france)? 
Now I understand why the french kiss is so appreciated in GB !

Tell me more about what YOU think...

_[It is possible you can find some mistakes in the text... please correct them...]_


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## maxiogee

Kmyyy said:


> What do the Puerto Ricans 180 times, the French 110 times and the British never?


In - a day, a year, a life?




> I read that in a tabloid this morning and I was really choqued


"Don't believe all you read" - Did no one ever tell you that?


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## Kmyyy

In a day !!

Yes I've heard about that, but after reading, I asked to a british teacher, and she confirmed me that... 
That will be the confusion between a french and a briton in a bus (for example)
One looks at the other to be nice, and the briton feels uncomfortable !


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## Venezuelan_sweetie

Kmyyy said:


> That will be the confusion between a french and a briton in a bus (for example)
> One looks at the other to be nice, and the briton feels uncomfortable !


 
Well, my french darling, that could happen down here in Caracas, as well. 

And, if you were here, you'd probably feel like running away from all these slabbering guys, constantly touching and kissing everyone around... 

PS:  Did you say _tabloid_?  And, you _believe_ it?


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## Kmyyy

From a french tabloid (journal)...


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## cuchuflete

Do "french tabloids" have a reputation for being more physical than British ones?  Do they leave ink smudges on the intimate parts of your hands?

Is this yet another boring stereotype thread in the making?

You may use the search feature to find lots of useless generalities about most cultures.


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## geve

Kmyyy said:


> What do the Puerto Ricans 180 times, the French 110 times and the British never?


I certainly don't touch someone else 110 times a day. 
*Donc*, l'information est fausse, forcément.


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## Benjy

c'est pas ce qu'un petit oiseau (source tres fiable) m'avait dit 

The thing is.. I don't see how that can possibly be true, try getting on the tube bus or even the train at peak times. People clamber all over each other to get on.


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## geve

I thinks Kmyyy needs to tell us how her source defined "touch"...


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## Lugubert

I suppose us Swedes are more British than Roman. And it's not just related to the language sphere. My travel partner, originally Sino-Vietnamese, but as Swedish as anyone, got touched rather innocently (according to me) on her knee by a US citizen (a friend of a friend) when we travelled India. She was instantly furious. When he repeated his effort, she started hitting him with a fortunately empty water bottle. It was most interesting to note that the other restaurant guests, 50/50 Indians and tourists, applauded her.


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## emilymonster

do you think that's the say as kissing when you greet- like in england we 'peck' once away from the face and say, in the netherlands they kiss 3 times?


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## don maico

Believe me, Brits are getting far more touchy feely than they use to be.Hugs and kisses to our best pals. Heart to hearts with those that matter to us. Anal retentiveness is becoming a thing of the past.


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## emilymonster

we regard our 'personal space' in england as very highly prized, but we're getting better...
stiff upper lip and all that is sort of gone, but we still not do not particularly show our affection to 'outsiders', as it were. you're more likely to see a show of affection in a private place- why would we want to show anyone else?


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## don maico

Extravagant displays of emotion are becoming more and more common amongst those that know each other well. For example e few yeras ago one wopuld not see rugby players exhibiting any kind affection or emotional outburst upon winning a match or scoring some points. Now its hugs all over the place.
To be fair whilst close friends are learning to become more intimate with each other its also true to say that the Brits (in the south at any rate) continue to be aloof to those they dont know. Its not uncommon to live in a street and  communicate very liittle  with ones neighbours. Talking to complete strangers is also not common at all. Sad but true.


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## Kmyyy

Touch, to have a physical contact (when somebody gives me back money, he touches me the hand...) that's what I mean !

Geve said : "_I certainly don't touch someone else 110 times a day. _
_*Donc*, l'information est fausse, forcément. _"

Tu ne t'en rends même pas compte mon coco, essaie de réaliser un jour dans un magasin quand on te rend la monnaie, dans un bus quelconque, dans la rue (quand elle est étroite, les francais n'hesitent pas trop à bousculer, et donc à se toucher) 

Let's speak english again !
I spoke to an english girl who was absolutely astonished that I may have
spoken to strangers in the street, (for an information) had an eye contact with them (she mentionned she would think that I want to kill her if I do that!!!) or smiled to them ( she said she would smile back, even if she thinks that the person want to go out with her...)
[Oh God I can't realize how many people to whom I smiled or looked at in London though I falled in love with them !!! I'm so mad... ]

Bref, I'm proud to know that, I'll not do it again !
Lugubert, your story is very funny...
Thanks to all for your answers !


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## don maico

Kmyyy said:


> Let's speak english again !
> I spoke to an english girl who was absolutely astonished that I may have
> spoken to strangers in the street, (for an information) had an eye contact with them (she mentionned she would think that I want to kill her if I do that!!!) or smiled to them ( she said she would smile back, even if she thinks that the person want to go out with her...)
> [Oh God I can't realize how many people to whom I smiled or looked at in London though I falled in love with them !!! I'm so mad... ]


Yes a stranger would find it odd if someone invaded their body space by approaching them too closely. Depending on the invaders body language the recipient might find it threatening or very friendly. 

on your last point the term is fancy them.

I once knew a lady who was partially deaf and had a habit of getting very close and staring intently in ones eyes and she lipped read a lot. The feeling I got was electric because she was also very nice and I fancied her. But looking back I dont think the feeling was reciprocated.


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## TimeHP

> Tell me more about what YOU think...


 
I think that, more or less, it could be quite true.
But this habit is not tipically British.
Chinese and Japanese avoid touching or kissing other people too.
You may be interested in this thread: http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=211292

Ciao


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## Kmyyy

TimeHP, you're perfect ! That was exactly what I was looking for...  
And I must say that you're right, the British are not the one to have these habits ! I travelled a lot, and in Bangkok and Pukhet, that was terrible how the japanese/chinese tourists were icy !!  

Salut...


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## don maico

Mediterranean people are generally much warmer hearted anyway.I agree about the Chinese. They are most icy in the UK as well. Not a a smile or even a glance. Just poker faces.


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## geve

don maico said:


> Mediterranean people are generally much warmer hearted anyway.I agree about the Chinese. They are most icy in the UK as well. Not a a smile or even a glance. Just poker faces.


I would not be that positive about the behaviour of more than one billion persons...
I did get a lot of stares when I was in touristic places in China, and the regular occasional glances like those you get in Paris when I was in large urban areas. On Tiananmen two young Chinese tourists grabbed both my arms to take a picture, a Chinese couple hurried their baby into my arms for a picture, too. People talked to me too, to offer help or just to (try to) have a conversation. There is no way one could avoid physical contact when Shanghai's subway stops and the doors open. 
No physical contact? Icy, poker faces? Not all Chinese - not in my experience.

Ah, les joies des stéréotypes...


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## Venezuelan_sweetie

geve said:


> I would not be that positive about the behaviour of more than one billion persons...
> 
> Not all Chinese - not in my experience.
> 
> Ah, les joies des stéréotypes...


 
My point exactly. 

It could be somewhat true that some cultures tend to move towards specific behaviours, but from that, to say "you can expect this and that from a French/Puertorican/Chinese/Briton/whatever-nationality", you would neet tons of prejudice/stereotypes/generalities/.....


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## Benjy

Kmyyy said:


> Touch, to have a physical contact (when somebody gives me back money, he touches me the hand...) that's what I mean !
> 
> Geve said : "_I certainly don't touch someone else 110 times a day. _
> _*Donc*, l'information est fausse, forcément. _"
> 
> Tu ne t'en rends même pas compte mon coco, essaie de réaliser un jour dans un magasin quand on te rend la monnaie, dans un bus quelconque, dans la rue (quand elle est étroite, les francais n'hesitent pas trop à bousculer, et donc à se toucher)



Et tu crois que ça se passe comment en Anglettre? le cassier te passe la monaie sur un tapis roulant? qu'il te la balance et que tu dois la ratrapper? que dans le bus on porte des vetements dans ce style pour eviter de se bousculer/se toucher?


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## Setwale_Charm

Kmyyy said:


> Hello everybody!
> 
> What do the Puerto Ricans 180 times, the French 110 times and the British never?
> 
> No, not fornication... not drink coffee... try to find !
> The answer is to touch somebody else !
> 
> I read that in a tabloid this morning and I was really choqued ! Are the British really so ? Do they consider that looking sb eyes to eyes in the underground or touching sb because the train is full is an attack to their private life ? Why do they ever feel sorry ? How would they feel if a frenchman kissed him every morning and evening (as it's usually done in france)?
> Now I understand why the french kiss is so appreciated in GB !
> 
> Tell me more about what YOU think...
> 
> _[It is possible you can find some mistakes in the text... please correct them...]_


 

 This is true and ...this is so wonderful!!! This is something I so much love about Brits (and Germans, Finns etc) and loathe about "more touchy" nations. I wish they would all be like Brits and learn to respect other people`s privacy.
  And you are right , Venezuelan_sweetie, will they ever finally stop thinking that their touching and receiving kisses from them feels so great??!
  There are other ways of showing one`s empathy and getting to the stage of "touching" later on.
  Keep it up, Brits!!


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## invictaspirit

A lot of this thread is vacuous.    Including what some Brits have said.

A lot of Brits hug, touch each other and kiss.

I bear-hug and back-slap male friends and women-women and men-women kiss each other on the cheek when meeting socially in my group of friends.  I don't think we are particularly atypical.


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## Kmyyy

Hey *geve* ! Ne te braque pas ...
Pour les Chinois/Japonais, je ne leur reproche pas d'être "touchy" mais plutot de ne jamais rire ou jamais être très déconneurs. Je l'ai constaté par moi même en Thailande (ils faisaient partie des touristes), cependant je ne mets personne dans le même sac, et tente le plus possible d'effacer tous les préjugés que je pourrais garder, justement, en posant la question sur le forum !  De plus, le fait que tout le monde te courre après (pour te mettre leurs enfants dans les bras pour une photo) vient du fait que tu es étranger(ère). L'auraient-ils fait si tu étais chinois(e) ?

*Setwale_Charm*, i'm not against the Brits, or something like that, I just note they have differents behaviour than I have. It's important for me to know how it works in other regions of the world, to be better adapted ! 

I (as a french girl) feel embarassed in the presence of an "cold" person (no distinction of culture) and especially rejected when somebody refuses to cheek-kiss me ! (Do I smell bad ?  )
It gives me a bad first impression of the person...and so on and so forth !


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## Kmyyy

Benjy said:


> Et tu crois que ça se passe comment en Angleterre? le caissier te passe la monaie sur un tapis roulant? qu'il te la balance et que tu dois la rattrapper? que dans le bus on porte des vetements dans ce style pour eviter de se bousculer/se toucher?


 
Disons qu'ils osent pas se regarder, ils ont tous un journal ouvert (meme s'ils ne le lisent pas) 
Ok, je généralise, mais je l'ai vécu... Franchement, (perso) jme sens mal avec des personnes de ce genre qu'il ne faut pas trop trop approcher, sinon tu passes pour un malpoli ou bien elles se braquent... Après, tu es probablement plus jeune, donc ca te parait absurde ce que je te raconte, et toi tu te permets d'agir comme ca te plait. Mais je discutais hier avec une anglaise (17 ans) qui m'a dit de sa propre bouche qu'elle penserait qu'on voudrait la tuer, si on la regardait dans les yeux un peu plus insistement que prévu  Encore une fois, je ne l'invente pas...
Moi je suis jeunette aussi (16ans) et c'est bien pour ca que je demande ici ce que vous en pensez (j'ai deja beaucoup de mal avec l'anglais, pour me faire comprendre).
Je faisais ca juste dans le but de comprendre d'autres cultures ou manière d'agir que la mienne.
Mais pour l'instant, je me suis pris une raclée de tout le monde, comme quoi je stereotypise, et qu'il ne faut pas mettre tout le monde dans le meme sac... Ce que je retiendrai, c'est que vous etes de manière generale (pour changer !) très "touchy". Pour le coup, je l'aurai compris !


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## Thomsen

Kmyyy, je t'ai autre example.  Sometimes when gay men meet they like to kiss on the cheeks.  I absolutely refuse to do this and prefer to shake hands unless it is an old friend.  I think some people are put off by it, but its just personal preference.

My point is that it's not just culture but individual people.  There are people who deviate from the culture both ways, warmer or colder.  But there is at least a grain of truth.  Would anyway say that a Scandinavian  (in general) is more outgoing than an a Brazilian (in general)?  Not likely for most people, though obviously stereotypes never hold true for everyone....


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## Kmyyy

Thomsen said:
			
		

> Kmyyy, je t'ai autre example. Sometimes when gay men meet they like to kiss on the cheeks. I absolutely refuse to do this and prefer to shake hands unless it is an old friend. I think some people are put off by it, but its just personal preference.


 
Have you associated the cheek-kiss to gays ?   Than, I can understand your point of view ! Even if you have to kiss a woman ?   



Thomsen said:


> Would anyway say that a Scandinavian (in general) is more outgoing than an a Brazilian (in general)? Not likely for most people, though obviously stereotypes never hold true for everyone....


 
You're right... I can understand the dissatisfaction of all the Brits of the forum ! Please Excuse Me ! I know how painful it is when somebody allots a stereotype that doesn't work for everybody. (Example : the french are arrogant...that irritates me)


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## invictaspirit

Apart from anything else, I hate to break it to you folks, but in terms of stereotypes, the French aren't seen as particularly emotionally warm.  

The Spanish, Italians and Brazilians, yes, sure, warm as toast and twice as fun...but not really the French. I think you'll find that many stereotypes place the French as giving a perfunctory and slightly polite and chilly 'mwack mwack' on greeting. Hardly a Latin hug-fest.

Stereotypes on social warmth are graded north-south in Europe, and even within countries.  The UK is no exception.  I'm about as southern as you can get without being French.  We are stereotypically more touchy-feely than northerners and Scots, and I have been criticised by both as being so.


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## ElaineG

> Have you associated the cheek-kiss to gays ?


 
Here in NY (and I would suspect in Washington where Thomsen is from), the _man to man_ cheek kiss is only routinely practiced (apart from among various immigrant groups) by _some _gay men. Straight American-born men don't naturally cheek kiss each other, though they may cheek kiss their female friends.

Other gay men that I know find the practice affected.


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## Thomsen

Kmyyy said:


> Have you associated the cheek-kiss to gays ?  Than, I can understand your point of view ! Even if you have to kiss a woman ?


 
No, but in the USA men don't kiss unless... No one would expect a straight guy to kiss another man, even on the cheek. I don't mind kissing women if they are from a culture that does so. Otherwise, see Elaine's post below. 



ElaineG said:


> Here in NY (and I would suspect in Washington where Thomsen is from), the _man to man_ cheek kiss is only routinely practiced (apart from among various immigrant groups) by _some _gay men. Straight American-born men don't naturally cheek kiss each other, though they may cheek kiss their female friends.
> 
> Other gay men that I know find the practice affected.


 
It is so affected. 

*Sorry I didn't mean this to be about me, but rather the fact that people within groups vary widely despite stereotypes or even prevailing practices.*

Kmyyy, je ne pense pas que les frances sont plus arrogants que les americaines!  Excuse my abysmal French.  I just wanted to say that I don't think the French are any more arrogant than the Americans!


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## Benjy

Kmyyy said:


> Disons qu'ils osent pas se regarder, ils ont tous un journal ouvert (meme s'ils ne le lisent pas)
> Ok, je généralise, mais je l'ai vécu... Franchement, (perso) jme sens mal avec des personnes de ce genre qu'il ne faut pas trop trop approcher, sinon tu passes pour un malpoli ou bien elles se braquent... Après, tu es probablement plus jeune, donc ca te parait absurde ce que je te raconte, et toi tu te permets d'agir comme ca te plait. Mais je discutais hier avec une anglaise (17 ans) qui m'a dit de sa propre bouche qu'elle penserait qu'on voudrait la tuer, si on la regardait dans les yeux un peu plus insistement que prévu  Encore une fois, je ne l'invente pas...
> Moi je suis jeunette aussi (16ans) et c'est bien pour ca que je demande ici ce que vous en pensez (j'ai deja beaucoup de mal avec l'anglais, pour me faire comprendre).
> Je faisais ca juste dans le but de comprendre d'autres cultures ou manière d'agir que la mienne.
> Mais pour l'instant, je me suis pris une raclée de tout le monde, comme quoi je stereotypise, et qu'il ne faut pas mettre tout le monde dans le meme sac... Ce que je retiendrai, c'est que vous etes de manière generale (pour changer !) très "touchy". Pour le coup, je l'aurai compris !





D'abord, tout ce que j'avais dit dans mon poste precedant c'etait à prendre au deuxieme, mais bon j'aurais du preciser. Trés souvent l'humour passe mal sur internet.

Voilà je tenais tout simplement à vous signaler qu'il est impossible, même dans ce pays de glaçons qu'est L'Angleterre, de passer la journée sans toucher ou se faire toucher par les autres.

Après ça tout est une question de culture. nous, on se fait des câlins. vous, vous tapez la bise. moi, je vois pas trop la difference  Vous trouvez bizarre qu'on ne le fasse pas, nous, on trouve bizarre que vous le fassiez.

Pour la fille, je crois qu'elle est plutot atypique et franchement vachement timide. on peut tout affirmer ou infirmer à partir des cas particuliers. 

À part ça j'ai rien à ajouter si ce n'est des platitudes creuses des stéreotypes vides de sens. Donc je vais me taire


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## distille

One of my English teacher (I was 16, so that was 12 years ago) used to tell us:

- Do you know why there are so many fights in British pubs, compared with French Bars? (the guy was Scottish I think, in any case he came from the UK)

Because this is the only occasion Brit men have to touch each other,


I don't know if it is true, but at least it was a nice theory, and for the sake of a nice theory...a french woman can only agree ;-)


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## maxiogee

Kmyyy said:


> I (as a french girl) feel embarassed in the presence of an "cold" person (no distinction of culture) and especially rejected when somebody refuses to cheek-kiss me ! (Do I smell bad ?  )
> It gives me a bad first impression of the person...and so on and so forth !



Why would you kiss someone of whom you haven't even got a first impression. This implies that you kiss total strangers - friends of a friend, maybe. I can't be doing that!!!

I loathe the falseness of the the air-kiss which many women seem to expect. The 'mwah mwah' sometimes not-quite-even-touching of cheeks and a half-hearted hug - sometimes preformed with just one arm. I have several female cousins who expect this of all their relatives and friends upon meeting. I've even seen them grimace over the shoulder of the person they're greeting as the look at a close friend, with a look of "Ugh, why am I doing this?" I fail to understand the procedure or the reason behind it.


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## don maico

I am afraid one is always going to find generalisations where particular groupings( eg nationalities) are concerned. There is ,though, an element of truth in them. English = aloof ,arrogant, reserved, pompous. Err yes ok some are.On the other hand approach them in a positive frame of mind and you are likely to get a more positive response


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## don maico

maxiogee said:


> Why would you kiss someone of whom you haven't even got a first impression. This implies that you kiss total strangers - friends of a friend, maybe. I can't be doing that!!!
> 
> I loathe the falseness of the the air-kiss which many women seem to expect. The 'mwah mwah' sometimes not-quite-even-touching of cheeks and a half-hearted hug - sometimes preformed with just one arm. I have several female cousins who expect this of all their relatives and friends upon meeting. I've even seen them grimace over the shoulder of the person they're greeting as the look at a close friend, with a look of "Ugh, why am I doing this?" I fail to understand the procedure or the reason behind it.


its not false. Its just kind of ritualistic thats all


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## Setwale_Charm

Kmyyy said:


> *Setwale_Charm*, i'm not against the Brits, or something like that, I just note they have differents behaviour than I have. It's important for me to know how it works in other regions of the world, to be better adapted !
> 
> I (as a french girl) feel embarassed in the presence of an "cold" person (no distinction of culture) and especially rejected when somebody refuses to cheek-kiss me ! (Do I smell bad ?  )
> It gives me a bad first impression of the person...and so on and so forth !


 
I have nothing against your traditions but one has to keep it within one`s own circle. 
I, for myself, am far from happy about having to touch somebody whom I do not choose to touch. Of course, the problem with Brits or Germans is that sometimes you very much want to touch him (her). Still, as I said, there are other ways of paving your way to that, but having to touch somebody who is unpleasant to you is an ordeal. 
I wonder, are customary norms of tactile contact in any way related to the problem of harassment or groping in different countries?


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## maxiogee

don maico said:


> its not false. Its just kind of ritualistic thats all



Rituals without meaning are false.


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## don maico

Setwale_Charm said:


> don maico) I have nothng against touching somebody I know and I like. But it has to be on the basis of common concent too.



I am not suggesting one should be forced to do it.As far as i can see touching between individuals builds up as a relationship develops from a formal to a informal stage and so on. If you didnt like someone you would avoid speaking to them let alone touch them.


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## TimeHP

Just to clarify:
We (= touchers) touch and kiss only people that we like touching and kissing. 
And we do it with people that like to be kissed and touched.
We don't go around touching and kissing everyone.
That's the difference: we don't feel obliged to be warm and expansive, we just are that way. 
So I wouldn't speak of falseness and hypocrisy.
People can be outgoing or introvert. But environment can condition human behaviour.
That's all.

Ciao

p.s. when I write 'that's all', I mean: this is my opinion...


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## COF

Though the British are becoming less reservered, it's considered common practice to innocently start conversations/speak with people you don't know. And people are quite suprised when this happens, and usually think the person is a weirdo.

I've found people are more open in the majority of other European countries.


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## geve

Kmyyy said:


> Hey *geve* ! Ne te braque pas ...
> Pour les Chinois/Japonais, je ne leur reproche pas d'être "touchy" mais plutot de ne jamais rire ou jamais être très déconneurs. Je l'ai constaté par moi même en Thailande (ils faisaient partie des touristes), cependant je ne mets personne dans le même sac, et tente le plus possible d'effacer tous les préjugés que je pourrais garder, justement, en posant la question sur le forum !  De plus, le fait que tout le monde te courre après (pour te mettre leurs enfants dans les bras pour une photo) vient du fait que tu es étranger(ère). L'auraient-ils fait si tu étais chinois(e) ?
> 
> *Setwale_Charm*, i'm not against the Brits, or something like that, I just note they have differents behaviour than I have. It's important for me to know how it works in other regions of the world, to be better adapted !
> 
> I (as a french girl) feel embarassed in the presence of an "cold" person (no distinction of culture) and especially rejected when somebody refuses to cheek-kiss me ! (Do I smell bad ?  )
> It gives me a bad first impression of the person...and so on and so forth !


Je ne me braque pas, je réponds à *don maico* avec mon expérience des Chinois en Chine, qui ne correspond pas à la sienne.  Bien sûr qu'ils ne m'auraient pas abordée de la même façon si je n'avais pas été étrangère, mais ces attitudes ne me paraissent pas être le fait de personnes culturellement réfractaires à tout contact physique. 
(d'autre part, mettre les Chinois et les Japonais dans le même sac, ce n'est pas très judicieux )

Je mets à part les façons de se saluer (telles que discutées dans l'autre fil), il y a en effet des coutumes locales, régionales voire nationales. Faire la bise n'est pas une chose courante dans d'autres cultures ; cela n'a rien de choquant ou de vexant, même si ça peut être difficile de s'y faire (pour ma part, les "hugs" à l'américaine me mettaient généralement mal à l'aise - mais je ne vais pas considérer les Américains comme mal élevés ou intrusifs pour autant - il s'agit d'un usage courant, c'est tout).

Maintenant en ce qui concerne les attitudes face au contact physique, à l'expression du visage, au caractère avenant de la population... Moi je trouve les Français arrogants (un peu) et râleurs (beaucoup), et sur le plan personnel je ne suis pas très encline au contact physique : voilà ce que j'aurais peut-être répondu si un Anglais m'interrogeait à ce sujet (comme tu l'as fait avec l'Anglaise de 17 ans que tu mentionnes). Si c'était toi qu'il interrogeait, tu aurais répondu autre chose... La généralisation à l'échelle des nations est une science difficile.


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## Chaska Ñawi

Now that we have welcomed this topic with open arms and embraced it wholeheartedly for several days, the time has come to end our chat with it, give it a farewell hug and let it continue on its travels.

Thank you for your understanding,
Chaska.


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