# 少则千把元，多则几千上万



## anialuo

Hi,

what is the meaning of 则 in this sentence? I can't find it in any dictionary.

在这里消遣 一晚上，少*则*千把元，多*则*几千上万 。


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## xiaolijie

则 can be considered as a kind of 是, used typically in the context where two things are contrasted. Here in the example: *"less is..., more is..."*. The sentence can therefore be re-written as: 在这里消遣 一晚上，少*是*千把元，多*是*几千上万 。


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## anialuo

Thanks a lot, xiaolijie!

One more question regarding the sentence- what does the 把 mean here? 
(千把元)


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## e.ma

I would say a thousand yuans (or whatever) at least, and some thousands, up to ten thousands if we are lucky. *则 *here would mean "if" and *把* would mean "to grab". Something like: if little, we can grab a thousand yuans; if much, we could get up to ten thousand.

But I might be completely wrong...


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## BODYholic

anialuo said:


> One more question regarding the sentence- what does the 把 mean here?
> (千把元)



把 means 'a handful'. (counting word?)


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## hkenneth

anialuo said:


> Thanks a lot, xiaolijie!
> 
> One more question regarding the sentence- what does the 把 mean here?
> (千把元)



I think here 把 just means 'approximately'.


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## hkenneth

anialuo said:


> Hi,
> 
> what is the meaning of 则 in this sentence? I can't find it in any dictionary.
> 
> 在这里消遣 一晚上，少*则*千把元，多*则*几千上万 。



saying 则 = 是 is incorrect.

则 means ‘if then’.

if A then B = A则B

therefore, 否则 = 'not if, otherwise', since 否 means 'not'

for example, 穷则思变 is a saying which means ‘*if* one is poor (or desperate), *then* he will think to make some change (of his life)’


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## xiaolijie

hkenneth said:
			
		

> saying 则 = 是 is incorrect.
> 则 means ‘if then’.


Don't be too sure and too clever, as you can sound rude. There are more than one way / different ways to explain the same thing. Besides, my explanation does not consist of just "则 = 是" and you shouldn't quote it like that.


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## hkenneth

xiaolijie said:


> Don't be too sure and too clever, as you can sound rude. There are more than one way / different ways to explain the same thing. Besides, my explanation does not consist of just "则 = 是" and you shouldn't quote it like that.



I didn't mean to offend but for sure at least it is not proper to relate 则 to 是 in any situation to any extent.

Here is the explanation of 则 in detail, including both ancient obsolete and contemporary meanings. *(Moderator's note: Because of copyright issues, the mentioned text has been deleted, leaving only the relevant entry.)*

For 少则千把元，多则几千上万, it is the 20th meaning.


則, 则 zé ㄗㄜˊ
20.連詞。表承接。c.所連接的後一部分是前一部分的結果，猶言就，那麼。
《孟子‧梁惠王上》：“若隱其無罪而就死地，則牛羊何擇焉？”
《三國志‧蜀志‧諸葛亮傳》：“誠如是，則霸業可成，漢室可興矣。”
唐劉禹錫《陋室銘》：“山不在高，有仙則名；水不在深，有龍則靈。”


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## xiaolijie

hkenneth said:
			
		

> I didn't mean to offend but for sure at least it is not proper to relate 则 to 是 in any situation to any extent.


You didn't mean to but you do offend, that is what I was trying to tell you! 
I used to explain 则 along the line of "if then", but I later on found that a short cut can sometimes work better. Such is the example below, explaining 则 via 是 would be much more practical than citing pages of Chinese in order to explain something much simpler than the explanation itself:
好*则*好，就是太贵。(It's good all right, but it's too expensive)
好*是*好，就是太贵。(It's good all right, but it's too expensive)

With these examples, can you still say "_it is not proper to relate 则 to 是 in any situation to any extent_" ??!

Anyway, a tip for your long lasting enjoyment of the forums: just say what you want but try not to jump into conclusions about other people's posts. As I already said, there are more than one way of approaching a problem and you shouldn't be too quick to make statements about other people's.


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## Razzle Storm

xiaolijie said:


> You didn't mean to but you do offend, that is what I was trying to tell you!
> I used to explain 则 along the line of "if then", but I later on found that a short cut can sometimes work better. Such is the example below, explaining 则 via 是 would be much more practical than citing pages of Chinese in order to explain something much simpler than the explanation itself:
> 好*则*好，就是太贵。(It's good all right, but it's too expensive)
> 好*是*好，就是太贵。(It's good all right, but it's too expensive)
> 
> With these examples, can you still say "_it is not proper to relate 则 to 是 in any situation to any extent_" ??!
> 
> Anyway, a tip for your long lasting enjoyment of the forums: just say what you want but try not to jump into conclusions about other people's posts. As I already said, there are more than one way of approaching a problem and you shouldn't be too quick to make statements about other people's.



I can understand where you're coming from, since trying to explain 则 to someone who doesn't know the classical meaning could be an overly complicated task, and could be simplified to 是. However, I think maybe hkenneth is saying that making 是 and 则 equivalent in someone's mind could lead to errors in understanding. 

Again, shortening the explanation saves a lot of time, and works for many cases, but it could cause whoever learns it that way to get into a bad habit of thinking the two are equivalent, which can be troublesome if they ever learn Classical Chinese (when 是 is not anywhere near the modern equivalent, and they have to re-learn the meaning).


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## Zhengke

anialuo said:


> Hi,
> 
> what is the meaning of 则 in this sentence? I can't find it in any dictionary.
> 
> 在这里消遣 一晚上，少*则*千把元，多*则*几千上万 。


 
这句话换一种更口语化的说法就是：
在这里消遣一晚上，花得少的话要一千左右，多的话要几千上万。

则在这里应该表示一种因果关系，如果花得少，那么要花掉你一千左右；如果花得多，就可能花掉你几千甚至上万。

“则”在具体语境中有很多含义，可以在 http://www.zdic.net/ 输入“则”查看。

“把”在这里就是“大约”的意思。具体在使用的时候，我们可能会说：“百把元钱”，“千把元钱”或“万把元钱”，在我印象里似乎仅限于这三者。我们不说“十把元钱”或“十万把元钱”，这时候我们说“大约十元钱”，“十元左右”，“大约十万元”，“十万元左右”。


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## viajero_canjeado

Continuing on that vein, with 十 you can also use 幾 to express an indeterminate amount.
有一次我把十幾個人在我車子裡塞進去.


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## Lamb67

Figuratively speaking 则 is a 'guy ' that needs you to do some work before you may honor its use while 是 retains its literal sense of 'yes,that's right'. 

Phonetically speaking ze(3) consisits of two tones-falling and rising WHILE shi(4) is only one.

The tone3 in Chinese in ze may project an image of a man studying Classic book moving his pigtail up and down as if rhyming with tone (3) in a dozy afternoon.


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## Ghabi

xiaolijie said:


> I used to explain 则 along the line of "if then", but I later on found  that a short cut can sometimes work better. Such is the example below,  explaining 则 via 是 would be much more practical than citing pages of  Chinese in order to explain something much simpler than the explanation  itself:
> 好*则*好，就是太贵。(It's good all right, but it's too expensive)
> 好*是*好，就是太贵。(It's good all right, but it's too expensive)
> 
> With these examples, can you still say "_it is not proper to relate 则 to 是 in any situation to any extent_" ??!


I just want to add that 则 and 是 serve different purposes in the sentences above. Let's parse them:

-好则好，就是太贵。 As far as goodness is concerned, it is good; but it's too expensive. 
-好是好，就是太贵。As far as goodness is concerned, it is good; but it's too expensive.

In the 1st sentence 則 is used to introduce the comment ("it is good"); while in the 2nd sentence 是 is a copula within the comment. Actually we can compose a 3rd sentence with the same meaning:

-好则是好，就是太贵。



Zhengke said:


> “把”在这里就是“大约”的意思。具体在使用的时候，我们可能会说：“百把元钱”，“千把元钱”或“万把元钱”，在我印象里似乎仅限于这三者。我们不说 “十把元钱”或“十万把元钱”，这时候我们说“大约十元钱”，“十元左右”，“大约十万元”，“十万元左右”。


We can also add 把 after a "measure word", often with a belittling connotation. For example, from the second chapter of 儒林外史: 


> 夏總甲道：「...... 況今年老爺衙門裏，頭班、二班、西班、快班，家家都興龍燈，我料想看個不了，那得功夫來看鄉裏這*條把*燈......」


I think 千把元 can also mean "a mere $1,000" in some contexts.


Razzle Storm said:


> ...... but it could cause whoever learns it that way to get into a bad habit of thinking the two are equivalent, which can be troublesome if they ever learn Classical Chinese (when 是 is not anywhere near the modern equivalent, and they have to re-learn the meaning).


You can say that again!


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## e.ma

谢谢各位的介绍。

。。。。。。。。。。


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## anialuo

Thank you all for the comments, it was of much help to me!

Zhengke: 那个字典真不错呀!


哦对了, 则不是读第二声吗?


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## Lamb67

哦对了, 则不是读第二声吗? 

oh, I maybe wrong but that man still can RISE his pigtail.


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## anialuo

> oh, I maybe wrong but that man still can RISE his pigtail.


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## hkenneth

Ghabi said:


> I just want to add that 则 and 是 serve different purposes in the sentences above. Let's parse them:
> 
> -好则好，就是太贵。 As far as goodness is concerned, it is good; but it's too expensive.
> -好是好，就是太贵。As far as goodness is concerned, it is good; but it's too expensive.
> 
> In the 1st sentence 則 is used to introduce the comment ("it is good"); while in the 2nd sentence 是 is a copula within the comment. Actually we can compose a 3rd sentence with the same meaning:
> 
> -好则是好，就是太贵。
> 
> 
> We can also add 把 after a "measure word", often with a belittling connotation. For example, from the second chapter of 儒林外史:
> I think 千把元 can also mean "a mere $1,000" in some contexts.
> 
> You can say that again!



Yes, I cannot agree more. Linking 是 to 则 is just like linking 'rather' to 'better', just because 'had rather' and 'had better' have the same meaning.


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## Lamb67

An analyze of 则's two parts money(贝）and a sword may make you think of Mr ZE(2) 则 is wondering what his stock price the next hour would be for instance. There are not many cases other than this could fit the topic better I suppose.


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## flenci

simply， 则=is


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## bamboobanga

i think it implicitly implies conditional tense，则＝could be。


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