# Freedom (eleutheria-leuteria)



## Solle

Kalimera!

 Unfortunately, I do not speak Greek but I take part in a choir that sings popular and folk songs in Greek. In the songs lyrics, I often see two very similar words: eleutheria and leuteria. My choir colleagues tell me they both mean "freedom", with a style difference. But if so, how could they be used in one and the same text? I'm just very curious and indifferent to what I sing, so I should be most grateful for any explanation.


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## Perseas

Actually, "λευτεριά" is a corrupted form of "ελευθερία".   ελευθερία---> ελευθτεριά.
Today we usually use "ελευθερία" when we refer to "freedom". "Λευτεριά", which is a term of the vernacular, is still in use but it was mainly used in the past.


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## Solle

Perseas said:


> Actually, "λευτεριά" is a corrupted form of "ελευθερία".   ελευθερία---> ελευθτεριά.
> Today we usually use "ελευθερία" when we refer to "freedom". "Λευτεριά", which is a term of the vernacular, is still in use but it was mainly used in the past.



Kala euharisto! 

Thank you very much for a detailed explanation.  I still wonder if these two word variations can be used in one and the same text (a song). It reads that Macedonia is "eleutheri", but people will remain "leuteria"...Is it possible?


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## Perseas

I assure you both variations can be used in the same text . And this mostly applies to a song which has rhyme.


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## fdb

ἐλευθερία is Ancient Greek, and is also used it the variety of Modern Greek called katharevusa. λευτεριά is Modern Greek (dhimotiki). This is an example of how some katharevusa words have been adopted in (some would say: have invaded) the spoken language.


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## Solle

Perseas said:


> I assure you both variations can be used in the same text . And this mostly applies to a song which has rhyme.



Ah, yes, the rhyme, that explains much Thank you so much!


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## Solle

fdb said:


> ἐλευθερία is Ancient Greek, and is also used it the variety of Modern Greek called katharevusa. λευτεριά is Modern Greek (dhimotiki). This is an example of how some katharevusa words have been adopted in (some would say: have invaded) the spoken language.



How interesting! And what is katharevusa? Is it a dialect or a stylistic variety of Greek?


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## adber010

In my dictionary Ελευθερία translates as "freedom" and λευτεριά as "liberty". So then the question becomes: what is the difference in english?


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## fdb

Solle said:


> How interesting! And what is katharevusa? Is it a dialect or a stylistic variety of Greek?



Katharevusa is essentially an artificial language, an attempt to "purify" the spoken language by restoring some ancient words and grammatical constructions. It has traditionally been favoured by the Orthodox Church and by some (mainly right-wing) politicians.

Dhimotiki is modern spoken Greek. It has been used by virtually all serious literary writers since at least the beginning of the 20th century.


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## Solle

fdb said:


> Katharevusa is essentially an artificial language, an attempt to "purify" the spoken language by restoring some ancient words and grammatical constructions. It has traditionally been favoured by the Orthodox Church and by some (mainly right-wing) politicians.
> 
> 
> Dhimotiki is modern spoken Greek. It has been used by virtually all serious literary writers since at least the beginning of the 20th century.



What an interesting linguistic situation, and still more interesting that the artificial "dialect" is not rejected by the native speakers.


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## Perseas

fdb said:


> ἐλευθερία is Ancient Greek, and is also used it the variety of Modern Greek called katharevusa. λευτεριά is Modern Greek (dhimotiki). This is an example of how some katharevusa words have been adopted in (some would say: have invaded) the spoken language.


"Ελευθερία" is an ancient word but my impression is that it never stopped being in use during the ages. 

I 'd like also to add that "λευτεριά" is used as a wish to pregnant women (to give a good childbirth) --> "καλή λευτεριά", and to people who are enslaved (to regain their freedom) --> "λευτεριά στον/στην name".


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## shawnee

The reason that the relationship between Katharevousa and Modern Greek is fluid (hence the survival of Ελευθερία) is a result of the fact that Katharevousa was not quite an 'artificial' language as such. The OP is advised to check out a wiki on the subject for starters.


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## Solle

shawnee said:


> The reason that the relationship between Katharevousa and Modern Greek is fluid (hence the survival of Ελευθερία) is a result of the fact that Katharevousa was not quite an 'artificial' language as such. The OP is advised to check out a wiki on the subject for starters.



I will, as I had no idea of this before, and now greatly interested


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## Solle

Perseas said:


> "Ελευθερία" is an ancient word but my impression is that it never stopped being in use during the ages.
> 
> I 'd like also to add that "λευτεριά" is used as a wish to pregnant women (to give a good childbirth) --> "καλή λευτεριά", and to people who are enslaved (to regain their freedom) --> "λευτεριά στον/στην name".



A beautiful wish for both those who give a new life and who regain their own free life.


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## Solle

adber010 said:


> In my dictionary Ελευθερία translates as "freedom" and λευτεριά as "liberty". So then the question becomes: what is the difference in english?



 It seems that "freedom" is wider in meaning and can denote both the moral and physical state of freedom while "liberty" refers to freedom from imprisonment, invasion. or another kind of political or social oppression.


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## adber010

Solle said:


> It seems that "freedom" is wider in meaning and can denote both the moral and physical state of freedom while "liberty" refers to freedom from imprisonment, invasion. or another kind of political or social oppression.


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## fdb

In English "freedom" and "liberty" are virually synonyms. The main difference is that "freedom" is a native (Germanic) word and "liberty" is a Latin borrowing. In this sense I would think that "freedom" is (at least historically) like /lefterya/ (the "genuine" Neo-Greek form) and "liberty" is like /elefθeria/ (a "learned" borrowing from an ancient language).


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## fdb

Solle said:


> It seems that "freedom" is wider in meaning and can denote both the moral and physical state of freedom while "liberty" refers to freedom from imprisonment, invasion. or another kind of political or social oppression.



I take the liberty (sic) to disagree with this.


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## velisarius

Sorry to disagree with posts #15 and 16, but freedom and liberty in English are almost always synonymous. It's just that "liberty"  belongs to a higher register, whereas "freedom" is the more usual and colloquial word to use. Both anyhow are normally translated in modern Greek as "ελευθερία".

"Ελευθερία ή θάνατος"- "Freedom/Liberty or Death"


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## Solle

fdb said:


> I take the liberty (sic) to disagree with this.



Ah, yes, this quote shows I was too categorical. Perhaps the difference is really just in style.


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## Live2Learn

Those who have said that freedom and liberty are virtually or almost synonymous are probably referring to meaning, not to use. There are numerous examples where one is used rather than the other. Take the following collocations as just some examples:

freedom from discrimination, scrutiny, etc.
freedom of choice, expression, inquiry, movement, speech, the press
freedom to practice, to think, to choose (cf. be at liberty to...)
religious freedom
political freedom
economic freedom
intellectual freedom
relative freedom
...bought their freedom
...will be given their freedom
...serve the cause of freedom
...an indication of the freedom afforded by the outdoors

For those who are interested in exploring similar topics, I recommend the following site: www.wordandphrase.info.


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## Live2Learn

Live2Learn said:


> Those who have said that freedom and liberty are virtually or almost synonymous are probably referring to meaning, not to use. There are numerous examples where one is used rather than the other. Take the following collocations as just some examples:
> 
> freedom from discrimination, scrutiny, etc.
> freedom of choice, expression, inquiry, movement, speech, the press
> freedom to practice, to think, to choose (cf. be at liberty to...)
> religious freedom
> political freedom
> economic freedom
> intellectual freedom
> relative freedom
> ...bought their freedom
> ...will be given their freedom
> ...serve the cause of freedom
> ...an indication of the freedom afforded by the outdoors
> 
> For those who are interested in exploring similar topics, I recommend the following site: www.wordandphrase.info.



I actually should have said, "There are numerous examples where one TENDS TO BE used more than the other."  For example a Google search of "economic freedom" yields 5,000,000 hits while "economic liberty" produces only 469,000 hits; "Freedom of choice" gives 7,030,000 hits, while "liberty of choice" gives only 399,000.


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## fdb

....whereby the variant with "liberty" tends to be more colourful or of more elevated style.


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