# Language skills and alcohol



## I.C.

Just curious, do your abilities to express yourself in the foreign languages you are fluent in increase or decrease when you've had a glass or two?
Mine increase. That's been proven by scientists. 
So I was wondering. 
I'm sober, by the way.


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## la reine victoria

I'm sober too!  I agree with you.  I believe alcohol can boost confidence and thus increase competence.


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## I.C.

Well, with me it definitely isn't a question of confidence.


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## Jana337

I don't drink but the complexity of language structures I use increases when I have fever

Jana


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## lauranazario

I.C. said:
			
		

> Just curious, do your abilities to express yourself in the foreign languages you are fluent in increase or decrease when you've had a glass or two?
> Mine increase.


Alcohol consumption makes many people lose some of their inhibitions, which may account for why some people may think they are more fluent in a foreign language after a couple of drinks. The alcohol itself has nothing to do with the ability to speak "better" in another language... although it may lead some people to believe they do. 

And may I add that a drunken slur does not sound good in ANY language.  

Saludos,
LN


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## la reine victoria

Queen Victoria (despite what you hear about John Brown plying her with drams of whiskey) *never* partakes of anything more than a *very small sherry* and then only at State Banquets!!!


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## JLanguage

More of one, less of the other.


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## I.C.

lauranazario said:
			
		

> The alcohol itself has nothing to do with the ability to speak "better" in another language... although it may lead some people to believe they do.


 You know, I actually compared pieces of writing. In the past some of them written to be handed in for marking.


> And may I add that a drunken *slur* does not sound good in ANY language.


 After a glass or two? I think you are mistaking something.


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## lauranazario

I.C. said:
			
		

> lauranazario said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And may I add that a drunken slur does not sound good in ANY language.
> 
> 
> 
> After a glass or two? I think you are mistaking something.
Click to expand...

No, my comment was not meant to imply that one's speech gets slurred after a glass or two.

I'm stressing/emphasizing the fact that (regardless of how many inhibitions a person might lose after consuming alcohol) a drunken slur sounds atrocious in ANY language.

Saludos,
LN


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## I.C.

I was simply interested if some people here think they have experienced something like this and if so, how they did, how many there are here and why they think this could be the case. 
Naturally I have thought up a falsifiable hypothesis why something like this could exist, what kind of person might be more likely to experience it and roughly how something like this might work - though that may be total bogus, of course, my knowledge of neurology is sketchy at best.
Background (which I actually only hesitantly supply): Myself I probably have a slightly unusually set-up brain. For example, I’m partially ambidextrous. By this I mean that my hands are not equally good at most things (though at some they are), but that they have a mixed specialisation. I don’t have a strong and a weak side in the sense most people do. Meanwhile good left-right coordination was something I had to work for over the years.
How the brain hemispheres are linked and how functions might be arranged may be linked to how people may differ in their style of acquisition of foreign languages and how they consequently organise their communication in these languages - I think. This might show better under certain circumstances - I would guess with no knowledge or understanding of neurology.

But if you feel uncomfortable about a subject involving devil alcohol, I’ll drop it now.


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## GenJen54

I have found, I.C., that I speak a bit better _become more conversant_ after a glass of wine, which does relax my inhibitions.  Of course, I become more conversant generally, so this does not necessarily have a _direct_ effect on my ability to process the new language, it only helps me "let my guard down."  When that happens, I am more aptly able to put together sentences I would have otherwise had to "think" about, and I am not as afraid or shy about using the language.

Once I get to a certain level of comfort with my skill, however, the fluency is there, regardless of whether I've had alcohol or not.

I'm not encouraging it as a means of enhancing fluency.  It simply allows one to break through certain barriers of fear that perhaps had been occluding one's desire to use the language publicly, or with native speakers, out of fear of ridicule.  

Of course, too much alcohol, and you risk becoming subject of ridicule no matter what language you speak.


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## I.C.

GenJen54 said:
			
		

> When that happens, I am more aptly able to put together sentences I would have otherwise had to "think" about


 This is the aspect I was thinking of - regardless of overall increased chattiness.
Partially it's a question of confidence and relaxation, but I'm wondering if that's all, whether alcohol - as one example - may not also lessen interference by possibly more culturally bound conscious reasoning and control processes when tapping into other parts of the brain. Maybe not for everyone to a significant extent, but maybe for parts of a population. Really just a hypothesis.
As far as my pesonal example is concerned, the decreased tendency to conscious control of language and exploration of alternatives may simply speed up writing and talking, so consequently result in a better flow and a more natural expression.

To add an in my opinion trivial disclaimer, I don't think the consumption of alcohol can be a help in learning a language - quite to the contrary -, I don't recall it to help with translating and I don't recommend the consumption of alcohol to other than occasional recreational uses. If asked, I would suggest moderation.


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## GenJen54

I.C. said:
			
		

> Partially it's a question of confidence and relaxation, but I'm wondering if that's all, whether alcohol - as one example - may not also lessen interference by possibly more culturally bound conscious reasoning and control processes when tapping into other parts of the brain.


 
This reminded me of something that happened on occasion when I lived and taught in France. As it so happened, some of the students whom I taught at the "college" (post high-school/pre-university) would on occasion pop into a pub I frequented with other Americans.

These students would nary speak a word of English while in the classroom. Saying that to get them to speak was like "trying to pull teeth" is not by any means an exaggeration. They would hardly utter a word, although their written grammar and expressions were very good.

When out of the classroom, however, they would gladly involve themselves in conversations in English.

I don't know if it was the more relaxed "atmosphere," or simply the fact that they had had a beer (or "monaco") or two, but in either case, I found their speaking abilities up to task with their written abilities. They just would not speak in the classroom.


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## Amityville

I don't find that drinking by itself makes much difference - what really works is speaking to a person I am interested in about a subject we are interested in or, preferably, passionate about. 
If you are nervous about speaking the foreign language, nervous of people's reactions or inhibited in some other way it might help you care less about your mistakes. 
When you say your abilities improve and it's scientifically proven, I.C., was this under sterile laboratory conditions ?   I mean to say, it wasn't just that you spoke more after a drink, then ? You used grammatical constructions and vocabulary that you didn't know you possessed ?


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## la reine victoria

_'When the wine goes in, strange things come out.'  Friedrich Schiller_


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## BasedowLives

i don't know what to think about this.
there have been a few times when i was pretty faded, and it felt as if i were talking pretty decently. i think it just makes me not care if i make mistakes and take more risks.


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## Fernando

When you drink:

- You think your language abilities have enhanced a lot in English
- Your English mates think your language abilities have enhanced in a language unknown to them.


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## Laia

I know that this is true: my English is better after some drinks.


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## manana

Parece que después de un par de copas en cualquier idioma se suelta la lengua.
 
Una profesora de  inglés de un curso de conversación al que estuve asistiendo nos aconsejaba, a los que éramos más tímidos y nerviosos, que antes de rendir nuestro examen que era ante una comisión de 3 profesores (situación  que a mi me resultaba  bastante tensa y chocante ) nos tomáramos “un pisco sour” .
 
Yo que tomo poco  porque  tengo pésima cabeza, creo que  con una sola copita de vino andaría bien.  El otro día para el cumpleaños de mi hija vino una amiga con un  joven alemán que está haciendo su servicio  civil en el extranjero. Venía recién llegando por lo que no hablaba una gota de castellano y sólo podía comunicarse en inglés. Mi hija  lo sentó a mi lado porque dijo que yo algo sabía. Y  bueno, gracias a que yo estaba un poquito achispada   no fue tan difícil comunicarnos.  No me sentí inhibida como  otras veces  y estuvimos conversando largo rato, sólo que cuando no le entendía  no me quedaba paralizada como otras veces  y me atrevía a decirle que por favor me explicara  eso que no entendía  “in another way”. Por primera vez  sentí que tuve una conversación  relajada  y divertida  en inglés  y que finalmente  nos entendimos bien. ¡Ah! también aproveche para enseñarle un poco de español. 
 
Bueno no  quiero que se crea que estoy promoviendo el alcoholismo, pero sí creo que en personas como yo,  con trancas en este aspecto,  una copa de vino ayuda a soltar la lengua y a que no te  importe si lo estás  haciendo bien o mal y  eso, en mi caso particular, permite que todo fluya y se logre "la comunicación" que  es lo que al final importa ¿no?


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## Kräuter_Fee

I'm not sure if I notice a difference, well, the difference is that I speak muuuch more when I've drunk a glass of alcohol (yeah, for me a glass is enough), but that also counts for my native languages... lol


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## santi

well when I got to colombia I didn't speak any spanish, and was very shy,I wouldn't talk to anybody,well guess what made me loosen up my verbal skills? yeah you guessed it, a nice bottle of rum got me talking some crazy stuff and after ten years and many,many,many bottles I now say that I speak a very fluent spanish.. 

this is


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## Isotta

A glass of wine does help sometimes. Though when I have a glass of wine, I am with friends and have time, which isn't that often, so perhaps half of it is the situation. Also, when it is cold, wine warms the mouth. French is more difficult for me to speak with a cold face.

Some of my French friends say that drinking before speaking English helps because the mouth is less tense and is more relaxed. Makes sense since French is spoken in tense mode, while English is spoken in released mode.

Z.


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## I.C.

GenJen54 said:
			
		

> I don't know if it was the more relaxed "atmosphere,"


 I'd think so, though:


			
				Isotta said:
			
		

> Some of my French friends say that drinking before speaking English helps because the mouth is less tense and is more relaxed.


-------------------------------------------------------


			
				Amityville said:
			
		

> When you say your abilities improve and it's scientifically proven, I.C., was this under sterile laboratory conditions ?


 Just a superfluous and rather stupid private joke.


> I mean to say, it wasn't just that you spoke more after a drink, then ?


 I thought I clarified that, “I actually compared pieces of writing. In the past some of them written to be handed in for marking.” Myself I had mostly thought of written expression anyway, stuff that can be judged afterwards. I find it hard to believe no one but me has spent boring nights force-finalising something from scratch, a glass of wine or port by his side… But anyway.


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## tigger_uhuhu

lauranazario said:
			
		

> Alcohol consumption makes many people lose some of their inhibitions, which may account for why some people may think they are more fluent in a foreign language after a couple of drinks. *The alcohol itself has nothing to do with the ability to speak "better" in another language*... although it may lead some people to believe they do.
> 
> And may I add that a drunken slur does not sound good in ANY language.
> 
> Saludos,
> LN


 
     

Totalmente de acuedo...
No creo que el idioma sea buen "pretexto" para el alcohol. Si fuera una ayuda imaginen las escuelas y otros lugares llenos de gente ebria porque están aprendiendo a hablar otro idioma


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## nikvin

Well I personally believe that a small amount of alcohol, just enough to relax you, can and ofetn does help. It basically means that the shyness is lost and one speaks more fluently without stopping to think and worry too much. The hesitation goes, but the words,( which we would never have realsied we knew)  come out, as do correct grammar and conjugations.

All this does have to have been learnt before of course!

I believe that many yrs ago a study as done on University students, under controlled circumstances,where some had nothing, some alcohol, some alcohol flavoured drinks, and those having alcohol, or thinking they had, did perform better, on those occasions


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## la reine victoria

I agree with you nikvin.


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## I.C.

nikvin said:
			
		

> It basically means that the shyness is lost and one speaks more fluently without stopping to think and worry too much. The hesitation goes, but the words,( *which we would never have realsied we knew*) come out, as do correct grammar and conjugations.


 Now, of course words, phrases, grammatical structures have to be encountered before anyone can make use of them, but why would simple relaxation have such an effect if it's just something to do with shyness and hesitation?


> I believe that many yrs ago a study as done on University students


 You don't coincidentally remember authors or title, do you...?

P.S.: Naturally I can imagine an answer along the lines of relaxation simply allowing a more complete use of higher brain functions, but I'm still wondering if the alcohol reduces interference by partially native-culture-coded control functions when tapping into foreign language databases or switching into a foreign language partition. I don't recall ever coming up with something more interesting in my native language after a glass, of course one can say that's because of the generally lower stress-level, but I don't feel stressed when speaking English - I'm not supposed to be any good and not worried about mistakes, even if I prefer not making them - and I don't see why I should be stressed when writing, I can erase and rewrite as I like.


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## Amityville

Quote:
Originally Posted by *Amityville*
_When you say your abilities improve and it's scientifically proven, I.C., was this under sterile laboratory conditions ? _

Quote:
I mean to say, it wasn't just that you spoke more after a drink, then ?




			
				I.C. said:
			
		

> Just a superfluous and rather stupid private joke.
> 
> I thought I clarified that, “I actually compared pieces of writing. In the past some of them written to be handed in for marking.” Myself I had mostly thought of written expression anyway, stuff that can be judged afterwards. I find it hard to believe no one but me has spent boring nights force-finalising something from scratch, a glass of wine or port by his side… But anyway.


 
That was a serious question, I.C, If you hadn't said "... been proven by scientists" which is not the same thing as your work being marked by teachers or judged by yourself, I wouldn't have asked. When I say 'sterile laboratory conditions' it is an admittedly jokey way of saying were the principles of scientific objectivity met and what were the criteria. 

Never mind, since you did clarify then.

No need for your rude and gratuitous remark though - see Forum Rules regarding decency. I was interested enough to post in this thread, as when I considered the question I was surprised to realise that no, alcohol does not improve things for me in non-native language competence, whereas in many other areas a glass or two does. I think it may be partly as Isotta suggested, the English mode being less tense than the French.


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## nikvin

Im afraid I dont remember anything about this study. It would have been possibly 30 yrs or more ago, and I didnt read it, just some write up about it.

Alcohol certainly loosens the tongue..... how often have secrets been divulged after a glass or 3 ............quite often........

I have certainly personally found that a little can and has helped. 
I specifically recall one instance, when, returning to our shabby rented flat in spain, we all (about 2am after an evening out) got electric shocks , switching on the lights , and touching other surfaces. I immediately contacted the - normally totally unresponsive- landlord, and told him what I thought, and gave him a right mouthful ( albeit politely). He came round straight away, saw for himself, and a plumber was despatched the next morning, along with the electrician, who became necessary, and the brick layer to rebuild the wall that was useless due to the water seeping through and reaching the electrics.

Without a couple of drinks, I would never have had the nerve to contact him. I used vocabulary I didnt know I knew, and grammar.

What the scientific explanation may be.........well I dont know. maybe a breakdown of some inhibiting, culture -learnt restraints, due to neurone paths, being suppressed.
What the scientific explanation is, interesting though I may find it, matters little in many ways. I have certainly from experience, noticed that alcohol (small quantities only) can help.
As said earlier of course too much, and in any language, one just becomes a blithering ,babbling, slurring idiot! ( and I have to admit to having done that too!!)


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## I.C.

Amityville said:
			
		

> No need for your rude and gratuitous remark though


 I think you misunderstood the intended meaning of something I wrote. If what I wrote _was_ phrased in a way that would easily lead to such a misunderstanding, then I apologise for my lack of oversight. 


			
				nikvin said:
			
		

> What the scientific explanation is, interesting though I may find it, matters little in many ways.


 Well, it's the bit I find interesting, but that’s just me. How these things work might also matter a bit when it comes to determining (possibly and in my opinion probably individually differing) efficient strategies for learning languages, I would think. I have some examples of funny ways language is or isn’t connected to the storage of data in the brain, but there’s no point in asking others about similar stuff, because it’s more closely linked to specific circumstances, while many people will have had a glass of wine some time or another.


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## nikvin

I:C.

if you do manage to come across any scientific data to prove or refute this premise, then I would be very interested in reading it, and also what you ahve regarding language storage/ learning in the brain!! It might make my life easier with some of my students!

So far, my personal observations, as already mentioned are sufficint to show me that alcohol can help!


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## LV4-26

lauranazario said:
			
		

> The alcohol itself has nothing to do with the ability to speak "better" in another language... although it may lead some people to believe they do.





			
				Fernando said:
			
		

> - You think your language abilities have enhanced a lot in English
> - Your English mates think your language abilities have enhanced in a language unknown to them.


 Hehe! Same idea expressed in two different ways.
That's what I'd always thought so far. I'm sure alcohol does that to music playing or driving for example. 
So I'd be very interested to read some scientific observations about the matter. (Of course, I understand quantity matters).

My only experiences (or shall I say 'experiments'? ) in that field were evenings at the pubs with my English friends when I was 20 or so. But I couldn't tell you if I actually spoke better English after a few pints : I was too drunk then to be able to remember.


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## I.C.

nikvin said:
			
		

> I:C.
> if you do manage to come across any scientific data


 Scientific data sadly I have none.


> also what you ahve regarding language storage/ learning in the brain!! It might make my life easier with some of my students!


 I'll try if I find the time. One trivial example: I was living abroad, after a few months I wrote a letter in German, I wanted to add my new phone-number, racked my brains, couldn't find it at all. Had to switch to thinking in English, I had stored it phonetically only.
As I've mentioned in another thread, I'm wondering whether differing abilities in visual thinking can have an influence on the suitability of different learning styles. 
Myself I was not happy with language lessons at school at all, the analytical approach did not suit me, I hated it. After finishing school my rudimentary knowledge of English didn't exactly improve. Got better with travelling. I figured it might work well for me to visualise what I wanted to describe and think in an own little English universe as much as possible, without cross-referencing to the knowledge in my native language. Tried to stick by this. Had trouble to express myself in my native language at times after talking and thinking English exclusively for a couple of days when on a student exchange. Only later partially re-unificated my thought patterns. I’m talking about a time-frame of two or three years here. Currently not immersed in English.


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## Amityville

I.C. said:
			
		

> I think you misunderstood the intended meaning of something I wrote.


 
Maybe I did, in which case I apologise.


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## nikvin

well trying to immerse oneself in the language is good. 
Once my students have got some knowledge I encourage them to use a Spanish only dictionary to look words up, and only resort to Spanish  to English as a last resort. It helps them learn more, and albeit the process may be longer, the likehood is of greater retention.
I had a student look up HORMIGA in the Sp one,  , got stuck on _galerías _subterraneas. The spanish only gave túnel as a synonym, the Sp- Eng, didnt even get anywhere near that option, and caused greater confusion.

Certainly everyone has different learning capabilities, and  its evident with people suffering from dyslexia, that keeping away from the written word, as far as possible,and using as much visual and audio material as possible 
makes it all alot easier.
At least I have seen a dramatic change with some students, once they admitted they suffered from dyslexia, and I changed the approach.With children its harder as they need to be able to read and write, but the adults, will mostly just need to speak it.


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## Hakro

> Just curious, do your abilities to express yourself in the foreign languages you are fluent in increase or decrease when you've had a glass or two?
> Mine increase. That's been proven by scientists.


Has anybody noticed that one's abilities to express oneself also in one's own language often increases after a glass or two?
I have.


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## la reine victoria

As the old saying goes *'Wine loosens the tongue'  :>)*


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