# Wearing a school uniform in your country- common?



## ayupshiplad

Evening all 

This topic came up in a recent thread in the Portuguese forum, and it got me thinking. In the UK it is, as far as I am aware, unheard of for pupils not to wear a uniform to school. Whilst it is not so universal at primary school, at secondary school every pupil has to wear a uniform, no matter how loose the guidelines may be. 

In my opinion, this has several advantages. Obviously, with a uniform there is less 'rivalry' between students, less need to wear the 'right' clothes. Therefore, when there is a uniform there is substantially less bullying in schools. Whilst bullying in schools will almost certainly always exist, the chance of this happening is reduced significantly when there is a uniform. In addition, whilst it may be initially expensive, it is far cheaper in the long run for all families to pay for a school uniform than to continuously buy their children new clothes to wear to school. (And anyway, you never have to decide what you want to wear in the morning ) 

Wearing a school uniform is very rare in France, Germany, Austria, Portugal and numerous other countries- but why? Is it to do with the right to 'express yourself', or for some other reason, or, as childish as it sounds, simply 'because'? Are there any other countries where wearing a school uniform is as common as in the UK? Is wearing a uniform assosciated with private or religious schools in your country?

I would really appreciate your thoughts on this one


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## avok

Hi,

Yes in Turkey all pupils have to wear school uniforms. The UK and Turkey are the only countries that I know where school children have to wear uniforms. 
While I was back at high school I disliked school uniforms but now I see uniforms were really practical because you did not have to think what to wear each new day!  
But sometimes some silly teachers would not let the kids in who left their ties at home!! and that was really cheap.


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## Alicky

Hello!

Here wearing a uniform is, as you say, associated with private or religiuous schools.
But, if you attend a public school; you are required not to use an uniform, but a "guardapolvo" http://tedel.org/blogbenitojuarez/media/blogs/ramiro/9.jpg. This is similar to a lab coat.

This garment is associated to schools even more than the uniforms. And its role is more closely related to stop bullying than uniforms, as the latter is seen as a symbol of status.


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## Black Sheep

I can't think of any UK schools where *not* wearing a uniform is an option.

I'm in favour of it as it allows poor children to look just the same as their richer peers.


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## The Lol

Here in Mexico almost all the students from preschool, primary, secondary and preparatory school wear uniforms, no matter if the schools are public or private; although wearing uniforms it's not really an obligation (it's not in the law), your son can go to school without uniform, and strictly speaking, the directors or principals can't do anything, but your son will look different between all the students in uniform. The uniforms are really a thing that each school determine, each school has a different uniform, and it's a tradition in Mexico to wear them, in primary and secondary schools mostly.


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## Macunaíma

At primary school we were supposed to wear a uniform --and I looked really cute in it  Wearing a uniform to school is not very common here in Brazil, but I agree that it's more convenient.

When I went to high school the school I attended didn't have a uniform and, as ayupshiplad said, students competed with each other who wore the most fashionable clothes. Some items were forbidden for obvious reasons --miniskirts, low-necked blouses, and so on, but aside from that sky was limit: flashy designer clothes, "prêt-à-porter" rebel look, high heels, accessories of all kinds for girls, body piercing and tatoos showing, etc. 

I always went to school with the same shabby jeans and t-shirts, which amounted to the same as wearing a uniform. For the record, I've never been bullied because of that


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## danielfranco

Here in the States it's a matter for the public-schools ISD (independent school district) to decide whether or not students in certain elementary and secondary schools will wear uniforms. Sometimes it's a security measure, but instead of avoiding bullies and such, it's a measure instituted to discourage "colors" (gang-related items, like bandanas, or a specific shirt-color, etc.) Certainly, private schools can ask you to wear whatever the heck they want you to wear, and you will, if you want to belong...
In Mexico we all wore uniforms in elementary and secondary PUBLIC schools. Nothing out of the ordinary, and rather drab (elementary: navy blue trousers, white shirt, navy blue sweater; secondary: beige slacks, white shirt, brown sweater).

Both in the USA and in Mexico the students found ways to stand out, even among millions of similarly dressed nerds.

D


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## alexacohen

Hello,

Here in Spain, unfortunately from my point of view, not every pupil has to wear an uniform when at school - just the little ones at nursery school, and pupils who attend expensive private schools.

And very short skirts, low cut bodices, trousers that hang so low that it's a miracle they don't fall to the floor are an usual sight. One does wonder why all those half naked girls who go around displaying her cleavages and belly buttons when temperatures drop to ten below zero are not down with the flu.


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## danielfranco

alexacohen said:


> One does wonder why all those half naked girls who go around displaying her cleavages and belly buttons when temperatures drop to ten below zero are not down with the flu.


 
Maybe they do drink their OJ and take 2,000 units of vitamin D (supposedly more effective than the flu vaccine!)... 

True, that's another reason that the ISD's insist on uniforms: to avoid adding gasoline to the open flame of a mob of fifteen hundred nerds in the apex of their lifetime hormonal output.

Like I said before, for security reasons.
D


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## Philippa

ayupshiplad said:


> In the UK it is, as far as I am aware, unheard of for pupils not to wear a uniform to school. Whilst it is not so universal at primary school, at secondary school every pupil has to wear a uniform, no matter how loose the guidelines may be.


Hello,
I think it's still quite common for 6th formers here not to wear a uniform to school. I guess the thinking is that once you're past the age of compulsory schooling (16 here) and you could be studying at college or working then a school uniform is less appropriate. Some 6th forms have a colour scheme e.g. black and white, but not a specific uniform.
At my school we could wear our own clothes in the 6th form. I can still picture us all sitting in front of the headmistress and her telling us that this was a privilege we weren't to abuse and that we should treat it as if we were dressing for work and specifically not wear jeans. We were all listening wearing jeans and we all continued to wear jeans! (jejeje - a self imposed teenage uniform!!) In fact the only rule that was enforced was not to wear really short shorts in the summer.


> Both in the USA and in Mexico the students found ways to stand out, even among millions of similarly dressed nerds.


I agree with Daniel thought that teenagers will still find ways to follow fashions even with fairly strict uniforms. As a teacher, one of the advantages of a uniform is that pupils have a chance to rebel a bit with exactly how they wear it (shirt hanging out, black trousers rather than navy etc) and you can correct them, but it doesn't really matter that much. It's not like rebelling by being rude or aggressive.
Saludos
Philippa


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## Consimmer

Malaysia requires primary school students (years one through twelve or thirteen) of state schools to where uniforms. Years one through six wear one type of uniform, and years seven and on wear a different uniform.


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## Evros

In Slovakia,it has been a problem because parents couldnt afford to pay every year extra money to those uniforms.So that,now all students wear what they want


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## Mjolnir

Very few schools require uniforms here in Israel. However, standard clothing for PE classes isn't that unusual.

My old high school didn't have a uniform, but had some rules about students' appearances (no super-short skirts for girls, no flip-flops, etc.). These rules were barely enforced


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## jinti

Where I live and where I grew up, uniforms are required by Catholic schools and some public schools. Catholic schools from elementary through high school generally require skirts, often plaid, for the girls (the school in my town had uniforms like this), who then proceed to shorten them as much as they can get away with.  I have no idea how they survive in winter waiting outside for the bus with bare legs like that-- I shiver just looking at them. Public school uniforms are often as simple as khaki/black/blue pants with a white shirt. 

Other public schools just have "dress codes" (guidelines for how to dress), which are enforced more or less strictly by each school. More and more public schools are moving towards uniforms for the reasons others have cited already (it cuts down on competition, etc.) but also because it is said to help get students into the right mindset for school. That is, the thought is that looking more "professional" will translate to acting more "professional". I think there's some validity to that, although it's certainly not going to solve all behavior problems.


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## Hakro

As far as I know, school uniforms have never been in use in Finland. 

Lately there has been some discussion about it because some parents have problems to buy their kids all those fashionable clothes - especially considreing that the price/quality relationship of those clothes is really out of this world.


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## Black Sheep

You were lucky, Philippa. At my very conservative grammar school we were still obliged to wear standard school uniform in the sixth form. The only concession was that we could swap our white ankle socks, or knee- high beige socks (winter wear), for stockings and suspenders!  But woe betide anyone who sported a laddered stocking - in fact (like the Queen) we had to keep a spare pair in case of such an eventuality.

Our uniform had to be 'worn with pride' - we were ambassadors of our school. It was forbidden to exit the school gates without wearing the school hat.

There are many schools nowadays which have a second-hand uniform shop. Clothes are soon outgrown but not outworn, so parents on a low income can easily kit their children out at a fraction of the normal price.

I loved my schooldays and enjoyed wearing my uniform. I still have my woven badge which was sewn to my blazer pocket. It is very old but a precious souvenir of happy times.


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## aleCcowaN

In Argentina we still have nowadays the guardapolvo for elementary school (6 to 12 or 14 years). School uniforms in high school (13 or 15 to 18 years) only in private schools, quite often just a dark green, dark blue or dark tan jacket with a badge on it. All this is a "modern" development.

One generation ago, when I was those ages, everybody wore uniform, elementary or high, public or private. In elementary school we had the white _guardapolvo_ (like the photo in the link above, an actual Argentine classroom) and we had a grade in all the subjects plus behaviour and cleanliness. A white _guardapolvo_ is a very good probe to test if you and your family are clean, caring people. In addition, with that uniform all of us look alike and all the differences between social, economical and racial classes were somewhat wiped out, a democratic ideal expressed by the motto "poor but clean", an additional tweak over "poor but decent".

That was the elementary school I knew and I have never seen a louse in all of my life (I had two periods: public school because of a mortgage to pay off / private school).

In high school all of us had nice uniforms, and everybody looked like the boys and girls in Melody (1971), I'd say even tidier.

Needless to say that all competition about who wears the most expensive sport footwear didn't exist, nor existed gangs that mugged you to take that footwear right out of your feet, as there are nowadays.

Do I regret that school uniforms have almost disappear? Well, in one hand using them acted as a mute or damper for social unevenness, everybody tried to be one of the group and each one was compelled to sacrifice some individuality in order to make a more unified society (lice now and then only in extremely poor neighbourhoods was proof of it). In the other hand we have to give up some valuable freedom to make up some stiff, rigid society.

Today we have freedom, variety, dirt, bullies and lots of lice.


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## Mahaodeh

As far as I know, all Arab countries have school uniforms from pre-school to the last year of high school.  In Iraq, they even have a uniform for university students.


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## chics

Where I live, uniform is only weared in some conservative religious schools, up to sixteen years old as much. I don't find them practical and confortable, whith ties and skirts for girls... and they're ugly. They are too expensive (more expensive than "normal" shirts, etc.) and the different social situation of different pupils are shown as well, in complements, when explaining holidays or showing other things, when they meet out school. It's quickly known.

However, when wearing our own clothes at least we expend money in something we choose to wear, in something that we'll use out of school as well. Dressing is also part of our personality and a thing we should learn. We can learn as well to have relationship with "different" people or people that dresses different as us. We learn the differences. It's a much less hypocrital system.

It's in fact rare to find these puplis you describe, showing their tangas and wearing pareos and flip-flops, but usually they are puplis who had must to wear uniforms. Some schools may have some light dress codes, as not showing underwear, or not wear jogging suits or beach suits. Some others not. Usually pupils dress very casual wear.

Young children, up to six or eight, often are told to wear a _guardapolvo_. It's also weared in lab classes, at any age.


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## avok

jinti said:


> ..That is, the thought is that looking more "professional" will translate to acting more "professional". I think there's some validity to that, although it's certainly not going to solve all behavior problems.


 
That's true ! Uniforms bring also some responsabilites for the things that you usually would not care when you have your flip flops on. 

Oh and one of the things is that in American movies, you always see that the recent graduates always find it hard to get used to wearing ties and shirts on their first days at work (making reference to the fact that they never wore them.) But that's never a big issue here (wearing ties etc. at work) because we are already used to wearing ties, shirts etc. because of our high school uniforms  

And also the feeling of belonging to a group called "High Schoolers in uniforms"  was somehow cool. 

I find it strange that in some countries uniforms are associated with private schools which ,I guess, would mean something like "I wear uniforms therefore I am rich ?"


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## deddish

As far as I`ve seen in Canada, mostly only private and religious schools have uniforms, but dress codes are quite common.

One of my friends who goes to a Catholic school has told me that having a uniform does not in fact make dressing easier in the morning- kilt or pants? Vest or no vest? How can I proclaim my individuality as much as possible without getting in trouble with the dress code?


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## RIU

Hola, 

Por Barcelona y alrededores cualquier colegio privado, ya sea _religioso, aconfesional o cosmopolita_ (no sé que será pero os aseguro que hay uno que se autodefine así) que se precie tiene su uniforme. 

En mi opinión, vista la gracia y donaire de la sociedad actual en cuanto al mal gusto y horterismo imperante, no veo mal que durante unos años las criaturas sepan como se llevan prendas mínimamente combinadas. Quizá algún día les haga falta. Quien sabe.

En cuanto a los precios de las mismas, son exactamente los mismos que las llamadas "normales" con la ventaja de que tus retoños no deben cambiar de prendas por que ya están "vistas", porque de verlas, éstas, se van a hartar un rato largo. Por que claro, si alguien me dice que solo en los colegios privados se lleva lo fashion, a mi entender, que se lo haga mirar. Observando a los colegios "nacionales", los cuales van sin uniforme, los complementos de los alumnos son exactamente los mismos de los uniformados.

En los encuentros extraescolares la vestimenta la veo muy relacionada al poder adquisitivo de la familia (o del número de hijos) como es normal. Es decir: de todo hay, lo que es cierto es que el hijo va en consonancia al padre o madre.

No conozco a nadie traumatizado, ni que vaya al psicólogo o psiquitra a causa de vestir uniforme en etapa escolar.

Alguien comenta que si va con uniforme, ¿como marca su individualismo? En mi opinión la individualidad está en el indivíduo, no en su vestimenta. Sin ánimo de ofender, el refranero nos brinda la siguiente sentencia: aunque la mona se vista de seda, mona se queda.

En fin, lamento haberos hecho perder el tiempo con mis comentarios absolutamente prescindibles.


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## tvdxer

Some private schools in the U.S. require students to wear a uniform, but not all.   Few public (government-funded) schools require students to do so.  This has been a topic of debate, with opponents to school uniforms claiming they stifle individuality and personal choice and supporters saying they help erase class / income barriers and promote order.  

The Catholic school I attended for two years instituted a uniform policy shortly (the year after?) I left - 1999-2000 I believe.  Perhaps around this time the uniform debate was more pronounced then it is today, since I rarely hear about it now.


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## sokol

Here in Austria children mostly are quite amused when they learn in their English lessons that the English have to wear school uniforms.

School uniforms are absolutely unusual in Austria - no special reason for it, just 'because'. ;-)
The question never arises here, parents never would even think to wish for school uniforms.

Most people do not even know that there are *some *schools here in Austria where uniforms are required (some exquisite private schools, or at least one that I have heard of: so you see, nothing of the original thought of 'unification' as these elite schools only would be visited by rich parent's childrens).


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## chics

RIU said:


> Por Barcelona y alrededores cualquier colegio privado, ya sea _religioso, aconfesional o cosmopolita_ que se precie tiene su uniforme.


Esto no es así, yo también vivo en Barcelona y los colegios privados, religiosos o no, que hay por donde vivo no son de uniforme. Yo veo a los chicos que salen de clase con su particular "uniforme" de tejanos y camiseta. 
Sí lo suelen llevar los que están por el Tibidabo...


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## ernest_

RIU said:


> En mi opinión, vista la gracia y donaire de la sociedad actual en cuanto al mal gusto y horterismo imperante, no veo mal que durante unos años las criaturas sepan como se llevan prendas mínimamente combinadas.



Lo que hace falta es un "revival" del movimiento mod, que es lo que yo trato de promover. Los uniformes no solucionan nada porque llevar uniforme no requiere aprender nada sobre la moda y las formas de vestir y el estilo, se trata simplemente de seguir un dictado. Cuando hay posibilidad de elección es cuando surge la necesidad de pensar.


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## ayupshiplad

avok said:


> I find it strange that in some countries uniforms are associated with private schools which ,I guess, would mean something like "I wear uniforms therefore I am rich ?"


 
I would say that is the case to a certain extent even in the UK! I go to a private school and it is really strict on uniform. I wear black heels, black tights, a kilt in my school's tartan, a white shirt (non-fitted) tucked into my kilt, a tie and a navy blazer. However, most state schools just require that you wear a black skirt/black trousers, a white shirt and some schools a blazer, but there aren't normally that many rules about skirts being too short or low cut tops etc...!

As Black Sheep said, we are also considered 'ambassadors for the school' (those exact words ), as my school is a long standing 'pillar of the city', so they get very strict on uniform!!! I think it's a good thing though. At first I didn't like it but now when I see other girls walking around town in belt skirts and low-cut tops I just think they look so ridiculous. I am proud that I look smart! 

So, my choice of rebellion when it comes to school uniform? Constantly wearing a fuschia pashmina. Gets them every time!


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## mirx

In México, uniforms are required and mandatory for all schools private or state-run, from as early as nursing schools all the way to highschool, uniforms work in many ways: people don't have to worry about what they wear, they all look the same any ways. There is uniformity, that is, there are no social classes or prejudices, everyones is the same (certainly not true). Security, if there was any safety breach and a foreing person enetered the shcool unauthorized, he will be immediately spotted. It also helps distinguish one's shcool among other institutes, and through this creates a sense of belonging (or hatre) and identification so needed in adolescence.

I may say that I spent tons of energy everyday figuring out plans to avoid the uniform inspectors in the morning, so that I could sneak in with my fashionable clothes (not so fashionable, now I see). When I finally got to university and was no longer forced to wear that dreadful uniform, I then realized that wearing uniforms was not a so-bad-thing after all. Instead of planning how to sneak into school wihtout the uniform, now I spent my time trying to make out combinations of my clothes. I mean, I was sure I had worn those trousers last week, and that shirt definitely smelled like I had it on two days ago.

Regarding individuallity and other nonsense, well, as Daniel Franco put it. "teens will alway find ways to standout in crowds", clothes are definitely not a deciding factor.

We also had a sports uniform and one more for the winter time, weather was never a jusitification not to wear your gray slacks, white wine-collared shirt, and your even more wine-colored jacket.

Cheers.

I now support the use of uniforms. It just makes sense, pupils not wearing one it's like working for an enterprise and not wearing a badge, or being part of a soccer team and not having a jersey.


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## RIU

chics said:


> Sí lo suelen llevar los que están por el *Tibidabo*...


 


RIU said:


> Hola,
> 
> Por Barcelona y *alrededores* cualquier colegio privado, ya sea _religioso, aconfesional o cosmopolita_ (no sé que será pero os aseguro que hay uno que se autodefine así) que se *precie* tiene su uniforme.


 
Estimada Chics ¡(j***) que mal queda lo de estimada!

Resalto alrededores por que más bien me refiero a la zona entre el Tibidabo y la Serra de l'Obac, y resalto que se precie, por que es cierto que no todos van con uniforme, aunque esta última afirmación, reconozco, es muy discutible.




ernest_ said:


> Lo que hace falta es un "revival" del movimiento mod, que es lo que yo trato de promover. Los uniformes no solucionan nada porque llevar uniforme no requiere aprender nada sobre la moda y las formas de vestir y el estilo, se trata simplemente de seguir un dictado.


 
Asumiendo que llevan uniforme desde que se levantan hasta media tarde, el resultado es que solo un 25% del año van uniformados, por horas, otro 25% en pijama, así que nos queda un 50% a libre elección. 




ernest_ said:


> Cuando hay posibilidad de elección es cuando surge la necesidad de pensar.


 
O no hay popsibilidad de elección o no surge la necesidad de pensar, viendo el panorama, claro está. Tu mismo dices que "falta algo".


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## chics

Depende de lo que aprecies en esos colegios... hay algunos de monjas en los que los niños llevan uniforme sólo para ser un colegio "de uniforme", y al que muchos padres llevan a sus hijos para que así lleven uniforme y, como ya alguien ha apuntado por ahí, mostrar una cierta posición económica. Aunque eso es más propio de clases medias y bajas, precisamente, y era mucho más frecuente (creo) hace años.

Hay otros muy conocidos y reconocidos en los que no se tiene que llevar uniforme. En general, es cierto que los que van de elitistas (en cuanto al origen de los alumnos, no hablo de calidad escolar) y los más conservadores (y a menudo religiosos, católicos) son los que más a favor están del uniforme. Y en un colegio donde se consideren de mentalidad más abierta en general no lo consideran necesario, o directamente están en contra.

No digo que un colegio con uniforme, aquí, sea mejor ni peor. Justamente que no indica nada de la calidad de sus clases. En Barcelona hay muchos privados en los que no se lleva uniforme, no me lo invento.

Uniendo la cantidad de niños y adolescentes que van a colegios públicos y los que van a privados sin uniforme, se puede decir que aquí la mayoría de niños van a escuelas sin uniforme. La imagen que transmiten actualmente, en general, estos niños uniformados es en principio de niños monjiles y pijos, un poco al estilo "Amo a Laura", que van a misa cada semana, que no quieren saber nada de chicos/as ni ir a discotecas, de derechas, un poco... poco espavilados. Es un tópico y una exageración, por supuesto. No es cierto, pero esa es la imagen.

Una imagen por cierto que pueden buscar los padres pero que algunos de estos niños y sobretodo adolescentes pueden odiar; y ésto lleva a que una parte de ellos decidan hacerse los guays a pesar del vestido de mona para demostrar que son "como los demás" o más aún, o lo que creen que son. Y entonces es cuando las chicas se comportan como putas, los chicos también, y las drogas (es que además tienen dinero...) de todo tipo corren como si nada, copian el lenguaje más barriobajero (nunca en casa) que encuentran, etc. Esa es otra imagen conocida. Tampoco real, lo que los otros ven.

Un escolar sin uniforme, en cambio, no tiene a priori una imagen predefinida ni unos prejuicios tan claros. Excepto por los anteriores.

Lo siento, RIU, sospecho que esto no te va a gustar nada. Pero pienso que en este hilo tan bien pensante y donde todos (excepto ernest) parecen tan a favor de instaurar uniformes para todos, collares con cruces y sonrisas profidén, alguien tendrá que haber que muestre otras opiniones que también se tienen por aquí.


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## RIU

¡Caramba! Yo no he dicho nada de lo que aprecie en un colegio, sino que he citado a colegios que *se* precien. De todo hay, cierto, pero llevar a un hijo a un colegio para que así el chavalillo vaya de uniforme, lo dudo. El coeficiente paternal andaria por los suelos. Mayoritariamente, opino, uno lleva los chavales a colegios determinados, por ejemplo, insisto, por ejemplo, para evitar que tus retoños sean objeto de lo que personalmente califico la corrupción de menores que en la actualidad practica nuestra progresista Generalitat de Catalunya -que juegan a papa-estado a pesar de las múltiples sentencias en contra-. Puedes juzgar por tu misma aquí para escolares de 12 a 16 años, el que va dirigido a escolares de 10 a 11 años no lo pillo en la web de la generalitat pero si en esta otra. Como verás los dos enlaces son de gencat.

No entiendo lo del origen de los alumnos. ¿Suiza? ¿US? ¿Ripollet?

Si, como dices, el uniforme de un colegio no lo hace mejor ni peor, ni afecta a la calidad de las clases, no veo como ligarlo a "mentalidad abierta" ¿De cintura para abajo?



> Uniendo la cantidad de niños y adolescentes que van a colegios públicos y los que van a privados sin uniforme, se puede decir que aquí la mayoría de niños van a escuelas sin uniforme. *Cierto*. La imagen que transmiten actualmente, en general, estos niños uniformados es en principio de niños monjiles y pijos, un poco al estilo "Amo a Laura", *Vamos, vamos, vamos, esto es demagogia, ¿Pero es que te crees que en su casa no hay televisor?* que van a misa cada semana, *Esto no tiene nada de malo ¿No crees?* que no quieren saber nada de chicos/as *Y supongo tambien deben creer en gnomos y todavia en los reyes magos, y en que los niños vienen de París, por que ya puestos... ¿En realidad tu te lo crees?* ni ir a discotecas, de derechas, un poco... poco espavilados *Idem anterior*. Es un tópico y una exageración, por supuesto. No es cierto, pero esa es la imagen. *Lo que en realidad es diferente es la imagen que pintas de estos alumnos, pero como ya hace rato que estmos off topic...*


 
Ya puestos, seguimos, si las chicas se comportan como putas, ¿como definirias los esfuerzos de la Generalitat el los colegios públicos? ¿Para que aprendan de las pijas, que es lo "bueno"? ¡Y drogas! Carambas, solo los pijos se drogan. ¡Esto es nuevo para mi! Por que nos engaña entonces el Gobierno diciendo que la coca se encuentra ya en los rios del pais. Pues si que hay pijos drogatas. ¿Seremos un pais de pijos y no me he eterado todavia?

Un escolar sin uniforme dices que no tiene prejuicios. Más bien tiene "otros" prejuicios. En todo caso estaria por ver cuales son preferibles.

Eh! Una abraçada però.


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## Auryn

This topic comes up a lot on British expats forums. All the parents seem to believe that there are two kinds of children's clothes: school clothes and civilian clothes - because that's what they're used to. Newly-arrived expats in France constantly ask what on earth their children are supposed to wear to school, since_ there is no uniform_ 

The answer from French people is invariably: "Their everyday clothes, what else?" 

I was an exception among French schoolkids as my Catholic school did have a uniform. It consisted of a horrible navy blue smock coming down to your knees which you wore over your own clothes. It made us look like 19th century orphans wrapped in potato sacks . We could wear our own shoes though, and people still cared about what they wore to school since it could be seen if you left the smock unbuttoned (strictly forbidden! Ahh, the good old days). We came to school in our own clothes and coat and only put the smock on once inside the school, in full view of everyone else. So much for hiding social differences.



ayupshiplad said:


> In addition, whilst it may be initially expensive, it is far cheaper in the long run for all families to pay for a school uniform than to continuously buy their children new clothes to wear to school.



My parents certainly didn't "continuously" buy me new clothes to wear to school (I wish!). There's a lot less wear and tear when you can wear different clothes to school than when you have to wear the same top, trousers/skirt and shoes every single day. The quality of your own clothes is likely to be better too; uniforms are usually made of cheap, nasty synthetic stuff. 

I don't see how paying for a new school uniform every year (kids grow fast) on top of their other clothes is cheaper than wearing your own stuff. Plus, I see a lot of children come home after school and go out to play still in their school uniform - and shoes - which can't be good. I don't understand why the parents don't make them change as soon as they get home. I wonder how often it get washed too, if the kids are in it all day, every day...


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## ayupshiplad

Auryn said:


> My parents certainly didn't "continuously" buy me new clothes to wear to school (I wish!). There's a lot less wear and tear when you can wear different clothes to school than when you have to wear the same top, trousers/skirt and shoes every single day. The quality of your own clothes is likely to be better too; uniforms are usually made of cheap, nasty synthetic stuff.
> 
> I don't see how paying for a new school uniform every year (kids grow fast) on top of their other clothes is cheaper than wearing your own stuff. Plus, I see a lot of children come home after school and go out to play still in their school uniform - and shoes - which can't be good. I don't understand why the parents don't make them change as soon as they get home. I wonder how often it get washed too, if the kids are in it all day, every day...


 
I still argue that uniforms are far cheaper! Primary school children will go out and play in their uniforms but seconday school children? My uniform costs about £200, which is the average price of one outfit...just one outfit! Obviously you mix and match but I cannot imagine having to wear normal clothes to school every day...it would be such a nightmare! I'd end up being a total kleptomaniac!


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## jinti

ayupshiplad said:


> I still argue that uniforms are far cheaper! Primary school children will go out and play in their uniforms but seconday school children? My uniform costs about £200, which is the average price of one outfit...just one outfit!  Well, around here you can get a pair of jeans for $40 and a shirt for $20 -- less for kids --, which gives you an outfit for about £30. Obviously you mix and match but I cannot imagine having to wear normal clothes to school every day...it would be such a nightmare! I'd end up being a total kleptomaniac!


It really doesn't need to be expensive to have a working wardrobe. I suppose if you feel you must wear all "name brand" clothes, follow every trend, etc., it would be. But that's a matter of values, not of need. 

It seems to me that if a student has "normal clothes" + uniforms, it must be more expensive than just having "normal clothes".


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## Polymnia

I grew up in Australia and South Africa where uniforms are normal in schools just like in Great Britain.  Then in Spain I went to an American School where you wear everyday clothes. Some schools over there had uniforms, a lot of others didn't. I have to say I liked having uniforms, so I did not have to think about what to wear every day.  Even as an adult in some of the professions I have worked in (airline and hotel)  I have had uniforms and like it.  Over here in the USA uniforms are found at private schools, most of them around Louisiana are Catholic schools as well.  I also lived in Norway and there they do not use uniforms at school.


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## Auryn

ayupshiplad said:


> I still argue that uniforms are far cheaper! Primary school children will go out and play in their uniforms but seconday school children?



Yup, my neighbour's teenage daughter and son are always walking their dog or bouncing on their trampoline in their school uniforms. I don't get it. You couldn't get me out of that polyester stuff fast enough.



> My uniform costs about £200, which is the average price of one outfit...just one outfit!



£200? What kind of outfit are we talking about here? I wouldn't spend that much on one outfit and I'm 39! 



> Obviously you mix and match but I cannot imagine having to wear normal clothes to school every day...it would be such a nightmare! I'd end up being a total kleptomaniac!


When you're used to it it's perfectly normal... it helped that when I was at school, nobody cared about brands.


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## Topsie

A few years ago in France the was a big hue and cry about not allowing Muslim girls to wear a headscarf to school - on the other hand nobody batted an eyelid at torn jeans with half your bum showing! At least if there was a compulsory dress-code (if not uniform) the problem wouldn't arise! (And yes, I _do_ realise that the headscarf controversy was more about not "ostentatiously showing" belonging to a particular religious group - state schools in France are secular ("laïque").


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## viera

I quite enjoyed wearing the school uniform in my Catholic high school in Toronto back in the sixties: a navy blue tunic (also called jumper) with a long-sleeved blue blouse underneath. No worrying about what to wear each day. By the last year, I was proud to advertise my senior status by my short-sleeved blouses, cut down when the elbows had worn through.

What bothered a lot of the girls were the sensible brown leather laced up shoes that we had to wear, but personally I didn't mind. Being comfortable is more important.


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## avok

Auryn said:


> The quality of your own clothes is likely to be better too; uniforms are usually made of cheap, nasty synthetic stuff.
> I wonder how often it get washed too, if the kids are in it all day, every day...


 
It may be in your Catholic school but in Turkey school uniforms are of much better quality. It's like wearing a suit. You can't just wear them at school you have to wear the uniform at home. They get washed if your mom is a clean woman


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## Brioche

In Australia *compulsory* school uniforms are the norm for private schools.

Nearly all government schools have a _recommended _uniform, but the wearing of it is not always compulsory.

Certainly in South Australia, the better regarded government schools usually have a strict policy on wearing the school uniform.

As a parent, I am quite convinced that school uniforms are cheaper in the long run. 

There is also the security aspect. It is immediately obvious if someone from outside the school is trespassing.


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## alexacohen

Brioche said:


> As a parent, I am quite convinced that school uniforms are cheaper in the long run.
> 
> There is also the security aspect. It is immediately obvious if someone from outside the school is trespassing.


Yes, you're absolutely right.
Many schools in Spain take kids for outings: museums, art galleries, parks, airports. How can four or five teachers keep an eye over thirty or forty kids if they're not wearing their school uniform?
A straying uniformed kid is easily spotted. A child dressed in jeans and a t-shirt is not.


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## IxOhOxI

Yes, it is in my country. It is set forth that all pupils here must wear the uniforms as long as they are called "pupils" I wore it since I was in the nursery school, primary school, secondary school, until now I am a university student and yet I've got to wear the uniform. In order to make it more systematic and standard, this rule is enforced. 

While, I've been studied in the U.S. like 3 or 4 years in HS, and I didn't have to wear such a uniform. But personally, I found it very untidy and indecent especially many girls that wore the mini skirts (I mean super mini skirts) I was like, oh god I saw their underwears when they sat or went upstairs. On the other hand, I thought it's kinda good to wear clothes freely.

In my opinion, it's better to wear a uniform. Well basically, I reasoned that there would be the 'Fashion contest' among boys and girls if the school is the non-uniform school. And you know, girls today clothe themselves improperly, or should I say almost naked? I think that won't do any good. The thing is though the uniform makes them not to worry about their looks so much, while in the class instead of looking their appearances they can focus more on their studies.

I once asked a friend of mine about this stuff whether it's better to wear or not to wear a uniform and the answer was "We come to study, we don't go on a date. That's why we wear our uniforms." 



> It is far cheaper in the long run for all families to pay for a school uniform than to continuously buy their children new clothes to wear to school.


I agree with you on this. Sometimes, they just spend much money on the expensive clothes. I guess they waste a lot of money on such clothes than a school uniform.



> When there is a uniform there is substantially less bullying in schools. Whilst bullying in schools will almost certainly always exist, the chance of this happening is reduced significantly when there is a uniform.


Speaking of bullying matter in this case, I don't know for sure but somehow I don't think by wearing a uniform could make it reducible.



> Is wearing a uniform assosciated with private or religious schools in your country?


Not in Thailand

Anyway, there are good advantages on wearing a uniform. In my country, we say that wearing a uniform honours ourselves and our institute of education. This actually concerns dignity as well.


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## Kajjo

ayupshiplad said:


> In the UK it is, as far as I am aware, unheard of for pupils not to wear a uniform to school. Whilst it is not so universal at primary school, at secondary school every pupil has to wear a uniform, no matter how loose the guidelines may be.


School uniforms are almost unheard of in Germany. They are extremely rare and most people are extremely opposed to school uniforms. So am I.



> Obviously, with a uniform there is less 'rivalry' between students, less need to wear the 'right' clothes.


Well, right, but pupils easily find other things to present, e.g. watches, toys, jewelry, underwear and so on. In their spare-time they start to to what other do in school. I really do not see the advantage to shift the problem from "whole-day" to "spare-time".



> In addition, whilst it may be initially expensive, it is far cheaper in the long run for all families to pay for a school uniform than to continuously buy their children new clothes to wear to school.


I do not think so. It is initially more expensive and it stays so. Here you can buy really cheap jeans  and sweaters and so on if you need to. Since the producer of the school uniform has a regional monopoly, the prices are never as good as normal market prices. Surely, the prices are less than competing against expensive clothes, but they are much more than using sensible clothes. 

When I was a kid, there was only minimal competition related to clothes. It was more about computers at home or sport uitlities. I have never been worried because I not had the most up-to-date sneakers. There is a lot about educaiton and family behaviour that can make fashion competition pointless!

I believe that school uniforms take away a lot of personality. We have to train children to be different and to live with this situation. There will be no equality in their professional life, so why should there be in scholl? Let them train for real life!

Further I believe, that clothes shall fit perfectly. I just cannot enter any shop an find trousers fitting perfectly. Why do you expect school uniforms to fit ideally to all children? It is lucky for those who feel comfortably in the school uniforms, and it horrible for those for do not. Some girls look nice in skirts, others in trousers. Why force everyone to the same outfit?

Kajjo


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## Martinz

Kajjo said:


> I do not think so. It is initially more expensive and it stays so. Here you can buy really cheap jeans  and sweaters and so on if you need to. Since the producer of the school uniform has a regional monopoly, the prices are never as good as normal market prices. Surely, the prices are less than competing against expensive clothes, but they are much more than using sensible clothes.


Absolutely untrue where I live! In my high school the uniform was:

Boys:
a plain white shirt: which you can buy anywhere inexpensively
a pair of plain dark trousers: ditto
a pair of black shoes: ditto
a dark blue pullover: ditto
a tie in the school colours: these could be bought from the school or a local shop for about £3.

Girls:
Exactly the same as the above except they had the choice of a dark skirt instead of trousers.

This was about 10 years ago at a normal comprehensive (state) school. At the other schools in my area it was more or less the same, although some schools had a blazer with the school emblem instead of a pullover, which is now also the case at my old school. 

I don't know much about posh private schools, but for 'normal' schools in the UK, having a school uniform definitely makes things much fairer and easier for pupils, parents and teachers alike.


Kajjo said:


> There will be no equality in their professional life, so why should there be in scholl? Let them train for real life!


On that basis, why should there be any equality anywhere?! Letting kids know from the off about their lower status (i.e. because their parents can't afford the latest fashions some other kids' parents can) doesn't seem like a good idea to me. 

Also, in the case of teenagers at high schools, what if they turn up in, say, mini-skirts so short you can see their underwear, or t-shirts with explicit/violent images printed on them? I'm sure this is not acceptable in Germany or other places where school uniforms are not compulsory. So there must be limits to some extent about what you can or cannot wear to school in those places too. But it seems to me that the best and fairest solution is a school uniform.


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## ayupshiplad

Kajjo said:


> Well, right, but pupils easily find other things to present, e.g. watches, toys, jewelry, underwear and so on. In their spare-time they start to to what other do in school. I really do not see the advantage to shift the problem from "whole-day" to "spare-time".


 
I can honestly say that I have never seen any competition about watches or jewellery etc at school. Yes, when you bump into people outside of school then you may check out what the other person is wearing and vice versa but the point of a uniform is that this doesn't happen every day! 



> I do not think so. It is initially more expensive and it stays so. Here you can buy really cheap jeans and sweaters and so on if you need to. Since the producer of the school uniform has a regional monopoly, the prices are never as good as normal market prices. Surely, the prices are less than competing against expensive clothes, but they are much more than using sensible clothes.


 
I don't think it is more expensive at all. I go to a 'posh private school' such as Martinz mentioned, but even there the cost of my uniform costs the same amount as one high street outfit. Moreover, in my city and indeed Scotland as a whole there are several shops which sell my uniform so I don't think there is any monopoly over it. I think maybe this is a country variation thing- in the UK, high street clothes (I don't know if I'm allowed to mention typical shops?) are normally fairly expensive. So for this reason a uniform is definitely the cheaper option here.

Edit: According to my German assistant, Martinz, there are some rules in Germany (though I guess they vary from region to region?) concerning school uniform, but the only one she remembers is that you were not allowed to wear 'crop tops' but that was as far as it went. I don't think they really had a problem with lots of people wearing short skirts etc.


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## mirx

ayupshiplad said:


> So for this reason a uniform is definitely the cheaper option here.
> .


 
And nearly everywhere.

School uniforms are better for many reasons that have already been discussed.

They are cheaper in the long run.
They provide "uniformity"
People don't have to worry about what to wear.
It highly increases the level of security in shcools.
It can be an icon that distinguishes a particular school from others.
It gives the student something to identify with.


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## Pedro y La Torre

Every school (public and private) has a school uniform in Ireland. The only exceptions are specialist grind schools where people go to sit their final exams.


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## Kajjo

mirx said:


> They are cheaper in the long run.


This I doubt very much. The question is "compüared to what". As Martinz mentioned, the selection of white T-Short and dark clothes is a perfect idea, but as far as I came to know school uniforms in England, they were much more school unique and thus more difficult to buy non-branded.



> They provide "uniformity"


Yes, they do. But what is positive about uniformity? That is one of my most drastic felt points against it.



> People don't have to worry about what to wear.


I have never _worried _about what to wear when I was young. _Thinking _about what to wear is a normal and should be trained early on.



> It highly increases the level of security in shcools.


How so?



> It can be an icon that distinguishes a particular school from others.


Yes, and where is the advantage of doing so? To be arrogant about you school without any reason? To think your school is any better when in fact is most certainly is not? To feel bad about people who do not share your "posh school"? This is bizarre.



> It gives the student something to identify with.


Yes, to identify with a school -- what is that good for? The pupils should develop a sense of individuality, of plurality, diversity. Not uniformity. The world is not uniform.

Kajjo


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## ayupshiplad

Kajjo said:


> This I doubt very much. The question is "compüared to what". As Martinz mentioned, the selection of white T-Short and dark clothes is a perfect idea, but as far as I came to know school uniforms in England, they were much more school unique and thus more difficult to buy non-branded.


 
But it doesn't matter whether they are school unique! Buying one outfit for all year round for school is always going to be cheaper than buying different clothes- I don't see how you can disagree with this!



> To be arrogant about you school without any reason? To think your school is any better when in fact is most certainly is not? To feel bad about people who do not share your "posh school"? This is bizarre.


 
I don't think it's about arrogance. It's about feeling as if you belong to a community. I think everyone feels the need 'to belong'. And to be fair, uniforms (in the UK anyway) are universal, to it's not about looking down on those who don't go to a 'posh school'.


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## Kajjo

ayupshiplad said:


> But it doesn't matter whether they are school unique! Buying one outfit for all year round for school is always going to be cheaper than buying different clothes- I don't see how you can disagree with this!


Because you certainly won't buy _one outfit_ but _several issues _of this outfit, will you? The parents have not the choice to go to cheap shops to buy clothing that will suffice, but they have to buy exactly the same as everyone else. Let's view it statistically: All parents will decide for a different price und quality. Do you expect the uniform to be equal to the cheapest possibility? Certainly not. So there will be parents who will have to pay more than without uniforms. 



> I don't think it's about arrogance. It's about feeling as if you belong to a community.


Yes, the artifical community of a school. How wonderful. Students belong to family, to peers, to sports etc., but to a school? I am happy that students in Germany do feel "proud" about a certain school, but only about their personal accomplishments.



> And to be air, uniforms (in the UK anyway) are universal, to it's not about looking down on those who don't go to a 'posh school'.


Well, I believe that every school has its individual outfit, so the pupils can identify with a certain school. It is easy to see that you can recognise a student of an expensive school or a cheap school by recognising the uniform. That exactly is why some students may feel proud of a certain school. The issue would be different if all school would use the same uniform, but that certainly is not desired by the schools...

Kajjo


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## mirx

Kajjo said:


> This I doubt very much. The question is "compüared to what". As Martinz mentioned, the selection of white T-Short and dark clothes is a perfect idea, but as far as I came to know school uniforms in England, they were much more school unique and thus more difficult to buy non-branded
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> In many senses Kajjo, having one or two school uniforms won't compare to the expense of having to buy 5 or 6. And it is certainly cheaper to outgrow one uniform, than having to stop using 6 pair of trousers because they don't fit anymore.
> 
> As someone from England (sorry pal, can't remember your name) just explained, most shcools will have very standar uniforms, and you can buy their clothes nearly in every shop. The ones who require you buy it directly from them are *usually* "posh" attented by posh pupils who have no problem paying them. Money here wouldn't be an issue.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, they do. But what is positive about uniformity? That is one of my most drastic felt points against it.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> > It vanishes in a great scale the differences between rich and poor kids.
> > The arrogance that you mentioned, can be contained a lot when everyone has uniforms. How? Well let's just say that kids, just like adults, judge others by the way they are dresssed. I don't know if this is applicable to German kids, but it certainly is for Mexican, American, French, Spanish, Irish and Italian kids, those are the ones I am familiar with and the ones I can speak about. I know not all the kids do it, but it is definitely a trend.
> > It also represents equality, which according to what I read a couple of posts ago, should not be taught to children, I mean why bother if they are not going to live in an equal world anyways? Thankfully most people don't think like that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have never _worried _about what to wear when I was young. _Thinking _about what to wear is a normal and should be trained early on.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Well, I have worried and spent lots of time _thinking_ of what to wear, most people my generation and others did as well, you can find their experiences earlier on this same thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How so?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The point has been already addressed by Brioche, by me and by somebody else. Read up and you will see _How._
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, and where is the advantage of doing so? To be arrogant about you school without any reason? To think your school is any better when in fact is most certainly is not? To feel bad about people who do not share your "posh school"? This is bizarre.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> As I get it, you somehow make an association of "uniform-posh schools", which is by no means the case. Knowing where your people are is always a relief. Perhaps you haven't experienced it, but there's nothing like finding someone familiar in a strange environment full of strangers. I agree that schools should outstand by their academic, cultural or sport merits. Let's say uniforms are the face of it all.
> As I said before, schools not having uniforms is like sport teams not wearing jerseys, employees not wearing badges, or the military not having their uniforms.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, to identify with a school -- what is that good for? The pupils should develop a sense of individuality, of plurality, diversity. Not uniformity. The world is not uniform.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> I simply cannot belive this, everyone knows that EVERYONE needs to feel part of something, children even more so. Of course some prefer to feel identified with gangs, with cults, or with clubs. But the need is there, inherent to the human being. Identifiying with a school, is being part of a group. We do this uncounsciuosly and naturally with, regions, provinces, other clubs, social groups, countries, everywhere.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kajjo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because you certainly won't buy _one outfit_ but _several issues _of this outfit, will you? The parents have not the choice to go to cheap shops to buy clothing that will suffice, but they have to buy exactly the same as everyone else. Let's view it statistically: All parents will decide for a different price und quality. Do you expect the uniform to be equal to the cheapest possibility? Certainly not. So there will be parents who will have to pay more than without uniforms.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> But certainly the majority will find it cheaper, if we are realistic, parents usually fall into buying what the kid wants not what is chaper. This is also applicable with toys, tech equipment, food, and other stuff.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, the artifical community of a school. How wonderful. Students belong to family, to peers, to sports etc., but to a school? I am happy that students in Germany do feel "proud" about a certain school, but only about their personal accomplishments
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> .
> 
> Well, I feel glad that Mexican pupils can also feel proud of their classmate who won a medal, I am glad that Brazilians can feel proud when their team wins the World Cup, I am glad that employees in Microsofttttt feel proud that their company is recognized everywhere. Yeah... they all are groups and they all wear uniforms or other way of uniformity. I hope you get my point here, it's not about feeling superior or any of that, it's simply the great sense of confidence and safety that comes from belonging.
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...


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## ayupshiplad

Kajjo said:


> Because you certainly won't buy _one outfit_ but _several issues _of this outfit, will you? The parents have not the choice to go to cheap shops to buy clothing that will suffice, but they have to buy exactly the same as everyone else. Let's view it statistically: All parents will decide for a different price und quality. Do you expect the uniform to be equal to the cheapest possibility? Certainly not. So there will be parents who will have to pay more than without uniforms.
> Kajjo


 
Well, if we just take my uniform as an example, I wear:

A kilt
Black tights
Black heels
A white shirt
My school tie
A blazer

Out of these 6 items, only shirts, tights and shoes are replaced every year, which you can buy from anywhere. As for blazer and kilt, which are admittedly fairly expensive, my parents have only had to buy 2 of them throughout my 6 years at secondary.

On a side note, I would like to object to the statement made by mirx that people that go to 'posh' schools have no trouble buying a uniform. There is evidently a mass misconception that anyone that goes to a private school is incredibly wealthy. About half of the people that attend my school are on scholarships or bursaries, and I would only class about 20% of the people as 'rich' (We could now get into a discussion about how wealth is relative, but in this instance I mean that only 20% of the people would have no problems initially paying for the uniform). 

To sum up:

Buying a uniform is initially expensive, but substantially cheaper in the long run.


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## Pedro y La Torre

To add to the above, I prefer the days when I wore a uniform. You just put it on and away you go. Having to choose certain clothes, sorting out what looks good etc. is a headache I could do without.

Very few people would argue against a uniform here, it makes everything so much easier.


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## Kajjo

mirx said:


> In many senses Kajjo, having one or two school uniforms won't compare to the expense of having to buy 5 or 6. And it is certainly cheaper to outgrow one uniform, than having to stop using 6 pair of trousers because they don't fit anymore.


The reason I don't buy this argument is that I do not expect students to wear their school uniforms in their spare-time. So if they were _other trousers _in the afternoon, then the parents have to buy _both school uniform and private clothes_. Where do you detect the savings? And won't the children judge others by the outfit they were in their spare-time, too? Also why do you argue that 2 sets of uniforms are enough, but you would need 6 sets of private clothes. This is biased.



> It also represents equality, which according to what I read a couple of posts ago, should not be taught to children, I mean why bother if they are not going to live in an equal world anyways? Thankfully most people don't think like that.


You make it sound the wrong way. I don't mean that people should not have the same _chances_, but they surely are not _equal_ in the sense that they have to like the same type of clothes, behaviour, music, sports and so on. The world is not uniform, it's diverse. Individuality is very important to succeed in real life.



> I simply cannot belive this, everyone knows that EVERYONE needs to feel part of something,


Right, and German pupils are just normal and feel more than enough "belonging" without having to wear school uniforms. 

Kajjo


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## ayupshiplad

Kajjo said:


> The reason I don't buy this argument is that I do not expect students to wear their school uniforms in their spare-time. So if they were _other trousers _in the afternoon, then the parents have to buy _both school uniform and private clothes_. Where do you detect the savings? And won't the children judge others by the outfit they were in their spare-time, too?
> Kajjo


 
Ahhh but the fact is that doesn't matter! If you wear 'private clothes' at the weekend, that's 2 outfits. At school too, and you've got 7!

And actually, I don't change out of my uniform when I get home...perhaps the difference between the German and British school systems (which is convieniently a topic of my German speaking exam!) is a factor. Normally (unless I have free periods), I'll get home at around 5 o clock, and as my school is in the centre of town, none of my friends live near I do, so I don't generally tend to go out again once I've got home, so prefer to laze around in my uniform, whereas in Germany, where you have most of the afternoon off anyway, it's more likely that you would wear 'normal' clothes than here.


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## Mate

*Moderator note*:

Please take a few moments to re-read the *Cultural forum guidelines - Lineamientos del Foro Cultural*


_"The purpose of this forum is to help participants and other readers learn about cultural aspects of different countries and groups of people. *It is neither a chat board, nor a place to advocate or promote personal viewpoints about the way things ought to be; rather, it seeks to help us learn how things are, and how they are changing over time, and not what I think of things and how I would like them to go."*_


Please avoid chat and remain on-topic.

Thanks for your understanding.

Mateamargo
CD forum moderator


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## mirx

Kajjo said:


> The reason I don't buy this argument is that* I do not* expect students to wear their school uniforms in their spare-time. So if they were _other trousers _in the afternoon, then the parents have to buy _both school uniform and private clothes_. Where do you detect the savings? And won't the children judge others by the outfit they were in their spare-time, too? Also why do you argue that 2 sets of uniforms are enough, but you would need 6 sets of private clothes. This is biased.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You were crystal clear there. YOU DO NOT, however many kids will stay on their uniforms through the afternoon. And even when they change, you have to agree that "normal clothes" will wear off less if they are only worn some hours of the day than if worn from morning to night. I "argued" that kids will need 6 or 7 different outfits because -again- the kids I am familiar with dislike being seen in the same clothes repeatedly. They will try to avoid wearing the same outfits as much as they can.
> 
> I am glad to learn that German kids are not so shallow and don't mind about those things, good for you people!!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You make it sound the wrong way. I don't mean that people should not have the same _chances_, but they surely are not _equal_ in the sense that they have to like the same type of clothes, behaviour, music, sports and so on. The world is not uniform, it's diverse. Individuality is very important to succeed in real life
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> . Thank God you have clarified that. I agree with you on that, and I also want to add that unforms have little or nothing to do with preventing someone from developing his sense of individuality.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right, and German pupils are just normal and feel more than enough "belonging" without having to wear school uniforms.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Good for them kids!
Click to expand...


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## LaianNaz

here The jews don't have to wear uniform in schools, because all of their schools as i know are public schools, but we(arabs (christians&muslims)) in our city there is two kinds of school public that are free , and private and religious that you must pay , and have a much better education , i attend a private school and we must wear an uniform always! there is punishment for whom break the rules


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## Lugubert

I know of one (1) Swedish (expensive, private) school that requires uniform, so it seems that they aren't forbidden here. There is practically no debate on introducing or totally banning uniforms.


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## panjandrum

Speaking as a parent who has had to cope with both situations, believe me that there is a very substantial reduction in early morning stress when kids have to wear school uniform, no choice.


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## Kajjo

panjandrum said:


> Speaking as a parent who has had to cope with both situations, believe me that there is a very substantial reduction in early morning stress when kids have to wear school uniform, no choice.


That I do believe. Morning stress. Costs. The whole discussion appears to center around the parents, not the children, though.

An interesting aspect of this threads is to realise that "uniform or not" is highly dependent on the school system. I could follow the arfuments pro uniform much more easily for whole-day schooling rather than German half-day schooling. For German conditions I see almost only disadvantages, both in costs as in individuality.

Kajjo


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## Etcetera

School uniform was obligatory for all kids in the Soviet Union and - for a short time - in Russia after the collapse of the Union. I only wore school uniform for a year or two; by 1995, most schools chose to abandon the idea of school uniforms and let children wear whatever they chose. In recent years, some schools have returned to school uniform, but now there isn't any "standard" of it - schools are free to decide what kind of uniform they want to have on their pupils.


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