# Romance languages: Stress in Portuguese, Spanish, Italian, Catalan, Romanian



## jazyk

I'd like to show you (and collect as well) a few examples of words with different stresses in the aforementioned languages. I didn't include French because it always stresses the last syllable.

Port terapia, Sp terapia, It terapia, Cat teràpia, Ro terapie
Port enciclopédia, Sp enciclopedia, It enciclopedia, Cat enciclopèdia, Ro enciclopedie
Port/It atrofia, Sp atrofia, Cat atròfia, Ro atrofie
Port/It euforia, Sp euforia, Cat eufòria, Ro euforie
Port/Cat orgia, Sp orgía, It orgia, Ro orgie
Port/It ciclope, Sp cíclope, Cat/Ro ciclop
Port clitóris*, Sp/Cat clítoris, It clitoride, Ro clitoris
Port pelicano, Sp pelícano, It pellicano, Cat pelicà, Ro pelican
Port penitenciária, Sp penitenciaría, It penitenzieria, Cat penitencieria
Port polícia, Sp policía, It polizia, Cat policia, Ro poliţie
Port telefone, Sp teléfono, It telefono, Cat telèfon, Ro telefon
Port míope, Sp miope, It miope, Cat/Ro miop
Port medula, Sp médula, It medulla, Cat medul·la, Ro măduvă
* Clítoris is sometimes heard.


----------



## robbie_SWE

Just a question is "penitenciária" (etc.) "_penance_" in English??

Because *"peniténţă" *is the Romanian word for it. 

 robbie


----------



## Jeedade

Port: farmácia, Sp: farmacia, It: farmacia


----------



## robbie_SWE

Jeedade said:


> Port: farmácia, Sp: farmacia, It: farmacia, *Ro: farmacie*


 
 robbie


----------



## olivinha

(Penitenciária = Penitentiary)

Port democracia, Sp democracia
Port Pântano, Sp Pantano 
Port pênalti, Sp penalti
Port período, Sp período o periodo


O


----------



## DrLindenbrock

jazyk said:


> Port terapia, Sp terapia, It terapia, Cat teràpia, Ro terapie
> Port enciclopédia, Sp enciclopedia, It enciclopedia, Cat enciclopèdia, Ro enciclopedie
> Port/It atrofia, Sp atrofia, Cat atròfia, Ro atrofie
> Port/It euforia, Sp euforia, Cat eufòria, Ro euforie
> Port/Cat orgia, Sp orgía, It orgia, Ro orgie
> Port/It ciclope, Sp cíclope, Cat/Ro ciclop
> Port clitóris*, Sp/Cat clítoris, It clitoride, Ro clitoris
> Port pelicano, Sp pelícano, It pellicano, Cat pelicà, Ro pelican
> Port penitenciária, Sp penitenciaría, It penitenzieria**, Cat penitencieria
> Port polícia, Sp policía, It polizia, Cat policia, Ro poliţie
> Port telefone, Sp teléfono, It telefono, Cat telèfon, Ro telefon
> Port míope, Sp miope, It miope, Cat/Ro miop
> Port medula, Sp médula, It medulla***, Cat medul·la, Ro măduvă
> * Clítoris is sometimes heard.


Hi Jazyk, hi everybody! 
a few preliminary considerations:

** _Penitenzieria_ is a word that I had never heard... it does exist in the dictionary but it's related with the Catholic church and its regulations.
I'm sure you meant "prison", "jail", so in that case the word would be _penitenziario_, which by the way is masculine.
*** _medulla _is a veeeery archaic word. My dictionary redirects me to me _midolla _(other accepted form, but also archaic: _medolla_), which means "the inner part of the bread", or even of fruits or cheese, and also, as a literary term, the essence of a problem. A rare meaning of _midolla_ can be _marrow_, but the word people use is definitely _midollo_ (masculin) (_medollo_ is also found in dictionaries, but it's archaic).

Ok, I know I've thrown too much stuff in here...sorrry! Here's how I would change the lists comprising these two words:
Port penitenciária, Sp penitenciaría, It penitenziario, Cat penitencieria
Port medula, Sp médula, It midollo, Cat medul·la, Ro măduvă

Here are some other ideas:
Port Ro_mé_nia or Ro_mê_nia, Sp Ro_ma_nia or Roma_ní_a , It Romania, Cat Romania, Ro Româ_ni_a
Port democracia, Sp democracia, It democra_zi_a, Cat democràcia, Ro democraţie
Port agência, Sp agencia, It agenzia, Cat agència, Ro agenţie

Also, there is another thing distinguishes Italian from Spanish and Catalan (I don’t know about Romanian and Portuguese).
Many verbs of the first conjugation (infinitive ending with –are in Italian) have a different stress. 
Example with verb immaginare (it.), imaginar (sp., cat.)
Io immagino, yo imagino, jo imagino
Example with verb continuare (it.), continuar (sp., cat.)
Io continuo, yo continúo, jo continuo

I'll see if I come up with other examples


----------



## jazyk

> Just a question is "penitenciária" (etc.) "_penance_" in English??


No.



> ** _Penitenzieria_ is a word that I had never heard... it does exist in the dictionary but it's related with the Catholic church and its regulations.
> I'm sure you meant "prison", "jail", so in that case the word would be _penitenziario_, which by the way is masculine.



The other words also refer to the Catholic church as well. Some languages also have the prison sense you pointed to.




> *** _medulla _is a veeeery archaic word. My dictionary redirects me to me _midolla _(other accepted form, but also archaic: _medolla_), which means "the inner part of the bread", or even of fruits or cheese, and also, as a literary term, the essence of a problem. A rare meaning of _midolla_ can be _marrow_, but the word people use is definitely _midollo_ (masculin) (_medollo_ is also found in dictionaries, but it's archaic).



I'm not interested in how archaic a word is. I'm just interested in words.




> Here are some other ideas:
> Port Ro_mé_nia or Ro_mê_nia, Sp Ro_ma_nia or Roma_ní_a , It Romania, Cat Romania, Ro Româ_ni_a
> Port democracia, Sp democracia, It democra_zi_a, Cat democràcia, Ro democraţie
> Port agência, Sp agencia, It agenzia, Cat agència, Ro agenţie



Thank you for your examples!




> Also, there is another thing distinguishes Italian from Spanish and Catalan (I don’t know about Romanian and Portuguese).



Portuguese can't have verbs stressed on the antepenultimate syllable. I think I've never come across a Romanian verb with that feature either.


----------



## sound shift

Catalan correr, Spanish correr. I'm not sure about the Italian.


----------



## jazyk

It correre.


----------



## robbie_SWE

You should have written English translations from the beginning Jazyk, to avoid people from misunderstanding you. 

The correct Romanian word for "_penitentiary_" (hope that's what you want) is *penitenciar. *

An old word that corresponds with "correre" etc. is the Romanian verb "*a* *cure*". 

 robbie


----------



## olivinha

olivinha said:


> (Penitenciária = Penitentiary)
> 
> Port democracia, Sp democracia
> Port Pântano, Sp Pantano
> Port pênalti, Sp penalti
> Port período, Sp período o periodo


One more to my small Port Sp contribution:
Port amoníaco, Sp amoníaco o amoniaco
O


----------



## Outsider

jazyk said:


> Portuguese can't have verbs stressed on the antepenultimate syllable.


Falássemos.


----------



## albondiga

Port: herói, Sp: héroe, It: eróe

(Someone else will have to add Catalan & Romanian ...)


----------



## albondiga

Port: telefone, Sp: teléfono
Port: nível, Sp: nivel
Port: limite, Sp: límite

(OK, someone else finish these off as well ...)

EDIT: oops, just noticed that my first example was already in jazyk's list, but I'll leave it up anyway so that robbie's response below continues to make sense...


----------



## robbie_SWE

Ro: *erou , telefon , nivel , limită* 

** robbie


----------



## albondiga

OK, two more points:

1) The only apparent trend here is in the words ending in *-ia* (or *-ie* in Romanian); the other examples are all kind of random.... so I've got to make the usual request: does anyone know the background behind any of these differences?  Can anyone make an educated guess about any of them?

2) This got me thinking about another one:

Port: coração, Sp: corazón, It: cuore

Even though the Italian is quite a bit different, they're still cognates with the stress on different syllables... my totally wild guess is that maybe the Spanish and Portuguese versions started like cinturacinturón (in Spanish), but then the version with -ón/ão stuck in Spanish and Portuguese but not in Italian, etc.? 

Does anyone know more about this example or any of the other examples of shifted stress?


----------



## betulina

Just to complete the Catalan ones missing:

farmàcia, pantà, penal, període, heroi, nivell, límit, cor.


----------



## DrLindenbrock

jazyk said:


> I'm not interested in how archaic a word is. I'm just interested in words.
> [/font][/color]


 
That's all right, everyone has different interests.  
I wrote down the archaic words in order to show you a little of the etymological background and how the word evolved...I could have just told you: 
no, you say "midollo"! 
but that would not have added much to the discussion.
Moreover, I wrote them in a footnote, note in the main list...
So, like in many instances in life, if something does not interest one, he just ignores it!  

Word list:
Port: limite, Sp: límite, It. limite
Port. oceano, Sp. océano, It. oceano, Cat. oceà


----------



## Cicerón

jazyk said:


> Port medula, Sp médula, It medulla, Cat medul·la, Ro măduvă



Spanish word medula is also accepted.

*médula* o *medula**.*
 (Del lat. _medulla_).
_Real Academia Española © Todos los derechos reservados_


----------



## robbie_SWE

Just wanted to add the Romanian "*ocean*" to the list. 

 robbie


----------



## Outsider

albondiga said:


> 2) This got me thinking about another one:
> 
> Port: coração, Sp: corazón, It: cuore
> 
> Even though the Italian is quite a bit different, they're still cognates with the stress on different syllables...


The true cognate of Italian _cuore_ in Portuguese is _cor_ (an archaic word for "heart" which survives in the set phrase _de cor_ "by heart", and in the verb _decorar_ "to memorize").


----------



## Dymn

In many Greek words ending in _-ia_ Italian stresses the _i_ while Spanish stresses the vowel before it. Apart from the already said _terapia, atrofia, euforia,_ _farmacia, _and _democracia_:

it: _amnesia_, es: _amnesia_
it: _anestesia_, es: _anestesia_
it:_ demagogia_, es: _demagogia _(however, both it & es: _pedagogia, pedagogía_)
it: _monogamia_, es: _monogamia_
it: _parodia_, es: _parodia_
it: _pederastia_, es: _pederastia
_
The only counter-example I've found is: it _orgia _es _orgía_.

Catalan calques Spanish, in this aspect.

---

Some words ending in _-il _are oxytone in Spanish but paroxytone in Catalan:

es: _misil_, ca: _míssil_
es: _textil_, ca: _tèxtil_
es: _reptil_, ca: _rèptil
_
Italian uses them as paroxytone as well as Portuguese except for _réptil/reptil _which seems to have variable stress.


----------



## Sardokan1.0

Some examples of this phenomenon in Italian and Sardinian (the bold marks the accent), the Sardinian version usually keeps the accent like the original in Latin


Av*e*re - H*à*ere (to have)

Ten*e*re - T*è*nere or T*è*nnere (to keep)

Ved*e*re - B*ì*dere (to see)

Sed*e*re - S*è*ere or S*è*tzere (to sit)
Torref*a*re - Turr*a*re (to roast)


----------



## Dymn

Sardokan1.0 said:


> the Sardinian version usually keeps the accent like the original in Latin


I actually think it's Italian which has kept the original stress in the first four verbs, because they are from the 2nd conjugation.

In Catalan:

_hav*e*r _(dialectally _h*e*ure _and _h*a*ure_)
_ten*i*r _(dialectally _t*i*ndre_)
_v*e*ure _(archaically _ve*e*r_; dialectally _v*o*re_)
_s*e*ure_ (archaically _se*e*r_)

In Spanish there is no mystery because all infinitives are stressed in the last syllable (even from the Latin 3rd conj.), so:

_hab*e*r
ten*e*r
v*e*r _(archaically _ve*e*r_)
_s*e*r _(archaically _se*e*r_)


----------



## Dymn

sound shift said:


> Catalan c*ó*rrer, Spanish correr. I'm not sure about the Italian.





jazyk said:


> It correre.


In Catalan, French and Italian, the stress of the 3rd Latin conjugation infinitives has been kept in the antepenultima. This has triggered the loss of the medial _-e-_ in Catalan (when phonotactically possible) and in French.

On the other hand, Portuguese and Spanish have regularized all the stresses to the last syllable.

Examples:

La _perdere, _Pt _perder_, Es _perder, _Ca _perdre_, Fr _perdre_, It _perdere_
La _vendere, _Pt _vender_, Es _vender_, Ca _vendre_, Fr _vendre_, It _vendere_
La _vincere_, Pt _vencer_, Es _vencer_, Ca _vèncer_, Fr _vaincre_, It _vincere_
La _nascere_, Pt _nascer_, Es _nacer_, Ca _nàixer_, Fr _naître_, It _nascere
_
#23 If Sardinian has shifted the stress of many (all?) 2nd conj. infinitives to the root syllable, I guess it is due to influence from the 3rd conjugation, so we could also include it in the Cat/Fr/It group, couldn't we, @Sardokan1.0 ?


----------



## Nino83

Sicilian (Italian)
2nd conjugation: v*ì*diri (ved*é*re), t*è*niri (ten*é*re), c*à*diri (cad*é*re),
3rd conjugation: (j)*à*priri (apr*ì*re), b*ù*gghiri (boll*ì*re), cump*à*riri (compar*ì*re), div*è*ttiri (divert*ì*re), d*ò*mmiri (dorm*ì*re), f*ù*iri (fugg*ì*re), *ì*nchiri ((ri)emp*ì*re), n*è*sciri (usc*ì*re), p*à*ttiri (part*ì*re), s*è*bbiri (serv*ì*re), v*è*niri (ven*ì*re), v*è*stiri (vest*ì*re)


----------



## Sardokan1.0

Dymn said:


> In Catalan, French and Italian, the stress of the 3rd Latin conjugation infinitives has been kept in the antepenultima. This has triggered the loss of the medial _-e-_ in Catalan (when phonotactically possible) and in French.
> 
> On the other hand, Portuguese and Spanish have regularized all the stresses to the last syllable.
> 
> Examples:
> 
> La _perdere, _Pt _perder_, Es _perder, _Ca _perdre_, Fr _perdre_, It _perdere_
> La _vendere, _Pt _vender_, Es _vender_, Ca _vendre_, Fr _vendre_, It _vendere_
> La _vincere_, Pt _vencer_, Es _vencer_, Ca _vèncer_, Fr _vaincre_, It _vincere_
> La _nascere_, Pt _nascer_, Es _nacer_, Ca _nàixer_, Fr _naître_, It _nascere
> _
> #23 If Sardinian has shifted the stress of many (all?) 2nd conj. infinitives to the root syllable, I guess it is due to influence from the 3rd conjugation, so we could also include it in the Cat/Fr/It group, couldn't we, @Sardokan1.0 ?




The stress shift is not very common, only in certain verbs, while in the verbs mentioned above the stress in Sardinian is like in Italian, with some different pronounces

La _perdere, _Pt _perder_, Es _perder, _Ca _perdre_, Fr _perdre_, It _perdere,  _*Sar *_*perdere.*_
La _vendere, _Pt _vender_, Es _vender_, Ca _vendre_, Fr _vendre_, It _vendere, _*Sar *_*bendere.*_
La _vincere_, Pt _vencer_, Es _vencer_, Ca _vèncer_, Fr _vaincre_, It _vincere, _*Sar *_*binchere.*_
La _nascere_, Pt _nascer_, Es _nacer_, Ca _nàixer_, Fr _naître_, It _nascere, _*Sar *_*naschere.*_


There are however many verbs that in origin belonged to 3rd conjugation that in Sardinian switched to 2nd conjugation, Example :

*Latin - Sardinian*

_Legere - Leggere or Legghere

Lego - Leggio - Leggo
Legis - Legges - Legghes
Legit - Legget - Legghet
Legimus - Leggimus - Legghimus
Legitis - Leggides / Legghides
Legunt - Leggen / Legghen

Currere - Currere

curro - curro
curris - curres
currit - curret
currīmus - currimus
currītis - currides
currunt - curren_


----------



## Dymn

Nino83 said:


> Sicilian (Italian)
> 2nd conjugation: v*ì*diri (ved*é*re), t*è*niri (ten*é*re), c*à*diri (cad*é*re),
> 3rd conjugation: (j)*à*priri (apr*ì*re), b*ù*gghiri (boll*ì*re), cump*à*riri (compar*ì*re), div*è*ttiri (divert*ì*re), d*ò*mmiri (dorm*ì*re), f*ù*iri (fugg*ì*re), *ì*nchiri ((ri)emp*ì*re), n*è*sciri (usc*ì*re), p*à*ttiri (part*ì*re), s*è*bbiri (serv*ì*re), v*è*niri (ven*ì*re), v*è*stiri (vest*ì*re)


Is this change regular in 2nd and 3rd conjugation verbs?


----------



## Sardokan1.0

Another verb with this stress switch :

*Italian - Sardinian*

_Decadére - Decàere_

There is a peculiarity in this verb, because the cognate of "Cadére" is not present in Sardinian, the Italian "Cadére" in Sardinian is "Rùere"

from Latin : [rŭo], rŭis, rui, rŭĕre = (to collapse, to crumble)

Also this verb like a great number of verbs, in Sardinian switched from 3rd to 2nd conjugation



Spoiler: Rùere



*
Latin - Sardinian*

_present_
1 r*ŭ*o - r*u*o
2 r*ŭ*is - r*u*es
3 r*ŭ*it - r*u*et
1 rŭ*ĭ*mus - ru*i*mus
2 rŭ*ĭ*tis - ru*i*des
3 r*ŭ*unt - r*u*en

the imperfect tense in Sardinian sounds like a mix of Latin imperfect and perfect

*Latin - Sardinian*

_imperfect_
1 ru*ḗ*bam
2 ru*ḗ*bās
3 ru*ḗ*bat
1 ruēb*ā́*mus
2 ruēb*ā́*tis
3 ru*ḗ*bant

_perfect_
1 ru*ī*
2 ru*í*stī
3 r*u*it
1 ru*i*mus
2 ru*í*stis
3 ru*ḗ*runt

_imperfect_
1 ru*i*a, ru*i*o
2 ru*i*sti, ru*i*as
3 ru*i*at
1 ru*i*mis, ru*i*mus, rui*a*mus
2 ru*i*tis, ru*i*zis
3 ru*i*an


----------



## Nino83

Dymn said:


> Is this change regular in 2nd and 3rd conjugation verbs?


As for the 3rd conjugation (4th Latin conjugation) it seems to me that inchoative verbs (-isc verbs) tend to have the same stress, _fin*ì*ri, cap*ì*ri_, while there is a tendence, for non-inchoative verbs, to have a stress on the antepenultimate syllable in the infinitive mood. 
As for the verbs of the 2nd conjugation (from the 2nd Latin conjugation) I don't know if there is a general tendence or if these are only few exceptions. 
If you want to know something more about it, you can list some verbs and I can add the Sicilian forms.


----------



## Sardokan1.0

Nino83 said:


> Sicilian (Italian)
> 2nd conjugation: v*ì*diri (ved*é*re), t*è*niri (ten*é*re), c*à*diri (cad*é*re),
> 3rd conjugation: (j)*à*priri (apr*ì*re), b*ù*gghiri (boll*ì*re), cump*à*riri (compar*ì*re), div*è*ttiri (divert*ì*re), d*ò*mmiri (dorm*ì*re), f*ù*iri (fugg*ì*re), *ì*nchiri ((ri)emp*ì*re), n*è*sciri (usc*ì*re), p*à*ttiri (part*ì*re), s*è*bbiri (serv*ì*re), v*è*niri (ven*ì*re), v*è*stiri (vest*ì*re)



Some of this verbs have the same stress in Sardinian

_2nd conjugation: 
_
v*ì*diri (ved*é*re) b*ì*dere 



Spoiler: Indicative Present



(b*i*do, b*ì*des, b*ì*det, bid*ì*mus, bid*ì*des, b*ì*den)


t*è*niri (ten*é*re) t*è*nere, t*è*nnere 



Spoiler: Indicative Present



(t*e*nzo, t*è*nes, t*è*net, ten*ì*mus, ten*ì*des, t*è*nen)


_3rd conjugation : 
_
v*è*niri (ven*ì*re) -> b*è*nnere 



Spoiler: Indicative Present



(b*e*nzo, b*è*nis. b*è*nit, ben*ì*mus, ben*ì*des, b*è*nin)


cump*à*riri (compar*ì*re) - This verb in Sardinian has two different forms: 

cumpar*ì*re (3rd conjugation)



Spoiler: Indicative Present



cump*a*rzo, cump*à*ris, cump*à*rit, cumpar*ì*mus, cumpar*ì*des, cump*à*rin


cump*à*rrere (2nd conjugation) - same conjugation of the verb "P*à*rrere" (Sembrare)



Spoiler: Indicative Present



cump*a*rzo, cump*à*res, cump*à*ret, cumpar*ì*mus, cumpar*ì*des, cump*à*ren


----------



## irinet

robbie_SWE said:


> You should have written English translations from the beginning Jazyk, to avoid people from misunderstanding you.
> 
> The correct Romanian word for "_penitentiary_" (hope that's what you want) is *penitenciar. *
> 
> An old word that corresponds with "correre" etc. is the Romanian verb "*a* *cure*".
> 
> robbie



Where did you take this verb from, 'a cure', Robbie?!

A veni, a vesti, a dormi (4th conj), a cumpăra.


----------



## robbie_SWE

irinet said:


> Where did you take this verb from, 'a cure', Robbie?!
> 
> A veni, a vesti, a dormi (4th conj), a cumpăra.



The archaic form of the verb *a curge* is _a cure_. See DEX.


----------



## irinet

robbie_SWE said:


> The archaic form of the verb *a curge* is _a cure_. See DEX.



Now, that you wrote "a curge", I see where "cure" comes from.
Thanks for reminding me this form.


----------



## Penyafort

These are some proper nouns and names that have different stress in Catalan and Spanish. Feel free to add equivalences in the other Romance languages.

_Geography_
els Car*pats -* los *Cár*patos
l'Hi*mà*laia - el Hima*la*ya
l'Eu*fra*tes - el *Éu*frates
*Mí*konos - Mi*co*nos
el Ti*bet* - el *Tí*bet
Eti*ò*pia - Etio*pí*a
Ucra*ï*na - U*cra*nia
*Bà*ssora - Ba*so*ra
*Hèl*sinki - Hel*sin*ki
*Kí*ev - *Kiev*
Ma*rrà*queix* - *Marra*kech*
Mu*nic *- *Mú*nich
Zu*ric *- *Zú*rich

_Greek names_
Aga*mèm*non - Agame*nón*
Aris*ti*des - A*rís*tides
Arqui*me*des - Ar*quí*medes
*À*tila - A*t*ila
*Cèr*ber - Cer*be*ro (el ca *Cèr*ber - el can Cer*be*ro)
*Cí*bele - Ci*be*les
Cle*ò*patra - Cleo*pa*tra
*Dà*mocles - Da*mo*cles (l'espasa de *Dà*mocles - la espada de Da*mo*cles)
*È*dip - E*di*po (el complex d'*È*dip - el complejo de E*di*po)
*Ès*quil - Es*qui*lo
*Hè*racles - He*ra*cles
*Jà*son - Ja*són*

_Names from other origins _
Es*pàr*tac* - *Espar*ta*co
*Jà*fet - Ja*fet*
*Ke*fren - Ke*frén*
el premi No*bel* - el premio *No*bel​


----------



## Dymn

Portuguese: _álcool_
---
Spanish: _alcohol_
Catalan: _alcohol_
Italian: _alcol_


----------



## Nino83

Dymn said:


> Italian: _alcol_


Italian: àlcol


----------



## Dymn

Ooops, you're right 

I add too:

Portuguese: _cérebro_
Spanish: _cerebro_

Catalan and Italian derive it from _cerebellum_ so stress is not comparable.


----------



## Olaszinhok

Dymn said:


> Catalan and Italian derive it from _cerebellum_ so stress is not comparable.



It's *cervèllo* in Italian pronounced txervel.lo 
Catalan *cervell*.


----------



## Circunflejo

DrLindenbrock said:


> Port Ro_mé_nia or Ro_mê_nia, Sp Ro_ma_nia or Roma_ní_a , It Romania, Cat Romania, Ro Româ_ni_a



If I'm getting it right, you are talking about the country called in English Romania. In that case, in Spanish, it would be Ruma*ní*a; neither Ro*ma*nia nor Roma*ní*a.



albondiga said:


> Port: telefone, Sp: teléfono



Catalán: te*lè*fon.



Penyafort said:


> el premi No*bel* - el premio *No*bel



Most Spanish speaking people in Spain (I don't know about how's pronounced in other Spanish speaking countries) pronounces it *No*bel as you said but I'd like to say that if we follow Spanish pronounciation rules, it should be No*bel.* I recall a teacher that always corrected the students that pronounced it *No*bel saying them that they should say No*bel* because that was the correct pronounciation in Spanish. Hi didn't have a big success as students kept saying *No*bel out of his classes  but, at least, he made us aware of the theoretical correct pronounciation. I must say I've heard someone else pronouncing it No*bel* but it's a rare pronounciation in Spanish.



Dymn said:


> Spanish: _alcohol_



This is another case in which theory and practice don't always agree. In theory, pronounciation in Spanish should be alco*hol*. However, many people pronounce a single /o/ so instead of alco*hol*, they pronounce al*col *but alcol isn't (yet) an accepted word to write.


----------



## merquiades

Penyafort said:


> These are some proper nouns and names that have different stress in Catalan and Spanish. Feel free to add equivalences in the other Romance languages.
> 
> _Geography_
> els Car*pats -* los *Cár*patos - les Carp*a*tes
> l'Hi*mà*laia - el Hima*la*ya - les Himalay*a*s
> l'Eu*fra*tes - el *Éu*frates - l'Euphr*a*te
> *Mí*konos - Mi*co*nos - Mikon*o*s
> el Ti*bet* - el *Tí*bet - le Tib*e*t
> Eti*ò*pia - Etio*pí*a - l'Éthiop*i*e
> Ucra*ï*na - U*cra*nia - l'Ukr*ai*ne
> *Bà*ssora - Ba*so*ra - Bassor*a*h
> *Hèl*sinki - Hel*sin*ki - Helsink*i*
> *Kí*ev - *Kiev - *Kï*e*v
> Ma*rrà*queix* - *Marra*kech - *Marrak*e*ch
> Mu*nic *- *Mú*nich . Mun*i*ch
> Zu*ric *- *Zú*rich - Zur*i*ch
> 
> _Greek names_
> Aga*mèm*non - Agame*nón *- Agamemn*on*
> Aris*ti*des - A*rís*tides - Arist*i*des
> Arqui*me*des - Ar*quí*medes - Archim*è*de
> *À*tila - A*t*ila -Attil*a*
> *Cèr*ber - Cer*be*ro (el ca *Cèr*ber - el can Cer*be*ro) - Cerb*è*re
> *Cí*bele - Ci*be*les - Cyb*è*le
> Cle*ò*patra - Cleo*pa*tra - Cléop*â*tre
> *Dà*mocles - Da*mo*cles (l'espasa de *Dà*mocles - la espada de Da*mo*cles) - l'épée de Damocl*è*s
> *È*dip - E*di*po (el complex d'*È*dip - el complejo de E*di*po) - le complexe d'Œd*i*pe
> *Ès*quil - Es*qui*lo - Esch*y*le
> *Hè*racles - He*ra*cles - Héracl*è*s
> *Jà*son - Ja*són - *Jas*on*
> 
> _Names from other origins _
> Es*pàr*tac* - *Espar*ta*co - Spartac*u*s
> *Jà*fet - Ja*fet - *Japh*e*t
> *Ke*fren - Ke*frén *- Khéph*e*n
> el premi No*bel* - el premio *No*bel - le prix Nob*e*l​


  Added the French


----------



## Red Arrow

merquiades said:


> Added the French


French stress is completely regular, even for names


----------

