# 그 자체였다.



## idialegre

Hi Everybody. In the novel 레몬 by 권여선, a woman is describing her sister, who was murdered. She says,

언니는 누구나 한번 보면 잊지 힘들 정도로 아름다운 소녀였다. 내용 없는 텅 빈 형식의 완전함이 주는 황홀 그 자체였다.

I understand the first sentence: "My sister was such a beautiful girl that it was difficult for anyone who saw her to forget her." But I find the second sentence confusing. Is 내용 없는 텅 빈 형식의 - "the empty, hollow form" - referring to her sister's corpse? And I don't know how to translate 그 자체였다. 

Anyone care to help out? Thanks!


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## SeasnailSalad

To show that her sister had a flawless appearance, the author seemed to try to explain how beautiful her looks were (언니는 ~였다) and a feeling of great happiness, pleasure, or love (rapture;황홀) you'd have when meeting her (내용 ~ 자체였다); that is to say, anyone who saw her in person would be as impressed by her beauty as the feeling.

The literal translations would be "(Her beauty was) rapture itself given by the empty[hollow] form of perfection," and "그 자체였다" could be translated into "it was what[as] it was," or often "itself" in some context.

My interpretations on '내용 없는 텅 빈 _형식_의 *완전함*이 주는' would be like there's no single defect _in her appearance_ so that it's regarded '*perfect*.'

I hope this helps!


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## idialegre

Thank you, SeasnailSalad, your explanation does help. But if you still have some patience for my questions, I'm just wondering if I'm perhaps misunderstanding some of the words. If I translate it word by word, 내용 없는 means "without content" or "without details." 텅빈 means "hollow." It's still not clear to me why she would describe the her sister's form as empty and hollow. Do you think she's commenting on her sister's character? (Maybe saying her sister was stupid??? ㅋㅋㅋ) I don't quite get it.


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## lkjhg811

idialegre said:


> I'm just wondering if I'm perhaps misunderstanding some of the words. If I translate it word by word, 내용 없는 means "without content" or "without details." 텅빈 means "hollow."


"내용 없는" means "without content". "텅 빈" means "hollow".



idialegre said:


> It's still not clear to me why she would describe the her sister's form as empty and hollow.


"White" stands for perfection, untainted by any other hue.
Similarly, "empty" and "hollow" stand for perfection, untainted by anything.



idialegre said:


> Do you think she's commenting on her sister's character? (Maybe saying her sister was stupid??? ㅋㅋㅋ)


No. She's not at all.


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## Tomato potato

My first feeling of "내용없는 텅빈 형식의 완전함" is being sarcastic about her stupidness.
What can be the sister's real intention? Describing perfect beauty? Maybe both?
The reason metaphors have a value is that they are understood in various ways.


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## SeasnailSalad

idialegre said:


> Thank you, SeasnailSalad, your explanation does help. But if you still have some patience for my questions, I'm just wondering if I'm perhaps misunderstanding some of the words. If I translate it word by word, 내용 없는 means "without content" or "without details." 텅빈 means "hollow." It's still not clear to me why she would describe the her sister's form as empty and hollow. Do you think she's commenting on her sister's character? (Maybe saying her sister was stupid??? ㅋㅋㅋ) I don't quite get it.



Well, it may sound like referring to her stupidity if the context given made you feel that way. We're not reading the book together from scratch though we are on the same page, and I've just kind of translated and explained some of the expressions from the book you are wondering. So I don't think I'm able to categorically explain what the author intended like in a crystal-clear way. Based on what you brought up here, I thought the author just wanted to make a comparison between her flawless appearance and something similar to it rather than being sarcastic. Therefore, the example answer would be all the interpretations are up to the readers.


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## idialegre

Thank you very much! Now I understand. 

I didn't know that emptiness and/or hollowness were also symbols or perfection. (In the USA they would usually symbolize an empty head, i.e., no brain.)


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## lkjhg811

idialegre said:


> (In the USA they would usually symbolize an empty head, i.e., no brain.)


In Korea, they could symbolize an empty head, depending on the context.


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## SeasnailSalad

idialegre said:


> Thank you very much! Now I understand.
> 
> I didn't know that emptiness and/or hollowness were also symbols or perfection. (In the USA they would usually symbolize an empty head, i.e., no brain.)


Probably it’s more of something seamless that doesn’t need a single stitch, which could imply a perfect thing that doesn’t need someone’s finishing touch. The descriptions the author used are not that very common to refer to something perfect in that way even in Korea, but it’s still understandable that way by the context.


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## idialegre

Thanks, that's very interesting.


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