# Hand Gestures and Misunderstandings



## Poetic Device

Recently I was talking to a friend that is from England, and the convorsation got a little heated.  I told her "time out" and made what I considered the hand gesture for time out (holding out one hand horizontally and one hand vertically while the middle finger of the horizontal hand is touching the palm of the vertical hand -| ).  Apparently, this in England, or whatever town she is from, means basically "up yours".  First of all, I am wondering if this is true or just her way to try to win an argument.  The second question is has anything like this ever happened to any person here and if so what was it?  TIA  <3


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## maxiogee

Poetic Device said:


> Recently I was talking to a friend that is from England, and the convorsation got a little heated.  I told her "time out" and made what I considered the hand gesture for time out (holding out one hand horizontally and one hand vertically while the middle finger of the horizontal hand is touching the palm of the vertical hand -| ).


Is this not just a "T" a symbol, stemming from either Basketball or American Football? These are not internationally followed sports and their semiology might not be as understood as you might think.




> Apparently, this in England, or whatever town she is from, means basically "up yours".  First of all, I am wondering if this is true or just her way to try to win an argument.  The second question is has anything like this ever happened to any person here and if so what was it?  TIA  <3


I don't believe her. "Up your's" is either a raised middle finger with all the other fingers folded inwards, or an outstretched forearm with the other fist balled up and used as a pivot point in the elbow of the forearm, which is then raised vertically.
I doubt that any Briton would take offence at the "T" symbol.


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## Alicky

Poetic Device said:


> Recently I was talking to a friend that is from England, and the convorsation got a little heated. I told her "time out" and made what I considered the hand gesture for time out (holding out one hand horizontally and one hand vertically while the middle finger of the horizontal hand is touching the palm of the vertical hand -| ). Apparently, this in England, or whatever town she is from, means basically "up yours". First of all, I am wondering if this is true or just her way to try to win an argument. The second question is has anything like this ever happened to any person here and if so what was it? TIA <3


 
For me "time out" is holding one hand vertically and the other horizontally. The vertical hand situates below the horizontal forming a T.

I tried your "time out" and to me it was weird. Specially the fact that I was using the middle finger. Could it be that the finger was the problem? Perhaps if you had used your whole hand... 
What do you think?


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## zebedee

Poetic Device said:


> Recently I was talking to a friend that is from England, and the convorsation got a little heated.  I told her "time out" and made what I considered the hand gesture for time out (holding out one hand horizontally and one hand vertically while the middle finger of the horizontal hand is touching the palm of the vertical hand -| ).  Apparently, this in England, or whatever town she is from, means basically "up yours".  First of all, I am wondering if this is true or just her way to try to win an argument.  The second question is has anything like this ever happened to any person here and if so what was it?  TIA  <3




Speaking from the English side, I'd have to agree that I think the problem is the middle finger. My "time out" gesture is a vertical hand touching a horizontal hand forming a T but without the middle finger bit.


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## maxiogee

zebedee said:


> Speaking from the English side, I'd have to agree that I think the problem is the middle finger. My "time out" gesture is a vertical hand touching a horizontal hand forming a T but without the middle finger bit.



How do you not involve the middle finger?
Hold one hand flat.
Hold the other one upright.
Place the upright one under the flat one (I put it where the knuckles nearest the palm are) and the only finger which will touch the flat hand is the middle one - the others are too short alongside it. To make them touch the flat hand means bending the middle finger, and the others need to bend too if the little finger is to touch the flat hand.


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## Nunty

maxiogee said:


> How do you not involve the middle finger?
> Hold one hand flat.
> Hold the other one upright.
> Place the upright one under the flat one (I put it where the knuckles nearest the palm are) and the only finger which will touch the flat hand is the middle one - the others are too short alongside it. To make them touch the flat hand means bending the middle finger, and the others need to bend too if the little finger is to touch the flat hand.



But apparently, he used *only* the middle finger:


> I told her "time out" and made what I considered the hand gesture for time out (holding out one hand horizontally and one hand vertically while the middle finger of the horizontal hand is touching the palm of the vertical hand -| )


I think it was inadvertently offensive, but I think she was probably making mileage out it. It wasn't intentional, after all. Apparently.

Anyway, isn't "time out" horizontally oriented, like a capital T?


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## maxiogee

Nun-Translator said:


> But apparently, he used *only* the middle finger:
> 
> 
> 
> I told her "time out" and made what I considered the hand gesture for time out (holding out one hand horizontally and one hand vertically while the middle finger of the horizontal hand is touching the palm of the vertical hand -| )
Click to expand...

I've got to disagree - how do you hold one hand vertically *and[/n] hold the middle finger vertical? Holding the hand vertically automatically means the middle finger is vertical - otherwise the hand is a fist with the middle finger raised.

What PD described is a "T" on its side, and I think she's probably confused her vertical and her horizontal.*


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## whattheflock

Yeah, I had to think about it for a while when I read the description of the first "T". Maybe the friend thought she was given the shaolin salute and was being challenged to a fight....

Regardless of how crooked the "T" mighta been, I think most anyone woulda understood that it was a "time out" request, I don't know.
But I was told once before when I was in college that unless I know exactly how people from different countries do their hand-signs, to abstain from gesticulating. Good advice, but difficult to implement for guys like me that will use wild gyrations of the arms and restless flapping hands to convey what I'm trying to say.


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## ireney

First of all that T sign, if it wasn't done properly (I am still confused by the description) would probably confuse me if it was too different from the usual Time-out sign but I wouldn't take it as an offensive gesture. If I didn't understand what it was I'd probably react with an eloquent "Wha'?" or "Huh?".

I'm usually pretty slow to take offence by anything but international offensive gestures (middle finger raised and the other one maxiogees described so well in post #2). 
One of the reasons is that people will inadvertedly give us the Mountza or Faskelo when they only want to either say "go back", "stop there" , hail a cab or just saw five emphatically (I've seen it in NBA games; coach seemed to be giving a mountza to his whole team). It's not hard since all you have to do is hold you palm up and outwards with the fingers open rather wide and thrust your hand toward the other person.
For us it's insulting, for everyone else it's not really. I've you got a mountza even from your very polite English teacher you learn to keep in mind cultural differences.

http://argoul.blog.lemonde.fr/argoul/images/greenspan_1.jpg I got that from English wikipedia's article on moutza. Mr Alan Greenspan seems to be giving a moutza to all of us


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## Alicky

whattheflock said:


> Yeah, I had to think about it for a while when I read the description of the first "T". Maybe the friend thought she was given the shaolin salute and was being challenged to a fight....
> 
> Regardless of how crooked the "T" mighta been, I think most anyone woulda understood that it was a "time out" request, I don't know.
> But I was told once before when I was in college that unless I know exactly how people from different countries do their hand-signs, to abstain from gesticulating. Good advice, but difficult to implement for guys like me that will use wild gyrations of the arms and restless flapping hands to convey what I'm trying to say.


 
That should be a "when travelling or dealing with foreigners..." law. I talk using gestures a lot; but when speaking with people from another cultures I try to avoid using my regular "talk-help" gestures.


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## Tolovaj_Mataj

ireney said:


> First of all that T sign, if it wasn't done properly (I am still confused by the description) would probably confuse me if it was too different from the usual Time-out sign but I wouldn't take it as an offensive gesture. If I didn't understand what it was I'd probably react with an eloquent "Wha'?" or "Huh?".


I agree with Ireney on this and aslo that it's better to avoid gestures when talking to people from a different background.



Poetic Device said:


> I told her "time out" and made what I considered the hand gesture for time out (holding out one hand horizontally and one hand vertically while the middle finger of the horizontal hand is touching the palm of the vertical hand -| ).


I try to understand your description and more and more I'm convienced you showed her a gesture for a technical foul (I'm talking basketball-wise).
So if you'd show me this in a very heated conversation, you would make me even more pissed off as your gesture means I don't follow the rules.
I her case - you said you believe she was from the UK - I think it was a pure misunderstanding as majority of Brits don't follow basketball at all.

Btw, a gesture for the time-out is like this: form a T by putting the right hand palm as a top and touching it from the bottom with a stretched INDEX finger of the left hand with all other four fingers being pressed together in a fist.

All gestures with a stretched out middle finger only are avoided in basketball from very obvious reasons.


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## Poetic Device

Alicky said:


> For me "time out" is holding one hand vertically and the other horizontally. The vertical hand situates below the horizontal forming a T.
> 
> I tried your "time out" and to me it was weird. Specially the fact that I was using the middle finger. Could it be that the finger was the problem? Perhaps if you had used your whole hand...
> What do you think?


No no no no!!!! I'm so sorry. I should have been more clear! All of the fingers are streached out, not folded under. I only said the thing about the middle finger as a reference of how to position the hands. Basically, Tony had it right. They do use it in football (either one, I think) and other sports. Whether or not it originated from there I wouldn't be able to tell you. This is so wierd that you guys are saying otherwise. I guess she just wanted to win the argument that badly.

In any event, Aside my screw-up.  My question still stays the same. * Has anyone made a hand gesture to another from a different culture/background to have it be misinterpreted?*


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## Alicky

Poetic Device said:


> No no no no!!!! I'm so sorry. I should have been more clear! All of the fingers are streached out, not folded under. I only said the thing about the middle finger as a reference of how to position the hands. Basically, Tony had it right. They do use it in football (either one, I think) and other sports. Whether or not it originated from there I wouldn't be able to tell you. This is so wierd that you guys are saying otherwise. I guess she just wanted to win the argument that badly.
> 
> In any event, Aside my screw-up. My question still stays the same. *Has anyone made a hand gesture to another from a different culture/background to have it be misinterpreted?*


 
Now I get it. Sorry. 
Regarding to your question, no. 
But then, I don't need hand gestures to be misinterpretated. I can't count the number of times I've said something that has been misinterpretated. Mostly because I can't express myself properly in my own language, even less in english.


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## fenixpollo

I'm on PD's side here -- if you turn the "T" on its side, it's still a time out.  My middle finger is longer than the others, so it touches the palm of the other hand, while the others don't reach... but they are all extended together.

I've never made a gesture that was misinterpreted, as far as I know.  The more common problem is not mis-understanding gestures from another culture, it's understanding them in the first place.


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## curly

If someone nade any kind of gesture in that situation it wouldn't matter what it was, i think i would assume that it's rude...


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## Benjy

Whilst not strictly a hand gesture one that gets me into trouble at work all the time is the french habit of puffing one's cheeks out and exhaling slowly whilst concentrating on question being asked. You know the one that english speakers tend to do to show that they're pissed off?


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## kaleidoscope

I think the problem with the "time out" gesture (whichever is the proper way to do it) is that most people outside of North America wouldn't know what it meant since it's used exclusively in North American sports, as far as I know. I can see how someone from the UK would mistake it for something else or simply not understand it... although I'm not sure that many would think it meant "up yours".

I had a Spanish friend who jokingly gave what she thought was a "peace sign" to a group of middle-aged hippy guys, only to discover that in the UK if you make that gesture with your knuckles facing outwards (instead of inwards), it basically means "f*ck off".


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## elpoderoso

A slightly related question (especially to any polish natives) 
A friend of mine said that when he winks at polish people when he says hello, they reply by blinking. Does this happen because
a) my friend is actually lying?
B)winking as part of a greeting, is not part of polish culture?
or
C)the polish people are having a laugh at my friends expense?


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## Sofia29

It happened to me once, talking to a guy from Spain who had lived in Italy for some time.

He asked me something and I didn't know the answer... I made the Argentine "I don't know" gesture . He was taken aback by it and I was like "what is it?? I just don't know!". Turns out he thought I was saying I didn't care. He confused it with the Italian "me ne frego" gesture: http://italian.about.com/library/nosearch/blgestures026.htm.


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## Victoria32

Poetic Device said:


> Recently I was talking to a friend that is from England, and the convorsation got a little heated. I told her "time out" and made what I considered the hand gesture for time out (holding out one hand horizontally and one hand vertically while the middle finger of the horizontal hand is touching the palm of the vertical hand -| ). Apparently, this in England, or whatever town she is from, means basically "up yours". First of all, I am wondering if this is true or just her way to try to win an argument. The second question is has anything like this ever happened to any person here and if so what was it? TIA <3


That is similar to  *'T'* in the NZ deaf manual alphabet - and it's the sign they used to use to mean a request for the toilet... (Not now - all signs must be able to be made with one hand now.)


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## Victoria32

Benjy said:


> Whilst not strictly a hand gesture one that gets me into trouble at work all the time is the french habit of puffing one's cheeks out and exhaling slowly whilst concentrating on question being asked. You know the one that english speakers tend to do to show that they're pissed off?


I did just that to my Australian boss, who went off at me! (Granted - it meant a give me patience sigh, as much as concentration... but we were on the phone, she wasn't suppsed to hear it!) 

Told off for 'huffing' at her!


VL http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Kitten_Huffing


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## Brioche

Victoria32 said:


> That is similar to *'T'* in the NZ deaf manual alphabet - and it's the sign they used to use to mean a request for the toilet... (Not now - *all signs must be able to be made with one hand now*.)


 
How wierd! The Australian Deaf wouldn't let a government official tell them how to speak/write their own language!

In the manual alphabet used by deaf people in Australia, both hands are used for all letters except C.

Most of the signs in Auslan [Australian Sign Language] are two hand signs. 
It takes two hands to sign _Auslan,_ but only one for _overbearing_!

There is a one-handed American Sign Language alphabet, and some Auslan signs are based on it.


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## Victoria32

Brioche said:


> How wierd! The Australian Deaf wouldn't let a government official tell them how to speak/write their own language!
> 
> In the manual alphabet used by deaf people in Australia, both hands are used for all letters except C.
> 
> Most of the signs in Auslan [Australian Sign Language] are two hand signs.
> It takes two hands to sign _Auslan,_ but only one for _overbearing_!
> 
> There is a one-handed American Sign Language alphabet, and some Auslan signs are based on it.


I don't know if it was the government that made that decision - I do know I am extremely bad at deaf manual languages! (I am ambidextrous, which I think is the problem.) 

We have the NZ deaf manual alphabet on the kitchen cupboard door so we can learn it, because my son is a nursing student and may need it.


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## JamesM

I don't have any personal stories, but I have heard of a few sources of misunderstanding.

I have heard that raised eyebrows in Greece mean "No", and that it is often mistaken by Americans as incredulity or surprise, but the "no" message is never received. Maybe Ireney can confirm that. 

There is also supposed to be a brief upward nod of the head that also means "no" in Greece, but in the U.S. is a common way for people to greet each other casually if they see each other at a distance.  I don't think we'd ever interpret it as "no" without someone explaining it to us.


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## ireney

JamesM said:


> I don't have any personal stories, but I have heard of a few sources of misunderstanding.
> 
> I have heard that raised eyebrows in Greece mean "No", and that it is often mistaken by Americans as incredulity or surprise, but the "no" message is never received.  Maybe Ireney can confirm that.
> 
> There is also supposed to be a brief upward nod of the head that also means "no" in Greece, but in the U.S. is a common way for people to greet each other casually if they see each other at a distance.




Ah yes I had forgotten about these two!  Yes, you are right. There's also the moving the head up and down. If it ends up up it's "no", if it ends up down it's "yes". However if it goes i.e down and then comes straight (which seem to some as an upward movement when it's really just the head getting back in straight line) it's yes and the opposite is "not" . My boyfriend says that we're crazy but then he doesn't understand why " *;* " is a question mark in Greek either so raspberries to him


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## Brioche

Victoria32 said:


> I don't know if it was the government that made that decision - I do know I am extremely bad at deaf manual languages! (I am ambidextrous, which I think is the problem.)
> 
> We have the NZ deaf manual alphabet on the kitchen cupboard door so we can learn it, because my son is a nursing student and may need it.


 
According to the Wikipedia article on NZ Sign Language, the manual alphabet in NZ is the same two-handed one that is used in UK and Australia.

It also says that NZ Sign Language, Auslan and British Sign Language have a common parent language, and are effectively dialects of one language.


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## Victoria32

Brioche said:


> According to the Wikipedia article on NZ Sign Language, the manual alphabet in NZ is the same two-handed one that is used in UK and Australia.
> 
> It also says that NZ Sign Language, Auslan and British Sign Language have a common parent language, and are effectively dialects of one language.


Which is good, because back in 2000 when I was studying these issues, there were greater differences.


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## zebedee

Poetic Device said:


> No no no no!!!! I'm so sorry. I should have been more clear! All of the fingers are streached out, not folded under. I only said the thing about the middle finger as a reference of how to position the hands. Basically, Tony had it right. They do use it in football (either one, I think) and other sports. Whether or not it originated from there I wouldn't be able to tell you. This is so wierd that you guys are saying otherwise. I guess she just wanted to win the argument that badly.
> 
> In any event, Aside my screw-up.  My question still stays the same. * Has anyone made a hand gesture to another from a different culture/background to have it be misinterpreted?*



Oh right! I got mislaid by the middle finger part of the explanation and thought it was a specific middle finger action which is offensive in GB. But the normal time-out gesture isn't at all offensive and is generally well understood in Britain, so your friend might just have been looking for a way to finish the argument.

As for misunderstanding cultural gestures, some Spanish people (a minority luckily for me) wave goodbye by holding their hand up with the palm facing them and opening and closing it. To me this gesture looks like a beckoning gesture saying "Come here!" There've been a few times when I've been walking away waving and smiling happily, seen this gesture and gone back thinking they were calling me back to say something they'd forgotten! Quite embarrassing...


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## Nunty

Here in Israel, we often point to something using the extended middle finger and an upturned palm. I had to unlearn that *very* quickly when my family moved to the US when I was a kid! Since I've been back (since '83) it seems that this gesture is used less. Spread of American "culture"?


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## Poetic Device

Nun-Translator said:


> Here in Israel, we often point to something using the extended middle finger and an upturned palm. I had to unlearn that *very* quickly when my family moved to the US when I was a kid! Since I've been back (since '83) it seems that this gesture is used less. Spread of American "culture"?


Is that what that is?!  I had a co-worker that did this and he was straight from Isreal (BTW, if all the guys were as attractive as he was, I understand why you moved back)and he would always do that.  I just thought it was a way to get away with giving people the middle finger.


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## Nunty

Yup, Poetic Device. Your co-worker was innocent.


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## Poetic Device

I can never remember.  What is that story with someone going into some place and making the U.S.A. sign for okay?


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## fenixpollo

Supposedly, Nixon got off the plane in South America flashing the OK sign -- which resembles the f*** you sign that is common in much of Latin America.


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## Alicky

fenixpollo said:


> Supposedly, Nixon got off the plane in South America flashing the OK sign -- which resembles the f*** you sign that is common in much of Latin America.


 
Oh my...
Yes, it does resemble the f... sign.
I can explain to you how hard I'm laughing right now. But this is a good example. You can't be too careful when making hand-gestures. And if you are a public figure this becomes extremely important.


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## Sorcha

I have come across a huge number of these, the ok sign in France means zero, as in something that is not cool. A spaniard i know had a close encounter in London asking for two beers (like the inverted peace sign), Sri lankans and Indians have that side to side head thing when showing respect (found that one quite confusing). i also have come across a number of interesting sounds that dont exist in English, most of them are Italian-like the one for  Italians saying no, which in to me means 'I disaprove'. Funny the differences you find!


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## kruthskins

Sofia29 said:


> It happened to me once, talking to a guy from Spain who had lived in Italy for some time.
> 
> He asked me something and I didn't know the answer... I made the Argentine "I don't know" gesture.  He thought I was saying I didn't care. He confused it with the Italian "me ne frego" gesture: http://italian.about.com/library/nosearch/blgestures026.htm.


 
I would interpret the Argentine "I don't know" sign as "f*** off." I'm not sure if other Americans would see it that way though. I remember being told that the sign means "f*** off" in American Sign Language.


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## Giorgio Lontano

ireney said:


> http://argoul.blog.lemonde.fr/argoul/images/greenspan_1.jpg I got that from English wikipedia's article on moutza. Mr Alan Greenspan seems to be giving a moutza to all of us


 
If than hand's middle finger was pointing at me I'd be rather insulted, since he'd be messing with my mother... 



kruthskins said:


> I would interpret the Argentine "I don't know" sign as "f*** off." I'm not sure if other Americans would see it that way though. I remember being told that the sign means "f*** off" in American Sign Language.


 
In my case, that sign would mean I don give a sh...

A hand gesture that could very well be misinterpreted around here is the one they use in Brazil for good luck (like this). It has a variety of obscene meanings, depending on the way you move your arm while doing it. 

Regards.


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## gotitadeleche

Giorgio Lontano said:


> A hand gesture that could very well be misinterpreted around here is the one they use in Brazil for good luck (like this). It has a variety of obscene meanings, depending on the way you move your arm while doing it.



And to me that gesture is part of a game you play with young children. You hook your index finger and second finger on either side of the child's nose, and when you draw your hand back you put your thumb between those two fingers (as in the picture in the link), and tell the child you have his/her nose. After some teasing, you give the child's nose back by doing the action in reverse.


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## Lugubert

Dubya Bush has been seen making what not only many Europeans interpret as the sign of the Devil('s horns). It was supposed to refer to a Texas football (?) team.


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## kruthskins

Lugubert said:


> Dubya Bush has been seen making what not only many Europeans interpret as the sign of the Devil('s horns). It was supposed to refer to a Texas football (?) team.


 
The sign actually refers to my university, the University of Texas. Our mascot is a longhorn (a type of cattle from Texas.) It is supposed to look like the animal's horns.


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## rolmich

In Israel, when you touch your own face with your right forefinger (index) just under your right eye, it means _I don't swallow this/tell this to someone else._
I know that in France, it is used in the same way, eventually preceded by the expression _Mon oeil !_
Do you have in your own culture this kind of hand gesture or others ?


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## mirx

rolmich said:


> In Israel, when you touch your own face with your right forefinger (index) just under your right eye, it means _I don't swallow this/tell this to someone else._
> I know that in France, it is used in the same way, eventually preceded by the expression _Mon oeil !_
> Do you have in your own culture this kind of hand gesture or others ?


 
Yes, we have many. Look at this old thread where this topic was discussed.


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## Lopes

Here this gesture means something like "do you get the deeper/alternative meaning of what I just said". We have a facial expression for what you described but that is ofcourse a bit hard to explain


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## ernest_

Yes, here is a bit like what Lopes says, although it's not in widespread usage.
I remember once I had a purely gestural conversation with somebody from across the room.
It went like:
1. I point to him.
2. I make a gesture meaning "writing" (like writing in the air with an invisible pen).
3. I make a gesture meaning "later" or "tomorrow" (index finger extended, moving in circles).
This was correctly interpreted as "do you have an exam tomorrow?", to which the person answered with a nod. Then he pointed at me, with raised eyebrows, meaning "and you?", and I nodded, meaning "me too".


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## rolmich

Benjy said:


> Whilst not strictly a hand gesture one that gets me into trouble at work all the time is the french habit of puffing one's cheeks out and exhaling slowly whilst concentrating on question being asked. You know the one that english speakers tend to do to show that they're pissed off?


 Without knowing that a thread had been opened on the same subject nearly four years ago, I opened mine today under the same name and wish to comment on your remark :
There is a variant in the way you describe this typically french facial expression : _puffing one's cheeks out and exhaling *quickly and noisily*_, means exactly what it means to english speakers :
I am pissed off and trying to restrain myself. (not to blow my top).


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## merquiades

Rolmich, je crois que ce geste (avec le même sens) existe aussi bien en Espagne que dans bien d'autres pays, mais c'est peut-être un peu moins fréquent qu'en France.  Aux États-Unis le geste existe avec un autre sens:  "Attention!  Je te vois bien, toi!  N'ose surtout rien!"  Par contre, on a l'expression "my ass" (mon cul!, mon oeil!) mais que je sache, il n'y a pas de geste qui l'accompagne. Salut!


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## DearPrudence

I just remember that in England I used a lot the French gesture consisting of putting your fist in front of your nose (as if to extend it, sort of) and rotating it a little.
After some time, I finally asked: "But do you understand what I mean by this?" and it turned out that they had absolutely no idea but never said it  Well, at least they were not offended.
(and FYI, it means to be drunk )


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## rolmich

DearPrudence said:


> I just remember that in England I used a lot the French gesture consisting of putting your fist in front of your nose (as if to extend it, sort of) and rotating it a little.
> After some time, I finally asked: "But do you understand what I mean by this?" and it turned out that they had absolutely no idea but never said it  Well, at least they were not offended.
> (and FYI, it means to be drunk )


DP allow me to complete your explanation (fist/nose/rotation) : it is to describe a drunkard (not necessarily yourself). It would be interesting to know if there are other gestures in other cultures to describe the same situation.
Also, I do not understand the logic behind this very french gesture. 
Do you have an explanation ?


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## DearPrudence

Thank you, Rolmich! I wouldn't like people to think that I'm a drunkard myself! 
I used it more like: "Don't drink too much or you'll be ... + gesture".

In French, we say "avoir un coup dans le nez" (literally: to have a blow in the nose) for "to be drunk", because when you're (very? I don't really know) drunk, your nose becomes red. So I think that's a start


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## rolmich

OK DP, but why this rotative movement of the wrist as if to screw one's nose back into place ?
There are many sites for french expressions on the subject (rond comme une queue de pelle/comme un polonais, totalement bourré etc...) I wonder if there are sites for hand gestures ?


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## KaRiNe_Fr

Salut,

Justement, le mouvement du poignet autour du nez fait un « rond », non ? (rond = soûl...)


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## sound shift

On a crowded Istanbul bus, I instinctively raised my thumb to the chap who had just offered his seat to my father. Where I come from, this gesture indicates approval, means "good". I have since read, though, that the raised thumb is "not used" in Turkey. I hope that this is the case and that I didn't give offence.


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## rolmich

Merci Karine.... comme parfois les choses les plus simples nous passent au dessus de la tête !
We have in Israël this gesture of the five fingers of the right hand touching each other and upwards meaning : _give me five minutes/some patience please._
I have heard that in Italy, this gesture is very offensive.
Could someone please confirm ?


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## Sepia

A quite funny gesture is when people from St. Petersburg, Russia, touch their throat with upper side of their forefinger - or to be more exact, snap it and thus hitting the side of their throat. It is used when they talk about alcoholic beverages, when they suggest we go drink something etc. 

Anybody know it? It seems to me to be a very local but ancient St. Petersburg thing.


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## mirx

Sepia said:


> A quite funny gesture is when people from St. Petersburg, Russia, touch their throat with upper side of their forefinger - or to be more exact, snap it and thus hitting the side of their throat. It is used when they talk about alcoholic beverages, when they suggest we go drink something etc.
> 
> Anybody know it? It seems to me to be a very local but ancient St. Petersburg thing.


 
I was going to ask exactly the same thing. My Polish friend says that for them ticking their neck with the index finger means that a person is drunk, that he is drinking, or that he is an alcoholic, or other alcohol related habits. In Mexico the same thing is expressed with a closed fist and then raising the little and thumb fingers, and putting the hand close to the mouth.


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## Dama de noche

mirx said:


> In Mexico the same thing is expressed with a closed fist and then raising the little and thumb fingers, and putting the hand close to the mouth.



In Spain we do the same, but with the hand open.


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## mirx

Dama de noche said:


> In Spain we do the same, but with the hand open.


 
If you open the hand then there's no fingers sticking out, just a palm moving up and down, am I getting it right?


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## Dama de noche

mirx said:


> If you open the hand then there's no fingers sticking out, just a palm moving up and down, am I getting it right?



I meant that the three middle fingers are stretched out and together. We put the thumb near the mouth and then we move it away. We repeat this movement a couple of times.


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## mirx

Dama de noche said:


> I meant that the three middle fingers are stretched out and together. We put the thumb near the mouth and then we move it away. We repeat this movement a couple of times.


 
Yeah, I think we mean tha same thing, our problem is phrasology.


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## rainbow84uk

I've picked up the Spanish 'drink' gesture from living here, but in England the most normal gesture to communicate the same idea is a mime of lifting a pint glass/mug to your mouth (fingers and thumb curved in a C-shape as though you're holding a large glass, moving from chest level towards the mouth).

Other gestures I've picked up here that make no sense at home are the 'qué fuerte!' gesture of loosely shaking one hand up and down in front of you at about chest height, palm facing towards you, to mean "Wow, that's so shocking/surprising/unexpected/scandalous!"

And holding both hands apart somewhere between waist and chest height, palms towards you and fingertips bunched together, then rapidly touching and separating your thumb from the rest of your fingers a couple of times. This means "lots and lots", although it seems to be used most often when talking about how busy/full a place was etc. _La discoteca estaba _(+gesture) means "The club was absolutely packed".


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## Anna_Barcelona

rainbow84uk said:


> And holding both hands apart somewhere between waist and chest height, palms towards you and fingertips bunched together, then rapidly touching and separating your thumb from the rest of your fingers a couple of times. This means "lots and lots", although it seems to be used most often when talking about how busy/full a place was etc. _La discoteca estaba _(+gesture) means "The club was absolutely packed".


 
I was in Syria a few years ago and, being Spanish myself, I was amazed to find out that this same gesture - but without separating your fingers - meant "wait!" xD.


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## oscarlami

Anna_Barcelona said:


> I was in Syria a few years ago and, being Spanish myself, I was amazed to find out that this same gesture - but without separating your fingers - meant "wait!" xD.



Yes, I´ve experienced the same in Qatar, but the actual gesture for "wait" doesn´t include the opening and closing of the fingers. Also it is only done with one hand, not with the two hands at the same time.
The gesture is more that of the argentinians when they say "boludo!", i.e palm up, fingertips together and moving the hand up and down as they speak. 

I was taking it as an insult for some time, maybe because I used to see it when driving around in the middle of chaotic traffic.
It´s, as you say, not an insult, but a gesture of "be patient" or "wait".

I think the gesture is common in the middle east.


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## slowik

I have a question about the video to the song called "Ai se eu te pego!" by a Brazilian singer called Michel Telo (here is a link). The women there make a specific hand gesture a lot: they wave their hands at their faces as if they were hot or about to swoon. Is it a Brazilian or South American gesture or is it just a part of the video (there is a choreography that the public does)?


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## das brennende Gespenst

I once had a class of half Asian students (mostly Korean) and half South American (mostly Brazilian with a few Colombians). I paired them up for a miming game and got the Koreans to mime "money" to the Brazilians. What means "money" in Korea means "anus" in South America. Half of my class were completely scandalised and the other half were confused. Hilarious!


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## Youngfun

I speak Chinese with Italian gestures...


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## anaczz

Sepia said:


> A quite funny gesture is when people from St. Petersburg, Russia, touch their throat with upper side of their forefinger - or to be more exact, snap it and thus hitting the side of their throat. It is used when they talk about alcoholic beverages, when they suggest we go drink something etc.
> Anybody know it? It seems to me to be a very local but ancient St. Petersburg thing.


I saw it in the Black Sea region, as well. I thougth it was a russian gesture.




slowik said:


> I have a question about the video to the song called "Ai se eu te pego!" by a Brazilian singer called Michel Telo (here is a link). The women there make a specific hand gesture a lot: they wave their hands at their faces as if they were hot or about to swoon. Is it a Brazilian or South American gesture or is it just a part of the video (there is a choreography that the public does)?


 You made me see that video!  ()
This is a gesture used when you are feeling heat (in a hot weather) and, for extension used when you're feeling hot (aroused). In this video it should be like a choreography that the audience is expected to do in the shows.


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## Vanda

slowik said:


> I have a question about the video to the song called "Ai se eu te pego!" by a Brazilian singer called Michel Telo (here is a link). The women there make a specific hand gesture a lot: they wave their hands at their faces as if they were hot or about to swoon. Is it a Brazilian or South American gesture or is it just a part of the video (there is a choreography that the public does)?


MY niece told me it is the same gesture we do when we are hot. I thought it could be another thing in the song, but apparently no.


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## Sepia

anaczz said:


> I saw it in the Black Sea region, as well. I thougth it was a russian gesture.
> 
> 
> 
> ..! ()
> ...




At least the story that goes with it is St. Petersburg folklore. However I have met a good deal of non-St. Petersburg Russians and people who have travelled a lot in Russia woh don't know that gesture.


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## Youngfun

Vanda said:


> MY niece told me it is the same gesture we do when we are hot. I thought it could be another thing in the song, but apparently no.



Couldn't be the double meaning of hot? Hot weather and hot girl?
I think in Brasil quente has the same double meaning as in English.


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## Outsider

Youngfun said:


> Couldn't be the double meaning of hot? Hot weather and hot girl?


Or that the girls find the singer hot.


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