# Ladies covering their heads



## prowlerxpla

In Italy from 1930 to 1960 in most places, expecially in small town, was considered right and proper for ladies (over 20 years old) to cover theyr head.
Does this behaviour exist, now and in the past, in other countries?
Of course in islamic countries ladies cover more than head, how is now allowed in these countries an uncovered head woman??


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## Frank78

Some ladies did it in Germany, too and older women still do. I think it was most popular  in the same time period as in Italy. I have been associating this with being a housewife, it´s something typical for them.


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## Cabeza tuna

I never see that here, I think is very strange :-s


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## sureño

Cabeza tuna said:


> I never see that here, I think is very strange :-s


It indeed exists in this land too. I’m sure it’s not strange in Chile either. 
You can see it in any church, where old women still use to cover their head to assist to the mass. 
Cabeza, se les llama en español “mantillas”. Estoy seguro que muchas mujeres las usan en tu país también .


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## Metzaka

They are still used in Mexico by older ladies. We called them 'velos' (veils). They are worn to mass and/or funerals.


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## emm1366

I have a picture of my mother's wedding wearing a hat covering her head and face in 1950


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## piraña utria

prowlerxpla said:


> In Italy from 1930 to 1960 in most places, expecially in small town, was considered right and proper for ladies (over 20 years old) to cover theyr head.
> Does this behaviour exist, now and in the past, in other countries?
> Of course in islamic countries ladies cover more than head, how is now allowed in these countries an uncovered head woman??


 
Hi.

I've noticed that this sort of vail is currently used by the lucky ladies who have the chance to have a close encounter with The Pope.


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## Chaska Ñawi

Up into the 50's Canadian women wore hats when they went out in public.  By the 60's this was only done at formal occasions, and by the 70's hats were gone forever as formal attire.

I remember a blistering cartoon in a Catholic catechism about women who were too cheap to buy hats, and wore kleenex on their heads instead when they entered the church.  It must have been a figment of a fertile clerical imagination, because I've never encountered such a thing in my life.


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## mirx

Now, in México as Trauductora pointed out, veils or "cloths over their heads" are worn only by very old women to go to funerals or a special ocassion in the Catholic church.

People who have already commented. Were these clothes worn only by Catholic women or also by members of other religions?


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## Cath.S.

It used to be common for old women in France a few decades ago, and alot of women wore headscarves to church.
Now blue rinses or bright red dyes with blonde streaks, with a bit of pinkish skull skin - barely - visible seem to be more in favor. Sigh.


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## ernest_

I think it was common in Europe when most people were living in the countryside and worked in agriculture. See for example, this painting by Millet:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Millet_Gleaners.jpg


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## federicoft

piraña utria said:


> I've noticed that this sort of veil is currently used by the lucky ladies who have the chance to have a close encounter with The Pope.



Yes, when attending a papal audience is still customary for women to cover their heads.


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## jinti

In the US, I'd say it depends on your religion, not on US culture in general.

For instance, I wear a headcovering for religious reasons, and so do a number of other Conservative Quakers here in the US. I have met only one Liberal Quaker who covered. There are quite a few Amish, Old Order Mennonite, and Brethren women where I'm from originally (Pennsylvania); they also cover. Where I currently live (New York City), there are a lot of Orthodox Jewish women who cover after marriage, and there are also a lot of Muslim women who wear the hijab.

But we are all bucking mainstream US culture by covering our heads.


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## Chaska Ñawi

I'm suddenly curious - in the cases of head-covering mentioned so far, do the men in these groups also cover their heads?


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## mirx

Chaska Ñawi said:


> I'm suddenly curious - in the cases of head-covering mentioned so far, do the men in these groups also cover their heads?


 

In Mexico - or should I say RURAL Mexico- it was the other way around, men normally wore sombreros and in effect they will uncover their heads while passing or entering a church, also when in front of a Lady, their boss or someone who they felt deserved an extra show of respect.


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## cubaMania

In the Christian bible in the book of Corinthians there is some basis for the notion that in church men should uncover their heads and women should cover theirs.
Corinthians 11:4-6


> 4 Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoreth his head.
> 
> 5 But every woman praying or prophesying with her head unveiled dishonoreth her head; for it is one and the same thing as if she were shaven.
> 6 For if a woman is not veiled, let her also be shorn: but if it is a shame to a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be veiled.


Corintios 11:4-6


> 4 Todo hombre que cubre su cabeza mientras ora o profetiza, deshonra su cabeza.
> 
> 5 Pero toda mujer que tiene la cabeza descubierta mientras ora o profetiza, deshonra su cabeza; porque se hace una con la que está rapada.
> 6 Porque si la mujer no se cubre la cabeza, que también se corte el cabello; pero si es deshonroso para la mujer cortarse el cabello, o raparse, que se cubra.


I can attest that some decades ago, Catholic women wore hats, scarves, veils, mantillas on their heads whenever entering church, and if they happened to enter a church unprepared they would put on top of their heads whatever was at hand--a handkerchief, a piece of kleenex, a scrap of cloth. (And the men would remove their hats to enter church.)


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## Traduita

You still see that with old women in Greece, mainly in the rural areas. But I think like a hundred years ago (at the least) it was unacceptable for a woman not to cover her head when going out of the house, unless she wanted to be considered of dubious reputation. At least in traditional settings, in the cities and upper-class environment it might be different.


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## jinti

Chaska Ñawi said:


> I'm suddenly curious - in the cases of head-covering mentioned so far, do the men in these groups also cover their heads?


 Among plain Conservative Friends, men usually do, although they will remove their hats in meeting while they or someone else offers a prayer.  Otherwise, the hats stay on during meeting and a lot of the time outside of meeting (but there are no hard and fast rules about it).  I think the same goes for Amish and Old Order Mennonite men, but I can't say for sure. 

Orthodox and ultra-orthodox Jewish men wear a yarmulke and when outside often a hat over it.


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## jazyk

I see this a lot with older women in the Czech Republic and Poland. In Brazil women members of the Congregação Cristã no Brasil do that in church. I think I saw on TV that this was customary in Brazil in the Catholic Church until the 50's or 60's.


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## fragile1

Now, when we became a global village everything infitrates - cultra, religions, East and West styles, behaviour, manners, meanings,  etc.
What I know about cover a head is taht in top of our head there is a crown chakra, known as The Tenth Gate, and I think it has more words to name it. If you cover your head, and doesn't matter if you are man or woman, is to protect your crown chakra, or other words, an energy cumulated in the crown chakra.
That's why teachers, man a woman, in kundalini yoga use turbans to cover their heads, and students vover their heads also. 
Teachers of kundalini yoga live in many countries, but the main idea became from East.


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## rmawhorter

As already mentioned different conservative Christian groups around the world expect woman to wear head coverings, some require it only in church while others expect them to always be worn. This tradition is considered a sign of submission to male leadership and therefore men do not do this. The headdress worn by nuns is actually related to this tradition. Wikipedia has an interesting article on veils for more information.


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## Orpington

In the UK I see quite a few old ladies wearing headscarves, especially when it's raining. However I don't think this is a religious thing, more just practicality. It could be a remnant of religious practice though.

Recently large scarves have become fashionable here, and I often see teenage girls and younger women wearing them as a headscarf if they are caught in the rain.


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## sokol

prowlerxpla said:


> In Italy from 1930 to 1960 in most places, expecially in small town, was considered right and proper for ladies (over 20 years old) to cover theyr head.





ernest_ said:


> I think it was common in Europe when most people were living in the countryside and worked in agriculture. See for example, this painting by Millet:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Millet_Gleaners.jpg



Indeed it was.

Also in Austria: it was nothing out of the ordinary at all for women to cover their head with a headscarf - in rural regions up to recent times even (see here in German, stating that in Austria, or Tyrol here specifically, a headscarf was not uncommon until recent times, and I know from personal experience that the same is true for rural Upper Austria).

This headscarf however was different from the Muslim one - it only covers the neck, and some don't even cover the neck (you could tie the ends together at the back).
Now this traditional headscarf was (and still is) part of the so-called "Tracht" (= the festival clothes worn in church).
This headscarf was (and still is) also used as farmer's work wear because it is simply practical (it protects the hair from hay and dust, and the smell of dung, not to forget) - if used at work the ends of the scarf usually are tied at the back for practical reasons, so that the neck won't be covered.

Things have changed though, and in cities as well as for the younger generation (and non-farmers) in rural regions the headscarf, if worn at all, is nothing but a fashion accessoire.
This was not so at least in rural areas up to the end of the 20th century. And even though in cities headscarfs were not as popular as they were in the countryside city ladies liked to wear hats: so some of them too used to cover their hair. (And lady hats too have become uncommon in our modern times, they are just out of fashion as we are used to say nowadays.)

Men by the way also used to cover their heads - with hats. Hatters however do not sell nearly enough as many hats as they used to. Interestingly, again most hat buyers (and wearers), as far as I can tell, live in rural regions. But the only people who still think they _have _to have a hat are hunters - for them a hat is obligatory.


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## Slavianophil

In Russia all women and girls cover their heads when they enter a church. It is considered extremely bad manners for a woman to be in church bare-headed. Out of church it is only nuns or demonstratively pious women who always cover their heads. (Men, of course, are required to take off whatever headgear they might be wearing when they cross a church threshold).

There are also Muslims in Russia, so many but not all Muslim women wear headscarves all the time. And almost all Gypsy women that I see here also wear headscarves.

Of course, about a hundred years ago it was considered to be improper for a married woman to leave home without a headscarf or a hat (peasant and working class women wore headscarves, upper class ones preferred hats).


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## sokol

Slavianophil said:


> In Russia all women and girls cover their heads when they enter a church. It is considered extremely bad manners for a woman to be in church bare-headed. Out of church it is only nuns or demonstratively pious women who always cover their heads. (Men, of course, are required to take off whatever headgear they might be wearing when they cross a church threshold).


This was (I think) also the case in Austria, but I guess the times when it was considered bad manners not to wear a headscarf at all in Church date back to the 19th century here, or early 20th century at most. This wasn't the case anymore in the 1960ies and 70ies.

(And yes, also in Catholic Churches men are supposed to take of their hat, or whatever headgear they wear - be it a cap or whatever, and this rule still applies.)


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## ajo fresco

Chaska Ñawi said:


> I remember a blistering cartoon in a Catholic catechism about women who were too cheap to buy hats, and wore kleenex on their heads instead when they entered the church.  It must have been a figment of a fertile clerical imagination, because I've never encountered such a thing in my life.



I'm embarrassed to admit this is true! 

When I was little, the girls were supposed to wear "chapel veils" (a small square of white lace that was attached to the top of one's head with a bobby pin) to Mass.

Whenever I "lost" mine (which happened from time to time because I didn't like wearing it), my mother used to pin a Kleenex to my head! 

It was a very common practice, at least in my parish.  The nuns always had extra Kleenex and bobby pins handy, in case the parents forgot to bring some.


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## Chtipays

In the country side in Mexico is common to see ladies wearing a "rebozo" a shawl that, depending on the weather, can cover their heads and shoulders or only their shoulders. When it is cold in here (France) and I wear a shawl I feel like covering my head with it, but there is so much noise about Muslim women covering their heads that I prefer not to do it 
But I think that they way the shawl is worn in country side Mexico depends on the weather not on the age, they cover their heads when is cold, but also to protect themselves from the burning sun. On the other hand you can also see the head covering in church, but only done by rural or older women. In large cities is less common.


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## Etcetera

cubaMania said:


> I can attest that some decades ago, Catholic women wore hats, scarves, veils, mantillas on their heads whenever entering church, and if they happened to enter a church unprepared they would put on top of their heads whatever was at hand--a handkerchief, a piece of kleenex, a scrap of cloth. (And the men would remove their hats to enter church.)


The Russian Orthodox Church insists on women wearing scarves on their heads when in church, and entering an Orthodox church without a charf, or a hat, or just anything on your head would be considered a serious breach (if you're female, of course). The Roman Catholic Church is far more loyal to us females, but in the church I attend there is a notice appendant to the door asking men to remove their hats when entering the church. 

As for covering your head outdoors, it seems that there is no longer any general rule. Well, in winter, most people would cover their head, obviously; in summer, many are wearing caps or straw hats or bonnets, but it depends on the lady's preference. I, for example, prefer not to wear anything - my hair are enough to keep my head warm.


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## Bashti

prowlerxpla said:


> In Italy from 1930 to 1960 in most places, expecially in small town, was considered right and proper for ladies (over 20 years old) to cover theyr head.
> Does this behaviour exist, now and in the past, in other countries?
> Of course in islamic countries ladies cover more than head, how is now allowed in these countries an uncovered head woman??



What do you mean by covering their heads? Using a hat, a veil or a scarf?


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## watercanyon

When I was growing up in the 1950s and 60s we girls and ladies wore hats at Easter and sometimes other Sundays to go to Protestant church services. The Catholic girls and ladies always wore hats or lace mantillas.  This was in the midwest and southwestern parts of the US.  

My first husband was from Atlanta, Georgia.  We got married in 1973 and when I went to visit his mother so she and her sister could give me a wedding shower, my mother reminded me to wear a dress (NOT slacks), high heel shoes, and have a pair of white gloves.  When we were ready to leave for my aunt's house, my mother in law asked if I had forgotten my hat, and then started to fuss about finding me one that would go with my dress from her collection, and then finally decided that it would be OK if I went without a hat (for a party that was IN someone's house).  This seemed very strange to me, but New Mexico is much less formal than parts of the south eastern part of our country.

We always took a mantilla or nice cloth handkerchief when traveling to visit historical places, and covered our heads when entering historical Catholic churches out of respect.  The Catholic ladies don't seem to cover their heads much anymore here, but when I travel to Guatemala or central America I still carry a mantilla just in case I need it.

Our men, in the 50s - 70s, used to remove their hats when they came indoors, anywhere, but generally wear their hats inside now, except for church and, sometimes, for meals.  A group I attend closes each meeting with prayer, and the men generally remove their hats during the prayer.

Our military has some different rules, the Navy always removed their hats indoors, except for specific ceremonies and weddings.  Some of the other services keep their hats on indoors, except for meeting with the commanding officers or other ranking officials.  Hats are always removed during prayers.


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## be.010

prowlerxpla said:


> Of course in islamic countries ladies cover more than head, how is now allowed in these countries an uncovered head woman??


 
Well, that varies according to the law of the country itself, and to local customs... You know, in some Islamic countries like Saudi Arabia and Iran, a woman cannot walk in the street without a hijab. In some other coutries like Tunisia, where also Islam is the major religion, a woman cannot enter the university with a hijab on her head!!
In other moderate coutries, it also varies, but probably no less than 50% of Sunni and Shia Muslim women wear hijab...
For instance, in the public university of Damascus (Syria), you could find plenty of 60% of all women wearing the hijab... Though only 90% of all women are Muslims, and only about 75% belong to sects that obligate women to wear hijab...
In these countries, most people don't feel anything about this, except that they'd expect that a woman without a hijab is just possibly less religious than those with it, or is she Christian... 30 years ago women without a hijab counted even MORE than now, relatively... So it sounds very natural to wear it or not...
By the way, in Islam, a woman has to cover all her hair (so that men who are not of her relatives can't see it). A man doesn't have to cover his head, but he can put anything on his head if he wants to... (traditionally, some men cover their heads with caps or something while they are in the mosque)...


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## manon33

As a Roman Catholic child in the 1960s in England I and my sister were expected to cover our heads in church. We were told it was so that the men/boys were not distracted by our hair.


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## Nanon

sokol said:


> This was (I think) also the case in Austria, but I guess the times when it was considered bad manners not to wear a headscarf at all in Church date back to the 19th century here, or early 20th century at most. This wasn't the case anymore in the 1960ies and 70ies.


 
Woaow. France must be backwards then. I have a picture of my mum and her in-laws that was taken on a Sunday morning in the early 60's. Everybody is going to (RC) mass. All women wear scarves.
OK, on the one hand, I confess D) that my family was pretty traditional, and on the other hand, I doubt the same photo of my mum, grandmother and aunts wearing scarves could have been taken in the '70s.


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## sokol

Nanon said:


> Woaow. France must be backwards then. I have a picture of my mum and her in-laws that was taken on a Sunday morning in the early 60's. Everybody is going to (RC) mass. All women wear scarves.


Oh but I was referring to times when it was (probably?) _obligatory _to wear a headscarf at Roman Catholic mass (while Slavianophil said above that this still is "almost" obligatory in Russia) - rest assured that in Austria it wouldn't have been significantly (if at all) different from France, scarves were pretty common then.

This has radically changed though, and nowadays only few women and girls cover their head at mass - and if they do they use fashionable scarves (except for the elder generation who partly still use traditional ones).


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## Nanon

Didn't you write this about Austria?


sokol said:


> This wasn't the case anymore in the 1960ies and 70ies.


OK. Just slightly backwards...


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## sokol

Nanon said:


> Didn't you write this about Austria?
> 
> OK. Just slightly backwards...


I did.  And meant with it that it wasn't _obligatory _to wear scarves in (RC) church in Austria in the 60ies and 70ies; I do know that my mother liked to wear one when going to church then (well actually I can't remember the 60ies), but she didn't when it was too hot for that: so it wasn't obligatory.

(And I grew up in a region which, then, was almost a 100 % Roman Catholic, and quite devout.)

Seems I've caused some confusion, sorry for that.


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## Pedro y La Torre

Etcetera said:


> The Roman Catholic Church is far more loyal to us females



That's certainly a novel way of looking at it.

As for the headscarves, in Ireland it's generally just women over the age of 70 who would wear them. Perhaps in the past women were required to wear them while going to church but certainly not today.


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## Epilio

In Spain one still can see elder women wearing a veil, normally in rural areas. There I suppose they attend Church with their veils put on, but in urban areas none woman use it and nobody takes offense.


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## Outlandish

I'm aware that there is a strong movement among Christian circles which encourage Christian women to cover there heads. I saw many websites promoting this and offering variant methods for doing so.

A couple of years ago, I saw a documentary on some Christian American and European college girls who decided to cover their heads. They thought it is more becoming and so right.


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## Pedro y La Torre

Outlandish said:


> I'm aware that there is a strong movement among Christian circles which encourage Christian women to cover there heads. I saw many websites promoting this and offering variant methods for doing so.
> 
> A couple of years ago, I saw a documentary on some Christian American and European college girls who decided to cover their heads. They thought it is more becoming and so right.



The only schools where this might happen would be in fundamentalist Christian institutions who, incidentally, teach that man lived with dinosaurs and the like. Could you provide a link or some evidence to back up this claim? Quite frankly I find such a move, if true, disturbing.


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## SDLX Master

To reply to the main thread, women do not cover their heads anymore as they used to do some 30 years ago or before. Ladies these days are totally free to add or remove accessories to their attire.



Chaska Ñawi said:


> I'm suddenly curious - in the cases of head-covering mentioned so far, do the men in these groups also cover their heads?


The picture for us men is similar to the ladies'. None of us are compelled to cover our bald or balding heads, but for some reason, most men tend to fly off the handle when alopecia comes their way (I am one of them ) and they do their best to cover the empty spots.


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## jinti

Pedro y La Torre said:


> The only schools where this might happen would be in fundamentalist Christian institutions who, incidentally, teach that man lived with dinosaurs and the like. Could you provide a link or some evidence to back up this claim? Quite frankly I find such a move, if true, disturbing.



I don't think Outlandish was saying that the colleges _required _women to cover, only that some students decided on their own to do so.  

I'm one of them (though I'm well beyond college age now ).  And while I'm Christian, I'm not fundamentalist, nor do I believe that dinosaurs and man lived together, nor did I attend a college that taught that.  Headcovering does not necessarily go hand in hand with those beliefs....


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## Forero

Nuns' wimpels, which now set nuns apart, were originally worn for modesty's sake, so that nuns would not draw attention to themselves.

I remember in the 1950s my mother only wore a hat on Easter or Christmas, but my grandmother (Southern Baptist, Protestant) wore a hat when she went to church and any time she went downtown. And she wore a different hat for working in her garden.

My brothers and I stayed with our grandparents for a couple of weeks each summer, and one night I saw my grandmother walk down the hall in her silk nightgown with her hair down. I had never seen all her hair before, and it was very long, down to her thighs, and I discovered my grandmother was a very beautiful woman, but very modest.

Among Quakers, hats have a special significance. The traditional black hats came from a time and place where all men wore hats and black ones were the least likely to draw attention. More important to them than the plain dress, was plain speech, no fancy talk or weasel words, no calling one person _you_ (the singular was _thee_), etc. Honesty and equality of humankind were, and still are, very important to their philosophy.

Less important, but still part of the tradition, is equality of earthly times and places. In other words, the meetinghouse (church) is like any other earthly place and First Day (Sunday) is like any other day, what is right or wrong being eternal.

All this just to give the background behind early Friends' (Quakers) refusal to do "hat honor", removing one's hat in the presence of a person of higher social status. In other words, Quakers kept their hats on even in front of a judge or a senator. This offended some folks, but it became quite a tradition among Friends never to remove one's hat.


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## Pedro y La Torre

jinti said:


> I don't think Outlandish was saying that the colleges _required _women to cover, only that some students decided on their own to do so.



I didn't either. I understood him to be saying that it was something that was encouraged in certain "Christian" circles/institutions. Perhaps not.



jinti said:


> I'm one of them (though I'm well beyond college age now ).  And while I'm Christian, I'm not fundamentalist, nor do I believe that dinosaurs and man lived together, nor did I attend a college that taught that.  Headcovering does not necessarily go hand in hand with those beliefs....



What you wear is obviously your own business. However, what kind of covering are we talking about here? A full length veil? A scarf? I'm unsure as to the exact type of covering Outlandish was alluding to.

While it's not uncommon to see elderly women wearing some sort of a headcovering, amongst younger women it certainly is (at least in France and Ireland). If it's becoming a trend in certain Christian circles, I would find it worrying - we see enough abuse of women's rights around the world without them being "encouraged" to engage in this sort of thing.


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## jinti

Pedro y La Torre said:


> I didn't either. I understood him to be saying that it was something that was encouraged in certain "Christian" circles/institutions. Perhaps not.
> 
> I guess we'll have to wait for him to come back and clarify.
> 
> What you wear is obviously your own business. However, what kind of covering are we talking about here? A full length veil? A scarf? I'm unsure as to the exact type of covering Outlandish was alluding to.
> 
> I can't say for sure what Outlandish was referring to either, but typical Christian coverings in the US are generally some variety of veil (like this one) or kapp/bonnet (like this or this, for instance).
> 
> 
> While it's not uncommon to see elderly women wearing some sort of a headcovering, amongst younger women it certainly is (at least in France and Ireland). If it's becoming a trend in certain Christian circles, I would find it worrying - we see enough abuse of women's rights around the world without them being "encouraged" to engage in this sort of thing.
> 
> Well, now, let's not equate covering with the abuse of women's rights.
> 
> I know quite a few Christian women who cover, and we're not forced into it, nor do we view it negatively.
> 
> In fact, I remember a conversation with a young Muslim woman some time ago here in New York City.  She was complaining to me about repeatedly being asked why she wore "that thing" (her hijab).  She said, "How do I tell them it's a matter of faith?"  And I said, "Like that, I guess."  It's the best answer I know.


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## watercanyon

This information about Christian women being encouraged to cover their heads today made me do a search - and I came up with some very interesting sites, including this one:  http://www.biblicalresearchreports.com/headcovering-today.php

I know that the Amish and Mennonite women, who practice a very traditional form of Christianity, still wear caps and/or bonnets at all times.


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## Outlandish

When I previously said that I saw on TV college girls covering their head, I meant ordinary nonpartisan Christian girls. They simply thought it proper for a girl to cover her head and dress modestly. They felt secure and protected with it.



One of the most important sites about Christian head covering:
http://www.fisheaters.com/theveil.htm


​Also:
http://catholichijabi.wordpress.com/category/christian-headcover/


various Jewish scarf ties:
http://www.tznius.com/cgi-bin/tying.pl


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## Pedro y La Torre

Outlandish said:


> When I previously said that I saw on TV college girls covering their head, I meant ordinary nonpartisan Christian girls. They simply thought it proper for a girl to cover her head and dress modestly. They felt secure and protected with it.
> 
> 
> 
> One of the most important sites about Christian head covering:
> http://www.fisheaters.com/theveil.htm
> 
> 
> ​Also:
> http://catholichijabi.wordpress.com/category/christian-headcover/
> 
> 
> various Jewish scarf ties:
> http://www.tznius.com/cgi-bin/tying.pl



The first site is an extremist Catholic site. The second is a blog. The third appears to be a site for Orthodox Jewish women. I don't think any of them can be regarded as "mainstream" in any way.

I can't find any proof that "ordinary nonpartisan girls" are taking to wearing head coverings. When one looks at the basis for the Christian wearing of headcoverings, the injunction in the Bible from St. Paul, to see it as anything other than a clamp down on women's rights takes some work.

That being said, I'm supportive of everyone being allowed to wear what they want if it's _their_ choice but it's almost impossible to separate such a discussion from the increasing diminuation in women's rights around the world.


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## Outlandish

Why say wearing head cover is against women rights?
If a woman wears head cover willingly, so where's the problem?


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## Pedro y La Torre

Outlandish said:


> Why say wearing head cover is against women rights?
> If a woman wears head cover willingly, so where's the problem?



I believe I specifically stated that if women did it _willingl__y_, then I see no problem. I may not particularly like or favour it but it is their decision to make. However, in many parts of the world the wearing of veils is not by choice, it is an obligation imposed by the state or by the expectations of the wider community.

It's for that reason that I stated it is almost impossible to separate this topic from the ever increasing abuse of women's rights around the world.


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## fragile1

[Originally Posted by *Outlandish* 
When I previously said that I saw on TV college girls covering their head, I meant ordinary nonpartisan Christian girls. They simply thought it proper for a girl to cover her head and dress modestly. They felt secure and protected with it.]



I think, it is out of the rules of that forum. this is extremely your opinion. So, in my opinion, not every "Christian" girls or girls from the countries, that supposed to be Christian, cover their heads because of the fashion. In the case, it is for fashion it is their business. Somehow any other reasons, I mean from another countries, are fashion to.


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