# Fare una cazzata



## Farotz

Salve, mi dispiace esordire chiedendo consiglio riguardo espressioni volgari, ma solo oggi, dopo ben 2 anni in Irlanda, mi sono reso conto che la parola "bullshit" non corrisponde pienamente a "cazzata", nel senso che in inglese puoi dire una bullshit, ma non fare una bullshit. Quindi vi chiedo:
Come posso dire: "ho fatto una cazzata"? e per esempio "ho fatto una cazzata  a vendere  la mia auto?" grazie mille


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## Paulfromitaly

Ciao e benvenuto 
Hai controllato sul nostro dizionario?

http://www.wordreference.com/iten/cazzata

It was really stupid/foolish of me to sell the car.


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## Paolo Yogurt

Paulfromitaly said:


> It was really stupid/foolish of me to sell the car.



Per mantenere la connotazione volgare, non sarebbe meglio qualcosa come '_It was so fucking stupid of me to sell the car_'?


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## Farotz

Grazie molte a tutti e due. spero comunque di non dover fare  un uso troppo frequente dell espressione ciao


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## musicaragefororder

arrivo tardi ma arrivo!!

la cazzata nel senso lato che hai descitto si dice "cock-up".  Regge sia il verbo DO che il verbo MAKE.

Si può anche impiegare come verbo per dire di aver sbagliato qualcosa  

es. "I've cocked it up!!"  cioè ho ciccato clamorosamente!!


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## Einstein

"Cock-up" si riferisce più ad una cosa fatta male che non al fatto che l'azione stessa era sbagliata.
Se aggiusto il motore della mia auto e dopo non va, ho fatto un "cock-up". È stata una _cazzata_ non rivolgermi al meccanico.


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## thatgirlinitaly

You could also say "screwed up" ie;

I really screwed up to not go back to the mechanic, etc.


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## musicaragefororder

Leggendo la richiesta originale mi sembrava che si facesse riferimento ad una cosa fatta male e non ad una stupidata detta. 

Sono d'accordo sul fatto che un sinonimo del verbo sia screw-up.  

Anyway Merry Christmas you all and avoid piss-up if you have to drive people home.


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## coeurdenids

Not necessarily as vulgar as "cazzata", but to express frustration, a close translation might be "I really blew it by selling my car".


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## nawal85

Ciao a tutti, 
sto sottotitolando un dialogo in inglese e ad un certo punto l'attrice dice:
" mi sa che ho fatto una cazzata" sottointendendo _ad uscire con lui _
Mi serverebbe un aiuto per trovare un corrispondente colloquiale e che rispetti i tempi della battuta e anche il registro.
Qualcuno può aiutarmi? Io avevo pensato: "I think I'm screwing it up"; ma non mi sento sicurissima.
grazie a tutti!


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## entrapta

Al limite I think I screwed up....(ho sbagliato a chiedergli di uscire) be' è un sottotitolo non devi rispettare il labiale no? meglio se è breve. Attendiamo altre idee


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## ilvecchio

Nawal85 - Una traduzione migliore sarebbe: "I think I have screwed up."


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## fitter.happier

Io direi: _I guess I screwed up._


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## CPA

_I guess I made a boo-boo.
I think I boobed._


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## nawal85

e se fosse: "penso che stia facendo una cazzata" cambierebbe qualcosa?vorrei dare l'idea di istantaneità.Cioè lei sta parlando con questo ragazzo e non è ancora del tutto certa che sia stato un errore. Anche perché più avanti dice proprio:" Sì, ho fatto una cazzata.".Grazie a tutti!


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## Gianfry

_I'm afraid I boobed..._


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## cappuccina

Però, nel contesto di lei e uscire con lui, 'boobed', 'boo-boo' sono troppo informali e, in verità, non fanno molto senso.  Si può dire anche 'I think I fucked up', ma è più forte.


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## Gianfry

nawal85 said:


> e se fosse: "penso che stia facendo una cazzata" cambierebbe qualcosa?vorrei dare l'idea di istantaneità.Cioè lei sta parlando con questo ragazzo e non è ancora del tutto certa che sia stato un errore.


 


cappuccina said:


> Però, nel contesto di lei e uscire con lui, 'boobed', 'boo-boo' sono troppo informali e, in verità, non fanno molto senso.  Si può dire anche 'I think I fucked up', ma è più forte.


I can't argue about "to boo". I quoted from CPA just to stick "I'm afraid" to it 
I was just trying to help nawal on her last doubt...


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## entrapta

Ma secondo me se prima dici _I think I screwed up_ e poi _Yes, I definitely screwed up_...sei più che a posto.


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## rrose17

entrapta said:


> Ma secondo me se prima dici _I think I screwed up_ e poi _Yes, I definitely screwed up_...sei più che a posto.


 

And if you wanted a little less vulgar
 "I think I made a mess of it" "Yes, I really made a mess of things."


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## CPA

Visto il contesto: _I don't think this was a good idea. _British understatement.  (Non oso usare gli smileys, hanno effetti imprevedibili in questa nuova veste di WR.)


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## BristolGirl

Concordo con CPA - perchè screwed up / messed up è molto generico. In questo caso lei pensa di aver fatto una cosa specifica, un preciso errore, cioè di aver sbagliato ad uscire con lui.


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## AlabamaBoy

nawal85 said:


> e se fosse: "penso che stia facendo una cazzata" cambierebbe qualcosa?vorrei dare l'idea di istantaneità.Cioè lei sta parlando con questo ragazzo e non è ancora del tutto certa che sia stato un errore. Anche perché più avanti dice proprio:" Sì, ho fatto una cazzata.".Grazie a tutti!


I think *I am making* a big mistake (going out with you/him.)


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## rafanadal

E' meglio non fare più cazzate in Borsa!
We better quit messing up in the market. 
Does it sound ok?


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## gandolfo

Hi

"It's a good idea not to keep/continue/ messing up/screwing up the stock market" this also keeps the sentence neutral, there's no "we"

"screwing up" is un po' volgare though, but within the context I don't think it's offensive


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## rafanadal

So, you don't say IN the market, you just say "screwing up THE market".
It's strange, it sounds like you are the actor of something that spoils the market and not the one who loses money in the market.
Anyway, you confirm that if somebody screws up the market, they are actually making mistakes buying or selling shares?
Thanks


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## gandolfo

> It's strange, it sounds like you are the actor of something that spoils the market and not the one who loses money in the market.



Well that's what I thought you meant the Italian is not that clear. Can you write a phrase in Italian that is more explicit then

edit
Meanwhile "We better stop messing about with/in the Stock Market (we are losing lots of money)'



> Anyway, you confirm that if somebody screws up the market, they are actually making mistakes buying or selling shares?


 No


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## rafanadal

Yes, this is what I meant, Gandolfo!
E' meglio non fare più cazzate in Borsa!
It's Italian slang meaning "we better quit, stop gambling in the stock market because we're bound to go broke!"
"Fare cazzate" in this context means "to make mistakes" "to mess up".


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## gandolfo

Yes, now I understand Your initial sentence wasn't explicit and also there was no context It could be read as both in translation, there's no active subject for example (we) Also cazzate can be translated into many different phrases in English so again, sorry to push it, context really helps, after all you don't want to incazzare someone with a bad translation do you?

"E' meglio che noi non facciamo più cazzate in Borsa" giusto?


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## California Smith

Fare una cazzata è comunissimo ma sempre volgare. Quindi la traduzione deve essere egualmente volgare. Come minimo tradurrei con to screw up, ma propenderei per to fuck up. Invece espressioni come "questa è una cazzata" o al plurale "queste sono cazzate", si traduce con "this is bullshit" o, un poco più gentile "this is BS". La traduzione di altre espressioni più morigerate, tipo fare stupidaggini, possono essere tradotte con espressioni più tranquille tipo to mess up.


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## chipulukusu

Sono d'accordo, se mi riferisco al fatto di aver fatto una specifica cazzata, allora I screwed up and I fucked up sono del tutto immediati come traduzione. Mi chiedevo se l'espressione _I did shit_, possa essere più adatta per indicare una _serie_ di cazzate, cioè essersi comportato male a lungo con una persona o aver fatto in genere un sacco di cazzate nella vita, tipo:

_I did shit with Lucy
I didshit throughout my life.

_Thank you.


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## rrose17

chipulukusu said:


> Sono d'accordo, se mi riferisco al fatto di aver fatto una specifica cazzata, allora I screwed up and I fucked up sono del tutto immediati come traduzione. Mi chiedevo se l'espressione _I did shit_, possa essere più adatta per indicare una _serie_ di cazzate, cioè essersi comportato male a lungo con una persona o aver fatto in genere un sacco di cazzate nella vita, tipo:
> 
> _I did shit with Lucy
> I didshit throughout my life.
> 
> _Thank you.


Ciao, no sorry to me mean this means something altogether different. It means "I did absolutely nothing with Lucy."


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## GavinW

California Smith said:


> Fare una cazzata è comunissimo ma sempre volgare. Quindi la traduzione deve essere egualmente volgare.



Hi CS, and welcome to WR!
Sorry to blow you down in your first post, but I have to say I don't agree.
This forum, and any decent bilingual reference source, is full of statements to the effect that the threshold in Italian for vulgar is higher than it is for English. That's a huge generalization, of course, but one that makes sense and that is often helpful. This means that a word like "cazzata" will slip below the safety net, or the "rude-word-radar". It means that a corresponding term in English will be milder. 
A concrete example might help. Schiettino (he of Concordia "fame"), said (testualmente) "Ho fatto una cazzata". It has been revealed in court that he said this on the ship's intercom/communications system, to "alert" personnel that he had done something wrong (made a mistake). In fact, he had run the ship aground. Interestingly (for our discussion), the Italian expression actually minimizes the gravity of his "mistake". A similar understatement in English might be, "(Oops,) I made a boo-boo", and in fact I back this as a strong candidate for a suitable translation of the phrase, in a wide range of situations (indeed, this has been suggested earlier in this thread).


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## chipulukusu

rrose17 said:


> Ciao, no sorry to me mean this means something altogether different. It means "I did absolutely nothing with Lucy."



Thank you rrose, I'm realizing that I have always misunderstood this expressions every time I heard them... thank you for shedding light on me!


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## k in the desert

GavinW said:


> Hi CS, and welcome to WR!
> Sorry to blow you down in your first post, but I have to say I don't agree.
> This forum, and any decent bilingual reference source, is full of statements to the effect that the threshold in Italian for vulgar is higher than it is for English. That's a huge generalization, of course, but one that makes sense and that is often helpful. This means that a word like "cazzata" will slip below the safety net, or the "rude-word-radar". It means that a corresponding term in English will be milder.
> A concrete example might help. Schiettino (he of Concordia "fame"), said (testualmente) "Ho fatto una cazzata". It has been revealed in court that he said this on the ship's intercom/communications system, to "alert" personnel that he had done something wrong (made a mistake). In fact, he had run the ship aground. Interestingly (for our discussion), the Italian expression actually minimizes the gravity of his "mistake". A similar understatement in English might be, "(Oops,) I made a boo-boo", and in fact I back this as a strong candidate for a suitable translation of the phrase, in a wide range of situations (indeed, this has been suggested earlier in this thread).



I agree with Gavin's statement and would like to add that many non-native English speakers get the wrong idea as to our use of "foul language" - often through American film and popular music. Depending on the company you keep, you can even go weeks without hearing a 4-letter word. Everyone doesn't swear at the drop of a hat. I think this can be a confusing issue.


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## curiosone

Ciao a tutti!  
I'd like to point out something that many Italians don't seem to understand, about the use of 4-letter words in English: 
_In English, the gesture is less vulgar/taboo than the spoken (or written) word._ 
This is the exact opposite of how Italians seem to see it - where the gesture signifying  vaffanculo is more offensive than the spoken word (I understand it's even illegal, to make the gesture).

Personally I NEVER use the F-word - tho' I might say "screwed up" in informal conversation with friends, or give someone "the finger".


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## GavinW

curiosone said:


> _In English, the gesture is less vulgar/taboo than the spoken (or written) word._



That's a very interesting (and revealing) point. Well said.


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## AlabamaBoy

k in the desert said:


> Everyone doesn't swear at the drop of a hat. I think this can be a confusing issue.


People between 15 and 25 swear a lot for various reasons. Hollywood tries to make their movies appeal to this age group by including a ridiculous amount of swearing, because young people make up a very large portion of the ticket sales. If you are not aware of that, you will think that the use of 4 letter words is very acceptable in English. Hollywood's purpose is not to accurately reflect real life, but to sell tickets.


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## Paulfromitaly

chipulukusu said:


> thank you for shedding light on me!



You shed light on a matter, not on the people who don't understand it


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## chipulukusu

Paulfromitaly said:


> You shed light on matter, not on the people who don't understand it



Thank you Paul, my mistake. I'll remember it!


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## Odysseus54

On the use of profanities , my experience is that in the US it is also a regional thing, as well as a sociolinguistic issue.  New York vs Atlanta, for instance.  In Miami I deal with construction people as well as with architects.  They speak differently.

I would translate Schettino's uttering as " I screwed up ", which, at least in Miami , the southernmost borough of NYC, is pretty mild.


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## Paulfromitaly

Odysseus54 said:


> in the US it is also a regional thing, as well as a sociolinguistic issue.



Just like in any other country


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## Odysseus54

Paulfromitaly said:


> Just like in any other country



  Seriously, though, my impression is that , whereas in Italy the use of profanity is mostly driven by social/age group factors, regionalism being a lexical etc variable, not so much a variable in how often profanities are used, in the US you do have a more restrained use of profanities in the Bible Belt.

It's a personal impression. It'd be interesting to see what others think about this.  As well as about the notion that in Italy you don't have areas where profanities are used significantly less.


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## rafanadal

Interesting thread.
Sentences such as "ho fatto una cazzata" or "mi fanno il culo se non consegno il lavoro per tempo" or "è andato tutto a puttane" are so ordinary in Italy and commonly used at any level, any social class, age and education. No doubt about that. I hear them all the time when I speak with doctors, lawyers, teachers, etc...
The question is: Are the US so different in this respect? I mean, could that be that, let's say, Wall Street operators or people in LA film industry never use words as freely as we do in their work setting?
And what about UK?


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## rrose17

rafanadal said:


> Interesting thread.
> Sentences such as "ho fatto una cazzata" or "mi fanno il culo se non consegno il lavoro per tempo" or "è andato tutto a puttane" are so ordinary in Italy and commonly used at any level, any social class, age and education. No doubt about that. I hear them all the time when I speak with doctors, lawyers, teachers, etc...
> The question is: Are the US so different in this respect? I mean, could that be that, let's say, Wall Street operators or people in LA film industry never use words as freely as we do in their work setting?
> And what about UK?


Well in Canada, which I imagine stands in between the UK and the U.S. I'd say unless you were really close to your doctor or lawyer, if they started to use expressions like this it would seem inappropriate and cause for concern. I think a teacher (maybe not university, somewhere in the middle of the term) would get reported for using offensive language.


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## kyuchek

Salve a tutti. Anch'io dovrei tradurre due frasi con l'espressione "*fare una cazzata*", usata nel senso di *commettere uno sbaglio importante.*
La frase è la seguente: _"Così, alla fine, diciamo chiaramente, se *facciamo una cazzata*, almeno la *cazzata* l’avremo fatta noi da soli, nessuno esterno la farà per noi!" _Il mio tentativo è il seguente: 
_So let me clearly say that if we mess up, it will be nobody’s fault but ours.  _Non so se la mia traduzione sia troppo succinta rispetto all'originale.


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## You little ripper!

_So let’s  be clear about this. If we (mess up)/(stuff up), it will be nobody’s fault but our own! _might sound a little more idiomatic.


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## kyuchek

You little ripper, thank you so much!


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## Pietruzzo

You little ripper! said:


> _So let’s  be clear about this. If we (mess up)/(stuff up), it will be nobody’s fault but our own! _might sound a little more idiomatic.


You are leaving out the "at least" part , which is important in my opinion. I wonder if the following makes sense:
"If we're messing it up, at least let it be our own mess , not someone else's".


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## kyuchek

Dear Pietruzzo, I was also wondering where to put " at least"...in order to give a closer translation to the Italian version.


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## rrose17

Just to tweak Pietruzzo’s I’d say
_If we mess up, at least it’ll be our own mess and not someone else’s!_


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## theartichoke

Another alternative, very informal: _If we screw this up, at least it'll be us who screwed it up / we'll be the ones who screwed it up, and not somebody else!_


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## You little ripper!

Pietruzzo said:


> You are leaving out the "at least" part , which is important in my opinion. I wonder if the following makes sense:
> "If we're messing it up, at least let it be our own mess , not someone else's".


The reason I left it out is because it wasn’t in the attempted translation by kyuchek (I was trying to make the attempt more idiomatic). I don’t think it is important. It doesn’t sit well in that sentence which is probably why kyuchek was having difficulty with it. Having said that, it does work better in the attempted translations by rrose and theartichoke. Another suggestion (without the ‘at least’) might be:

_So let’s be clear about this. If we (mess up)/(stuff up),  we only have ourselves to blame, not somebody else!_


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## kyuchek

Thank you very much to everybody! You really helped me!!! I love all the versions you translated and I don't really know what to choose..


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## Pietruzzo

You little ripper! said:


> I don’t think it is important. It doesn’t sit well in that sentence


"Almeno" is a key-word in the Italian sentence. 
_"se *facciamo una cazzata*, la *cazzata* l’avremo fatta noi da soli," means "we can only blame ourselves" while "se *facciamo una cazzata*, almeno la *cazzata* l’avremo fatta noi da soli," means "we want to make our own  mistakes", basically._


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## You little ripper!

Pietruzzo said:


> "Almeno" is a key-word in the Italian sentence.
> _"se *facciamo una cazzata*, la *cazzata* l’avremo fatta noi da soli," means "we can only blame ourselves" while "se *facciamo una cazzata*, almeno la *cazzata* l’avremo fatta noi da soli," means "we want to make our own  mistakes", basically._


‘At least’ does not translate _we want to. _


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## chipulukusu

I would suggest to use _if anything_ in the English translation instead of _at least:
"Let's put it this way:  if anything if we blow up it will be our own mistake, nobody will do it it for us"._

This might make clearer the meaning of "_almeno_" in the Italian version.


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## You little ripper!

‘If anything‘ sits a lot better in that sentence, in my opinion.


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## kyuchek

Thank you both. I've never used "if anything", but I guess in this context maybe it works better for expressing "almeno".


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## rrose17

Sorry, not to be a pain, but I think "at least" makes perfect sense and works better than "if anything" here.


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## You little ripper!

‘At least’ is used as a positive in a usually negative situation. What is the the positive in stuffing up themselves as opposed to someone else stuffing it up for them?

_If we do screw this up, if anything it will our fault, not someone else’s._


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## kyuchek

So in this context, I don't know if "at least" is better than "if anything" once translated in English, because I'm not a native speaker, but I'm sure that in Italian "almeno" is essential. In this case, the positive aspect of "stuffing up themselves as opposed to someone else stuffing it up for them" consists in their own responsibility, in their own choice, in their freedom.


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## You little ripper!

kyuchek said:


> So in this context, I don't know if "at least" is better than "if anything" once translated in English, because I'm not a native speaker, but I'm sure that in Italian "almeno" is essential. In this case, the positive aspect of "stuffing up themselves as opposed to someone else stuffing it up for them" consists in their own responsibility, in their own choice, in their freedom.


Kyuchek, ‘at least’ does translate ‘almeno’, but in my opinion it doesn’t make complete sense. We know from the ‘tirare i remi in barca’ thread that these musicians have a slightly different understanding of that particular metaphor than how it’s generally understood (there’s a big difference between ‘relaxing‘ and ‘not giving a damn’), and I think they’ve done the same here, so it depends on whether you want to translate it literally or whether you want a translation that makes sense - to me at least. It doesn’t seem to be a problem for some of the other natives, so maybe you should go with the literal translation. Most native English speakers will occasionally say things that when analysed don’t really make sense, but it doesn’t stop us from saying them.


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## theartichoke

You little ripper! said:


> ‘At least’ is used as a positive in a usually negative situation. What is the the positive in stuffing up themselves as opposed to someone else stuffing it up for them?



I didn't see what you were getting at earlier, but now I do.  Let's just say it's a personal point of view thing: I myself see it as _far_ better to screw something up myself rather than having someone else screw it up for me, simply to be able to say "oh well, at least I gave it my best shot!" as opposed to having to say "why was I so stupid as to let those @#$%** idiots get anywhere near it?!" I suppose the operative words are "for me"--in order for this logic to apply, it has to be a situation in which the screw-up really affects me, not one where I'd be happy to point the finger and say "hey, they screwed it up, not me!"


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## You little ripper!

theartichoke said:


> I didn't see what you were getting at earlier, but now I do.  Let's just say it's a personal point of view thing: I myself see it as _far_ better to screw something up myself rather than having someone else screw it up for me, simply to be able to say "oh well, at least I gave it my best shot!" as opposed to having to say "why was I so stupid as to let those @#$%** idiots get anywhere near it?!" I suppose the operative words are "for me"--in order for this logic to apply, it has to be a situation in which the screw-up really affects me, not one where I'd be happy to point the finger and say "hey, they screwed it up, not me!"


I’d find it embarrassing to have to admit it was my fault; I’d rather it was someone else’s or something I had no control over!   I probably had the ‘tirare i remi in barca‘ thread in the back of my mind and decided that they’re probably not the best with communication. That is not to say they’re not brilliant musicians!  I suppose it’s best to translate literally in this particular case and let the reader come up with their own conclusion as to what was meant.


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## Pietruzzo

theartichoke said:


> : I myself see it as _far_ better to screw something up myself rather than having someone else screw it up for me,


This reminds me of an old aphorism: "Non datemi consigli, so sbagliare benissimo da solo"


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## kyuchek

Oh my god, what an interesting discussion!!!! 
All of your suggestions and comments have been so precious to me that you can't imagine!!! I adore everything that you have thought and written because everything is true!!! So all your translations are fantastic and I'm happy that now, we all agree about the sense and the meaning of this Italian sentence. Thank you so much! You really helped me!!!


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