# Can local climate really affect the mood of a country's citizens?



## olives

Hello everyone,

I'd like to have your opinion about the following :
Can local climate really affect the mood of a country's citizens?

Bye.


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## maxiogee

What do you mean by 'local climate'?
Do you mean "the citizens of X are all .... because they live in such a (insert climate type) country"
- or - 
do you mean "Does the Mistral/Fohn/Sirocco really change people's moods"?


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## cuchuflete

No, Tony, it's about identifying those countries which have uniform climates, year round, in all of their geography.  Once you find such a country, you assess the citizens, to see if they are bright eyed and bushy tailed, or glum and grumpy.

For more detail on the well documented effects of climate on national moodiness, see

Barnston, A.G., 1988: Effect of weather on mood, productivity, and frequency of emotional crisis in a temperate continental climate. International J. Biometeorology, 32(2), 134-143.


Palinkas LA and Houseal M (2000) Stages of change in mood and behaviour during a winter in Antarctica. Environment and Behaviour,
32:128-141.

According to Mark Twain, loosely paraphrased, speaking of New England coastal weather...

If you don't like the weather here, wait five minutes!

So I guess we must all be mercurial and unstable in our moods.


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## mirx

I've done some research on the matter, countries with moderate climate seem to have the highest rates of happiness.

The happiest countries in the world are these. A study by a different orginization showed these results.

Another study by a Washington univerity showed similar results:

_*"Unsurprisingly, the number one predictor of happiness is wealth. The richer nations - the United States, Canada and members of the European Union - score consistently higher on Veenhoven's happiness chart than the less developed economies of Africa and Asia. But income isn't the only factor. The former Communist countries - Russia, Hungary, the Czech Republic - have far lower satisfaction levels than one would expect given their GDPs, while Mexico and other relatively poor Latin American countries consistently outperform nations with higher GDPs. Moreover, while Britain and the United States are among the happiest countries in the world, they are significantly lower in happiness than Switzerland, Denmark and Iceland"*_

I also know that Finland which wheather is extreme and gets sunshine only half the year, shows the highest rate on suicide.


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## geve

I don't understand how this statement _*"Unsurprisingly, the number one predictor of happiness is wealth" *_fits with the top five happiest countries in the world as listed in mirx' first link: *1. Nigeria **2. Mexico **3. Venezuela **4. El Salvador **5. Puerto Rico.*

But there's already a thread about happiest countries in the world (which, by the way, gives a different ranking, but we don't want to go too deep into survey methodologies do we?), so we should try to stick to discussing weather here... It's cold and sunny today in Paris, a rather nice weather I must say, and I'm feeling in a good mood. What about you? Should we do a poll maybe? 




olives said:


> I'd like to have your opinion about the following :
> Can local climate really affect the mood of a country's citizens?


If you don't mind, I'd like to post a few definitions (from the WRD) so that we all agree on what we're talking about:
climate: _the weather in some location averaged over some long period of time_
weather: _the meteorological conditions: temperature and wind and clouds and precipitation_
mood:_ a characteristic (habitual or relatively temporary) state of feeling_

My personal belief (but I have no study to back it up) is that human beings are versatile, going from one state of feeling to another. I also believe (again, no studies, just my personal subjective point of view) that human beings living in a same place at a same time can be in different states of feelings. Climate is a fixed characteristic of a place. Climate doesn't change - at least, it doesn't change several times a week or a day, and it should be the same climate for you and your next-door neighbour for instance. 
So no, I don't think climate has an effect on mood. 

Now, _weather_ could have an influence on mood - combined with many other factors that couldn't be put in a list. A good weather might contribute to a good mood, a bad weather to a bad mood. But then, whether a weather is good or bad, is subjective!

Here's to not drawing conclusions at all. 

__________________
 Warning! This post may contain traces of sarcasm. (ad hoc signature)


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## cuchuflete

The first link takes us very merrily and cheerfully to this:


*CABLE      TELEVISIONTHE HAPPINESSSHOWSTREAMING      INTERNET*​ *Happiness      Information, Resources, and Over One Hundred Free Online Shows 


*Just looking at all the pastel colors on that page has taken away all the gloom of this rainy day, and made me want to dance in the meadow, singing joyful songs, while I contemplate the happy news that Nigeria ranks first on the list of happy places, and mediate on  that lovely fact.  Tweeedle deeedle dum.  ​


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## geve

cuchuflete said:


> Just looking at all the pastel colors on that page has taken away all the gloom of this rainy day, and made me want to dance in the meadow, singing joyful songs, while I contemplate the happy news that Nigeria ranks first on the list of happy places, and mediate on that lovely fact. Tweeedle deeedle dum.


Yes, isn't it amazing how colors can affect moods, even that of the least frivolous language freak? Oh but wait, this was the topic of another thread... 

Cuchu, I hope you're not implying that rain necessarily has a negative effect on people? Because there are people who get merry when it rains, for instance this guy seems to like it, and maybe this kind of people might enjoy it, or the owners of this place...
So it's possible that weather affects the mood, but it's impossible to tell if it'll be in a good or bad way. As I said before: whether a weather wears one is hard to say*. Which leads me to another very interesting question: does weather affect wethers?


__________________
*If you want geve out of this thread please press 1. If you think geve is like a ray of sunshine in a dull day please press 2 or see a professional.* (ad hoc signature)


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## cuchuflete

geve said:


> another very interesting question: does weather affect wethers?


Ewe tell me.


__________________
*If you want climate out of this thread please press geve. If you think a ray of sunshine on a dull day is better than dark chocolate, please press geve again and see a meteorologist. If you are always in a happy mood, but want a change of climate, please skip to question #37.a. *


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## geve

See what happens when you try to have an average weather-type conversation on a language forum? You end up with sheep jokes!

Cuchu, you truly are one-of-a-kine.

__________________ 
*Ok, enough of 1-pressing, I get it!*


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## ireney

So what IS good weather? While I was in Edinburgh I saw people being really cheerful about how "lovely it is today and how sunny and warm" and I was going around with my coat on. I used to get depressed and open my window on July to scream at Heavens that "IT'S SUMMER YOU KNOW!" but no one seemed to take the not-so-subtle hint and it continued raining on a daily basis. 

I have seen people from warmer places than Greece look at me as if I am crazy when I talk about how nice and crisp the weather is with a refreshing wind while they shiver. I'm cheerful, they are not.

Anyway, from my perspective, in Scotland it only stops raining to make room for sleet or snow, the sky seems amazingly low (if you live in Belgium or Scotland for example and see someone walking around, heedless of the hidden dangers of e.g. a lamp posts, looking at the sky with a preplexed expression chances are he's from the Med and tries to figure out why the sky looks so much closer to earth) and I will not comment on the wind. 
Scots seemed cheerful enough to me.

P.S. And I am on occasion cheerful even when I think my brains are slowly melting away on a hot July. My dad on the other hand has a nack of finding something to grumble about even when it's spring, the weather is fantastic and most are in a good mood.
_Greece_'s weather should produce people more cheerful than North Europe right? I am much less cheerful on the whole than i.e. Trude, my friend from _Norway_  There are precious few Greeks as cheerful as Trude that I know of.


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## Mate

This thread urges me to visit http://www.meteonet.com.ar/ to foresee how my mood will be for the next five days.

Cheers - Mate


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## Etcetera

ireney said:


> So what IS good weather?


That is the question, indeed!
I love rainy weather. I really enjoy heavy raining and cloudy skies. That's the usual weather in St. Petersburg in spring, summer and autumn. OK, OK, *this* summer was in fact pretty warm and sunny, but nonetheless. Some people find rain disgusting and prefer the South of Russia, where you have about 30 degrees from April to October. Each to his taste, you know. 
I believe our mood doesn't depend on the weather so much. On the contrary, our attitude towards this or that weather depends on our mood.


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## cuchuflete

Unfortunately, this passes for climate.


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## geve

Ireney, your post reminds me of how my mother would wake my sister and I when we slept in during week-ends at the countryside: she would come and open the shutters and cheerfully say "you should get out of bed now, see the lovely weather?" We would take a glance at the grey cloudy sky, groan, and put pillows over our heads.

So there's no need to come from a different country to have different ideas on weather!


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## maxiogee

cuchuflete said:


> Unfortunately, this passes for climate.


Cuchu, you're meant to open the shower curtain before you take photographs through the bathroom window!

=====

To conclude this thread please allow me to ram home a small point.
The happiness level of a country is directly proportional, obviously I don't need to resort to research or facts to back this - it is self-evidently true, to the number of Irishpeople living there.


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## cuchuflete

We must have had yet another influx of Irishmen. Click the link again. Since you wrote your post, half the fog has lifted.

That would be the Belfast effect.


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## ElaineG

Well, everyone has treated this thread as sort of a joke, which amused me too...

But:  There are apparently discernable differences in suicide rates depending on season, and also on latitude.  Seasonal-affective disorder is real.  It's pretty well established that sunshine has a direct a effect on mood and health.

When I lived in Scotland, I thought the cultural obssession with pubs, and yes, binge drinking, had something to do with the incredible darkness of the winter months -- sunrise at 8:45 am, sunset at 3:30, often grey in the intervening hours.  I'm not a psychologist or a socialogist, but I think that does affect life in many ways.

The dog-days of summer in NY put people on edge.  Remember Do the Right Thing?  The premise that a heatwave is a contributory factor to violence seems very plausible to me.

Anyway, I don't think that the idea that our climate shapes our cultures, oru practices, and therefore to a certain extent, our temperaments, is an absurd one.


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## natasha2000

geve said:


> *If you want geve out of this thread please press 1. If you think geve is like a ray of sunshine in a dull day please press 2 or see a professional.* (ad hoc signature)


 
I press 2!!!!!!!!!


Serously, I think the weather does have influence on a mood. Meybe not of the whole nation, but individually, yes. I remember of the each year's instant depression that I got immediately afte rgetting up in the morning and seeing the whiteness of the snow outside... I HATE SNOW. Each year the very same thing happened every time when the first snow appears in Belgrade... I get up, happy and ready for a brand new day, I open the curtains to let the light to fill my room and....   Oh, my God! It snowed! No, no, I just want to go back to my bed and hybernate until spring comes back... Finally, I decided to change the country, so now I don't have that problem any more.


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## ireney

It's one thing though to say that a certain aspect of the local climate or that a certain kind of weather affects the mood and quite another to say that the climate affects the mood of the citizens of a country in general.

Culture yes. I mean you live in a place with ice all year round you have to adapt. Not to much rain to make the land lush? Adapt.
Of course the same has to said about the lay of the land. Lots of sea and islands around a piece of really mountainous land? Exploration and sea-trade here we come! Lots of flat, arable land? How about some farming?
Then it's the "neighbourhood".  Lots of people with exciting discoveries? Let's look at the potential of exchanging ideas and learn from them as we re-arm for the next war. Not many people around? Loneliness doesn't make for lots of excitement.

And so on and so forth. Climate in general is one of the factors one has to take into account when talking about culture, practises etc.
Aspects of the climate may have an effect on people's mood and that's about it really. We are rather adaptable as a species I think so unless someone can produce evidence that people from less sunny countries are more or less cheerful than those from more sunny countries for example I think the answer is "let's be a bit more careful about how we phrase a question"


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## Maja

maxiogee said:


> The happiness level of a country is directly proportional, obviously I don't need to resort to research or facts to back this - it is self-evidently true, to the number of Irishpeople living there.


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## Vanda

I am afraid it might have an influence. Many Brazilian friends who have moved (temporarily or not) to colder northern countries (in Europe and USA mainly) usually complain about wintertime and how bad they feel. 
In the beginning there is that tasty of novelty: snow, heavy fancy clothes, etc, but after a while they miss the sun, the warmth, the beaches and can't barely stand the cold weather, mainly those living in very raining countries.
Incidentally people living in our Northern regions, having the sun shinning the whole year, appear to be happier than people living in the Southern region which is colder, although not as cold as in the places first mentioned. And maybe it is just a perception but they (from our Northern region) seem to do things slower than we do, so I think they are a bit less stressed than we with our hectic stressed life. 
-big sigh- Today it is raining in here the whole day and I really felt like being in this place rather than here. I'm not in a good mood!
I've read somewhere that psychiatrics prescribe sun bathing for their most problematic/lunatic patients.


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## cuchuflete

Vandinha,
You have raised an entirely new and different topic— adaptation to a new climate distinct from the one a person has known all their life.

I imagine that if I were to leave my current climate (very cold and dry=>cold and rainy=>hot and dry=>cool and rainy) for a place with less seasonal variation, it would take a long time to adjust.


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## geve

I feel I can come back since Natasha pressed 2 - Thank you Natasha! 

Elaine, Vanda, I agree with what you're saying, but isn't it about weather more than climate? 


ElaineG said:


> But: There are apparently discernable differences in suicide rates depending on season, and also on latitude.


Depending on season, yes - not climate. As per suicide rates depending on latitudes, I think it would be hard to evaluate the role of climate in it. I've read theories in which food habits play a significant role in the depression rate, due to the proportion of different acids in it and their effect on the brain...


ElaineG said:


> The dog-days of summer in NY put people on edge. Remember Do the Right Thing? The premise that a heatwave is a contributory factor to violence seems very plausible to me.


Yes, but it's an exceptional weather situation in a city that otherwise experiments temperate climate. Couldn't it be a reaction to a change of weather (or of climate, when they move abroad as in Vanda's example)? Is violence more important in arid or subtropical places? 


That being said, it's true that our general disposition, our energy vary from season to season (the seasonal-affective disorder illustrates that point very well). Does that mean that people living in places where there are strongly marked seasons, are generally feeling better or worse that those who live in countries where the climate is harsh but rather steady?


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## KaRiNe_Fr

I guess a windy climate is a serious issue regarding mood... and not only because the wind can unhorn oxes (there is a French saying "il y a un vent à décorner les boeufs")... Actually I think wind can make people crazy. See the result.


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## la reine victoria

KaRiNe_Fr said:


> I guess a windy climate is a serious issue Actually I think wind can make people crazy. See the result.


 


Indeed it can Karine.  When I first visited my brother in Munich the föhn was blowing.  My brother said, "Watch out - this wind can literally drive you mad!"  (How true  , but I'm still taking the tablets).  

He then went on to tell me that when the föhn was blowing the Munich suicide rate rose alarmingly - most people choosing to throw themselves from the towers of the Frauenkirche Church.

Then we went for a lunch of weisswurst and Bavarian beer!




LRV


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## Mate

*"...What is SAD?*
Throughout the centuries, poets have described a sense of sadness, loss and lethargy which can accompany the shortening days of fall and winter. Many cultures and religions have winter festivals associated with candles or fire. Many of us notice tiredness, a bit of weight gain, difficulty getting out of bed and bouts of "the blues" as fall turns to winter.

However some people experience an exaggerated form of these symptoms. 

Moderator note: In accord with forum rules and copyright laws, quotations for "fair use" are limited to four sentences.  Please use the link to read the entire text. 


 Source: http://www.ncpamd.com/seasonal.htm

Ps: this forero is a living proof of what is stated above. 

Cheers - Mate


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## Bonjules

cuchuflete said:


> I can't really agree, from my experience. Having grown up in a place with nice, snowy winters, moving to California was no problem, very exiting. Until, after the sun shining on my head every day for a few years, it occurred to my that a nice winter would be not so bad.
> But it was homesickness, really.
> I ended up in New England, with arctic winters and (occasionally) 10ft snowdrifts, very exiting. Beeing a little older now(and the toes not warming up so fast anymore) I don't miss those temperatures either,really.
> I think it depends mostly on whether you like where you ended up and at what stage you are in your life.
> saludos


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## cuchuflete

We can swap anecdotes--I grew up in an area with four distinct seasons, then moved to various tropical places, where I had difficulty adjusting--but the question Vanda's post raised is really not about my personal experience or yours, but whether most people experience a notable mood change with a change in climate.  I don't know if this has been studied, or if mood changes from climate are usually just attributed to an overall sense of dislocation.  

I do know many South Americans who suffer, both physically and—it appears— emotionally, from New England winters.


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## Bonjules

well,
it might very well be that coming from the Tropics to
a cold place with gloomy winters is much harder than
the other way around!(for most folks)


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## cuchuflete

I suspect you are right.  Somehow it seems easier to take off a few layers of clothing to get comfortable than to pile more on, and still get frostbite and windburn.


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