# てか、てゆーか



## lammn

I often hear people say てか or てゆーか when they change their topics.
An example of usage is てゆーか、そういう人に対して危機感が強い。

However, I don't exactly know what they mean and in which occasion can one use those words.
Could anyone explain its meaning and usage please?


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## Noamoxkaltontli

I've always seen them as verbal crutches. You use them to secure your place in the conversation while you arrange your thoughts. Or perhaps to let others know you are arranging your thoughts, something like "like" in english.  
"_Its like_, they didn't want us to come here in the first place!"

They are probably related (I don't know which one was first for sure)
「〇〇というか××というか」(I don't know whether its 〇 or ×) sentences.


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## masatom

Hello.
[/SIZE] 
[original form] 
　というか、それよりも、わたしは、・・・といいたい。[/SIZE]

 
is not formal expression nor written expression.
is used by those who has low intelligence, or young people, especially by teenage-female.
may be a dialect of Tokyo district.
Tokyo is the Japanese capital but it has dialect.
For example standard Tokyo dialect

Usage
1. in other words
When we are speaking, and we find a better expression, we want to rephrase.
In such a situation, we use before speaking the rephrase sentence.
2. express objection to other’s opinion.
When she express objection to other’s opinion, she start her opinion starting with .
3.  well,   let me see.
Some girls say it with no specific meaning. They use the phrase just trying to fill in pauses between their sentences. Or they are thinking next sentence, using .
4.  Let me talk something
When two young girls are chatting, and the third girl want to join the conversation, the third girl start her speech with  

My advice:
A foreigner had better not use that expression. It is too dangerous.
If a foreigner use  it seems very strange to me.
Just hearing and not to use is my advice.

Thank you.


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## Flaminius

Hello *masatom*,

First of all, welcome to the WordReference forums!  Great observations on the usage of てゆーか!    I hope you will have more linguistic fun around here.

I am just wondering, however, if the original meaning of the expression "in other words" at least is not limited to a specific group in the Japanese speech community.  In fact, I have heard _teyūka_ in sense of "in other words" (I am avoiding hiragana representation since it is an inherently non-standard writing form) used by people much older than myself in serious negotiations.  It seems to me that ゆう as an allomorph of いう has been replacing the latter in many instances including the preference of _teyūka_ over というか in the spoken language.



> てゆーか is used by those who has low intelligence, or young people, especially by teenage-female.


I understand that てゆーか serves the functions of your usages from 2 to 4 in speech of young people, especially teenage girls but low intelligence does not seem to be correlated with the usages.  It may be just that speech patterns of youth are motivated by different factors from those motivating speech of more mature generations.

Edit: Just off the top of my head, unwillingness to appear assertive can be seen especially clearly in the usage 2 (expressing disagreement).


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## masatom

Thank you Flaminius.
I agree with you.

My daughter aged 8 uses てゆーか　but I don't think she has low intelligence.
What I want to mention is this.
If you are an adult aged around 30-70 and if you use てゆーか often (especially Usage 3), you seems very childish. And one might susupect that you have a low intelligence (for your age.)

So your opinion is correct that "low intelligence does not seem to be correlated with the usages" . 
You mean "Seems childish for his age"  and  "low intelligence" is a different things,
I think.
If so, you are correct.
For me, Someone who can't speak adult speech and only children speech is thought to be low intelligence by others.

I live in Kyushu-district. 
And I don't like Tokyo dialect.
Old age people who often use てゆーかlive in Tokyo or Kanto dialect.
I think てゆーか　is some kind of dialect. Not standard language.
So the feeling about てゆーか is different by our age and where we live in.
Thank you.


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## lammn

Thanks to all of you (in particular, masatom) for the detailed explanation of てゆーか!

But then, *is てか the short form of てゆーか?*



masatom said:


> My advice:
> A foreigner had better not use that expression. It is too dangerous.
> If a foreigner use てゆーか it seems very strange to me.
> Just hearing and not to use is my advice.


 
May I know why is it dangerous for foreigners to use てゆーか?
For your record, I heard my English native-speaker friends using てゆーか/てか a lot. They are university graduates and I suppose they have very good command of the Japanese language.


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## masatom

Thank you, Lammn.

You think you don't have to worry using ‚te-yuuka.
I can understand your thinking well. 
I think your friend must be a fluent speaker of Japanese.
Or the Japanese friend of your friends are relatively young and don't care about ‚te-yuuka.


Let me explain why I think it is dangerous.
We love our native language, right?
And We feel sometimes uncomfortable when we hear dirty words or broken words.
We feel badly or sorry sometimes. When?

Criminal person, smugglers, or pirates may use dirty words. But who care?
We don't feel sorry to hear dirty words from criminal because we think it is natural.

If we hear from decent people, we feel badly. Because it is unnatural for the situation.

And how about our children? They are beginners of our language.
If they use dirty words or broken words, parents want to correct them. Why?
Because parents love their children and their language, right?

So if a foreigner who appears to be the beginner of our language speaks dirty words or broken words, we feel sorry about it. And we feel uncomfortable. Not to the foreigner, but we feel uncomfortable to know the fact that our language is becomming worse.

So if beginners of the language use unappropriate words, we feel somehow unnatural.
If the foreigner is a fluent speaker of the language, it seems natural. 
So we don't care. Only it might be his dishonor.

Some foreign actor is a fluent Japanese dialect speaker. He talks the dialect on TV.
It is alright. We know he speakes intentionally.

Let me use my example.
We hear often Americans use " What hell on earth is it?" But I think I had better not use the phrase.
We hear often Americans use, "Oh, my God!"
When I used "Oh, my God!", my American friend was surprised and asked " I think you are not a Christian. Why do you use Oh, my god?"
It seemed very odd for him. And after that I don't use the phrase.

These are the reason why I think it *might be* dangerous.

The point is I think ‚te-yuuka is not standard Japanese.
And it is perfectly OK to those who think te-yuuka is standard Japanese.
It depends on every Japanese individual.

So maybe you are right. and maybe I am right, according to who are listening to you.

Thank you.


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## lammn

I see your point now, masatom. 

I _thought_ that てゆーか is just casual speech.
But after reading your comments, I came to understand that てゆーか is a "dirty" or "broken" word to native speakers.

But then, can I use というか or というのは to "replace" the word てゆーか in casual speech?


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## masatom

Thank you, lammn.

I think というか　or というのは　is more suitable.

And more formal expression is "と申しますのは（to-moushimasunowa)"
と申しますのは　is proper when you say to older people or to your boss or to your teachers  or to higher ranking person. It is 謙譲語 or 敬語 in Japanese.

Of course "と申しますのは"　is too rigid for daily casual speech with your friends.


And now I have lost my confidence whether てゆーかis just casual speech or not.
I don't think てゆーか　is dirty but I think it broken.

I think now that てゆーか　is just causal speech to those who don't care much about their words.
And such a people might be the majority of today's Japan.

So if you use てゆーか, you mgiht be praised by them. 「てゆーか」を使うなんて、日本語がお上手ですね。（You are a very fluent Japanese speaker as you can use てゆーか.)

So who cares?

I think those who have bad feeling about てゆーか　is someone who want to read this website's threads, like you and me. Those who love languages, and want to be more fluent.
Maybe they are the minority of Japan.

So you can use the phrase in many cases, and you had better not use the phrase in some situation, such as talking with *Me.*

Thank you.


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## lammn

Thank you very much for the explanation!
I shall be more careful in choosing which words to use. ^^;;


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