# Rite of Passage



## albertaguirre1

Can someone help me properly translate
right of passage
or
rights of passage


----------



## Imber Ranae

It's "rite of passage", as in a sacred ceremony, not "right of passage". A rather literal translation would be _ritus transitionis_, but there are specific names for particular Roman cultural rites of passage. I'm not sure there was ever an equivalent term for the general concept of rites of passage in Latin, however.


----------



## Flaminius

Hello, *FrogRain*.

Maybe we could say _initiatio_?


----------



## albertaguirre1

Oh goodness you are correct. It is rite of passage indeed.

Anyone know the Roman name for this ceremony?


----------



## Cagey

albertaguirre1 said:


> Oh goodness you are correct. It is rite of passage indeed.
> 
> Anyone know the Roman name for this ceremony?


Please tell us what the context of the ceremony would be.  Would it be the initiation into adulthood?  Would it be for a male or a female?  Would it be a test of some kind?  "Rite of passage" is made to be a very general term.  As Imber Ranae says, it is unlikely that the Romans had such a term.  Instead, they would have spoken of individual ceremonies.


----------



## albertaguirre1

Thank you for your response.

This is a ceremony I am developing for my son to usher him into adulthood. This ceremony includes physical challenges.. . and more...

at the end he is given a new name and a gift such as a sword


----------



## Pistrix

I think Flaminius gave you sound advice.


----------



## Cagey

You could use Imber Ranae's term, or follow Flaminius' suggestion, _initiatio_, which does mean _initiation_. 

Another possibility would be to develop a term based on the Roman custom of celebrating a boy's entry into manhood. In this ceremony, a boy would set aside the toga he wore as a boy and put on the toga virilis (toga of manhood).  HERE is one description of the ceremony.  

For more information you could search for "toga virilis ceremony", or go to the library.  

If you would like to use this, or some variation on it, we can use this ceremony as a starting point and work out a name.


----------



## albertaguirre1

Thank you all for your input. This ceremony has great meaning to us and it will be handed down from generation to generation. So a heartfelt thank you to all.

I did read about the _toga virilis_ ceremony. I think virilis means adult or grown man. Not sure.

I like the thought of initiato (pronounced in-ish-ee-ah-tow?)

I was also thinking of adding something to the effect of "adulthood" or "manhood"  -initiation into manhood- maybe?


----------



## Cagey

Yes, virilis means "adult or grown man".  "Toga virilem sumere" (literally: to put on a man's [OR manly] toga) is "to attain manhood".   When  a young man put on the _toga virilis_ for the first time, he began a year (or so) of being mentored in an adult role, often that of a participant in political life.  This might happen at different ages  ~ scholars debate this ~ but somewhere around 15 would be a reasonable guess.  Of course, one of the differences between our cultures is that we expect people be in school longer, while Romans expected young men to learn "on the job" under the supervision of an experienced adult. 

If we had a stricter dress code, the Roman ceremony would be like a ceremony in which a young man put on his first business suit and set off to do an internship. 

_Initiatio_, (the _t_s are pronounced as _t_s) was actually used to mean participation in secret religious rites.  You might call your ceremony _initiatio sacrorum virilium_: the participation in sacred manly rites. 

I suspect others will have suggestions and comments.


----------



## albertaguirre1

I see.. 
How about "_initiatio virilium". Does this work as "initiation into manhood"?

_Is it "tio" at the end of initiatio or "to"?


----------



## Outsider

It's with an "i", like in English. The English word is derived from Latin.


----------



## Cagey

albertaguirre1 said:


> [....]
> I did read about the _toga virilis_ ceremony. I think virilis means adult or grown man. Not sure.
> [....]


_virilis_ is an adjective.  That is why I translated it as "manly", though _virilis _really doesn't have the connotations that _manly_ has in English; it means "appropriate to the status of an adult male."

Latin is not big on abstract nouns like "manhood".  _Pubertas_ would be closest: in Latin it means the age of maturity.  Personally, I wouldn't use _pubertas _because people will assume that it means _puberty _~ unless that is what you are celebrating. Otherwise, you can use an adjective with _aetas_ (age), for instance _aetas adulta:_ "adult age".


----------



## albertaguirre1

Agreed on  _Pubertas_ 

So what would the fill name be?
_
"initiatio virilium_ _aetas_"


----------



## Cagey

I hope someone else will take a look at this and comment.  

Grammatically I think it would be "_initiatio aetatis virilis_" (rites of 'manly' age). However, I don't think _virilis_ is used this way in Latin.  That needn't stop you from doing so, of course; and it's not an egregious departure from proper Latin, if it is a departure.   In a way, anything that looks like plausible Latin will work for your purposes.  It's certainly plausible. 

As I said, I hope you get some feed-back from other people as well.


----------



## albertaguirre1

Can someone write this phonetically?_"initiatio aetatis virilis"

_How about_ Initiation Rights?

_


----------



## Cagey

albertaguirre1 said:


> Can someone write this phonetically?_"initiatio aetatis virilis"
> 
> _How about_ Initiation Rights?
> 
> _


I'm no good at phonetic writing. 

However, the problem with Initiation Rites is that the Latin word for initiation in itself means _rites_.  You might say "initia virilia": this would mean "'manly' secret rites."  (I am putting quotations around _manly_ for the reasons I explained above ~ that the Latin word does not have the connotations the English word does.)


----------



## albertaguirre1

Wow so many variations. Hard to figure out what to use


----------

