# Even if ... explanation in detail



## amorcelius

Hello to everyone!

I know that there are threads similar to this (like this one even if it won't help you ), but I need more elaboration of how it works.
Besides the above pointed method with "-se/sa bile", I found a method using "hos" -> "Hoş, param da olsa almazdım"
So, what is (if there is) the difference between the two? Are there more options of saying something containing "even if..."?
And here is example with which to start -  "Even if the world ends, I will not do it."  (Dunya son verse bile yapmayacakam)
how to make it with the "hos" construction? -> (Hos, dunya son vermek da olsa ya ....) the real question is - toward what this "olsa" is directed?
Feel free to use other types of sentences...
Thank you!


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## Asr

Hello,

With our without "hoş", it still means the same thing.  (Hoş,)Param olsa *da* almazdım.  It is " da" what gives the meaning of "-sa bile". Param olsaydı bile almazdım. (Even if I had the money, I wouldn't buy that). You can replace "hoş" with ""gerçi", which means "actually".

I am not sure if that is clear. In short; Param olsa bile almazdım / Param olsaydı da almazdım, have exactly the same meaning for me. You can add hoş/ gerçi to both sentences which wouldn't change anything at all.


Even if the world ends, I will not do it. : Dünyanın sonu gelse bile bunu yapmayacağım./ Dünyanın sonu gelse de bunu yapmayacağım. See,what matters is "de/da" for the construction.


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## amorcelius

Asr said:


> Hello,
> 
> With our without "hoş", it still means the same thing.  (Hoş,)Param olsa *da* almazdım.  It is " da" what gives the meaning of "-sa bile". Param olsaydı bile almazdım. (Even if I had the money, I wouldn't buy that). You can replace "hoş" with ""gerçi", which means "actually".
> 
> I am not sure if that is clear. In short; Param olsa bile almazdım / Param olsaydı da almazdım, have exactly the same meaning for me. You can add hoş/ gerçi to both sentences which wouldn't change anything at all.
> 
> 
> Even if the world ends, I will not do it. : Dünyanın sonu gelse bile bunu yapmayacağım./ Dünyanın sonu gelse de bunu yapmayacağım. See,what matters is "de/da" for the construction.



What can I say...? THANK YOU! 
I would love this thread, to be used for more examples about "even if..." (for those who still have difficulties)
Just one tiny additional question - why there isn't "onu" or something similar before "almazdim"? (after all, it is "I wouldn't buy THAT")


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## Asr

You're most welcome 

You must have noticed that we don't use pronouns as much as you do in English, because it is already implied in the sentence. You can add "onu/bunu" before the verb, but without it the sentence is not incomplete. 

Here are some examples of even if:

Onu görsem de konuşmayacağım/ Onu görsem bile konuşmayacağım: Even if I see him, I won't talk to him.

Yağmur yağsa da dışarı çıkacağım / Yağmur yağsa bile dışarı çıkacağım : I will go out even if it rains.

Yeryüzünde kalan son erkek olsa bile onunla evlenmem : I won't marry him even if he is the last man on earth


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## amorcelius

Asr said:


> You're most welcome
> 
> You must have noticed that we don't use pronouns as much as you do in English, because it is already implied in the sentence. You can add "onu/bunu" before the verb, but without it the sentence is not incomplete.
> 
> Here are some examples of even if:
> 
> Onu görsem de konuşmayacağım/ Onu görsem bile konuşmayacağım: Even if I see him, I won't talk to him.
> 
> Yağmur yağsa da dışarı çıkacağım / Yağmur yağsa bile dışarı çıkacağım : I will go out even if it rains.
> 
> Yeryüzünde kalan son erkek olsa bile onunla evlenmem : I won't marry him even if he is the last man on earth



Thank you very much for the examples! 
When you said "we don't use pronouns as much as you do in English", reminds me of one other question  
about possessive relationship ->  X-in/un Y-i/u  like "duyanin sonu" (the end of the world) - logical, I get that. 
But what about when I do not see suffixed possessor and yet there is such relationship -> "bolum sonu"  (the end of the chapter/episode - or at least I think so)
unfortunately, I cannot give right now more examples, but I have so stumbled upon several with such case. 
(or should I open another thread for this question!?) (on one hand, I do not want to overflow the forum with cases for every single question that pops up in my head, but on the other, it is confusing as to where to ask something extra when the situation "brings" it)


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## Asr

ahh, that is difficult! I am not sure how it works, or if there is a general rule...

I guess  I'd say "bölüm sonu" is not a possessive noun phrase, instead a noun, an entity on its own. Because there are such things as Bölüm başı, bölüm ortası, bölüm sonu.

But it has to be Ayşe'nin kedisi, dünya'nın sonu, Elif'in ayakkabısı

Like you can say "kapı kolu": because it is a thing, a door handle, a general name.

Ayakkabı bağı : shoe lace

Araba tekeri: car tire etc...  those are all names for things.


That's just me trying to make a sense of it... does it make any sense to you as well? Maybe someone can come up with a better explanation in a new thread.


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## Rallino

I would say *X-(n)-in Y-(s)*-i can be translated as _the Y of the X_, and *X Y-(s)-i* as _the X Y_. So;

Araba*nın* anahtar*ı* = the key of the car (of a specific car that everyone knows about).
Araba anahtar*ı* = a car key (we don't know of which car, but it's not a house key, that's for sure.)


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## amorcelius

Rallino said:


> I would say *X-(n)-in Y-(s)*-i can be translated as _the Y of the X_, and *X Y-(s)-i* as _the X Y_. So;
> 
> Araba*nın* anahtar*ı* = the key of the car (of a specific car that everyone knows about).
> Araba anahtar*ı* = a car key (we don't know of which car, but it's not a house key, that's for sure.)



Wow, it DOES makes sense!
Thank you very much! Appreciated!


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