# itse vs minä - self



## kforcalifornia

Hi! I'm trying to figure out how to say "self" when speaking non-reflexively, or at least when referring to oneself as an entity rather than solely reflexively. I am a very early learner and I know my English grammar may not always translate helpfully.

For example, I'd love to make the sentence "Yritän tulla paremmaksi ihmiseksi" more personally directed, as in "I am striving to become my better self / a better self."
The closest options I can figure out are:
"Yritän tulla paremmaksi minuski" or 
"Yritän tulla paremmaksi itseski"​
My best guess seems to be the former, since this statement in English could make sense in the plural ("We are striving to become our best selves"), but I'm not even sure if either attempt makes sense!

Very curious to learn more -- thanks in advance!


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## Grumpy Old Man

kforcalifornia said:


> "Yritän tulla paremmaksi minuski" or
> "Yritän tulla paremmaksi itseski"​




_Minuksi _and _itseksi are_ the correct spellings but unfortunately neither sentence is natural Finnish. Some people might use the first option. I don't think I have ever heard anyone utter it, though.

As a rule, it's never a good idea to try to export the structures of one's native language into another language. That rarely works, and if does, it's usually just good luck.​


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## kforcalifornia

Hmm, that's what I was afraid of -- by asking about whether it made sense I meant in terms of content as much as grammar. Any suggestions on how to communicate a similar meaning most welcome -- ie, how to communicate a goal of personal internal improvement rather than improvement according to a general external standard.


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## Finland

Hello!



kforcalifornia said:


> Hmm, that's what I was afraid of -- by asking about whether it made sense I meant in terms of content as much as grammar. Any suggestions on how to communicate a similar meaning most welcome -- ie, how to communicate a goal of personal internal improvement rather than improvement according to a general external standard.



Some ideas:
Yritän tulla paremmaksi. Yritän olla parempi versio itsestäni/minusta. Yritän olla parannettu versio itsestäni/minusta. 

HTH
S


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## Gavril

How about _Yritän toteuttaa itseni_? (Literally this means, "I am trying to fulfill myself.")


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## Hakro

Gavril said:


> How about _Yritän toteuttaa itseni_? (Literally this means, "I am trying to fulfill myself.")


Usually we say in partitive _yritän toteuttaa itse*ä*ni._ But it doesn't necessarily mean that I'm trying to be better.


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## Finland

Well, it would be an unusual way to use the verb toteuttaa. Normally one says "Yritän toteuttaa itseäni". With "kokonaisobjekti" (itseni) it sounds somehow more final and thorough, maybe a bit like saying "I'm trying to make myself a reality". I would advise you not to use it in normal text.

HTH
S


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## Gavril

Finland said:


> Well, it would be an unusual way to use the verb toteuttaa. Normally one says "Yritän toteuttaa itseäni". With "kokonaisobjekti" (itseni) it sounds somehow more final and thorough, maybe a bit like saying "I'm trying to make myself a reality". I would advise you not to use it in normal text.



The original poster wanted to translate the phrase "I am trying to become my better self / a better self" -- presumably (s)he wants to carry that process to its conclusion. So, I thought that the total object form (_itseni_) would be more in line with this meaning than the partial object (_itseäni_). Could you help me understand why this is wrong?

Kiitos


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## Finland

It is not easy to explain these things. Anyhow, I cannot say that itseni is outright wrong here, it's just that this sort of use is quite out of the ordinary. "Toteuttaa itseään" is a set phrase, "toteuttaa itsensä" an ad hoc new version of it. I suppose the partial object suits the idea better in Finnish ears because fulfilling oneself, expressing oneself feels like such a continuum that it cannot really have a proper end, if that makes sense. However, if you are talking about something inanimate, say, a project, then the total object form works fine with toteuttaa. Yhtiö toteutti rakennusprojektin. Hallitus aikoo toteuttaa säästösuunnitelmat. Referring to a person using "itse" I could imagine for example a poster for a performance workshop or something with the headline "TOTEUTA ITSESI", for some reason it works better in imperative. 

In your context, I would be more inclined to suggesting something like "Haluan olla parempi minä". I think that would suit this sort of self-help type of style better.

HTH
S


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## Erling

How about _pyrin kehittämään itseäni_? There's no implication of conclusiveness, of course.


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