# geraten



## Robert_Hope

Hallo Zusammen

Ich verstehe diesen Satz nicht ganz, wegen des "geratenen".

Benannt nach zu groß geratenen Pilzen auf einer Pizza, veröffentlicht die Band 2006 ihr Debütalbum _Die Invasion der Killerpilze_

Wissen Sie ein Synonym?

Dank im Voraus

Bob


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## martl

Robert_Hope said:


> Hallo Zusammen
> 
> Ich verstehe diesen Satz nicht ganz, wegen des "geratenen".
> 
> Benannt nach zu groß geratenen Pilzen auf einer Pizza, veröffentlicht die Band 2006 ihr Debütalbum _Die Invasion der Killerpilze_
> 
> Wissen Sie ein Synonym?
> 
> Dank im Voraus
> 
> Bob


Synonoym fällt mir leider keines ein. 

Vielleicht hilft folgendes Beispiel zum Verständnis:
Du leihst von einem Freund ein Hemd aus, das Dir zu groß ist:
"Das Hemd ist mir zu groß"
Du schneiderst selbst ein Hemd und es wird zu groß:
"Das Hemd ist mir zu groß geraten"

Das "geraten" verweist in dem Zusammenhang auf den Fertigungsprozess, Das Hemd/Die Pilze hätten auch die richtige Größe haben können, wenn der Schneider/der Koch besser gearbeitet hätte.

Bei den Pizzapilzen hat man das aber wohl nicht beabsichtigt, sondern diesen Ausdruck vor allem deshalb gewählt, weil "benannt nach zu großen Pilzen auf der Pizza" etwas holperig geklungen hätte.


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## Robocop

Robert_Hope said:


> Ich verstehe diesen Satz nicht ganz, wegen des "geratenen".
> Benannt nach zu groß geratenen Pilzen auf einer Pizza, veröffentlicht die Band 2006 ihr Debütalbum _Die Invasion der Killerpilze_
> Wissen Sie ein Synonym? ==> herauskommen


Benannt nach zu groß *herausgekommenen *Pilzen...


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## Robert_Hope

Ist mir leider noch nicht klar

Wissen Jemand eine englische übersetzung davon?

Danke

Bob


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## Jana337

Robert_Hope said:


> Ist mir leider noch nicht klar
> 
> Wissen  Kennt Jemand eine englische Übersetzung davon?
> 
> Danke
> 
> Bob


Mushrooms that got too big (inadvertently). 

No better idea at the moment. 

Maybe you are confused about the quantity of words between the article and Pilzen.
Benannt nach zu groß geratenen Pilzen auf einer Pizza - benannt nach Pilzen auf einer Pizza, die zu groß geraten sind.


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## Robert_Hope

Jana337 said:


> Mushrooms that got too big (inadvertently).
> 
> No better idea at the moment.
> 
> Maybe you are confused about the quantity of words between the article and Pilzen.
> Benannt nach zu groß geratenen Pilzen auf einer Pizza - benannt nach Pilzen auf einer Pizza, die zu groß geraten sind.


 
Danke für die Korektur 

Das Wort "geraten" ist mir noch nicht klar. Ich spüre den Sinn "cut" (geschnitten) oder "zu groß geworden sind". 

Danke

Bob


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## cyanista

A few examples with attempted translations:

Die Sauce ist etwas salzig geraten. - The sauce turned out too salty.
Die Schuhe sind für Größe 39 zu klein geraten.  - The shoes appear to be too small for size 6.5.
Die Anleitung ist etwas mager geraten. - The manual is somewhat lacking in detail.

If I were you I would just leave it out.


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## elroy

I think "turn out" is generally a good translation.

The mushrooms turned out to be too big for the pizza.


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## cyanista

elroy said:


> I think "turn out" is generally a good translation.
> 
> The mushrooms turned out to be too big for the pizza.



Yeah, but that's not how the sentence goes. Would you write 

 Named after mushrooms on the pizza which turned out to be too big (the mushrooms, not the pizza), the band released their debut album...

?


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## Robocop

Robert_Hope said:


> Benannt nach zu groß geratenen Pilzen auf einer Pizza, veröffentlicht die Band 2006 ihr Debütalbum _Die Invasion der Killerpilze_


The meaning expressed in the subordinate clause is somewhat peculiar. "zu gross geratene Pilze auf einer Pizza" does not make sense to me. 
a) If the intended meaning is to say that *the mushrooms* that were used to garnish the pizza *were too big*, you would *not *use "zu gross geraten" in this context for idiomatic speaking.
b) If on the other hand  the intended meaning is to say that *the mushrooms turned out too big* in the process of baking the pizza, I don't understand. As far as I know baking makes the mushrooms rather shrink not grow bigger.


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## Robert_Hope

Robocop said:


> The meaning expressed in the subordinate clause is somewhat peculiar. "zu gross geratene Pilze auf einer Pizza" does not make sense to me.
> a) If the intended meaning is to say that *the mushrooms* that were used to garnish the pizza *were too big*, you would *not *use "zu gross geraten" in this context for idiomatic speaking.
> b) If on the other hand the intended meaning is to say that *the mushrooms turned out too big* in the process of baking the pizza, I don't understand. As far as I know baking makes the mushrooms rather shrink not grow bigger.


 
Es freut mich, dass es auch für einen Muttersprachler keinen genauen Sinn macht! 

And yes, mushrooms shrink when they are cooked!

Soll ich gewalt sein und "over-sized" oder "giant" mushrooms schreiben? Der Sinn davon ist nicht zu entfernt, oder?

EDIT: "Turned out" ist auch einen guten Vorschlag, finde ich.

Ich danke Ihnen allen für Ihre Antworten!

Bob


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## elroy

cyanista said:


> Named after mushrooms on the pizza which turned out to be too big (the mushrooms, not the pizza), the band released their debut album...


 If I felt the need to include "turn out" without any ambiguity, I could say

_Named after mushrooms that turned out to be too big for the pizza they were on, the band..._

But I don't need to be that literal:

_Named after over-sized mushrooms on a pizza, the band..._


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## Jana337

elroy said:


> If I felt the need to include "turn out" without any ambiguity, I could say
> 
> _Named after mushrooms that turned out to be too big for the pizza they were on, the band..._
> 
> But I don't need to be that literal:
> 
> _Named after over-sized mushrooms on a pizza, the band..._


The second sentence is nifty but unfortunately fails to make it clear that the mushrooms expanded in the cooking process.


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## elroy

Did they?  Are we sure that's what happened?  Maybe I don't know what's going on here.


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## cyanista

Jana337 said:


> The second sentence is nifty but unfortunately fails to make it clear that the mushrooms increased in the cooking process.


???

Jana, I think you are way off here.  The original sentence does not imply that at all. The mushrooms could have been cut too large or just _were _large and the journalist used "geraten" simply because he/she is paid per word.


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## elroy

Yeah, I understood the sentence to mean that the size of the mushrooms was initially deemed to be suitable but then they turned out to be too large once they were actually placed on the pizza or something. An odd scenario, but hey. Let's not forget that the name of this band is _Killerpilze_.


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## cyanista

elroy said:


> Yeah, I understood the sentence to mean that the size of the mushrooms was initially deemed to be suitable but then they turned out to be too large once they were actually placed on the pizza or something. An odd scenario, but hey. Let's not forget that the name of this band is _Killerpilze_.



It was a pizza that the boys ordered from delivery service (I happened to hear this enthralling story on TV  ) and when it came the mushrooms on it where so large they called them "Killerplize". That's how the idea for the band's name was born.


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## elroy

Enthralling, indeed. 

In that case, I think my translation with "over-sized" might work.


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## Jana337

cyanista said:


> ???
> 
> Jana, I think you are way off here.  The original sentence does not imply that at all. The mushrooms could have been cut too large or just _were _large and the journalist used "geraten" simply because he/she is paid per word.


Sorry for confusion.  I didn't think that at the beginning but I acquired that feeling in the middle of the discussion.


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## mgsth

Robocop said:


> The meaning expressed in the subordinate clause is somewhat peculiar. "zu gross geratene Pilze auf einer Pizza" does not make sense to me.
> * a) If the intended meaning is to say that the mushrooms that were used to garnish the pizza **were too big, you would **not use "zu gross geraten" in this context for idiomatic speaking.*
> b) If on the other hand  the intended meaning is to say that *the mushrooms turned out too big* in the process of baking the pizza, I don't understand. As far as I know baking makes the mushrooms rather shrink not grow bigger.


*a)* is what was actually meant here and it *is* idiomatic speaking, at least to me. _zu groß geraten_ just means that they were too big for whatever reason, mostly by the fault of somebody (like the on who had cut them). cyanista already said the rest.


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## Robocop

mgsth said:


> *a)* is what was actually meant here and it *is* idiomatic speaking, at least to me. _zu groß geraten_ just means that they were too big for whatever reason (for me it can mean either that they were allowed to grow too big or that somebody cut them to size too big but again, would that make sense?!), mostly by the fault of somebody (like the on who had cut them). (they were too big even after cutting?!)



I have never had or seen a pizza garnished with *giant *mushroom so far. What sort of mushroom could that be? What is the name of this giant mushroom pizza?
Could it be that the member of the band were drugged and hallucinated about the size of the mushrooms on the pizza?! (I quite like this explanation)


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## berndf

Grimm offers "Wohlgeraten" or "Wohlgelungen" as synonyms. Unfortunately, I can't think of 100% fitting English translations for those either. If you speak French: It means "bien réussi".


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## Quelle

DWDS
geraten:
umg. scherzh. d. Kleid, Rock ist zu kurz g. (_zu kurz gemacht worden_) 

Dementsprechend: Die Pilze waren zu groß geraten --> zu groß gemacht worden --> nicht klein genug geschnitten


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## mgsth

@Robocop
Why do you make it that complicated? The mushrooms are just _zu groß geraten_, it's not important why. 

However, hallucination is a very good explaination for them.


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## Robocop

Quelle said:


> Dementsprechend: Die Pilze waren zu groß geraten --> zu groß gemacht worden --> nicht klein genug geschnitten


Ich habe von Anfang an verstanden, was "zu gross geraten" bedeutet, aber ich verstehe immer noch nicht, was man damit in Zusammenhang mit dem Garnieren einer Pizza aussagen will. Von *welchen Pilzen* ist hier die Rede, die, obwohl zerkleinert, immer noch übergross sein sollen!!??  Soll mir mal jemand sagen, wie diese mit "Riesenpilzen" garnierte Pizza heisst!


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## Quelle

Schau mal hier.


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## mgsth

Wenn das mal kein Killerpilz ist.


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## martl

Robocop said:


> Ich habe von Anfang an verstanden, was "zu gross geraten" bedeutet, aber ich verstehe immer noch nicht, was man damit in Zusammenhang mit dem Garnieren einer Pizza aussagen will. Von *welchen Pilzen* ist hier die Rede, die, obwohl zerkleinert, immer noch übergross sein sollen!!??  Soll mir mal jemand sagen, wie diese mit "Riesenpilzen" garnierte Pizza heisst!


Fizza Funghi?  Ich denke, es wurden einfach extra große Champignons verwendet, was eine Gruppe Jugendlicher allemal zu Heiterkeitsausbrüchen hinreißen kann.


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## Quelle

martl said:


> Fizza Funghi?


 
Oder etwas genauer: Pizza Funghi Assassini


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