# EA:dughrii دوغري



## GDAN

Hi,

I've looked this word up and the definition didn't seem to explain the way it was used in one of my books.

1.hiyya btimshii dughrii &

2.shoof, ya siidi, ana raagil dughrii:7'amsiin ginay fi shahr.
(This is the response of a landlord when asked about the rent of one of his units)

Does this word have something to do with moral character?


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## Ghabi

Yes, as in English, the word "straight" can refer to both the physical and the moral aspect.


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## GDAN

izzayyak ya Ghabi

So in regards to sentence #1, "she's walking straight" is the same as saying "hiyya bint Tayyiba wi amiina"?

What about sentence #2, how does this fit into " ana raagil dughrii..."? My book translates this as "no bargaining".


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## habibimike

It would mean something to the effect of " I'm a straight shooter"


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## GDAN

Hello Habibimike,

So the landlord is letting them know in advance "this is the rent, take it or leave it"? Guess that "straight" does make sense in this context, thank you.

So in business matters its a "straight shooter".  If I wanted to describe a persons moral character, could I just use id dughrii, and if so, is this the masculine form?


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## habibimike

Dughri means: 1- Straight (as in direction, go straight etc...)

2- Straight (as in straight shooter, or I do not play games)

3- Moral character: Ana Dughri could mean I am an honest man etc..

4- Same is used for both genders: hiya be temchi dughri/Huwa be yimchi dughri


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## Finland

Hello!



GDAN said:


> Hello Habibimike,
> 
> So the landlord is letting them know in advance "this is the rent, take it or leave it"? Guess that "straight" does make sense in this context, thank you.
> 
> So in business matters its a "straight shooter". If I wanted to describe a persons moral character, could I just use id dughrii, and if so, is this the masculine form?


 
Natives will correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't recall hearing الدغري except as a name. It acts as an adverb or an adjective, and it is also invariable, so no feminine form.

It is a bit of a strange word because it is a loanword from Turkish (doğru means straight, right etc.)

S


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## GDAN

Thank you very much Habibimike.  It appears that the author of my book knows some up to date expressions.  The only thing is the translations may confuse those of us who're not advanced enough to comprehend these expressions without an equivalant expression in our native languages. Now I understand.


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## GDAN

Thank you Finland.


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## Ghabi

And as you might expect, the word اعوج ("crooked") can be used to describe someone's character (both the physical and the moral connotations of the word are used in the opening scene of the movie _Paradise Now_).


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## habibimike

Except that the word "aawaj" is not invariable, Huwa aawaj, hiya aawja....


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## elroy

In Palestinian Arabic, "dughri" is not invariable if it's an adjective.

Huwwe zalame dughri. = He is a moral/upstanding/decent man.
Hiyye binet dughriyye. = She is a moral/upstanding/decent girl.

Is this really different in other dialects? Would you really say "binet dughri"? 

As an adverb, it _is_ invariable, but so are all other adverbs. However, "huwwe bimshi dughri," in Palestinian Arabic, has a different meaning. It means "He walks in a straight line."

We also use "dughri" to mean "straight" in the context of giving directions ("Go straight and then turn left at the light," etc.). 





> Yes, as in English, the word "straight" can refer to both the physical and the moral aspect.


 Can you give an example of "straight" in English used to refer to someone's morals (except for the fixed expression "straight shooter")? 





> So in regards to sentence #1, "she's walking straight" is the same as saying "hiyya bint Tayyiba wi amiina"?


 Not to me. If I meant that, I would say "hiyye binet dughriyye."

In the rent context, I understand the landlord's statement to mean that he is an honest man so the amount he is asking for is reasonable, i.e. he's not overcharging the tenant.

Finally, in Palestinian Arabic, the feminine form of "a3waj" is "3ooja" (by the way, I just realized that in English, "crook" must be related to "crooked"! ).


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## Ghabi

elroy said:


> Can you give an example of "straight" in English used to refer to someone's morals (except for the fixed expression "straight shooter")?


 
Well, a crook can always "go straight"... 



elroy said:


> Finally, in Palestinian Arabic, the feminine form of "a3waj" is "3ooja".



I guess Mike also means the فعلاء pattern, just a matter of different transliteration schemes.


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## elroy

Ghabi said:


> Well, a crook can always "go straight"...


 Can he? I don't think that's idiomatic. I just did a Google search for "crook went straight" and got a measly 7 results, and "straight" is used to mean "directly" in all of them (for example, "went straight to the store's mailbox").

I really don't think you can say that "straight" can be used to mean "morally upstanding" unless it's part of the set expression "straight shooter" (and maybe a couple other idioms, but I can't think of any right now). If you said "That guy is straight," that, to me, would mean that he is not gay. 


> I guess Mike also means the فعلاء pattern, just a matter of different transliteration schemes.


 It's not about the pattern; it's about the pronunciation. I suspect that he means that in Lebanon it's pronounced "3awja", but we say "3ooja," i.e. we use "oo" instead of "aw." This is a common difference between Lebanese and Palestinian (cf. "dawr" vs. "door").


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## clevermizo

elroy said:


> Can you give an example of "straight" in English used to refer to someone's morals (except for the fixed expression "straight shooter")?



"Living straight" or other such collocations sound idiomatic to me but they also sound very defunct or old-fashioned. Part of the reason why straight has changed in meaning is because now it is commonly used to mean "heterosexual" and so the meaning of upstanding morals has fallen out of use.

Straight-shooter also sounds very stilted and old-fashioned. I would expect it in an old movie or something.


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## GDAN

Don't forget about "straight edged" (a person who lives an alcohol and drug free lifestyle), and straight arrow (morally upright).  As Elroy pointed out, the word straight used by itself usually means not gay.

As clevermizo said, these expressions haven't been popular since the late 1980's. (thanks for making me feel old)  However, Habibimikes use of the (ancient slang from black and white movies ) helped me.  My knowledge of arab language and culture is still too weak to understand these idioms.  Finding an idiom in english that has a close meaning has been my crutch until I'm able to think in arabic.

Thank you Elroy. Now I know the translation could drastically change depending on the nationality of the translator.  I am surprised to learn that Habibimike would have a translation closer (if not identical to my Egyptian arabic book) than you. Since Lebanon is further away from Egypt I would think your translation would be closer. Just shows that I have a lot to learn.


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## AndyRoo

elroy said:


> Can you give an example of "straight" in English used to refer to someone's morals (except for the fixed expression "straight shooter")?


 
In British English:

"I'm a straight kind of guy" (famously said by Tony Blair as one of his dodgy deals was being investigated) means "I'm an honest man". It would work OK in this example with the landlord.

And I agree that a crook (or any other dishonest person) can "go straight" as Ghabi says. If you look up "going straight" you'll get lots of results on Google.

"Straight up" means "honestly". 
"I'll be straight with you" means "I'll be honest with you".


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## elroy

GDAN said:


> I am surprised to learn that Habibimike would have a translation closer (if not identical to my Egyptian arabic book) than you.


 Where exactly do you think we differ? As far as I can tell, Habibimike didn't comment directly on the translation of the sentence about the rent.

By the way, I need to alter what I previously said about that sentence. I hadn't read your post closely; in the absence of context, I understood it to mean "morally upright," but I just noticed that this is said in response to a question about the rent. In that case, it could also mean "straightforward," as in, "I'm not going to play any mind games by starting with an overly high price and having you haggle with me until we get to the lowest price I'm willing to accept." So yes, in that context, it _implies _"no bargaining" because it would be a waste of time. 





AndyRoo said:


> In British English:
> 
> "I'm a straight kind of guy" (famously said by Tony Blair as one of his dodgy deals was being investigated) means "I'm an honest man". It would work OK in this example with the landlord.
> 
> And I agree that a crook (or any other dishonest person) can "go straight" as Ghabi says. If you look up "going straight" you'll get lots of results on Google.
> 
> "Straight up" means "honestly".
> "I'll be straight with you" means "I'll be honest with you".


 I am familiar with the last two but not the first two.


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## Ghabi

clevermizo said:


> Part of the reason why straight has changed in meaning is because now it is commonly used to mean "heterosexual" and so the meaning of upstanding morals has fallen out of use.



It never fails to bring a smile on my face when I see the English version of Nietzsche's book is still titled _The Gay Science_.


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## GDAN

I guess I assumed his translation was closer.  My assumption came from the fact he used "hiya be temchi dughri" in his example of how the word can be used to describe moral character (same as the book with possible difference in pronunciation).  If I understood you correctly this would mean "he walks in a straight line" to a Palestinian.

Looking at your last post, I see that in regards to the landlord example, you two seem to agree about the translation.
Please correct me if I am wrong. I'd rather learn to speak and understand the language correctly than be concerned with my pride.


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## elroy

Oh, I see!  I thought you were talking about the example with the landlord.

Yes, as I said, "hiyye btimshi dughri" means "She walks in a straight line" in Palestinian Arabic.  If Habibimike was saying that that means "She is morally upstanding" in Lebanese, then that is indeed a difference between the two dialects.


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