# ennyit vmiről



## MSZ

"_ennyit valamiről_" - is it equivalent to English "_so much for ..."?
_*
-ról, -ről  *in Hungarian can mean "_about"_: _"A kalap*ról* beszeltunk" _->_ "We were talking about the hat"_

In English, there is a construction with _about:_ 

 "so much _about_ the town" - in this case, the phrase indicates that we have this much, and no more, to say _about_ the town.  This is the way I would most naturally (and neutrally) understand Hungarian *-ról*: "ennyit a városról".

Contrast this with a construction with _for_:

 "so much _for_ being brief" is used in a situation where you're pointing out something that is the opposite of what was intended or expected, much in the sense of "see, this is how little we respect - how much we give/care *for* - our stated intention of keeping this note brief".  It does not have to be the speaker failing to meet the expectation - it may be some other person or some fact about the world being contrary to expectations. Couple of other contexts:


So much for her being generous (a well-known philanthropist has just given a counterexample of her generosity)
So much for the good weather (rain, when the forecast had called for sunshine)
or even: so much for good weather (where we were simply hoping for good weather, but it turned out bad)
 
So much for him/his being the stronger (a bigger boxer, predicted to win, is knocked out by his opponent)
 I am not certain that I would be comfortable using the Hungarian "_ennyit X-ről_"  in the above contexts where English uses _for_. What do other speakers say? Would "_Ennyit a jó időről_" be appropriate in the middle context above?


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## Zsanna

I would think that although the situation is very similar in Hungarian there may be a twist somewhere... 

_Ennyit a jóidőről_ could be used exactly as you described in English (if I understood you well): "here we are, bad weather is here again!"/"this the end of good weather!"/"this is as far as good weather lasted!". 
Probably in spite of what was announced by the weather forecast but also when this is what you'd expect in the season, meaning winter is coming. 

So in Hungarian it can be used to express either a result that goes against expectations or the end of something (it may be an extended meaning).

I wonder whether you wouldn't use rather "So much about..." in English in the following case. (I stick to the weather-sentence for the sake of simplicity even if practically it may seem a bit strange.) 
If we hear a long (official) argument about the advantages of good weather and, after having some, an unforseen disaster happened exactly proving the opposite or at least provide an important counter example. 
So, in the end it'd mean that nobody would believe the original argument any more. 
Could this be an occasion to say _so much about good weather_?


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## MSZ

Zsanna said:


> I would think that although the situation is very similar in Hungarian there may be a twist somewhere...
> 
> _Ennyit a jóidőről_ could be used exactly as you described in English (if I understood you well): "here we are, bad weather is here again!"/"this the end of good weather!"/"this is as far as good weather lasted!".
> Probably in spite of what was announced by the weather forecast but also when this is what you'd expect in the season, meaning winter is coming.
> 
> So in Hungarian it can be used to express either a result that goes against expectations or the end of something (it may be an extended meaning).
> 
> I wonder whether you wouldn't use rather "So much about..." in English in the following case. (I stick to the weather-sentence for the sake of simplicity even if practically it may seem a bit strange.)
> If we hear a long (official) argument about the advantages of good weather and, after having some, an unforseen disaster happened exactly proving the opposite or at least provide an important counter example.
> So, in the end it'd mean that nobody would believe the original argument any more.
> Could this be an occasion to say _so much about good weather_?



I would still use _so much for_ in your example - I think because it is still a counterexample in the same sense as in the original contexts I provided ("look how much weight we can give this argument ..."). Perhaps in my post I overemphasized "contrary to expectations" - the situation feels quite the same when the actual is contrary to claims or assertions.

As for _Ennyit a jóidőről_: all your contexts imply a change or a termination - we have had some good weather, and it's now over (not necessarily as something different from what was forecast). English _so much for_, on the other hand, does not care whether we are talking about a change or not.  

So let's try this: it has been raining for three days; the announcer tells us that it's going to be sunny and pleasant the next day. The day comes, and there is no change, just as miserable as before. _So much for the good weather (that they forecast)_ is perfectly appropriate. Is _ennyit a jóidőről_?

In the same situation, I could just as easily say:  _So much for the weatherman_. Does  _Ennyit a meteorológusról_ sound good here?


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## Zsanna

It is a tricky case... 


MSZ said:


> So let's try this: it has been raining for three days; the announcer tells us that it's going to be sunny and pleasant the next day. The day comes, and there is no change, just as miserable as before. _So much for the good weather (that they forecast)_ is perfectly appropriate. Is _ennyit a jóidőről_?


It doesn't seem to offer itself easily. 
Maybe _Ennyit a beígért - _promised_ - jó időről_ - because we had only a promise, we didn't actually have any of it in reality (in your example).



MSZ said:


> In the same situation, I could just as easily say: _So much for the weatherman_. Does _Ennyit a meteorológusról_ sound good here?


Again, I wouldn't think so and this is the sign that "so much for" is not really a proper equivalent of "ennyit vmiről". 
I'm not even sure in what situation you'd say it.
But you could say:
_Ó, a meteorológusok és az előrejelzéseik_! or 
_Ennyit a meteorológusokról és az előrejelzéseikről_!

The plural helps to make a general statement about weathermen and weatherforecasts and that sounds more natural. (Even if it does not explain much.)


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## MSZ

Zsanna said:


> It is a tricky case...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Originally Posted by *MSZ*
> In the same situation, I could just as easily say: _So much for the weatherman_. Does _Ennyit a meteorológusról_ sound good here?
> 
> 
> 
> Again, I wouldn't think so and this is the sign that "so much for" is not really a proper equivalent of "ennyit vmiről".
Click to expand...


Hmm. That's what I thought ...


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