# menu items



## pollyb

I am spending new years in Paris and have a menu print out of items being served at dinner. please translate; soupe a l'oignon au petit matin, crottin de chevre marine a l'huile d'olive en verdurette. thank you for your help


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## Helene

OK... well, first thing, you have to know that in some French restaurants they like to put fancy names on their menu, so I guess you want to know what you are going to eat so that's what I'm going to help you with :
Soupe à l'oignon is an onion soup (FYI : "au petit matin" means early in the morning, but don't you jump to the conclusion that we eat onion soup in the morning !)
Crottin de chevre.... : that would be some goat cheese marinated in olive oil with some salad !

Voila ! I hope this helps !

Happy new year and bon appetit !


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## valerie

verdurette does not mean salade, it is just a invented name (I never heard it before) refering to vegetable or to green, that allow you to suppose it IS salad, but not using this trivial word


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## valerie

Shall somebody explain to pollyB what crottin also means?


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## ishatar

Why? Would you have any trouble to do it right?


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## pollyb

Helene said:
			
		

> OK... well, first thing, you have to know that in some French restaurants they like to put fancy names on their menu, so I guess you want to know what you are going to eat so that's what I'm going to help you with :
> Soupe à l'oignon is an onion soup (FYI : "au petit matin" means early in the morning, but don't you jump to the conclusion that we eat onion soup in the morning !)
> Crottin de chevre.... : that would be some goat cheese marinated in olive oil with some salad !
> 
> Voila ! I hope this helps !
> 
> Happy new year and bon appetit !



thank you for your help, I was afraid I would be eating goat!


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## Focalist

Helene said:
			
		

> Soupe à l'oignon is an onion soup (FYI : "au petit matin" means early in the morning, but don't you jump to the conclusion that we eat onion soup in the morning !)


Although you DO. Or, at least, I have (in the company of French friends): "soupe à l'oignon" is the traditional way of finishing off a "night on the tiles" or an all-night party. In fact, I don't think I've ever had onion soup in Paris at any time *other than* the small hours. 

F


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## pollyb

I can't thank you all enough for your answers, they have been extremely helpful and I look forward to having onion soup in the wee small hours of the New Year!!


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## valerie

ishatar said:
			
		

> Why? Would you have any trouble to do it right?




I just would not like to deter him from tasting le crottin de chèvre et toutes ses verdurettes, but it is tempting...


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## pollyb

If you will not explain the translation, we probably will not eat it, do you find it amusing to be sarcastic to someone you don't even know?

Pollyb


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## valerie

Keep cool Pollyb, comme on dit en français  

I mentioned this is ANOTHER meaning of the word, so do not be worried about eating crottin de chèvre, especially with the verdurettes, it is really good, promis juré.

And actually I find it amusing, although I would not like to offend you or to cross you


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## valerie

ishatar said:
			
		

> Why? Would you have any trouble to do it right?



Actually the problem I have is I do not know the translation, and I do not want to explain it. So let me consult mi favorite Collins, and we'll see


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## Focalist

pollyb said:
			
		

> If you will not explain the translation, we probably will not eat it, do you find it amusing to be sarcastic to someone you don't even know?
> 
> Pollyb


Pollyb, I don't think anyone's deliberately trying to be sarcastic: it's just that they've all been pussyfooting about not wanting to just come out with it and say that "crottin de chèvre" mean's "goat's droppings". It's just a name, though... don't let it put you off a delicious cheese 

I once bought a really strong French cheese called "Crotte du Diable". Unfortunately it so filled the cabin that my travelling companions forced me to throw it into the English Channel when we were only halfway home..  

F


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## pollyb

I know crottin means droppings or bodily excretement, someone else was kind enough to inform me of this. Just to be on the safe side I do not think I will eat that salad!

thanks anyway


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## valerie

Thank you, F. you've been more rapid than I. Although I have to correct you, there is no confusion possible in French:
Crottin de chèvre is NECESSARILY cheese
Crottin is the sense of droppings is only used for horses and donkeys, never goats.

So pollyB, will you forgive me? and will you try le crottin de chèvre?

Btw, F. could you explain pussyfooting to me, I can not catch the meaning of it


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## pollyb

pussyfooting means going round and round the real meaning of something without really telling the true meaning / hope you understand.  Another expression similar is beating around the bush!
Pollyb


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## OlivierG

pollyb said:
			
		

> pussyfooting means going round and round the real meaning of something without really telling the true meaning / hope you understand.  Another expression similar is beating around the bush!
> Pollyb


In French, "tourner autour du pot" ?


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## Helene

"tourner autour du pot" is the exact translation... it's funny to see all the different images used to express an idea ! 

And PollyB do eat the cheese... trust me, it's not too strong, and with the salad it's really delicious !


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## Focalist

valerie said:
			
		

> Crottin de chèvre is NECESSARILY cheese
> Crottin is the sense of droppings is only used for horses and donkeys, never goats.


Wow! That must be the famous "précision et clarté de la langue française" kicking in again 

So what I'm dying to know now, Val, is what DO goats drop? And rabbits and sheep and mice and kangaroos? Don't tell me there are special words in French for all of their particular do-dos..! (That's "do-dos" as in "deep do-do", not as in  "Dors, fais dodo, dors mon chéri..." )

F


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## Helene

Well... actually Val was right !!! And there are, indeed, different words depending on the animal !! If you're really interested by the subject I guess I can think of three different names crottin for the horse (or donkey...), bouse for the cow and I guess for the rest you can use crotte (eventhough if you really want to complicate matters I could think of some others...)
So, yeah... French is tricky but who said it wasn't ?  But don't worry, there're always some generic words in French you can use and that everybody would understand !


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## xanana

valerie said:
			
		

> Keep cool Pollyb, comme on dit en français



Vous avez de la chance, d'aujourdhui. Je viens d'apprendre la phrase qui convient: 

_Du calme!_


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## ishatar

pollyb said:
			
		

> Just to be on the safe side I do not think I will eat that salad!
> 
> thanks anyway



What are you afraid of? To actually enjoy it? Come on, it's not like you were to eat _Cervelle d'agneau_ farcie aux _cuisses de grenouilles_ sur lit _d'escargot de bourgogne_! 


Xanana => Les immortels can breath again thanks to you.


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## Felix

Polly,
Chèvre is one of the finest, most subtle and creamiest French cheeses.  I have one English friend who regards all other French cheese as 'foreign muck' (Désolé, mais c’est comme ça) but is addicted to the stuff!  I have to bring it each time I go home. Definitely to be tried.  

Personally I always find English translations of French dishes lose all the poetry (particularly translations in France I'm afraid).  In one favourite restaurant I can find nothing on the English version of the menu that I would want to eat, but the identical items on the French version sound and are delicious.  (Tartiflette: Potato and bacon bake is one example).  For example everyone who likes shell fish and tries the above mentioned _escargot_ enjoys them, while those offered a plate of snails do not!


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## pollyb

Ok, I will try the Chevre (sorry I do not have the proper accent marks on my computer) but if in reality there really are animal droppings in that salad I am going to come looking for all you people who said it was just cheese! 
I also want to thank everyone for all their help, this is a fantastic web site, my husband and I are making our first trip to Paris on Dec. 30, 2004 to spend the new year in Paris, we are so looking forward to it.


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## Lucas

pollyb said:
			
		

> but if in reality there really are animal droppings in that salad I am going to come looking for all you people who said it was just cheese!



Are you joking or what ? Don't keep on insinuating French people are shit eaters, or we might well all get   .
France is the country of fine cuisine. We do not eat jelly.


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## KathleenC

It appears to be time to develop a sense of humor and perspective--in any language.


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## valerie

I would have guessed Lucas was joking, just caricaturating the cliché of the French cuisine...


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## ishatar

What, KathleenC? You dislike our sense of humour?  Well, I'm afraid you may as well don't read our posts any more because we use it all the time! 

PollyB, you are a wise person after all. You will not regret it! (but I'm ready to give you my adress for the fight, just in case  )


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## pollyb

thank you Ishatar for seeing that I was trying to be funny in my statement about hunting down the people recommending I eat the cheese, I am sorry that Lucas did not see the humor in it, I would never insult the French in regards to their food; lighten up Lucas!
for any of you American baseball fans  Go Red Sox!!!!


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## Lucas

pollyb said:
			
		

> lighten up Lucas!



Am I heavy ?

As you had made an ambiguous statement, I made one. How to reply better to an ambiguous question than with an ambiguous answer ? Valérie and Ishatar noticed it... Sorry you didn't.


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## valerie

Are there specific forms of humour or of expressing jokes or irony according to the countries you're from?

I was surprised that only me and Ishatar noticed Lucas was making fun of French cuisine and (supposed) arrogance. The same happened in other threads with English people appearing to have a great time making fun of something nobodyelse would understand

I think that's a question for the culture forum, see you there


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## Focalist

Helene said:
			
		

> I guess for the rest you can use crotte


- Maman, qu'est-ce qu'on mange?
- Des croque-monsieur.
- Je n'aime pas ça des crottes de monsieur!

F


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