# lol



## little_vegemite

Hello, first of all I'll put up the general meaning of lol as this thread isn't about its meaning "lol = laugh/laughing out loud."
What I wanted to know is whether in other countries 'lol' has also become part of everyday speech rather than just confined to the written form on the internet and msn communication? 
It is not necessarily common where I live but I do use it in speech and other people I know do also (then again we are teenagers...and it could be a passing fad), but still...is it used elsewhere in speech? 
Also...do you know of other terms that you find has become incoporated into speech that used to be only used in msn/web speak?


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## Trisia

Oh, this word definitely entered everyday speech in Romania. Among teenagers, of course (I'm 22, way too old for that).

I guess it would be kind of hard to pick up other abbreviations such as this one, because it's very easy to say "lol" instead of "foarte amuzant" ("very funny"), but tc (tee-see) would be a weird way of putting it.

Trisia


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## Kajjo

I have never heard SMS or usenet abbreviations spoken out in everyday language. Maybe some teenagers do so, but surely it did not become part of the German language.

Kajjo


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## Drechuin

little_vegemite said:


> What I wanted to know is whether in other countries 'lol' has also become part of everyday speech rather than just confined to the written form on the internet and msn communication?



In France, it's a very common term on the internet or on your cellphone
 (although we have a translation: _mdr_, standing for _mort de rire_).
But using it while speaking or in more formal writings would be seen mostly as retarded (at least in my experience. I'm not a teenager any longer, so maybe those darn kids are using between themselves more easily).


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## Stéphane89

In Belgium, and I suppose it's the same in France, we use it very much on the internet or in SMS. As for saying it when I speak, I never do so. To be honest, I think it doesn't fit in an oral conversation. But some people do so (although I don't know many of them).


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## Glitz

Ive neverheard anyone over hear speak it specially not my friends, though it can be very easy to accidently go LOL! Becuase most of us tend to spend SO much time on the computer and texting, that we get really used to just abbreviating words.


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## Trisia

Relax, Lil' Vegemite. I'm sure Drechuin didn't mean to offend you! 

I agree that in normal conversation it's inappropriate to use it. And by normal I mean talking to your teachers, parents, friends etc. Not if you're hanging out with your buddies. That's your decision (but I must warn you that prolonged usage helps in reducing your vocabulary skills).

To be perfectly honest, I think I've heard it more when the speaker was being sarcastic. Like:

A: Let me tell you a joke. A giraffe enters a bar.. (blah-blah-blah, very uninteresting joke, silly punch line etc.)
B: lol...


EDIT: I just noticed your question. I should tell you I overheard a conversation on the bus the other day. Two girls (about 12-13, I'd say), were talking about all the flirting they had done in a chatroom, the evening before. It went on like this:

A: He was sooo funny, so I said... lol!
B: No kidding. Is he cute, too?
A: I don't know yet. But I'm gonna find out, lol.
B: By the way, what does lol mean?
A: I don't know. It's about something that's amusing, I think.


"BTW" Don't take this as a typical Romanian conversation...


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## little_vegemite

Good point, I agree, just as using it outside internet/msn/messaging conversations in written form is inappropriate, using it with people in a formal situations is also inappropriate. In response to Glitz, you may find a few months down the line it will become more common...when people first started using it, it was like "oops, how embarrassing, I can't believe I just used msn speak in real life..."


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## Drechuin

little_vegemite said:


> Retarded as in mentally retarded? That worries me. As I use lol in conversation.



I didn't want to offend you. 
Lol fits probably perfectly in English. In fact, maybe it fits also in French between teenagers. But in most situations, it doesn't fit at all.

The reasons
-A lot of people won't even know what you're speaking about (The Internet became common in France later than in other countries -we had the Minitel before- and even amonst those who used the Internet, a lot of them are not interesting in chatting).
-Lol is quite often a symptom of SMS speak (those young grammar-anarchists whose favorite sentence is "lol! I write like I want, we're not in a dictionary! lol!". Sorry, I don't know how to translate their mistakes, but they are legion). Not a good point.
-We have other ways to express mirth and laughters. Like laughing.

That said, I've also used 'lol' orally. When I met some internet friends in real life for example, or sometimes to be sarcastic.
But it's definitely very specific occasions.

Edit


Trisia said:


> "BTW" Don't take this as a typical Romanian conversation...



I'll take this as a typical conversation between twelve-year-old girls. 



little_vegemite said:


> Note: Drechuin did say the french had mdr (mort de rire), although none of the french teens I speak to use that.



Lol seems to be more in vogue those days.
As for why lol is used by French people? The two words are mainly internet-based, most of the Internet is in English, English is mandatory in school as a foreign language... So people use what they see.


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## dunescratcheur

Drechuin said:


> In France, it's a very common term on the internet or on your cellphone
> (although we have a translation: _mdr_, standing for _mort de rire_).
> But using it while speaking or in more formal writings would be seen mostly as retarded (at least in my experience. I'm not a teenager any longer, so maybe those darn kids are using between themselves more easily).



"Retarded" - j'aime.... ou plutôt: mdr!

Older & old fashioned BE speaker that I am, written lol = yes, spoken lol = never heard it.


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## Kajjo

I regard it as highly peculiar to speak in written abbreviations. It's like comic speech of teenagers to much exposed to dumb comics rather than real life.

You wouldn't say *laugh, laugh*, you would just laugh. There is no need to replace emotions by abbreviations in real life. It is just a valid means to convey emotions in transcripted speech like in chats or emails.

Kajjo


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## little_vegemite

Kajjo, it would seem so, but I think it may be a symptom of using msn conversation/internet chat/messaging, etc. too much that what we use to express ourselves in written form ends up being a more valid way of expressing ourselves all the time. (this isn't necessarily what I do, I'm just postulating a theory about modern communication here)


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## Drechuin

little_vegemite said:


> Kajjo, it would seem so, but I think it may be a symptom of using msn conversation/internet chat/messaging, etc. too much that what we use to express ourselves in written form ends up being a more valid way of expressing ourselves all the time. (this isn't necessarily what I do, I'm just postulating a theory about modern communication here)



I rather agree, especially since the border between spoken language and critten language becomes more and more blurry.

I mean that before the internet (especially instant messengers), it was almost impossible to have a written real-time conversation. Either with a mail or an e-mail, you had time to write, without an immediate answer.
Now, on IRC or MSN you literally write like you speak. It influences the way you write, it wouldn't be surprinsing if it also influence the way you speak.


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## little_vegemite

I agree with Drechuin, what I find funny is sometimes now people are talking and they go "I was speaking to her/him yesterday and he/she said...and then I said...and then..." and it goes on like this, and the way you can tell that they were actually speaking on a real-time messenging service (like msn) is that they are "typing" in midair with their fingers (unconsiously) as they tell you what the other person and themselves were talking about...: ) heehee.


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## Dragontail77

Hello,

I thought that this kind of abbreviation existed mainly due to space restrictions on mobile phones (remember the earlier phones, which only had space for a 30-character SMS, compared to today's 4G versions, which can easily handle several times that amount), and in order to facilitate and accelerate written communication on MSN and similar services (easier to write 'lol' or 'btw' than the full version).

I'd be very surprised to find these abbreviations sneaking their way back into oral communication, mostly for two reasons. Firstly, if I were to have a spoken conversation with you, little vegemite, there wouldn't be any space restrictions, and secondly, there would be a limit to how 'abbreviated' and 'accelerated' the conversation could become, before descending into unintelligibility, right?

If you were reading out a URL, "double-you double-you double-you dot..." is standard, I think. But if I told you I spent my Saturday surfing on the double-you double-you double-you, I reckon you would understand, but think I was weird .


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## Kajjo

little_vegemite said:


> Kajjo, it would seem so, but I think it may be a symptom of using msn conversation/internet chat/messaging, etc. too much that what we use to express ourselves in written form ends up being a more valid way of expressing ourselves all the time. (this isn't necessarily what I do, I'm just postulating a theory about modern communication here)


Well, I would regard it as highly irritating if someone would not laugh, smile, look sad but just say *laugh*, *smile* and *cry, cry*. This borders on being ridiculous in my point of view. This is nothing better than comic speech and loss of reality. Even teenagers must be able to whole-heartedly laugh or to show all other kinds of emotions. I myself type very much in the internet, but would never have the idea to say to real persons things like comic or SMS speech.

I really do not understand you argument, because typing *smile* is imitating real life, is giving the other one the clue that you would smile now in real life. So why on earth do not actually smile in real life? This should be one-way.

Kajjo


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## little_vegemite

Kajjo said:


> Well, I would regard it as highly irritating if someone would not laugh, smile, look sad but just say *laugh*, *smile* and *cry, cry*. This borders on being ridiculous in my point of view. This is nothing better than comic speech and loss of reality. Even teenagers must be able to whole-heartedly laugh or to show all other kinds of emotions. I myself type very much in the internet, but would never have the idea to say to real persons things like comic or SMS speech.
> 
> I really do not understand you argument, because typing *smile* is imitating real life, is giving the other one the clue that you would smile now in real life. So why on earth do not actually smile in real life? This should be one-way.
> 
> Kajjo


 
Um...There's a difference between things like "lol" and *smile* and *shrugs*, etc. 'lol' doesn't necessarily replace you actually laughing, on msn, etc. you can use "haha, hehe, etc." as well, and you don't say those in spoken unless you're being really sarcastic, but 'lol' can replace "that was funny." Although you're not actually laughing or "That would be funny" It doesn't replace an action...(and I don't have a consistent argument, sorry.)


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## little_vegemite

No, jokes. I'm not sure, but I was just pointing out that abbreviations don't necessarily have to be discounted simply because they were originally created when there were space constraints and then once space constraints are gone they are invalid...Anyways, I think this is going off topic, I only wanted to know how people used it in other countries.


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## Chaska Ñawi

Moderator Note:  I notice a distinct correlation between the existence of a thread on chatspeak and a number of very chatty posts.

If people wish to discuss the edging of chatspeak into conversation, together with the demographic in which conversational chatspeak appears, this is acceptable.  Chat is not.


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## Dragontail77

little_vegemite said:


> I think this is going off topic, I only wanted to know how people used it in other countries.


Agreed.  I'd say no, in that case: with my friends, web/sms-speak is not used verbally, no matter how informal the register, for the reasons that Kajjo has outlined.  But informally, and in its original media, it is used occasionally.


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## geve

Two of my co-workers use LOL in speech frequently, and they're closer to 30 years old than 20, but they're heavy users of instant messengers. I'm not, and I find this new "word" somewhat ridiculous - but then I don't like it much in writing either (in a French text I mean).

They use it on its own, as an interjection. It does not replace the actual fact of laughing. It rather replaces comments one can make about something funny, such as "excellent" or "so funny" or "good one".

I think this is indeed due to a heavy practice of messengers; when they're used heavily, new forms of communication tend to spread to other areas of life. To take another example, it is quite common in France to say "bisous" or "je t'embrasse" at the end of a conversation on the phone. But now, probably because of the rise of mobile phones, it is not uncommon to hear someone say "bisous" as a goodbye to someone, _when they're actually standing in front of each other_. Why say it when you have the person in front of you and can simply do it? And - most of the times - when you just did?...

These new forms of speech probably spread more quickly among young people, because they're more open to change and tend to use new communication technologies more. But I'm sure we'll all get used to it eventually!


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## HistofEng

I'm 22 years old and I say "lol" in speech sometimes. I'm not actually thinking of laughing when I say it.

It's more like saying "I find that amusing," and I'm usually smiling when I say it. It's more of a "filler" word.

It's usually used when talking to friends I'm really comfortable with.


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## HistofEng

Another one that is used almost as frequently as "lol" is "wtf"

It's an abbreviation for "What the fuck," which is an expression used to convey disbelief.

The thing is when you write or read "lol" or "wtf" when messaging someone over the internet, you don't actually think "Laugh out loud" or "What the fuck." Rather, you think "L-O-L" and "W-T-F."

What's also very interesting is that some people just say "What the" instead of the whole expression. I've also heard people on occasion say out loud "What the fff..." which curiously mimics what one would hear listening to network televsion in the United States since they mute out the curse words.


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## Macunaíma

But isn't *lol *used to _indicate_ that the person is laughing? So, during an actual conversation, why not just laugh instead of using an acronym to _indicate_ that you are (would be) laughing? That sounds absurd! But then there are a lot of acronyms that are used in speech in English, which doesn't happen in my language, so perhaps that's not so uncommon and that's just me... I watched the film The Queen on TV the other day and I was surprised to see the Queen saying "_She's no longer an HRH _( pronounced: _aitch-ar-aitch_ )" and her Personal Assistant (I'm not sure now if that was the name of his job...anyway) at one point said, in a scene where he was rushing up the stairs "_Tell him to come here a.s.a.p._ ( _ay-es-ay-pee_ )". I had always thought those were only used in writing...

.


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## HistofEng

Macunaíma said:


> But isn't *lol *used to _indicate_ that the person is laughing? So, during an actual conversation, why not just laugh instead of using an acronym to _indicate_ that you are (would be) laughing? That sounds absurd!
> .


 
That's the thing! When people write "lol" they are usually not laughing. The most they are usually doing is just smiling. When people are really laughing they usually put "hahahaha." If they just put 2 "ha's" [haha] then they probably aren't laughung either. 

This has been my experience with internet chatting and messaging. And I've actually talked about the above subject on more than one occasion with friends


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## little_vegemite

geve said:


> Two of my co-workers use LOL in speech frequently, and they're closer to 30 years old than 20, but they're heavy users of instant messengers. I'm not, and I find this new "word" somewhat ridiculous - but then I don't like it much in writing either (in a French text I mean).
> 
> They use it on its own, as an interjection. It does not replace the actual fact of laughing. It rather replaces comments one can make about something funny, such as "excellent" or "so funny" or "good one".
> 
> I think this is indeed due to a heavy practice of messengers; when they're used heavily, new forms of communication tend to spread to other areas of life. To take another example, it is quite common in France to say "bisous" or "je t'embrasse" at the end of a conversation on the phone. But now, probably because of the rise of mobile phones, it is not uncommon to hear someone say "bisous" as a goodbye to someone, _when they're actually standing in front of each other_. Why say it when you have the person in front of you and can simply do it? And - most of the times - when you just did?...
> 
> These new forms of speech probably spread more quickly among young people, because they're more open to change and tend to use new communication technologies more. But I'm sure we'll all get used to it eventually!


 
I agree with you geve, that what is important for people to note about 'lol' used in speech is *it is not replacing actual laughing* it is replacing phrases like "that was funny" "good joke" , etc. So what it has become (for some people at least) is not "laugh out loud" as in "I'm laughing" it is a 'word' replacing a whole phrase : ). 

And in response to Macunaima, people do use asap a lot actually and it can also be said "aysap" (without pronouncing each letter). In australia nd probably in lots of other places too, we use "B.Y.O" alot as well for "Bring your own" - as in "Its BYO drinks." And to HistofEng, people in Sydney (not me though and I don't want to name a cultural group in case I'm simply repeating what was a stereotype and then offending anyone who may happen to be of said cultural group) well some people say "w.t.f mite?" (said phonetically mite = mate).


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## Max.89

In Italy we don't use lol in speeches,you would seem quite stupid.
We use lol in forums or at most in sms messages.


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## geve

"Asap" (pronounced as a full word, never spelled out) is widely used in France, at least in business speak. (I find it even more interesting when the acronym comes from another language, and at one point stops being a mere combination of initials to become a noun in itself... eg. RSVP)

LOL is to young people and technology-addicts what ASAP is to businessmen!


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## Alxmrphi

Where I live, using "lol" in everyday language is confined to more of a young generation that live on MSN and usually type more than talk to others.

Nobody would say "lol" like one word seriously, it's always for comic effect, like if we're sitting at a table in a pub, and someone says a bad joke, and someone else wants to be sarcastic, that's when saying "lol" would fit in, and it'd be a funny joke.

Two other examples of SMS language used like 'lol' are 'omg' (oh my god), but this is spelt out (oh-em-gee) when said.

The other is when someone is being sarcastic and might combine it with "omg" but they say "one one one one", because when people over-react on MSN it's usually

!!!!!!!!!!!!11!!!!!! - As the "1" key is the same for "!" usually at the end there are mixed in "1's" and it'd be comical to actually say "one one one", and people'd know exactly what was going on (most anyway)

As for it entering speech in a normal and real way, definitely not, at least where I come from, it's always used jokingly.


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## HistofEng

Alex_Murphy said:


> !!!!!!!!!!!!11!!!!!! - As the "1" key is the same for "!" usually at the end there are mixed in "1's" and it'd be comical to actually say "one one one", and people'd know exactly what was going on (most anyway)
> 
> As for it entering speech in a normal and real way, definitely not, at least where I come from, it's always used jokingly.


 
Wow...that's a new one. I know people who say "o-m-g" and "o-m-f-g" (oh my fucking god) but I don't know anyone who says "one one one."


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## luis masci

In Spanish (and apparently in most Latin languages) we usually don’t use abbreviations like "lol".The only one I can remember right now is MFT.
It’s said when someone is completely wrong or totally clueless with something. 
But it has probably just a very local usage and I doubt other than Argentineans can understand it.


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## Earth Dragon

I haven't heard this outside of TV or videogames. When it is done, it is mostly used to make fun of chatty little girls or computer geeks.


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## dn88

little_vegemite said:


> Hello, first of all I'll put up the general meaning of lol as this thread isn't about its meaning "lol = laugh/laughing out loud."
> What I wanted to know is whether in other countries 'lol' has also become part of everyday speech rather than just confined to the written form on the internet and msn communication?
> It is not necessarily common where I live but I do use it in speech and other people I know do also (then again we are teenagers...and it could be a passing fad), but still...is it used elsewhere in speech?
> Also...do you know of other terms that you find has become incoporated into speech that used to be only used in msn/web speak?



It is commonly found in everyday speech in Poland (I mean especially among teenagers), some even dare to say "LOL2" (I suppose the expression has its roots in our Polish Internet communicator ) which is not so common but can be heard from time to time.


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## Fernando

I confirm luis masci comment for Spain. I assume that nobody over 40 will even know what you are speaking about. 

I am not a heavy SMS/IM user nor a teenager, so I could be wrong for those groups.

I discovered what lol was in this forum, I think.


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## Antpax

Fernando said:


> I discovered what lol was in this forum, I think.


 
So did I. I completely agree with Luis and you.

Ant


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## Etcetera

'Lol' is used in blogs and on icq, though not so often. On forums, people prefer to use smileys.
I've never heard this word in speech, but that doesn't mean that it isn't used - I may not have the chance to hear it. There are, however, some abbreviations which are used in speech - IMHO, for example. It's really popular over here.


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## little_vegemite

What does IMHO mean?


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## geve

It just occurred to me that when you see things like "I heart this", "lol" was bound to appear as a word in itself...

(IMHO = In My Humble Opinion)


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