# patent coffee



## rossana54

Ancora io ragazzi. Siamo sempre a fine ottocento. Si parla di pensioni per villeggianti che "soothed their clients with patent coffee". Patent coffee è per caso un tipo particolare di caffé, o posso tradurre semplicemente con "caffé speciale"?

Grazie


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## entrapta

E finisce così? E dire che ho tradotto anche roba sul caffè ma mai sentito patent coffee... a naso direi anche io una varietà pregiata di caffè però...boh.


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## rossana54

ok, grazie lo stesso


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## Tegs

Sicura che non era "p*o*tent" coffee? Patent coffee non ha senso...


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## a malta

Ciao a tutti!
Visto che sto andando a prendere il caffè dalla mia nonna...
Tegs, non trovi che ci sia un po' di contrasto ..."sooth with potent coffee" sarebbe alleviare/ calmare...e calmavano i villeggianti con caffè potente, forte?
Magari Rossana ci racconta qualcosa in più...
Vado, resto curiosa di saper come si risolve a m


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## Tegs

a malta said:


> Tegs, non trovi che ci sia un po' di contrasto ..."sooth with potent coffee" sarebbe alleviare/ calmare...e calmavano i villeggianti con caffè potente, forte?



Forse si, ma immagino che dipende dal contesto che c'è. Comunque, "potent" si usa come aggettivo per descrivere il caffè, invece "patent" no. Patent come aggettivo voul dire "evidente/ ovvio". Calmare con caffè ovvio mi sembra molto più strano come idea che calmare con caffè forte


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## Anja.Ann

Ciao a tutti  

Azzardo: "patent" 6. e 7. 

Potrebbe trattarsi di caffé proveniente da terreni dati in concessione dallo stato? 
Ho trovato un documento che parla di "Land Surveys" (1800) di colonie e piantagioni: 
"The lands were patented originally by the Coffee survey. This Coffee and/or Ellicott line ran just north of Lake Jackson at what is now the town of Florida. .." (pagina 20)


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## Tegs

Anja.Ann said:


> Ciao a tutti
> 
> Azzardo: "patent" 6. e 7.
> 
> Potrebbe trattarsi di caffé proveniente da terreni dati in concessione dallo stato?
> Ho trovato un documento che parla di "Land Surveys" (1800) di colonie e piantagioni:
> "The lands were patented originally by the Coffee survey. This Coffee and/or Ellicott line ran just north of Lake Jackson at what is now the town of Florida. .." (pagina 20)



Hm, se fosse _patent*ed *_coffee, potrebbe essere un caffè che è protetto legalmente con il processo di "letters patent". It would be weird, though, to patent a coffee. People patent inventions and exciting new products that might be stolen by competitors. Coffee doesn't seem to me to require patents...


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## Anja.Ann

Tegs, 

I was thinking of possible "coffee" coming from a "patent", i.e. "land granted" by the government ... we are in the 1800s  ... it was just an idea, not that good, but ... I hoped it could somehow help.


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## Holymaloney

Hi 
Just wondering if _*patent *_here could mean _*shiny*_, as in _patent _leather shoes .
What an even stranger sentence it would be though. Dunno, Tegs? Anja?

EDIT: Anja, secondo me il tuo suggerimento è il più plausibile


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## Anja.Ann

Dunno either  Holy dear  
Have a great weekend, BTW!


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## Tegs

Anja - that might be possible, I suppose it would depend on the rest of the context - like whether the text is set in America or not. We could do with more input from Rossana, I reckon  

Holy - in the case of patent shoes, patent refers to the way the leather has been treated. So in order for something to be patent (in the meaning of shiny), it must be made of leather in the first place. So, unless the coffee is reeeaaally bad.... haha!


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## You little ripper!

Tegs said:


> So in order for something to be patent (in the meaning of shiny), it must be made of leather in the first place. So, unless the coffee is reeeaaally bad.... haha!


As in _tastes of old boots_?


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## Tegs

You little ripper! said:


> As in _tastes of old boots_?



More like _made _of old boots - even scarier! Bleeurrgh!


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## Holymaloney

Tegs said:


> Anja - that might be possible, I suppose it would depend on the rest of the context - like whether the text is set in America or not. We could do with more input from Rossana, I reckon
> 
> Holy - in the case of patent shoes, patent refers to the way the leather has been treated. So in order for something to be patent (in the meaning of shiny), it must be made of leather in the first place. So, unless the coffee is reeeaaally bad.... haha!


 Quite right Tegs! But I've read and heard so many strange things since I've been here, I suppose anything goes . Agree that we need more information from Rossana who apparently has made a run for it .........may well do the same meself actually


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## Anja.Ann

Oh, Rip, ciao!  
Let's all have a coffee  ... and wait for Rossana!


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## Tegs

Oops, Holy, sorry, forgot you were a native, doh, hence the pointless explanation about leather, oh well. Anja - good thinking! I'm having one as I type and thankfully, it doesn't taste of old boots! But I envy you your Italian coffee....


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## Anja.Ann

Join us, Tegs!  Oh, please, bring us some real Irish champ, BTW!


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## Tegs

Anja.Ann said:


> Join us, Tegs!  Oh, please, bring us some real Irish champ, BTW!



Will do!


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## rossana54

ragazzi, scusate il ritardo. Sì, siamo in America.

Io ho visto che patent significa anche "di buona qualità", così ho tradotto caffé speciale, che si accorderebbe con soothed, viziati, blanditi. Che ne pensate?


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## pescara

One of the definitions I found for patent is "proprietary."  Could it be that each of these pensioni had its own proprietary blend of coffee?  Maybe they roasted their own coffee beans, so that different pensioni would serve different kinds of coffee depending on the kind of beans they used, how they roasted them, etc...  It is not a common usage of "patent" but it is in the dictionary and it could make sense in the context.  

Ciao.


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## rossana54

mmm yes, maybe.

Thanks a lot


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## Holymaloney

pescara said:


> One of the definitions I found for patent is "proprietary." Could it be that each of these pensioni had its own proprietary blend of coffee? Maybe they roasted their own coffee beans, so that different pensioni would serve different kinds of coffee depending on the kind of beans they used, how they roasted them, etc... It is not a common usage of "patent" but it is in the dictionary and it could make sense in the context.
> Ciao.



Yes, could very well be, a sort of own brand sort of thing


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## london calling

I still think we need more context. To me _patent coffee_ is a colour. 

Rossana, è un romanzo? In quale paese stiamo? Si parla dell'ottocento, ma è uno scritto dell'ottecento o è solo ambientato nell'ottocento? Il contesto va dato fin dall'inizio....


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## pescara

I found another definition for patent that makes more sense in this context.  See definition #3 under adjectives in the link below: _high quality_.    

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/patent

Ciao.


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## rossana54

Grazie pescara


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## Einstein

Holymaloney mentioned patent leather and it was the first thing I thought of too! Patent leather is imitation, artificial leather and I wondered if patent coffee was some kind of artificial coffee, a forerunner of Nes**** (no advertising!). I remember something called "Camp coffee" (which I can advertise as I'm sure it doesn't exist any more) when I was a child. I don't know when that was invented. The opposite of good quality coffee, but the kind of thing a British boarding house (pensione) might well have offered its guests.

PS I see here that Camp coffee hasn't disappeared altogether and, reading this, I think it's quite likely to be the solution (no pun intended).


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## Teerex51

Einstein said:


> Patent leather is imitation, artificial leather ...



Actually, patent leather is _real leather_ with a glossy finish   (See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent_leather)


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## Einstein

Teerex51 said:


> Actually, patent leather is _real leather_ with a glossy finish   (See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent_leather)


OK, so I'm probably thinking of _imitation patent leather_.
Something like "Camp Coffee" stlll seems a possible explanation, given the context.


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## rossana54

Yes, so in two words bad coffee, cioè caffè scadente.

Right?


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## Teerex51

rossana54 said:


> Yes, so in two words bad coffee, cioè caffè scadente.
> 
> Right?



Ciao Rossana, I really don't think so.
I've just read this intriguing thread and, for what it's worth, I have my own theory about "patent coffee".
Until the 1800s, coffee was brewed simply by adding hot water to ground coffee beans. Then, midway through the century, two different types of coffeemakers were invented (percolators and coffee brewers).
Both were patented and enjoyed instant (_oops _) success because the resulting brew was clear and free of grounds. _Patent coffee_ (in my opinion) is nothing but coffee made with one of the then new, patented devices.

(If the author had simply wanted to say "bad coffee", I'm sure he/she would have found a less perplexing way of saying it...)


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## rossana54

Ciao.Tee.


Sì, capisco il tuo punto. Grazie davvero


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## Tegs

Hey Teerex, a very interesting addition to the discussion - your knowledge of coffee history is impressive  Anyway, that theory seems to make sense


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## Teerex51

Thanks Tegs, I had a little help from the Internet...


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## Tegs

Teerex51 said:


> Thanks Tegs, I had a little help from the Internet...



Haha! Ok, I'll change my last comment to: your googling skills are impressive


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