# 华夏圆梦 天下归心



## J.F. de TROYES

This is one of the slogans used on a poster about " the Chinese dream" and I can't make it out.

I suppose that 华夏圆梦 means  China ( or: Old China ) is achieving a dream, but what about 天下归心 ? Submitting the world ?

Could you please help me out. Thanks a lot.


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## Skatinginbc

The idiom 天下歸心 basically means 全民都心悅誠服地擁戴領導者 "Everybody willingly and gladly comes to support the ruler".
It can be used in various contexts, for instance,  
1. To praise a former ruler for his achievement: XXX was so great that "the entire nation readily supported him"
2.  To express the wish of a ruler: XXX wishes to do his best for the people so that "the entire nation will readily support him".
3. To  flatter a ruler: The ruler will     be extremely happy (龍心大悅) if you send a message to the public that he has done so much for us that many of  our dreams have been fulfilled and "the entire nation is gladly  supporting him". 
4. To brainwash people with a picture of peace:  Our collective dreams will soon be fulfilled and "the  whole nation will stand united for our common goals". The slogan 天下歸心 goes well with a beautiful picture of 百鳥朝鳳 (also called 百鳥朝王) in which  a phoenix is surrounded and admired by numerous smaller birds.  The  phoenix represents the ruler (the emperor) and the small birds represent  us, the "small" people.      

華夏 could carry the connotation of "Greater China" and 天下歸心 could suggest the wish of unification.


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## SuperXW

I believe Skatinginbc has given you good explanations. As a political slogan, this sentence is sensational but ambiguous. You can expect different interpretations from both supporters and opponents (although the majority of mainland Chinese won't be the opponents). My experience is that most Chinese have the complex that the big country was too weak to get respect from other countries, even its own people were all trying to move overseas. It is like "the heart of the nation" was "falling apart". Nowadays, as the country is getting stronger again, the natives' dream seems fulfilled. If so, foreigners should admire Chinese, and oversea Chinese may think about "go back to the motherland". This can be described as 天下归心, as "all people's hearts trend toward China", No.4 in Skatinginbc's post. It can be interpreted, but not necessarily, as "the wish of unification".

The idiom originally associates with the ruler and its government, however, this age is not like the old time when most Chinese really loved and idolized them, and attributed every success to them. Today, people only feel good about the idiom as they consider themselves as members of this stronger nation.


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## fyl

When I google this "华夏圆梦 天下归心", I encountered a picture also with the "24 characters socialism core values" on it. They invented this thing last year, and they tried to make people RECITE it (!!), which has become a laughter. (Our Publicity Department must be the smartest organization ever existed.)

Apparently this is a flattery done by exaggeratedly publicizing the two things "Chinese dream" and "socialism core values" that were explicitly proposed by the leader.
The exact meaning would be secondary. 天下归心 can be explained differently but I would say it means "gaining people's heart (including general acceptance of the values and the legitimacy of ruling) is one part of the dream".


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## Ghabi

天下归心 is the last line of a well-known poem by no one less than Cao Cao. Whoever dares to use this expression must have a very high opinion of themselves.


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## Skatinginbc

What is a "sugar-coated pill"? You hide a bitter pill inside some pleasant  sweet stuff so that people take it without detecting the unpleasantness  of it.  The true intention is to make people take the pill.  What is a  "sugar-coated message" or "brainwashing"?  You hide a message in some  nice words so that people take it without detecting the unpleasantness  of it.  The true intention is to instill the message. To me, the "24 core values" and "Chinese dreams" seem to be the sugary, nice  words, something everyone likes to hear--righteous, hopeful, pleasant,  and sweet, and the message they truly try to sell with that  poster seems to be: "Trust our great leader, submit ourselves to our great leader, accept the legitimacy of our great leader" 信任、支持、遵從我們偉大的領袖. 


J.F.  de TROYES said:


> what about 天下归心 ? Submitting the  world?


To conquer the "world" 天下?  It _does_ have that shade of  connotation.  Cao Cao, who made the phrase 天下歸心 famous, indeed harbored  the ambition of conquering the "world" 天下 (i.e., unifying the Sinosphere).  The slogan 天下歸心 combined with a  picture of 百鳥朝王 evokes a sense of Sinocentrism or Imperialism.  It  just seems so "封建".  And that "封建" mentality ironically contradicts to one of the sugary "24 core values" listed in the campaign, that is,   民主 (民主 = sugarcoating; 封建 = bitter pill kept from plain sight).


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## SuperXW

If my memory serves, Cao Cao wrote 周公吐辅，天下归心. At least he was referring to the story of 周公, one of the legendary saint king in the ancient time. All people's hearts belonged to 周公 because he treated his subordinates very well. If this is the case, not too bad for a ruler's methodology, I'd say.


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## Skatinginbc

> 周公吐辅，天下归心.


表達求才若渴的心情、想實現統一國家(天下)的大業.
天下 = 天子治下的領土
天子 = 統治天下的帝王, 帝王受天命而有天下, 故稱「天子」.
曹操挾天子以令諸侯.  諸葛亮所謂的「天下三分」, 其「天下」指的是「漢土」.


SuperXW said:


> oversea Chinese may think about "go back to the   motherland". This can  be described as 天下归心, as "all people's hearts   trend toward  China".


In that case, I think 四海歸心 would be better.  It can avoid the politically charged "天下" and permit  more flexible interpretations.  爭天下 is often associated   with hegemony  (e.g., 《管子.霸言》夫爭天下者，必先爭人),   while 爭四海 is less political like    scholarly debates (e.g., 《新唐書·韓愈傳贊》愈獨喟然引聖，爭四海之惑) or skill   competitions  (e.g., 《初刻拍案驚奇》龍爭四海竟長空。光搖劍術和星落).  天下 often refers to "the  whole China" (諸葛亮《出師表》天下三分) or "the rule or  domination of China"  (e.g., 《論語.泰伯》：泰伯其可謂至德也已矣，三以天下讓).  四海 is less ambiguous as a reference to "all over the known world" (e.g.,   《論語·顏淵》四海之內皆兄弟也).   Above all, 天下歸心 is a _*fixed*_   expression.  It originates from  《論語.堯曰》興滅國，繼絕世，舉逸民，天下之民歸心焉 and was   made popular by Cao Cao.  I'm afraid  that an attempt to make a   different interpretation for that idiom may give an impression of  "cultural and  linguistic contortion".  

"華夏圓夢, 四海歸心" (四海之內的華人都心向祖國) sounds good to me.  I'm more than willing to "心向祖國".  It does not have the connotation of 爭霸 or 真命天子 often associated with 天下.  And please get rid of that 百鳥朝王圖.  It is just so offensive to my eyes.


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## J.F. de TROYES

I really appreciate how rich yor views and explanations are.



Skatinginbc said:


> Above all, 天下歸心 is a _*fixed*_   expression.  It originates from  《論語.堯曰》興滅國，繼絕世，舉逸民，天下之民歸心焉 and was   made popular by Cao Cao.  I'm afraid  that an attempt to make a   different interpretation for that idiom may give an impression of  "cultural and  linguistic contortion".
> QUOTE]
> 
> As my Chinese is poor, could you translate these verses by Cao Cao ?  So can we say that the expression has historically one clear meaning, but can be ( maybe purposely  ) interpreted in different ways as a political slogan ?


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## fyl

天下歸心 is from the Analects instead of Cao Cao according to Skatinginbc. The original sentence is 


> 謹權量，審法度，脩廢官，四方之政行焉。興滅國，繼絕世，舉逸民，*天下*之民*歸心*焉。


My very coarse translation (with bad English..):
Be cautious with measures, examine laws (measures and laws are similar, possibly a metaphor), fix bad official functions, then in all places politics will work.
Revive extinct states, inherit died families (the old China consists of states, a state consists of big families, state and family were structurally similar things at that time), promote the forgotten virtuous wise men, then people *all over the world will turn their hearts to* (the king). (the "world" at that time means all states in China.)

Obviously these two sentences contain good rhetoric and are structurally like a couplet. 天下 and 四方 (underlined) are corresponding words. I wouldn't say 天下 is different from 四方 here. They are both vague concepts meaning "all around".


Cao Cao (曹操) made 天下歸心 popular by his famous verse


> 周公吐哺，天下歸心。


周公 was the culture founding father of the Zhou dynasty, the far origin of Confucianism, an "idol" of Confucius. He should be considered as one of the early creators of the Chinese civilization.
周公 was also said to be perfect in ethics. Two of the stories are related here:
1. He was an important politician in early Zhou dynasty and was in charge of the whole country in the most difficult times. But he never thought about taking the power for himself. He stabilized the country, established all kinds of political systems, educated the young king, and returned his power back.
2. He was extremely diligent and easy to approach. He stopped 3 times during a meal, and stopped 3 times during washing his hair, to meet with people.
The first sentence 周公吐哺 refers to the second story. 吐哺 means "spit out food", i.e. stop eating. The verse means "周公 done all those 吐哺 things, and people all around the world turned their hearts to him".

曹操 was the "prime minister" in Han dynasty. He controlled the whole country, and the emperor did not have any power, which was very similar to the situation in the first story of 周公. 曹操 did not took the emperor position through out his life either (though his son did).
In the novel 三国演义, 曹操 made this poem right before (may not be true in real history) the "Battle of Red Cliffs" (an important plan to reunion/conquer the entire China). Obviously, he was comparing himself with 周公, showing off his ambition, and giving the war a righteous color (because he was like the saint 周公).
(In history, according to many people's views, 曹操 was considered not be like 周公 at all. He utilized the emperor instead of being loyal. He was ambitious in conquering the world instead of obtaining people's hearts.)


Today anyone whoever compares themselves to 周公 are simply senselessly boasting, and whoever tried to make connections between a leader and ancient figures are simply blindly flattering.


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## Skatinginbc

> 《論語》謹權量，審法度，脩廢官，四方之政行焉。興滅國，繼絕世，舉逸民，天下之民歸心焉。


Confucian Analects:  "He carefully  attended to the weights and  measures, examined the  body of the laws, restored  the discarded  officers, and the good  government of the kingdom took its course. He  revived  states that had  been extinguished, restored  families whose  line of succession  had been broken, and called to office  those who had  retired into obscurity, so  that throughout the kingdom (天下)  the hearts of the people turned towards him." http://www.cnculture.net/ebook/jing/sishu/lunyu_en/20.html

天下 all Chinese states, the land under the reign of the high king or supreme ruler 
歸 (transitive verb) = render, hand over 
歸心 literally "render one's heart" ==> pay allegiance wholeheartedly 誠心歸附 (Likewise, 歸首 literally "render one's head" ==> surrender 投降; 歸命 literally "render one's life" ==> pay allegiance with total obedience 歸順).
天下歸心 "throughout the nation everyone pays allegiance to the ruler wholeheartedly", "throughout the empire all hearts turned to him"  指全国的民心都归于一统,拥戴新的领导者" (http://www.zdic.net/c/9/15c/351705.htm),  形容天下老百姓心悦诚服 (http://xiaoxue.hujiang.com/cyu/tianxiaguixin/), 獲得全民的信任、支持  (http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-...4U%C2k%A4%DF&pieceLen=50&fld=1&cat=&imgFont=1).   

興滅國，繼絕世，and 舉逸民 are all tactics of winning over "people's hearts" (收買人心), or more accurately, winning over local powers or aristocrats.  None of them actually concerns commoners.  Neither does 周公吐哺, which reflects his eagerness of winning over talents or the elites.  They are examples of how to _win_ a nation 贏取天下.


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## fyl

Skatinginbc said:


> more accurately, winning over local powers or aristocrats.  None of them actually concerns commoners.


Definitely.
In ancient China, the central power did not even have a relationship with the ordinary people. They only had controls on the local powers, local power governed local big families, and families consists of people.  This is the basic of feudalism.
The commoners almost had nothing to do with the emperor/king. Mostly, the local powers were responsible for the concerns about commoners. They were expected to do the same things as the king did to "win" their subordinates. In ancient China, families, states, entire country were similar things and were always analogies of each other.
The whole society was like this before Qin dynasty. The emperor power controls did not go beyond 郡 (big county) before Song dynasty. Even after Song, the central power seldom went below 县(county). The control or whatever relationship between central power and ordinary people is very recent story.


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## Skatinginbc

華夏圓夢, 天下歸心   ==> 歸 is a transitive verb here, structurally parallel to 圓 (tv)  "to  complete, fulfill".  Here, 歸心 is verb phrase and therefore does not   mean 回歸之心 (NP) "nostalgia for home" or 歸附之心 (NP) "intent of submitting  to the authority".  The 歸 in 天下歸心 is not the same as the one in 遊子歸鄉 "return to the homeland", in which 鄉 is a locative whereas 心 in 天下歸心 is a patient (i.e., object of an action).  

歸 in Archaic Chinese is an interesting word.  It can mean 「與」 "hand  over" 獻出 (《康熙字典》與也，許也) or 「投」 "give up" 放棄控權、託付 (《康熙字典》投也，委也; e.g., 投誠 =  投心 = 歸心 = 誠心歸服), somewhat like "to give up" in "Let's give it up for  Michael Jackson, the greatest performer!"  "_*Give* _it _*up*_" carries the sense of "_*let* _yourself _*go*_".   Interestingly, 歸 can also mean "let go" in Archaic Chinese (e.g.,  放牛歸馬).   Thus another possible interpretation for 歸心 is 放心 "let go of  worry"  (e.g., 《商君書·農戰》聖人知治國之要，故令歸心於農; 《史記·魯仲連鄒陽列傳》國敝而禍多，民無所歸心).  Say,  if I see 暴君一死天下歸心, I will seek an alternative interpretation for 天下歸心   because the ruler has died and there is no indication in that sentence  that someone has  taken his place for people to pledge allegiance to.   So I would  interpret 暴君一死天下歸心 as "Once the dictator has died, all  people of the nation let go of their worries" and 暴權一倒天下歸心 as "Once the  evil regime has fallen, all people under the sky let go  of their  worries". Obviously this is not what 華夏圓夢天下歸心 intends to  mean.   放心  does not apply here.

《漢典》 gives four definitions for  歸心, namely, (1) 诚心归附, (2) 安心, (3) 归附的念头, (4) 回家的念头  (http://www.zdic.net/c/2/108/284594.htm).   As explained above, (2), (3)  and (4) do not fit well here, so it  leaves only one interpretation, that  is, 诚心归附.  Other interpretations  for 歸心 would be considered "unorthodox" (not listed in dictionaries) or,  if said nicely, "innovative".


SuperXW said:


> My experience is that most Chinese have the  complex that the big country was too weak to get respect from other  countries, even its own people were all trying to move overseas. It is  like "the heart of the nation" was "falling apart". Nowadays, as the  country is getting stronger again, the natives' dream seems fulfilled.


One "innovative" interpretation of 歸心 could ft your notion  described above: that is, 歸 = 還 "restore"; 歸心 = "restore confidence,  turn their hearts back".  It however implies that the government is  admitting past failure: It lost people's confidence so that it needed to  be restored; It lost people's hearts so that it tried to make them come  back.  I'm not sure if admitting past failure is the message the government intends to send.

The public service ad (公益广告) might have played a trick on people's cognition: The title says "华夏圆梦, 天下归心", while the full text in small prints says "天下归心，华夏梦圆".  There is potentially a difference in the logical sequence.  Compare: 华夏圆梦(因而/才能)天下归心 vs. 天下归心(因而/才能)华夏梦圆 ==> 全天下都誠心歸順(於我), 中國的美夢(因而/才能)成真.       And there is potentially a difference in the tense or mood.  Compare: 华夏圆梦 (中國要完成美夢 or 若中國能完成美夢) vs. 华夏梦圆 (中國的美夢成真了). 
Here is the full text: 谁的巧手剪出春花烂漫？谁的心灵引来百鸟翩跹？春回大地，凤翔九天；天下归心，华夏梦圆。这中国梦的富贵底色哟，是美丽祥和的精神港湾.
Who is 谁?  Who is the 鳳 (百鳥之王) way up in the highest sky (九天; 鳳翔九天唯我獨尊)?  Who is the one that provides us with the "spiritual harbor" 精神港湾?  After reading the full text, I have no doubt it is an ad to glorify and garner support for the communist emperor.


SuperXW said:


> the majority of mainland Chinese won't be the opponents


As you can tell, it's quite a cultural shock for me.  It brings me back to 清朝 when people were used to hear "奴才給老祖宗請安".  Would the majority of the Mainland Chinese agree to the idea of making all Olympic athletes from all over the world dance to the music of 百鳥朝鳳 with a big signage saying "天下归心" as the background?  Would that be a proud moment of the so-called "Chinese dream" 华夏圆梦?


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## J.F. de TROYES

Thanks so much to all of you for sharing with me your great knowledge and helping me to clear up many things. I haven't got yet spare time enough to have a closer look at your translations,explanations and views , what I am keen to do as soon as possible. 
Maybe I'll be led to ask you some more questions, as interestingly your commentaries give various viewpoints.


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## fyl

Skatinginbc said:


> 《漢典》 gives four definitions for  歸心, namely, (1) 诚心归附, (2) 安心, (3) 归附的念头, (4) 回家的念头  (http://www.zdic.net/c/2/108/284594.htm).   As explained above, (2), (3)  and (4) do not fit well here, so it  leaves only one interpretation, that  is, 诚心归附.  Other interpretations  for 歸心 would be considered "unorthodox" (not listed in dictionaries) or,  if said nicely, "innovative".
> 
> One "innovative" interpretation of 歸心 could ft your notion  described above: that is, 歸 = 還 "restore"; 歸心 = "restore confidence,  turn their hearts back".
> 
> The public service ad (公益广告) might have played a trick on people's cognition: The title says "华夏圆梦, 天下归心", while the full text in small prints says "天下归心，华夏梦圆".  There is potentially a difference in the logical sequence.



I'm now sure they got not only opponents but also many haters . I won't comment on the interpretations since it's too political. However, for the language part, I have two comments:
1. I don't think there is a need to make such kind of over-logical analysis to figure out the meaning of 归心, it is obviously 诚心归附, 诚心拥戴, 心悦诚服, 获得全民的支持 as you have mentioned. And this meaning DOES fit SuperXW's explanation well.
2. The switching of words in "华夏圆梦，天下归心" is for the rhyme (漫、跹、天、圆、湾). This kind of trick is extremely frequently seen in Chinese poems and songs (though this is a weird song).


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## Skatinginbc

周公吐哺, 天下歸心 ==> 歸心於誰?  周公.
《隋書.鄭譯傳》 以公德望，天下歸心 ==> 歸心於誰?  The 公 that the speaker has been talking about.
興滅國，繼絕世，舉逸民，天下之民歸心焉 ==> 歸心於誰?  The person that the speaker has been talking about.
凤翔九天；天下归心，华夏梦圆 ==>  歸心於誰?  The 鳳  (i.e., the 谁 who 剪出春花烂漫, the 谁 who 引来百鸟翩跹) that the speaker has been talking about.  My point: 歸心 refers  back to old information (凤翔九天), not forward to new information (华夏梦圆).  


fyl said:


> the meaning of 归心, it is obviously 诚心归附, 诚心拥戴, 心悦诚服,  获得全民的支持 as you have mentioned. And this meaning DOES fit SuperXW's  explanation well.


I'm afraid SuperXW's explanation may not go well with the full text of that poster (凤翔九天；天下归心，华夏梦圆) in which 天下歸心 refers back to 凤翔九天.   Had it not come with the context (i.e., the poem and the  picture on the poster), I would have  accepted SuperXW's interpretation although I still think "華夏圓夢, 四海歸心" would have been better (see  post #8).  
華夏圓夢, 四海歸心 ==> 歸心於何? 歸心於"華夏". 歸 = 奉獻出; 歸心 = 奉獻心力诚心支持


fyl said:


> This kind of trick is extremely frequently seen in Chinese poems and songs


Is it "_extremely_" common to switch the word order *not only* in the phrasal level (圆梦 ==> 梦圆; 甜酸苦辣 ==> 酸甜苦辣) *but also*   in the clausal level (华夏圆梦，天下归心 ==> 天下归心, 华夏梦圆)?  I think it is   not very common even in ancient poems, in which the rules of rhyme as  well as  the requirements for 平仄 are much stricter and therefore there  was a  greater need for a switch. In addition, 天下归心, 华夏梦圆 sacrifices parallelism 對稱 (圆梦 vs. 归心).  If  华夏圆梦，天下归心  were the overriding element or the central idea for the writer,  then  everything including the rhyme would have been built upon it.  Obviously,   there is something more important than that sentence so that the writer   was willing to sacrifice or twist it in many levels.  One possibility  is  that 凤翔九天 is actually the overriding element that the writer was   unwilling to sacrifice, and so the choice of rhyme (in this case, 言前*辙*) for the whole poem was dictated by that phrase.


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## SuperXW

Skatinginbc said:


> As you can tell, it's quite a cultural shock for me.  It brings me back to 清朝 when people were used to hear "奴才給老祖宗請安".  Would the majority of the Mainland Chinese agree to the idea of making all Olympic athletes from all over the world dance to the music of 百鳥朝鳳 with a big signage saying "天下归心" as the background?  Would that be a proud moment of the so-called "Chinese dream" 华夏圆梦?


That's why it is a sensitive political matter, not just a linguistic question.  See, human nature is such a strange thing, our judgement can be so variable based on who we are facing: usually it is totally normal for "our own people" to criticize "our own" government, culture and other things, but whenever a "outsider, foreigner" criticizes them for the same reason, "own people" would not be glad. Even very knowledgeable people would turn to defend themselves, trying to catch foreigners' mistakes.

In reality, the majority of people never know or think too much beside the idiom's (or anything's) apparent meaning. They may not be as well educated or insightful as you guys do. The majority are not always "right". Maybe, many of them actually feel it's a cool idea to make all Olympic athletes from all over the world dance to the music of 百鳥朝鳳 with a big signage saying "天下归心" as the background. You can find similar events, comments, lyrics all over the Internet. 
(《说说中国撤侨那些事儿，美国人无语了》http://www.chanyeren.com/html/TransverselyOn/2015/04/09/10445.html, 
周杰伦《本草纲目》：外邦来学汉字，激发我民族意识；屠洪刚《精忠报国》：我愿守土复开疆，堂堂中国要让四方来贺) 
For any country's government and citizen, can "nationalism" ever be "wrong"? Or, "not supporting the country" is "wrong"?  

In Mainland China, one factor is that in the Great Cultural Revolution, the Party has broken down as many "old cultures" as possible, which created a knowledge gap between some old cultures and new cultures. As the old idiom is being re-used today, most people would not immediately associate it with the old contexts as you do. As long as it is "talking good" about their own group, they would rather interpret it literally, mixing with their "good imagination". 

Sorry if this post involves some political discussion, which could be off-topic? If our dear moderator has to delete it, maybe you can do it after other friends have read it?


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## brofeelgood

SuperXW said:


> Sorry if this post involves some political discussion, which could be off-topic? If our dear moderator has to delete it, maybe you can do it after other friends have read it?



I hope not. Personally, I've found it beneficial to read all your views on the matter, regardless of the grounds or motivation behind - geographically, culturally, politically or otherwise. 

I started off having the same interpretation as Skatinginbc (and still do for most parts), but after all the exchanges, I guess it's unfair to assume a single be-all-and-end-all decipherment of the phrase concerned. At the very least, I know what to (and not to) expect if I were to speak with a friend from China about this next time.

Thanks Ghabi, SuperXW, Skatinginbc, fyl for your time and insights. It's been enlightening.


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## Skatinginbc

Thank you, SuperXW, for your valuable inputs.  I find them very honest and thought-inspiring.   


SuperXW said:


> For any country's government and citizen, can  "nationalism" ever be "wrong"? Or, "not supporting the country" is  "wrong"?


A political message that appeals to nationalism may generate a swell of grassroots support and thereby pressure naysayers to _shut up and sing_  to the music (like the backlash Dixie Chicks experienced).  Perhaps  that's exactly the beauty of the political slogan in discussion.


SuperXW said:


> As long as it is "talking good" about their own group, they would rather  interpret it literally, mixing with their "good imagination".


It  seems to be saying that the slogan is widely supported because of its  ability of entertaining or exploiting the "good imaginations" of a wide  audience (including those Sinocentrists who wish to see 四方来拜) rather than its ability of delivering a message that is proper and precise.     


SuperXW said:


> In  reality, the majority of people never know or think too much beside the  idiom's (or anything's) apparent meaning.


I bet many of  them simply read the big title and not the small prints on the poster  that provides a specific context for that phrase 天下歸心.  If the adults are OK  with sugarcoating, the government is practically licensed to feed the pill to your  children.


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## fyl

Skatinginbc said:


> 谁的巧手剪出春花烂漫？谁的心灵引来百鸟翩跹？春回大地，凤翔九天；天下归心，华夏梦圆。这中国梦的富贵底色哟，是美丽祥和的精神港湾.
> Who is 谁? Who is the 鳳 (百鳥之王) way up in the highest sky (九天; 鳳翔九天唯我獨尊)? Who is the one that provides us with the "spiritual harbor" 精神港湾? After reading the full text, I have no doubt it is an ad to glorify and garner support for the communist emperor.



Basically, in this thread only SuperXW and I are mainlanders who have enough experiences with all the politics and the so-called 「共产中文」. At the beginning, I was thinking your interpretations involved too much hatred. The efforts that have been put in "deciphering" such a routine slogan in a bad way reminded me of cultural revolution. Until seen brofeelgood's post I know people could really think in this way.

There can be many different explanations for what this exactly means.
1. 谁剪出春光烂漫，谁引来百鸟翩跹？这不是疑问句，只是在感叹现在这一派春光灿烂、百鸟翩跹的景象。就好像你出门遇到一群野兽，「哎呀哪来的狼啊」，并不是问哪来的，哪来的也不是要讨论的重点。《青藏高原》：「是谁带来，远古的呼唤；是谁留下，千年的祈盼」是谁？莫名其妙的问题。
那个画就是一幅传统的吉祥画，意义仅止于「祥和」而已，凤凰本身就有吉祥的意义。我上次买了双鞋子上边有龙，难道我脚踩双龙要当神仙了？那么多弯弯绕日子还过不过了？指不定谁家被单子上、椅子上、床铺上、老太太的拐杖上也有二龙戏珠、凤翔九天之类的装饰。
2. 谁剪出春花烂漫，谁引来百鸟翩跹？当然是「春风」啊，「不知细叶谁裁出，二月春风似剪刀」。政治上，春风经常是「新时代」的比喻，比如「沐浴在改革开放的春风里」。
凤凰又是什么？中国啊。近代以来中国一切政治的出发点都是救亡图存，国歌里都是「中华民族到了最危险的时候」，从跌入泥潭到重新翱游天际，这个新时代有哪个政府不会宣扬？
3. 谁剪出春光烂漫，谁引来百鸟翩跹？谁是凤凰？当然是无数普通的中国人。共党在政治宣传上经常强调劳动者的形象，倒退几十年，工农形象几乎到处都是。《在希望的田野上》（彭丽媛成名曲）：我们的家乡，在希望的田野上，炊烟在新建的住房上飘荡，小河在美丽的村庄旁流淌，一片冬麦，那个一片高梁，十里哟嗬塘，十里果香，哎咳哟嗬呀儿咿儿哟，嘿我们世世代代在这田野上生活，为她富裕为她兴旺，我们的理想，在希望的田野上，禾苗在农民的汗水里抽穗，牛羊在牧人的笛声中成长，西村纺花，那个东港撒网，北江哟播种南国打场……
4. 谁剪出春光烂漫，谁引来百鸟翩跹？谁是凤凰？党啊，党的领袖啊。党以前自诩为「无产阶级的先锋队」，现在自称「代表最广大人民的根本利益」，作为「人民代表」，又实际掌控一切政策，当然要自诩为开拓者、创造者。《走进新时代》：继往开来的领路人，带领我们走进那新时代。

这么多解释哪个对呢？要我说，哪个都不对。领导说「中国梦」、「社会主义核心价值观」，底下不以此为题做宣传还想不想混了？这个海报只不过以此为题发挥了一下。你大概不知道现在酒的广告都是「中国梦、梦之蓝」。你大概也不知道因为领导喜欢足球，有的地方干脆把学校里其他的体育项目全部取消了，结果上了新闻被一顿骂。由于近期反腐、政治斗争都比较残酷，官员主动站队，阿谀奉承就多了一些。你要知道在大陆这种响应口号的政治宣传是经常发生的，如果是公家单位，还要参加学习、写心得报告的，这种东西不过是例行公事，哪有什么深层含义？



Skatinginbc said:


> A political message that appeals to nationalism may generate a swell of grassroots support and thereby pressure naysayers to shut up and sing to the music (like the backlash Dixie Chicks experienced). Perhaps that's exactly the beauty of the political slogan in discussion.


This indeed happens. But instead of making naysayers shut up, this caused conflicts or even hate between different groups of people.
Nationalism is the fundermental thing of the party, and the country. A political message in China often involves nationalism.



Skatinginbc said:


> I bet many of them simply read the big title and not the small prints on the poster that provides a specific context for that phrase 天下歸心. If the adults are OK with sugarcoating, the government is practically licensed to feed the pill to your children.


Thanks for the reminding but are you seriously thinking that you know these kind of things better than those who grew up in the environment?
The sugarcoating theory sounds funny. If they ever need a sugarcoat for things like "the leadership of the party", "supporting the great leader", "wish of unification", they already collapsed. They NEVER need a sugarcoat for these things and they NEVER consider these as pills.
Many people simply read the title? The fact is, no one will read this kind of poster. This is a political propaganda. A political propaganda is the lecturing voice from CCTV, the monotone 共产中文 from the course 思想政治 in every school, the boring learning sessions whenever the leader made up a new slogan. Those who voluntarily take a serious look at these kind of things might be crazy or ambitious in politics (or flattering).
Even if people carefully read the poster, few people will interpret it as you did. As I said, there are too many ways to interpret it. Also "supporting for the leader" is nothing new and not interesting at all, people would be guessing for the reason if there is an emphasis on this.


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## Skatinginbc

Thank you, fyl.  Your valuable inputs give us better understanding of the culture in China.  


fyl said:


> 凤凰本身就有吉祥的意义。


彩鳳呈祥是在人看得見的低空飛舞, 而不是在人看不見的太空飛舞. 祥瑞的來臨當然是向你飛近, 哪有飛到九重天, 離你遠去的道理?  A  hovering or  alighting 鳳 tends to symbolize auspiciousness or peace  (e.g., 日下鳳翔雙闕迥，雪中人去二陵稀), whereas a soaring 鳳 often serves as a metaphor  for 人中鳳 "man of men" (e.g., 龍臥乎一崗之顛,唯主而事。 鳳翔於九天之上,非梧不棲).  In 古龍's  《鳳舞九天》, the 鳳 refers to 陸小鳳.  


fyl said:


> 我上次买了双鞋子上边有龙，难道我脚踩双龙要当神仙了？那么多弯弯绕日子还过不过了？指不定谁家被单子上、椅子上、床铺上、老太太的拐杖上也有二龙戏珠、凤翔九天之类的装饰。


If 蔣中正 bragged about his possession of a 龍椅 AND a 龍袍,  I would strongly suspect it to be an expression of an imperial dream.   Get my point?  It depends on who the speaker is and if there is _convergence of evidence_ (天下歸心 + 鳳翔九天 + 百鳥朝王). 


fyl said:


> 谁剪出春光烂漫，谁引来百鸟翩跹？这不是疑问句


They are rhetoric questions like 《青藏高原》是谁带来远古的呼唤；是谁留下千年的祈盼, which can be understood as some sort of  statements (i.e.,  青藏高原带来远古的呼唤；青藏高原留下千年的祈盼), and the interrogative  pronouns are not  meaningless: They actually have a referent. 


fyl said:


> 谁剪出春花烂漫，谁引来百鸟翩跹？当然是「春风」啊...凤凰又是什么？中国啊。


「春风」 makes a lot of sense, but 天下歸心於「春风」(「新时代」) does not.  You may say  天下歸心於「鳳」(「中国」 or 「中華民族」), but such metaphor is not common (if ever  existent) in  the Chinese society I've lived in.  龍 could have opened  up that possibility.  Can you please give us an example where 「鳳」 refers  to China or the Chinese people?  Or is it just another innovative  writing that makes use of people's "good imaginations"?


fyl said:


> Nationalism is the fundermental thing of the party, and the country.


That is really telling.   As you know, "nationalism" is not a neutral  word.  Some people  find it glorious; some people find it scary.   Likewise, some people  support that nationalist slogan in discussion,  and some people are alarmed by it.


fyl said:


> 官员主动站队，阿谀奉承就多了一些。你要知道在大陆这种响应口号的政治宣传是经常发生的，如果是公家单位，还要参加学习、写心得报告的，这种东西不过是例行公事，哪有什么深层含义？


你是司空見慣, 見怪不怪; 我是管见所及,  少見多怪.


fyl said:


> The sugarcoating theory sounds funny.


Sorry, my bad.  I crossed the line.


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## Ghabi

Moderator's Note: Since the linguistic, literary and cultural aspects of the slogan have been more than covered, this thread is now closed. Thank you for the participation.


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