# lad, chap, guy, bloke, lad, character, mate



## happyday

Hello,
Could you help me to feel the differences between these words? They mean nearly the same, but I would like to put them in order of politeness. If we start with 'gentleman', which one is the next? And which one is the last?
Thanks


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## tepatria

There really is no hierarchy for these terms. They are simply different words with the same meaning, although lad is used to describe a young boy rather than a man. I'm not sure character fits either as it is a more general description and fits females as well.


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## GreenWhiteBlue

Be aware that "bloke" and "chap" are almost never used in American English, and "lad" is rare in American English.  The use of "bloke" or "chap" would usually be a deliberate affectation to give a "British" air to what was being said.


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## Alxmrphi

GreenWhiteBlue said:


> The use of "bloke" or "chap" would usually be a deliberate affectation to give a "British" air to what was being said.



Just to note for other readers, nobody really says "chap" anymore (though I can't speak for everyone, I've only heard it in old films / tv programs, from about 20-30 years ago, in normal spoken everyday English, it'd only be used deliberately to sound posh / old fashioned.

I think the older generation would still use it, but I wouldn't expect it from someone under 40-50.

Anyway, that's just my opinion. The impression I get from a lot of Americans is that British people speak with the most ridiculous posh accent from the 1950s, as nearly all portrayals of Brits on American TV use this, or a big over exaggerated Cockney accent..


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## Nunty

Perhaps it's a generational thing? My good friend (in her sixties) from Rochdale uses "chap" not infrequently when referring to someone. She does not use it in direct speech.


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## Alxmrphi

Nunty said:


> Perhaps it's a generational thing? My good friend (in her sixties) from Rochdale uses "chap" not infrequently when referring to someone. She does not use it in direct speech.



I think it is It took me a while to come up with a safe borderline of age to make a separation that I was comfortable with. I wouldn't be surprised if I heard someone in their 50s/60s using it, young people certainly wouldn't use it, and even the generation above, it had faded out for them, but the one higher, I think it was still fine to use when they were growing up and remained normal usage.


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## cycloneviv

The use, or non-use, of "chap" in BE and AusE is also discussed here:

Rightio, tally-ho and chap - still used in British English?

A more international discussion of the term can be found here:

Chap

Personally, I use it quite often.


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## ralife

Hello all.

I have always heard that the words "_bloke_" and "lad" are mostly used in the UK, meaning the same thing as _dude _in the US.

Is that correct?

Are these word currently in use?

The reason of my question is that I fear to use old-fashioned expressions.
thank you all!


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## Spira

Yes, they all are still in use. Perhaps used more or less frequently according to the region and the age of the speaker.


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## entangledbank

I _say_ 'bloke' but I'm not sure if anyone around me does much. 'Lad' is certainly in common use.


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## sound shift

I still use "bloke" and "lad". I don't say "dude".
"Bloke" and "lad" are not quite the same. "Bloke" means "man" but "lad means "boy", "youth", except where the word refers humorously/ironically to grown men.


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## madsh33p

sound shift said:


> I still use "bloke" and "lad". I don't say "dude".
> "Bloke" and "lad" are not quite the same. "Bloke" means "man" *but "lad means "boy", "youth", except where the word refers humorously/ironically to grown men.*



I don't fully agree with that. I agree that "bloke" can be used for any man, however, I don't think "lad" necessarily applies to boys or youths. It is quite common to call a group of men that is e.g. in a pub together "a bunch of lads". When a group of men (regardless of age) go out together, this is also often referred to as a "lad's night out" (though there could be an element of humour in this in some cases)
I do agree, though, that it would be slightly odd to refer to an older man as a "lad", unless in a humorous manner. For example, I wouldn't call my grandad a lad, unless I was joking or winding him up.

I would say that both "bloke" and "lad" are quite commonly used in the UK. I would not regard either as outdated or old-fashioned.


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## ralife

Hey, 
thank you VERY MUCH for all the information!
You have helped me to keep my English updated.

Cheers!


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## sdgraham

Except that I don't remember anybody using "bloke" as a form of address as is disgustingly common in the U.S. with "dude."

For example, I don't think anybody would address somebody with "Hey, bloke."

No?


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## Spira

No, bloke is not used as direct address. It corresponds more exactly to a guy (or a dude).


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## panjandrum

Bloke seems to be used with reference to a third person.
Lad is too, except that you might hear someone yell "Hey, lads," to attract attention.

(See also buddy,  mate, pal)


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## mplsray

ralife said:


> Hello all.
> 
> I have always heard that the words "_bloke_" and "lad" are mostly used in the UK, meaning the same thing as _dude _in the US.
> 
> Is that correct?
> 
> Are these word currently in use?
> 
> The reason of my question is that I fear to use old-fashioned expressions.
> thank you all!



Please note that the use of _dude_ in the US is generally limited to young men. See this article (Google Docs version of same article here). It thus differs from _bloke_ and _lad_, which are, as far as I can tell, used by all ages and by both men and women in the UK.

Addition: The article concerns the use of _dude_ as a term of address, but it is also used, again mainly by young men, in the sense of "fellow." The American equivalent to _bloke_ and _lad_ in this sense would be _guy._


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## Spira

Nice distinction, mplsray. I didn't realise that girls do not employ the term "dude".
You are correct about use of bloke and lad in the UK.


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## Spira

mplsray said:


> Please note that the use of _dude_ in the US is generally limited to young men. See this article (Google Docs version of same article here). It thus differs from _bloke_ and _lad_, which are, as far as I can tell, used by all ages and by both men and women in the UK.
> _._


 
This is a long article, and I haven't finished yet, but already several times I have come across the statement: _The impression that dude is used by young men (under 30) is confirmed by the survey, but young women also used the term a significant amount, particularly when speaking to other women............_
So it's perhaps not just reserved to males.


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## mplsray

Spira said:


> This is a long article, and I haven't finished yet, but already several times I have come across the statement: _The impression that dude is used by young men (under 30) is confirmed by the survey, but young women also used the term a significant amount, particularly when speaking to other women............_
> So it's perhaps not just reserved to males.



That's why I used the words "generally limited."


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## Spira

OK, point taken, though the writer does employ the term "significant amount" for female usage. Anyway, I get the point that it's still basically a guy's term.
Guys, by the way, is now used in UK, mainly by and about men, although in the US it's pretty well non-sex identifiable.
I'm trying to rack my brain for the female aquivalent of bloke and lad in AE.


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## panjandrum

Be careful generalising about AE acceptability of "guys".
See the following thread (and comment there if you wish):
Guy,  guys (age/sex/acceptability of?)


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## Spira

It pays to be careful in all things.
There has been, however, a clear tendency in the US to blur the distinction of sex on the word "guy" in the last 20 years. Before, the men were guys, the girls were dolls (or something similar), as in the play. Now you frequently hear girls directly addressing their girl friends as guys, when in groups. 
This blurring has not really occurred in the UK, where Jimmy Saville's "hello there, guys and gals" would still seem correct, even if rather comic.

PS to Alx. When I was a teenager in London 40 years ago the term "chap" was already considered by my age-group to be old-fashioned, or public-school posh. It all depends on region and social class, I suppose. So you'd have to be my parents' age (80+) to be saying it.


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## Loob

Spira said:


> PS to Alx. When I was a teenager in London 40 years ago the term "chap" was already considered by my age-group to be old-fashioned, or public-school posh. It all depends on region and social class, I suppose. So you'd have to be my parents' age (80+) to be saying it.


Good heavens, my man! I am nowhere near 80, and I certainly use "chap".


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## Spira

Loob said:


> Good heavens, my man! I am nowhere near 80, and I certainly use "chap".


 
I did say region and social class, didn't I 

Don't worry, I don't say "Dude" either  (and I bet you don't either).


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## ewie

Loob said:


> Good heavens, my man! I am nowhere near 80, and I certainly use "chap".


Me too, me too! ~ in fact I'm only _6!


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## Disneyesque

I heard this on BBC. (Well, precisely it was from a random blog, I spotted the script when I was googling the meaning of 'nick' as a verb.)

A: So, one of them lost a bike and the other one lost his chocolate biscuits.
B: *Unlucky chaps*. Maybe the police can help them.

How can I understand this line? All of these thread above says that the word is old-fasioned and posh, but it was in the student material from public broadcasting.. should I use the word or not, in this way? I use a 'lad' for boy and 'lass' for girl sometimes 

(They are not totally interchangeable to the word boy/girl as for me. Like, I usually describe my sister 'My sister is a sassy young* lass *dreaming of becoming an actress.' to people, or say 'Oh, he is such an arrogant *lad* in a bad manner', in a little lighthearted way.) I thought it could be an adult version of 'lad'...


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## natkretep

I might still use _chap_ or its diminutive _chappie_ - there's probably a lot of regional variation. Is B an older person, a posh person, or given to stylised speech?

_Lass_ for me feels very Scottish, although I think Americans might also use it.

No easy answer - it depends very much on _who_​ you're talking to!


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## Kayta

lad, chap, guy, bloke, character
In Australia, I've only heard lad as part of common sayings like "he's a likely lad." 
Chap would only be heard on old British sitcoms. 
Guy is fairly common, often used to refer to a man whose name you don't know. e.g. This guy at the shops told me.."
Bloke is also common, used similarly to guy but in more informal contexts. e.g. There was this bloke at the pub who..."
Character I've only heard used as part of a description like "he's a shady character", or "he was quite a character."


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## Disneyesque

Well, I gave a background information in unneccesarily detailed way, so it became distracted and out-of-scope. Just say, A and B are having a very informal chat. A talked about the situations that some boys' belongings were nicked, and after listening to them B said *'Unlucky chaps.'* Do you think I can use the word *chap* in a normal situation nowadays in a same way? Any ideas are welcomed. 

I am always ready to try new expressions, but never want to be a pretender as mentioned in some threads above.


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## Disneyesque

We are crossed, Kayta  Thank you for introducing another threads, and giving me your thoughts.

If that's the case, I think the word Chap would make me funny in any way, because I found out when the foreigners learning my mother tongue use a way too local words, it is little odd to me and sometimes seems to be an intended manner.


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## Loob

princess_cm said:


> Well, I gave a background information in unneccesarily detailed way, so it became distracted and out-of-scope. Just say, A and B are having a very informal chat. A talked about the situations that some boys' belongings were nicked, and after listening to them B said *'Unlucky chaps.'*


 You can always give a link to the site, princess: click.  And it's an important piece of background that it's the _BBC Learning English_ site - so the dialogue has been constructed with a particular purpose in mind (in this case to explain various meanings of the slang term "nick").  

As to whether you can use the word 'chap' yourself, well, it certainly wouldn't worry *me* if you did, because I use it.  But other contributors have said it sounds rather old-fashioned to them, and you presumably wouldn't want to sound old-fashioned.


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## JustKate

I have two online friends in the UK, both men in their 20s, and they still use _chaps_ - a lot, really. Maybe they're being deliberately old-fashioned - it's so hard to tell such things when one converses primarily through emails and PMs - but they really do use the word a LOT, almost as often as _lads_.


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## djmc

In a mixed group one may get someone saying "Well, are you chaps and chapesses going to go out or shall I make another pot of tea".


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## cycloneviv

Kayta said:


> Chap would only be heard on old British sitcoms.



Really? I must live in old British sit-com land! I would not be surprised to hear, or uncomfortable saying "He's a nice chap" or the like.


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## Kayta

Must be a regional difference cycloneviv. I'm still surprised when a Victorian friend refers to swimming cossies (swimsuit) which I've never heard locally.

The only time I've heard chap, apart from old British sitcoms, is as part of a cliched saying, like "he's a lucky chap."


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## sound shift

The people who built the pharaohs' tombs in the Valley of the Kings were referred to as "chaps" by the presenter of a television programme on the subject that I saw yesterday. Five years on from the last post, "chap" remains alive!


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## Hermione Golightly

"Builder chaps" Very funny! What channel was that on?


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## sound shift

BBC4. The presenter was Dan Cruickshank. "Guys" doesn't come easily to many BrE speakers of his age (or mine). He did occasionally refer to these very skilled builders as "fellows". "Blokes" would have been disrespectful to the dead, I think.


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## Hermione Golightly

Thanks_, _I'll have a look at it. I agree about 'blokes' being socially inferior to 'chaps'. I don't use chap much at all and would never address a group as chaps. It's too jolly hockey for me. I use 'fellow' often, singular only, third party usage.


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## Margrave

[Threads merged at this point.  DonnyB - moderator]
Hi!
Please, what is the equivalent in Ireland, Scotland and New Zealand for the English word _chap_?

England: chap
Australia: mate
New Zealand: ?
Ireland: ?
Scotland: ?

Any advice is welcome


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## lingobingo

I can’t even remember the last time I heard anyone in the UK use the word *chap*! It’s pretty outdated, I think?


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## Margrave

lingobingo said:


> I can’t even remember the last time I heard anyone in the UK use the word *chap*! It’s pretty outdated, I think?


Thank you. What is please the updated equivalent to "mate" in English from England?


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## Margrave

heypresto said:


> Do you have a _complete sentence_ in mind? And a _context_?


Thank you. No, only the words alone. But if this facilitates for you, there is the phrase: - Is everything fine with you, mate? (that is in AU-EN). What would be the equivalent word to "mate" in EN-EN?


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## lingobingo

Margrave said:


> What is please the updated equivalent to "mate" in English from England?


I think you need a *bloke* to tell you that. 

But different words may be used to refer to someone and to directly address them. That’s why we need proper context.


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## Margrave

@lingobingo  thank you! How about an Irish and Scottish synonym to "bloke" ?


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## sound shift

lingobingo said:


> I can’t even remember the last time I heard anyone in the UK use the word *chap*! It’s pretty outdated, I think?


Maybe in swinging North London! I still hear round my way.


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## Edinburgher

Margrave said:


> What is please the updated equivalent to "mate" in English from England?


You have misunderstood.  LB meant that _*chap*_ is outdated, not _*mate*_.


> Is everything fine with you, mate? (that is in AU-EN). What would be the equivalent word to "mate" in EN-EN?


It would be the same, though there are other options, the suitability of which would depend on context.  If you know the person's name, you'd use that; or you could say "son" or "dear" or (regionally) "hen" or even "cock".  Using "chap" alone is not possible in this context, but you could say "old chap".  It's a little dated perhaps, but I wouldn't say it's *out*dated.  You can't use "bloke" as a form of address, but only when talking about someone. Then "chap" is a more refined alternative to "guy" or "bloke".


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## se16teddy

lingobingo said:


> I can’t even remember the last time I heard anyone in the UK use the word *chap*! It’s pretty outdated, I think?


 Yes, in my _milieu chap _it is enjoying a renaissance as a form of address. I am still not sure whether to regard it as friendly, condescending or what! (Especially when it is my manager using it in an email...)


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## lingobingo

Interesting! I had no idea “chap” was making a comeback. Although now I come to think of it, I can imagine someone saying “there’s a good chap” (definitely condescending).

According to Wiktionary, in Scotland men call each other “chief”.


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## entangledbank

As the only context given so far is a vocative, we should clarify what you can't say:

Is everything fine with you, chap?
Is everything fine with you, bloke?
Is everything fine with you, cove?
Is everything fine with you, gentleman?
etc.

But 'guvnor' and 'pal' are two more that are sometimes heard as a vocative.


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## Loob

se1r6teddy said:


> Yes, in my _milieu chap _it is enjoying a renaissance as a form of address.


In the singular, teddy - as in "Is everything fine with you, chap?" I've never heard that, though I have heard plural "chaps" as a form of address.


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## se16teddy

Loob said:


> "Is everything fine with you, chap?"


  exactly.

PS Here is the exact conversation:
- Whereabouts in the building are you?
- 5th floor chap.


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## Uncle Jack

"Chaps" (plural) might well be heard as a vocative (and you might here "chapesses" as well, since as far as I know "chap" only refers to men), but it would sound old-fashioned to me in the singular - clearly I don't mix in se16teddy's circles. 

In my vocabulary, "mate" has no gender and might be used equally for men and women, but I suspect I am in the minority. This is easily the most common vocative in Britain as a whole, although the area were I live favours "pal".

There are also a wide range of endearments that are in common use as traditional vocatives in specific regions of Britain, and depending on where you are you need not be surprised at being addressed as "pet", love", ducks", or "my lover" although I would be a little surprised to hear any of these being used by one man addressing another. I suggest you don't try using them yourself.


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## Margrave

entangledbank said:


> As the only context given so far is a vocative, we should clarify what you can't say:
> 
> Is everything fine with you, chap?
> Is everything fine with you, bloke?
> Is everything fine with you, cove?
> Is everything fine with you, gentleman?
> etc.
> 
> But 'guvnor' and 'pal' are two more that are sometimes heard as a vocative.


Thank you. Please, in which country "cove" is used as a vocative?


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## Margrave

Uncle Jack said:


> "Chaps" (plural) might well be heard as a vocative (and you might here "chapesses" as well, since as far as I know "chap" only refers to men), but it would sound old-fashioned to me in the singular - clearly I don't mix in se16teddy's circles.
> 
> In my vocabulary, "mate" has no gender and might be used equally for men and women, but I suspect I am in the minority. This is easily the most common vocative in Britain as a whole, although the area were I live favours "pal".
> 
> There are also a wide range of endearments that are in common use as traditional vocatives in specific regions of Britain, and depending on where you are you need not be surprised at being addressed as "pet", love", ducks", or "my lover" although I would be a little surprised to hear any of these being used by one man addressing another. I suggest you don't try using them yourself.


Thank you @Uncle Jack you are in Cumbria, the border with Scotland. Would the Scots use "mate" as a vocative? Or they would use "pal"?


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## lingobingo

*Cove* is definitely outdated. And it was anyway never used as a “vocative” (a direct form of address), only as a word describing a young man.


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## Loob

Margrave, can you explain why you're asking? Do you want to use these terms yourself in speaking to people from Scotland, Australia etc? Are you writing a novel? The bottom line is that the terms used will depend on the situation, the individuals, and the relationships between them.


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## Margrave

Loob said:


> Margrave, can you explain why you're asking? Do you want to use these terms yourself in speaking to people from Scotland, Australia etc? Are you writing a novel? The bottom line is that the terms used will depend on the situation, the individuals, and the relationships between them.


Hi @Loob . Thank you. No, I am not writing a novel. The phrase I suggested (above) was not the best. I wish to know how to salute friends from Australia, England, Scotland and Ireland. What I look for is like:

Australia: Hello, mate!
England: Hello, pal!
Scotland: Hello, ____!
Ireland: Hello, ____!


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## Margrave

Edinburgher said:


> You have misunderstood.  LB meant that _*chap*_ is outdated, not _*mate*_.
> 
> It would be the same, though there are other options, the suitability of which would depend on context.  If you know the person's name, you'd use that; or you could say "son" or "dear" or (regionally) "hen" or even "cock".  Using "chap" alone is not possible in this context, but you could say "old chap".  It's a little dated perhaps, but I wouldn't say it's *out*dated.  You can't use "bloke" as a form of address, but only when talking about someone. Then "chap" is a more refined alternative to "guy" or "bloke".


Thank you very much!


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## entangledbank

Ones I hear in London include _man, bruv, black, mate, pal_. All have different nuances, I suppose.


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## tunaafi

Margrave said:


> England: Hello, pal!


If any of my English friends or acquaintance addressed me as 'pal', I would wonder what had got into them.


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## Margrave

tunaafi said:


> If any of my English friends or acquaintance addressed me as 'pal', I would wonder what had got into them.


Thank you. How would they address you then? (vocative).


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## tunaafi

If they use anything at all, it's just my name.


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## Margrave

@lingobingo thank you! @Edinburgher please could you confirm if "chief" is used in Scotland or in Edinburgh?  I need to be sure.


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## Edinburgher

I wouldn't say it's never used, but if it is, it's pretty rare. Probably more rare than "Jimmy".


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## lingobingo

I think I’ve heard the Scottish character Jazzer on the radio soap _The Archers_ use the term “chief” – but he _is_ a complete stereotype, according to this article: Is The Archers guilty of national stereotyping?

(In checking this, I’ve just discovered that the actor who plays Jazzer is blind. Wow! I had no idea. Well done Auntie, for once.)


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## Uncle Jack

Margrave said:


> I wish to know how to salute friends from Australia, England, Scotland and Ireland. What I look for is like:
> 
> Australia: Hello, mate!
> England: Hello, pal!
> Scotland: Hello, ____!
> Ireland: Hello, ____!


I very strongly recommend that when addressing people from Britain that you don't use any vocative at all, unless you are sure that it is appropriate. The ability to cause offence cannot be overestimated. By all means add the person's name, but apart from that, a plain "Hello" is best.

I can assure you that if I were greeting lingobingo, for example, that I would just say "Hello", and I dare say that she would just say "Hello" back to me.


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## tunaafi

Uncle Jack said:


> I very strongly recommend that when addressing people from Britain that you don't use any vocative at all, unless you are very that it is appropriate. The ability to cause offence cannot be overestimated.


 

I get (some would think unreasonably) annoyed when somebody responds to one of my answers with "Thanks, mate" (or any other word except my name.


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