# Send it to <me/ myself>



## drei_lengua

Hello everyone,

"Just send it to myself and John" - I hate this common mistake in the use of "myself". 

I work in corporate America and have quickly come to the conclusion that fancy executives and big proud project managers like to use so many pretentious phrases. My apologies if you are a fancy executive or big proud project manager. How come no one ever says "Just send it to John and me."???? Worse, I also hear "Just send it to John and I." This is AWFUL!!!!! 

"myself" is a word used to express something that only "I" can do to Drei. 

What is with such poor grammar in corporate America? I hear it everywhere such as on conference calls, during presentations, etc. It is corrupting our language and it is time to fight this language disease.

Okay, I am finished bitching (=complaining heavily).     (by the way, the smileys to the left represent a progression back to happiness, i.e. warning -> crazy -> embarrassed for having complained -> happiness)

Thoughts?
I look forward to your replies.

Drei


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## Brioche

The pompous love polysyllabification.

Why use one syllable when you could use two?
Why use one word when you could use four?

And with "myself" you don't have to consider whether _*I*_ or _*me*_ is the correct pronoun.


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## davidatherton

This is one of the most insidiously annoying forms of speech that is creeping into everyday parlance. This appears to be due to the mistaken assumption that the usage of the reflexive pronoun where the object pronoun should be used is more polite or more formal.

Recently, whilst on the 'phone to my credit card company, I was asked "What can I do for yourself", told "_..your new card has been sent to yourself_" and then asked "_is there anything else I can do for yourself_". Recruitment consultants are other major offenders (perhaps because they spend all day on the 'phone: "_...if there's anything I can do please do not hesitate to contact myself_...."

Not only is this grammatically wrong, but it grates on the ear - I for one want to shout at the perpetrator each time I hear one of these constructions!!

Let's stop the rot!!


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## Seana

Hi,
I have a little question about the first person singular.  I haven't searched it on the former threads here.
"I" when it’s a subject and “me” or "myself"  when it’s an object  but I never know which sentences are correct and I  always mixed it up.
E.g.
It is I have the duty of doing it.
It is me have the duty of doing it.

"The work was done by both John and I”
"The work was done by both John and me"
or "The work was done by both John and myself

E.g.  "I don't  like driving myself.”
 Using “myself”  when  I have used “I” earlier in the same sentence it is obvious to me. 

But those ones below aren't so obvious  to me
"Insurance policy should be signed  by my husband and I.
“Insurance policy should be signed  by my husband  and me.”
or maybe “Insurance policy should be signed by my husband and myself.”


Many thanks in advance


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## vince

It is I who has the duty of doing it (though: it is better to say: "I am the one who has to do it")

The work was done by both me and John

Insurance policy should be signed by me and my husband

"by" is a preposition, object pronouns follow it

e.g. "he walked by me" not "He walked by I"

There was  a similar thread a month or two ago about "and I" vs. "and me"


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## kertek

"I" is for the subject of the sentence. "Me" is for the object. so:

It is I that has the duty to do it (but this sounds strange - we'd say it is _my_ duty).
The work was done my both John and me (or myself, for emphasis).
The insurance policy should be signed by my husband and me (or myself).

Lots of native speakers get this wrong (and I'm waiting for someone to point out that I am one of them...!)


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## A90Six

Seana said:
			
		

> *Leave the other person out of the sentence to see for yourself which sounds correct.*
> 
> Hi,
> I have a little question about the first person singular. I haven't searched it on the former threads here.
> "I" when it’s a subject and “me” or "myself" when it’s an object but I never know which sentences are correct and I always mixed it up.
> E.g.
> It is I have the duty of doing it. (leave out *it is* and it should become clear)
> It is me have the duty of doing it. (leave out *it is* and it should become clear)
> 
> "The work was done by both John and I” (leave out *both john and*)
> "The work was done by both John and me" (leave out *both john and*)
> or "The work was done by both John and myself (leave out *both john and*)
> 
> E.g. "I don't like driving myself.”
> Using “myself” when I have used “I” earlier in the same sentence it is obvious to me. (If used to refer to the earlier "I" it is for emphasis. It may also be used to mean, " I don't like driving myself, I prefer to be chauffered."
> 
> But those ones below aren't so obvious to me
> "The insurance policy should be signed by my husband and I. (leave out *my husband and*)
> “The insurance policy should be signed by my husband and me.” (leave out *my husband and*)
> or maybe “The insurance policy should be signed by my husband and myself.” (leave out *my husband and*)
> 
> 
> Many thanks in advance


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## DAH

kertek said:
			
		

> The work was done my both John and me (or myself, for emphasis).
> The insurance policy should be signed by my husband and me (or myself).
> 
> Lots of native speakers get this wrong (and I'm waiting for someone to point out that I am one of them...!)


 
Please read:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflexive_pronoun


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## Seana

Thank you very much all of you.
But A90Six don't your cuts change the meaning those sentences?


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## A90Six

Seana said:
			
		

> Thank you very much all of you.
> But A90Six don't your cuts change the meaning those sentences?


Yes, the cuts would change the meaning. The idea is that you remove those parts to see whether I, me or myself is correct, then put the removed pieces back in. Voila!

A90Six.


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## Seana

Oh, yes I  catch the point.
It is exactly what I needed - a little trick.


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## JohnnyTheSkier

Hey all!

'Dear XXX, Please approve air tickets from Washington to London for John Smith and me/myself".

Which one is correct? Or should it be '... for me and John Smith'?

Thanks!


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## bibliolept

If my understanding is correct, "me" is preferred.


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## JohnnyTheSkier

Thanks, *bibliolept*! However, having read your reply, I can assume that there is some ambiguity in my sentence. Then how could one rewrite this to get rid of it?


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## bibliolept

My doubt concerns my own knowledge, rather than your meaning.


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## tomandjerryfan

"Me" is correct, and the order doesn't matter. Either way would be correct and would sound fine.


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## JohnnyTheSkier

Thanks a lot!


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## anothersmith

In the U.S., you will occasionally (perhaps often) hear people say "myself" in a sentence like this.  But "me" is the correct pronoun to use.


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## Brioche

JohnnyTheSkier said:


> Hey all!
> 
> 'Dear XXX, Please approve air tickets from Washington to London for John Smith and me/myself".
> 
> Which one is correct? Or should it be '... for me and John Smith'?
> 
> Thanks!


 
*me* is correct.

Traditional English grammar holds that "myself" is reflexive, and should only be used if the subject of the clause is I.

Some people say "myself" because they are not sure whether to say I or me.

As for word order, it is considered polite to put the other person first. "for John Smith and me".


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## JohnnyTheSkier

Thanks again!


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## idialegre

A huge number of native speakers of AE would say, "For John Smith and I." It's incorrect, but I have the feeling it will become accepted usage one sad day...


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## Haylette

That's common in England too. It's one of the things which annoys me most.


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## Janey UK

Hi

I'm having a running argument with my boss at the moment over the usage of either *me* or *myself* in sentences such as the following:

If you have problems, please speak to either Chris or myself.
Please tell myself or Chris if you are going to be late.
Either myself or Chris should be able to attend the meeting.
The Chief Executive wanted either Chris or myself to address the meeting.
Both myself and Chris are free at that time and we would be happy to attend.

My boss insists that only "myself" can be used in each of the above sentences, but I disagree and think that in some cases the word "me" or "I" not only sounds better, but is more grammatically correct. 

For instance, left to my own devices I would rewrite the above sentences as follows:

If you have problems, please speak to either me or Chris
Please tell me or Chris if you are going to be late
Either Chris or I should be able to attend the meeting
The Chief Executive wanted either me or Chris to address the meeting 
Both Chris and I are free at that time and we would be happy to attend.

I know that, diplomatically, I should simply agree with my boss, but I can't! In my opinion (in the opinion of myself? ) his version sounds clunky and jarring. 

My 'rule' has always been to remove the other person from the sentence, and see if the revised sentence still makes sense (as follows):

If you have problems, please speak to either Chris or myself.
Please tell myself or Chris if you are going to be late.
Either myself or Chris should be able to attend the meeting.
The Chief Executive wanted either Chris or myself to address the meeting.
Both myself and Chris are am free at that time .

It doesn't work with *myself*, right?

Whereas, in my sentences, it's possible to omit the other person:

If you have problems, please speak to either me or Chris
Please tell me or Chris if you are going to be late
Either Chris or I should be able to attend the meeting
The Chief Executive wanted either me or Chris to address the meeting 
Both Chris and I are am free at that time.

Can anyone settle the argument? I'm happy to eat humble pie if my boss is right...


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## panjandrum

There are other threads on some of your topic, but this is clearly an emergency 

Leaving aside for the moment the current trend to be flexible (ie sloppy) about much of this usage:

In current use myself is a reflexive pronoun.
Only I can speak to myself, or give something to myself, etc.
Myself is also used in apposition for emphasis.
I did it myself.
I myself did it.

Myself was at one time used as a subjective pronoun, where we currently use I.
Such usage is marked in the OED as archaic and Irish English  
Myself is having a coffee break now.

Myself was also at one time used as an objective pronoun, where we currently use me.
Such usage is marked in the OED as archaic and Irish English except in enumerations,
Bring more coffee to myself - archaic.
Bring more coffee to Archie, Bill, Claire and myself - less archaic.

What's happened to your boss is that he lacks self-confidence.
He has a phobia about getting I/me mixed up and is terrified of what might happen to him if he does.
He's been terrorised by a parent or teacher who insisted he say Billie and I, not Billie and me - half the time - and insisted he say Billie and me, not Billie and I - the other half of the time.

So he wimps out.  He can't bear to say: 
... speak to either Chris or me.
... tell Chris or me if you are going to be late.
Either Chris or I should be able to attend ...
... wanted either Chris or me to address ...
Both Chris and I are free ...
- His escape is to use myself into these sentences instead.

Note that I have placed the other person first in each case.
That is courtesy, not grammar, but courtesy is important don't you think?

Your rule is good practice.  It is what's recommended in most of the I/me threads here.

(Final edit:  The use of himself as a subjective and objective pronoun is a different question altogether.)


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## Janey UK

Thanks for that, pan...an excellent explanation! I'll also seek out those other threads you mentioned and do some more delving! 

So, basically, I lack courtesy but I'm grammatically correct    ... OK, I can live with that! Since I don't have to waste time eating humble pie I can put the time saved to productive use by working on my courtesy instead! 

Actually, in my own defence, I was correctly taught to put the other person first in all sentences, but lately I've become sloppy in this respect because I'm learning Italian, and in that language it's commonplace to put oneself first, thus relegating the other person to second place. I'm trying to accustom myself to saying "Io e Chris..." rather than "Chris ed Io..." and it appears that as a consequence I'm losing my manners in my native language!


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## panjandrum

Oh no!
In my concentration on the topic I overlooked that particular aspect of Janey's suggested alternatives.  How very embarrassing for me.  As a small gesture of apology, here are some of the most directly relevant threads:
I/me/myself
Myself/Me/I
I / me  or myself, which one?
"I let me be yours" , "I let myself be yours"
Rose and I and Rose and myself.
me, myself and I
Me or myself


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## risby

Janey UK said:


> some more delving



and, if you want further ammunition:

http://www.learnenglish.org.uk/grammar/archive/reflexivepronouns01.html
"When is the word myself used?"
Myself should not be used as a substitute for the personal object pronoun me ... The golden rule is that you should only use myself if the word I comes before it in the same sentence.

http://thegrammaticalpuss.blogspot.com/2005/12/me-myself-i.html
Me, myself & I
I is the subject of the sentence. Me is the object ... Myself, on the other hand, is a reflexive pronoun

http://www.drgrammar.org/faqs/#34
Me, Myself, or I?
According to The Oxford Dictionary of American Usage and Style, "Myself is best used either reflexively (I have decided to exclude myself from consideration) or intensively (I myself have seen instances of that type). But myself shouldn't appear as a substitute for I or me.


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## Janey UK

Thanks Risby, I need all the ammunition I can get! My boss is as stubborn as a mule!


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## mansijjj

See these are the true sentences. I was also confused like between i and me. but then i did a lot of research and found the facts. so below are the correct sentences. 

If you have problems, please speak to either Chris or  me.
Please tell Chris or me if you are going to be late
Either Chris or I should be able to attend the meeting
The Chief Executive wanted either me or Chris to address the meeting 
Both Chris and I are free at that time and we would be happy to attend.

- to give respect to others in grammar, we use "Chris and I" instead of "I and Chris".


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## richardliu

Hi, my friends,

As a non-native speaker, I am very confused about the use of pronouns sometimes. For the blank in the following text, should I fill in me or myself? please help me!

My first memeories of acts of kindness are from when I was about 12 years old. From then on I always help out at home and with friends.That winter I notice that many olderly people had difficulty getting to the grocery store after a snowstorm.So I started to spend part of a snowy Saturday knocking at aparement doors to ask if any one needed anything from the store.......I like it and it made them so happy. it started with ___(me/myself)  alone and then the number grew.A short time later,my friends joined in


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## Wishfull

Hi. As a non-native, my guess would be;

I started it alone
I started it by myself
I started it with me alone
I started it with myself alone


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## richardliu

Thanks for your prompt reply!


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## Wishfull

You're welcome.
But don't trust me.
I'm waiting for native speakers' correct replys myself too.


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## Halloway

I would write:

"It started with just myself and then the number grew".

But Wishfull's first two examples are also OK.


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## Doggie doggie

Hi, Holloway, here is Doggie again. Could you please tell us why *myself* is used here?
Thanks.


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## Halloway

Doggie,
I think you could use *me* instead of *myself* but in this context I think I want to stress the personal element and *myself* does that.


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## Doggie doggie

Ok, Halloway, thank you.


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## johndot

You can either say
 
It started with me alone, *or*
I started by myself
 
It started. Who with? With me. How? By myself.


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## Doggie doggie

johndot said:


> You can either say
> 
> It started with me alone, *or*
> I started by myself
> 
> It started. Who with? With me. How? By myself.


That makes sense to me, johndot, thanks.


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## richardliu

Thanks for all of you!


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## lux_

Hallo everyone, this is a mail I received recently and I was wondering about the use of "myself". Shouldn't it actually be "me", in this case?
Here is the whole test:

_Change of plans. PLS send all the docs to myself and also indicate which positions are you interested in so I can get some more info about it to you.
_


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## owlman5

I think I would have used "me" here too, Lux.  By saying "myself", the writer is just trying to emphasize the meaning of "me".


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## ewie

*Moderator note:* Hello Lux.  I've merged your question with a _few_ previous threads on this subject, which is a commonly asked-about one.


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## lux_

Thank you owlman for your reply.

Thanks ewie for doing that and sorry you had to go through that extra work because of me. I usually check all the time before opening a new thread, but I guess this time I was a little too distracted. It won't happen again.


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