# Collect



## ThomasK

Some questions regarding 'one' and uniting led us to collecting. So I suggest we collect ;-) the different translations for collecting here. 

It might be interesting to distinguish between 
 - collecting things (this may have different meanings already: stamps, putting together, ...) and 
 - collecting people

As usual references to roots and metaphors are much appreciated. 

_(I am pasting some of the answer from the previous thread here.)_

Dutch : 

- uniting people (_*verenigen*_, _unus_), but not things: because there seems to be a common goal when we use that word
- bringing together (_*samenbrengen*_) people and things, but that is only physically, so it seems to me; it reminds me of _col-lect_,_*verzamelen*_ [_zamel // samen_, together]), though, somehow, there may be some form of goal

English: 
- *collect* things :  lit. read together (reading was collecting...), ... 

- *bring together* people,  *rally* (re-allier, bringing back to order, I believe), *assemble* (to make (a)like, _assimilare_)


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## ThomasK

Turkish (_thanks, Rallino_): 



> - To collect things (for a collection for example) can be said with: _*biriktirmek*_
> 
> - for people, we  can use _toplamak_ = "to summon"


 
But then what is the precise meaning ?


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## ThomasK

Slavic languages (_thanks, Orlin_): 



> To collect things is
> - e. g. (да) събера/събирам in Bulgarian,
> - skupiti/skupljati or sabirati/sabrati in BCS and
> - собрать/собирать in Russian.


 
But then: could you explain the roots of those words, Orlin, and tell us what words mean what? Thanks !


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## Orlin

ThomasK said:


> Slavic languages (_thanks, Orlin_):
> 
> 
> But then: could you explain the roots of those words, Orlin, and tell us what words mean what? Thanks !


 
Sorry but it's difficult for me, so I'll post links to Croatian online dictionary including etymology:
http://hjp.srce.hr/index.php?show=search_by_id&id=d15gXRk%3D,
http://hjp.srce.hr/index.php?show=search_by_id&id=dlhvWRk=.
And don't forget that most Slavic verbs form aspectual pairs and I've listed the perfective/imperfective verb with the same meaning.


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## ThomasK

I tried to read them using Google, but it does not work well. Is there no key word in both ? Thanks, anyhow...


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## Orlin

ThomasK said:


> I tried to read them using Google, but it does not work well. Is there no key word in both ? Thanks, anyhow...


 
I'll try to explain so: these verbs are formed from the verbs бера/brati/брать with a basic meaning "to pick" ("to take" in Russian) and a prefix for "company" or "togetherness" - sorry but I'm not specialist.


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## ThomasK

But that is fine, Orlin, I think that will do !!! Thanks a lot!


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## sakvaka

*Finnish*: 
_kerätä_ = collect
_koota_ = gather (s.1.p. _minä kokoan_)
(_yhdistää_ = unite, join, connect)

But I don't think _verenigen_/_yhdistää_ has something to do with _samenbrengen_/_koota_ or _verzamelen_/_kerätä_ in Finnish: after all, we have to gather people before uniting them. 

In Finnish, there's no difference between collecting people and things. However, let's have a look at the list of synonymes.

_haalia _= to strive to get something (practically never about people)
_kasata _= collect (derived from "pile"), mainly about papers, evidence, and such like


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## Volcano

ThomasK said:


> Some questions regarding 'one' and uniting led us to collecting. So I suggest we collect ;-) the different translations for collecting here.
> 
> It might be interesting to distinguish between
> - collecting things (this may have different meanings already: stamps, putting together, ...) and
> - collecting people


*
In Turkish, I would say for both:

bir araya getirmek or toplamak - to gather sth/sb up*

*If to distinguish in a specific manner, 

-for things: biriktirmek, koleksiyon yapmak

-for people: toplamak, çağırmak*


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## bibax

Czech: like in Russian (собрать/собирать)

*sebrati* (perf.) / *sbírati* (imp.) = to collect, to pick (things, also army);

prefix *s-/se-* (= con-/syn-/together) + *bráti* (imp.) = to take; it is a cognate to the Latin fero (to carry, to bring, to bear) and Greek phero;

For comparison, Latin - Czech forms of fero/beru:

indicative pres.: fero - beru, fers - bereš, fert - bere (< *beret), ferimus - bereme, fertis - berete, ferunt - berou (< berú < *beront);
imperative: fer! - ber!, ferte! - berte!;

*shromážditi* (perf.) / *shromažďovati* (imp.) = to collect, to gather, to amass, to assemble (people, also army)

derived from *hromada* = heap, pile, stack, multitude, .....;

*seskupiti* (perf.) / *seskupovati* (imp.) = to group together (things, people, military forces);

from *skupina* = a group; from *kupa* = hromada;


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## apmoy70

In Greek:
*To collect:* «Συλλέγω» (sil'eɣo). Classical verb «συλλέγω» (sull'ĕgō). Compound word formed by the joining of preposition «συν» (sun)-->_with, together with_ + «λέγω» (l'ĕgō)-->_to tell, recount, tell over, say, speak_. «Συλλέγω» lit. means _to compile, summon together_. Collection is «συλλογή» (siloʝ'i _f._).
*To gather:* 
(a) «Μαζεύω» (maz'evo). From the Hellenistic verb «ὁμαδεύω» (homad'evō)-->lit. _to speak together and make noise_ (from «ὅμαδος», h'omados _m._-->_the noise made by a number of people speaking together_) metaph. _to gather_.
(b) «Δρέπω» (ðr'epo). From the Classical verb «δρέπω» (dr'ĕpō)-->_to pluck, cull_. From PIE base *der- (excoriate, rive, tear) e.g «δρέπω δάφνες» (ðr'epo ð'afnes)-->lit. _to pluck laurels_ metaph. _to be glorified_; «δρέπω τους καρπούς των κόπων μου» (ðr'epo tus karp'us ton k'opon mu)-->_to gather the fruits of my labour_


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## ThomasK

apmoy70 said:


> In Greek:
> *To collect:* «Συλλέγω» (sil'eɣo).  «λέγω» (l'ĕgō)-->_to tell, recount, tell over, say, speak_. «Συλλέγω» lit. means _to compile, summon together_. Collection is «συλλογή» (siloʝ'i _f._).
> *To gather:*
> (a) «Μαζεύω» (maz'evo). From the Hellenistic verb «ὁμαδεύω» (homad'evō)-->lit. _to speak together and make noise_ ( metaph. _to gather_.


 
This is quite special. I wondered: 
- there is a link then with Lat. _legere_, isn't there? 
- Μαζεύω is not like calling, I guess, but could you find an English equivalent?


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## apmoy70

ThomasK said:


> This is quite special. I wondered:
> - there is a link then with Lat. _legere_, isn't there?


 Of course, «λέγω» is cognate with legō (present infinitive _legere_).


ThomasK said:


> - Μαζεύω is not like calling, I guess, but could you find an English equivalent?


«Μαζεύω» lit. means _to amass_.


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## Orlin

apmoy70 said:


> «Μαζεύω» lit. means _to amass_.


 
So it seems to be similar in literal meaning with BCS skupiti/skupljati.


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## itreius

ThomasK said:


> Slavic languages (_thanks, Orlin_):
> 
> 
> 
> But then: could you explain the roots of those words, Orlin, and tell us what words mean what? Thanks !



skupiti/skupljati is linked with the German kaufen and Dutch kopen. 
skupiti <- _skup_ <- _s + kupiti_ <- Old Slavic _kupiti _<- Gothic _kaupjan_


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## ThomasK

I see: you 'buy' them together, do you? ;-) No, the previous meaning will be something like acquiring (collecting) by buying, I guess..


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## bibax

> skupiti/skupljati is linked with the German kaufen and Dutch kopen.
> skupiti <- skup <- s + kupiti <- Old Slavic kupiti <- Gothic kaupjan


I have another etymology at least for the Czech verbs:

*seskupiti* (= to group together) < skupiti < s + kupiti from *kupa* = heap, multitude; kupa is a cognate with German Haufen;
*skupina* is a group (generally);

*skoupiti* (= "to buy together") < s + *koupiti*;
*koupiti* means to buy, from Germanic kaupjan (> kaufen) from Latin caupo;

So seskupiti (< kupiti) and skoupiti (< koupiti) are not related verbs.


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## ThomasK

That seems more probable. However, maybe Itreius has some special reference...


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## itreius

bibax said:


> I have another etymology at least for the Czech verbs:
> 
> *seskupiti* (= to group together) < skupiti < s + kupiti from *kupa* = heap, multitude; kupa is a cognate with German Haufen;
> *skupina* is a group (generally);


That's interesting and it makes a whole lot of sense. I've checked the same source again and although skup (~skupina) lists _s + kupiti _as etymology, kup (meaning - German Haufen, English "pile") has the following one (which is what you're getting at):

Old Slavic *kupъ, *kupa, Lithuanian kaupas: "hill" ← ie. *kowp- (Old High German houf, Old Irish cúan)

Obviously, if I  had to guess between the two, the _kup _(as in hill/pile, _haufen_) etymology seems more logical.


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## ThomasK

I checked a Wester's Multilingual Thesaurus and only put some European words here: 

- Danish 
*samle* _(same in Swedish, and Norwegian, I think): _I recognize the same root as _verzamelen_ in Dutch 
- Corse *radunà* 
- Hungarian *utánvételezett*


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## sakvaka

ThomasK said:


> I checked a Wester's Multilingual Thesaurus and only put some European words here:
> 
> - Danish
> *samle* _(same in Swedish, and Norwegian, I think): _I recognize the same root as _verzamelen_ in Dutch



In *Swedish*, _samla_. If they want to say "to gather", they can add the adverb _ihop_ (together; up as in "fold up"). I have understood that "samla" for people is rarer than "samla ihop". However, let's wait for the natives. _I bet we will wait forever..._


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## Tjahzi

Well, for most Swedish verbs are a number of ways to more or less alter the meaning of a verb by adding a suffix/prefix/preposition/adverb. That is also the case of "samla". I will present some common variants of it and their meanings for you;

Samla - in it's "pure"-form is used with the meaning of "to gather".

_"Människorna levde på att samla bär och rötter"_ - The people lived from gathering berries and roots.

Samla på - "på" is the preposition corresponding to "at/on". This form is used for the perfective action of collecting. 

_"Hon samlar på frimärken."_ - She collects stamps.

Samla ihop - "ihop" litterally means "together". This from is used (in it's locative sense) when one collects(/gathers) objetcs that are spread out in/on an area. 

_"Hon samlade ihop frimärkena som var utspridda på bordet."_ - She rounded up the stamps that were scattered on the table."

Samla in - "in" corresponds "into", but is technically a local adverb rather than a preposition in Swedish. Used when a (relevant) part of the action in question is the putting of the gathered/collcted object into something.

_"Hon samlade in frimärkena i påsen igen."_ - She rounded up the stamps and put them back in the bag again. 

Samla upp - "upp" corresponds to "up", but like "in", functions as an adverb. Used when a relevant is the movement from a lower level (to a higher).

_"Hon samlade upp frimärkena från golvet."_ - She picked up the stamps from the floor (where they were scattered). 


Above, I have listed the strict locative usages, however, some of them can also be used in a more abstract way;

_"Läraren samlade in proven när tiden var ute."_ - The teacher collected the tests when the time was out."

_"De samlade in pengar till en skolresa."_ - They were collecting money for a school trip.

_"Han samlade ihop folk för att bilda ett fotbollslag."_ - Ha was assembling people to form a football team.


In addition, there is also a reflexive form; 

Samla sig - "sig" is the (3rd. person singular) reflexive pronoun. This form is translated as "composing oneself".

_"Hon försökte samla sig innan provet."_ - She tried to compose herself before the test.


And finally, probablythe most common variant of the "pure"-form; the passive "samlas", where -s is the passive suffix. It is used about people with the meaning of "to gather".

_"Människorna samlades på gatan." _- The people gathered on the street.'


Maybe some basic knowledge of Swedish grammar is required to fully understand the example. Please let me know if you want some further explaination, or if you have any other thoughts regarding my small presentation.


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## ThomasK

That is just great. I'm impressed. it is also interesting that you have phrasal verbs like in English, whereas our second part of the phrasal verb has become a prefix (sometimes separable) of the verb. 

I am inclined to think you use _samla_ where we use _nemen/ take_ sometimes. I mean: we would say we pick them up (oppikken), we cannot expressing collecting and picking up at the same time strictly speaking, but everyone will understand we collect them as well.


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