# 歌唱家，歌手



## yuechu

大家好！

I recently came across the word 歌唱家 in a novel I was reading. Is there any difference between 歌唱家 and 歌手？(For example, is 歌唱家 more formal than 歌手?)
Thanks!


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## ovaltine888

Usually we do not call a pop singer a 歌唱家.


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## ovaltine888

I think it is in the Chinese context that the title of **家 is a great honour and respect for a virtuoso, a person with outstanding skills in some specialized area, while his personal image must be noble with high moral  standard and should not be explicitly linked with commercial success.

Therefore, those pop singers are not considered 歌唱家 because they are way too accessible and too commercial.


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## ovaltine888

One thing to add.

We tend to translate ***ist into **家 in Chinese. But in many cases ***ist is simplly refered to an occupation or a role, but not necessarily outstanding in English context. So you may find us reluctant to give the title 钢琴家 to an unfamed pianist or an amateur pianist in the school orchestra because they are not up to par of the defiinition. Instead, we may use 钢琴演奏者 for this kind of "pianist". Actually it does not sound natural, though.

It also happens to the word "scientist". The Chinese translation is supposed to be 科学家. But if you are not a household name like a nobel prize winner, Chinese scientists would not refer themselves as 科学家 even if you are indeed working in a university or a research institute. Rather, for these "ordinary scientists", we are more likely to call them 科学工作者.

Nowadays, many commerical companies also have the job titles of "scientist" in their R&D department. I also find myself struggling to translate this job position into 科学家. Probably 研究员 sounds more acceptable?


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## yuechu

Thanks for your detailed explanations, Ovaline888!    I think that Chinese people around me were discussing something similar to this years ago, but I had no idea what they meant at the time. It's much clearer now!

谢谢！


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## Lostcause

In my personal opinion, xx家 is very formal use in Chinese, usually referring to professional or prestigious people.
for instance, scientist 科学家, educator 教育家. 🐼


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## SuperXW

xx家 a master/great achiever of (some field)
x手 a professional/person of (some profession/occupation/career)
Thanks for Oval's reminding. There're some fixed combinations so that we cannot change the words in blankets freely.


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## ovaltine888

SuperXW said:


> xx家 a master/great achiever of (some field)
> x手 a professional/person of (some profession/occupation/career)


but you cannot say 科学手 数学手 教育手


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## SuperXW

ovaltine888 said:


> but you cannot say 科学手 数学手 教育手


科学/数学/教育 sounds more like "fields", rather than "profession/occupation/career", I suppose?
But indeed, most of them are fixed combinations, I guess we just cannot use any word.
Maybe for some skills, people just don't think they can have great achievement?
小提琴手  小提琴家
贝斯手 贝斯家
鼓手 鼓家
艺术家 音乐家
写手 作家 作手 写家
航海手 航海家 水手 水家
小说手 小说家
弓箭手 弓箭家 武道家 武道手
...
If we bring 员, 师, 人 into the discussion, it would be more chaotic.
I guess it just like "-st/-er", we just remember them.


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## ovaltine888

SuperXW said:


> 科学/数学/教育 sounds more like "fields", rather than "profession/occupation/career", I suppose?



I brought these three in because they are the occupations that are difficult to translate into Chinese when referring to the ordinary practitioners rather than those prestigious masters of these fields.

The best translation I can think of is 科学/数学/教育 工作者. But they are really vague and general and do not sound like a specific occupation as in English (scientist/mathematician/educator)


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## SuperXW

ovaltine888 said:


> I brought these three in because they are the occupations that are difficult to translate into Chinese when referring to the ordinary practitioners rather than those prestigious masters of these fields.
> 
> The best translation I can think of is 科学/数学/教育 工作者. But they are really vague and general and do not sound like a specific occupation as in English (scientist/mathematician/educator)


In my mind, they are not so "ordinary" anyway... 
普通的工作，应该用更具体的职业或职衔，比如"研究员/学者”“精算师/统计师”“教师/校长/院长”等……
既然升级到了scientist/mathematician/educator，这几个词都扩展到相应的学术领域了，我感觉都是大牛……用“家”好像也不为过？
特别是“数学”，这个学科太基础、抽象了，如果不落到某项具体工作上，就是纯理论研究，没法直接产生社会价值，我只能想到“数学家”。
如果是一般人员，“科学/教育工作者”感觉比较恰当。


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## skating-in-bc

歌唱家 (e.g., 李泰祥, 推薦大家聽他唱的《錯誤》): *雅 *(學院派 美聲/民族 唱法), 強調藝術價值, requiring extensive classical/technical training.

歌手 (e.g., 齊豫, 推薦大家聽她唱的《橄欖樹》): *俗* (i.e., 流行/通俗唱法; e.g., 校園歌手, 鄉村歌手, 民謠歌手, 流行歌手, 搖滾歌手), 強調娛樂或共鳴效果, requiring some or limited technical training.

聲樂家 (e.g., Andrea Bocelli): 西洋古典美聲唱法專家


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## kategogogo

Interesting topic. Looks like they have adequately answered your question. I'll just leave my opinion at the bottom, in case there's someone out there still curious.

In mainland mandarin context, you are called 歌唱*家* if

you're CLASSICALLY trained, widely recognised and well respected. Classically trained means you're instructed in either western classical music, i.e. Bel canto style of opera singing (美声唱法) or Chinese folk singing (民族唱法). Luciano Pavarotti is definitely a 歌唱家.
you're as era defining as John Lennon or Bob Dylan. It's not impossible for a rock/pop singer to be qualified as 流行乐歌唱家, however the selection criterias are much much tougher. 《滚石》评出史上最伟大的50位音乐家 (Personally I'm reluctant to call Elvis Presley 歌唱家, 'cause he's much more of an icon than a musician or a singer)

(Continue only if you're still keen to know more)

手
X手-擅长某种*技能*的人

家
X家-掌握某种*学识*或*丰富经验*的人

X工作者 literally translates as those who work in the filed of xx. You say the conotation is more neutral, much less demanding. you don't have to be good at it, you don't have to be experienced to be called X工作者. 'x' would normally be the name of an *industry*, e.g. *科研*工作者、*文艺*工作者, it can't be the name of a profession, so 医生工作者 or 画家工作者 doesn't work. You are mostly likely to hear this term in formal context, rather than in daily conversation. 朗朗 may humbly refer to himself as a 文艺工作者 (average art fellow) rather than 钢琴家 (well-recognized) when delivering a speech or having an interview.


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