# All Slavic languages: Dren



## EuropeanOrigin

Hi all, I was wondering if anybody can provide some information on the Slavic word for cornel or dogwood. I have noticed that in Croatian/Serbian/Macedonian it is Dren, in Bulgarian Dryan, in Polish Dereń, in Slovak Drieň and in Czech Dřín. The questions I had were,

1. Did Slavic borrow this word from another language? 
2. Why don't east Slavic languages use the same word (they may, I just haven't noticed)?
3. What is the PIE root of this word?
4. Do non Slavic languages use words that derive from the same PIE root?
5. Are toponyms and hydronyms like Drenica, Drenovo and Drina derived from this word?

Any information would be good, thanks in advance


----------



## Christo Tamarin

EuropeanOrigin said:


> 1. Did Slavic borrow this word from another language?


No. It is a Slavic word derived from a verbal stem meaning "to tear, rend, rip".


EuropeanOrigin said:


> 2. Why don't east Slavic languages use the same word (they may, I just haven't noticed)?


Russians prefer to use a Turkic loanword. 
Anyway, Vasmer gives that word.


EuropeanOrigin said:


> 3. What is the PIE root of this word?


Please see Vasmer.


EuropeanOrigin said:


> 4. Do non Slavic languages use words that derive from the same PIE root?


Please see Vasmer.


EuropeanOrigin said:


> 5. Are toponyms and hydronyms like Drenica, Drenovo and Drina derived from this word?


In Bulgaria, they are many such toponyms, e.g. Dryanovo.


----------



## rusita preciosa

Wiki says that the Russian word for the whole genus is *кизил* /kizil/. As CT mentioned it is derived from the Turkic word for "red".
For most of Russia that is a relatively exotic, "southern" plant,  so it is logical that the word and the plant came from the South.


----------



## marco_2

EuropeanOrigin said:


> 2. Why don't east Slavic languages use the same word (they may, I just haven't noticed)?



But they do: in Ukrainian and Belorussian, apart from _kiził _they use the words *дерен *(der*e*n) and *дзёран *(dz'*o*ran) respectively. By the way, in Polish we have used a Ruthenian (East Slavic) loanword *dereń *since the 15th century, it used to be *drzon *or *dracz *before with the same etymology _(to tear)._


----------



## EuropeanOrigin

Christo Tamarin said:


> In Bulgaria, they are many such toponyms, e.g. Dryanovo.


In Wikipedia it writes that the river name Drina is derived from the Latin name of the river (_Drinus_) which in turn is derived from Greek (_Dreinos_). So this is not related to the Slavic word Dren, right?


----------



## Lubella

I confirm
in Ukrainian we do have *дерен* and also *терен, *both are plants


----------



## Christo Tamarin

EuropeanOrigin said:


> In Wikipedia it writes that the river name Drina is derived from the Latin name of the river (_Drinus_) which in turn is derived from Greek (_Dreinos_). So this is not related to the Slavic word Dren, right?


No Slavic relation for Drina, of course.


----------



## EuropeanOrigin

Christo Tamarin said:


> No Slavic relation for Drina, of course.


Thanks. A little off topic, but is there a known etymology for Drina?


----------



## Lubella

There is one curious thing ... both *дерен* and *терен *mean also soil, land, field


----------



## Christo Tamarin

Lubella said:


> There is one curious thing ... both *дерен* and *терен *mean also soil, land, field


Russian* терен* <= French terrain <= Fr. terre <= Lat. terra. Not related to *дерен*.

By the way, in which language *дерен* means "also soil, land, field"?


----------



## rusita preciosa

In Russian *дёрн* is sod (upper layer of soil held together by the grass roots).

I'm not familiar with "терен" in Russian.

There is *терновник* / *терновый куст / тёрн* (thorn bush) or *тернии* (used in translation of Seneca's saying "per aspera ad astra, через тернии к звездам"). Vasmer does not relate its origin with "terra" or anything similar.


----------



## Lubella

Christo Tamarin said:


> Russian* терен* <= French terrain <= Fr. terre <= Lat. terra. Not related to *дерен*.
> 
> By the way, in which language *дерен* means "also soil, land, field"?


 
in Ukrainian, of course!!!
*дерен* http://sum.in.ua/s/deren
*терен* http://sum.in.ua/s/teren
the difference is only in accent


----------



## marco_2

A, it's *darń *in Polish (in Bulgarian: *чим *or *тревна покривка*).


----------

