# Aramaic: פתגם



## amirsherman

Shalom everyone,

In Daniel 3:16 we see פִּתְגָ֖ם in עֲנֹ֗ו שַׁדְרַ֤ךְ מֵישַׁךְ֙ וַעֲבֵ֣ד נְגֹ֔ו וְאָמְרִ֖ין לְמַלְכָּ֑א נְבֽוּכַדְנֶצַּ֔ר לָֽא־חַשְׁחִ֨ין אֲנַ֧חְנָה עַל־דְּנָ֛ה פִּתְגָ֖ם לַהֲתָבוּתָֽךְ

Was the last vowel, which is kametz, originally a patakh and it was lengthened because of the pause?

Thank you in advance


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## Ali Smith

I don't think so, because the emphatic form of פתגם 'message' is פִּתְגָמָא. Observe:

וּמִנִּי֮ שִׂ֣ים טְעֵם֒ דִּ֣י כׇל־אֱנָ֗שׁ דִּ֤י יְהַשְׁנֵא֙ פִּתְגָמָ֣א דְנָ֔ה יִתְנְסַ֥ח אָע֙ מִן־בַּיְתֵ֔הּ וּזְקִ֖יף יִתְמְחֵ֣א עֲלֹ֑הִי וּבַיְתֵ֛הּ נְוָל֥וּ יִתְעֲבֵ֖ד עַל־דְּנָֽה׃
(עזרא ו יא)

So, the vowel will always be קמץ.


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## zj73

פתגם does not mean message. It means 'answer' or 'order'.


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## Abaye

zj73 said:


> פתגם does not mean message. It means 'answer' or 'order'.


Are you sure? Hebrew פתגם (maybe borrowed from Aramaic) means message (among its meanings). The Persian origin پیغام means message.


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## Ali Smith

zj73 said:


> פתגם does not mean message. It means 'answer' or 'order'.


You may be correct. In Biblical Aramaic פִּתְגָם only seems to mean "answer" or "order". By the way, does anyone have any idea why the ג is spirantized?


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