# ورقة بالمواعيد



## Eihab

Hi friends,

What is the best translation of this sentence? 

اريد ورقة بمواعيد الحضور والانصراف بما في ذلك يوم الخميس الذي يخرج فيه الأولاد مبكرا من المدرسة


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## كلمات

I'd like to have the weekly school schedule.


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## Tracer

_*1.  Close to the original Arabic:*_

*I want a presence and absence sheet which includes the Thursday in which the children left school early.*

_*
2.  What a native English speaker would most likely write:
*_
*I'd like to have an attendance sheet showing the Thursday the children left school early.
*


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## Eihab

Thanks  كلمات, But I think _schedule _is for the periods.


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## Eihab

Thanks Tracer, close to what I was looking for.


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## كلمات

Calendar is for periods of time. Schedule works for me here, but so does attendance. I don't think you need to add in Thursday since it is implied, but if you do, you have to correct the second part of the sentence and make it in the present "*I'd like to have an attendance sheet *that also* shows* the Thursdays children leave school early."


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## Eihab

Yes, it's clear now. Thanks.


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## Tracer

كلمات said:


> Calendar is for periods of time. Schedule works for me here, but so does attendance. I don't think you need to add in Thursday *since it is implied*, but if you do,* you have to correct the second part of the sentence and make it in the present *"*I'd like to have an attendance sheet *that also* shows* the Thursdays children leave school early."



1. There is no error in the "second part of the sentence".

Using the gerund (show*ing*") instead of a clause (....that show*s*.....) in this type of sentence is extremely common in English and is used all the time. Both alternatives are equally correct. The use or non-use of the word "Thursday" has no bearing at all on this usage of the gerund.

2. I don't see how (Thursday) "is implied". Implied by what? No, if the Arabic says "Thursday", here you have to write "Thursday" in English.


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## كلمات

1. Well if you're asking for the "entire" week' schedule, it's implied that Thursday is included.
2. Shows or showing wasn't the problem even if in the original example you provided, you're giving Thursday the importance and could mean you're asking only for that day's attendance sheet. And it wasn't one specific Thursday. It's every Thursday.


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## Tracer

Well, it appears we're both reading the original Arabic differently and drawing conclusions that may or may not be warranted.

The way I read it:

1. There's no "entire week" mentioned in the Arabic. The "entire week" may be implied, but I chose not to read it that way, mainly because, to me, it was only ONE Thursday out of many that the children left early. They don't leave school early EVERY Thursday. At least, that's how I read it. 
(Why would he mention (in Arabic), "the Thursday in which the children left early" if they leave early EVERY Thursday?  He's making a distinction, seems to me, between THAT Thursday and every other Thursday).

He's asking for the attendance sheet for the week....and ONLY for the week....in which the children left early on Thursday. It's a specific week he wants the records for....not just any week. Therefore, you have to include Thursday in the English translation to differentiate THAT Thursday (when the children left early) from every other Thursday (when the children did not leave early). 

2. I'm not sure I understand your second point. As I said in my previous, whether you use the "showing" form (gerund) or the simple present (shows) is not dependent on whether the word "Thursday" is used. Both forms are correct whether "Thursday" is written or not. In addition, whether the THURSDAY means "every Thursday" (your opinion) or whether THURSDAY means "one specific Thursday" (my opinion), the "ing" form AND the "-s" form can be used in either case.

I guess only the original poster would know which kind of Thursday is involved here.


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## إسكندراني

OP means more than one Thursday; it seems the kids go out routinely on thursdays
الخميس الذي يــخرج فيه الأولاد


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## كلمات

Yes, I did add that "Shows or showing wasn't the problem". But the error was that you were singling out a specific Thursday with your sentence, excluding the rest of the week and not mentioning that it's for every, or at least the many, Thursday(s).

He added that reference to Thursdays because he wanted to stress it in case they forget to mention it.
I didn't draw any conclusions from the OP Arabic sentence. It has but one meaning.


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## كلمات

I would also like to add that "schedule" is for indicating the time the school starts and ends at in a day, while "attendance sheet" is for noting the presence and absence of students/pupils at a school or a specific class. It has nothing to do with what time a school would start or end.


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## the_diana

ريد ورقة بمواعيد الحضور والانصراف بما في ذلك يوم الخميس الذي يخرج فيه الأولاد مبكرا من المدرسة


Kindly send me/ give me/ hand me the attendance form which includes Thursdays when children leave school early.


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## cherine

I agree with كلمات's understanding of the sentence. The request is not for "attendance and absence" (this we call الحضور والغياب) nor does it talk about one Thursday, but all Thursdays.
It's a request to know at what time the children should go to/be at school, and at what time they leave, including the Thursdays which have a different schedule.


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## Tracer

Thanks for the explanations and your patience.

I see it now.  The Thursday here is a general Thursday, not a specific one.  That is why the text uses the "simple present" يخرج to denote, like in English, a fact which is always or generally true, not limited to one specific instance. Another thing that threw me off was the use of the singular Thursday in Arabic.  I assumed he was referring to one specific Thursday, but, apparently, he wasn't.

Thanks again.


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## Eihab

cherine said:


> It's a request to know at what time the children should go to/be at school, and at what time they leave, including the Thursdays which have a different schedule.


Exactly.


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