# iva



## Gavril

Would _iva _be a good translation for the words_ irony, sarcasm _or _mockery_? Are there more specific words for any of these?

Jos muuten jollakulla on SSA/NES/jne., mitä alkuperää _iva-_sanan arvellaan olevan?

K


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## Grumpy Old Man

In many contexts, yes. _Irony of fate_ (kohtalon iva) comes to mind. _Derision_ is often a good word: _His words were filled with derision. _(Hänen sanansa olivat täynnä ivaa.)


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## SamiFrenezas

Yes, _iva_ and _pilkka_ would cover all the meanings. Although, I would use simply _ironia_ for irony and _sarkasm_i for sarcasm. For mockery I can't come up with better equivalents than_ iva_ and _pilkka._


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## Gavril

So, are the following translations correct?

_Isn't that ironic?_ = _Eikö se ole ivallinen_? (Or maybe just _Mikä iva!_)

_I wasn't being serious; I was being sarcastic._ = _En ollut tosissani, se oli iva.
_


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## Grumpy Old Man

Gavril said:


> So, are the following translations correct?
> 
> _Isn't that ironic?_ = _Eikö se ole ivallinen_? (Or maybe just _Mikä iva!_)
> 
> _I wasn't being serious; I was being sarcastic._ = _En ollut tosissani, se oli iva.
> _


No, we would say: _Eikö se olekin ironista? En ollut tosissani; se oli sarkasmia._


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## sakvaka

Gavril said:


> So, are the following translations correct?
> 
> _Isn't that ironic?_ = _Eikö se ole ivallinen_? (Or maybe just _Mikä iva!_)
> 
> _I wasn't being serious; I was being sarcastic._ = _En ollut tosissani, se oli ivaa.
> _



1st sentence: We usually say _Aika ivallista_/_ironista_ ("quite ironic").
2nd sentence: It goes fine, but remember to put _iva _in the partitive case. Another possible translation would be _se oli sarkasmia_.

EDIT: Three minutes late of Grumpy Old Man


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## Gavril

En halua viedä liikaa aikaanne, but I'm curious to know: would you use _ivallinen_ to describe the style of the last part of this article (starting with "Mutta emme pärjää ilman ...")?

KVK


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## Duracell

Gavril said:


> Would _iva _be a good translation for the words_ irony, sarcasm _or _mockery_? Are there more specific words for any of these?



First of all, I agree with all the Finns who have already commented on this.

My intuition at first was that _iva _would rather be _mockery _than _irony _or_ sarcasm._ I was even going to say that I would never use _iva _to refer to _sarcasm _or _irony _because I thought it wouldn't be right. However, I found the following explanation in Kielitoimiston sanakirja:

"iva - ylimielinen, halveksiva t. verhottu pilkanteko, ironia, satiiri.
_Joutua ivan kohteeksi. Hienoista ivaa sisältävä pakina. Oli kohtalon ivaa, että - -._" (Kielitoimiston sanakirja, Kotimaisten kielten tutkimuskeskus 2006. Gummerus kirjapaino Oy, 
Jyväskylä 2007: 350.) 

So, _iva _seems to refer to irony as well.


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