# think about



## Evito

Si può usare "pensare a" e "pensare di" per trasdurre "think about"?

I'm thinking about you: Sto pensando a te.
I have to think about it: Devo pensarne (???)


----------



## att3ras

Evito said:


> Si può usare "pensare a" e "pensare di" per trasdurre "think about"?
> 
> I'm thinking about you: Sto pensando a te.
> I have to think about it: Devo pensarne (???)


   Devo pensarci


----------



## saia

Evito said:


> Si può usare "pensare a"  e "pensare di" ( it depends on the context) per tradurre "think about"?
> 
> I'm thinking about you: Sto pensando a te.
> I have to think about it: Devo pensare a riguardo.(???)


----------



## arirossa

I have to think about it: Devo pensarci/devo pensarci su.


----------



## virgilio

I am open to correction but I - as a non-Italian - would say:
pensare a qualcosa = to turn your thoughts to, to dwell upon (something)
pensarci sopra - to think it over
pensare di qualcosa - to have an opinion about something.
e.g.
Ecco la mia nuova macchina. Cosa ne pensi?
That's my new car.    What do think (about it)? - How do you like it?

Virgilio


----------



## TT ZNJU

Things are quite simple... Let me explain my bilingual point of view, if I can:
pensare a (+ noun or -ing verb) = "think of, think about"
pensare di (+ verb only) = "think to" but see ex. below because "to" only fits in grammar books for general expressions, whereas in spoken language subject+verb+same subject+verb is most usual.
Ex. I am thinking of you now, I am thinking about going away from here; I think I am a good translator.
Got it?


----------



## virgilio

TT ZNJU,
            Re your:" pensare di (+ verb only) = "think to"
 May I make two corrections:
(1) I assume that by  (+ verb only) you mean (+ infinito only). If so, infinitives are not actually verbs but substantives - in Italian they are masculine substantives. e.g. Mi piace molto il leggere. 
(2) "think to" as a translation of "pensare di" is indeed correct English but is quite erudite (all the better for that, of course) and would never be heard in conversation nowadays, except from the lips of educated and well-read people - and such folks are a bit thin on the ground these days in the UK.

Best wishes
Virgilio


----------



## Evito

Could anyone give an example of a sentence in English with "think to"? I'm not sure I know what it means


----------



## virgilio

Evito,
       Come ho scritto sopra suonerebbe oggi molto erudito e non si sentirebbe che dalle labbra di persone educate ed abituate a leggere la letteratura di qualche secolo fa. Ecco  un esempio:
"Thinking to confound me with long words, the fellow embarked on an elaborate and convoluted period of which Cicero himself would have been proud".
Credendo di sconcertarmi con parole lunghe,.......(nel senso di "credendo che mi avrebbe sconcertato....")

Virgilio


----------



## Evito

Is this any different from a snooker commentator saying "Well, judging from the way he's lining up for the shot he must be *thinking to* bring the black into play here with a hard screw shot"?


----------



## Flaviano Martello

Evito said:


> Is this any different from a snooker commentator saying "Well, judging from the way he's lining up for the shot he must be *thinking to* bring the black into play here with a hard screw shot"?



Actually I think they are the same use of think to.

Probably the use of think to varies regionally. In the US it is pretty rare.  We would say

... he must be thinking about bringing the black into play ...


----------



## virgilio

Evito,
        It is difficult to see any distinction but then perhaps the individual commentator happened to be a man of some education and refinement.
Ce ne sono di tutti i colori, as they say.
Best wishes
Virgilio


----------



## Evito

virgilio said:


> Evito,
> It is difficult to see any distinction but then perhaps the individual commentator happened to be a man of some education and refinement.
> Ce ne sono di tutti i colori, as they say.
> Best wishes
> Virgilio



Well no, don't think it's a man of education or refinement, but he's an older English man...maybe it's regional...

Thanks for the help
Evito


----------



## vikgigio

virgilio said:


> Evito,
> Come ho scritto sopra suonerebbe oggi molto erudito e non si sentirebbe che dalle labbra di persone educate  (colte) ed abituate a leggere la letteratura di qualche secolo fa. [...]



Mi permetto di correggerti, perché 'educated' è un falso amico di "educato".
_Educated _si traduce con _colto_
_Educato _invece vuol dire _well-mannered
_Per il resto, il tuo italiano è buonissimo, come più volte ho avuto modo di constatare.
Ciao!


----------



## shamblesuk

Mi dispiace ma 'thinking to' è scorretto e non l'ho mai sentito usare.

Lee 




Evito said:


> Is this any different from a snooker commentator saying "Well, judging from the way he's lining up for the shot he must be *thinking to* bring the black into play here with a hard screw shot"?


----------



## Alxmrphi

Penso alla mia ragazza = I am thinking about my girlfriend
Ho proposto, e adesso lei ci pensa sopra = I proposed, and now she is thinking it over
Penso di sarà una moglie buona = I think she will be a good wife

Are these all correct uses of the three ways discussed in this thread?


----------



## shamblesuk

Last one will need _Penso che_ as you're not writing about yourself.

Lee



Alex_Murphy said:


> Penso alla mia ragazza = I am thinking about my girlfriend
> Ho proposto, e adesso lei ci pensa sopra = I proposed, and now she is thinking it over
> Penso di sarà una moglie buona = I think she will be a good wife
> 
> Are these all correct uses of the three ways discussed in this thread?


----------



## vikgigio

Alex_Murphy said:


> Penso alla mia ragazza = I am thinking about my girlfriend
> Ho proposto (Le ho fatto la proposta, if you mean 'I proposed to her'), e adesso lei ci pensa sopra (ci sta pensando su) = I proposed, and now she is thinking it over
> Penso di che sarà una buona moglie = I think she will be a good wife
> 
> Are these all correct uses of the three ways discussed in this thread?



Penso di andare a mangiare ('penso' and 'andare' have the same subject, i.e. IO)
Penso che andrà a mangiare (different subjects)


----------



## Flaviano Martello

shamblesuk said:


> Mi dispiace ma 'thinking to' è scorretto e non l'ho mai sentito usare.
> Lee



I disagree.

The Oxford English Dictionary says that 'think' may be followed by an infinitive or an object clause when meaning ' To conceive or entertain the notion of doing something; to meditate, contemplate, intend, purpose, design, mean, ‘have a mind’, ‘have thoughts (of)’.'

You thought to break a country heart / For Pastime
-- Tennyson

With them joined all the haranguers of the throng, That thought to get preferment by the tongue.
-- Dryden

It is _perfectly fine_ English and not incorrect. It may now be a little literary or regional, but no one can insist that it is wrong.


----------



## giovannino

Alex_Murphy said:


> Penso alla mia ragazza = I am thinking about my girlfriend
> Ho proposto le ho chiesto di sposarmi, e adesso lei ci pensa sopra = I proposed, and now she is thinking it over
> Penso di che sarà una moglie buona buona moglie = I think she will be a good wife
> 
> Are these all correct uses of the three ways discussed in this thread?


 
In Italian "proporre" cannot be used on its own to mean "ask somebody to marry you".


----------



## Nicholas the Italian

vikgigio said:


> [...]


Vik, although I agree with you that what you wrote is the most correct way an Italian would talk, don't give Alex the impression his sentences were so wrong 



> Penso alla mia ragazza = I am thinking about my girlfriend
> Mi sono proposto, e adesso lei ci pensa sopra = I proposed, and now she is thinking it over
> Penso che sarà una moglie buona = I think she will be a good wife


ci pensa => ci sta pensando
sopra => su
moglie buona => buona moglie
are better, but not required (feel free to correct me...).


----------



## Alxmrphi

Oh Nicholas thank you! I was so frustrated with myself after vik's post, but as long as I know they were only minor "what a native would say" ajustments, at least for the most part I had the correct idea, thank you.

Can someone give an example of "Pensare di" to mean to hold an opinion about, this is the last thing that I need to understand in this thread. Thanks.


----------



## Nicholas the Italian

Alex_Murphy said:


> Can someone give an example of "Pensare di" to mean to hold an opinion about, this is the last thing that I need to understand in this thread. Thanks.


"Che ne pensi del governo Prodi?"
"Che ne pensate della mia macchina nuova?"
"Che ne pensi di partire domattina invece di stasera?"
"Che ne pensi di andare a prendere il pane?" [this seems more a request than a question - a so-called rethorical question]

Edit: "Penso di partire domattina invece di stasera": here the meaning is not "to hold an opinion about", it's just the implicit form for "[io] penso che [io] partiro' domattica invece di stasera".


----------



## virgilio

Vikgigio,
           Ti ringrazio molto per le correzzioni e per le tue gentilissime parole.

Virgilio


----------



## virgilio

Evito,
Re your snooker commentator:"Well no, don't think it's a man of education or refinement, but he's an older English man..."
If he's an older Englishman, he's probably learned a little refinement by now, I would guess!
Virgilio


----------



## vikgigio

virgilio said:


> Vikgigio,
> Ti ringrazio molto per le correzzioni e per le tue gentilissime parole.
> 
> Virgilio



Prego. Another small correction.


----------



## virgilio

Vikgigio,
           In English we have a saying;"There's many a slip 'twixt cup and lip" and I think that my contributions are a very good example.
Thank you again. 
Lo sapevo naturalmente ma ogni tanto le dita mi si ribellano contro l'autorità del cervello quando mi trovo di fronte ad una tastiera . Il mio professore di musica mi diceva decenni fa lo stesso.
Grazie
Virgilio


----------



## vikgigio

virgilio said:


> [...]"There's many a slip 'twixt cup and lip" [...]



Oddio, non sono riuscito a capirlo...... help!


----------



## virgilio

Vikgigio,
            É uno stile di molti anni fa e vuol dire; Fra tazza e labbro ci sono molte sviste.  
'Twixt = betwixt (inglese anziano) = between
Forse "dal dire al fare c'è di mezzo il mare"

Virgilio


----------



## vikgigio

virgilio said:


> Vikgigio,
> É uno stile di molti anni fa e vuol dire; Fra tazza e labbro ci sono molte sviste.
> 'Twixt = betwixt (inglese anziano) = between
> Forse "dal dire al fare c'è di mezzo il mare"
> 
> Virgilio



Ah.. era proprio quel 'twixt che si interponeva tra me e la comprensione.. 
Non so se 'tra il dire e il fare c'è di mezzo il mare' sia il proverbio corrispondente in italiano.. penso che quest'ultimo faccia riferimento al fatto che tra il proporsi di fare qualcosa e la sua realizzazione c'è di mezzo un mare di cose, e che quindi non costa niente chiacchierare ma il difficile è mettere in pratica ciò che si promette. Il tuo proverbio vorrà dire altro, immagino.. 

AI MODERATORI : se sapessi farlo (sempre che ne abbia la facoltà) staccherei io solo questa parte di thread in uno nuovo (dal post #27, direi).. dato che mi rendo perfettamente conto che sto andando FT!


----------



## horseman

This question of "pensare di"   "pensare a "is hopelessly confusing...and the posts confound everything even further.    Isn't there just some   rule when to use which?  For example,  I want to say in Italian.."I was thinking of calling you late at night to see if you were alone."   My attempt:     "Stavo pensando di chiamarti tardi la scorsa notte per sapere se tu stessi da sola" Is this right?

Thank you


----------



## Flaviano Martello

horseman, 

I agree that the matter is very confusing. 

First we have to distinguish between "think of/about" with a noun or noun phrase after it vs. "think of/about/to" with a verb phrase after it. 

In your example "I was thinking of calling you" we are really dealing with a a following verb phrase (although it is technically a "gerund" in English). In my notes I have written the following:

pensare a (fare qualcosa) = think about (doing something) — in the sense of "consider (doing something)"
pensare di (fare qualcosa) = plan (to do something), intend (to do something)

In your example sentence you proabably want "pensare a", but, depending on how you really think about it, you could also have meant "I planned to call you (but in fact I didn't) ..." or "I intended to call you (but in fact I didn't)". But my guess is that "I was considering calling you (but decided not to, or never got up the nerve, or whatever ...)" is what you had in mind. 

If it helps at all, I think Italian "pensare a (fare qualcosa)" is like French "penser à (faire quelquechose)" and Spanish "pensar en (hacer algo)"; I think Italian "pensare di (fare qualcosa)" is like French "penser (faire quelquechose)" and Spanish "pensar (hacer algo)".

I am a native speaker of English but not of the other languages so these are simply my impressions. The differences are subtle because the situations in which you might say "I was considering doing something" and "I was intending to do something" are, practically speaking, often the same, particularly if what you were considering doing or intending to do never ended up happening anyway.

Some of the examples discussed earlier in the thread look like they involve following verb phrases but they don't really. Specifically in a case like "What do you think about going to Amalfi" the object of "think" is approximately "what about going to Amalfi", not "going to Amalfi". So these examples, where you use "pensare di" before the actual verb word (because "what" has to appear at the beginning of the question), are not quite the same as simple ones in which you might say "I am thinking about going to Amalfi", in which "pensare a" is fine. 

I hope this helps -- the whole matter confuses me too. It is quite possible that Italian speakers actually use both options somewhat indiscriminately in certain cases ... this might help explain why a rule seems to be so hard to nail down.


----------



## Necsus

horseman said:


> This question of "pensare di" "pensare a "is hopelessly confusing...and the posts confound everything even further. Isn't there just some rule when to use which? For example, I want to say in Italian.."I was thinking of calling you late at night to see if you were alone." My attempt: "Stavo pensando di chiamarti tardi la scorsa notte per sapere se tu stessi da sola" Is this right?
> Thank you


I'd say "ieri avevo pensato di chiamarti la sera tardi/a notte fonda, per sapere se eri sola (,poi non l'ho più fatto)", anyway your use of 'pensare di' is absolutely correct.


----------



## Flaviano Martello

Looking at Nescus’ post I am wondering if Italian "pensare a (fare qualcosa)" has a stronger connotation of trying to make up one's mind about doing something than my previous post implied, and "pensare di (fare qualcosa)" does not really imply having made up one's mind, and is therefore not quite the same as "intend(ed) to" in English.

My sense in English at least is that there is kind of a scale going from "pondering/considering vaguely in one's mind a possibility" to "(definitely) intend/plan to do something".

 For the more tentative scenario in English we would probably say "I was thinking about (doing something)" which does not actually entail having made up one's mind. For example "I am thinking about buying an Audi" does not entail that I've made up my mind to buy an Audi.

A little less tentative is "I was thinking of (doing something)" which, in my estimation, is ambiguous with respect to having made up one's mind. In other words, if I say "I was thinking of going to Amalfi" it does not imply that I had made up my mind to go, but on the other hand it does not imply that I haven't made up my mind to go either. So "I am thinking of buying an Audi" could mean I have made up my mind to buy one, but it doesn't necessarily require that I have made up my mind to buy one. 

Or, for example, if I say, "We are thinking of going to the museum today" it could, depending on the context, mean that we have already made up our minds and certainly intend to go, or it could mean that we are still considering the question -- I think. (I am not absolutely sure at this point!)

Perhaps Italian "pensare a (fare qualcosa)" is clearly in the "more tentative" category and Italian "pensare di" is anything less tentative than that, ranging from English "thinking of" to English "intending to".


----------



## Necsus

FM, actually _'pensare *a* (fare qualcosa)_' means _to take care of_, _to look after_: "penso io a mettere a letto i bambini, non ti preoccupare".
And "We are thinking of going to the museum today" as far as I know means that we are still considering the question.


----------



## flaze

virgilio said:


> Evito,
> Re your snooker commentator:"Well no, don't think it's a man of education or refinement, but he's an older English man..."
> If he's an older Englishman, he's probably learned a little refinement by now, I would guess!
> Virgilio



To be honest, I don't think it has anything to do with refinement, and everything to do with a regional way of speaking. I've heard someone say, 'I'm thinking to pop down the shop', and this person was no more 'refined' than me, despite it not being something I'd say. 

There are still remnants of the 'thou' form in English, mostly in the North, although I think pretty much confined to the object pronoun, e.g. 'get thee [thyself] gone'. It doesn't mean these people are more or less educated or refined... it's simply a way of speaking that has survived in _their_ dialect, but not in others.


----------

