# βαλτή



## OssianX

I can't find this word anywhere (except as a name).  The context: "…είχαν χαθεί σ' εκείνη (τη βαλτή, πιθανόν) πυρκαϊά…"  Should I be looking for a noun or an adjective?  Any help much appreciated, as always.


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## apmoy70

Βαλτός, βαλτή, βαλτό is an adjective. "Bαλτή πυρκαϊά" is a fire that's planted, a suspicious fire, an arson fire. Βαλτός (masculine) is synonymous with "agent provocateur"


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## OssianX

Ah!  Many thanks.


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## orthophron

βαλτός adj. < βάζω (= to set).
to set fire to something or light a fire (including the sense of committing arson) can be rendered with "βάζω φωτιά" in Greek.
βαλτή φωτιά always implies the arson.


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## makot

βαλτός, βαλτή, βαλτό is another ("shortened") version of the participle βαλμένος, βαλμένη, βαλμένο of the verb βάζω, the only form in which we come upon this verb in the passive voice. It denotes intent (mala fide) even when used to describe a person. For example: "Καλά, βαλτός είσαι;!" loosely translates into "Are you doing this on purpose!?"


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## orthophron

apmoy70 said:


> Βαλτός, βαλτή, βαλτό is an adjective. "Bαλτή πυρκαϊά" is a fire that's planted, a suspicious fire, an arson fire. Βαλτός (masculine) is synonymous with "agent provocateur"


I don’t know if a fire can be a plant (OssianX, as native English speaker could tell us), but what I 'd like to say is that the meanings of βαλτός mainly arise from the meanings of the verb (βάζω).

βαλτός can refer to somebody joined a group to spy or exhort others to do something (βάζω κάποιον να κάνει κάτι = to put someone up to doing something or hire someone to do something).

βαλτά κοσμήματα can mean jewellery deliberately placed somewhere with a view to being found and misleading.

In our case (… είχαν χαθεί σ' εκείνη τη βαλτή, πιθανόν, πυρκαϊά …), βαλτή πυρκαϊά is a fire intentionally set, not broken out by accident (the meaning derives from βάζω φωτιά = start a fire).


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## OssianX

When my Oxford Learner's gave me, as a translation for the adjective βαλτός, "plant," I admit I was puzzled for a moment.  The English slang or idiom is "the evidence was planted on him" (meaning, indeed, "deliberately placed somewhere with a view to being found and misleading").  A person such as a police informant can similarly be "a plant."  "Plant" is hardly ever used as an adjective in this sense.  "Suspicious" would be a rather tame translation.  In the case of a fire, "set"; so for  εκείνη (τη βαλτή, πιθανόν) πυρκαϊά, I'm probably going to say "that conflagration (probably set)."

Thanks again to all.


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## cougr

orthophron said:


> I don’t know if a fire can be a plant



A fire can be planned (προγραμματισμένη φωτιά) but not plant.

Edit:this was cross posted with OssianX's post above


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## OssianX

The origin of the English idiom is the verb: to plant something (on someone).  The metaphor there is fairly clear I think; it's something buried out of sight that will rise up and produce something useful.  It's true that the "on" is not obvious, but since you can't plant something *in* someone, I guess it was the readiest alternative.  From the verb comes the noun: a plant as an informant buried in an organization who, it is hoped, will produce the fruit of information.  Given this etymology, by the way, it's not too hard to see why "plant" doesn't operate as an adjective in English; "planted evidence" is pretty common, though.

(God I love how language works.)


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