# An ugly daughter-in-law



## ofriendragon

An ugly daughter-in-law is bound to meet her parents-in-law some day.

Is this sentence correct, and could you tell me your response to the meaning it conveys? Could you improve it for me?

Many many thanks.


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## panjandrum

In terms of the words and the grammar, the sentence looks correct.
In terms of the choice of words, ugly is extremely direct, almost brutal.
In terms of meaning, it is a little strange in that most daughters-in-law have already met their parents-in-law before they become daughters-in-law.


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## Thomas Tompion

To amplify Panjandrum's third sentence: why does the girl's ugliness make her more or less likely to meet her parents-in-law?  
If I heard your sentence on someone's lips I would think they were wishing to be unkind about the girl - they wanted to get in that 'ugly', and could hardly wait for a happy context to turn up.


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## ofriendragon

I finished my essay, however, I dared not show it to my teacher because I was afraid that I had made too many mistakes. Humm, *An ugly daughter-in-law is bound to meet her parents-in-law some day.* In the end, I handed it in.
 
Then does this sentence make sense? Are there any idiomatic sayings in English similar to it?


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## giannid

It's a little confusing to say daughter-in-law and parents-in-law.  You might have said _An ugly wife is bound to meet her parents-in-law some day_.  It makes it a little easier to understand.

And I'm not aware of any English sayings similar to this.


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## xrayspex

"parents-in-law" are usually referred to simply as "in-laws".  In the US, at least. 

Is this saying supposed to have some symbolic meaning over and above ugly brides and judgemental parents?


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## Thomas Tompion

I think we must be dealing with a direct translation of an common Chinese saying, and we have been answering the question too literally.  We need an English saying which means 'something rotten always comes to the surface'.  How about 'murder will out'? or 'a bad penny always turns up'?  I'm not very happy with either in the context, though 'murder will out' is certainly striking when talking about an essay you're not happy with.


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## ofriendragon

It's really a common Chinese saying, a household one, which generally means something that may possibly not be accepted or may even  be refused according to some judgments because it is considered to be an ugly daughter-in-law <symbolic, it has nothing to do with any certain girls>.


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## xrayspex

Ah, the "red-headed step-child".


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## ofriendragon

"red-headed step-child" 
A stepchild might be singled out for abuse. But a red-headed stepchild (who presumably looks like his or her absent birth-parent) might be abused even more because he or she is so obviously different from the other children.Urban Dictionary

So "red-headed step-child" doesn't mean the same with that Chinese saying.


What about this version ?

*An ugly daughter-in-law (wife?) must meet her parents-in-law.*


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## JamesM

It may be a cultural difference, ofriendragon, but I don't think the saying conveys the same meaning in English as it does in Chinese.  I can't think of a saying in English that is similar in meaning, but I will puzzle over it for a while.


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## xrayspex

_what does "red-headed step-child" mean?

_A red-headed stepchild is member of the family who is undeservedly reviled or abused.  We usually use the term to convey pity or sympathy.  

The "family" may be an organization or group, rather than biological.


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## Nunty

Does the Chinese saying mean that even an ugly girl will get married one day? I'm afraid I still don't understand.  What is the significance of "meet her parents-in-law")


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## Thomas Tompion

Guys, we are looking for an ENGLISH SAYING or PROVERB which means the same - some disagreeable aspect of ourselves or something we've done which will be revealed in the end and which we therefore must confront: is that right Ofriendragon?

  Literal translations are not what Ofriendragon is after - unless I've misunderstood her/him.

A red-headed step-child is a child who is obviously not your own, a child who is treated worse than other children in the family - like Cinderella.


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## ofriendragon

> Guys, we are looking for an ENGLISH SAYING or PROVERB which means the same - some disagreeable aspect of ourselves or something we've done which will be revealed in the end and which we therefore must confront: is that right Ofriendragon?


 

Yes.
Suppose you have a son and you require he should marry a girl who meets at least some standards. If the girl is asked to meet you, what will the girl think? She may be a little timid and afraid that she won't meet your requirements (set for your son), so she may be afraid to see you. But *a **daughter-in-law** (wife?) is bound to meet her parents-in-law,* right? “Why am I afraid of meeting my parents-in-law even if I am ugly? I will meet them sooner or later.” The girl may think like this and she will come and meet you in the end. The “girl” may be a girl or may be a task you have to report to your boss, but as you see, it is not necessarily an ugly thing. I think I have expressed this saying clear though there may be some grammar mistakes.


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## xrayspex

"Bow to the inevitable". 

Are we making progress???


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## Nunty

Thomas Tompion said:


> Guys, we are looking for an ENGLISH SAYING or PROVERB which means the same - some disagreeable aspect of ourselves or something we've done which will be revealed in the end and which we therefore must confront: is that right Ofriendragon?
> 
> Literal translations are not what Ofriendragon is after - unless I've misunderstood her/him.


I'm not sure how we can do that if do not understand the original proverb, _guy_, in all its parts, so that we can then find an English one that means the same.


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## Thomas Tompion

Nun-Translator said:


> I'm not sure how we can do that if do not understand the original proverb, _guy_, in all its parts, so that we can then find an English one that means the same.


 
Well, ofriendragon has explained the situation: she's done an essay in English that she's not very proud of and she's nervous about handing it in.  To prepare her teacher for the worst, and to show that she's taken initiatives she's asking us for an equivalent English proverb to the old Chinese one about how the ugly girl must meet her step-parents in the end, the essay being the girl and the teacher being the step-parents.  I've suggested 'murder will out', which is a touch dramatic, perhaps.  Are there any proverbs about mud rising to the surface, for instance?  The shit hitting the fan isn't very appropriate.

Lucky thing I chose a male-sounding pseudo!  'Guys' means girls and boys in American.  I was trying to be jocular rather than offensive.


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## Roddyboy55

The chickens will come home to roost?

Rod


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## maxiogee

I think this is a phrase which proves that, like some fine wines, some phrases don't travel well!


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## Nunty

Thomas Tompion said:


> Well, ofriendragon has explained the situation: she's done an essay in English that she's not very proud of and she's nervous about handing it in.  To prepare her teacher for the worst, and to show that she's taken initiatives she's asking us for an equivalent English proverb to the old Chinese one about how the ugly girl must meet her step-parents in the end, the essay being the girl and the teacher being the step-parents.  I've suggested 'murder will out', which is a touch dramatic, perhaps.  Are there any proverbs about mud rising to the surface, for instance?  The shit hitting the fan isn't very appropriate.
> 
> Lucky thing I chose a male-sounding pseudo!  'Guys' means girls and boys in American.  I was trying to be jocular rather than offensive.


I am an adult, neither a boy nor a girl. I accept that you were trying to be jocular, however, and retract my snit. 

At the same time, an equivalent proverb must meet the requirements of all the elements in the original. For instance, you have changed the original "parents-in-law" to "step-parents" in trying to explain it to me, but we do not know if that is a substantive change to the intended meaning or not.

"Murder will out" does not seem to meet the requirements, in my poor and partial understanding of them, at all. I would suggest, without understanding what on earth we are talking about, "face the music".

A better parallel (if not equivalent) proverb could be found if someone would deign to explain the original from the interior: what each part means and how those parts work together.


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## .   1

I think that this means that there is a partner for everybody.
There are plenty of fish in the sea.

.,,


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## hownow

"The homely bride has to reveal herself to the in-laws eventually."

This Chinese idiom means the inevitability of "facing the music" albeit without the wrongdoing sense on the part of the bride. In the old days of arranged marriages, it was actually common for the in-laws and the groom to see the face of the bride only after the ceremony, and hence the saying.


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## Nunty

Ah, thank you very, very much, hownow!  
We now know we are looking for a proverb that means facing an invevitable result, but without necessarily implying any wrongdoing. <rubbing hands together in glee> Now we can start looking. "Face the music" and "murder will out" are both wrong, because both imply wrong-doing of greater or lesser degrees.


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## quietdandelion

ofriendragon said:


> An ugly daughter-in-law is bound to meet her parents-in-law some day.
> 
> Is this sentence correct, and could you tell me your response to the meaning it conveys? Could you improve it for me?
> 
> Many many thanks.


 
I know the Chinese version, and I think it is hard to find an exact equivalent in English. 

Maybe, like other members has mentioned in this thread, it is in one sense equal to "face the music" or "a cat will one day come out of the bag."


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## .   1

I think that it is an atrocious and judgmental 'proverb' and I hope that there are not too many similar sayings.
My understanding (love is blind) is that there is no such thing as a homely bride (all brides are beautiful) and that all proper husbands consider their wives to be beautiful (I have grown accustomed to the shape of your face).
Maybe there is a saying about judgemental parents losing the respect of their son (never make a man choose between you and his wife).

.,,


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## Nunty

In the example given: I have written an essay that isn't very good and I would prefer not to give it to my teacher, but I have not choice in the matter, I would say "I have to face the music and hand in my essay." I'm not sure what the origin of this idiom is, but I can't think of anything else that would fit that situation.


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## quietdandelion

A side note: as far as I'm concerned, this saying doesn't necessarily signify that the daughter-in-law is ugly or homely in appearance. It has the connotation that all of her weak points will be revealed including her cooking skills, the abililties to keep a house, and her filial piety to her parents-in-law...etc.


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## winklepicker

Dear Ofriendragon, I think it is clear that a literal translation into English is rather offensive, and doesn't mean the same. So I think you have a choice between an English (near) equivalent (_I had to bite on the bullet_ perhaps?) and a translation that does not offend. _Sooner or later, you've got to meet your in-laws,_ maybe. I can assure you that _meeting the in-laws_ carries just the same sense of doom in BE as it does in your language!


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## panjandrum

*Truth will out.*

Another reference here.


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## Nunty

I like "truth will out".


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## Roddyboy55

Where is hly2004 when you need him/her?

Rod


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## ofriendragon

Thank you all! 

_*Truth will out*_ is a possible version, though it has not the humourous sense compared with the Chinese "counterpart" .


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## coconutpalm

I like the one "bow to the inevitable". It seems to me that "Truth will out" suggest wrongdoings in the "girl's" side, while the original is kind of self-mockery. The "girl" is not necessarily bad or homely. She may be very confident all the time, it's only when she is to face her para-in-laws that she becomes less confident.


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## Thomas Tompion

coconutpalm said:


> I like the one "bow to the inevitable". It seems to me that "Truth will out" suggest wrongdoings in the "girl's" side, while the original is kind of self-mockery. The "girl" is not necessarily bad or homely. She may be very confident all the time, it's only when she is to face her para-in-laws that she becomes less confident.


 
The problem is that Ofriendragon has now made it quite clear that we are looking for a proverb which has a humorous impact, so most of the original suggestions won't do.


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## river

How about "At some point, a toupee has to come off."


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## river

A quote from Scripture might work: "All that is hidden will be revealed."


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## ofriendragon

> she's done an essay in English that she's not very proud of...


 
Sorry, ofriendragon is a He.


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## JamesM

Thomas Tompion said:


> The problem is that Ofriendragon has now made it quite clear that we are looking for a proverb which has a humorous impact, so most of the original suggestions won't do.


 
Actually, I read back through the thread and the request is for either a proverb or a saying.

This is still not an exact parallel but there is an old adage:

"A problem faced is a problem half-solved."

That doesn't have any humorous connotations, though.


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## Thomas Tompion

river said:


> How about "At some point, a toupee has to come off."


 
I think this is a brilliant suggestion, if it really is a reasonably well-known saying: I'd never heard it before.


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## .   1

ofriendragon said:


> Thank you all!
> 
> _*Truth will out*_ is a possible version, though it has not the humourous sense compared with the Chinese "counterpart" .


This obviously depends upon your sense of humour.

.,,


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