# Indonesian: Indonesian



## Outsider

MarX said:


> I reckon I said this in another thread, but in Indonesian, we don't have distinct words to name the people of a country or the language.
> 
> Spain =  *Spanyol*
> Spanish (language) =  *Bahasa Spanyol*
> Spaniard = *Orang Spanyol*
> 
> That's why referring to Indonesian as simply *Bahasa* (=_language_) is a shibboleth for Indonesians to recognize foreigners, because no natives would say only *Bahasa* to refer to _Indonesian_. We  always say  *Bahasa Indonèsia*, even though it's four syllables longer.


Picking up on this remark made by MarX, I'm curious to know if there really is no shorter term for the Indonesian language than _Bahasa Indonesia_.

Also, is _Melayu_ ever used as the name of the language? Has it been used in the past?


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## theo1006

If you use the term _Melayu_, you still have to say _Bahasa Melayu =_ Malay Language_._ But I think this is how the Malaysians refer to their language, they could hardly say they speak Indonesian.
In the 70ies the spelling of the Indonesian and Malaysian languages has been made the same. Before that the spelling of Malaysian was based on English and the spelling of Indonesian on Dutch. But there remain a lot of differences in the vocabulary.
In Indonesia _Melayu_ or (Dutch) _Maleis_ used to refer to the 'creole' language used between the different population groups. In colonial times this had a rather low status, therefore the Indonesians do not like to hear their language referred to as _Maleis_. 
So their really is no shorter term than Bahasa Indonesia. It's how the language works. Referring to English, we say _Bahasa Inggris_, not just _Inggris_. E.g. "I am studying English", translates as "Saya belajar bahasa Inggris". If you say "Saya belajar Inggris", people might think you are referring to the country.


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## Outsider

A belated thank you for your reply.


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## smamat

In Malaysian Malay, you may use only 'Melayu' to refer to the language, as in

saya pandai cakap Melayu (I know how to speak Malay)

or even

awak boleh cakap Indonesia tak? (can you speak Indonesian?)

But I think this is rather informal. I concur with MarX's assertion that using the word 'Bahasa' to refer to either of these languages (Indonesian/Malay) is an indication you're a foreigner. In fact, to my Malay ear this usage is very annoying. 'Bahasa' means 'language'.

So if someone says to you

'boleh cakap Bahasa tak?' (can you speak 'Bahasa'?)

it will sound as if the person is asking you

can speak a language?

even though we well and truly know the good intentions of the (foreign) person.


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## rasserie

i concur

bahasa means language.



smamat said:


> In Malaysian Malay, you may use only 'Melayu' to refer to the language, as in
> 
> saya pandai cakap Melayu (I know how to speak Malay)
> 
> or even
> 
> awak boleh cakap Indonesia tak? (can you speak Indonesian?)
> 
> But I think this is rather informal. I concur with MarX's assertion that using the word 'Bahasa' to refer to either of these languages (Indonesian/Malay) is an indication you're a foreigner. In fact, to my Malay ear this usage is very annoying. 'Bahasa' means 'language'.
> 
> So if someone says to you
> 
> 'boleh cakap Bahasa tak?' (can you speak 'Bahasa'?)
> 
> it will sound as if the person is asking you
> 
> can speak a language?
> 
> even though we well and truly know the good intentions of the (foreign) person.


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## rasserie

as a side note, 

"kau jangan nak bahasa aku, eh!"

notice the word bahasa, if any of u guys know what it means, then u know the malay language "bahasa pasar"


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