# Hello Professor



## lmciver

I'm trying to address a University Professor that I don't know in German, but I am not sure of the difference between male/female.  Here is my attempt:

Hallo Professor _________________(male)
Hallo Professorin________________(female)

I'm wondering if this would be correct and/or too informal?  

Thanks in advance for your feedback!


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## Löwenfrau

Ich würde sagen: "Sehr geehrte (Herr) Professor/ (Frau) Professorin"; ich glaube, "hallo" ist zu informell.


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## fdb

...geehrter / ....geehrte


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## ablativ

_Sehr geehrter Herr Professor / sehr geehrte Frau Professor_


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## Frank78

ablativ said:


> _Sehr geehrter Herr Professor / sehr geehrte Frau Professor_



"Sehr geehrte Frau Professorin XYZ" works indeed as well. Although it sounds strange to my ears.


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## Löwenfrau

fdb said:


> ...geehrter / ....geehrte



Of course, sorry


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## Löwenfrau

Frank78 said:


> "Sehr geehrte Frau Professorin XYZ" works indeed as well. Although it sounds strange to my ears.



If you say the name, maybe just "Sehr geehrte Professorin XYZ" sounds more natural? Or just "sehr geehrte Frau XYZ"


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## Frank78

Löwenfrau said:


> Or just "sehr geehrte Frau XYZ"



You can do that, if you know him or her. The majority of the professors don't insist on their title, in contrast to doctors, especially the medical ones.


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## ablativ

Frank78 said:


> "Sehr geehrte Frau Professorin XYZ" works indeed as well. Although it sounds strange to my ears.


To my ears, too. But you are right. Anrede und Gruß in Briefen und E-Mails richtig schreiben


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## lmciver

thank you so much for your replies!  I should add (embarrassed face) that I do not know much German at all, but I am trying to learn!  

Also, I do not know this professor yet. Would it be safe to use "Sehr geehrte Professorin _______"  (without the "Frau")?  I don't want to be too formal nor too informal.


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## Kajjo

No, please include "Frau" oder "Herr" in front of "Professor".


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## twinklestar

Frank78 said:


> "Sehr geehrte Frau Professorin XYZ" works indeed as well. Although it sounds strange to my ears.



Could you explain why it sounds strange to you? It is difficult for me to read the content of the link ablative provided, because the article is all in German and it is too long for me. Google Translate doesn't work well sometimes.



Kajjo said:


> No, please include "Frau" oder "Herr" in front of "Professor".



Great! I was being eager to wait someone to answer it. Then, is there no moderate addressing between informal and too formal as the OP desires? Just two options- either informal or formal?

Is "Liebe XYZ" only applied to the family or friends?

Thank you!


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## Kajjo

twinklestar said:


> Great! I was being eager to wait someone to answer it. Then, is there no moderate addressing between informal and too formal as the OP desires? Just two options- either informal or formal? Is "Liebe XYZ" only applied to the family or friends?


Yes, there are more than enough shades between very formal and very informal. The main point is, that addressing a professor in a written letter cannot be too formal. You simply use the most formal address and that's it. Please note, that the professor will receive dozens letters each day and all will carry the same formal address. He or she will not even think a second about it. It will be standard. Thus, I strongly advise against trying to deviate from the established, formal address. The more you deviate, the more it will be noticed.

_ Sehr geehrte Frau Professorin Müller, ...  (auch: ...Frau Professor Müller)_
 _Sehr geehrter Herr Professor Müller, ...

 Sehr geehrte Frau Prof. Müller, ...
 Sehr geehrter Herr Prof. Müller, ...
_
It's fine, it' standard, it's a no-brainer. Just do it and you are on the safe side. No one has a second glance. It's perfect.

To your other questions:

_Liebe Frau Müller,... _(surname)
_Liebe Kerstin, ..._ (first name)

The address with "Liebe" has become quite common nowadays and can be used for informal address between people who know each other and want to express some kind of amiability. In emails it's very common and for example, in this forum, you could address all of us this way in private conversations without any problem. Some decades ago, it was more or less restricted to friends and family.

_Hallo Frau Müller,... _(surname)
_Hallo Kerstin, ..._ (first name)

This is the modern, neutral alternative of informal address. It almost always fits in emails and for all private matters. Many people use it in business emails as well, as soon as they know each other better. For example, I even address some of my former professors in this way in emails, if I have a close professional relationship with them. Please note, that this is not a good way in written letters, which require more formal address.


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## Frank78

twinklestar said:


> Could you explain why it sounds strange to you? It is difficult for me to read the content of the link ablative provided, because the article is all in German and it is too long for me. Google Translate doesn't work well sometimes.



Probably because it's an academic title. "Frau Doktor*in* Schmidt" sounds equally strange.


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## Kajjo

Frank78 said:


> Probably because it's an academic title. "Frau Doktor*in* Schmidt" sounds equally strange.


...und das sagt ja zum Glück wohl auch niemand! Mal von ganz verbissenen Feministinnen abgesehen, mit denen man eh nichts zu tun haben will.

Ich höre und sage ausschließlich "Frau Doktor". Das ist korrekt und die einzig empfehlenswerte Variante.


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## Demiurg

Or to avoid the problem with _Professor(in)_ / _Doktor(in)_:

_Sehr geehrte Frau Prof. Müller, ...
Sehr geehrte Frau Dr. Schmidt, ..._


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## Kajjo

Demiurg said:


> Or to avoid the problem with _Professor(in)_ / _Doktor(in)_: _Sehr geehrte Frau Prof. Müller_


 Yes, my preferred method in the rare cases I need to address a female professor.


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## twinklestar

Thank you very much, everyone.



Frank78 said:


> Probably because it's an academic title. "Frau Doktor*in* Schmidt" sounds equally strange.



Oh, I see. It's about the feminine gender of the academic titles.

Is it because there were few women in academic circle before, so native speakers don't or hardly use feminine academic titles?


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## Kajjo

twinklestar said:


> Is it because there were few women in academic circle before, so native speakers don't or hardly use feminine academic titles?


No, I don't think so. I believe it's, because before feminism, everyone was happy using titles and understanding them as gender-neutral.

"Frau Doktor" is absolutely normal and even feminists have not changed this. So it could have stayed with Professor, too.

Or should we say "Frau Doktrix?"...


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## Hutschi

Hi, I found a document: Anrede und Gruß in Briefen und E-Mails richtig schreiben (wit many examples, but the text is German)

They state you should use the highest title.

So if the professor is Dekan, you should write

Sehr geehrter Herr Dekan (_name_) (Would the name be necessary?)

I do not  know if there is "Sehr geehrte Frau Dekanin ...)

(So you should find out the highest title.)


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## Kajjo

Ich kenne "Dekan" nicht als akademischen Titel. In allen mir bekannten deutschen Universitäten wird der Dekan auf Zeit gewählt und wechselt daher regelmäßig. An etlichen Hochschulen heißt der Dekan auch schon nur noch Fachbereichsleiter oder so. Das ist ein Amtstitel und kein persönlicher akademischer Titel. 

Ich habe in meiner akademischen Laufbahn noch nicht gehört, dass ein Dekan mit diesem Titel wirklich im hochschulischen Alltag angeredet wird, schon gar nicht in Briefen, die mit seiner persönlichen wissenschaftlichen Arbeit zu tun haben. Auf Festreden vielleicht als rein formale Anrede mal, aber sonst?

Ich könnte mir vorstellen, dass Österreicher das anders sehen, aber in Deutschland glaube ich nicht, dass irgendjemand auf "Dekan" wert legt.


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## Frieder

Talking about titles ... I wouldn't call Frau Merkel "Frau Bundeskanzler(in)". If she insists I'll call her "Frau Doktor Merkel".


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## Hutschi

Dann sind die Hinweise dort falsch. Ich habe es durchgestrichen.
Dass "Dekan" kein akademischer Titel ist, ist klar. Es ist ein Amtstitel.


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## Demiurg

Kajjo said:


> Ich habe in meiner akademischen Laufbahn noch nicht gehört, dass ein Dekan mit diesem Titel wirklich im hochschulischen Alltag angeredet wird, schon gar nicht in Briefen, die mit seiner persönlichen wissenschaftlichen Arbeit zu tun haben. Auf Festreden vielleicht als rein formale Anrede mal, aber sonst?



Bei Festreden ist die korrekte Anrede aber nicht _Herr Dekan_ sondern _Eure Spektabilität_.


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## Kajjo

Demiurg said:


> Bei Festreden ist die korrekte Anrede aber nicht _Herr Dekan_ sondern _Eure Spektabilität_.


Ausschließlich in Österreich... oder? Habe ich in Deutschland noch NIE gehört, sondern nur als historisch und obsolet wahrgenommen.


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## Demiurg

Ich habe beim Deutschen Hochschulverband folgendes gefunden:


> Bereits bei der Anrede gibt es von der jeweiligen Fachkultur abhängige Unterschiede. In etwas "konservativeren" Fächern (z.B. Medizin, Jura) sollte für den Rektor die respektvolle Bezeichnung "Magnifizenz" und für den Dekan "Spectabilis" der Anrede "sehr verehrte(r)/geehrte(r)" vorangestellt werden. In den Ingenieur- oder Technikwissenschaften ist dies eher unüblich.



Ich kenne das auch nur aus alten Filmen. Ich denke, in Folge der 68er-Bewegung ("Unter den Talaren - Muff von 1000 Jahren") wurden da viele alte Zöpfe abgeschnitten.


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## djweaverbeaver

I would just like to point out that everyone has assumed that by 'addressing' @lmciver meant in the written form.  It could also have meant the spoken form of address, as it was not specified in the OP.  No one would say *sehr geehrte/r Frau/Herr Professor ________* in speech.


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## Kajjo

@DJ: You are right, of course. Maybe too much of a false friend? Anyway, at latest in #13 the OP should have noticed we discussed solely written letters. And honestly, the better the question is phrased, the better are the answers... 

Back to your idea and the main topic:

Adressing an unknown professor when meeting personally:

_Guten Morgen, Herr Professor Müller!
Guten Morgen, Frau Professor Müller!_

Or _"Guten Tag, ..."_ or _"Guten Abend, ..."_, depending on the time of day.


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## Frieder

Kajjo said:


> Adressing an unknown professor when meeting personally:
> 
> _Guten Morgen, Herr Professor Müller!
> Guten Morgen, Frau Professor Müller!_



... but only if you want to make a point of being a brown-noser. If I had to address an unknown professor personally I'd say:"Guten Morgen!" If I know his name (Müller) I'll greet him with "Guten Morgen, Herr Müller." Any person - be it a professor or a president - who frowns on me for this can get stuffed .


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## twinklestar

Frieder said:


> ... but only if you want to make a point of being a brown-noser. If I had to address an unknown professor personally I'd say:"Guten Morgen!" If I know his name (Müller) I'll greet him with "Guten Morgen, Herr Müller." Any person - be it a professor or a president - who frowns on me for this can get stuffed .



It seems Germans care the academic titles and official titles very much from the comments of yours and other posters. Is that same for the other native speakers-i.e. Austrians?



Frieder said:


> Talking about titles ... I wouldn't call Frau Merkel "Frau Bundeskanzler(in)". If she insists I'll call her "Frau Doktor Merkel".



I had thought it depended on the situtations. I mean in colloquial.

If Merkel visited China in her capacity of being the German Chancellor, I certainly would address her official title-Frau Bundeskanzlerin . (In the reports of Deutsche Welle, it is always Bundeskanzlerin.)

If she and I would be in an academic circle, I would address her -Dr. Merkel. (Should I always add "Frau" in front of Dr. Merkel"?)

If she and I just got to know each other, I would address her "Frau Merkel".

Would above addressings of mine be offensive to her in German perspective?

Should I ask a German how to address him/her appropriately if we just get to know each other?


Thank you!

PS. In China I _personally_ think it is always appropriate to address anyone "Mr/Ms. + XYZ (Surname)", regardless their official and academic titles, in a non-official situtation. Of course, I assume Chinese President Xi would be happier if I address him "President Xi" rather than "Mr. Xi" , but he probably wouldn't be offended if I addressed him Mr/Herr Xi in any unofficial situations. Neither does a Chinese professor in a non-academic situation.

EDIT: I should have said the  the native speakers in the words I highlighted in blue when I typed the post.


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## manfy

twinklestar said:


> It seems Germans care the academic titles and official titles very much from the comments of yours and other posters. Is that same for the other native speakers-i.e. Austrians?


Some do, some don't - it's hard to generalize (and that's true for Austria and Germany).
There's a running joke, saying that all Austrians have some strange titles and that they insist on being addressed that way.
I may have been this way during the monarchy, which ended with World War I, but nowadays it's nothing special to be a Mag., Dipl-Ing., or Dr., therefore putting emphasis on such titles can come across sarcastic and mocking.



twinklestar said:


> Should I ask a German how to address him/her appropriately if we just get to know each other?


 
Don't even start with this!  A normal, polite address as "Herr/Frau XY" is perfectly fine and appropriate and most of the time accepted. If you get the response "Danke, danke. Aber ich bin Dr./Professor/Hofrat XY, bitte!" from that specific person, then this shows he/she wants be be addressed that way AND it shows that the official title is probably the only thing that he/she has to offer! Don't expect too much from that person...


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## twinklestar

Thank you very much for your answers, Manfy.

And sorry I didn't intend to marginalise the other native speakers when I typed German (people)  on my previous posts here and other threads. Mostly I referred to the native speakers, but somehow I forgot.


I just learnt what " a Mag, Dipl-Ing" mean from the Internet search. I guess the native speakers expect the other people address their titles if Mag., Dipl-Ing, Dr. etc. are printed on their business cards. Correct me if I am wrong, please.


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## manfy

twinklestar said:


> I just learnt what " a Mag, Dipl-Ing" mean from the Internet search. I guess the native speakers expect the other people address their titles if Mag., Dipl-Ing, Dr. etc. are printed on their business cards. Correct me if I am wrong, please.


 
No, normally not. Please don't address them with _all_ the titles on the business card!
In my opinion it's a little bit stupid, or let's say 'pretentious', to put Mag. Dr. on your business card, because without Magister or any other master degree you cannot get a PhD degree.
But well, some people like it.
Personally, I'm a supporter of putting your official title/titles on the business card. That's the right place for it. This way the receiver of the card can get a basic idea about your academic background. In my view, if this card contains multiple academic titles, this is for information only. It is not intended to be used for addressing that person. If you want to use the title, use only the highest one.

Personally, I still refuse to use the title in the address (maybe with the exception of introduction to others during very formal events). If the addressee insists on it in normal meetings, I will respect his/her wishes - but then for me it's not a sign of respect, it's just a "Floskel".


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## Kajjo

Frieder said:


> ... but only if you want to make a point of being a brown-noser.


I don't think so. If you know the title and just met the guy, you use the title. If you work with him on a regular basis, it's usually just "Herr Müller".



> If I know his name (Müller) I'll greet him with "Guten Morgen, Herr Müller."


You might do so... but very many people with titles will be pissed or at least frown. This is somewhat "bare of culture" (a little bit exaggerated) from my point of view. If you know the title, you can easily use it. Not to use a title you know about tells a lot about you but not about the guy frowning. I will never understand this opposition to academic titles. Do them the pleasure, follow the guideline, it's simply about being polite. Otherwise a short nod of the head might be enough, too. Not much difference then.


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## Hutschi

Hi, it seems to be more difficult,
We discussed mostly the formal phrase.
I want to add;
If you are a professor and meet a professor, you can also say "Herr Kollege".
Wikipedia gives a lot of hints: Anrede – Wikipedia
It is a kind of _*respect *_to use "Doktor" when you speak with a doctor, and to use "Dr." in adresses. So I agree with Kajjo to use "Doktor".
It may be different in different countries/areas, however.

Obsolete is the Usage "Frau Doktor ..." for the wife of a doctor who does not own the title herself.

In infomal language it depends on the environment and is very different.
At one working space I workes, each in the team where called by their first names.
The higher in the hierarchy (leader of the office) where called with the full name.

It was rather difficult when you where new to use the first name. I avoided it in the first time.
Than my team leader introduced the usage, so it was easy.

In another team the team leader said already in the first meeting "We use "du" and first names - we are a good team." - but it became terrible for me, because i was 20 years older than the others and slower leaning all the new things.
In the northern area there is a saying: "Es ist viel leichter 'du Rindvieh' zu sagen, als 'Sie Rindvieh!'"

Informal the dipl. med. (Diplommediziner) are called "Doktor" by the most people, this is not an academical degree in this case, but a tradition for the special profession.


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## Kajjo

Hutschi said:


> It is a kind of respect to use "Doktor" when you speak with a doctor, and "Dr." in adresses.


Absolutely. Most German doctors (not onle medicine, but other academics with Dr title) are somewhat pissed if not addressed with the title, in business, financial and official situations anyway. In private, it's more complicated and relaxed nowadays.

It never does harm to use a title. If someone feels to lose face when addressing a doctor  with "doctor", I cannot help him. To be polite and to behave properly is never losing face.

If a person with Dr title meets someone else with equivalent title, the title is usually not used. If a person, e.g. a medical doctor you have an appointment with, knows you know his title but you don't use it, he automatically assumes you have a Dr title, too. After handshake the typical question would be which faculty you are from. Not using a title without having an own one, is impolite and irritating. It's some sort of play you have to join.


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## berndf

Kajjo said:


> Ausschließlich in Österreich... oder?


Nein, umgekehrt. Die lustige Eindeutschung _Spektabilität_ für die Anrede durch nicht-Kollegen gibt es nur in Deutschland. In Österreich bleibt es bei dem traditionellen _Spectabilis_.


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## Kajjo

berndf said:


> Nein, umgekehrt. Die lustige Eindeutschung _Spektabilität_ für die Anrede durch nicht-Kollegen gibt es nur in Deutschland. In Österreich bleibt es bei dem traditionellen _Spectabilis_.


Wobei wir hier keinen falschen Eindruck erwecken sollten: Spektabilität gibt es auch in Deutschland seit Jahrzehnten nicht mehr. Der Begriff ist vollkommen obsolet.


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## berndf

Doch, die Anrede gibt es noch. Seit den 70er Jahren ist sie i.d.R. aber nur noch formellen Anlässen vorbehalten. Der Laudator einer akademischen Festrede würde den anwesenden Dekan wahrscheinlich mit _Spectabilis_, u.U. auch mit _Spekabilität _anreden. Das ist etwa so, wie man einen Botschafter im täglichen Umgang angemessen mit _Herr Botschafter_ anreden würde, zu offiziellen Anlässen aber mit _Eure Exzellenz_.

Die alten Fakultäten, die nicht aus der alten philosophischen Fakultät hervorgegangen sind, also Jura, Medizin und Theologie, mag es noch verbreiteter sein.


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## Kajjo

Anden Unis, an denen ich bisher Festreden gehört habe, gab es diesen Begriff nicht mehr. Dekan ist Dekan und fertig und selbst der Titel ist ja nichts mehr wert, sondern rotiert im allgemeinen.


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## berndf

Kajjo said:


> Dekan ist Dekan und fertig und selbst der Titel ist ja nichts mehr wert, sondern rotiert im allgemeinen.


Das war an deutschen Unis auch vor der Hochschulreformen der späten 60er/frühen 70er schon so.



Kajjo said:


> Anden Unis, an denen ich bisher Festreden gehört habe, gab es diesen Begriff nicht mehr.


An der Uni Hamburg z.B. schon noch. Hier ist ein Beispiel aus dem Transkript eines Festkolloquiums vor etwa 15 Jahren:
_Sehr verehrte Frau Martens, sehr verehrter Herr Ipsen, Spectabilis, sehr geehrte Damen und Herren!_ (Quelle)

Wie sehr das noch eingehalten wird, hängt sicher auch von der Fakultät ab. Juristen sind etwas konservativer. Bis 1985 war ich als WiMi am Fachbereich Wirtschaftswissenschaften der Uni Frankfurt und habe dort an einigen Festveranstaltungen mitgewirkt und kann mich auch noch gut an die Anrede durch den Laudator erinnern.


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## Kajjo

Dann muss es echt an den Juristen liegen... Hamburg kenne ich ja gut. Naturwissenschaftler machen so etwas nicht mehr... oder ich habe echt immer erfolgreich durchgehört... ;-)


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## berndf

Ja, die Fakultät macht da eine Menge aus.


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## twinklestar

> Interview mit der österreichischen *Botschafterin* in China* Dr. Irene Giner-Reichl*: Chinas Rezept kann in Ländern entlang der Landroute der “Ein Gürtel, eine Straße” -Strategie angewandt werden



Hello again,

The cited words are from the title of a report probably written by a Chinese journalist from a news-website based in China.

Would journalists of native speakers add "Frau" before "Dr. Irene Giner-Reichl" in such a report? I mean_ "Frau Dr. Irene Giner-Reichl"_. Or is it fine in the above words I quoted?

How should I appropriately address her if I would be the journalist who interviewed with her? Is it "Botschafterin Frau Dr.  Irene Giner-Reichl"?

Thank you!
*
*


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## Frieder

twinklestar said:


> How should I appropriately address her if I would be the journalist who interviewed with her?


I'd say "Frau Botschafterin".


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## twinklestar

Frieder said:


> I'd say "Frau Botschafterin".



Thank you for your help.


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## Ali Smith

Can you use _both _"Professor" and "Doktor"? For example,

Sehr geehrter Herr Professor Doktor Schmidt/Sehr geehrte Frau Professor Doktor Schmidt,

(body of letter)

Hochachtungsvoll
Ali Smith


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## Frieder

Yes you can. Some would even say you should.


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## Demiurg

Ali Smith said:


> Can you use _both _"Professor" and "Doktor"? For example,
> 
> Sehr geehrter Herr Professor Doktor Schmidt/Sehr geehrte Frau Professor Doktor Schmidt,



In this case, I would always write"Dr." instead of "Doktor".


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