# Construct States



## Zeevdovtarnegolet

I find this topic very confusing, though I do understand the premise.  But I guess I am confused about the finer points.  For example, when you want to indicate what something is made of, would you use the construct or "shel."

I understand the idea behind why "uga gvina" becomes "ugat gvina,"  but I have also seen "glida shokolad."  Should it be "glidat" here?


The confusing part for me is how I keep seeing variations and want to know if they mean the same thing.  So for example, with the phrase "the king's name" would the following two be both equally correct? :

ha shem shel  ha  melech  

shem ha melech  (Ok this one is probably wrong I don't remember how these are done - the one's without shel but you get the idea)

The second way here confuses me.  It feels weird but I don't want to keep using shel shel shel all the time.  The second way sounds more elegant and concise.  


And in the second type, can you have two "ha's" : 

ha kita ha more   OR      kita ha more

Or should it be kitat?

I realize I am conflating a lot of different things together and this is why I am confused.


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## tFighterPilot

"Glida Shokolad" isn't something you'd usually hear. "Glidat Shokolad" sounds much better. "Kita" also turns to "Kitat". You might be interested to look at this earlier thread http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=2306112


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## Zeevdovtarnegolet

The glida shokolad is something I have in my Hebrew book I am using called "Ivrit min ha hatchala."  Maybe it was a typo.


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## airelibre

Just to clarify since I don't think it is answered in the previous thread, when there is a construct phrase such as "the A of the B", the A is automatically definite due to the B's being definite. Therefore you cannot have ha kita ha more, it is simply kitat hamore. This prevents confusion with a definite noun + plus an adjective, such as hayeled hatov - the good boy.
I hope I explained this clearly enough, perhaps someone else can explain it better.


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## JaiHare

Zeevdovtarnegolet said:


> The glida shokolad is something I have in my Hebrew book I am using called "Ivrit min ha hatchala."  Maybe it was a typo.



I would agree that גלידת שוקולד _glidat shokolad_ would be better, but I've also heard גלידה שוקולד _glida shokolad_. I think it's short for גלידה בטעם שוקולד _glida be-ta'am shokolad_. That's just a guest that I'd venture.


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## sawyeric1

Is it a lot more common for construct states to not have dashes? Ex: בית-ספר or בית ספר


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## utopia

GLIDA SHOKOLAD is something you'd hear a lot, especially from children.


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## utopia

One can say there's no binding rule when to use a hyphen (if "school" was hyphened, then it would look like that: בית־ספר - it should be an upper dash), only when we use a prefixes like דו־, אי־ like in ,אי־אפשר or רב־אלוף and so on, do we need today (according to the academy) to use it.


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## utopia

It's more common today in construct states not to have hyphens at all.


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## origumi

utopia said:


> (if "school" was hyphened, then it would look like that: בית־ספר - it should be an upper dash)


What's upper dash? I don't see it on the keyboard.


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## sawyeric1

Is the gender of a construct noun always the gender of the first word?


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## Drink

Almost always yes. But note that a following adjective can be modifying either noun, and the gender will depend on which one it modifies. For example, "בית האישה הטוב" means "the good house of the woman" while "בית האישה הטובה" means "the house of the good woman".


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