# Icelandic: hann/sá/þessi, hún/sú/þessi



## qiaozhehui

I'm little bit confused about the different uses of the following pronouns:



hannsá
þessi
húnsú
þessi
þaðþað
þetta


Mainly I'm not sure when to use sá/sú/það.

 For example, the following sentences from Laxness' book _Íslandsklukkan (I only have access to the Swedish translation, the English approximations are mine):


_*Sú var tíð, segir í bókum...
*_Det var en tid, heter det i skrifterna...
(There was a time, it says in the books...)

_*En árið sem sú fororðníng barst út híngað...
*Men det år då den förordningen nådde hit ut...
(But the year when that regulation was carried out here...)

*Skaparinn er nú samt sá sem ræður.
*Vår Herre är nu en gång den som rår.
(The Creator is now still the one who rules.)

For example, why couldn't one say the following sentences?:

**Skaparinn er nú samt hann sem ræður.*
**Hún var tíð, segir í bókum...
***Þessi var tíð, segir í bókum...

*Could somebody possibly explain the grammatical differences between these pronouns? Specifically, in what situation must sá/sú/það be used instead of the other pronouns. Thanks?


----------



## Tjahzi

Well, long story short, they are _demonstratives_. There are three types of demonstratives (in Icelandic), "proximate", "distant" and "one of a pair", corresponding to English _this_, _that_ and _that (one of the two)_. 

That said, when a language demands the one type and when it demands the other is complicated.


----------



## NoMoreMrIceGuy

Grammar is not my strong suit, so take everything I say with a grain of salt.

These are called ábendingarfornöfn and are used sort of like an article.

_Hann er sá eini.
He's the one._
_
Þetta er (hann) Jón sem lagaði vaskinn.
This is John, who fixed the sink

Þetta er sá Jón sem lagaði vaskinn.
This is the John who fixed the sink._

Hopefully someone that actually knows what they're talking about comes along and clarifies.


----------



## Brautryðjandinn í Úlfsham

Here are some examples:

Bókin er rauð. = The book is red.
Sú bók er rauð. = That book (that was mentioned earlier) is red.
Þessi bók er rauð. = This book is red.
Hin bókin er rauð. = The other book is red.
Hin rauða bók er fundin. = The red book is found.
Hún er rauð. = It (the book) is red.
Þessi er sú eina sem hún þekkir. = This one (book) is the only one (book) that she knows.

Could a native Icelandic speaking person please confirm if these are correct? Thank you!


----------



## Brautryðjandinn í Úlfsham

qiaozhehui said:


> I'm little bit confused about the different uses of the following pronouns:*Sú var tíð, segir í bókum...
> *_Det var en tid, heter det i skrifterna...
> (There was a time, it says in the books...)
> 
> _*En árið sem sú fororðníng barst út híngað...
> *Men det år då den förordningen nådde hit ut...
> (But the year when that regulation was carried out here...)
> 
> *Skaparinn er nú samt sá sem ræður.
> *Vår Herre är nu en gång den som rår.
> (The Creator is now still the one who rules.)
> 
> For example, why couldn't one say the following sentences?:
> 
> **Skaparinn er nú samt hann sem ræður.*
> **Hún var tíð, segir í bókum...
> ***Þessi var tíð, segir í bókum...
> *



"Skaparinn er nú samt sá sem ræður" I think might be reworded "Það er nú samt skaparinn sem ræður" and this I think in turn could be "Það er nú samt hann sem ræður".

Skaparinn er sá sem ræður. = Sá sem ræður er skaparinn.
Það er skaparinn sem ræður. = Það er hann sem ræður.

I think you might also be able to say: Það er sá sem ræður sem skapaði jörðina. = It is he who rules who created the Earth.

Ég borðaði eplið. = I ate the apple.
Það er ég sem borðaði eplið. = It is I who ate the apple.
Ég er sá sem borðaði eplið. = I am the one who ate the apple.
Sá sem borðaði eplið er ég. = The one who ate the apple is me.


----------



## Brautryðjandinn í Úlfsham

Here might be a correct sample conversation using "þessi" and "sú":

A: Ég skal sýna þér tvær bækur sem ég á. Aðra þeirra keypti ég í dag en hina keypti ég í gær.
B: Þessi sem þú keyptir í dag er löng en sú sem þú keyptir í gær er stutt.

A: I'll show you two books that I own. One of them I bought today but the other one I bought yesterday.
B: This one that you bought today is long but the one you bought yesterday is short.


----------



## Brautryðjandinn í Úlfsham

"Sá sem" can mean "he who", "the one who", "that one who", "that (masculine) object that"
"Hann sem" can also mean "he who" but I think it's mainly used like this: það var hann sem .... = it was he who...
"Þessi sem" can mean "this one who", "this (masculine) object that"
There's also "hinn sem" which means "the other one who".
Here are some comparisons between "sá sem" and "hann sem":
Ég hitti hann.
Það var hann sem ég hitti.
Ég hitti þann sem þú þekkir.
Það var sá sem þú þekkir sem ég hitti.
I think you almost always have to have "það er..." to have "hann sem" in the meaning of "he who". "Hann sem" can also mean "him/it (masculine) as" in sentences like "Ég nota hann (blýantinn) sem ritfang - I use it (the pencil) as a writing utensil". "Hann sem" maybe can also be used in expressions of light surprise or astonishment at a contradiction with the words "hann sem er (alltaf) svo...".


----------



## Brautryðjandinn í Úlfsham

**Skaparinn er nú samt hann sem ræður.*

I think that this is wrong. I think you could say "það er hann sem ræður". In the sentence "það er hann sem ræður" the word "hann" can be interchanged with the word "skaparinn". "Það er hann sem ræður" would mean "it is he (i.e. that person (with emphasis)) who rules (i.e. not I/she/they)". "Það er sá sem ræður" would mean however "it is the one who rule" or "it is he who rules (who does such and such a thing... (without as much emphasis))". This is a more emphatic version of simply saying "hann ræður". You could therefore form the sentence "þessi er sá sem ræður" but not "þessi er hann sem ræður". "Þessi er sá sem ræður" means "this one is the one that rules" but I think "þessi er hann sem ræður" is incorrect. Could a native please confirm this?

**Hún var tíð, segir í bókum...
*"Hún var tíð" would mean "she/it (feminine) was a time (time)" or "she/it (feminine) was frequent  (adjective)" and not "there was a time". In this circumstance, I think the words "sú var tíð að..." is like an set idiom that means "there was a time when..." but literally this means "that was (a/the) time that..."
**Þessi var tíð, segir í bókum...*
"Þessi var tíð" would mean "this one (person/object in masculine/femine) was a time (time)" or "this one (feminine person/object) was frequent (adjective)" and that probably wouldn't be the correct meaning in this context.


----------



## Brautryðjandinn í Úlfsham

"Sá sem" means "the one who". "Sá sem" can also be translated as "he who" but that is only when using a literary or historical form in sentences like "He who knows all is come" instead of "the person/one who knows everything has arrived". In Icelandic the two sentences would both be "sá sem veit allt er kominn" but you maybe could make that sentence more historical-sounding by changing the word order. For example, "sá er kominn er allt veit" or "kominn er sá er allt veit" with "er" instead of "sem". So, "sá sem" in Modern English without a literary or historical context should be "the person/one who". "Hann sem" on the other hand is used in sentences where it is still common in Mordern English without a literary or historical context to say "he who". For "It was he who told me so". In Modern English it is completely normal and not necessarily literary or historical to say "it was he who" therefore this can be translated into Icelandic as "hann sem". If in Modern English we were to say "it is he who comes who is kind", this could be rephrased as "it is the person/one who comes who is kind" because the first  sentence is just an elaborate way of saying "he who comes is kind" and this is the literary/historical use of "the person/one who" and therefore is translated as "sá sem" in Icelandic.


----------

