# smiling for photographs



## hikari37lito

Why dont Japanese smile on the picture that they attach on their resume?


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## Etcetera

I don't know about the Japanese, but the Russians hardly ever smile on the photographs they have on their passports or attach to their CVs. For some reason, it's generally considered that one has to wear the most serious expression on such pictures.


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## whattheflock

Well, I remember most of my "official" pictures ever taken in Mexico (passport, resume's, credentials, ID's, etc.), and I remember the camera-man telling me to "wipe that smile off your face!"
I suppose it's a way of showing seriousness, dependability, temperance, and all those qualities that should be desirable in an adult world.


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## Hakro

I don't know about CVs but smiling in a passport photo is absolutely prohibited in Finland and probably in other countries, too. If you hava a smiling picture you can't get a passport.


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## Sallyb36

It used to be the same here in the UK, but I believe that we are now allowed to smile


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## panjandrum

Sallyb36 said:


> It used to be the same here in the UK, but I believe that we are now allowed to smile


Only if you can smile in a neutral expression with your mouth closed (see below).

I'd be surprised if this non-smiling habit applied only to the Japanese, mostly for reasons mentioned by Etcetera and whattheflock.

It is now very unusual to see photographs on CVs (UK version of resume).  The equality elements of employment legislation mean that characteristics such as age, sex and ethnicity are not normally disclosed.



			
				UK Passport Agency said:
			
		

> The photographs must show:
> 
> no shadows;
> you facing forwards, looking straight towards the camera;
> a neutral expression, with your mouth closed;
> your eyes open and clearly visible (with no sunglasses or heavily tinted glasses, and no hair across your eyes);
> no reflection or glare on your glasses, and the frames should not cover your eyes (you may find it easier to remove your glasses);
> your full head, without any head covering, unless it is worn for religious beliefs or medical reasons; and
> nothing covering your face. Please make sure nothing covers the outline of your eyes, nose or mouth.


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## Chaska Ñawi

Wherever a photo is a serious, formal occasion that doesn't happen every day (Victorian and Edwardian times, today in many parts of rural Latin America), people look serious and formal.


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## Etcetera

panjandrum said:


> Only if you can smile in a neutral expression with your mouth closed (see below).


I had such a photograph on my first passport (I received it when I was 15). 
My friends often say it's rather difficult to identify me with the photos I have on most of my documents, because the usual expression of my face is much more cheerful. 

When I had to write my CV, I didn't attach any photo. It just wasn't required.


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## Tolovaj_Mataj

Actually the photographers usually say to me "and now please smile" when taking pictures for the official documents. I've just checked my ID card and the driving certificate and on both pictures I don't have my lips firmly pressed.



panjandrum said:


> It is now very unusual to see photographs on CVs (UK version of resume). The equality elements of employment legislation mean that characteristics such as age, sex and ethnicity are not normally disclosed.


 
Same here. But the birth date must be revealed.
And.... name and surname tell everything about sex and ethnicity, at least here.


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## whattheflock

And, just maybe, it is also a hallmark of the individual cultures. Here in the States we all "say cheese" for the camera-person. But, a lot of times when the picture is supposed to look dignified or whatever, they take the picture and then say, "alright, now one just for fun!", and then we all cut capers or pull silly faces or flash or moon the camera. Well, at least I do. No wonder no one ever wants to take my picture.


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## Victoria32

Sallyb36 said:


> It used to be the same here in the UK, but I believe that we are now allowed to smile


In the 1980s, we could here, but not any more... No smiles!


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## .   1

I recently transfered my Driving Licence to a new state and was very pleased to see a 'Life's too short to not smile' sign at the entrance to the photo booth.  I was even given right of refusal on the first photo.  My wife went through to her third choice photo and she is happy.  This is a recent trend as we were not allowed to smile in official photos up until now.

.,,


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## fenixpollo

When I have passport or driver's license photos taken in the U.S., I'll put on a serious face. Almost every time, the photographer will wait an interminable amount of time -- waiting for me to smile. As soon as I smile, they take the picture. Once, a photographer even said impatiently, "Aren't you going to smile?"


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## zaigucis

I have smiling picture in my passport


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## Lavinia.dNP

Can anyone explain me why in some countries it is forbidden to smile in passport pictures?

It's the first time I hear about this and I'm quite curious.

In Italy any photographer will almost force you to smile.
Usually I look better in pictures when I have just a hint of a smile on my face, but every time the photographer wants me to make a big smile, and it always makes the picture look horrible.


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## GenJen54

There are no restrictions to smiling in the U.S.

It is also not common at all in the U.S. to include a photo with a resume.  I would guess that in some organizations it could be seen as grounds for discrimination.  I have never fully understood the practice.  A person should be evaluated by their accomplishments and work history, as outlined on a CV.  Personality and "looks" can evaluated later, during an interview.


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## fenixpollo

> Why dont Japanese smile on the picture that they attach on their resume?


 Why do Japanese attach a picture to their resume? Perhaps managers don't feel comfortable making big decisions about people without at least seeing what they look like. Maybe it feels too impersonal to them. 





GenJen54 said:


> Personality and "looks" can evaluated later, during an interview.


 But "looks" should not be one of the criteria for selecting job candidates, right, Jen? That's discriminatory, too.


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## serg79

A question to the previous posters (apart from those from the UK): Don't you have self-service photo booths in your countries?
It seems strange
to me people talking about photographers asking them to smile (or not) for official photos, because never
in my life have I had to have any kind of photograph for a passport, etc, taken by an actual photographer
(seems very old-fashioned here).


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## whattheflock

We have the auto-photo booths, alright. The ones that take four pictures of you, or the ones that print out a computer photo in shiny thermal paper.
Maybe it's a conspiracy by all the photographers in the American continent that no auto-booths could ever take photos with the very precise measurements and backgrounds and stuff needed for passports. They want to bleed our wallets dry!


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## Coffy

In Colombia you can hardly find self-service photo booths. There is usually a photographer (yes, we are so old-fashioned), but they make you smile. Some years ago we were not allowed to smile in the ID pictures, but now we can. I have some friends whom you can even see their teeth in the photos. However, for passports we can't smile!!! :S


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## Tsoman

fenixpollo said:


> But "looks" should not be one of the criteria for selecting job candidates, right, Jen? That's discriminatory, too.



That all depends on which side of the spectrum you fall on


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## .   1

G'day Serg,
We have photo booths but these are just for happy snaps not for official photos.
There is a requirement for identification that is performed by the Official Photographer.

.,,


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## almostfreebird

I don't know why my post was deleted. My post was "I can't smile in front of the mirror". There is a mirror inside self-service photo booths and I can't smile in front of the mirror.


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## .   1

almostfreebird said:


> I don't know why my post was deleted. My post was "I can't smile in front of the mirror". There is a mirror inside self-service photo booths and I can't smile in front of the mirror.


That makes perfect sense.
I would have a hard time smiling if the bloke smiling back at me had exactly the same facial features as me and was imitating my smile.
I see this response as being on a psychological level in that we have a hard time smiling at ourselves.
I don't smile into mirrors.

.,,


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## Etcetera

Lavinia.dNP said:


> Can anyone explain me why in some countries it is forbidden to smile in passport pictures?
> 
> It's the first time I hear about this and I'm quite curious.


As far as I know, there's no law forbidding to smile in passport pictures in Russia. But the photographs always tell me not to smile. 
I guess that in this country it may have something to do with the Soviet legacy. I remember seeing a truly shoking picture of a Moscow trolleybus in the 1930s: no one passenger was smiling, on the contrary, they were all wearing the most serious and even sorrowful expression. That was the first time I realised what the life then was.


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## Chaska Ñawi

almostfreebird said:


> I don't know why my post was deleted. My post was "I can't smile in front of the mirror". There is a mirror inside self-service photo booths and I can't smile in front of the mirror.



Sorry, Almostfreebird.  Now that you've explained, I understand perfectly!


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## fenixpollo

Tsoman said:


> That all depends on which side of the spectrum you fall on


I don't understand this post, Tsoman. What spectrum are you talking about? 





. said:


> We have photo booths but these are just for happy snaps not for official photos.


The same is true in the US. Photo booths are for fun. 





almostfreebird said:


> I can't smile in front of the mirror.


 So, does your cryptic post mean that passport/CV photos in Japan are generally taken in a photo booth? And that most Japanese have difficulty smiling at the photo-booth mirror? Or is there a different attitude being reflected here?


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## serg79

almostfreebird said:


> There is a mirror inside self-service photo booths and I can't smile in front of the mirror.


Me neither, although I'd find it hard to force a smile for a photographer too.
To me it's kind of strange that in countries like the USA, Australia and Italy (<especially as it's an EU country and they have the same kind of passports as we do in the UK and Ireland) you still need a photographer to take photos for official documents. Certainly for at least the last 25 years (as long as I can remember) here, you've been able to use those photo booths for your passport photos. I can't imagine anyone using them for fun these days!
You can actually even take your own passport mug shots here if you follow the guidelines for acceptable photos and have a good enough camera/printer... then you can take as many photos as you like until you get the perfect facial expression.


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## Lavinia.dNP

serg79 said:


> Me neither, although I'd find it hard to force a smile for a photographer too.
> To me it's kind of strange that in countries like the USA, Australia and Italy (<especially as it's an EU country and they have the same kind of passports as we do in the UK and Ireland) you still need a photographer to take photos for official documents. Certainly for at least the last 25 years (as long as I can remember) here, you've been able to use those photo booths for your passport photos. I can't imagine anyone using them for fun these days!
> You can actually even take your own passport mug shots here if you follow the guidelines for acceptable photos and have a good enough camera/printer... then you can take as many photos as you like until you get the perfect facial expression.


 
I don't know if in Italy it is compulsory to have the picture taken by a photographer, but I go to a photographer because the pictures from the booth are so horrible!

This summer, for my ID card I brought a set of photoshopped pictures of me. I had photoshopped a picture of me in order to make the background white, copy-pasted it several times side by side, and printed on photo paper with an ordinary printer. The face was rather big, because it was taken from a close distance, but when I brought them, the lady showed them to the other employees saying "here! that's how every ID picture should be taken! it is so clear!"
Apparently, she seemed to accept them. Good for me!


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## almostfreebird

fenixpollo said:


> So, does your cryptic post mean that passport/CV photos in Japan are generally taken in a photo booth? And that most Japanese have difficulty smiling at the photo-booth mirror? Or is there a different attitude being reflected here?


 
I don't know about the law, but I guess people(in Japan) don't use photo-booths for their passports. For CV I think they usually use self-service photo-booths because it's easy and cheap(inexpensive) and when you get or renew your driving licence some staff in the police(generally woman) take your picture free of charge. But those photos taken in photo-booths or by those staff in the police are usually bad I guess, sometimes they look like criminals or psycopaths, so if you want your photo taken good you'd go to a photographer who have good taste in art.(regardless of pro or amateur).
As for smiling into mirrors; models, actors, actresses and narcissists could smile anytime anywhere when they were required to do so, not me.


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## fenixpollo

almostfreebird said:


> As for smiling into mirrors; models, actors, actresses and narcissists could smile anytime anywhere when they were required to do so, not me.


Does that mean that anyone who smiles for a photograph is a narcissist or an actor?


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## Etcetera

serg79 said:


> You can actually even take your own passport mug shots here if you follow the guidelines for acceptable photos and have a good enough camera/printer... then you can take as many photos as you like until you get the perfect facial expression.


Here in Russia, you can also make a picture of yourself using your camera and then go to a photo studio and ask them to print those photos. I find it useful and think when I'll need new photos for documents I'll do it. I hate being photographed by strangers, you know.


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## Span_glish

hikari37lito said:


> Why dont Japanese smile on the picture that they attach on their resume?


Are pictures required/expected as part of a resume?
I would thought that employers already have enough problems with discrimination laws without viewing a picture.


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