# EHL Forum Rules & Online resources



## Frank06

*Welcome to the Etymology and History of Languages Forum*

*The forum is devoted to*


questions of etymology and language change throughout history;
the divergence of related languages;
and political, economic, social and religious influences on languages; 
*general linguistics* in order to establish and explain theoretical background knowledge necessary (like phonetics and phonology, typology of languages, dialectology, sociolinguistics, etc.). -> Announcement
*Threads may be about: *

single languages,
language families,
other combinations of languages, as appropriate for the topic.
*In this sticky you will find:*
The EHL Forum rules
On line resources


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## Frank06

*1. Be helpful, not hurtful*

If someone's Spanish, English, French, Italian (or whichever languages apply) isn't perfect, don't treat him/her badly.
*2. Quoted material*

No web pages or copyrighted content may be inserted into WordReference posts except as indicated below. Minor fair use excerpts from dictionaries such as a definition/translation or two are permitted. Quotes and translations of texts up to 4 sentences are permitted, but see specific EHL rule #14 below. Links to content elsewhere are acceptable and appropriate, provided such links meet the requirements stated elsewhere in these rules.
All forms of inserted content that do not meet these conditions will be removed without exception.
*3. **School assignments*

If you want help with a school assignment, you are required to do your own work first. Then, and only then, may you post it with a request for help with specific doubts.
*4. Dictionaries*

Look for the answer in dictionaries first (click here for links to online etymological dictionaries).
*5. Thread title*

Put the word or phrase in the title when asking a question (avoid "I'm new", "Help!" and the like).
*6. Spelling and language*

Chat language and chat spelling are not allowed in any language used.
Members are required to make their best attempt to write in the standard variant of the language of their choice. This includes the proper use of capital letters and punctuation.​
Theoretically, there is no restriction on the language in which you write your post. But try, when asked for, to translate or paraphrase (parts of) your posts in a language which is generaly understood by our members. And no, this doesn't necessarily have to be English .​
*7. Be polite*

The use of "Hello", “Hi” and "Thank you" is welcome.
*8. Thou Shalt Not Chat*

Don’t use the forum as a chatboard (it is inefficient); use the private message (PM) feature if you want to send a personal message to another forum member
*9. Advertising free forum*

Do not post links to commercial sites. This is an advertising free forum and we want to keep it this way.
*10. Questions and comments*

If you have further questions please post them in the "Comments and Suggestions" Forum or send a private message (PM) to your favourite moderator.
*11. Report a post*

Use the report-a-post feature in the top right corner of each post, if you read a post that contains questionable language/pictures or if you feel it does not belong to this specific forum. This will help to run the forum smoothly.
*12. General WR Rules*

Please check the forum rules periodically since they will be updated whenever necessary. For a detailed list, please check the comprehensive WR Rules.
*13. Quoting previous posts*

Only quote the relevant parts of a previous post.
Please put your reactions outside the [/quote] tag.

* Not: *


> abc abc abc
> your reaction to abc


* But:*



> abc abc abc


your reaction to abc

*PARTICULAR RULES FOR THE EHL FORUM*

*14. Acknowledge the source*

Try to back up your explanations with sound arguments based on accepted methods used in mainstream linguistics. Mention your source(s) when asked for.
When you make an educated guess, please clearly indicate as such.
*Quoting* may exceed the general limit of four sentences under the conditions given below:
---> The exception from the 4-sentence rule *only applies to scientific sources*, that is to sources which would be acceptable for quoting in a linguist's work. This *excludes Wikipedia* and similar sites, for which our general quoting rules of 4 sentences still will apply. It also *excludes word lists* - EHL should remain a discussion forum and not try and develop into a "rival Wiktionary".
---> Source must be given by *scientific quoting* - acknowledge the source, and separate source and comments of yours in a way which leaves absolutely no doubt about which has been quoted and which has been your comment.
---> And last but not least - make an attempt of *reducing the overlong quote to what is absolutely necessary.* We do not want to accumulate a load of long quotes which do not really contribute to the topic, or of which only some small passages are relevant.

Please note that this change of rules is made on a *preliminary basis;* if it works out it will become permanent.
However, moderators may still shorten or delete overlong quotes by their own discretion.  

*15. Novelty theories*

This forum deals with (firmly) established historical linguistic peer reviewed theories. 

EHL is not a venue to launch or expand on private pet theories, pseudo-linguistic ponderings, idiosyncratic and fringe ideas. This also includes theories based upon random lists of similarly looking words, chance coincidences, wild speculations or associations and other pseudo-linguistic and pre-scientific methods.
Novelty theories on the perceived relations between two languages (let's say Sumerian and Japanese), on the 'First' or 'Original language' (let's say Hebrew) or similar(ly) idiosyncratic theories, folk-etymologies etc. are outside the scope of this forum.
 These include pseudo-scientific authors as Isaac Mozeson, Edo Nyland, Zoltan Simon, Barry Fell, Joan Leaf, Polat Kaya, and, alas, many many many more.
*16. Politics
*

WR and EHL are forums which deal with linguistics, not with politics. We do not allow political sneers or merely politically motivated statements, theories etc. disguised as linguistic theories.

*

SPECIAL QUOTING RULES FOR THE EHL FORUM*

Discourse in EHL is often more academic in nature than in other WR forums. Therefore we allow certain exceptions from the general rules:  scientific quoting should be allowed even when exceeding the general  4-sentence-rule.

However, moderators may still shorten or delete overlong quotes by their own discretion.
We ask you to follow those guidelines:

*Quoting* may exceed the general limit of four sentences under the conditions given below:

---> The exception from the 4-sentence rule *only applies to scientific sources*, that is to sources which would be acceptable for quoting in a linguist's work. This *excludes Wikipedia* and similar sites, for which our general quoting rules of 4 sentences still will apply. It also *excludes word lists* - EHL should remain a discussion forum and not try and develop into a "rival Wiktionary".

---> Source must be given by *scientific quoting* - acknowledge  the source, and separate source and comments of yours in a way which  leaves absolutely no doubt about which has been quoted and which has  been your comment.

---> And last but not least - make an attempt of *reducing the overlong quote to what is absolutely necessary.*  We do not want to accumulate a load of long quotes which do not really  contribute to the topic, or of which only some small passages are  relevant.


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## Frank06

*1. General etymological dictionaries and databases (arranged by language family)*

*1.1. Portal site (multiple language families)*
a. Databases - Portal site, 60+ etymological databases, a.o. Indo-European, Altaic, Sino-Tibetan, Dravidian, Afro-Asiatic, Japanese, and many more language families (and subfamilies) and language isolates [in English]


*1.2. Altaic
Turkish*
a. http://socrates.berkeley.edu:7037/cg...TELLsearch.cgi - Turkish Electronic Living Lexicon, general dictionary of modern Turkish with etymological explanations [in English]
b. http://www.nisanyan.com/sozluk/search.asp?w=kof&x=26&y=8 - not a 100% reliable [in Turkish]


*1.3. Austroasiatic
Vietnamese*
a. Chinese-Vietnamese Etymology: Tunguyen Han-Nom - Từnguyên HánNôm (haylà TiếngNôm có gốcHán, The Etymology of Nôm of Chinese Origin, ho) [in Vietnamese, Chinese, English]


*1.4. Austronesian
Indonesian*
a. Indonesian Etymology Database - Indonesian Etymology Database [in Indonesian, English]


*1.5. Indo-European languages*
a. http://www.indo-european.nl/\index2.html - Portal site, 23 etymological databases of various (older) IE languages and sub-families [in English]
b. The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition. 2000 - C. Watkins' list of PIE roots (related to English) [in English]

*Proto-Indo-European*
a. http://homepage.uibk.ac.at/~c30310/idgwbhin.html - Köbler, Gerhard [in German]
b. http://www.indo-european.nl/cgi-bin/startq.cgi?flags=endnnnl&root=leiden&basename=%5Cdata%5Cie%5Cpokorny - Pokorny's classic PIE dictionary (slightly outdated) [in English]
c. WordReference Forums - PIE roots and tree of reflexes -- experimental site under development.

*Baltic
Lithuanian*
a. http://www.lkz.lt/startas.htm - [in Lithuanian]

*Celtic
Gaelic*
a. MacBain's Dictionary - A. MacBain's _Etymological Dictionary of the Gaelic Language _[in English]

*Germanic
Proto-Germanic*
a. http://lexicon.ff.cuni.cz/pdf/pgmc_torp/pgmc_torp.pdf - A. Fick's _Wortschatz der germanischen Spracheinheit_, 1909 [pdf] [in German]
b. http://homepage.uibk.ac.at/~c30310/germwbhinw.html - Köbler, Gerhard [in German]
c. Germanic Lexicon Project - Germanic Lexicon Project [in English]

*Dutch*
a. http://gtb.inl.nl/ - Woordenboek der Nederlandse Taal, with etymological notes [in Dutch]

*English (and derived languages)*
a. http://www.etymonline.com/ - [in English]
b. http://www.dsl.ac.uk/index.html - Searchable dictionaries from this site:_ SND, Scottish National Dictionary_, documenting Modern Scots, i.e. 1700-present and_ DOST, Dictionary of the Older Scottish Tongue_, documenting Middle Scots.

*German*
a. http://homepage.uibk.ac.at/~c30310/derwbhin.html - Köbler, Gerhard [in German]
b. http://dwb.uni-trier.de/Projekte/DWB/ - Grimm's dictionary [in German]
c. http://www.mhdwb-online.de/ - Middle High German dictionary [in German]

*Swedish*
a. http://g3.spraakdata.gu.se/saob/ - General dictionary of modern Swedish with etymological explanations [in Swedish]
b. http://runeberg.org/svetym/ - Old dictionary, 1922 [in Swedish]

*Greek
'Mycenean' Greek*
a. http://www.projethomere.com/ressources/linearb.pdf - Linear B glossary [pdf] [in English]

*Greek*
a. http://www.komvos.edu.gr/dictionaries/dictonline/DictOnLineTri.htm - General Greek dictionary with etymological notes [in Greek]

*Italic (and Romance)
Catalan*
a. http://www.grec.net/home/cel/dicc.htm - Catalan dictionary with etymological notes [in Catalan]

*French*
a. http://atilf.atilf.fr/academie.htm - Dictionary of the Académie Française, with etymological notes, 8th edition [in French]
b. http://francois.gannaz.free.fr/Littre/accueil.php - [in French]
c. http://www.cnrtl.fr/etymologie/ - French etymology excerpted directly from the TLFi dictionary (Trésor de la Langue Française Informatisé) [in French]

*Galego*
a. http://www.agal-gz.org/estraviz/ - General Gelego-Portuguese dictionary with etymological notes [in Portuguese]

*Italian*
a. http://etimo.it/ - Slightly outdated Italian etymological dictionary [in Italian]

*Occitan*
a. http://etymologie-occitane.chez-alice.fr/ - history of Occitan words (about 1500 words now)

*Portuguese*
a. http://www.agal-gz.org/estraviz/ - General Galego-Portuguese dictionary with etymological notes [in Portuguese]

*Romanian*
a. http://dexonline.ro/ - General Romanian dictionary with etymological explanations [in Romanian]

*Spanish*
a. http://www.elcastellano.org/palabra.php - Limited etymologic dictionary [in Spanish]
b. http://www.rae.es/RAE/Noticias.nsf/Home?ReadForm - General dictionary of the Spanish Academy with etymological notes [in Spanish]

*Slav(on)ic
Czech*
a. http://www.sweb.cz/corpus/slovnik.htm - Rather rudimentary [in Czech]

*Russian*
a. http://starling.rinet.ru/cgi-bin/main.cgi?root=/usr/local/share/starling/morpho&morpho=1 - Ozegov, Zalizniak, Vasmer [in Russian]
b. http://www.oomnik.org/korneslov - Lexical roots and derivatives [in Russian]
c. http://www.vasmer.narod.ru/ - [in Russian]

*1.6. Sino-Tibetan
Chinese*
a. http://www.chineseetymology.org/ - Chinese _character_ etymology (as with most character etymological dictionaries: to be taken with a grain of salt) [in English]


*1.7. Uralic
Estonian*
a. http://www.eki.ee/dict/raun/ - Limited [in Estonian]


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