# World / Light



## francisgranada

Hello World!

Is there any similarity or etymolological affinity in your language between the words meaning _"world"_ and _"light/brightness/clear...",_ like in the following examples?

_World_
Hungarian: *világ* 
Czech_: *svět* _
Romanian_: *lume* _

_Light, brightness ..._
Hungarian_: *világosság*_ 
Czech_: *světlo*_
Romanian_: *lumină*_


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## rusita preciosa

Yes for Russian. 
Moreover, it is actually the same word *свет* /svet/ - light and world.


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## francisgranada

rusita preciosa said:


> Yes for Russian.
> Moreover, it is actually the same word *свет* /svet/ - light and world.


 
Yes, also in Hungarian _világ_ (world) can be used in some cases in the sense of light (without the formant -_osság_).


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## jazyk

World is mundo and light is luz in Portuguese, but we have dar à luz (lit. to give to the light), which actually means to give birth or to give rise.


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## francisgranada

jazyk said:


> World is mundo and light is luz in Portuguese, but we have dar à luz (lit. to give to the light), which actually means to give birth or to give rise.


 
There is a similar expression in Hungarian: _világra hozni_ (lit. "bring to world", but it can be interpreted also as "bring to light").

***********************************
There is something similar, though not the same, in some romance languages, too: 

sp. _*mundo*,_ it. _*mondo*_ (latin _mundus_)- world 
sp. & it. _*mondo*_ (latin _mundus_) - clean, limpid, neat ... 


_According to the dictionary of the Real Academia Española:_
_*mondo**, da*_*. *(Del lat. _mundus_). 
1. adj. Limpio y libre de cosas superfluas, mezcladas, añadidas o adherentes.
...

(I don't know if it is valid also for the Portuguese, Catalan, French ...)


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## bibax

I know nothing about Old Indian but I have found that *loka* (world) is somehow related to *roka* (light).


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## DearPrudence

jazyk said:


> World is mundo and light is luz in Portuguese, but we have dar à luz (lit. to give to the light), which actually means to give birth or to give rise.


Just the same in French:
*world: le monde
light: la lumière
come to light: venir au monde *_(come to the world)_* / voir le jour*_ (see the light)

_Edit:





> _sp. & it. *mondo* (latin mundus) - clean, limpid, neat ... _



We don't have "monde" as an adjective but we have "*immonde*": filthy, revolting


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## jazyk

> ***********************************
> There is something similar, though not the same, in some romance languages, too:
> 
> sp. _*mundo*,_ it. _*mondo*_ (latin _mundus_)- world
> sp. & it. _*mondo*_ (latin _mundus_) - clean, limpid, neat ...


The same in Portuguese, but the adjective mundo is not in current use, I am afraid. Its opposite, imundo, is a common word, though.


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## ThomasK

_Het licht zien_ vs. _wereld_ in Dutch, but I do not think they refer to the same thing. We generally say: _het levenslicht_, the light of life. 

_Mundus_ and English _mundane_: plain, common, but a link with the world or light? Don't think so. 

It is quite intriguing though. I wonder if anyone can find a trace in Germanic languages.


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## bibax

In Latin *mundus* means:

1. _adj._ clean, limpid, neat, elegant, ...;

2. _noun - primary meaning:_ outward, garb, habiliments, ... (e.g. mundus mulieris = ladies garb);
_- secondary meaning:_ world, universe, mankind;

So mundus is not related to lux (lumen) and leoht (both from PIE root *lewk-).


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## Orlin

In Bulgarian they're related: свят = world and светлина = light.


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## apmoy70

In Greek:
_World_: «Κόσμος» ('kozmos, _masculine noun_); Classical «κόσμος» ('kŏsmŏs, _masculine noun_)-->_Adornment, adorning, ornament, order, good order_, with obscure etymology (there are a few etymological suggestions for it: *ken-, _fresh, new, young_; *ghodh- (*ghedh-), _to clinch, hold together, unite_)
_Light_: «Φως» (fos, _neuter noun_); Classical «φάος/φῶς» ('pʰāŏs [uncontracted]/pʰōs [contracted]); PIE base *bʰā-, _light, lightning_.
So, the two are unrelated.


			
				jazyk said:
			
		

> ...but we have dar à luz (lit. to give to the light), which actually means to give birth or to give rise


We say «φέρνω στον κόσμο» ('ferno ston 'kozmo)-->_to bring to the world_ with the meaning of giving birth. When someone says «φέρνω στο φως» ('ferno sto fos)-->_to bring to the light_ he/she means _to discover, make a new finding_ or _bring out an information/truth hidden for a long time_.


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## ThomasK

_(Not 'eis', Apmoy? That was the word I learnt in classical Latin.)_

I really wonder if anyone could find the etymology of the Slavic words. It is quite intriguing!


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## bibax

The Protoslavic noun *svět* (= light) is from the PIE root **kweit-* = white, to shine. Thus it is related to English white, Old English *hwit*. Note the *s-* vs. *h-* (satem/Slavic vs. kentum/Germanic languages).

It seems that also Latin *mundus* and Greek *kosmos* meant originally something else than "world".


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## ThomasK

Thanks for the information. It seems quite strange though that the same word can then come to refer to the world, if we start from the basic meaning 'white' (or light). 

_Kosmos_: doesn't it refer to the fact that the Greek considered it decorated, perfectly ordered (think of _cosmetics_)? (Confirmed by etymonline.org)
_Mundus_ refers to clean, elegant, I now learn at the same source, and as such kind-of calque of the Greek. 

But maybe, starting from that: could the _white_ refer to the (perception of) perfection of the world ?


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## francisgranada

bibax said:


> The Protoslavic noun *svět* (= light) is from the PIE root **kweit-* = white, to shine. Thus it is related to English white, Old English *hwit*. Note the *s-* vs. *h-* (satem/Slavic vs. kentum/Germanic languages).
> 
> It seems that also Latin *mundus* and Greek *kosmos* meant originally something else than "world".


 
That's also the intuition of mine. The answer is maybe somewhere in the book of Genesis ...


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## ThomasK

Aha, a religious source... Not improbable. Have Slavic languages also been strongly influenced by religion? The 16th-century Bible translation - and the strong influence of the church in Western Europe - did influence Dutch (e.g., uniformity/ standardisation, lots of phrases, etc.).


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## francisgranada

ThomasK said:


> ... Have Slavic languages also been strongly influenced by religion? ...


 
Yes, starting with the Old Church Slavonic, that was strongly influenced especially by the greek.


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## francisgranada

bibax said:


> The Protoslavic noun *svět* (= light) is from the PIE root **kweit-* = white, to shine. Thus it is related to English white, Old English *hwit*. Note the *s-* vs. *h-* (satem/Slavic vs. kentum/Germanic languages).


 
Another curiosity:
Slavic: *svět* (world), *květ* (flower), *cvět* (russian: colour)
Hungarian: *világ* (world), *virág* (flower)

I'm not sure now, but as far as I remember the world *květ* is related to *svět*, too (through "light", not as "world"). However, the word *květ* is rather "kentum" than "satem"... (of course, not all the *k changed to *s, but it's interesting.)

The Hungarian *világ* (light > world) and *virág *(flower) are related to each other as they come from the same root.


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## Selyd

In Ukrainian they're related: світ = world and св*і*тло = light.


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## ancalimon

In old Turkic,  it's superficially related. "OR" means highest, bright  "YER YÜZÜ" means "face of earth, ground"  (Yer: ground, earth   Yüz: face)  Also we have KOR (heart of fire, eternal fire) which was used to define the Sun as "Kor Göz" "the everlasting fire eye (ordered by Tengri)". Moon was the "Kör Göz" "the blind eye (ordered by Tengri)"


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## ThomasK

francisgranada said:


> Another curiosity:
> Slavic: *svět* (world), *květ* (flower), *cvět* (russian: colour)
> Hungarian: *világ* (world), *virág* (flower)
> 
> I'm not sure now, but as far as I remember the world *květ* is related to *svět*, too (through "light", not as "world"). However, the word *květ* is rather "kentum" than "satem"... (of course, not all the *k changed to *s, but it's interesting.)
> 
> The Hungarian *világ* (light > world) and *virág *(flower) are related to each other as they come from the same root.


 
I thought it would be interesting to hear more about that from the EHL-foreros; so I copied Francis's message there. I now wonder whether anyone can detect any mistakes, or explain certain developments, etc.


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## vianie

There's also a connection with the unmentioned word "saint", at least in Slavic languages: Czech - svatý, Slovak - svätý, Polish - święty, Ukrainian - святий, Russian and Belarusian - святой, Croatian - svet, Serbian - свети etc.


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## ThomasK

That refers to religious language then. So the basis of the word for 'world' could be religious, I guess...


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## mataripis

*TAGALOG:  World= Daigdig    Light= Ilaw, Tanglaw,Liwanag,Sinag,(lesser degree)   Sometimes "World" is translated in Tagalog as "Buhay" or life(in English).*


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## ThomasK

So no resemblance at all...


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## Encolpius

francisgranada said:


> Hello World!
> 
> Is there any similarity or etymolological affinity in your language between the words meaning _"world"_ and _"light/brightness/clear...",_ like in the following examples?
> 
> _World_
> Hungarian: *világ*
> Czech_: *svět* _
> Romanian_: *lume* _
> 
> _Light, brightness ..._
> Hungarian_: *világ(osság*_)
> Czech_: *světlo*_
> Romanian_: *lumină*_



It is not necessary to change világ to világosság. First because the primary meaning of that word was "light", even the famous Czuczor-Fogarasi Dictionary of 1862 gives that meaning to the first place. Now I can remember only two examples of that meaning: szeme *világa *and the children song: Virágéknál ég a *világ*, sütik már a rántott békát...


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## francisgranada

Encolpius said:


> It is not necessary to change világ to világosság. First because the primary meaning of that word was "light", even the famous Czuczor-Fogarasi Dictionary of 1862 gives that meaning to the first place. Now I can remember only two examples of that meaning: szeme *világa *and the children song: Virágéknál ég a *világ*, sütik már a rántott békát...


Of course. Also *világtalan *(blind, literally lightless).


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## ThomasK

I just wonder: is this word for 'world' also used when translating 'travel around the world'? If I understood well, it is mainly used in connection with _bring to light (// bring to the world) _in Rumanian. Of is it more general?


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## francisgranada

ThomasK said:


> I just wonder: is this word for 'world' also used when translating 'travel around the world'?


 In Hungarian yes. "Normally" _világ _is used in the sense of _world, _and _light _(as opposite to _darkness_) is "világosság". But the word _világ _still maintains the (original) meaning, i.e. _light_. There is also an other world for light in Hungarian: _fény_.


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## ThomasK

But no other word for 'world', I guess then? What is the meaning of the [suffix ?] -_ossag_?


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## Encolpius

No word for World. világ (light, world) > világ-os [noun>adjective, i.e.: bright, light] > világos-ság [adjective>noun, the German -keit, Dutch -heid] it's the same


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## Encolpius

Macedonian can be added...or maybe Japanese


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## 810senior

Japanese doesn't fit that in.
Unluckily, there is no relation between them...

World:世界[sekai, lit. region of the world], 世の中[yo no naka, lit. inside the world, also used as noun, as in 世知辛い世の中じゃ_sechigarai yo no naka zya_, what a troublesome world]
Light, brightness:光[hikari, lit.shining; v. 光るhikaru to shine], 明るさ[akarusa, brightness, from adjective 明るいakarui bright, splendid]


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## ThomasK

Can we now really say that one word in some languages means both 'light' and 'the world'? I keep wondering whether one is not like a metaphorical meaning of the other (just wondering).main issue is: does the meaning depend on the context or not? if the world meaning only turns up in certain expressions, then I'd call the hypothesis of the double meaning in doubt...


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