# farsi le seghe mentali



## ricky165

come posso dire in inglese "seghe mentali", in italiano si usa in maniera abbastanza, come dire, spicciola e volgare, farsi le seghe mentali quando uno pensa a cose che non li potrebbero mai succedere o quando si preoccupa eccessivamente. Ho pensato a "mental wanks" ma non so se sia giusto.


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## lsp

mental masturbation


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## MarinaB

Ciao a tutti

come si potrebbe tradurre "non farti pippe mentali" in inglese?

Contesto: per una cosa poco importante e urgente la persona si sta troppo impegnando, si sta complicando la vita... si fa dunque "le pippe mentali"...  

L'espressione è intraducibile, ma forse c'è qualcosa di simile?

thank youu
Marina


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## kellytree

Mental masturbation - but I have only heard this expression used by Italians speaking English.


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## Paulfromitaly

Maybe:

Don't freak out on something.
Don't fuss to much over something.


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## london calling

kellytree said:


> Mental masturbation - but I have only heard this expression used by Italians speaking English.


 
Hello!
No, I can assure you we say it in London....! And it translates "farsi le pippe mentali" perfectly because that is exactly how us Brits use it.....!


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## Roo Boy

Che vuol dire segamentale? È una parola volgare?


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## nonnoparmiro

LOL
It's actually complicated to explain.. let's say it's a juvenile slang form, but i wouldn't call it vulgar.
In Engish it litterally means "mental wank" and it refers to the act of mulling over a bad thought for too long, or being too concerned for something trivial. Basically thinking too much


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## Paulfromitaly

It's "sega mentale", two words.
Farsi le seghe mentali means to make a big thing out of some minor problems and therefore think and worry about them too much.


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## bise

Anyway I would define it vulgar!
You can use it just in very very informal context!


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## london calling

Roo Boy said:


> Che vuol dire segamentale? È una parola volgare?


 
Mental masturbation........!

EDIT: In Italian it's about as rude as it is in English (I mean you have to know the person you say it to well!).
The meaning is exactly the same....


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## AnnyPan

For example, people use this term when you are wondering about a man/woman that you like... "Is him true?" "What does he feel about me?" "Is he really with her mother at the cinema on saturday night???"
...and so on :-D


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## nami90pieces_west_MCL

Sto cercando di fare capire ad un ragazzo che riguardo al mio fisico, dal momento che sono un po' cicciottella, mi facico un sacco di 'seghe mentali'/paranoie/viaggi negativi...


Come si traduce?
Ho letto prima che traducono 'seghe mentali' con 'mental masturbation', ma ci credo ben poco.

Chi mi aiuta?


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## arthurlee

Per l'ennesima volta approfitto di un vecchio post...

Sto leggendo un libro dove a un certo punto il protagonista, che ne sta passando di tutti i colori ed è sempre sotto stress, decide di sfogarsi prendendo a pugni il sacco da boxe, andando a correre ecc., e a questo proposito spiega:
"*It was the only time I wasn't chewing myself into little mental bits*"
Il concetto mi sembra chiaro: solo in quel momento smetteva di *rimuginare sui suoi problemi*. 
Ma che ne dite di "*Era l'unico momento in cui non mi facevo le seghe mentali*"? Troppo libera?
Grazie per i suggerimenti!


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## GavinW

arthurlee said:


> Ma che ne dite di "*Era l'unico momento in cui non mi facevo le seghe mentali*"? Troppo libera?


 
Well done for resuscitating an unanswered and potentially productive thread.
Too _free_? Not a bit of it. Just maybe not quite_ right_, in the sense that the English expression does not contain a negative connotation, in itself, whereas the Italian expression definitely does. In other words, no, it is not a good idea to chew oneself up into mental bits, but the narrator is not necessarily expressing a negative opinion of (ie commenting on) the action itself (and its utility, shall we say).
But I found your post stimulating. Let's hope for a good translation of seghe mentali in English.... More contexts, anyone?


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## arthurlee

Hey Gavin thanks a lot. 
Anyway it just occurred to me that another way to convey that meaning could be "era l'unico momento in cui *riuscivo a staccare la spina*" and/or "*la smettevo di torturarmi* con i miei pensieri".
I guess these expressions possess a less negative connotation compared with the "onanistic" one!


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## skerby

what about: "you should have a "no frills" attitude" ? 
Does anyone think this is right?

Sorry if I upped this old thread, I just thought it was relevant to the subject in debate


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## Teerex51

skerby said:


> what about: "you should have a "no frills" attitude" ?
> Does anyone think this is right?



_No frills_ vuol dire "senza fronzoli". Una _no-frills attitude_ definisce un atteggiamento essenziale, concreto.

Come traduzione di "pippe mentali" mi sembra molto tirata.


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## london calling

Teerex51 said:


> _No frills_ vuol dire "senza fronzoli". Una _no-frills attitude_ definisce un atteggiamento essenziale, concreto.
> 
> Come traduzione di "pippe mentali" mi sembra molto tirata.


Concordo. Sono due concetti diversi.


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## Alxmrphi

"_Making a fuss over nothing_" ? Is it like this?


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## london calling

Alxmrphi said:


> "_Making a fuss over nothing_" ? Is it like this?


Yep! Paul suggested something similar a while ago...

Whilst we're at it, I think we also _make mountains out of molehills_, don't we, which is a little politer than "mental masturbation" (_farsi una pippa_ does mean to masturbate, however).


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## Alxmrphi

Ah I completely missed Paul's post!


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## neuromatico

Would the natives (and lc: honourary native) consider _farsi le seghe mentali_ to be an equivalent and/or equally common expression?


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## london calling

neuromatico said:


> Would the natives (and lc: honourary native) consider _farsi le seghe mentali_ to be an equivalent and/or equally common expression?


Thanks!
I would, although I think that "pippa mentale" is a little less rude/vulgar that "sega mentale", but you still have to be careful who you say it to 

True natives?


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## Odysseus54

neuromatico said:


> Would the natives (and lc: honourary native) consider _farsi le seghe mentali_ to be an equivalent and/or equally common expression?




Yes to both, and for some reason it sounds slightly ruder to me.

I see that LC was quicker to the draw than me - but we agree, and that's the good thing.

Why is 'pippe' less rude than 'seghe' ?  I suspect because 'pippe' sounds more like funny talk, whereas 'seghe' is almost forensic.


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## Blechi

Alxmrphi said:


> "_Making a fuss over nothing_" ? Is it like this?


Not quite. 
Farsi le pippe mentali means to give too much importance to something. Am I clear?


Odysseus54 said:


> Yes to both, and for some reason it sounds slightly ruder to me.
> 
> I see that LC was quicker to the draw than me - but we agree, and that's the good thing.
> 
> Why is 'pippe' less rude than 'seghe' ? I suspect because 'pippe' sounds more like funny talk, whereas 'seghe' is almost forensic.


 
Forensic? Are you sure? I never heard the word "seghe" in a forensic context. Did you mean anything out of my reach? "Seghe" belongs to the same register as "wanker". 

Did any English speaking Native ever hear the word "wanker" used in court or in minutes?


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## Odysseus54

Blechi said:


> Not quite.
> Farsi le pippe mentali means to give too much importance to something. Am I clear?


If that were the case, "to fuss about nothing" would be perfect.

"Farsi le pippe mentali" means to go around in circles in your head , creating scenarios, anticipating reactions, going through 'what ifs' , in solitary self-comforting fashion, rather than choosing a more productive tack.





Blechi said:


> Forensic? Are you sure? I never heard the word "seghe" in a forensic context. Did you mean anything out of my reach? "Seghe" belongs to the same register as "wanker".
> 
> Did any English speaking Native ever hear the word "wanker" used in court or in minutes?


I beg your pardon - I meant it in a metaphorical sense.

Let's say then "more technical", when compared with the less serious term "pippe" , if you prefer.


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## gdbjoe

Interesting thread, I'm actually looking for a good translation for "seghe mentali", and I was wondering if "mind games" could make it...

Googling I see mind games being referred as "An act or series of acts of calculated psychological manipulation,  especially in order to confuse or intimidate.", can this be interpreted only from one person to another, or something someone could also do on him/herself?

Thanks, sorry my horrible grammar, waiting for a native to correct me ;-)


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## King Crimson

gdbjoe said:


> Interesting thread, I'm actually looking for a good translation for "seghe mentali", and I was wondering if "mind games" could make it...
> 
> Googling I see mind games being referred as "An act or series of acts of calculated psychological manipulation, especially in order to confuse or intimidate.", can this be interpreted only from one person to another, or something someone could also do on him/herself?
> 
> Thanks, sorry my horrible grammar, waiting for a native to correct me ;-)


 
La prima che hai detto secondo me, v. anche questa vecchia discussione sui _mind games_.


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## london calling

nami90pieces_west_MCL said:


> Ho letto prima che traducono 'seghe mentali' con 'mental masturbation', ma ci credo ben poco.


Perchè? Noi così lo diciamo. Isp è di madrelingua, come me.


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## queenelisabeth84

london calling said:


> Mental masturbation........!
> 
> EDIT: In Italian it's about as rude as it is in English (I mean you have to know the person you say it to well!).
> The meaning is exactly the same....



I don't believe it!! Do you really say "mental masturbation" in English? Ouch, as an Italian speaker that sounds really more vulgar than in Italian!


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## london calling

queenelisabeth84 said:


> I don't believe it!! Do you really say "mental masturbation" in English? Ouch, as an Italian speaker that sounds really more vulgar than in Italian!


Why don't you believe it? The expression's been around for many, many years!


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## eiasu

ops!
I always translated "mind-fuck" in "seghe mentali"
was I badly wrong with that translation?
I never looked up into dictionaries, i assumed so,
but now when I check some online dictionaries I find quite different translations.
thank you
Eiasu's 1st post


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## Teerex51

Hi, I guess you know what they say about assuming... 
_Mental masturbation_ and _mind-fuck_ are different things, neither one being especially healthy. One is self-inflicted, the other requires more people.


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## eiasu

Teerex51 said:


> Hi, I guess you know what they say about [I AM NOT ALLOWED TO POST LINKS]...


ASS-uming .... that was told to me once upon ago 


Teerex51 said:


> _Mental masturbation_ and _mind-fuck_ are different things, neither one being especially healthy. One is self-inflicted, the other requires more people.


I do not understand, can you please specify what you mean by:


Teerex51 said:


> the other requires more people.



thank you
ciao
eiasu


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## Teerex51

Sorry, this thread is not about _mind-fuck. _Please look it up and find out why it's generally induced by third parties.


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## eiasu

Teerex51 said:


> Sorry, this thread is not about _mind-fuck. _Please look it up and find out why it's generally induced by third parties.


ok grazie, buon vento teerex


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## Ted Brasil

Hi, 

urban dictionary in my view is right suggesting mindfuck as the equivalent of 'sega mentale'. Mindfuck is defined as : An image that totally fucks with your mind. When you see it, you will shit bricks. As an example: WOW! That picture was a mindfuck!


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## GavinW

Ted Brasil said:


> Mindfuck is defined as : An image that totally fucks with your mind. When you see it, you will shit bricks. As an example: WOW! That picture was a mindfuck!



Sorry, I don't think the example you cite would ever work as an illustration of sega mentale, as has already been argued by others in this thread (although it works fine as an illustration of mindfuck, of course). So I seriously take issue with urban dictionary's translation. (WR: 1; UD: 0...)


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## Alxmrphi

GavinW said:


> Sorry, I don't think the example you cite would ever work as an illustration of sega mentale, as has already been argued by others in this thread (although it works fine as an illustration of mindfuck, of course). So I seriously take issue with urban dictionary's translation. (WR: 1; UD: 0...)



D'accordo in pieno!
(... sempre da un punto di visto non madrelingua ma sono alquanto certo che abbiamo ragione in questo caso!)


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## Lorena1970

But in the end, has the question been sorted out? It doesn't seem...
"farsi le seghe mentali" doesn't match almost any of the translation provided, in my view. The meaning I have always given to this expression is "_to take deep pleasure by over-thinking about whatever in order to indulge into personal thoughts or artificially and cunningly enhance the value of poor concepts by verbally complicating them"
_
Is there an English expression to expresses that concept? Thank you


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## tsoapm

ricky165 said:


> farsi le seghe mentali quando uno pensa a cose che non li potrebbero mai succedere o quando si preoccupa eccessivamente





Odysseus54 said:


> "Farsi le pippe mentali" means to go around in circles in your head , creating scenarios, anticipating reactions, going through 'what ifs' , in solitary self-comforting fashion, rather than choosing a more productive tack.


For these contexts, perhaps “rumination” might be a relevant term. Unfortunately, the register is completely different...

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo.../201002/rumination-problem-solving-gone-wrong
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...-mechanics-rumination-and-repetitive-thinking


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## ohbice

Lorena1970 said:


> _ artificially and cunningly enhance the value of poor concepts by verbally complicating them_


Questa accezione di seghe mentali non l'avevo mai sentita... E sono d'accordo con Teerex più sopra quando dice che le seghe mentali "classiche" non coinvolgono altri, ma sono autoinflitte.
Ciao
p


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## TimLA

Lorena1970 said:


> But in the end, has the question been sorted out? It doesn't seem...
> "farsi le seghe mentali" doesn't match almost any of the translation provided, in my view. The meaning I have always given to this expression is
> "_to take deep pleasure by over-thinking about whatever in order to indulge into personal thoughts or artificially and cunningly enhance the value of poor concepts by verbally complicating them"_
> Is there an English expression to expresses that concept? Thank you



To me, 'seghe mentali' requires a fairly vulgar register (as mentioned by tsoapm), but perhaps not always.

I've found a variety of translations:
mental masturbation
psych out
psych up
stinkin' thinkin'
mental saws (wow, that one was odd, to say the least!)
neurotic thought process
mental trip

(I like the one's in blue)

Here's a nice, full discussion of seghi mentali in Italian.

I think in a formal context, I'd go with something around the word "neurotic", informally, a variety of phrases, as mentioned above.


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## Lorena1970

ohbice said:


> Questa accezione di seghe mentali non l'avevo mai sentita... E sono d'accordo con Teerex più sopra quando dice che le seghe mentali "classiche" non coinvolgono altri, ma sono autoinflitte.
> Ciao
> p


Hai mai sentito parlare un critico (di cinema, d'arte, di architettura, di design) ? La figura del CRITICO è una tipica figura che basa la sua prosopopea sul "rafforzare", attraverso astuzie verbali, giri di parole, estensione di concetti, allungamento della broda etc. concetti base quali "questo è bello" " questo è brutto" "questo e alto" "questo è basso" etc.etc. che se espressi con un linguaggio naturale, privo di 800 citazioni e alambicchi e di SEGHE MENTALI, sarebbero più comprensibili e immediati. Ma poi si perderebbe il senso del "voi siete ignoranti e non capite" che ai critici tanto piace. Ecco, tra gli addetti ai lavori, questi personaggi sono spesso descritti come "segaioli", ovvero persone che hanno fatto della sega mentale un'arte oratoria.


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## london calling

Quindi questi segaioli traducono le proprio seghe mentali in un linguaggio parlato, Lo.


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## Lorena1970

london calling said:


> Quindi questi segaioli traducono le proprio seghe mentali in un linguaggio parlato, Lo.


Esatto!!!! Sai quanti...???!!!!


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## sorry66

As far as critics go, you can say 'jabbering critics'.
The verb  is 'jabber' and so is the noun.
_Don't listen to the jabber of reviewers.
I don't want to hear critics jabbering on about art._

Also, still on the critic theme, maybe 'getting off on your own ideas' or 'getting off on yourself'?

"hai mai sentito parlare *delle “seghe mentali”? *è un termine volgare ed efficace, per indicare i pensieri non desiderati che vorresti fermare o “spostare”."
I found this on a psychology website. This is more like obsession - 'your thoughts are going round in circles'


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## Lorena1970

sorry66 said:


> 'your thoughts are going round in circles'



Jabbering is something different. This one is good but it's standard English and not as vulgar and idiomatic "seghe mentali" in Italian is.......


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## sorry66

To Lorena?? 'jabbering' is not the same as 'your thoughts going round in circles'!

The following is fairly vulgar:


sorry66 said:


> Also, still on the critic theme, maybe 'getting off on your own ideas' or 'getting off on yourself'?



Sorry, I have three posts above on different aspects of the question. I think you've mixed them up, Lorena.


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## ohbice

Lorena1970 said:


> Hai mai sentito parlare un critico (di cinema, d'arte, di architettura, di design) ? La figura del CRITICO è una tipica figura che basa la sua prosopopea sul "rafforzare", attraverso astuzie verbali, giri di parole, estensione di concetti, allungamento della broda etc. concetti base quali "questo è bello" " questo è brutto" "questo e alto" "questo è basso" etc.etc. che se espressi con un linguaggio naturale, privo di 800 citazioni e alambicchi e di SEGHE MENTALI, sarebbero più comprensibili e immediati. Ma poi si perderebbe il senso del "voi siete ignoranti e non capite" che ai critici tanto piace. Ecco, tra gli addetti ai lavori, questi personaggi sono spesso descritti come "segaioli", ovvero persone che hanno fatto della sega mentale un'arte oratoria.


Sì. be', nel mio piccolo ho anche scritto critica d'arte. E sì, nelle mie righe di critica mettevo anche un po' delle mie seghe mentali... ma ancora vedo una differenza tra il significato "classico" di _farsi le seghe mentali _e questa accezione che tu dici, gonfiare concetti banali per farli sembrare fantastici... ci penso su ancora un po'.


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## sorry66

ohbice said:


> il significato "classico" di _farsi le seghe mentali _



What is the classic definition?

There seem to be two definitions in this thread-

one negative for the person - making a fuss over nothing, getting neurotic, not being able to control your thougths - pippe mentali
the other relatively positive for the person - mental masturbation, getting off on yourself (your ideas) as in Lorena's critics example.


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## Mary49

sorry66 said:


> What is the classic definition?
> one negative for the person - making a fuss over nothing, getting neurotic, not being able to control your thougths - pippe mental*i *


The only classic definition is this one.
You can consider helpful this site  http://nonciclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Sega_mentale    "La *sega mentale*, generalmente indicata al plurale come *seghe mentali* o, più raramente, come *pompe mentali*, *viaggi mentali*, *trip mentali* e nella sua forma più lunga come *film mentali* è l'atto di portare alla completa degenerazione ogni minimo pensiero/concetto/senzazione".
See also here   http://www.psicologianeurolinguistica.net/2012/10/seghe-mentali-8-consigli-per-gestire-la.html    "...è un termine volgare ed efficace, per indicare i pensieri non desiderati che vorresti fermare o “spostare”, and here  http://parliamoitaliano.altervista.org/espressioni-volgari/    "*Farsi le seghe*/*pippe mentali*: preoccuparsi per problemi inutili. Es:_ smettila di farti le seghe mentali, vedrai che andrà tutto bene!"._


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## Pietruzzo

"Le seghe mentali" are always negative. In fact you would never say you're making a "sega mentale"; it's the people around you who tell you that and always with a negative connotation. As far as I'm concerned, the first time I came across this expression was in some "assemlea studentesca" in the seventies. There was a guy who'd been talking for half an hour about capitalism, multinationals and the like, then another dude said angrily "Compagni, non facciamoci le seghe mentali"


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## sorry66

I understand that it's a criticism and, therefore, negative.
But if it's 
"i pensieri non desiderati che vorresti fermare o “spostare”'  then the person who is being criticised has been experiencing something negative
And if it's
"gonfiare concetti banali per farli sembrare fantastici..." than the person who is being criticised has been experiencing something positive  before he gets reprimanded (like the guy in your example)

So, in English, you would have to translate the two meanings differently.


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## ohbice

Ciao Sorry. Mi sto facendo delle seghe mentali = I am building a useless castle in my mind. All I have to do is cancel this shit (doubts, hipotesis, fears, paranoids, eccetera). This is the *significato classico*.
Lorena thinks that seghe mentali is also related to "_artificially and cunningly enhance the value of poor concepts by verbally complicating them"_ (in my translation: _"gonfiare concetti banali per farli sembrare fantastici..."). _I have some doubts about this "non classical" meaning.
Ciao
p


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## sorry66

@ohbice Thanks!


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## tragedia

london calling said:


> Why don't you believe it? The expression's been around for many, many years!



I don't know about Britain (it's gotta exist there...), but, in North America, we often use—at least in 2017! (this thread is a little old at this point, I see)—a version that is explicitly vulgar and can never be used in polite situations. I'd say, nowadays, *!!!* "mind f*ck" *!!!* , as a noun, would be a good translation.


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## johngiovanni

It sounds like a useless mental  jerk-off.


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## bibiga

Per dovere di cronaca, a Roma si usa più "pippe mentali"


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## london calling

tragedia said:


> I don't know about Britain (it's gotta exist there...), but, in North America, we often use—at least in 2017! (this thread is a little old at this point, I see)—a version that is explicitly vulgar and can never be used in polite situations. I'd say, nowadays, *!!!* "mind f*ck" *!!!* , as a noun, would be a good translation.


It does exist in the UK, that's why I suggested it, but as does your modern version which is, however, far  more vulgar .


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## PureNRG

tragedia said:


> I don't know about Britain (it's gotta exist there...), but, in North America, we often use—at least in 2017! (this thread is a little old at this point, I see)—a version that is explicitly vulgar and can never be used in polite situations. I'd say, nowadays, *!!!* "mind f*ck" *!!!* , as a noun, would be a good translation.


Mindfuck isn't really the same thing. As stated before sega/pippa mentale actually means what Paulfromitaly explained very well. Mindfuck is something that fucks with you mind so much that it changes your prospective.



Ted Brasil said:


> Hi,
> 
> urban dictionary in my view is right suggesting mindfuck as the equivalent of 'sega mentale'. Mindfuck is defined as : An image that totally fucks with your mind. When you see it, you will shit bricks. As an example: WOW! That picture was a mindfuck!


But that's not what sega/pippa mentale means. It is something that someone who mulls over things too much, questioning it over and over, etc... does.


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## london calling

PureNRG said:


> Mindfuck isn't really the same thing. As stated before sega/pippa mentale actually means what Paulfromitaly explained very well. Mindfuck is something that fucks with you mind so much that it changes your prospective.
> 
> 
> But that's not what sega/pippa mentale means. It is something that someone who mulls over things too much, questioning it over and over, etc... does.


Exactly. It's mental masturbation.


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## Włoskipolak 72

Buongiorno 

Se io dico '' farsi film mentali '' ? Ha qualcosa in comune con '' farsi le pippe '' ?

Poi ho trovato questa descrizione che mi aiuta a capire meglio il concetto !   


Cosa sono le pippe mentali?

Non sono altro che la riproduzione automatica di pensieri portatori di una qualche tensione , cioè di sofferenza, generata da uno stato di paura nei confronti di qualcosa che il nostro cervello ritiene pericoloso per la nostra incolumità, il più delle volte non reale ma simbolica. Inoltre è un pensiero che non porta a nulla.
Quindi se vuoi smettere di soffrire e goderti la vita devi smettere di farti le* pippe mentali.*


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## curiosone

A non-vulgar way of saying 'mental masturbation' might be 'circular thinking' or (more frequently used) "circular thoughts.'

But I'd still translate 'seghe mentali' as 'mental masturbation,' because it conveys the exact same meaning (in the same way). 
Nowadays I've heard it heard it used (quite normally) at Life Coaching seminars, when speaking of 'mental patterns' (scheme mentali).

By the way, wanker' and 'wank' are British English - not used in North American English (at least not down my way).


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## theartichoke

This thread has been puzzling me, because only posts #41 and #45 (by a now-banned user) bear any relation to what I'd use the term "mental masturbation" for. To me, the term mental _masturbation_ implies -- by definition -- that the activity is pleasurable. So mulling things over, overthinking things, obsessive worrying, and the like, insofar as one gets no enjoyment from doing so, are not mental masturbation. The definition that pops up in various online places when I search on the term, namely "engaging in intellectually stimulating conversation with little or no practical purpose," seems correct to me. Of course, it doesn't have to be "conversation": a philosopher who spends hours ruminating and writing papers about some trivial point of logic could also be said to be engaging in "mental masturbation." But the point is that the philosopher finds these thoughts interesting and stimulating; if you think obsessively about something because you're anxious or indecisive, it's not "mental masturbation."

Based on this thread, though, it seems that I and the banned user of 41 and 45 are in the minority. I'd be unsurprised if _le seghe / pippe mentali _in Italian and _mental masturbation_ in English meant different things _from each other_, but the way this discussion has broken down so far is just odd.


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## Paulfromitaly

theartichoke said:


> overthinking things..obsessive worrying


This is what it means to me.


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## A User

theartichoke said:


> To me, the term mental _masturbation_ implies -- by definition -- that the activity is pleasurable. So mulling things over, overthinking things, obsessive worrying, and the like, insofar as one gets no enjoyment from doing so, are not mental masturbation.


No, il fatto di essere piacevole piacevole non c’entra nulla.
L’errore è proprio quello di saltare subito alla conclusione del significato derivato di sega, cioè di masturbazione.
Il punto di partenza non è il significato figurato di sega, ma  quello primario: Utensile destinato a tagliare legname, ecc., costituito da una lama di acciaio che viene fatta scorrere sull’oggetto da tagliare con moto di va e vieni con opportuna pressione.
Sega mentale è l’andirivieni (movimento di andare e venire) mentale ricorsivo, ossessivo - e a giudicare dall'esterno poco proficuo - di una persona coinvolta in una problematica o che si fa coinvolgere mentalmente in una problematica. 
La masturbazione riproduce la stessa dinamica del movimento, ed è solo lo step successivo.
"Masturbazione cerebrale" trova riscontro anche in italiano e non ha un uso popolare, ma intellettuale. 
Cito Pierangelo Bertoli nella canzone "A muso duro"(1979):
 «...E le masturbazioni cerebrali / Le lascio a chi è maturo al punto giusto / Le mie canzoni voglio raccontarle a chi sa masturbarsi per il gusto...».
Se ne deduce che non c'è gusto nelle masturbazioni cerebrali.


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## tsoapm

A User said:


> Il punto di partenza non è il significato figurato di sega, ma  quello primario: Utensile destinato a tagliare legname, ecc., costituito da una lama di acciaio che viene fatta scorrere sull’oggetto da tagliare con moto di va e vieni con opportuna pressione.
> Sega mentale è l’andirivieni (movimento di andare e venire)


Vale anche quando si dice ‘pippa’ invece?

I think the idea of it being a solitary, self-involved activity probably has a lot to do with it (I know that it isn't necessarily solitary).


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## ohbice

Io credo che la sega utensile non c'entri un fico secco. Pippa mentale, sega mentale, masturbazione cerebrale e via elencando derivano in quanto a nome dall'atto di masturbarsi. Quanto al significato, perlomeno per come uso io l'espressione, non hanno il significato allegro-positivo-soddisfacente del masturbarsi, bensì hanno una connotazione tristanzuola e/o problematica (forse perché, se proprio devo azzardare un'ipotesi, c'è un'ampia fetta di popolazione che ritiene la masturbazione un triste/povero ripiego rispetto a una bella  scopata).


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## Paulfromitaly

ohbice said:


> Io credo che la sega utensile non c'entri un fico secco.


Esattamente, e il fatto che si usi la stessa epressione con "pippe" lo dimostra.


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## london calling

theartichoke said:


> Based on this thread, though, it seems that I and the banned user of 41 and 45 are in the minority.


You really are in a minority. 🙂 In both Italian (seghe /pippe) and in English no pleasure is implied. It means to overthink and is definitely a criticism of whoever is engaging in the said activity. 🤣


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## A User

tsoapm said:


> Vale anche quando si dice ‘pippa’ invece?
> 
> I think the idea of it being a solitary, self-involved activity probably has a lot to do with it (I know that it isn't necessarily solitary)


Hai centrato il punto, le seghe – mentali e non - si possono fare da soli o in compagnia, e sono due casi diversi.

Possiamo dare a “farsi le seghe mentali” il significato particolare - secondo caso - di elucubrazione o riflessione elaborata piacevole solo per chi la fa e poi la comunica, ma non per colui/colei che ascolta, rimanendone totalmente indifferente.
Il parallelo con l’attività sessuale in questione ci sta tutto in questo caso, perché dobbiamo presumere  non ad una attività sessuale solitaria, ma perlomeno di coppia, nella quale però è solo una delle parti quella che gode.
È evidente che, in questa situazione, il significato di ragionamento ossessivo non sia presente e non ci sia nessun riferimento ad una azione ripetitiva e quindi all'utensile.

Il “pippone” è un discorso lungo, pesante e noioso, pronunciato da una persona solitamente in maniera unidirezionale, e anche qui la ripetitività è esclusa. Ma se dal pippone/discorso torniamo al pippone manuale la ripetitività ritorna, e nel pippare ci puoi vedere tanto la cannuccia (la pipa) quanto l'azione ripetuta di aspirare dalla pipa, che prende il posto dell'utensile sega.


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## theartichoke

london calling said:


> You really are in a minority. 🙂 In both Italian (seghe /pippe) and in English no pleasure is implied. It means to overthink and is definitely a criticism of whoever is engaging in the said activity. 🤣



I completely agree that it's always a criticism (nobody would describe their own pleasurable intellectual pursuits as "mental masturbation"), but the web seems to agree with my definition, which is partly why I'm puzzled that nobody here seems to. The guy in the first link even looked into the history of the phrase:
Mental Masturbation
Mental Masturbation


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## Odysseus54

I think here 'sega' simply indicates a futile, unproductive exercise.   Waste of time etc.

The expression 'farsi le seghe mentali' in essence just means 'overthinking something', said in a coarser and more dismissive way.


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## Passante

nonnoparmiro said:


> LOL
> It's actually complicated to explain.. let's say it's a juvenile slang form, but i wouldn't call it vulgar.
> In Engish it litterally means "mental wank" and it refers to the act of mulling over a bad thought for too long, or being too concerned for something trivial. Basically thinking too much


Com'è fai a dire che non è volgare?
Italiano aulico direi stai solo facendo voli pindarici. 
In italiano formale ti stai facendo troppi problemi. 
In italiano informale persone che non conosci ti stai facendo troppi viaggi. 
In italiano informale persone che conosci molto bene non farti troppe seghe.


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## Mary49

Passante said:


> Italiano aulico direi stai solo facendo voli pindarici.


I voli pindarici sono tutt'altra cosa.
pindàrico in Vocabolario - Treccani
"con riferimento ai rapidi trapassi logici con cui Pindaro introduce nelle sue odi episodî del mito, la locuz. _volo p_., usata per indicare, in un qualsiasi discorso scritto o parlato, un passaggio rapido, senza espressa connessione logica, da un argomento a un altro, o un’ardita digressione dall’argomento principale".


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## Passante

Appunto! rileggi cosa hai scritto, farsi le seghe mentali è appunto pensare ad altro rispetto  a quello che dovresti pensare.


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## Mary49

Io leggo sempre quello che scrivo e posto e ribadisco: sono due cose diverse.
Forse non hai riletto tutto il thread e magari anche qualche ricerca in rete non farebbe male.


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## Włoskipolak 72

Buongiorno

Se io dico '' farsi film mentali '' ? Ha qualcosa in comune con l'espressione '' farsi le pippe '' ?
Grazie


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## Paulfromitaly

> *NOTA:*
> 
> Ricordo che lo scopo del thread è SOLO spiegare e tradurre in inglese l'espressione "farsi le seghe mentali".


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## Passante

Volo | Dizionario dei modi di dire - Corriere.it
....Si usa con senso spregiativo per discorsi sconclusionati, o ironico per l'esposizione di progetti, teorie, speranze o altro che appaiono utopistici, illusori, eccessivamente ambiziosi e via dicendo....

È vero che una Sega può essere una martellante ossessione ripetitiva, ma più banalmente è un viaggio cerebrale che si compie con nessuna attinenza con l'oggetto del contendere, non a caso si assimila anche con il modo di dire non farti dei viaggi. 
Ma evidentemente anche i miei sono voli non alla portata di tutti. 

In generale la rete non è la panacea di tutti i dubbi del mondo. Personalmente consiglierei sempre lo studio dei libri.



Włoskipolak 72 said:


> Buongiorno
> 
> Se io dico '' farsi film mentali '' ? Ha qualcosa in comune con l'espressione '' farsi le pippe '' ?
> Grazie


Per me è simile ma non per forza uguale. 
Com'è sempre dipende dal contesto.


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## ohbice

Farsi film mentali per come lo intendo io è fantasticare, immaginare una situazione lontana dal vero. Farsi seghe mentali è perdere tempo su una piccola ossessione continuando a rigirarsela in testa. 
Concordo che il contesto è sempre importante, ma nel caso di una espressione come "farsi le seghe mentali" penso che il contesto possa servire più che altro a "stirare" il significato dell'espressione (che è più o meno fisso) in varie direzioni non proprio ortodosse...


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## Mary49

In his post #81 Paul is right.
So I have a question for our English and American friends: can "farsi seghe mentali" be translated (in literary / refined / elegant English) as "brusque digression" / "long digression" / "fancy flight" (these are the translation for "volo pindarico")?

PS Books are my bread and butter...


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## Passante

Mary49 said:


> In his post #81 Paul is right.
> So I have a question for our English and American friends: can "farsi seghe mentali" be translated (in literary / refined / elegant English) as "brusque digression" / "long digression" / "fancy flight" (these are the translation for "volo pindarico")?
> 
> PS Books are my bread and butter...


Have no fear, if you've had enough Passante _Pindaric flights (delle seghe mentali di Passante) _all you have to do is 'don't read her'.  GG


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## guyfromleeds

Non credo che ci sia un’espressione simile in inglese usando delle parolacce ma ci sono modi di dire la stessa cosa:

Stop worrying over nothing!
Stop overthinking things!


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## rrose17

I agree with gfl and arti in post #66. I’ve never heard the term mental masturbation, which seems to be a BE thing. Mental gymnastics/acrobatics  comes to mind, essentially useless overthinking.


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## london calling

guyfromleeds said:


> Non credo che ci sia un’espressione simile in inglese usando delle parolacce ma ci sono modi di dire la stessa cosa:
> 
> Stop worrying over nothing!
> Stop overthinking things!


You don't have mental masturbation in Leeds? Lucky you. 😂


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