# Should, Must and so on



## Polastudent

Hi:
 
I need your help. What is the correct order for adverbs in a sentences with modals or conditionals verbs?
 
For examples:
 
§ We should never forget we work for him/her.
§ We always must have an open mind
*§ *We must listen to them kindly.
 
What is the correct position for never, always and kindly?
 
 
 
*Regards*

* *
*Pola *


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## Misao

Polastudent said:
			
		

> Hi:
> 
> I need your help. What is the correct order for adverbs in a sentences with modals or conditionals verbs?
> 
> For examples:
> 
> § We should never forget we work for him/her.
> § We always must have an open mind
> EDIT: We must have always an open mind  (forgot the correction... )
> -- If you write "We must have always..." then you need end your sentence in passive, because you are placing the adverb as in  passive sentences: "we must have always applied for..."
> 
> *§ *We must listen to them kindly.
> 
> What is the correct position for never, always and kindly?
> 
> 
> 
> *Regards*
> 
> 
> *Pola *


 
Hi Pola. In English the adverbs of time (never, always, usually...) are always after the modal verb. When the main verb is not a modal verb, then they are place before them

- I always forget to call him!
- I never study at night

When you use compund tenses (past perfect, etc) then they are placed after the auxliliary verb:

- I've always said that the best season is summer
- I've never heard such a nonsense!
- I am always looking for the tricky part of things..

Or in passive voice:

- I was never treated so unpolite!
- She was always praised by the press.

The rest, I think, can be placed at end, after the verb....

Hope this helps


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## Sidd

Awesome answer Misao


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## Polastudent

Misao :

Thanks a lot. It was a great help. Your explanation is in depth. Even, I will print now. 

Thanks again for you and Sidd.

My best wishes

Pola


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## Misao

You are welcome, Pola! It is easy...just think about what is the best place to place them, where they sound better... 

Sidd, thanks for your comment...


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## Polastudent

Misao:

Ok. I will do it. Thanks for your advice. You are an intelligent and a kind person.

Regards

Pola


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## Walterronnny

what differences there are between  :

For Example with For instance? when can i to use each word, where?


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## Misao

Walter, son intercambiables. Puedes usarlas indistintamente. 

Tienes algunos fallos: con los verbos modales (can/must/should/might/may/ought to) no se pone "to" detrás:

- When can I use each word?

Y en las preguntas: What ARE the differences between "for example" AND "for instance"? el verbo suele ir en segunda posición cuando hacer preguntas con palabras "wh-" (what/how/where, etc)

Y recuerda abrir un nuevo Thread cada vez ke tengas una pregunta, así será más fácil que obtengas las respuestas más rápido. 

Cheers! 

Oh!. You are welcome Pola!


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## Walterronnny

ah ok , podrias decirme el significado de los veros modales que pusistes? es para salir de mis dudas que tengo con esos verbos.

Sobre mi anterior fallo, intentaba decir : Cuando puedo "usar" (to do) each word, por eso es que tuve ese error, que espero la proxima vez no salga ya .

Gracias
Walter.


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## Misao

Walterronnny said:
			
		

> ah ok , podrias decirme el significado de los veros modales que pusistes? es para salir de mis dudas que tengo con esos verbos.
> 
> Sobre mi anterior fallo, intentaba decir : Cuando puedo "usar" (to do) each word, por eso es que tuve ese error, que espero la proxima vez no salga ya .
> 
> Gracias
> Walter.


 
"To do" significa "hacer", walter 

VERBOS MODALES:

can/be able to = poder (CAN solo se utiliza en presente y en pasado -could- para el resto de tiempos se utiliza BE ABLE TO  - will be able to / have been able to / had been able to)

MUST / MUSTNT / HAVE TO = DEBER / TENER QUE. Son de obligación. Must tiene un nivel más alto de obligación que HAVE TO.

SHOULD / OUGHT TO = DEBER. En el sentido de consejos:

Deberías ir al médico --- You should / ought to go to the doctor.

MIGHT/MAY = PUEDE QUE. Tienen el sentido de probabilidad. 

- He may be right -- Puede que tenga razón
* Maybe: quizá 

NEED = NECESITAR. Creo que sobran explicaciones  Bueno, como modal, puede formar la negación así: needn't, pero se usa más "don't need"


SHALL: Semimodal que se usa en las preguntas de ofrecimiento:

- Shall I help you? ---¿Te ayudo?

También se puede decir "Will I help you?", esto es, con la forma del futuro.


Bueno, creo que no me dejo ninguno. Esto, claro, es una explicación muy básica de los verbos modales. Sería mejor que te hicieras con alguna gramática inglesa. 

ciaoo!


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## Walterronnny

cada vez me quedo mas impresionado, mil gracias por la completa explicacion, sobre lo anterior que dije to do, quise decir to use..

gracias nuevamente, en unos minutos ire ya a dormir, mañana leere otra vez estos threads para asi ya no olvidarme jamas.

Mil gracias!

Walter.


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## Misao

Good nite, Walter!


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## Walterronnny

Misao said:
			
		

> Good nite, Walter!



Buenas noches amigo, espero mañana poder encontrarnos otra vez por aqui, y poder aprender de todos ustedes..

Muchas gracias y espero no resultar molesto con tantas preguntas.


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## Polastudent

Walter,

Misao is a girl like me, so you must say "Buenas noches amiga"

Regards 

Pola


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## Stu Pedazo

*Hola Pola:*

No creo que yo sea la más indicada para contestar preguntas sobre gramática, pero intentaré ayudarte.  

En una frase se coloca _el adverbio de frecuencia_ (en este caso es la palabra "_never_") delante del verbo principal o entre el verbo principal y el verbo auxiliar. 

*1. We should never forget we work for him/her. (entre el verbo principal y el auxiliar)*
*2. We never forget we work for him/her. (delante del verbo principal)*

*1. We always have an open mind. (delante del verbo principal)*
*2. We must always have an open mind. (entre el verbo principal y el auxiliar)*

"Kindly" es un _adverbio de modo_. Normalmente los adverbios de modo van detrás del verbo principal o detrás del objeto.

*1. We listen kindly to them. (detrás del verbo principal)* 

Si hay una preposición delante del objeto, (towards, to, etc.) se puede colocar el adverbio delante de la preposición o detrás del objeto. 

*2. We must listen to them kindly. (detrás del objeto)*
*3. We must listen kindly to them. (delante de la preposición)*

 No se debe colocar un adverbio de modo entre el verbo y el objeto. Ejemplo:

*We listen kindly the speech. (entre el verbo y el objeto)*  

Espero que te sirva.


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## Sidd

Los dobles post son muy desagradables, faltan al respeto de los que pretendemos ayudar.

Has hecho que Stu Pedazo pierda tiempo contestando algo que ya te habían contestado.

Espero que algún moderador lo borre.


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## Walterronnny

Polastudent said:
			
		

> Walter,
> 
> Misao is a girl like me, so you must say "Buenas noches amiga"
> 
> Regards
> 
> Pola



i did believe that be a boy but ok.  (Corregirme que seguro he escrito mal)


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## Polastudent

Sidd:

Ignoraba que no se podía republicar si no era contestado tu primera publicación.

LA respuesta de Stu ha sido muy útil, ya que contiene aspectos que las otras no tenían.

Lamento tu violencia en el tono de tus palabras y más aún tus deseos negativos hacia mí. Revela tu poca tolerancia y falta de respeto con los demás.

Pola

Pola


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## Sidd

Polastudent, 
1) Tu primer post fue contestado en 3 minutos. 
2) Tu segundo post fue publicado tras 30 minutos. 
3) El contenido era exactamente el mismo.
4) Stu te podría haber contestado en el primer post, tal y como está ahora gracias a que un moderador se tomo el tiempo. Que no se te olvide que Stu se tomó tanto tiempo porque no sabía de los otros mensajes. Cuando él escribió su respuesta era la primera contestación a tu segundo post (el que se produjo media hora más tarde)
5) Ni te has disculpado, ni has agradecido el tiempo del moderador.
6) No creo que mi post fuera "violento" ni en la forma ni en el contenido.


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## Misao

Sidd...no me estoy enterando de nada. ¿Qué doble post? Yo contesté la primera a Pola. El que produjo un doble post aquí fue Walter...

Me he perdido....Y creo que también usaste un tono poco "polite" con Pola.


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## Walterronnny

Bueno, creo yo que lo mejor seria dejar de discutir, que al fin y al cabo no se llegue a ninguna parte, no creen?


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## Stu Pedazo

Hola:

Lamento tener que recurrir al inglés, pero no tengo un nivel avanzado de español y no quiero arriesgarme a que se malinterpreten este post. I neither want nor intend to participate in an argument. I would just like to point out that this thread ("_Hi:I need your help. What is the correct order for adverbs in a sentences with modals or conditionals verbs?..._) was double-posted and that later both threads were merged to form this one. I responded to one of the threads without knowing that the question had already been answered elsewhere, and to be forthright, I probably wouldn't have answered had I known. (By the way, excellent explanation, Misao!  ) Nonetheless, I think it was a simple oversight on Pola's part and I am glad that some of the information included in my previous post proved useful to her. 
PD: Gracias Sidd, for your concern and sensitivity in this matter.


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## Soy Yo

Para cambiar énfasis (exclamar) puedes decir:

Never have I done such a thing!
Never have I heard such nonsense!


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## Soy Yo

Misao said:
			
		

> Hi Pola. In English the adverbs of time (never, always, usually...) are always after the modal verb. When the main verb is not a modal verb, then they are place*d* before them
> 
> - I always forget to call him!
> - I never study at night
> 
> When you use compund tenses (past perfect, etc) then they are placed after the auxliliary verb:
> 
> - I've always said that the best season is summer
> - I've never heard such a nonsense! *I never heard such nonsense. (Nonsense is uncountable.)*
> - I am always looking for the tricky part of things..
> 
> Or in passive voice:
> 
> - I was never treated so unpolite*ly*!
> - She was always praised by the press.
> 
> The rest, I think, can be placed at end, after the verb....
> 
> Hope this helps


 
Muy interesante...

Perhaps "best form" can be said to follow your rule for placing the adverb of time after the modal, but it does often come before the modal at least in US spoken English. I believe it sounds more emphatic when you move it from after the modal to before it.

I never have been treated so badly. (I never HAVE been treated so badly.)
She never has treated me well.
He always has given his best.

Anyone else feel this way about the placement of the adverb????


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## Misao

Soy Yo said:
			
		

> Muy interesante...
> 
> Perhaps "best form" can be said to follow your rule for placing the adverb of time after the modal, but it does often come before the modal at least in US spoken English. I believe it sounds more emphatic when you move it from after the modal to before to before it.
> 
> I never have been treated so badly. (I never HAVE been treated so badly.)
> She never has treated me well.
> He always has given his best.
> 
> Anyone else feel this way about the placement of the adverb????


 
You are actually the native...I only explained the way I was always told by all my English teachers... 

*the ones in red are all adverbs...are they well placed?


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## Polastudent

Misao and Soy yo:

Thanks a lot.

Pola


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## Soy Yo

Misao said:
			
		

> You are actually the native...I only explained the way I was always told by all my English teachers...
> 
> *the ones in red are all adverbs...are they well placed?


 
Yes, your adverbs are very well placed.  Could they be placed anywhere else? Let me think.


You are actually the native.  (sounds ok)
Actually, you are the native. (i probably would have said this ) 
You are the native, actualy
You actually are the native.  (a different emphasis with a different intonation)

...the way I was always told (this is the only way I would say this one (I think )
...the way I always was told (a little awkward but not terrible) 

Often non-native speakers have good insights because of rules used in teaching English as a second language...rules like this that I don't think a native speaker is "taught".


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## Misao

Soy Yo said:
			
		

> Often non-native speakers have good insights because of rules used in teaching English as a second language...rules like this that I don't think a native speaker is "taught".


 
I think so too. I am teaching Spanish to an English boy and I compare both languages the whole time, for example, in verbal tenses or in structures that are build the same in both languages, using the vocabulary I was once told...(present perfect, second conditional, etc) and most of the times he doesn't know what I am talking about..And that makes me wonder if you are "taught" English grammar at school. In Spain it is compulsory till you end up in High School. And one of the exams to go to Univesity is about Spanish Language (grammar and Literature)...Is it so in England or in the States?. 
I mean, I know why I use a determined preposition, why I use this LO or La or what are the functions of SE in every moment...(in Spanish, of course)


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