# Flat, deep, shallow



## ThomasK

How do you translate these three (and others in-between)? Do they have connotations?

Dutch: *plat, diep, ondiep* (un-deep...)
Connotations:
- *plat*: ordinary, plain, even gross (_slecht/ bad_ for example used to mean flat)
- *diep*: intense, profound
- *ondiep*: we can refer to 'oppervlakkig' to express "superficial", without depth...


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## Messquito

In Chinese: 平 深 淺
Connotations:
平：smooth(平順), peaceful(和平), dull(平淡), monotonous(平板)
深：intimate(感情很深), profound(深刻), dark-colored(深色)
淺：light-colored(淺色), shallow (knowledge), superficial(膚淺)


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## Mori.cze

In Czech we have
*hluboký *for deep. It can be used literally and figuratively similar as in English: _deep abyss_, _deep eyes_, _deep meditation_, _deep truth_...
*mělký *for shallow. It is not really idiomatic to use figuratively, we have _shallow water_, _shallow plates_ (for solid food to distinguish from _deep plates_ for liquids), but if I met a _shallow character_, I'd suspect it's an English influence. In the figurative sense we use *povrchní*, surface-ish (person, knowledge etc.).
*plochý *for flat. This is often used figuratively in a sense of lack of depth, so a badly written novel has a _flat plot _or life-unlike _flat characters_.
Also, we have rather colloquial *placatý* (probably a loanword from German) for pancake-like shape, with no figurative use whatsoever.


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## 810senior

Messquito said:


> In Chinese: 平 深 淺
> Connotations:
> 平：smooth(平順), peaceful(和平), dull(平淡), monotonous(平板)
> 深：intimate(感情很深), profound(深刻)
> 淺：light-colored(淺色), shallow (knowledge), superficial(膚淺)


The same as Japanese.

Flat:　平らtaira (only means that there's no difference in the horizontal level)
Deep: 深いfuka-i : (intimate, dark-colored, dense, intense figuratively)
Shallow: 浅いasa-i (as almost the same as Chinese, light-colored and keeping shallow knowledge)


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## Medune

In Portuguese:
Chato/plano: both mean horizontally levelled, but chato can also indicate someone or something dull or annoying.
Profundo: both physically and psychologically deep.
Raso/superficial: both physically and psychologically shallow.


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## ger4

German:

_*flach*_: 'flat, shallow' (usually not distinguished in German)
_eine flache Landschaft_: 'a flat landscape'
_flaches Wasser_: 'shallow water'
_*oberflächlich*_: 'superficial' < _Oberfläche_ 'surface' (_Ober_ 'upper' + _Fläche_ 'plain, surface, level')
_*seicht*_: 'shallow' (more typical for poetic speech or figurative expressions)
_seichtes Wasser_: 'shallow water' (more poetic than _flaches Wasser_)
_ein seichter Film_: 'a superficial film'
_*Untiefe*_ (noun: _un-_ 'un-' + _Tiefe '_depth'): 'shallow water' (hardly ever used as an adjective)
_*tief*_: 'deep', both literally and figuratively ('intense, profound')
_tiefsinnig_: 'profound' (_-sinnig _< _Sinn_ 'sense')

Edit
_*platt*_ is another word for 'flat', often used informally (especially in northern Germany). It can't be translated as 'shallow' (_plattes Wasser_ would be impossible)
_auf dem platten Land_: in the countryside
_Plattdeutsch_: Low German, literally 'flat German'


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## apmoy70

Greek:

Flat:
MoGr adj. *«επίπεδος, -δη, δο»* [eˈpipeðos] (masc.), [eˈpipeði] (fem.), [eˈpipeðo] (neut.) < Classical adj. *«ἐπίπεδος, -ος, -ον»  ĕpípĕdŏs* (masc & fem), *ĕpípĕdŏn* (neut.) < compound; Classical prefix and preposition *«ἐπί» ĕpí* --> _on, at, by, at the same time, because_ (PIE *h₁epi- _on_ cf Skt. अपि (ápi), _also, too_, Av aipi, _also_, Arm. եվ (yev), _and_) + Classical neut. noun *«πέδον» pédŏn* --> _soil, earth, ground_ (PIE *ped- _foot_ cf Skt. पाद (pāda), _footstep_, Hitt. peda- _place_). Connotation: perhaps in relation to the sound e.g. when there's bad acoustics in a room, hall, or concert, the sound is «επίπεδος». To describe similar concepts as in English we prefer the adj. *«επιφανειακός»* [epifani.aˈkos] from *«επιφάνεια»* [epiˈfani.a] (fem.) --> _surface_.

Deep:
MoGr adj. *«βαθύς, -θεία/-θιά, -θύ»* [vaˈθis] (masc.), [vaˈθi.a] & colloq. [vaˈθ͡ça] (fem.), [vaˈθi] (neut.) < Classical adj. *«βαθύς, -θεῖᾰ, -θύ» bătʰús* (masc.), *bătʰeîă* (fem.), *bătʰú* (neut.), with obscure etymology, possibly with IE origin. Connotation: It can be used exactly as in English.

Shallow:
(A) MoGr adj. *«αβαθής, -θής, -θές»* [avaˈθis] (masc & fem), [avaˈθes] (neut.) < compound; Classical privative prefix *«ἀ-» a-* (PIE *n-/*n̥- (in Gr. we have the vocalisation of the nasal) cf Skt. अ- (a-), Lat. in-, Proto-Germanic *un-) + Classical neut. noun *«βάθος» bắtʰŏs* --> _depth_ (cognate with «βαθύς»). Connotation: Not used at all either literally or figurately, except for the shallow sea which is decribed by the neut. adj. in plural: *«αβαθή»* [avaˈθi] (neut. nom. pl.) --> _shallow waters/seas_.

(Β) MoGr adj. *«ρηχός, -χή, -χό»* [ɾiˈxos] (masc.), [ɾiˈçi] (fem.), [ɾiˈxo] (neut.) < Classical adj. *«ῥᾱχός, -χή, -χόν» rʰākʰós* (masc.), *rʰākʰḗ* (fem.), *rʰākʰón* (neut.), Ionic var. *«ῥηχός» rʰēkʰós* --> _thorn-hedged, palisaded, wattled_; the semantic shift happened quite early, which is logical if you think about it: diving into shallow seas can result into touching the underwater bushes, or the bottom of the ocean (with obscure etymology). Connotation: It can be used exactly as in English.

(A) is learned, (B) is vernacular.


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## Dymn

*Catalan:*

flat: _pla_
deep: _profund_
shallow: _superficial
_
*Spanish:
*
flat: _llano_
deep: _profundo_
shallow: _superficial_

Connotations:
- flat: normal, ordinary, simple (_poble pla / pueblo llano_ "flat people": lower and medium classes as opposed to upper classes), with little development ("flat character")
- deep: intense, inner and pent-up (feelings), comprehensive ("deep knowledge")
- shallow: basic ("shallow knowledge"), someone who only cares about money and outer beauty instead of actual happiness and inner beauty (pejorative)


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## rusita preciosa

Russian:
Flat: *плоский* /ploskiy/ (figurative meaning: stupid, not funny - only said about jokes/humor)
Deep: *глубокий* /glubokiy/ (has the same figurative meaning as in English: profound, intense)
Shallow: *мелкий* /melkiy/ (figurative meaning: petty, nitpicky)


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## Armas

In Finnish we have many adjectives meaning flat (things (_litteä_), area of land (_laakea_), something squeezed/deformed flat (_littana_)), the only one with a figurative meaning too is _lattea_, which also means vapid, insipid, cliched, banal.

deep_ = syvä_ = profound (meaning etc.), intense (color)

We have no word for shallow, we use_ matala_ the primary meaning of which is "low"._ Matala rakennus_ "low building"_, matala vesi _"shallow water".


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## Gavril

Diamant7 said:


> *Spanish:
> *
> flat: _llano_
> deep: _profundo_
> shallow: _superficial_



A long time ago, I learned _somero_ as a translation of "shallow" in Spanish, but it doesn't seem to be the most common way of expressing this meaning. According to the WR dictionary, _somero_ can refer to things that are located at a shallow level (_rocas someras _"shallow rocks") -- can it also be used for a shallow body of water, shallow soil, etc.?


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## Dymn

Maybe it's because I'm no native Spanish speaker, but I admit I've never heard this word before. The RAE gives as a definition: "which is almost above or very immediate to the surface", which makes me think you can't say _mar somero _for example.


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## ThomasK

I think I can say the general meanings of _shallow_ (and of the other words) are similar - except for the Russian word...

@holger: I did not know about _seicht_. I cannot see a link with Dutch, dwds.de does not give conclusive evidence about the origin...
@Apmoy: _ρηχός_ has an interesting etymology...


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## ger4

ThomasK said:


> I did not know about _seicht_. I cannot see a link with Dutch, dwds.de does not give conclusive evidence about the origin...


I haven't found anything on dwds either but according to this source it is derived from a Proto-Germanic stem _*sinxtia_ ('shallow') which seems to be related to a transitive verb meaning 'to dry out (a body of water)' derived from a PIE stem *_sek _(the Latvian adjective _sekls_ is a cognate and has the same meaning, 'shallow').


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## igusarov

ThomasK said:


> How do you translate these three (and *others in-between*)?


But what do you mean by "others in between"? Are you looking for depth-related words used to denote a degree of intensity (like normal, high, low), with more words for intermediate values?


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## Karton Realista

Polish: 
Deep - *głęboki* (the same figurative connotations as English one) 
*Płaski* - flat (płaska deska - flat plank, an unflattering description of women's clevage) 
*Płytki* - shallow (also superficial, without depth).


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## ThomasK

@holger: I cannot seem to find a link with Dutch, it reminds me of the French _sec_, rather.

@igusarov: I meant other words relating to depth - but I am Always interested in metaphorical connotations or uses of those words.


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## igusarov

ThomasK said:


> I meant other words relating to depth - ...


Oh, so the word "flat" is perceived as a reference to zero depth? I would say that in Russian it is perceived as "planar", i.e. the primary mental image is "no bumps no dips, not crumpled". So that this word looks odd in a row of deep-shallow words.


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## ThomasK

You're right, you're right! The main meaning of 'flat' is as you say. I associated "shallow" and "flat" with one another due to associations in my own language, where "plat" (outright, gross) and "oppervlakkig" (superficial) are similar though not synonymous. Yet, I think flatness does imply the absence of any kind of depth as well (and of heights ["elevations"???], you are right)...

Should anyone have feelings, intuitions, ..., with regard to that link (or the lack of links), please tell us!


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## mataripis

Tagalog has lapad for flat sometimes patag or pantay. Mababaw for shallow and malalim for deep but in rough roads and undulated land, uneven surface is lubak or lubog.


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## ilocas2

> Russian:
> Flat: *плоский* /ploskiy/ (figurative meaning: stupid, not funny - only said about jokes/humor)





> Polish:
> *Płaski* - flat (płaska deska - flat plank, an unflattering description of women's clevage)
> *Płytki* - shallow (also superficial, without depth).



In Czech there is also *ploský* and *plytký*


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## igusarov

Thank you for the clarification, ThomasK. If you ask for associations and feelings, then I'd venture an opinion that figurative meaning of Russian word for "shallow" stems from its size-related meaning, rather then from depth-related meaning.

"*мелкий*" = "*shallow / small*" has two primary meanings (and a few derived ones).
a) "Consisting of many small identical objects", emphasis is on "small".
"мелкая пыль" = "fine dust"
"мелкий шрифт" = "small font"
"мелкий текст" = "text written in small font"
"мелкие яблоки" = "small apples"

"мелкие детали" in the context of machine construction would mean "small parts" like screws and nuts. In the context of project planning, the same expression would mean "small (insignificant) details". I.e something that isn't worth mentioning when talking about the big picture.
I believe it is this sense "small, insignificant, unworthy, of secondary importance" that has given this word its figurative meaning when applied to people and their deeds.

"мелкий чиновник" = "small clerk" - disdainful way to describe a clerk working at a very low job position. This phrase says nothing about his physical dimensions, only about his insignificant role.
"мелкий человек" = "petty person", "trifling person"
"мелкая месть" = "petty revenge" - unworthy deed that any person who knows the meaning of "honour" should be ashamed of.

b) "Of little physical depth"
This meaning is quite direct and, I think, is not used figuratively. It is this meaning that is implied when talking about rivers, ponds, dishes, ditches, etc.


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## ger4

ThomasK said:


> @holger: I cannot seem to find a link with Dutch, it reminds me of the French _sec_, rather.


Could there be a link with verbs like _zakken_ or _zinken_, 'to sink' (deep water > sinking water level > shallow water > drying out)? This article mentions similar German verbs (_sinken, sich senken, versiegen_).


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