# golferia



## margarita80

Hola!!! Que tal todos?! Bueno, estoy leyendo el libro "la tesis de nancy". es sobre una americana que vivio en sevilla durante los 60. ella esta hablando con su novio sobre el golf, pero en vez de decir golf dice golferia...que significa esto? su novio se pone muy celoso y enfadado con ella. tiene que ver con "ser un golfo"?

gracias!
maggie


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## Agró

Exacto, o, dicho de otra manera: ser un perdido


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## Mirlo

Si un "perdedor/bueno para nada"

PS. Bienvenida al foro!!!!
Saludos,


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## Agró

Cuidado, un *perdido *no es un *perdedor*. Un perdido es un juerguista, un vividor.


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## Mirlo

Un perdedor es un *"loser" *que conlleva todos los otros significados al menos en inglés..

*Perdedor:*

I_ adjetivo_ losing
II_ m,f_* loser

Loser:*
[noun] a person with a record of failing; someone who loses consistently.

Gracias,


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## Agró

Mirlo said:


> Un perdedor es un *"looser" *que conlleva todos los otros significados al menos en inglés..
> Gracias,


*loser *(una sola 'o'). Pues en español son casi antónimos. Hay montones de golfos o perdidos (vividores, listillos) que son todo menos perdedores, al contrario, unos triunfadores.


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## Mirlo

En Estados Unidos se usa de las dos maneras , ya que se hizo popular con los jóvenes.. Mis hijas solían decir a loser + a loser makes a moron
Ejemplo:

Definition of *loser* in the Online Dictionary. *Meaning of looser*

Not strict in matters of morality; *not rigid according to
      some standard of right.*


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## Agró

Mirlo said:


> En Estados Unidos se usa de las dos maneras , ya que se hizo popular con los jóvenes.. Mis hijas solían decir a looser + a looser makes a moron
> Ejemplo:
> 
> Definition of *looser* in the Online Dictionary. *Meaning of looser*


Insisto: loser, no looser.
To lose es perder (loser es perdedor, no perdido)
To loose es aflojar


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## Mirlo

*Meaning of looser*

Not strict in matters of morality; *not rigid according to some standard of right.*


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## Jim986

Hi. To me, "golfo", "golfería" doesn't have any connotation of the person so described being a loser in today's sense of the word. In 1960 it was a bit more serious, but still only meant "juergista". A hundred years ago, in English, "perdition" was where you could send or find immoral people, and such a one, if feminine, was a "lost" woman (quite rich, perhaps, but lost all the same). Not any more. Today only money and fame count, so we who don't have them are losers, if not entirely lost. Delicious book, by the way.


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## Mirlo

Well then in this case you are right, maybe It's a *looser*, but I just wanted to clarify that the word "looser" exists.

La palabra perdido esta como Degenerate = degenerado/degenerar

intr. y prnl. Decaer, perder la calidad, características y virtudes originales
Me confundí porque Nunca he escuchado decir "es un perdido". He escuchao "se ha perdido (en un mundo de...)"

Thank you.

Saludos,


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## margarita80

Ok, today in my Spanish class we actually reviewed the difference between a perdido and a perdedor. A perdedor is someone who loses some sort of contest (a football match, a card game, a video game, etc.) and a perdido is a loser in a metaphorical sense: someone who does nothing with there life, a good-for-nothing, etc. The famous Beck song "Soy un perdedor (I'm a loser baby), actually uses the wrong "version" of "loser" in Spanish. It should be perdido.


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## Jim986

Hola Mirlo. you haven't heard it applied to "degenerate" people, but neither have I outside books, and even then you have to go back 100 years or so. Today, "perdition", "lost woman" etc. are themselves lost.


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## margarita80

Mirlo said:


> *Meaning of looser*
> 
> Not strict in matters of morality; *not rigid according to some standard of right.*



looser is the comparative form of the adjective "loose". A good example of usage is what a child says when their mother ties their shoes or ponytail too tight: "Make them looser! They are too tight!" (Imagine whiny voice )


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## Mirlo

margarita80 said:


> Ok, today in my Spanish class we actually reviewed the difference between a perdido and a perdedor. A perdedor is someone who loses some sort of contest (a football match, a card game, a video game, etc.) and a perdido is a loser in a metaphorical sense: someone who does nothing with there life, a good-for-nothing, etc. The famous Beck song "Soy un perdedor (I'm a loser baby), actually uses the wrong "version" of "loser" in Spanish. It should be perdido.



It's not my intention to be arguing about this but I do not want people to get the wrong answer...

The problem is that in English a *"loser"* is *un* *Fracasado (good for nothing).
The dictionary has it as :
Perdedor:*
I_ adjetivo_ losing
II _m,f_* loser

perdedor,ra *

adj. y s. Que pierde o fracasa en un juego o empeño: *(fracasado)*
Asi es que en la canción está bien usado...


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## margarita80

so then what is a perdido? Now I am confused. Could this just be a difference in vocabulary? I'm in Madrid, Spain.


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## Mirlo

According to the dictionary:

Perdido:

desp. [Persona] viciosa o libertina. También s.:
las malas lenguas dicen que casó con una perdida.
En grado sumo:
es tonto perdido.
Maybe you can use both,???
Saludos,


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## aztlaniano

My try:


margarita80 said:


> golferia...que significa esto? su novio se pone muy celoso y enfadado con ella. tiene que ver con "ser un golfo"?


_Una golfa_ is a woman who moves in disreputable circles, drinks a lot and/or takes drugs, probably sleeps with many men (especially with _golfos_) and may well be in trouble with the law. 
 saludos


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## margarita80

Apparently I can't cut and paste from other urls yet, but I just checked on dictionary.com from the Random House Dictionary that defines loser as:  "a person, team, nation, etc that loses" (perdedor) and "a misfit, esp. someone who has never or seldom has been successful at a job, a personal relationship, etc." (perdido).


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## margarita80

margarita80 said:


> Apparently I can't cut and paste from other urls yet, but I just checked on dictionary.com from the Random House Dictionary that defines loser as:  "a person, team, nation, etc that loses" (perdedor) and "a misfit, esp. someone who has never or seldom has been successful at a job, a personal relationship, etc." (perdido).



aztalaniano - Es asi, lo que he dicho de la diferencia entre perdido y perdedor en Espana?


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## Mirlo

margarita80 said:


> Apparently I can't cut and paste from other urls yet, but I just checked on dictionary.com from the Random House Dictionary that defines loser as: "a person, team, nation, etc that loses" (perdedor) and "a misfit, esp. someone who has never or seldom has been successful at a job, a personal relationship, etc." (perdido).


ramdom house comes from "wikipedia" anyone can put their opinion in Wikipedia 
Check Merriam Webster or other...
In fact, the majority of my definitions comes from Word Reference...
*Loser *Dictionary.com
3.*Slang.* a misfit, esp. someone who has never or seldom been successful at a job, personal relationship, etc.


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## margarita80

I just checked the Merriam Webster and it says:

1. a person or thing that loses especially consistently (perdedor)

2. a person who is incompetent or unable to succeed; _also_: something doomed to fail or disappoint (perdido)


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## Mirlo

*Perdido: (Word Reference)*

*desp. [Persona] viciosa o libertina. También s.:
las malas lenguas dicen que casó con una perdida. *
*En grado sumo:
es tonto perdido.*
*Esta definición de perdido no tiene nada que ver con no ser un fracasado.
Y ese es mi punto (I rest my case)*


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## aztlaniano

margarita80 said:


> Es asi, lo que he dicho de la diferencia entre perdido y perdedor en Espana?


 

There's no problem with "perdedor", someone who loses. Perdido has the meanings you cite, but also not*e* the definitions Mirlo came up with from somewhere:
desp. [Persona] viciosa o libertina. También s.:
las malas lenguas dicen que casó con una perdida.
En grado sumo:
es tonto perdido.
Number 1 above is the one of interest in your case.
But are you translating _Nancy_ or just trying to understand it? If the latter, the discussion of loser, lost, looser is not relevant.
saludos


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## Mirlo

Word Reference check it out...

Diccionario de la lengua española © 2005 Espasa-Calpe S.A., Madrid:
*perdido,da *


adj. Que no tiene dueño conocido o destino determinado:
perro perdido.
desp. [Persona] viciosa o libertina. También s.:
las malas lenguas dicen que casó con una perdida.
En grado sumo:
es tonto perdido.
poner o ponerse perdido loc. col. Ensuciarse sobremanera:
me he puesto perdida de tinta.


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## Jim986

Hola otra vez.
Una (mujer) perdida / a lost (woman) in the old sense of immoral, condemned to "perdition", not received in polite society, damned, etc. "Un (hombre) perdido": the same in masculine: one given to lost women, strong liquors and generally going to the dogs.

It should be noted that in both English and Spanish (outside the Church) this meaning is now outdated. "Un perdido" (o una) today means no more than someone who has lost his/her way.

Un/una perdedor/a is a loser in the modern English sense of the word.


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## Mirlo

So if I understand right you can use both...like I said before??
*Sorry:*
I'm not trying to prove anything I just want the people who read this thread to have the right information and not get confused like it happened in other threads...

Saludos,


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## Jim986

You can use both, but obviously each one has a different meaning. Going back to the word "golf@", a "golfa" would have been, in the eyes of the Church and respectable society, "una perdida" (immoral woman), but not "una perdedora" (someone bound to fail).


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## margarita80

I think it would be best if someone from Spain answered the question, as I'm questioning the vocabulary here in Spain, which can be different, as it's different with all regions, countries, etc.

Funny how this all came about starting with me wanting to understand a joke in a book!


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## margarita80

And thanks everyone for following this tread! This website is super-helpful!!!


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## Mirlo

Jim986 said:


> You can use both, but obviously each one has a different meaning. Going back to the word "golf@", a "golfa" would have been, in the eyes of the Church and respectable society, "una perdida" (immoral woman), but not "una perdedora" (someone bound to fail).


 
Thank you very much.....you have been more than kind, I'm sorry for the trouble...

Saludos,


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## EliTrans

Hi there everyone! I came across this old thread looking for an actual definition (Spain Spanish) of golfería and was surprised to see the discussion veer so far from the subject heading! Could any Spaniard help me with the definition of "golfería" in the following context:

(describing a man) 
"Le domina la pasión por descubrir la verdad, un particular sentido de la justicia, y un alto grado de golfería y encanto."

Yo había entendido "golfo" como alguien que suele ligar mucho, como un mujeriego, o "womanizer" en inglés.

Entonces "golfería" podría ser "womanizing" en este contexto?

Muchas gracias, thank you!


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## Agró

*golfería*
2. f. Acción propia de un golfo (‖ pillo, sinvergüenza).

*golfo*
Der. regres. de _golfín_2.
2. m. y f. Pillo, sinvergüenza, holgazán. U. t. c. adj.

Real Academia Española © Todos los derechos reservados

Así pues, es sinónimo de "pillería", "sinvergonzonería" u "holgazanería".


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## EliTrans

Gracias, pero estaba buscando la traducción en inglés... a mi me parecen las definiciones de esos términos en WordReference bastante variadas: 
*pillo* _adj_ (travieso) rascal, imp, devil 
*holgazán* _adj_ (vago) lazy
*sinvergüenza *_adj mf_ (bribón, atrevido) rascal, scoundrel, scamp

Yo siempre había entendido golfo como alguien a que le gustaba mucho la fiesta y las mujeres, no sé si me equivoco?

Si no he encontrado esto, supongo que podría ser más bien en este sentido?
*sinvergüenzura* SF (LAm) shamelessness 

Gracias!


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