# holiday / permission



## ThomasK

Time to talk about holidays, I think. Have you ever taken into consideration that it often has to do with getting permission. 

I illustrate a little: 

Dutch - _*verlof*_ (permission) --- zich veroorloven (to grant oneself, to allow oneself: to afford)

French - _*congé*_ (id.)

English - _*leave*_ (id.)

German - _*Urlaub*_ (you can recognize _erlauben_ in it: to allow)

There might be more traces of permission in those languages, but I am not aware of them. How about yours ?


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## Rallino

In Turkish as well,

izinli olmak = to be allowed, means to have a day-off.


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## rusita preciosa

In Russian it is *отпуск */otpusk/- release 
(the prefix от- means "off/away" and the root -пуск- means "letting go")


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## apmoy70

Not in Greek: 
«Διακοπή» (ðiako'pi _feminine noun_) or commonly (ðiako'pes _plural feminine noun_, after French influence-->_vacances_). From the Hellenistic noun «διακοπὴ» (dĭăkŏ'pē _feminine noun_)-->_gash, cleft, canal, breach, rupture_. From the Classical verb «διακόπτω» (dĭă'kŏptō; ðia'kopto or ðia'kovo in Modern Greek)-->_to cut through, break through, interrupt_. Compound formed with the joining together of the prefix and preposition «διὰ» (dī'ă)-->_through, throughout_ + verb «κόπτω» ('kŏptō)-->_cut off, chop off_. «Διακοπές» lit. means _intermissions, interruptions_


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## ThomasK

Would you say, Apmoy, that these 'intermissions' betray an explicit link with permission? They might, but with us the words don't seem linked.


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## itreius

Croatian

*dopust*
(dopustiti - to allow, to permit)


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## apmoy70

ThomasK said:


> Would you say, Apmoy, that these 'intermissions' betray an explicit link with permission? They might, but with us the words don't seem linked.


No, I do not think so...however, we call the holiday (Christmas-Easter) and summer break, «άδεια» ('aðia _feminine noun_) lit. _permission_. From the Classical feminine noun «ἄδεια» ('ădeiă)-->_safe conduct, amnesty, indemnity, __freedom from fear. _Compound formed with the joining together of the privative prefix «α-» (a-) + «δέος» ('dĕŏs _neuter noun_)-->_fear, alarm. _PIE base *dwei-, _to fear_. In Greek, when we take a break in holiday season from our work, we say (in vernacular) «έχω άδεια» (I have permission) and vacate oblivious of dangers or perils


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## bibax

Czech:

*dovolená* (leave) from *dovoliti* = to allow, to permit, a calque from German.
In the past the German loanword *urláb* was commonly used.

In Polish: *urlop* from German.


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## jazyk

Portuguese: vacation - férias.
Leave - licença.


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## Orlin

rusita preciosa said:


> In Russian it is *отпуск */otpusk/- release
> (the prefix от- means "off/away" and the root -пуск- means "letting go")


The same in Bulgarian.


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## Lars H

Swedish:

Att vara _ledig _(vacant, but the meaning is "to be free" (from work))
_Permission _- a military term
_Lov_, as in _Jullov_, _Sommarlov _(used when kids have leave from School)
_Semester _(holiday, vacation)

Finally I could add that _Orlov_ (from Urlaub) was used in the old days in the Navy.


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## ThomasK

Thanks, but I would not link _vacation_, or _ledig_ with permission. Would you? Freedom, yes, permission, no, I'd say...


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## elirlandes

Irish goes more with the idea of "freedom" 
Holidays = *laethanta saoire* [free days]


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## ThomasK

I suppose there are three or four basic meanings underlying holidays 
- holy days (Catholic church) as in _holidays_
- permission not to work as in _verlof, leave, congé, Urlaub, licença, _άδεια_..._
- freedom, maybe even 'emptiness' as in _vacation_

Have I forgotten one ? _(Just BTW: how did those people manage without holidays before ? ;-))_


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## Selyd

*ThomasK*
I suppose there are three or four basic meanings underlying holidays 
- holy days (Catholic church) as in _holidays_
- permission not to work as in _verlof, leave, congé, Urlaub, licença, _άδεια_..._
- freedom, maybe even 'emptiness' as in _vacation_
- *sacred*

In Ukrainian:
The best level a holiday - *свято* /svyato/ From *sacred.* These days our ancestors worshipped the gods.
At job - *відпустка */vidpustka/ *release* 
At school university - *канікули, вакації *// *vacation*_._ Another's words.
Not a working day - *вихідний* /vyhidniy/ *rest-day. *From to leave.


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## bibax

In Czech the students have *prázdniny*, from prázden (empty), prázdno (emptiness).

Russian/Ucrainian каникули/канікули means _the dog's days_ (after Sirius, Dog Star, the brightest star in the sky in Canis Major).


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## ThomasK

Thanks, Selyd, but aren't holy days sacred as well ??? ;-)


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## rusita preciosa

bibax said:


> Russian/Ucrainian каникулы/канікули means _the dog's days_ (after Sirius, Dog Star, the brightest star in the sky in Canis Major).


In Russian it is only used for school/university break and is pronounced /kanikuly/.
The word actually comes from latin *canicula* (little dog), which, as bibax indicated, was a nickname for Sirius. Sirius/Canicula was visible during the hottest days of the year, when Roman Senate took a break, hence the name.


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## ThomasK

But these 'dog days' is mainly some kind of nickname, isn't it? I cannot be used 'productively' to refer to holidays, I think. Or can it ?


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## rusita preciosa

ThomasK said:


> But these 'dog days' is mainly some kind of nickname, isn't it? I cannot be used 'productively' to refer to holidays, I think. Or can it ?


It does not mean "dog days" and there is no percievable connection with the word "dog" in Russian.
It is a normal (not nickname/slang) word for break, except it is only used for breaks in education establishments (schools, colleges, universities, academies etc...)

(of course I can only speak to Russian as I do not know other Slavic languages).


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## ThomasK

I see. I am sorry: my mistake. So it is fairly official. So maybe I could say it is a name of certain holidays, not a general name. Am I correct this time ? The point: should it be listed as a synonym of holiday as such in a list in a polyglot dictionary, do you think? _(I have no plans, rest assured !)_


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## rusita preciosa

Hmmm... no, I'd say it is the same difference as when in English you say "Christmas *break*" when you talk about kids off from school  and "Christmas *holiday/vacation*" when you talk about an adult off from work.

Typically, students have a fall break, a winter break, a spring break and a summer break (the big one). They all are called *каникулы* (plurale tantum).


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## ThomasK

OK, then it is official: it is one synonym for 'vacation', but used in specific contexts. But I think there will be difference in that a *'break'* as such in English will often not be understood as a holiday, whereas *каникулы* are always holidays, I guess. _(Sorry, no more replies necessary if too complex !)_


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## Lars H

Came to realize that we have holidays also in Swedish; _helgdagar_, literally _hallowed __days_. This term is used for "red" days in the calendar, such as Christmas Day, Easter day, Midsummer Day and so on.

Actually two official _helgdagar _are not religious by nature, May 1st (that fewer people celebrate for each year) and the National Day, June 6th (that even fewer celebrate).


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## Orlin

Selyd said:


> In Ukrainian:
> The best level a holiday - *свято* /svyato/ From *sacred.* These days our ancestors worshipped the gods. Bulgarian *празник* -> празен = empty.
> At school university - *канікули, вакації *// *vacation*_._ Another's words. Bulgarian *ваканция*.
> Not a working day - *вихідний* /vyhidniy/ *rest-day. *From to leave. Bulgarian *почивен ден* = day for rest.


+Bulgarian.


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## ThomasK

No contributions from China or Africa somewhere ? I really about the idea itself in those languages/ cultures...


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## ilocas2

Slovak:

dovolenka


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## ThomasK

I am sorry, but could you comment on the origin of this word? Any reference to permission or to holiness?


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## ilocas2

It's similar to Czech, so look at the comment about Czech.


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## ThomasK

I see, that was in #8... Thanks!


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## Ghabi

Arabic:
إجازة ijaaza 1) permission 2) vacation 3) certificate/licence

Cantonese:
假 gaa2 1) (in frozen classical Chinese expression only) to grant, lend; to borrow, rely on 2) fake, bogus
假 gaa3 vacation, holiday
(note the tonal difference but connected meanings)


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## ThomasK

You have all of those meanings together in Arabic then? The one I wonder about is certificate/ licence. I can imagine a link: a driving licence/ _permis de conduire_ is called a _rijbewijs_ in Dutch: a "driving certificate" (...). But so far I have not seen this link in previous contributions...

Chinese: the granting resembles permission, or privilege, I guess: holidays are like a privilege... However, I do not see any link with fakeness -- or should I not assume there must be some semantic link between these meanings? I'd think reliability and 'fakeness' are opposites...


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## ThomasK

ThomasK said:


> I suppose there are three or four basic meanings underlying holidays
> - holy days, sacred days (Catholic church) as in _holidays_
> - permission not to work as in _verlof, leave, congé, Urlaub, licença, _άδεια_..._
> - freedom, maybe even 'emptiness' as in _vacation_


_- _intermissions, breaks???


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## Ghabi

ThomasK said:


> You have all of those meanings together in Arabic then?


Yes.


> However, I do not see any link with fakeness


The link seems to be that something lent to you is not really yours, thus the bogus connection (there's the idiom "[like] the fox who borrows the tiger's name [to intimidate others]", which means it's a charlatan).


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## ThomasK

Of course, I quite understand now, had never thought of that!


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## merquiades

ThomasK said:


> I suppose there are three or four basic meanings underlying holidays
> - holy days (Catholic church) as in _holidays_
> - permission not to work as in _verlof, leave, congé, Urlaub, licença, _άδεια_..._
> - freedom, maybe even 'emptiness' as in _vacation_
> 
> Have I forgotten one ? _(Just BTW: how did those people manage without holidays before ? ;-))_



I don't really connect holiday, vacation with leave at all.  They are all just forms of free time.

*Holiday* (Holy day)-  no one works, because originally it may have been sacred. 

*Vacation* (vacant time) -  an empty period of time so you have time go away somewhere if you choose.

*Leave* (permitted time) - you don't normally have a right to this time off, so you need to be granted special permission.  You are sick, or had a baby, for example.  Also it could be an army soldier asking to go home for the weekend.


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## ThomasK

Let me try to understand: do you mean that leave and holiday are quite different, separate things for you? You do suggest that both are forms of free time. I wonder whether this has to do with linguistic differences [the use of the word 'leave'] or with a real semantic difference.

I do realize that time off or leave for example need not be a holiday strictly speaking, but Cambridge Dictionary states: "time *allowed** away from **work** for a **holiday* or illness". The main thing as for me was the origin of these related words, the origin of the free time: permission, or holy days, or ...


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## Stoggler

merquiades said:


> I don't really connect holiday, vacation with leave at all.  They are all just forms of free time.
> 
> *Holiday* (Holy day)-  no one works, because originally it may have been sacred.
> 
> *Vacation* (vacant time) -  an empty period of time so you have time go away somewhere if you choose.
> 
> *Leave* (permitted time) - you don't normally have a right to this time off, so you need to be granted special permission.  You are sick, or had a baby, for example.  Also it could be an army soldier asking to go home for the weekend.



In British English, the term 'leave' isn't necessarily as described above - I take annual leave from work, which is the specified number of days each year in my contract that I'm allowed to take.  I have the right to take it, the only caveat that the timing needs to be agreed with the employer.  The term 'holiday' is also used for these days off work (even if you don't go away).

Vacation is used in a lot of British universities to refer to the breaks for Christmas and Easter.


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## merquiades

Stoggler said:


> In British English, the term 'leave' isn't necessarily as described above - I take annual leave from work, which is the specified number of days each year in my contract that I'm allowed to take.  I have the right to take it, the only caveat that the timing needs to be agreed with the employer.


  Perhaps it is used like this in America too.  I'm not sure. I've never had a proper job there. _Annual leave_ doesn't sound completely foreign to me.  Perhaps I would guess it meant sabbatical.  Looks like _congés annuels._



> Vacation is used in a lot of British universities to refer to the breaks for Christmas and Easter.


 _Vacances scolaires_.  In this case, American schools say "_break_":  Winter break, Spring break, Summer break, Thanksgiving break, Halloween break, Christmas break.....
Which reminds me that "holiday" also has another meaning at least in the US:  the time between Christmas and Epiphany when people celebrate and decorate their homes.  I guess the origin is "holy day" too, but it sounds more secular than "Christmas" and gives a feel that it could apply to anyone. _Les fêtes (de fin d'année) _ Also it doesn't imply everyone celebrates or that everyone is free from work during this period.


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## ThomasK

I have been thinking about holidays again in these C times, but no news. As for this "annual leave" discussion: I think at least it is time off for things outside work; so I think it is intrinsically linked with holidays (travelling or not).


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## Welsh_Sion

*Welsh

Gwyliau *(n.f.pl.) is the standard word for holiday(s), from the singular *Gŵyl* (originally the feast day of some saint or other). In that respect it stands side by side with '*holy*' + '*day*' of English. (*Fête *in French.)

*Thomas K,*

You also mentioned 'these C times' (one is tempted to think of times 'Before Covid' as BC!) and was surprised you didn't bring in the English word *furlough* noun and verb (which I hadn't seen before). The etymology is quoted as: early 17th century: from Dutch *verlof*, modelled on German *Verlaub*, of West Germanic origin and related to* leave2*. (One translation of this in Welsh is '*ar gennad*' i.e. 'on leave').

Reprising the *leave* bit (as a noun, not a verbal noun) then we can have,  *caniatâd* (n.m.) 'permission' and *caniatâd *(n.m) *i fod yn absennol* for 'leave of absence', i.e. 'permission to be in the state of absent.'

However, interestingly enough the ideas of 'maternity leave' and other types of 'leave' involving some other outside factor (e.g. sickness, being away from one's ship, birth of a baby for the father ...) have the idea of 'a rest from' (viz. '*seibiant o*') or 'freedom/release from' (viz. '*rhyddhad o*').

In passing, I'm sure you know the national stereotypes contrasting, '*to take French leave*' = '*filer* à* l'anglaise*' .... 

These in Welsh are:

*mynd heb ganiatâd*,'to go without permission', *mynd heb ofyn*, 'to go without asking',  *mynd heb ddweud*,'to go without saying', and* cymryd cennad y ci* 'to take the dog's permission'.

Finally, a Welsh idiom for 'taking the day off': '*cael diwrnod i'r brenin*' (Literally: 'to receive a day to the king').

Cofion gorau / Best wishes.


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## Armas

Finnish: *loma*, the first meaning of which is space between things (and time between activities) or _*vapaa*[päivä]_ "free [day]" or _*pyhä*[päivä]_ "holy [day]" (Sundays and religious holidays).


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## ThomasK

@Armas: so no real permission, I gather... Does "free" "without cost" or just "leasure, freedom"? 

@Welsh_Sion: my English is fairly good, I hope, but still: I may have come across the word _*furlough*_, but I did not know it at all. I suppose it is not quite common... May I interrpret your  '*seibiant o*'  or '*rhyddhad o*' as something like a favour, something granted, a privilege? Are they based on some root? Thanks a lot for the information!


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## Penyafort

In *Catalan*:

 - (holidays) *vacances *[plural of *vacança*, from Latin _vacantia _'leisure; empty place', from the verb_ vac·o_ 'be free/empty/unoccupied']
- (leave) *permís *[from Latin _permissu_, past part. of _permitt·o_ 'let go, let leave, give up, allow', from _per-_ 'through, along' + _mitto _'let go, send']


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## hui

Finnish:

*lupa*, permission, but previously also used to mean extra free time from school, maybe just for one or two lessons or even for the whole day, *lupapäivä *("permission day").


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## Welsh_Sion

@Welsh_Sion: my English is fairly good, I hope, but still: I may have come across the word _*furlough*_, but I did not know it at all. I suppose it is not quite common... May I interrpret your '*seibiant o*' or '*rhyddhad o*' as something like a favour, something granted, a privilege? Are they based on some root? Thanks a lot for the information!

_________

Apologies for *furlough* - I've only come across it since Covid, too.

*seibiant *(n.m.) < *saib *(n.m.f.) 'pause, rest, interval' + *-iant* (suffix which creates an abstract noun added to the stem of a verbal noun).
*rhyddhad *(n.m.) < *rhyddhau* (vn) 'release, liberation, freedom'  > *rhydd* (adj.) 'free' ('libre' NOT 'gratuit).


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## Encolpius

Hungarian: *szabadság *(we use the same word as for "*freedom*") I wonder other languages have something similar,too.


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## ThomasK

You mean that *szabadság m*eans holiday and freedom? Well, isn't freedom like permission: when I get permission, I feel free? Might there be a link with _leave_ then? Or do you wonder whether any languages has one word meaning both (freedom and holiday)?


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