# Where is/are my fries?



## Silver

Hi,

Context:

My mother made a plate of French fries for me but it was too much and I couldn't finish all of them at lunch, so I left some on the plate for dinner. But after I came back from job, I didn't see my French fries, I then asked my mother:

Where *is* my fries?
Where *are* my fries?

(I was speaking Chinese; it's one sentence. But when it becomes English, I need to think about the singular or plural problem.)

I wonder if the second one is fine. I originally thought that the first one is correct.

Can anyone help?

Thanks a lot


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## Copyright

Same advice as in this thread:
Where is/are your scissors?

_Where are my fries?_ (Correct)
_Where's my fries?_ (You'll hear it, but it must have the contraction.)


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## Hermione Golightly

'Fries' is plural so the verb has to be plural.


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## Silver

Thanks a lot. I was thinking all those fries were in a plate so I used the singular, but yes, they are plural so I need to use the plural.....


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## Language Hound

Copyright said:


> ..._Where's my fries?_ (You'll hear it, but it must have the contraction.)


Just wanted to add that "Where's my fries?" tends to be said by people who are not very well educated.
What you may also hear--and what really makes me cringe--is: "Where's my fries at?"
I wouldn't encourage anyone to use these if your goal is to speak English correctly.

(@Silverobama:  The fries were _on_ a plate, not "in" a plate.)


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## Silver

Thanks a lot, LH, for your kind reminder.


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## Andygc

Language Hound said:


> Just wanted to add that "Where's my fries?" tends to be said by people who are not very well educated.


Too true. Well-educated Brits with a degree and several postgraduate qualifications say "Where's my *chips*". 

Well, this one does.


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## Copyright

Can't agree with the "not very well educated" observation. There's and Where's with a plural verb are simply too widespread:
use of [ there's ] to introduce a plural noun


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## JustKate

If the speaker isn't using a contraction, nearly everyone would say "are." But it is undoubtedly true that "where's" is a very common replacement for "where're."


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## Language Hound

Thanks for the laugh, Andy.

Well, count me among those who consider _Where's my fries?/clothes/socks/or any other plural noun _very poor grammar.
I always say, "Where're my fries?/clothes/socks/or any other plural noun.
As I haven't noticed many educated native AE speakers use this construction, I wonder if it isn't more prevalent in BE.
I should add that I don't consider myself a linguistic snob and I do have a lot of contact with native AE speakers who are not sticklers for grammar, but even they seem to use "Where's" followed by a singular noun.

_Cross-posted_ with JustKate, whose post now has me questioning my reality and my life...
Seriously though, it's very hard for me to imagine that slews of Americans are asking questions such as "Where's the cars?" or "Where's the kids?"


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## Copyright

It's worth reading the thread linked in post 8, and the linked threads in that thread. (That's enough thread in one sentence, I think.)


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## Language Hound

Thanks, Copyright.  I had read the other two threads that the new one replaces.
This new one, though, is frightening! Perhaps I'm leading a sheltered life after all...
I don't take issue with the first example ("There's a handful of facilities..") because of "a handful."


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## Copyright

I did have two previous threads there, and they were supportive but not very substantial. Then I went to Google and it led me back to the big one – big enough that I deleted the other two. Sorry for any confusion – I've been reading the big one myself.


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## sunyaer

Language Hound said:


> ...
> Seriously though, it's very hard for me to imagine that slews of Americans are asking questions such as "Where's the cars?" or "Where's the kids?"



Do you mean that native Americans would say ""Where's the cars?" or "Where's the kids?"

I might have heard "is" being followed by plural noun said by native speakers of English, but I still didn't trust my ears.


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## perpend

Language Hound said:


> _Cross-posted_ with JustKate, whose post now has me questioning my reality and my life...
> Seriously though, it's very hard for me to imagine that slews of Americans are asking questions such as "Where's the cars?" or "Where's the kids?"



I think JustKate's advice/input was sound.

Does "Where's the keys?" ever slip out of your mouth?


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## Copyright

sunyaer said:


> Do you mean that native Americans would say ""Where's the cars?" or "Where's the kids?"
> 
> I might have heard "is" being followed by plural noun said by native speakers of English, but I still didn't trust my ears.


Yes, we could say those ... but some of us might use "Where's" or "There's" with a plural noun selectively, meaning not with every plural noun, and we might use "Where are" or "There are" with the same nouns in other circumstances.


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## sunyaer

Copyright said:


> Yes, we could say those ... but some of us might use "Where's" or "There's" with a plural noun selectively, meaning not with every plural noun, and we might use "Where are" or "There are" with the same nouns in other circumstances.



Could you please give some examples of these  circumstances?


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## Copyright

sunyaer said:


> Could you please give some examples of these  circumstances?


It would depend on whether or not I was in a hurry. If I had time, I might use the grammatical "are." If I were in a hurry, I might use the contracted "is."


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## natkretep

Fries or chips are different from cars or kids.

If you are referring to orders or food portions, it's not unusual to say, 'Where's the chips?', 'Where's the baked beans?', 'Where's the sausages?' I agree it has to be contracted _is._


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## Language Hound

sunyaer said:


> Do you mean that native Americans would say ""Where's the cars?" or "Where's the kids?"


What I mean is that it is difficult for me to imagine that a large number of Americans actually use "Where's the" followed by a plural noun.
However, based on statements in this thread and the other threads whose links are provided here, that does indeed seem to be the case.
P.S. I think you mean "native AE speakers," not "native Americans."



perpend said:


> Does "Where's the keys?" ever slip out of your mouth?


No, never.



natkretep said:


> Fries or chips are different from cars or kids.
> 
> If you are referring to orders or food portions, it's not unusual to say, 'Where's the chips?', 'Where's the baked beans?', 'Where's the sausages?' I agree it has to be contracted _is._


So, at least in BE, is "Where's the" + plural noun used just for food?


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## perpend

Language Hound said:


> No, never.



Interesting .... you would never say "Where's the keys?"

What say you, in your vernacular, LH?


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## Language Hound

No, "Where's the keys?" would never naturally come out of my mouth.
I would say "Where're the keys?"


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## Loob

I'm fairly sure I don't say "Where's" with a plural noun either - what I say is "Where are?", pronounced /wɛərə/.

I do, in informal speech, use "there's" with a plural noun, though I think some plurals (eg those preceded by _lots of._..) are more likely to prompt this than others.


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## perpend

LH, This is good, because we have a good example of American English speakers not agreeing, due to different dialects, perhaps.

I use "Where's the keys?" in my dialect.


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## Rhye

I think the problem with colloquially, casually saying "Where're the keys?" is that it sort of mitigates the effects of the contraction; if the contraction is meant to shorten the time and effort of saying the phrase, then I think "where're" fails to an extent. One must enunciate it to the point of nearly saying "Where are", otherwise it will be an unintelligible mumble. So I can understand that some would choose to incorrectly say "Where's" in casual situations of little to no importance.


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## perpend

I did notice the "incorrectly say" (don't agree), Rhye, but otherwise very much agree with your scribbles.


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## Loob

Rhye said:


> I think the problem with colloquially, casually saying "Where're the keys?" is that it sort of mitigates the effects of the contraction; if the contraction is meant to shorten the time and effort of saying the phrase, then I think "where're" fails to an extent. One must enunciate it to the point of nearly saying "Where are", otherwise it will be an unintelligible mumble. So I can understand that some would choose to incorrectly say "Where's" in casual situations of little to no importance.


I've always been a bit puzzled by the contraction "Where're". Unless I'm stressing "are" for some reason, my "Where are" and "There are" _*always*_ have a schwa.


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## Language Hound

Rhye said:


> ...if the contraction is meant to shorten the time and effort of saying the phrase, then I think "where're" fails to an extent. One must enunciate it to the point of nearly saying "Where are", otherwise it will be an unintelligible mumble. So I can understand that some would choose to incorrectly say "Where's" in casual situations of little to no importance.


"Where's" is one syllable; "Where're" is barely two.  I pronounce "Where're" much like "wearer."  I think "Where're the keys?" sounds quite intelligible.
By not having to briefly halt as I must between "Where" and "are," I believe less time and effort go into saying the phrase, so I don't think it "fails"
as a contraction.


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## Andygc

Loob said:


> I'm fairly sure I don't say "Where's" with a plural noun either - what I say is "Where are?",


Whereas I find "Where's the keys?" perfectly natural and "Where's the children?" possible, but not "Where's the cars?" In other words:


Language Hound said:


> So, at least in BE, is "Where's the" + plural noun used just for food?


No, I think it's used for anything that can be seen as an item or group - like a bunch of keys, or my children when they were younger.


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## se16teddy

Silverobama said:


> Thanks a lot. I was thinking all those fries were in a plate so I used the singular


I think native speakers often use this logic in conversation, but it is not considered "correct" in formal contexts.


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## Kirusha

Funny thing is, as I was reading this thread I tried saying "Where are my chips?" in my best imitation mutter-style drop-your-endings BE voice and ended up hearing myself say "Where's my chips?". Which makes me wonder. Could this phenomenon be primarily phonetic in origin rather than semantic (semantically driven as in the plate-to-chips move)? From /wɛərə/ to /wɛəw/ to /wɛəz/. This might also account for the difference between the keys and the cars.



Andygc said:


> Whereas I find "Where's the keys?" perfectly natural and "Where's the children?" possible, but not "Where's the cars?"


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## Silver

Well, I want to add something:

I can understand why natives tend to say "Where's my keys?", "Where's my +plural noun?"

Because those things are not very important, trivial things, I gather.

Am I right?

It seems that if we keep talking something else, the thread is going to be locked.


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## sunyaer

Silverobama said:


> ...
> Because those things are not very important, trivial things, I gather.


It's because those things can be seen as a group, especially when "where's" is used with words like "a lot of", "a bunch of". You see your children as a group of kids, but the cars you own are things that can't be viewed as group. That's why we see objection to the use of "where's my cars".


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## Silver

sunyaer said:


> You see your children as a group of kids, but the cars you own are things that can't be viewed as group. That's why we see objection to the use of "where's my cars".



Well, I just want to stop this topic, my dear friend. I can't understand why cars can't be considered as a group.


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## bennymix

I'm not sure this is common or detectable in this person's AE and CE experience.
It's too damn hard to say!   In other words I both insert and hear the 'ah' sound before the final 'r'.



Language Hound said:


> No, "Where's the
> keys?" would never naturally come out of my mouth.
> I would say "Where're the keys?"


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## Andygc

Where's the keys? They aren't trivial, but keys are usually in a bunch on a keyring.
Where's my chips? On a plate or in a bag.
Where're the cars? They are normally seen as individual things, not as a mass.
But, we've booked 2 cars to go to the wedding - Where's the cars? becomes possible - they are now a unit.


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## sunyaer

Andygc said:


> Where's the keys? They aren't trivial, but keys are usually in a bunch on a keyring.
> Where's my chips? On a plate or in a bag.
> Where're the cars? They are normally seen as individual things, not as a mass.
> But, we've booked 2 cars to go to the wedding - Where's the cars? becomes possible - they are now a unit.



Good point and examples.
Would you or other native speakers say "where's the cars?" in the context of booking 2 cars for the wedding?

I understand "possible" as something that might not be actually heard in real conversation.


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## Andygc

I intend "possible" to mean it's something I might say and might hear. Earlier, I wrote


Andygc said:


> but not "Where's the cars?"


Having thought about it, I realised that it could be something I might say, so I wrote


Andygc said:


> But, we've booked 2 cars to go to the wedding - Where's the cars? becomes possible - they are now a unit.


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## Kirusha

I still keep wondering if there may be some phonetic basis here, possibly linked with rhoticity. For someone who doesn't pronounce a noticeable /r/ sound in "are" it's <-> hard to say "where are" when speaking fast, especially if the next sound is /ð/, but if someone says /är/, they'll be more likely to perceive "where's" followed by a plural noun as ungrammatical. Does that strike you as plausible?


<-> Distracting expletive removed. Cagey, moderator.


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## perpend

sunyaer said:


> Would you or other native speakers say "where's the cars?" in the context of booking 2 cars for the wedding?
> 
> I understand "possible" as something that might not be actually heard in real conversation.



I would <---->


<---> More off-topic and distracting chat removed.  Cagey, moderator.


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## natkretep

Kirusha said:


> I still keep wondering if there may be some phonetic basis here, possibly linked with rhoticity.


I don't think it's a phonological constraint, Kirusha - not for me anyway. Of course _where's_ has one less syllable than _where're_ but the latter isn't difficult to pronounce: /wɛːzðə/, /wɛːrəðə/. As should be obvious from my transcriptions, I'm speaking as a non-rhotic speaker.


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## Kirusha

Thank you, Natkretep. There seems to be presently a lot more acceptance for/ awareness of "there's" plus a plural noun. Among reasons for its spread some people mention elision. Perhaps "where's" will soon follow suit. And then "when's" and "how's" ("when's the negotiations?", "how's your partners?"). 

Edit. Nothing's new under the sun. 

"How's your parents, Balmy?" The boy made no answer; he shrank closer to the entrance. (Henry Lawson, 1900).


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