# The woman is always right.



## Encolpius

Hello, is there any similar sentence from classical Latin literature?. I have problems to translate woman. Since woman can also mean wife and I do not like the word femina so much. So my translation would be: Uxor sempre recte dicit. Can you make up any better similar phrase? Thanks.


----------



## francisgranada

Only a suggestion: instead of _uxor_ perhaps you should use _mulier_. _Uxor_ means "wife", while _mulier_ corresponds more or less to Hungarian _asszony_, Spanish _mujer_, Italian _donna, _etc_._

P.S. "Always" is _semper _(not _sempre_) in Latin.


----------



## Scholiast

salvete

Encolpius' snag (with which I utterly sympathize) can be dealt with by using a pronoun: _ipsa semper recte_ (or _iure_).

Σ


----------



## francisgranada

Scholiast said:


> ... (with which I utterly sympathize) ...


You seem to have an _uxor _at home  ... (if so, then I beg her pardon). I think _ipsa _is ok in a concrete situation, or when the context is clear, but if Encolpius wants to use it as a "saying" or "proverb", then some term for "women" would be needed.


----------



## Scholiast

Nope, sorry francisgranada (# 4)

Any Roman would know exactly to whom _ipsa_ refers. It's a bit like "himself" in Scots English, referring to the Laird.

Σ


----------



## francisgranada

Scholiast said:


> ... Any Roman would know exactly to whom _ipsa_ refers ...


Finally, not  only the Romans would know   ... Nihil sub sole novum.

A propos, I have two questions:

1) In  "ipsa semper rect*e*_", recte _is an adverb. So, strictly speaking, grammatically something is missing in this sentence, for example the verb _dicit_. In spite of this, is the meaning automatically clear?

2) Would it be possible to say also "ipsa semper rect*a* (est)_" _in the same sense/meaning?

P.S. As to the Scots/Irish English himself/hersef/..., I didn't know about, but I think it's perfectly understandable in the given context .


----------



## Scholiast

And once again, Scholiasta suis SPD.



francisgranada said:


> 1) In "ipsa semper rect*e*_", recte _is an adverb. So, strictly speaking, grammatically something is missing in this sentence, for example the verb _dicit_. In spite of this, is the meaning automatically clear?



In principle, of course, francisgranada is right: it's not a complete sentence with complete syntax. But I was looking for an idiomatic and conversational phraseology to do justice to the OP's enquiry. As lamented before, I have not my library at my elbow, but I would bet my bottom dollar that there are things like this in Plautus.

And of course, it would be perfectly grammatical to say something like _ipsa recta est_, but I think it would carry not quite the right nuance—to me it would mean something like "She is standing bolt upright", if it means anything at all.

And oh yes, I do have an _uxor_, who is the loveliest lady on the planet.

Σ


----------



## francisgranada

In Spanish and Italian I'd say "la mujer tiene siempre razón" and "la donna ha sempre ragione", respectively. Now in Latin, no similar construction could exist?

For example (my mere invention for curiosity): "Mulier semper rationem habet".



Scholiast said:


> ... And oh yes, I do have an _uxor_, who is the loveliest lady on the planet.


Deo gratias .... (This is a very nice answer).


----------



## Scholiast

In Italian surely "la moglie". But that would be just "'Er indoors", _n'est ce pas_?

With all respect and courtesy, _mulier_ even in its smoothed-out modern version, still sounds to me a little, shall we say, "off-ish". I shall of course consult my feminist friends. And wish they would wear skirts, like proper women!

Σ


----------



## francisgranada

Scholiast said:


> In Italian surely "la moglie" ...


The Italian _moglie_, though  etymologically corresponds to the Spanish _mujer _and, of course, to the Latin _mulier_, it's meaning is rather _uxor, _while in Spanish and Latin not exclusively. See, for example, the prayer _Hail Mary, _where in Italian the term _donna _(< Lat. _domina_) is preferred:

Latin: _Benedicta Tu in mulieribus_
Spanish_: Bendita Tú eres entre las mujeres_
Italian_: Tu sei benedetta fra le donne_


----------



## Scholiast

Joking apart, honest question to francisgranada: is, historically, Hungary Catholic or Orthodox in its national observance? I confess to complete ignorance here, and would like to be enlightened.

Σ


----------



## Scholiast

Of course, from Luke, "Blessed art thou among women..."

My curiosity remains.

Σ


----------



## francisgranada

Scholiast said:


> ... is historically, Hungary Catholic or Orthodox in its national observance? ...


Catholic (the majority) and Protestant.  The Orthodox religion is also present, but statistically irrelevant. More or less, the same situation is valid also in Slovakia (historically part of the Kingdom of Hungary).


----------



## ain'ttranslationfun?

French: "Bénie sois-tu entre toutes les femmes." 



Scholiast said:


> Joking apart, honest question to francisgranada: is, historically, Hungary Catholic or Orthodox in its national observance? I confess to complete ignorance here, and would like to be enlightened.
> 
> Σ



Did you mean "...Roman Catholic or Orthodox Catholic...." (of which there are a few varieties: Russian Orthodox Catholic, Greek Orthodox Catholic...). (Am H: ["Old  French _orthodoxe_, from Late Latin _orthodoxus_, from Greek _orthodoxos_, having the right opinion [...])". - I'm not an etymologist, but I looked this up out of curiosity.


----------



## francisgranada

To be more precise: in our regions traditionally there are Roman Catholics (the majority), Protestants (Calvinists and Lutherans), Graeco-Catholics (belonging to Vatican) and Orthodox(es) (independent from the pope/Vatican). The members of both the Graeco-Catholic an the Orthodox Churches are relatively few.


----------



## exgerman

The characters and the narrator all use _mulier_ for both woman and wife in the work from which your nick derives.


----------



## Encolpius

Scholiast said:


> salvete
> 
> Encolpius' snag (with which I utterly sympathize) can be dealt with by using a pronoun: _ipsa semper recte_ (or _iure_).
> 
> Σ



Thanks, I like your sentence very much. Brief and neutral.


----------

