# という学説のこと



## dgwp

I wonder if anyone could help me understand the meaning/function of the underlined parts of the following sentence? 

天動説は、すべての天体が地球の周りを公転しているという学説のこと。

I think the whole sentence translates something like: "Geocentric theory is the theory that all heavenly bodies orbit the Earth."

Many thanks

David


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## Lupen The Third

Hello dgwp! I'm still not very good in Japanese, but let me try...

First off : I think you got the meaning!

"こと" means a lot of things, ex :
thing, matter, fact, experience and so on.

学説のこと should be literally : The fact, experience of the theory.
The theory as a fact.

Let's focus now on "という学説".
When a verb precedes a noun, there is relative proposition.
For ex :
泣いた子ども (Naita kodomo) > The child that cried
-etc- と言った映画 (to itta eiga) > the film called -etc-

"という学説のこと" = The theory which says that

Now the sentence, this is how I would translate it (literally) :

What about the Ptolemaic theory, it's the theory which says (enunciates) that all the heavenly bodies orbit the circumference of the Earth.

Back to "学説のこと" : We are stressing that the Ptolemaic theory, is the fact of the theory, the matter of the theory. Theory seen like a thing! 
Others ex :
食べること= The fact of eating - eating or to eat (simply)
読むこと = The fact of reading - reading or to read (simply)

Anyways, your understanding was right!

But as I always say...it's better to wait for someone's confirmation!
ルパン三世


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## wathavy

dgwp said:


> I wonder if anyone could help me understand the meaning/function of the underlined parts of the following sentence?
> 
> 天動説は、すべての天体が地球の周りを公転しているという学説のこと。
> 
> I think the whole sentence translates something like: "Geocentric theory is the theory that all heavenly bodies orbit the Earth."
> 
> Many thanks
> 
> David



「天動説」とは、「天体が地球を中心にして公転している」という「考え方」のこと「です」。
天動説とは、考え方のことです。ただし、その考え方というのは、天体が地球を中心に公転しているという考え方のことです。

Geocentric, which dictates the Earth is the center of the orbiting cosmos, is one theory.

Geocentric is a way of thinking. The thinking is that whole universe is orbiting around the Earth.

という is somewhat like making a sentence to be a adjective. "xxxx" which can be explained as "zzzz". という=which is or which can be explained as.

のこと　is short form of のことです。 Basically, used with という　and is component of the colloquial sentence to me.
というｘｘｘのこと(です)。
What I meant was the sentence above is a set.


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## Lupen The Third

wathavy said:


> Geocentric, which dictates the Earth is the center of the orbiting cosmos, is one theory.
> 
> Geocentric is a way of thinking. The thinking is that whole universe is orbiting around the Earth.
> 
> という is somewhat like making a sentence to be a adjective. "xxxx" which can be explained as "zzzz". という=which is or which can be explained as.
> 
> のこと　is short form of のことです。 Basically, used with という　and is component of the colloquial sentence to me.
> というｘｘｘのこと(です)。
> What I meant was the sentence above is a set.



This is why I said that I'm not still very good in Japanese and that it was better to await for someone's else confirmation! 

Sorry David!


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## wathavy

Lupen The Third said:


> This is why I said that I'm not still very good in Japanese and that it was better to await for someone's else!
> 
> Sorry David!



Don't be sorry, Lupen.
If you want to be good at, you can best learn it by teaching it.
Everyone say that.(I think).

I just wanted to know if I know how to explain too.
I think your explanation works, too.


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## harunoyuki

Hi!
Yourst ranslation is perfect　.
１．という coordination/apposition clause "that".　　　　grammatical　rule
ref:　「今日、Aさんという人が来るらしいです。」 not coordination.
Uncertainty estimation　"I hear his name is A."　　
２．のこと equal
は～のことです。とは～のことです。　　というのは～のことです。
These three phrases are always used to explain something. 
Standard expression.
ゴールデンウイーク（というの）は連休のことです。


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## Lupen The Third

wathavy said:


> Don't be sorry, Lupen.
> If you want to be good at, you can best learn it by teaching it.
> Everyone say that.(I think).
> 
> I just wanted to know if I know how to explain too.
> I think your explanation works, too.



Thank you


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## dgwp

Thank you very much for all your help with this!

Best wishes

David


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## Derselbe

Lupen The Third said:


> When a verb precedes a noun, there is relative proposition.
> "という学説のこと" = The theory which says that



The confusion here might result from a different way of thinking of western languages. In English (and comparable languages) there is a clear and important distinction between active and passive verbs. In Japanese there is a passive but it doesn't fullfill the functions of the English passive. The distinction between active and passive which we are used to in English etc. is not existent in Japanese. The question as to who is agent and who is patient is answered by the context. 
The best example to see this phenomenon is という.

ピーターという男の子 
can as well mean
_The boy who says "Peter"  _(boy is agent)
and
_The boy called Peter (boy is patient)_

Which one is meant is answered by the context.
Often it is very obvious as in
昨日に食べた料理は何だったけ。
_What did I eat yesterday again? _
Here 食べた料理 is the _food which was eaten_ and not the _food that ate_. The noun after the verb is its *patient* in terms of English grammar.

But in 泣いた子供 the noun is the *agent* as Lupen already translated correctly:
_The child who cried._

とうい　is in my experience mostly followed by its patient. So the standard translation should be 
XというY -> 
The X called Y 
and not 
Y who says X

What do we learn from that? We should stop thinking in English categories and try to understand the Japanese way to think.


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