# Foreign plurals



## AndrasBP

Hello,

It's an unusual feature of Engish that it uses a number of foreign plural endings, where the suffix was "imported" together with the foreign word,
e.g. _larvae, fungi, bacteria, analyses, mafiosi, paparazzi, châteaux, kibbutzim, eisteddfodau_ etc.
Also in German, there are some foreign words that take a foreign plural, e.g. Streik*s*.

(This would be impossible in Hungarian, where *all *nouns take the plural suffix *-k*.)

Do you know about foreign plurals used in other languages?


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## TheCrociato91

Hello.

In Italian we _usually _incorporate foreign words without pluralizing them; that is, we use the singular form for the plural, too (1 _hotel_, 2 _hotel_; 1 _fan_, 2 _fan_, etc.). When it comes to Latin words, we may either use the Latin plural (2 _curricula, _2_ corpora_, etc.) or simply use the singular form for the plural (2 _curriculum_, 2 _corpus_, etc.). 

There might be exceptions, I'll have a think when I get around to it.

As for English, I'm just going to add to your list the Italian loanword "spaghetti", which is used as an uncountable noun (albeit plural in Italian).

Some languages even go a step further and pluralize an already plural noun. I'm looking at you, Spanish. What on earth is "espagueti*s*"?


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## Perseas

TheCrociato91 said:


> In Italian we _usually _incorporate foreign words without pluralizing them; that is, we use the singular form for the plural, too


The same here.

English words don't make plural in Greek, but sometimes you may hear 'κομπιούτερς (computers)' or 'σεντς (cents)'.
It's also very common to hear 'μπάιτς (bytes)' and 'μπιτς (bits)'.

On the other hand, we usually use the singular 'τζίν (jean)' instead of 'jeans' for a pair of trousers, and the plural 'κόμικς (comics)' for a comic book for children with pictures.



TheCrociato91 said:


> When it comes to Latin words, we may either use the Latin plural (2 _curricula, _2_ corpora_, etc.) or simply use the singular form for the plural (2 _curriculum_, 2 _corpus_, etc.).


In Greek you can hear both 'φόρουμ (forum)' and 'φόρα (fora)' as plural, with the latter being formal.


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## Dymn

*Spanish
*
Foreign plurals are very rare in Spanish. The Latin endings _-is, -us, -um _pluralize as _-is, -us, -ums_. Foreign words ending in consonant usually pluralize adding an _-s _instead of _-es _unlike native words, e.g. _robot_ > _robots, cómic > cómics_. Some words, like _test, podcast_, are usually left as unvariable because adding an -_s_ would result in a cluster too complicated for the strict Spanish phonotactics. The only foreign plural that occurs to me is _Länder_, with variable capitalization, referring to the German federal states.

Contrary to Anglo tradition, Hispanics are not so fussy when it comes to foreign words and the "official" stance (as dictated by RAE) is to adapt all foreign borrowings -morphologically, orthographically-, quite often way beyond what laymen do (e.g. recommending spellings such as _güisqui _instead of _whiskey_), or weird translations (e.g. the other day Fundéu -a RAE off-shoot for neologisms- suggested using _nacionalpopulismo_ instead of _alt-right_). I know it may be a bit off-topic but this is the general trend why I think foreign plurals are less common in Spanish than in English.



TheCrociato91 said:


> I'm looking at you, Spanish. What on earth is "espagueti*s*"?


And what on earth is "un murales", my dear Italians?


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## Penyafort

*Catalan*

As the other Western Romance languages, uses an -s in general for almost all words, whether they are native or foreign. So most Catalan words coming from English form the plural with an -s (as English would in most cases too): *xats*_, *eslògans*, *pàrquings*, *clubs*, *córners*, *escàners*, etc.
_
Words from other languages, whether adapted or not, tend to follow the Catalan rules of the plural: *la geisha *> *les geishes*, *el zepelí *> *els zepelins*, etc.

Only when the word is clearly not adapted, the plural remains unchanged: *els foie-gras*, *unes delicatessen*

Words taken from an Italian plural are regarded as singular and they must take an s to form the plural: *espaguetis*_, *raviolis*, *nyoquis*, *paparazzis*, etc. _But if they end in -a, they follow the Catalan rule of -a > -es: *lasanya*_ > *lasanyes*, *pizza *> *pizzes*, etc.
_
Same thing can be said from words taken from an Arabic or Hebrew plural/collective term. They are usually regarded as singular and follow the rules of the plural.

Many of the exceptions to the rule of -à > -ans (mà 'hand' > mans 'hands') are due to the word being foreign, as that _n_ would be antietymological, so only -s is added: *xa *'sha' > *xas*, *esquí *'ski' > *esquís*, *ximpanzè *'chimpanzee' > *ximpanzès*, *mannà *'manna' > *mannàs*,* nyu *'gnu' > *nyus*, *xampú *'shampoo' > *xampús*, etc.


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## TheCrociato91

Perseas said:


> English words don't make plural in Greek, but sometimes you may hear 'κομπιούτερς (computers)' or 'σεντς (cents)'.
> It's also very common to hear 'μπάιτς (bytes)' and 'μπιτς (bits)'.
> 
> On the other hand, we usually use the singular 'τζίν (jean)' instead of 'jeans' for a pair of trousers, and the plural 'κόμικς (comics)' for a comic book for children with pictures.



Instead, I think we tend to keep the plural when the loanword is already plural: we only say_ jeans_. 



Perseas said:


> In Greek you can hear both 'φόρουμ (forum)' and 'φόρα (fora)' as plural, with the latter being formal.


I'd say this is also true for Italian. Most people simply use the singular form for the plural for Latin words. The use of the Latin plural is usually linked to written discourse or formal speech (the latter possibly coming across as pretentious).



Dymn said:


> And what on earth is "un murales", my dear Italians?


I'll give you that; many people use "murales" as a singular noun, although it's clearly incorrect (whereas "espaguetis" or "ñoquis" are correct  ).


> Un *murale *(in spagnolo _mural_, al plurale _murales_; la forma plurale è usata anche in italiano, spesso erroneamente anche come singolare


 (Murale - Wikipedia , emphasis added).


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## Penyafort

TheCrociato91 said:


> (whereas "espaguetis" or "ñoquis" are correct  )



But that's what happens when the word is not considered a foreign word anymore.

In Italian you are also not aware that singular nouns like _serafino _come from a plural, for instance.


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## Sardokan1.0

TheCrociato91 said:


> Some languages even go a step further and pluralize an already plural noun. I'm looking at you, Spanish. What on earth is "espagueti*s*"?



Also in Sardinian we use that kind of plural ending with *IS *

_*Italian :* Gli spaghetti - *Sardinian *: Sos ispaghettis_

Plurals ending with IS in (northern) Sardinian are mostly used for jobs or adjectives. While in southern Sardinian are more common.

_Su carabineri -> Sos carabineris
Su panatteri -> Sos panatteris (il fornaio, i fornai)
S'infirmieri -> Sos infirmieris
Su furisteri -> Sos furisteris (il forestiero, i forestieri)
Su marineri -> Sos marineris (il marinaio, i marinai)
Su coghineri -> Sos coghineris (il cuoco, i cuochi | Latino "coquinarius")_

etc.etc.


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## AndrasBP

Thank you for your replies.



TheCrociato91 said:


> Some languages even go a step further and pluralize an already plural noun.


In Russian, plural English loanwords need their own plural suffix to conform to the rules of Russian morphology:

*джинсы *(dzhinsy) = jeans
*чипсы *(chipsy) = potato crisps/chips


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## bibax

AndrasBP said:


> In Russian, plural English loanwords need their own plural suffix to conform to the rules of Russian morphology:
> 
> *джинсы *(dzhinsy) = jeans
> *чипсы *(chipsy) = potato crisps/chips


Like in Czech (inanimate plural ending *-y*):

*jeansy* (plurale tantum like any trousers and pants, also written *džínsy*) = jeans;
(however we say also *džíny* without the English ending -s);

*komiks* (sing.), *komiksy* (plur.) = comics;

we distinguish čipsy and čipy:
*čipsy* = potato crisps/chips;
*čipy* (Czech plural without the English -s) = silicon chips (in integrated circuits);

also
*baksy* (rarely, usually *babky*) = bucks;

and notorious
*Tálibáni* (animate masc. plur. ending *-i*), _Tálibán_ is already plural (= "students");
in Hungarian I suppose _tálibánok_ (plur.);


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## KalAlbè

In Haitian Creole it doesn't matter if it's a foreign plural or not. Singular or plural does not affect nouns in Haitian Creole.
The nouns remain the same.


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## Perseas

Some words of Greek origin like *stigma *have two plurals: stigmas/stigmata (English); Stigmen/Stigmata (German). The plural "stigmata" is a Greek form.


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## Red Arrow

In *Dutch*, recent loanwords usually get plural -s.
Words ending with -eur, -foon, -a, -i, -o, -u and -y are all loanwords and get plural -s. (not all of them are recent loanwords)

Native vocabulary only gets plural -s when the last syllable of the word contains a schwa or ends with -aar(d).

Latin words ending with *-icus* always get plural *-ici*. Other masculine Latin words are treated like Dutch words.
Latin words ending with *-ium* or *-eum* always get plural *-ia *or* -ea*. (plural -iums or -eums is also possible) Other neuter Latin words are treated like Dutch words.

Datum gets plural *data* or plural *datums* depending on the meaning.

And then there are three completely irregular plurals:
stoma - stoma*ta *(from Greek)
matrix - matr*ices* (/iʃəs/) (from Latin)
index - ind*ices* (/iʃəs/) (from Latin)


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## Yendred

*French *generally accepts both forms of plural: the form which respects the original language, and the frenchified form. I think of two examples:

From Italian: _scénario_, which may form its plural in _scénarii _(Italian form) or _scénarios _(Frenchified form), although _scénarii _form is considered snobbish.
From Latin: _média_ (itself already the Latin plural of _medium_), which may form its plural in _média _(Latin form) or _médias _(Frenchified form).
Some others have kept the original form and were not frenchified:
_match/matches, gentleman/gentlemen_ (from English)
_lied/lieder _(from German)


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## apmoy70

Perseas said:


> The same here.
> 
> English words don't make plural in Greek, but sometimes you may hear 'κομπιούτερς (computers)' or 'σεντς (cents)'.
> It's also very common to hear 'μπάιτς (bytes)' and 'μπιτς (bits)'.
> 
> On the other hand, we usually use the singular 'τζίν (jean)' instead of 'jeans' for a pair of trousers, and the plural 'κόμικς (comics)' for a comic book for children with pictures.
> 
> 
> In Greek you can hear both 'φόρουμ (forum)' and 'φόρα (fora)' as plural, with the latter being formal.


Greek has also completely assimilated foreign words, which are now declined according to the rules of Greek grammar, eg:

«Σενάριο» [seˈna.ɾi.ɔ] (neut.) --> _script, scenario_ < It. scenario.
It forms naturally plural: «Σενάρια» [seˈna.ɾi.a] (nom. pl.), «σεναρίων» [se.naˈɾi.ɔn] (gen. pl.) etc.

«Μοντέλο» [mɔnˈde.lɔ] (neut.) --> _model, fashion model_ < It. modello.
It too forms naturally plural: «Μοντέλα» [mɔnˈde.la] (nom. pl.), «μοντέλων» [mɔnˈde.lɔn] (gen. pl.).

«Σενάζι» [seˈna.zi] (neut.) --> _(construction) the pouring of concrete into a framework containing steel rebar to create reinforced concrete_ < Fr. chaînage.
V
«Σενάζια» [seˈna.zʲa] (nom. pl.), «σεναζιών» [se.naˈzʲɔn] (gen. pl.).

«Σεντέφι» [senˈde.fi] (neut.) --> _(rustic) ivory_ < Turk. sedef.
V
«Σεντέφια» [senˈde.f͜ça] (nom. pl.), «σεντεφιών» [sen.deˈf͜çɔn] (gen. pl.).

«Τόπι» [ˈtɔ.pi] (neut.) --> _bolted fabric, inflatable fun ball, colourful ball for children made of plastic_ < Turk. top.
V
«Τόπια» [ˈtɔ.p͜ça] (nom. pl.), «τοπιών» [tɔˈp͜çɔn] (gen. pl.). 

«Χαρμάνι» [xarˈma.ni] (neut.) --> _blend, especially of tobacco or coffee_ < Turk. harman.
V
«Χαρμάνια» [xarˈma.ɲa] (nom. pl.), «χαρμανιών» [xar.maˈɲɔn] (gen. pl.).
etc.

I think the general rule is the older the borrowing, the smoother and more natural the process of assimilation is.


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## merquiades

Yendred said:


> *French *generally accepts both forms of plural: the form which respects the original language, and the frenchified form. I think of two examples:
> 
> From Italian: _scénario_, which may form its plural in _scénarii _(Italian form) or _scénarios _(Frenchified form), although _scénarii _form is considered snobbish.
> From Latin: _média_ (itself already the Latin plural of _medium_), which may form its plural in _média _(Latin form) or _médias _(Frenchified form).
> Some others have kept the original form and were not frenchified:
> _match/matches, gentleman/gentlemen_ (from English)
> _lied/lieder _(from German)


There is a plural that grates on my nerves:  sandwichs instead of sandwiches.


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## bibax

In Czech the ending of the neuter nouns is *-a* like in Latin and Greek, so the Czech plural forms of Latin/Greek loanwords of the neuter gender resemble the Latin/Greek forms:

to jablko (neuter sing.) - t*a* jablk*a* (neuter plur.) _the apple - the apples
_
to album - t*a* alb*a*
to centrum - t*a* centr*a*
to datum - t*a *dat*a*
to medium - t*a *medi*a*
to museum - t*a *muse*a*
to paradoxon - t*a* paradox*a* (also masc. _ten paradox_ - _t__*y* paradox*y*_)
to drama - t*a* dramat*a* (Czech also retains the original stem _dramat-_)
to stigma - t*a *stigmat*a*

N.B. the words _to (ta)_ and _ten (ty)_ are demonstrative pronouns, Czech has no article.


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## Yendred

merquiades said:


> There is a plural that grates on my nerves:  sandwichs instead of sandwiches.



_sandwiches _is the traditional spelling, and _sandwichs_ is the recommended (but not mandatory) form since the spelling reform of 1990.
If it's any comfort, I can tell you that I prefer the traditional spelling, and I would naturally have written it this way.
Anyway, the pronunciation is the same in singular and plural, no matter what spelling you choose: [sɑ̃dwitʃ] (although you would often hear people improperly pronounce it [sɑ̃dwiʃ])


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## merquiades

Yendred said:


> (although you would often hear people improperly pronounce it [sɑ̃dwiʃ])


  Oh, I never thought of that.  Are people starting to apply that reform?  I guess it means I can't correct it anymore.  That would also explain the _ frites fraiches_ that I see more often.  
 I'm rather used to [sɑ̃dwiʃ]), it bothers me less to hear that than seeing the_ sandwichs_ instead of _sandwiches_.


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## Yendred

The spelling reform of 1990 was enacted to "simplify" several words spelling. Following the law of the least effort, people tend to use the simplest form, that is _sandwichs _instead of _sandwiches._
And concerning official documents, France is such a centralized and normative country (you may know that ), that they certainly follow the recommended spelling.



merquiades said:


> That would also explain the _ frites fraiches_



I'm not sure to see what you mean. Do you mean _fraiches _instead of _fraîches_? (with circumflex accent)


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## DearPrudence

Yendred said:


> *French *generally accepts both forms of plural: the form which respects the original language, and the frenchified form. I think of two examples:
> 
> From Italian: _scénario_, which may form its plural in _scénarii _(Italian form) or _scénarios _(Frenchified form), although _scénarii _form is considered snobbish.
> From Latin: _média_ (itself already the Latin plural of _medium_), which may form its plural in _média _(Latin form) or _médias _(Frenchified form).
> Some others have kept the original form and were not frenchified:
> _match/matches, gentleman/gentlemen_ (from English)
> _lied/lieder _(from German)


Looks like the exceptions to the rule. I would say that generally, we use the French plural, ie "*-s*", especially for Latin.
Unlike in English, we would never say "des cacti", "des indices" (for "des index" I mean) (what next: "des aquaria, des referenda, des viri (?), des hiati (?)" ?).

For Italian words, we generally don't adopt the Italian system and just say:
"des pizza*s*" (never "des pizze"), "des adagio*s*".
And then, we do things that probably make Italians cringe but, for instance, we use Italian plural forms as singular forms.
Eg: we say "un spaghetti" and then put it in the plural ("des spaghettis").
Also, we say "un panini" (instead of "panino" I suppose) and therefore write "des paninis" (same for "confetti", "paparazzi"...).

Apparently, in the same way, the Russian word "blini" is already plural but we use it in the singular ("un blini") and put it in the plural by adding "-s" ("des blinis").

We imported words from many languages and I would say we can't be expected to know how to form the plural of all these words (who would say "des mezeler" for "meze" (or "mezze(s)" in French)?)


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## Yendred

DearPrudence said:


> Apparently, in the same way, the Russian word "blini" is already plural but we use it in the singular ("un blini") and put it in the plural by adding "-s" ("des blinis").



Indeed, *-i *is the plural mark in Russian, and having learnt Russian at school, it always bothers me to hear "_un blini_", since we should theoritically say "_un blin_". But then people wouldn't know how to pronounce it [blɛ̃] or [blin] 
(note that in Russian "_blin_" (_блин_) simply means "_crêpe_")

By the way, concerning Russian words introduced into French, this is not the only compromise with grammar, since our traditional "_bistrot_" comes from the Russian word "_bystro_" (_быстро_) = _fast _(an adverb).


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## merquiades

I suppose that taking plural forms from foreign languages and reinterpreting them as singular is the reason for widespread use of  _un brownies, un cookies, un muffins_ too.
However, _un whisky, des whiskys_.
Italians do cringe at _un panini_.


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## Red Arrow

Same in Dutch: één panini, twee panini's, drie panini's
Foreign words always get plural s


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## merquiades

Red Arrow :D said:


> Same in Dutch: één panini, twee panini's, drie panini's
> Foreign words always get plural s


with apostrophe?


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## Red Arrow

Yes, paninis would be pronounced [paninɪs] instead of [paninis]. Syllables need to stay open in Dutch spelling.

Same with auto's (cars), paraplu's, baby's and pizza's.


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## AndrasBP

Yendred said:


> it always bothers me to hear "_un blini_"





merquiades said:


> Italians do cringe at _un panini_.


I'm a Russian speaker and I do cringe at _"un blini"_.



Yendred said:


> we should theoritically say "_un blin_". But then people wouldn't know how to pronounce it [blɛ̃] or [blin]


You should simply spell the word_ "bline"_ to get the correct Russian pronunciation.



Yendred said:


> our traditional "_bistrot_" comes from the Russian word "_bystro_" (_быстро_) = _fast _(an adverb).


Not quite on topic, but I feel I must point out that this is most probably false. It's a widespread folk etymology. Read here.


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## Red Arrow

I found another one!

één scampi, twee scampi's, drie scampi's


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## AndrasBP

DearPrudence said:


> We imported words from many languages and I would say we can't be expected to know how to form the plural of all these words



That's what the English should also say in my opinion, but instead, in articles about Basque-language schools (_ikastola_), they use the Basque plural suffix -k and write funny things like _"the ikastola*k* were created"_.
Same for Welsh "eisteddfod*au*".
Is it perhaps because they're minority languages and by using _their _plurals the writers feel they respect and acknowledge them? I haven't seen this with German or Russian words (dachshund*s*, matryoshka*s*).


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## Yendred

AndrasBP said:


> You should simply spell the word_ "bline"_ to get the correct Russian pronunciation.







AndrasBP said:


> Not quite on topic, but I feel I must point out that this is most probably false. It's a widespread folk etymology. Read here.



I thought the correct etymology came from the Prussian army in 1870. I didn't know it was a controversy. Thanks for the link.


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## Awwal12

AndrasBP said:


> Do you know about foreign plurals used in other languages?


Not precisely what you meant originally, but several English words were loaned into Russian in plural forms and augmented with Russian plural suffixes. As a result, they retain English "-s" in singular forms (if they exist) as well.
Pl. рельсы (rel'sy - rails) - sg. рельс (rel's - a rail).
Pl. tantum джинсы (dzhinsy - jeans) - coll. sg. джинса (dzhinsa - jean cloth).
Pl. бутсы (butsy - a kind of leather boots, mostly for football) - sg. бутса (butsa - a boot of this kind)
Pl. клипсы (klipsy - clips, as devices) - sg. клипса (klipsa - a clip)
Pl. slang чиксы (chiksy - "chicks", i.e. girls) - sg. чикса (chiksa - a "chick").
Pl. slang баксы (baksy - "bucks", i.e. dollars) - sg. бакс (baks - one "buck").

The final -а which is sometimes present and sometimes absent comes from the fact that you cannot tell the gender/declension paradigm from the plural form ending in -ы (Russian has gender distinctions only in the singular number, and nouns which end in -ы in their nominative plural forms may be either words of the 1st declension paradigm, normally feminine, or they can be masculine words of the second declension paradigm; in the first case, their nominative singular forms will end in -а, otherwise they will have a zero inflexion).


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## AndrasBP

AndrasBP said:


> You should simply spell the word_ "bline"_


Although this would make the word sound feminine, wouldn't it?
Would you instinctively say "une bline chaude"?


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## Perseas

bibax said:


> In Czech the ending of the neuter nouns is *-a* like in Latin and Greek, so the Czech plural forms of Latin/Greek loanwords of the neuter gender resemble the Latin/Greek forms:
> 
> to jablko (neuter sing.) - t*a* jablk*a* (neuter plur.) _the apple - the apples
> _
> to album - t*a* alb*a*
> to centrum - t*a* centr*a*
> to datum - t*a *dat*a*
> to medium - t*a *medi*a*
> to museum - t*a *muse*a*
> to paradoxon - t*a* paradox*a* (also masc. _ten paradox_ - _t__*y* paradox*y*_)
> to drama - t*a* dramat*a* (Czech also retains the original stem _dramat-_)
> to stigma - t*a *stigmat*a*
> 
> N.B. the words _to (ta)_ and _ten (ty)_ are demonstrative pronouns, Czech has no article.


The Greek neuter article is 'to' (singular) and 'ta' (plural) --> eg. το δράμα - τα δράματα (to drama - ta dramata). I didn't know that Czech also use 'to' and 'ta' (although they are demonstrative pronouns).


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## Yendred

AndrasBP said:


> Would you instinctively say "une bline chaude"?



Yes, why not. Just like we say "_une crêpe chaude_".
Since we don't know the Russian gender, the usage would make it natural for French.
And the plural would be _"blines_" or "_blini_".


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## Torontal

Turkish has many Arabic loanwords in plural form which are then used in a singular meaning in Turkish. Just some examples: evliya (muslim "saint"), eşkiya (bandit), talebe (student), elbise (dress), evlat (son, kid), ahbap (friend, buddy), ahşap (lumber), evrak (document), esnaf (artisan), esrar (1. mystery, 2. hashish), ecdad/ecdat (forefather/s/, in this word the original plural meaning is mostly still retained, but i've also seen it treated as a singular), ebeveyn/valideyn (parent, these two are originally in Arabic dual form), etc etc etc... the list could be continued with many other words.

And then these words take regularly the Turkish plural -lar/ler.


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## Ansku89

I can't think of any words in Finnish that would normally have a foreign plural. There are some occasions where an originally plural form is for some reason understood to be singular and then we add the Finnish plural to it. One example of this is _muffinssi_ which is a muffin, _muffinssit_ is muffins. So the singular word comes from the English plural, just edited to make it more Finnish.


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## guihenning

Portuguese tends to modify words whenever possible to suit our orthography, although these forms usually take a while to be officially accepted. Generally speaking, we just add -s for plurals. Latin words ending in -us have the latin plural, so the word _campus_ (of a university) has its formal plural _campi. _There's a Portuguese word for that, which is _câmpus _for both singular and plural. I think this word was simply how people thought it was supposed to be written as if it were a Portuguese word until it appeared in dictionaries.
As for Italian words, we do like the French seem to do, as stated above, adding a -s. Some common words, however, are written in a Portuguese fashion, which means that the Italian word, plural, was brought into Portuguese, became a singular and we made a plural out of that, so: espaguete/espaguetes, (spaghetti/spaghettis), pizza/pizzas, nhoque/nhoques, (_panini/paninis), _muçarela/muçarelas_,_ etc


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## djmc

Breton borrowed a lot of vocabulary from French. Often it was the plural that was borrowed. For instance carotez (carrots) or kerez (cherry); If one wanted to stress that it was one that one meant, the is a form - the singulatif e.g. carotezen or kerezen. These form a regular plural carotezenou or kerezenou.


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## Nanon

Yendred said:


> blinis


What makes me cringe is when I hear _blinis _in French - pronounced with final _*s*_! That sounds like an English or Spanish, not Russian, plural . It sounds as if any foreign plural should do the trick!


DearPrudence said:


> "des adagios".


That reminds me of a sketch by Guy Bedos:


> « Il en a pas d'autres ? – D'autres quoi ? – Des adagios … - On dit des adagi. - Sais pas, de toute façon, y'a que celui-là qui marche. »


But we do say either _sopranos / altos _or _soprani / alti_. The Italian form is more likely to occur among musicians.


guihenning said:


> Portuguese tends to modify words whenever possible to suit our orthography, although these forms usually take a while to be officially accepted.


Curiously, the loanword _media _has been accepted in Brazilian Portuguese:

a mídia, collective noun, feminine singular
but it has not (yet?) been fully accepted in European Portuguese:

os _media_, masculine plural, with the foreign form in italics or between quote marks
Novamente mídia, média e "media" - Ciberdúvidas da Língua Portuguesa


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## AndrasBP

djmc said:


> Breton borrowed a lot of vocabulary from French. Often it was the plural that was borrowed. For instance carotez (carrots) or kerez (cherry)


"Ceri*s*e" is singular in French.
"*K*erez" can't have been borrowed from French, but rather from Latin directly, when "c" was still pronounced [k] before front vowels. I suppose that was when the ancestors of Bretons and Welsh still lived in the Roman province of Britannia. Welsh also has lots of loanwords from Latin, "cherry" is "ceirios", pron. /*k*eirios/.


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## Red Arrow

True. The Dutch word is kers, also with a K.


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## merquiades

Another borrowed word in plural that has been reinterpreted as a singular in French:  _tacos.   Je voudrais un tacos_,  s pronounced.  Pretty awful.


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## Red Arrow

That just gives me the shivers.


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## merquiades

Heard that in your capital city.


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## Red Arrow

merquiades said:


> Another borrowed word in plural that has been reinterpreted as a singular in French:  _tacos.   Je voudrais un tacos_,  s pronounced.  Pretty awful.


We actually do the same thing with our own words.

English - Old Dutch - Modern Dutch
shoe - schoe - schoen
shoes - shoe*n* - schoe*nen*

toe - tee - tee*n*
toes - tee*n* - te*nen
*
Imagine English people saying one shoes, two shoeses, one toes, two toeses. That's what happened in Dutch.


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## Gavril

On the issue of "foreign plurals" in English (_fungi_, _analyses_, etc.), I would venture to say that most or all of them fall into two categories.

1) Optional forms that most non-educated speakers wouldn't be aware of or use. For example, there is nothing "automatic" about saying _bases_ rather than _basises_, or _fungi_ rather than _funguses _(at least there isn't for me) -- it's just that the Latin-style forms are more popular among prescriptive authorities.

2) Words that only exist in the "plural" form for most speakers, such as _bacteria,_ _spaghetti_, etc. In other words, the majority of speakers don't treat these words as plurals at all, but as mass nouns that don't have a singular/plural distinction in the first place.


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## AndrasBP

Red Arrow :D said:


> Imagine English people saying one shoes, two shoeses, one toes, two toeses. That's what happened in Dutch.


Sometimes it happens the other way round: the "s" at the end of a singular noun is perceived as a plural, and is later dropped: 
The Middle English form of "pea" was "*pease*". The form survives in "pease pudding" and "pease porridge".


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## merquiades

I think it would be rare to see _peas_ written_ pease_.  But then putting peas into a pudding or porridge is also strange.


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## AndrasBP

merquiades said:


> I think it would be rare to see _peas_ written_ pease_.


Yes, it is rare today because it's a Middle English form, but the dish is not widely consumed today either. Apparently it's common in parts of Britain, but may be unknown in the US.



merquiades said:


> But then putting peas into a pudding or porridge is also strange.


It isn't _putting _peas into pudding, it's _making _pudding from peas. A thick purée, sort of.


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## velisarius

merquiades said:


> [...] putting peas into a pudding or porridge is also strange.



English boiled suet puddings can be either savoury or sweet - in the same way that a pie can be savoury or sweet: it depends what's inside.  The pudding is tied up in a cloth and boiled. Pease pudding is a sort of puree of soaked and cooked yellow peas, traditionally boiled up in a cloth - that's how it came to be called a "pudding".


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## Stoggler

velisarius said:


> English boiled suet puddings can be either savoury or sweet - in the same way that a pie can be savoury or sweet: it depends what's inside.  The pudding is tied up in a cloth and boiled. Pease pudding is a sort of puree of soaked and cooked yellow peas, traditionally boiled up in a cloth - that's how it came to be called a "pudding".



Ooh, fond memories from my childhood of bacon pudding comes to mind!  

Suet puddings used to be a bit of a Sussex mainstay.  One of its more famous dishes is the Sussex Pond Pudding.


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## bibax

A very rare example* when Czech retains the original plural form:

*hippie - hippies*

_Hippie byl ... = The hippie was ...
Hippies byli ... = The hippies were ..._

We say also informally *hipík - hipíci* (with the Czech suffix *-ík*, in plur. *-íci*) which is easily declinable in Czech (unlike hippie).

*I do not count the already mentioned coincidences of plural forms in Czech and Latin/Greek:

in masculine (plural ending *-i* like in Latin, -k is palatalized before -i):
horník (miner) - horníc*i* (miners)
cynik - cynic*i*
scholastik - scholastic*i*

in neuter (plural ending *-a* like in Latin/Greek):
jablko (apple) - jablk*a* (apples)
album - alb*a*
museum - muse*a*
paradoxon - paradox*a
*
It is a mere happenstance (or maybe it has been inherited from Indo-European?).


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