# Should we break up this forum?



## mkellogg

I'm impressed with how active this forum has become in only 2 months of operation.  I would like to thank especially the top contributors who have done such a good job at being helpful and friendly to so many people.

As the Spanish-English forum continues to grow, we should consider breaking it up into smaller forums.

What do you all think?
If we do break it up, what should the new forums be?

Mike


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## funnydeal

What do you all think about the following topics?

- grammar questions

- sayings

- vocabulary

- translation only


I am not sure that those would be wise sugestions.


Thanks Mike


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## cuchuflete

Hello Mike-- as an anarchist at heart, I kind of like the free-for-all as is.  
That said, if you do decide to tear it asunder, I would like to see the following:

-Translation questions, Español a inglés
-Translation  questions, English to Spanish
-Grammar
- Translation of song lyrics

The separation of the last one is just a requested convenience, to park these where I don't have to bother with them.

Best regards,
 "Cuchufléte"


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## Vicki

I also like the serendipity of the unorganized variety of postings. 

But if categories are the future, consider:

• Surrealistic song lyrics that don't make sense in their original language
• Grammar nuances that only native speakers recognize, but cannot explain
• Phrases with no context and which are simply puzzling
• Culture-based sayings that are fundamentally untranslatable

 

Saludos.
Vicki


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## jacinta

Hiyo,  

Here is my opinion:
-Long Translation: of songs and text -Those who have the time will go here.
-Short Translation:  How do you say...?

-Grammar questions - This one is all-encompassing because grammar includes so much: structure, usage, and translation

There is probably something I'm missing that I'll think of later...

I feel that it isn't really necessary to break in into English-Spanish, español-inglés.  We seem to work that out fairly well.


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## cuchuflete

Mike- an afterthought...

What about a forum for slang expressions, with the goal of eventually creating a bi-lingual glossary.  The on-line slang glossaries I've found leave a little to be desired.

The ideal glossary would be searchable by any of the key words, in any language, and would label the definitions or translated phrases as to country of origin.

If you look at the enormous volume of messages about the sundry meanings of 'coger' en various countries, you can seek the opportunity.

Also, if were able to find a way to code the threads, _e.g.,_ legal, computers/IT, food, [/I]etc._, it might be useful to students and casual browsers doing a search for related threads.  This would be an alternative to breaking the forum [splintering it?] into too many finite sub-categories.

Thanks again,
C._


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## gddrew

We could break it up any number of ways to Sunday. Too many categories won't serve the purpose very well, so keeping it as high level as possible--such as what funnydeal suggested--is the way I suggest to go.

Saludos,
Greg


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## braco

I would do it as follows:

IDIOMS
GRAMMAR
TRNASLATIONS.


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## Oculto04

Many times, answering to a question in the English-Spanish forum about how we say something in Spanish, the answers are eventually about Spanish grammar items, slight differences among different Spanish valid words or expressions, differences among how Spaniards, Mexicans, Argentinians, etc. say the same topic, etc.

So I would suggest a "Spanish only" forum. It would be as useful to English speakers as English only forum is to us.

I know that people could then ask for "French only","Italian only" forums, too,  and that this could cause to have too many open forums ... But this is your choice.

Congratulations for this web site.

Regards.


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## patriv

cuchufléte said:
			
		

> Mike- an afterthought...
> 
> What about a forum for slang expressions, with the goal of eventually creating a bi-lingual glossary.  The on-line slang glossaries I've found leave a little to be desired.
> 
> The ideal glossary would be searchable by any of the key words, in any language, and would label the definitions or translated phrases as to country of origin.
> 
> If you look at the enormous volume of messages about the sundry meanings of 'coger' en various countries, you can seek the opportunity.
> 
> Also, if were able to find a way to code the threads, _e.g.,_ legal, computers/IT, food, [/I]etc._, it might be useful to students and casual browsers doing a search for related threads.  This would be an alternative to breaking the forum [splintering it?] into too many finite sub-categories.
> 
> Thanks again,
> C._


_


Hi

I like this last suggestion by Cuchufleté... I'm almost new to the forum, but i've searched through to find translations, and I think it would be nice to code threads by subjects like legal, computers, food, etc. If the search engine used those key-words, it would be very helpful.  They could also be used to order/filter the threads, so that you can only look at the ones you want. 

Best regards to you all_


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## braco

Oculto04 said:
			
		

> Many times, answering to a question in the English-Spanish forum about how we say something in Spanish, the answers are eventually about Spanish grammar items, slight differences among different Spanish valid words or expressions, differences among how Spaniards, Mexicans, Argentinians, etc. say the same topic, etc.
> 
> So I would suggest a "Spanish only" forum. It would be as useful to English speakers as English only forum is to us.
> 
> I know that people could then ask for "French only","Italian only" forums, too,  and that this could cause to have too many open forums ... But this is your choice.
> 
> Congratulations for this web site.
> 
> Regards.



This is a very good Idea...


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## lauranazario

Mike,
IMHO (in my humble opinion) I think it would be a bit premature to divide this forum into categories. Like you said, it has only been operating for 2 months.

The forum's current format allows people to skim through the thread names and select those to which they feel they can make a worthwhile contribution. 

I, for one, think too much "categorization" may scare away people that are new to the forum (let's keep in mind that new people are joining every day!) 

I think you (as forum administrator) should encourage people to be more specific when naming their threads. A permanent bookmarked posting could be a way to go about this... telling forum dwellers that instead of using vague names like "I Need Help", people posting should be asked to choose a direct, pertinent name for the thread/s they initiate. As forum administrator, you could send a discreet message to those people who do not "comply" with using informative thread names. The private email feature of this forum is a perfect vehicle for that and will avoid any need for public "chastising"!


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## gotitadeleche

I am one who prefers not to split up the forum at this time. I like the mix. Although a searchable forum of slang terms or idioms would be helpful.


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## dave

Hi Mike and gang,

I too would favour the status quo - I rather like the random nature of the forum and not knowing what I´m going to get when I peek inside. I also enjoy a lot of the off-topic chat, and have learnt as much (if not more) from this than the original thread discussion! Also, if the forum were to be splintered, it is likely that some of our regular contributors will lean towards basing themselves in one particular forum (i.e. their favourite) and this may result in both losing their expert opinion elsewhere and, more importantly, fragmenting this wonderful community!

However, if separation is agreed as the way forward, I wouldn´t be too upset to see song lyrics put to one side (sorry Freddy!), and perhaps also the short translations of specialised and technical terms - but that´s only because they make me feel so inferior because I can´t possibly contribute to them!

Anyway, that's my two pen'th. It's your site Mike, you are our leader and you should do with it as you think best. It'll still be wonderful whatever! Thank you.


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## cuchuflete

Vicki said:
			
		

> I also like the serendipity of the unorganized variety of postings.
> 
> But if categories are the future, consider:
> 
> • Surrealistic song lyrics that don't make sense in their original language
> • Grammar nuances that only native speakers recognize, but cannot explain
> • Phrases with no context and which are simply puzzling
> • Culture-based sayings that are fundamentally untranslatable
> 
> 
> 
> Saludos.
> Vicki



*Bravo Vicki!* 

Phrases with no context provided should be relegated to some distant island.
Song lyrics of the type so well described above should be mixed with green leafy vegetables and added to the compost heap before posting.

Saludos,
C.


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## mkellogg

I'm surprised by the number of votes for leaving it the same, but if that is what works best, that's fine.  My concern is that it will become overwhelming as the forum continues to grow.  What happens in another month when we have twice as many posts per day?

I've been searching for a modification to the forum software that will alllow people to see all the posts in all the sub-forums at the same time, but I haven't found it yet...

Searchability is a big issue:  If we create a subforum for vocabulary, we could modify the "New Thread" page so that instead of "title" and "message", the options are "word or phrase" & "Example sentence or context".  If we could get people to follow those rules, then I could even, someday, deliver the thread titles as links in the main dictionary.


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## Maeron

My vote is for not breaking up (yet) for the reasons which others esp. Dave have expressed better than I could. Moreover, I'm sure everyone has seen on other lists and forums 1) people who post in the wrong section, and 2) topics which cross section boundaries. If you're keen not to miss anything that you might be interested in, you have to read all the sections anyway, and it's more work when they're broken up into different areas.


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## el alabamiano

Hi, Mike!

First of all, my compliments, as well as appreciation for your hard work and personal attentiveness towards the forumites needs!

My own suggestion is to limit the break-up to three categories:

Grammar
Translation
General

Also, I can't help but to be curious as to your idea of recruiting volunteers to help you oversee the forums. Is that still on, and if so, when will that go into effect? Each of the forums has so many intelligent people who regularly go the extra mile to help all of us, so I see no problem with not having enough volunteers.

Once again, my compliments...

Neal


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## mkellogg

El alabamiano,

That's my next question.  Let's not talk about it yet!

Mike


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## Spicy

I think is a good idea to create a subforum for vocabulary-
Personally speacking this is what I need mostly

----------------------



			
				mkellogg said:
			
		

> I'm surprised by the number of votes for leaving it the same, but if that is what works best, that's fine.  My concern is that it will become overwhelming as the forum continues to grow.  What happens in another month when we have twice as many posts per day?
> 
> I've been searching for a modification to the forum software that will alllow people to see all the posts in all the sub-forums at the same time, but I haven't found it yet...
> 
> Searchability is a big issue:  If we create a subforum for vocabulary, we could modify the "New Thread" page so that instead of "title" and "message", the options are "word or phrase" & "Example sentence or context".  If we could get people to follow those rules, then I could even, someday, deliver the thread titles as links in the main dictionary.


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## mkellogg

OK, I figured out how to do it.  We can create subforums (if that's what we decide) and still let people browse all sub-forums at once.

For example, here's an example link that will allow you to browse all subforums at once:
http://forum.wordreference.com/search.php?do=getdaily&days=1000&f=1 

I could set up the same for any sub-forums of Spanish-English that we might decide on.


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## Lems

Vicki said:
			
		

> I also like the serendipity of the unorganized variety of postings.
> 
> But if categories are the future, consider:
> 
> • Surrealistic song lyrics that don't make sense in their original language
> • Grammar nuances that only native speakers recognize, but cannot explain
> • Phrases with no context and which are simply puzzling
> • Culture-based sayings that are fundamentally untranslatable
> 
> 
> 
> Saludos.
> Vicki




Like *Vicki*, I enjoy the surprise:

 
L'ordre est le plaisir de la raison, 
mais le désordre est le délice de l'imagination.
Paul Claudel (1886-1955)

Order is the pleasure of the reason,
but disorder is the delight of the imagination. 

 

Saludos 
Paulo

________________________
Gracias por sus correcciones.
I appreciate any correction.


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## garryknight

As another newcomer I'd also like to congratulate you on the site.  And I, too, like the current format with everything under the same roof. But if you feel you have to split it, I suggest the following categories:

 Miscellaneous

)



			
				mkellogg said:
			
		

> here's an example link that will allow you to browse all subforums at once:
> http://forum.wordreference.com/search.php?do=getdaily&days=1000&f=1


 This looks something like what I get when I click 'New Posts'.


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## esance

Hello!!

Jolines todo en inglés!! uffff teneis que practicar el español ehhhhh.... interesante.... me sumo a Vicki y añadiría:

Terminología en agricultura, informática, derecho y medicina
Palabra soeces versus poemas o frases románticas
Sinónimos y antónimos
Encabezados y pies de página para cartas formales e informales
Expresiones formales e informales
Etc.....


Es broma!!! Un afectuoso saludo a TODOS!! 
Imagino que el tiempo nos dirá como ir organizando el forum, si bien es "bueno preverir antes que curar".


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## el_novato

Hello Mr. *mkellogg*

I only want to say two things

1.-  This place is very good. Thank you.

2.-   If I can help you or contribute with the forum (in any thing) , please let me know, it will be a pleasure to do it.

Saludos.

el novato


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## LadyBlakeney

Oh, my goodness! This thread sure is long!

I'll try to organize my thoughts. Please excuse me if I don't get to it.

First of all, I would like to join those well deserved congratulations to Mr. Kellogg that other members posted before. Your concern about the convenience of the forums is really commendable.

About the categorization of the Spanish forum, I would like it to remain as it is now, and I would welcome a search tool like the one Mr. Kellogg showed in his link. I also believe it would be great to force people to state clearly the topic/context of their questions. Therefore, I go for the following:

> Mandatory fields to be populated when posting a new thread: word(s)/subject of the thread; context; category (maybe choosing from a list).
> The forum containing all the threads.
>The search engine allowing searchs by category(ies).

What do you all think of this?


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## mkellogg

Well, it looks like we have a consensus to leave the forum alone, at least for the time being.

If at any time there is enough interest in specialized forums such as "Professional Translators Only" or "Medical Terminology" - the type of forum that most of us would not be interested in, please let me know.


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## cuchuflete

Mike, 

Allow me to offer my sincere thanks for your attention to your audience.  In this day and age, benevolent tyrants are a rare commodity!

Cuchufléte

PD- I nominate song lyrics for the first amputated forum.


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## Zephyrus

Hi Mike...my humble opinion is that it would be great if translators could have a forum just for translation topics, this way we could exchange some points of views and help each others.
regards.


p.s....Happy Translator's Day (it was yesterday...sorry)


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## mkellogg

I have had a few requests for a "Professional Translators Only" forum.  It would be more serious and professional in general, and I feel that it would not distract much from our general forum here.

What do you all think?


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## el_novato

Hello Mr. *mkellogg*

I want not to offend the proposals of the "foreros friends"

Hello:  This my opinion.   We have 3 kinds of suggestions. In that kinds we have friends that are they not very convinced for the sub-classification of this forum, and other friends are very enthusiasm  with the sub-classification  I would vote for not make the sub-classification yet.

I think you are right, in a few weeks, we can have a lot of threads ( without counting the post ).

If you want to make the sub-classfication (or a pilot test), but only with two categories:

*General * and ***Special*.

(I think it will be very soon to make a lot of sub-classification).

*General  * can cover almost all kind of threads.

*Special  * can cover specefic words or sentences (example:  law, medicine, slang, lyrics, agriculture, etc). 

-- Somebody proposed grammar, but if you want about grammar, you can ask in the "English only forum". 
-- Another one proposed many classifications.
-- Professional translator: You are very welcome, I am only a *novato*.  You can provide a lot of help in " The Special Secction  ".

I think this suggestion will  be welcome for the new "foreros", and it let us to discover the benefit of it.

With this sub-classification, you (or we if you decide take our help) have time to reconsider the possibles new classification before the quantity of things,collapse the forum (in the hypothetical case).

The last decision will be of your verdict and/or the votes.

*IMPORTANT*:
I do not have experience in another forums (maybe the other foreros have it, or are experts). THIS is my suggestion.

*Saludos de su amigo el novato*

*** * You can propose another name for the Special secction.


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## lauranazario

mkellogg said:
			
		

> I have had a few requests for a "Professional Translators Only" forum.  It would be more serious and professional in general, and I feel that it would not distract much from our general forum here.
> 
> What do you all think?



Count me in among the "yes" votes!!!


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## Magg

Mike, 

I'm on Cuchufléte and Dave's side this time. I love this forum for what it really is, and the way it is organised. Mixing different topics forces you to get involved in a wider learning process, either by interacting with others or just reading their experiences. I don't know, but I'd kind of feel dispersed, as if we weren't to be together any more (mmm... this last sentences doesn't sound good to me).

At least, I wouldn't like the split concerning grammar, vocabulary, phonics, etc. Maybe more general topics such as cinema, literature, TV programmes, famous people, music (bands, lyrics, concerts), sports...

What I find a great idea is the 'slang forum' suggested by Cuchufléte.


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## David

Oiga, Sr. Mike: Yo propongo las siguientes categorías:

Jóvenes intrépidos
Jóvenes que solo quieren entender la letra
Jóvenes que quieren la terminología correcta para enamorarse o traficar
Viejos tercos
Nit-pickers
Vendedores de bienes raíces apurados por tener el cliente en la antesala
Y como dice Borges, 
Los que sea propiedad del Imperador
Lo que no figura en esta clasificación.
Traductores comerciales, productos nocivos
Traductores profesionales, productos sanos
Metiches con conocimiento
Metiches sin conocimiento
Universitarios que ya no aguantan tanto estudiar y quieren perder un ratito traduciendo refranes y dichos.


Viva el desórden.

David (Viejo terco, metiche sin conocimiento, no propiedad del Imperador)


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## garryknight

Magg said:
			
		

> What I find a great idea is the 'slang forum' suggested by Cuchufléte.


 A great many of the requests are for translations of idioms, whether they are slang, metaphor, proverbs, sayings, and so on: exactly those clusters of words that don't appear in the dictionary. Maybe an 'idiom' forum would be worth setting up. But then, maybe there would be too much crossover with other potential categories...


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## el_novato

jaja, esa estuvo buena *Dave*:

El conocimiento no se ha peleado con la risa:

Puedes incluir en tu clasificación:

Noctámbulos.
Navegadores compulsivos.
Temas para despertar sonrisas.
y las que vengan ...

¿Quién es órden?   Pero mientras me contestas, que viva el des órden!!!.


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## el_novato

Ahhh, y una sección para los poemas de *funnydeal * (no te enooojes, es solo una bromiiiita).

Comentario:
Pero se imaginan que hiciéramos una clasificación para cada cosa.  Al final tendríamos mas clasificaciones que participantes.

*Welcome * to Wordreference.com  Please also visit our WordReference Forums.
If you want to visit  Espanish-English Forum, please visit our web.  www.espanishenglisforum.com and in this forum, you can choose between a several categories, and all day and all days, we continued growing.  The new category of the day is "comentarios de el novato".  (Lo tuvimos que poner aparte, nos estaba causando conflicto con el espacio de el servidor en todas las categorías, que bárbaro, debería pedir trabajo comentando).

*Mr. mkellogg*, no se moleste, es solo para ver la potencialidad benéfica de las subclasificaciones.  Ya le dí mi punto de vista y mi ofrecimiento.  Desde luego que respetamos las reglas del foro.  Solo pido que se considere antes de un cambio radical, es el primero foro que conozco y amo, *pero tampoco me consideren un asesino del desarrollo*.  

Otro comentario:
Ya ven que está de moda lapidarte por lo que digas, eso lo veo mucho en las películas gringas.  Saludos a "hollywod".

*el novato*


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## cuchuflete

Hello again Mike,

I spent more years than I care to count designing market research for new products, and that leads me to the following comment:  You tossed out the possibility of a 'translators' only forum', and invited positive feedback.  That stimulated what?  Three or four positive responses?

Please consider not only the number of prompted positives, but the count of negatives and non-respondents, all as percentages of  [1]the total population of registered users
and [2] those who are participating in this thread.

Trying to be even-handed, I'll try to list some pros and cons for such a forum:

In favor--the responses will not be as likely to include some of the chaff that works its way into many threads, so that the paid professionals' time will be spent more efficiently.  This is clearly a benefit to the professional who has a point of nuance in need of clarification.

In opposition--Many non-professionals will be intimidated or otherwise deterred from participating, thus denying both browsers and the professionals a range of highly valuable input, including some of the 'street' language and word-of-mouth etymology that infuses so many of the more fascinating amateur postings.

I love experiments...they often yield wonderful surprises.  I am thinking of Vicki's use of one of my favorite words, 'serendipity'. (cf. Ceylon, Sri Lanka, Serendip, Discovery!)

I see no harm in trying it, so long as you request more feedback [Gawd! what a hateful neologism that is.] after a few weeks of segregation of the experts from the great unwashed.

Rest assured, I'll keep reading all of it, and be grateful to have this wonderful stimulus.

Many thanks for all your efforts,
Cuchufléte


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## belén

hello mike,
i wanted to join the rest of the gang in congratulating you for this great place
i am voting for staying the same we are right now. i have found myself learning more that i would have ever imagined just by checking threads i probably wouldn't have checked if the subdivision existed...but whatever decission you take, we will hang around for sure..this webplace is addictive!! 
best regards,
belén


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## jacinta

Hello, Mike,

Apart from all the tontería, ( you are all hilarious, really! You are what make this place fun)  I would appreciate a professional translators' category for those who need serious answers and are using this forum for technical terminology.  That way I will know to pass by those queries without blinking.  So, I vote to have a separate category for technical translation, ie: medical, computer tech, whatever it may be.


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## Vicki

Re this and similiar comments from others:





			
				jacinta said:
			
		

> I would appreciate a professional translators' category for those who need serious answers and are using this forum for technical terminology.  That way I will know to pass by those queries without blinking.  So, I vote to have a separate category for technical translation, ie: medical, computer tech, whatever it may be.


I'd suggest calling it "technical (_or_ specialized) terms (_or_ terminology)" rather than "for professional translators" (or similar phrase), because it's my observation that it's not always the professionals (folks who do it for pay) who are interested in these questions and who actually come up with the answers. 

For that matter, I'd like to think that everyone's queries are "serious". The last time I checked, we're all using a free resource, "professionals" and "amateurs" alike. What difference should it make if some gain financially from the help acquired here? Hmmm... maybe some of those little appreciated song lyric questioners are working on a product they hope to sell.  

If it's simply a matter of the professionals not wanting to "waste time", they of all people should be crystal clear in their thread titles as to what they're seeking.

Finally, I agree with this, which others have suggested as well:





			
				LadyBlakeney said:
			
		

> Mandatory fields to be populated when posting a new thread: word(s)/subject of the thread; context; category (maybe choosing from a list).


I don't know what programming options are readily available with this forum software, but a dropdown menu with just a few general, searchable categories (including "technical terms" or the like) would go a long way toward satisfying the general desire for classified threads.

Mis dos centavitos.   

Saludos.
Vicki


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## jacinta

You're right, Vicki, I should have chosen my words more carefully.  I don't mean to say that not every query is serious.  I would hope that my own questions are taken seriously.  Every question is a serious one!  and I think everyone treats each one as such.  I guess a "technical" subcategory is what I meant to say.


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## mkellogg

Maybe Vicki's suggestion of a "technical terms" forum is the right way to go.  It would be a good and polite way to provide a space for professionals (of any type) to have a discussion.  Nobody would be excluded either, which would be nice in some respects.  From there, I can have my fun sub-dividing that forum into medical, banking, insurance, legal, etc. and still leave you all alone.  

A few of you have mentioned classified threads and moderators.  Let's save that discussion for another thread after we resolve this issue...


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## esance

Hello,

Agree with "los dos centavitos" de Vicki 

Esperamos tus deliberaciones mkellogg!!


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## marietta

Fisrt of all, and like all the rest, I want to congratulate you MKellogg on your successful page. Specially because it's one just for questions and answers and no other frills.
I agree with a few others that there could be a chance for a more focused translation forum.

It's going to a success also, you can bet on that.
Marie.


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## Pearl

mkellogg said:
			
		

> I have had a few requests for a "Professional Translators Only" forum.  It would be more serious and professional in general, and I feel that it would not distract much from our general forum here.
> 
> What do you all think?



Hi Mike!

First of all I want to thank you and all the rest of the people in the site that make this tool possible day after day.

I personally feel the Forum is a surprise every time I enter. I like it that way. On the other hand, I don't quite get the idea of the "Professional Translators Only" Forum (it makes me think of some kind of A class and C class threads). 

Cheers !


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## imf

Cómo se traduce al español el término "inactive asset" (contabilidad). Me puede dirigir alguien a alguna fuente fiable para encontrar una definición.

Muchas gracias.


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## Vicki

imf said:
			
		

> Cómo se traduce al español el término "inactive asset" (contabilidad). Me puede dirigir alguien a alguna fuente fiable para encontrar una definición.
> 
> Muchas gracias.


Creo que se dice "activo retenido".

Espero que sea de ayuda.

Saludos.
Vicki

P.D. Bienvenido. Generalmente, para lanzar una nueva pregunta fuera del tema (el futuro del foro, en este caso), es mejor seleccionar "New Thread", que se encuentra encima de la página. Así sabremos inmediatamente que buscas algo nuevo.


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## lauranazario

Pearl said:
			
		

> ... I don't quite get the idea of the "Professional Translators Only" Forum (it makes me think of some kind of A class and C class threads).



Seems you are under the impression that the proponents of a "Professional Translators" area want to completely shut down this forum as we know it... no, no, no, that is NOT our intention. What "we" --and I mean professional translators-- are saying is that perhaps creating a "professional area" WITHIN this forum would be a very good addition. 

And why creating such an area would be a good idea? Because it could help those with special and very specific needs that can only be addressed by a peer. 

Please keep in mind that it is not my intention to disrespect or demean the casual forum dweller... but sometimes well-intentioned "guesses" do not provide the particular answers or knowledge we seek.

So please understand that I do not endorse changing the nature of this forum... all I am saying is I would not oppose the creation of an Area --just a small area-- for professionals.

Peace to all.


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## Vicki

lauranazario said:
			
		

> What "we" --and I mean professional translators-- are saying is that perhaps creating a "professional area" WITHIN this forum would be a very good addition.
> 
> And why creating such an area would be a good idea? Because it could help those with special and very specific needs that can only be addressed by a peer.
> 
> Please keep in mind that it is not my intention to disrespect or demean the casual forum dweller... but sometimes well-intentioned "guesses" do not provide the particular answers or knowledge we seek.


There's a better way to approach this. For that matter, there are problems with the very concept "professional" in this arena. 

Who's to say who's a peer? There are professionals with gaps in their knowledge, or whose training may have been inadequate, or who have ten years' experience but it's the same year repeated ten times—and there are extraordinarily capable "amateurs" who happen to earn their living another way. In addition, I have seen errors in the work of self-described professional translators (here and elsewhere).

I'd also caution professionals with "special and very specific needs" not to discourage the help of others who may be the most capable of all. For just one example, occasionally the question of technical terminology comes up on this forum, and by chance a native speaker, albeit "non-professional" translator, who actually works in that field provides the best help. Also, there are native speakers whose writing skill in that language exceeds by far that of the "professional" translator for whom it's a second language. That skill, experience and taste can be very useful.

As I've mentioned before, _the easiest way_ for those who who have "special and very specific needs" to get the level of help they request is to simply be specific in the threads. (This is often not the case.) 

Those _foristas_ who aren't sincerely interested in the question or who don't feel up to the task will select themselves out. A "professional" in the language-slinging business should have no trouble crafting on-target thread titles.

Saludos.
Vicki

P.S. In case it matters—though as you can guess from the above I don't think it should—among other things, I do translate for pay.


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## lauranazario

Vicki said:
			
		

> There's a better way to approach this. For that matter, there are problems with the very concept "professional" in this arena.
> 
> Who's to say who's a peer? There are professionals with gaps in their knowledge...



I fail to see the "problem" with creating a designated area (if our administrator chooses to do so). I have tried --repeatedly-- to point out that I do not encourage or endorse transforming the whole forum and therefore change its original "serendipitous" (borrowing someone's observation) nature.

And who's to say who's a peer? Well, each and every translation professional who acts in good faith and does not get a kick of misleading others either with false representation or questionable knowledge. We all seem to keep close tabs on each other anyway so I'm pretty sure corrections will be posted if we see something that is blatantly incorrect, the same way as we respectfully contribute our two cents' worth in any discussion that may need clarification.

Regarding the issue of professionals with gaps in their knowledge, I'd say this is quite a common occurrence. I can only speak for myself when I confess that I don't claim to know everything, nor do I fool myself into thinking that way. There are subject matters at which I am not proficient and I don't offer my services in those areas. By the same token, using this forum to offer opinions on subject matters I don't "master" would be equally irresponsible. But I digress...

Sorry if voicing my interest in the possible creation of a professional area has rubbed anyone the wrong way. It was --and continues to be-- a thought on how to improve the great environment we already have here.


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## cuchuflete

*Thank you Vicki. *

Your example regarding technical terminology is most apt.  Recently we had a request from a professional translator who was struggling with some of the more arcane aspects of an ERP [Enterprise Resource Planning] software application users' manual.

Having worked in a closely related arena, I was able to help--most of the translation work was accomplished in a detailed back-and-forth outside the public forum, at the behest of the translator.  Something similar, and also in private, happened this past weekend, with a factory equipment maintenance application.  It is doubtful that any of the foregoing would have occurred if the initial posts were in a professional/technical area.

It should be obvious by now that I am not a professional translator.   If some of those who are choose to self-segregate in a sub-forum, more power to them.  We can then debate whether the bars at the zoo are for the protection of the residents or the observers.

I'll stay in the public arena, with its wonderful spirit of mutual help and sharing, without regard to one's source of income.  I am delighted to be able to help both professionals and amateurs.  I learn from them and am grateful to them all.

Best regards,
Cuchufléte


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## lauranazario

cuchufléte said:
			
		

> We can then debate whether the bars at the zoo are for the protection of the residents or the observers.



The are in place to protect both residents and observers from vicious attacks from either side. We should only be so lucky...


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## mkellogg

I guess I should come to some sort of decision, right?

Unless there are serious objections, I'm going to create a "Specialized Terminology" sub-forum under the Spanish-English forum.  There, lawyers, doctors and their translators can have a space to discuss terms that the rest of us do not know or care about.

I'm going to hold off on creating a "Professional Translators" forum for a month or so.  (I'm doing something with French translators now that might affect how I set it up.)  I really feel that the forums could attract a new audience by creating a space for them.

Again, I think the idea of forums to discuss words and translations can attract many different people with many different interests.  I would like to provide a forum for each "demographic" as this website grows.

Thank you all for your ideas and suggestions!

Mike


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## Magg

Pearl said:
			
		

> On the other hand, I don't quite get the idea of the "Professional Translators Only" Forum (it makes me think of some kind of A class and C class threads).
> 
> Cheers !



Pearl,

Your words remind me of a languge forum I used to visit not long ago, which I've exiled from my frequent ones due to the idea you've mentioned right above.

There, there were a few 'erudites' that paid more attention to refuting other's explanations by adding more and more information (that you didn't really need), and making use of a terminology somehow complex for the beginner or lower-intermidiate learner. Some of them even used dirty swear words to answer the other.

I'm not saying I'm taking for sure this is going to happen, but I wouldn't like to feel like visiting a forum where current users have a higher level of the language, making me feel uncomfortable.

If the 'technical' or 'translation' forum succeeds, I'd ask the professionals participating to be polite, respectful and humble with the learners.


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## Piano_boy_chile

Cuchuflete,

Oh I'm so glad someone came up with a "song translations" section, since many of my questions I wanna make refer to words I've heard or read in music made in English. As you may have guessed or read, I'm very interested in music, entertainment and what the composers of our time are saying. But if we do make that section, we should try and make other sections that have been said here, like food, technicals terms and computer/internet terms. Maybe we could make the "breaking" out of the topics that most have been mentioned here.
Good luck to all.

Pianoboy.-


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## Piano_boy_chile

After reading the last messages, I see that there was more going on than what I thought when I replied Cuchuflete's message about the song translations. If there's going to be people who will add more and more etymological and almost philosophical meanings to simple words when not asked or when it's not necessary, and other people answering with swearings and curses, I would rather continue as we've been so far; but at least I don't see that's what has been going round here, on the contrary, I've felt the mutual support some have mentioned here. So, I stick by the idea of breaking the forum into topics, mantaining the most important language themes, such as idioms, grammar and vocabulary, and separating the English/Spanish translation from the Spanish/English.
Greetings. Blessings. Good luck.


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